#not that the religious aspect of hazbin hotel has anything to do with it

[thesecretfawn]

i don’t judge kids because i didn’t turn 18 and forget everything i ever went through but i see a kid with a hazbin hotel layout and i will appear as if i was born 45 years old in a Christian church pew

[mrfleshwizard]

Hello,i see you like deep diving into religious stuff well i have the thing to say....

THE BINDING OF ISAAC (obvious reference) (its a game,i remember watching russian analysis or explaination video about lore)

when I look at the design of characters who are all kinds of deities or important figures from religions in Hotel Hazbin... they look awful,very loreless and most importantly, not close to the original but damn it, there was some way to explain it, some way

in TBOI,the characters there also don't look particularly close to the original (and same in silhouette), but this can be explained by the fact that the main character (ISAAC) has a rather traumatized imagination and terrible life, maybe he sees the figures as himself because he feels sinfull... and here we move on to the topic of the issues with the family in TBOI & HH

Isaac and Charlie they are not similar characters but they have somewhat same shit

they both have divorced parents,who loved their children very much in TBOI This is an important aspect that reveals Isaac as a character and I forgot to say that he is not himself a religious figure, but he strongly refers to this writing,Isaac himself here is a very young kid who was raised in christian family and experinced parents' quarrel and he thinks its his fault

In HH, this is like a very dramatic crap, but it's not even necessary to explain particularly deeply revealing things here, so remember that Lucifer was supposed to be a not particularly supportive father in a dark matter? yes, fuck with that, he's a CUTIE WHO PARADISE LET DOWN THE MIDDLE FINGER ON HIM and of course he went dramatically into the abyss which become hell itself and Lilith left her family incomprehensibly.. in TBOI this is due to the fact that Isaac's father was an alcoholic

welp someone said that Charlie is like a self-insert of the author himself and if you take this fact seriously, lol Isaac is also like a self-insert in fact is that the creator of TBOI, Edmund McMillen growing up in a Christian family and in short, he read the Bible and many related things to this religion and he believed less in God in fact, but that's not the point,TBOI essentially reflects his difficult childhood, his family suffered from drugs and alcohol, he was a fragile child of yours, he drew a lot of monsters and the family not liked that

so what the point of the story? : An experienced indie game developer can do better than some rich animator-artist who was too lazy to watch YouTube videos about Christianity

and i will also say that TBOI is also critique of christianity but not naive like HH do. Its more realistic,you should watch videos about that

-oni anon

I remember this game! I watched gameplay of it when I was very young. I barely remember anything of this game. Thank you for reminding me of it.

I never thought of TBOI as a critique of christinaty, probably becouse I was young when I watched the gameplay.

Well, the fact that indie gamę devolper might do better job at something than Rich person isn't surprising. Viv doesn't really have an passion to things she creates and it's sad.

Thank you oni anon. I hope you will have an beautiful day and an great life.

:)

[teeth-cable]

Heres an issue I've been thinking on that I don't see anyone talking about in them critical space. I wrote a long ass ask to another blog about how Vivziepop sucks at portraying ethnic groups but its was and since your on the topic of Vivziepop FUCKING up basic religions I want to send something more organized and specific. I have an issue as an ethnically Jewish person with Rosie.

I will preface this by stating I am disconnected with my culture but I am trying to reconnect and I am not practicing. I actually would welcome people more connected than me or practitioners to add to this or correct me.

So we know Rosie is supposed to resemble a Jewish mother... I feel gross with that phrasing because there's a lot. Like again I'm disconnected but why did Vivziepop have to specify Jewish Mother? Like this almost feels like a stereotype and the best faith things I could guess is Vivziepop just thinks jews are a religious group or is just ignorant in general. The thing about our religion is that it's mostly closed... Like typically as far as I'm aware you can only practice if you are ethnically Jewish. So she wrote this in an official document highlighting a character specifically being jewish in a way that feels gross.

Another thing is you literally can't have a setting set in hell with Jewish characters because Hell doesn't exist in the Torah (the holy book) like all that stuff that Jesus said contradicts what was already written which is why Jews don't worship or see Jesus as the Messiah. I'm unsure if he is viewed as a prophet or not. I know in Islam he is seen that way.

I forget the name of the afterlife but basically when bad people die they only suffer for a year and everyone goes to the same place.

Also Rosie possibly being Jewish makes no logical sense because to be Jewish your mom has to be and her mother before her. It's a matriarchal aspect though there are a few places that accept patriarchal descent that is a recent thing. Rosie is Hellborn last I checked and sinners can't reproduce with Hellborns so.... How the fuck is she Jewish?

Then her being a cannibal is very off-putting because a lot of people who barely know anything about Judaism know that Jews usually have a specific diet practice. Now not everyone knows the name of it but it's called Kosher. And yes not everyone practices it is still widely known we aren't supposed to like eat stuff that comes from pigs. It's a bit fucked that the only Jewish character is a cannibal... That probably is connected to some anti semitic stereotype somewhere that I'm unaware of since there's a fuck ton.

Also Vivziepop wants an ethinically accurate cast but instead of specifically asking for a jewish actress she mentioned someone who sounds like a jewish mother... What does that even mean?

Like unlike the goblins from the series that must not be named, this reeks of ignorance instead of malice. Especially, since we know Vivziepop absolutely refuses to do research for her shows that require literally more than a 10 minute google search.

Like you can't fully separate an ethnically Jewish character from the religion itself unlike uh a character from Spain can be separated from Christianity. Like our blood and religion are deeply tied together especially as we are being prosecuted throughout history and still managing to survive it all because of it.

Like if you absolutely want a jewish character in Hazbin your gonna need a sensitivity reader and have to make them a sinner.

The character I see get talk about most about antisemitism in Hazbin Hotel is Mimzy and Rosie is just an "Ah-Ha!" moment for critics because her leak bio directly confirmed it. While there can a discussion if Mimzy can technically count as an Jewish stereotype because we don't know if she's Jewish or not, I found Rosie to be more egregious because Viv used the line, "Rosie has a strong presence and confident energy as a Jewish mother." First what is that even supposed to mean? And second by this description Viv see Rosie as a Jewish character and will code her as such.

I think the critics forget Rosie will be a recurring side character in the show which is why we haven't seen many discussions yet about what it means for Rosie's character to be Jewish coded.

I will said Viv's ignorance is getting to a point of malice to me since she very aware of the criticism she gets for characters like Velvette and Alastor and her not doing research and purposely spreading misinformation because of it is icky. Like this woman has to know eventually she can't just keep making up information of POC groups and religions out of nowhere and has to hire someone from those groups to help her. If Viv really did care about researching about these group for good rep she would have consulted with them first. If Viv hired a Jewish person to help her write Rosie, she would have learned about the problems you addressed with Rosie being a Hellborn who is jewish and the weird implications she added like making the only Jewish character into a cannibal. Viv has claimed Hell is supposed to take inspiration from different religions and cultures but that's just not true because Viv's hell is clearly christian inspired with a hint of demonology elements.

I'm unsure how she would even make the idea work in the first place if Christianity's hell is supposed to be the main setting in Hazbin Hotel and Helluva because different religions have different rules and interpretations of Hell, Heaven, and the characters, heck some religions don't even have Heaven and Hell like what we discuss here.