#owen is not the main character because this is an ensemble show

[lovecolibri]

Anyway,

[scattered-winter]

ok. this might be slightly insane but uhh...how do you feel about doing all 4 pevensie kids (or however many of your choosing) for character bingo? i know they're probably not, like, blorbo status but your narnia posting around thanksgiving made me think of them. (if not them, i propose: owen bc your owen rants delight me, and judd bc. judd <333)

AKSJLDFKSHDGISLRIJSKHG UR SOOOO VALID ACTUALLY !!! i'm gonna do them all <333 because i want to <333 i've actually never read the narnia books so these are all the movie kids <3

lucy, edmund, susan, peter <3 you've awakened something in me <33

everything on this is derogatory <3 i have a rich inner world where owen is a genuinely interesting character with a genuinely interesting narrative but i also don't give a fuck about him so i'm probably never gonna talk about it <3

judd <333333333 my beloved <33333333333333 the only wrong thing he's ever done is support owen in any way shape or form and that's just down to the writing constantly propping owen up and so i choose to ignore it all <3

[watmalik]

I kinda understand if this will be the last season for Lonestar. Mostly all characters are coupled and happy, the only pending main storyline is that of Carlos and his dad. It's not a bad season to end it with, but if this is actually true? It will be unfortunate as there are sooooo many untold stories regarding the rest of the ensemble.

Let's be honest, it's been a complete and utter Owen show. No matter whose story they've shown, Owen just HAD to be there. At first I didn't mind it, but then it just became a very annoying constant. I get he is the main character but you also have an entire main cast to use.

I don't like comparing this show to OG, but bc it is their mother show you kinda have to and you don't see Athena or Bobby, hell not even Maddie centred in every single storyline. I picked these three because before this show, Peter Krause, Angela Basset and JLH were/are widely recognised in the business (and ig worldwide if you're not from the US like me) which I guess you can put Rob Lowe in the same light as well as, Gina Torres. However, Gina is not merely given the same spotlight as Lowe in 911LS and that's not fair imo. Nor is it fair the lack of main plot lines surrounding the other characters.

[intoxicatingimmediacy]

Loki Season 2: Who Plays X-5?

"Loki" Season 2 brings everyone's favorite god of mischief back to the Marvel Cinematic Universe — but he's not alone. Marvel Studios' first foray into a multi-season show introduces plenty of new characters, like O.B. (Ke Huy Quan), General Dox (Kate Dickie), and X-5 (Rafael Casal), a Time Variance Authority (TVA) agent with quite the disdain for Mobius (Owen Wilson) and his love of Jet Skis. Although "Loki" Season 2 is Casal's most mainstream project to date, the actor has had enough appearances in his relatively young career to leave viewers wondering where they've seen him before. In 2018, he starred in the critically acclaimed movie "Blindspotting," writing and acting alongside longtime friend Daveed Diggs to bring the culture and reality of Oakland, California, to life on-screen. Casal also starred in, produced, and served as showrunner for Starz's spin-off sequel series of the same name. Additionally, the actor was part of the ensemble cast of "Bad Education," playing Kyle Contreras alongside Hugh Jackman, Ray Romano, and Allison Janney in HBO's award-winning television movie on America's largest public school embezzlement case. He also appeared on the 2019 revival of "Are You Afraid of the Dark?" as the main villain, Mr. Tophat, and played John Cook on Showtime's "The Good Lord Bird" miniseries. "Loki" Season 2, Episode 1 introduces X-5 as a seemingly strict TVA agent who delivers Mobius and B-15 (Wunmi Mosaku) to the TVA's judges' council. Based on the Season 2 trailer, fans can expect to see more of Rafael Casal, who seems to be going by the alias Brad Wolfe outside of the TVA. However, you won't catch the actor revealing much about his character anytime soon. "I cannot even confirm or deny this," Casal joked in April in response to Screen Rant Plus interviewer Tatiana Hullender's comment that he's "Loki" Season 2. "But that's a cool show, and if I was on it, it would be so awesome. I'll bet Tom Hiddleston is the best, I think Owen Wilson seems like a really awesome guy, and that all that cast and crew, I'll bet, are fantastic to work with. And so I'm really excited to see what Season 2 has because I'm a fan." While Casal found a fun way to adhere to any NDAs he may or may not have with Marvel Studios, "Loki" Season 2, Episode 1 officially confirms his MCU debut as X-5, and based on his scenes, it's evident he had a great time filming alongside Hiddleston and Wilson.

[abowlofpetuniasandawhale]

Tbh as much as I love(d) the characters on Lone Star, the writing as a whole was just never there for me the way it was with OG 9-1-1 and I hope if they do decide to do another spinoff in its place, they really learn from the mistakes of Lone Star.

Rambling about those mistakes under the cut bc it got out of hand

From S1 LS was overall a very weak setup. The pilot has serious pacing and tone problems from the get go that i could dedicate a whole dissertation to, but I think the first real nail in the coffin was having so few characters with shared history or pre-developed relationships in the main cast. It cut the writers work out for them in a way i don’t think they were prepared to actually tackle in the context of a procedural. There was a lot of potential to see these strangers grow together but, as good as the actors were, by S2 it still just wasn’t believable that these people would be more than just average coworkers.

The theming within episodes was also non-existent, that’s all i really have to say about that (and I know people complain about that with original recipe also but as someone who binged them at the same time the difference was stark)

It was too much of the Rob Lowe Showe (tm) to ever be a solid ensemble and Owen as a character was never interesting or complex enough to carry the show for me. In fact i think my biggest complaint is that every character on the show is kind of a perfect paragon with no serious character flaws sticking around long enough to add real depth (Judd was allowed to have real, ugly PTSD symptoms for all of what? Two episodes?). The storylines that the other characters did get were often pretty superficial and short-lived, and some of the most interesting storylines and character traits were just dropped because the writers clearly couldn’t figure out how to use them in episodes (what happened to detective Paul???? nvm they’d have to have interesting calls occasionally for that to be useful).

Personally, I tuned out a little over halfway through season three when I realized I was only hanging around for Carlos and the vague hope that Marjan and Paul would eventually get more screen time, but even from the pilot i could see the writing on the wall and i reallllllllllly hope Tim&co can see it now in retrospect. Especially because these are all things that they managed to dodge almost entirely in the original.

[byersfanclub]

people love to just ignore or deny the fact that stranger things is an ensemble cast where every character is practically a main character with different characters getting more screen time and more of their story explored in different episodes and seasons than other characters. Like yes, el is a huge part of the story and will is also a huge part of the story, they are the two most important characters I think most people could agree on that considering el and will are the reason the entire show starts but to completely disregard other characters as just as important to the plot or that they should kill off more characters cause “drama” is insane to me. the duffers have stated themselves that stranger things isn’t game of thrones. they’ve had ideas to kill off beloved characters but come back and change that idea because they realize how important they are and killing them off would almost come off as shock factor than anything else (biggest reason why I don’t think they’ll kill of steve, he was already supposed to die) I think this is why it’s a good thing they tend to kill off 1. unlikeable characters (billy) or 2. characters that haven’t been around since the beginning (if im not wrong, robin is the only character brought into a season that didn’t get killed off like bob or billy and decided to kill eddie off instead of robin because eddie’s death is going to have more impact on the story than if they killed off robin) 

reddit bros who think they’ll kill off will or mike simply cannot understand how important both will and mike are to not just the entire story but to EACH OTHERS stories.  deaths in stranger things 99% of the time are important to plot. the only meaningless “big” death I can even think of is alexei. hopper’s “death” is important. barb’s death is important. bob’s death is important. billy’s death is important. brenner’s death is important. eddie’s death is important. max’s “death” is important. 

if any characters next season are on the chopping block my honest guesses would be dr. owens and lonnie byers (vecna not included cause it’s obvious he’s gonna be taken the fuck out) I genuinely can’t see any other of the other’s being killed off. MAYBE murray in some grand hero scene to save everyone else, but even then I'm not so sure. 

either way, this is one of the reasons I love stranger things so much compared to a lot of other ensemble cast shows that love to just kill, kill, kill their cast and add in characters... just to kill them and add more. let’s stop treating st like mainstream shows, considering the duffers never intended/thought st would ever become what it is today. they aren’t going to follow the mainstream. 

[paperstorm]

So storyline episode distribution is hard to calculate. The characters are mentioned in order of most screentime.

Owen has the terrorist storyline from 4x1-4x06, he had the Kendra storyline which is 4x10, 4x13, 4x14. He also had the storyline with the Tarlos wedding in 4x08 and he's gonna have a storyline with TK in 4x15-4x16 which I'm excited for. Owen has had three episodes where he's had the most screentime.

Tommy has had her storyline with Trevor 4x01, 4x02, 4x07, 4x14. She also had a lot of focus during the TNT storyline in 4x10. Also she's gonna have a storyline with Judd in 4x16. I'm glad that this season we're getting a balance of personal life storylines and paramedic captain storylines. Tommy has had three episodes where she's had the most screentime.

TK has had a lot of Tarlos storylines. I would consider the 4x01-4x04 storyline to be focused more on Carlos but I would say that 4x02 and 4x04 had a lot of focus on TK. Then he had 4x08, 4x12. 4x10 is a TNT storyline so it counts. TK is gonna have a storyline with Owen in 4x15 and 4x16. TK has had 1 episodes where he's had the most screentime.

Marjan had like a 4 part ish storyline. The episodes are 4x05, 4x08, 4x9 and 4x12. Marjan has had three episodes where she's had the most screentime.

Carlos had 4x01-4x04. He also had 4x08, 4x12. He's gonna have a cool storyline in 4x15 with Grace which I'm super excited for. Carlos has had two episodes where he's had the most screentime.

Grace has had two episodes where she had storylines; 4x05 with the kid calling 9-1-1 and 4x13 with her dad. She's in other storylines where she's there as Tommy's friend and to support Judd. She's had 1 episode where she's had the most screentime.

Paul has had arguably 2 episodes with a storyline and that's his storyline with Asha. It started in 4x05 but we got more development for it in 4x07. He kind of shared a storyline with Owen in 4x14 so maybe I should count it.

Judd has had one episode where he has a storyline; 4x11 with Wyatt. He's gonna have a storyline from 4x16-4x18 with Wyatt.

Mateo has had one episode with a storyline. It's 4x11.

Nancy has had no solo storylines. She had the TNT episode but that's really it.

Ooh look at you breaking it down. I am surprised that Judd is lower on the list this season because as much as this is an ensemble show, the MAIN main characters have always been Owen, Michelle/Tommy, TK, and Judd. I’m curious why he’s had less to do this year.

[peonyblossom]

it is so interesting to think of different combinations of characters of who could've been on the plane in the season 8 finale of grey's anatomy.

Obviously Meredith, Derek, and Cristina would be on the plane because while, yes, Grey's is an ensemble cast show, those three are more Main Character than a lot of the rest (specifically Meredith because they show's literally named after her lol). And literally anything traumatizing that happens on that show happens to Meredith lol. And while it makes a lot of sense character wise for Cristina to be on the plane, it could've very easily been Teddy, job wise. Teddy literally said most attendings wouldn't let their fellows go by themselves to do that complicated of a surgery. Mark and Lexie also make a lot of sense, character wise. The real wild card is Arizona. She wasn't even supposed to be on the plane, it was supposed to be Alex. And I think Alex would've made a lot of sense character wise too. But for a later plot point in season 9, the plane needed to have three attendings (or more, but really only three makes sense), so if Alex was on the plane either Meredith, Cristina, or Lexie would have had to not be on the plane. Personally, I think it would've made the most sense for Lexie to be the one not on the plane if that was the case, except that she dies there. So, I think that if Lexie didn't die, she wouldn't have really needed to be on the plane and Alex could've. But then we'd need another attending so who would that be? I think character wise, Owen would make a lot of sense, but job wise I don't think that tracks. I think job wise Bailey would make a lot of sense, but character wise I just don't see her fitting in. I think the best option for both character and job related reasons would be Teddy. But does that mean Cristina wouldn't be there? I don't think so. I think Teddy would've gone with Cristina because Teddy trusts Cristina and likes working with her and would want her to be there.

Anyways.

TLDR; What if? What if different people were on the plane?

[buck-yyyy]

alright. for the past week or so i've been thinking a lot about the ST fandom space on tumblr, and i'm gonna be so blatantly honest--the "hive mind" that we all talk about and love, especially when it comes to byler, is starting to feel like a bad thing. i feel like we've built up a lot of unrealistic expectations for what season five is going to look like, and for lack of better available phrasing... i really wish that that mindset had never formed.

(to be clear--i am including myself in this criticism!! i am not excluded from what i am saying in the slightest. just to make sure none of you think i'm saying i'm exempt from it or that i think i'm better than anyone, because i am NOT)

anyways, i made this tier-list to be as show-accurate as possible in terms of each character's relevance. stranger things is an ensemble show, but not every character is going to be given the same amount of screen time or have the same amount of attention paid to their storylines, and i think that the division between primary, secondary, and tertiary protagonists in the show is often misconstrued in ways that lead people to believe that a lack of focus on a character's story is some sort of bigoted failing on the writers' part.

(this is not about lucas, erica, or patrick. every single criticism of the way their storylines have been handled by the writers, especially with the treatment of lucas and erica, is absolutely true. this show has a racism problem, fucking acknowledge it).

anyways, to the best of my ability, i've put the protagonists and antagonists in order of their importance/prevalence to the main story*. they have separate tiers, because i don't feel they're fully comparable.

this has nothing to do with what characters i like the most, or how well i think that their stories were written/pulled off--this is simply my own examination of how each character feeds into the fundamentals of what stranger things is. this does not take theories or speculation into account--this is SOLELY based strictly on the text.

i'm not including edward, rosemary, or any other speculative theory-based characters, because 1. i'm trying to be unbiased and don't want to favor specific theories over some i haven't heard of, and 2. they are moreso subtext than text at the moment. no i'm not counting newspapers or set design as text. sorry if that comes across as rude.

owens is in his own category because i cannot for the life of me figure out whether or not he's actually a good guy. chrissy, patrick, and fred are also in their own category because they're not necessarily protagonists, but they're certainly not antagonists--they're more devices in the story than anything else.

there's definitely room for improvement, and i'm very much open to criticism on how i've structured this--but please for the love of god just keep it constructive, don't call me an idiot or be condescending because i didn't take your theories into account when putting this together. i'm just one dude!!!

anyways. the biggest reason i made this is because i am firmly of the opinion that vickie being under-developed compared to other main ships is NOT lesbophobic, it's simply the fact that robin is not a primary protagonist and is therefore not going to be paid the same amount of screen time as certain other characters. it sucks that vickie is a carbon-copy of robin, and it sucks that she's barely gotten any characterization, especially since amy mcnulty is an incredible actor, but it isn't subtle or unintentional homophobia. it's the fact that robin (and by extension, her love interest) is not as important to the story as ships including one or multiple of the primary protagonists.

*flayed!billy (ST3) and billy hargrove (ST2) are noted as different characters and have different places in the tier-list, as are henry, vecna, the mindflayer, and the meatflayer.

[chenlopez]

9-1-1 is definitely an ensemble show even with big names like Angela Bassett, Peter Krause and Jennifer Love Hewitt.

Yeah it is. It meets all the criteria. It doesn’t have a “main” character, but it does have actors who are contracted to have more screen time. If that makes sense? Lonestar isn’t an ensemble show. It has a main character and then it trickles down like a pyramid. You have Owen, then Tommy/TK then Carlos/Judd/Grace followed by Mateo, Paul, Nancy, Marjan etc. they’re all paid as main cast because they are the cast of the show. But that’s more to do with how series regulars are paid blah blah. Rob is the main actor. And everyone else follows the call sheet in how much time they get allocated. But OG shares more time between characters, giving most of them pretty frequent storyline’s no matter how “important” they are off screen.

[braveclxrke]

not to be salty on main but that ep was so good because the writers actually used the amazing ensemble cast they have and didn’t just focus on you know who Owen and Gwyn look at the amazing episodes you can have when you involve the other characters in your show e.g Carlos Nancy Grace Tommy 

[lovecolibri]

SaL anon here friend and, well, that was an intesting start to LS. So my quick review is I loved the 126 interactions, both during and outside of the emergency, apparently this is Tim's strong suit since it involved the actual ensemble and felt world's away from where the OG interactions are now. I absolutely hate the Owen plot, it makes no sense and is giving me flashbacks of another show's awkward attempt at a white supremacist storyline, but with thankfully less visions 🙄🙄🙄. And then

we have the Tarlos storyline. I'm not outright against it, even with how nonsensical it is. You and I are veterans of Plothole NM, we've seen worse. But that storyline has a lot of heavy lifting to do and it already started on a bad note. I know the reason Carlos hasn't brought this up in 3 years is the writers didn't know it was happening till a few months ago (planned since S1 my ass Tim) but I'm going to need an onscreen explanation, this is talk that should have happened. And I do want to see Carlos have a plotline that's his own where he gets to grow and his issues are addressed, the character deserves that. But they better be careful how they handle it cause the scene last episode and interview clips I've seen aren't encouraging. I'm not super thrilled at the "I'm a bad friend" line from Carlos, addressed to his FIANCE, who he just dropped this huge bombshell on. And since we know Iris isn't signing divorce papers next episode, that she's apparently "vetting" TK next episode (seriously girl, take a seat), and her and Carlos's friendship is going to make TK feel like an outsider, this character has got me super wary. Maybe it's an overreaction, but we just got done with a show where a straight woman got in the middle of the queer couple and was frequently prioritized, I'm don't want to see it again. If she says one mean or judgmental thing to TK I'll shove her in the plothole she crawled out of.

Hello my friend! It was so good to not only have some weewoos back, but my watching ritual is going to my grandmas to chill, watch together, and talk about the show after while we work on puzzles so I overall had a great Tuesday (aside from constantly thinking it was Monday lol). I also really enjoyed the 126 and the interpersonal scenes. Everyone bagging on Owen all episode was hilarious to me personally, the Judd/TK dynamic is as delightfully brotherly as always, Nancy and Mateo are adorable, and Nancy calling Tommy out was SO funny, and Brianna’s delivery continues to be on point. I wanted more Marjan and Paul as always but they also got their quips in and seeing the teams in action felt good! I agree that things definitely felt way less forced than OG felt this season.

NGL you said “thankfully less visions” and I was *scrambling* to remember what happened in OG 911 about visions before I realized it was about RNM s3 and I had just fully suppressed that stupid vision plot from my brain 🤣🤣🤣 I do think this show will handle things better than RNM did, but that is saying absolutely nothing because RNM did it SO badly sooo 🤷🏻‍♀️ My main gripe with this, as with most of Owen’s storylines, is that they are centralized around NO ONE ELSE in the main cast, and since he gets most of the screentime, it’s going to mean LESS time for everyone and everything else. Judd and Grace and Tommy are all involved in each other’s “personal” storylines even just as someone to talk/vent to, plus Tommy has TK and Nancy as well to talk to, TK and Carlos obviously have each other as to Mateo and Nancy, we’ve had some great Paul/Marjan stuff especially last season and when the show started, we had lots of good Owen/TK and Judd/Owen scenes, plus a few good scenes with Owen and Tommy or Michelle as captains. Even Billy had a connection to Judd and Grace, and wanted to be over the 126 so that wasn’t entirely separated either, but everything else for Owen has been focused outside of the team. Even the Owen/Marjan stuff in the opener last season was them being separated most of the time and unaware they were both in the same place. And here’s the thing, I LIKE the Owen scenes with the main characters! I like the banter, and he has some really great moments as a dad/father figure and as a captain. But every time it becomes all about a character outside of the 126 it just falls SO flat for me. So add to that mess the fact they want to address white nationalism in Texas by having him go undercover for the FBI? Hard pass. I care zero percent about what they do with this storyline. I HOPE they at least use Owen’s love for his team and the diverse minorities they represent as an anchor point for this storyline but still. Can we go back to him having cancer and trauma and dealing with it by being a good captain and making sure his team takes care of their physical and mental health please? (I’ve been re-watching s1 and like...there was some GOOD stuff there with him and the team and I miss that energy!) I will say I am SOOOOO excited to see him and Andrea Reyes being wedding-zillas about the Tarlos wedding because THAT is the kind of Owen shenanigans I can enjoy!

As for the Tarlos storyline I’m willing to see where it goes for sure because I do think Tim had the thought ages ago (without considering how the characters have changed since their first concept came to be while planning s1) and I also think it’s going to give US some good backstory and depth for Carlos, and it’s going to give RAFAEL some meaty stuff to work with and stretch his acting chops which will be fun to see. HOWEVER. My main gripe is just...the sheer number of MASSIVE plotholes/questions this storyline creates, and a lot of that has to do with them never leaving ANY clues that this could be a thing. 

Andrea (and possibly Gabriel) knows? Because a) this 100% should have come up as part of the reason for the s2 misunderstanding about why Carlos hadn’t told them about TK even if it was a vague and cut-off conversation we weren’t fully apart of. And b) HOW MUCH and WHEN did she know? Because if she’s known all along it’s WEIRD that it hasn’t come up even accidentally at all especially in s2, AND it doesn’t track with Carlos saying they did it for “normalcy” reasons if they were dating other people and no one seems to have known anything about it by the way they have all acted for 4 seasons.

As stated above, Iris was dating someone for ages before she disappeared! And no one said anything about her “stepping out” on her husband? Was everyone in the know that it was a sham? And if so, then why do it at all? 

Also, Iris wasn’t doing it to use his medical insurance since she wasn’t diagnosed until after she was found and at that point she was still refusing treatment. 

If she HAD been using his insurance recently and the “marriage” was an excuse to keep her coverage up all this time, wouldn’t Carlos have been getting her insurance statements when they paid a bill? And getting the bills for her deductibles and stuff? Surely TK would have seen the mail at this point?

Carlos was allowed to help in the investigation and was never under suspicion himself? Even when they found the truck and blood, he was allowed to take part and it never once came up that he shouldn’t be allowed because he was legally her husband? 

Wouldn’t it have come up when they were talking about wills that legally half of everything Carlos has or has bought (INCLUDING THE LOFT) legally belongs to his wife? (ONE good thing is that we didn’t get this reveal while Carlos was unconscious in the hospital, can you even imagine?!)

I KNOW there are more things I’m forgetting but that’s just questions off the top of my head and it’s already so much! Had Timmy put in like, the barest effort to include some crumbs, we all could have had an OH SHIT THIS is what *xyz* scene was about?! Which could have been fun! But by dropping it entirely only to bring it up in season 4, it’s just created a bit of a mess. Hopefully we get the answer to some of these questions in the next couple of episodes but none of that changes that the actual build up SHOULD have been there because there were ample opportunities to sneak hints and instead it still just comes out of nowhere. 

As for Iris herself, I’m already really heated about the slap because like, that was SO unnecessary. Like a hug, then playful punch to the arm, then hug again could have had the comedic effect I know they were going for, but using a full on bitch slap across the face is NEVER funny. Can you imagine if Eddie had slapped Shannon when she returned after ghosting him? Why is it okay in this case then?? ANYWAY, I know what they were TRYING to do but it absolutely did not work for me. I’m also a little leery of how they seem to have “cured” Iris off screen after the last we heard (in season ONE) was that she didn’t want treatment (though maybe the mentioned her when they mentioned Michelle leaving? I honestly don’t remember). I’m just not sure what they are planning to do with her, and if it’s going to work, especially if they make her the “bad guy” keeping Tarlos apart by holding the divorce papers hostage. I have avoided the interviews because as much as I would like Tim back on OG for his arc planning skills, mostly coherent storylines, main character focus, good emergencies, and overall tight ship running, I still don’t particularly want to hear what he has to say 🤷🏻‍♀️ I think we could get some good stuff of TK talking out his feelings which will be nice and I do feel like this is different from the sponsor thing last season because Iris isn’t a legitimate prospect for Carlos. However, I’m absolutely with you. “If she says one mean or judgmental thing to TK I'll shove her in the plothole she crawled out of.” I’m zero percent attached to her character, we barely even saw her in s1 and it’s been ages since then, and I’d much rather see Tarlos scenes of them working this out between them rather than a bunch of scenes with her instead but we’ll see how things go!

I am excited about the Tommy storyline though, and I was excited to see D.B. Woodside since I loved him in Lucifer. Mostly though, I’m really hoping to get more Marjan, Paul, Nancy, and Mateo because like...damn. It’s about fucking time. No matter what, at this point I am curious, excited, and ready for more!  

[post-modern-prometheus]

Hey so I saw how in one of your answered asks you mentioned about the main characters being tied together for a reason. And I agree 100%. Like I think of everything they’ve gone through and it makes sense. Especially since considering ever single one (besides Jonathan but he heard Nancy calling for him when she went in the tree and other events) was in the upside down and able to survive. Like they have this survival thing going and while normally I’m annoyed by it I think it makes sense in this show. Especially considering the upside down/government was able to get into everyone’s houses. Byer’s house is obvious, Barb dies in Steve’s swimming pool by the demogorgon, wheelers house had gotten affected by the gov when they came to ask about El in season 1, dart was found in Dustin’s trash can, hopper’s house had gotten rigged and a lot of stuff happened in his cabin, and max’s house had gotten infected with billy. The only house it hasn’t it fully was Lucas’. Also it is weird that Steve knocked on the byer’s door when Nancy and Jonathan were going to fight the demogorgon. And how in season 2 the mindflayer and demodogs only went after the lab and them. There was no mention of hopper dealing with someone who had seen or heard these strange noises. And now with the promo mottos being the beginning of the end and vecna saying you’re suffering is almost at an end and owens saying to el that her friends are in the eye of a storm which is a war brewing. There has to be something there and also there have been talks about things being a coincidence in the show (which most often gets brushed off also in the show). Like there’s been so many indications about it and my brain goes crazy. There has to be a reason that these people are connected to the upside down and tied together.

HI YES!!!! it's like. there has to be something there. there HAS to be. because every single character is important. in this ensemble show, every character is a main character (or at least that's how it felt in s1.....) and every character is or should be as important to the plot as every other one. im thinking about the gravity falls finale and how even all the random background characters all had a fated part to play in bringing down bill. when we get this upside down lore, i hope there's something about fate or maybe someone orchestrating smth etc etc. there has GOTTA be something there. because only "important" characters know about the upside down. only the main characters know. and once you know, you're IN it. somehow, they all end up back IN IT. esp in s1 when the plot weaved together so brilliantly (coming out once again as a s1 stand and s3 anti). like when something happens it happens to Everyone. THERE HAS TO BE SOMETHING THERE.

[lonestarbabe]

Some fans on here might not be aware (of Rob’s influence and pull behind the scenes) but I am and I still get annoyed about it because there are other shows where actors are executive producers and all of this stuff but they don’t have storylines revolving around them. I just think that whole thing (the explanation of Rob’s role/influence offscreen) is played out. Because yeah I get it but that just makes me side eye him and everyone else like Tim and the writers even more because we (this is just my assumption- for most of us on here at least) are not watching for him. It’s just so unprofessional to me because like I said there are other popular shows just like this one where main lead actors have pull behind the scenes and the storylines don’t revolve around just their character. I get it- I know who Rob lowe is and all of that. But I still don’t care? I still think it’s stupid that we have to get the Owen strand show half the time? And if they’re gonna give us this much of his screen time they could at least make him develop as a character and likable. But they don’t 90% of the time sooo what’s their excuse. I’m just tired of people using the whole ‘well rob lowe is (insert whatever role/influence offscreen)’ so that excuses why we have to suffer through his mostly cringe scenes’ when it doesn’t even have to be like that imo

Season three has been better for me in that respect because they aren't as Owen-centric, but I do agree that generally speaking it has been pretty unlikable how they've been pushing Owen as Mr. Hot Action Man (sigh), and like you said, I want to see development if they spend time on Owen! I honestly would think his flaws were great if they actually used those flaws meaningfully (it's like TK has a lot of the same flaws but they actually use his to take his character places!)

A lot of ensemble shows will have the character who gets A LOT of screen time, which I can live with. It's not always my ideal character, but it's fine in most shows. Yet, it's different when you completely miss out on perspectives and stories of other characters. And obviously, when there are underrepresented characters who pushed aside to give a white man the chance to swoop in and be the hero... it's worse...plenty of room for criticism there.

Although, I do think that Rob Lowe speaks to a lot of the demographic who watches Lone Star, which is slightly more outside the 18-49 demo than 9-1-1. There's also the discrepancy between fan circles and just the normal people who watch without the extra engagement. But none of that means we can't want the show to have better balance!

[nolitetebastardescarborundorum]

911 is an ensemble show. Despite having a big star with basset on the show I feel like everyone of the mains has the same amount of screentime and his spotlight.

That's not the case with lone star. Owen is dominating ¾ of every episode. I don't love the show nearly as much as 911 because of that. He's my least favorite character and just super boring and arrogant imo. His plot revolves around his appearance and now this ego battle with his ex wife. It's just so bland and meh. And unlike bobby he's just not sympathetic at all.

We're 20 episodes in this show and still barely know nothing about marjan, besides that she's Muslim and was engaged, Paul besides that he's trans and Carlos besides the episode with his parents. I would like to see their begins episodes or at least an ongoing plot for them over multiple episodes. Enough with Owen

[stormyoceansmain]

What’s your opinion on 911 vs lone star? Do you have a preference and what do you like about one compared to the other etc.?

im gonna be honest here, as much as i surprisingly enjoyed watching lone star and i do love most of the characters, i think the og series is on a completely different level when it comes to.. pretty much everything tbh, so there's really no question about which one i prefer: hands down, the og is one of the best show i've ever watched and i love it so much that it's actually hard to put it into words

i personally don't think lone star is half as bad as some people make it out to be, though, i just think it's an entirely different beast, so if you get into it expecting to find an exact copy of the og you' re definitely going to be disappointed, but i started watching it after being thoroughly warned and i liked it way more than other shows i started and then abandoned halfway through

in a sense, i think lone star is way more of a typical procedural show than the og, because it's way less character-driven and the episodes are more self contained (the biggest example i can think about for this is the difference between the disaster episodes in the two shows: the earthquake, the tsunami, and even the dam break/mudslide in the og span over more episodes and it's hard to watch only one of them because the storyline flows from an episode to the other, connecting them, while the volcano and the wild fire in lone star feel like two very separated things, and there's only tim's death giving a sort of continuity between the two, but i watched the crossover episode before watching lone star and i still got the gist of it), and my main issue with this kind of more traditional procedurals is that they do tend to have an ensemble cast, but more often than not they are not an ensemble show, because they usually give the focus only to one or two characters, while the others remain on the side

i guess i can understand that with lone star they tried to gather to viewers who are more into this genre, but the problem is that even in this kind of traditional procedural you need to have those one or two compelling main characters to drive the show and keep the viewers interested (like mulder and scully in the x files), and to me owen is simply not good enough to carry lone star by himself (they also tried it with michelle in season 1, but she wasn't that good either imho)

i think that if the writers made their peace with the fact that lone star will never work out as a typical procedural, and leaned back towards the structure of the og, then the show would benefit from it immensely, because as much as they tried to change it up, its strength remains the ensemble cast, so they need to start giving all the characters the storylines and the screentime they deserve (which is what i like the most about the og, btw, because even with the ridiculous amount of characters they now have i still think everyone gets their time to shine)