#no way would hori do this so outright

[ofmermaidstories]

i just wanted to say as a long time reader i'm so happy to hear your thoughts on the ending, because i feel like so many people were very "this is the worst ending ever and it ruined the series" or "this ending was perfect and anyone who disagrees just didn't understand the story" when i think neither is really true at all lol... like it's okay to take what you need from the ending and agree and disagree with certain parts! no perfect story exists because if it did then writers would stop writing! but i'm still so excited to see where your love of the series takes you in the future, and i'm grateful that you share your work with us always :) i hope you have a good week!

i love the series too much to swing blindly either way. 🥹 and i understand/can see perfectly how like, there’d be readers who’d be upset with the wrap up, or otherwise feel the knee-jerk reaction to defend it from all criticism. 🥺 i’m not one of them though. 🥹 hori achieved what he set out to do (tell a very specific story about a boy learning what it means to dream, and the cost and responsibility of gaining and losing them), there’s just some pot holes on the road to it. 🥺 and maybe they could’ve (should’ve) been addressed, maybe easily, maybe not (maybe it’s a problem for when the road was first built, in terms of foundation or missing approval plans, maybe) but the road still works. we still get there in the end. 🥹

i had fun the entire time, even with the complaints lmao. i agree with you, anon! like, i don’t think perfect creators/writers exist. we all have blind spots, or biases that otherwise skewer what we try to achieve. i think flaws make creators and their creations interesting!!!!!! if anything i think that tells you more about them and their work than the things they get right does. The way Hori protects and almost babies his hero boys—his men—from their consequences, lmao, like he’s almost too scared to truly hurt them in the long run? He always just shies away from saying things outright—things are always left just open enough that he can back peddle later on, fix things. The complete dry lack of romance, despite him taking pains to hint at it and the way it’s guarded among Ochako and Tsyu like some precious, girlish secret. 💀 Idc what anyone says about that last one, I don’t believe he’s deliberately subverting expectations—I think he’s just bad at writing romance (that isn’t unintended 💀) and also a coward, lmao.

But that’s the stuff that’s fun! It’s fun to pick it apart and then it’s fun to piece it back together either by writing fic or trying to find fics that have like, the fix-its you want. 🥹 Hori’s flaws and deliberate gaps are what makes it the perfect sandbox we know and love. and i think he knows that, tbh—there’s so many tiny things he hints at, throughout the story, that we just never get full explanations of. The UA robot uprising, lmao. The cyberwar after the kids leave school, mentioned in this last chapter?? The fact that he’s plotted out the past users lives, and is just kinda like—eh, yeah, i’m never gonna tell. LOL. Maybe what I keep calling cowardice is just a misjudgement of the lines he draws for himself, in the sand. 🧐🥺 I guess we won’t know, lmao.

i’m waffling. Anon, I hope you’re having a good start to your week. 🥹 Thank-you for being so nice, specifically with your last words—there’s a lot I wanna write for MHA!!! I’m excited to start something new that gets to play with what Hori left for us. 🥹 Like Lili said in her earlier ask—I’d like to write them a hundred other happy endings, too. 🥹

[sapphic-agent]

I read your analysis and anti bakugou posts and I want to say thank you!

Going to be kinda long so I’m sorry!

There is another fandom where there is character exactly like bakugou; angry, violent, egotistical and target his hate and aggression to one person only.

the character name is Jiāng cheng from the MDZS novel. But the narrative in the story doesn’t treat all the shit that jerk did as right, it the opposite. He seen as vile that nobody want to associate with (getting banned from all the match making places in the story even)

He never takes the spotlight of the two main nor he is redeemed characters instead seen as pathetic and arrogant jerk he is. The MC, Wei wuxian who was his adoptive brother (not really more like a servant that got treated like a dog) cut ties with him in the end.

He a well written and rounded character but the character personality is shit and I don’t really like him. And the narrative isn’t treating him any differently than being a piece of shit

Why I’m telling you this? Because I feel like if MHA have been written by someone who isn’t Hori bakugou would not have gotten away with the shit he did in the story.

beside the point of the way the narrative treat Jiang cheng, it’s the fandom. When I got into the MDZS fandom I was so disappointed to see bakugou stans 2.0 there but instead of bakugou it’s Jiang cheng.

Both bakugou and Jiang cheng get the same treatment in the fandom as “UWU needs to protect the angry violent person” and “it’s the MC fault our cute UWU baby didn’t do anything wrong” and lots of stuff that I bet you seen in the bnha fandom

It’s sad that even if the story shows that what Jiang cheng wasn’t right (unlike bakugou case where the story doesn’t make him have any consequences) people would outright be mean to other people just because they follow the canon prototype of the character in their fics (I seen it and it’s horrible)

And, in fics it’s seems that every time that Jiang cheng appears in the scene he makes everyone OOC (if the fic is sticking to canon personality). Makes them act like they won’t ever act; it’s the same thing with bakugou (in canon and fanon respectively sadly)

I love to call it the “black hole effect” when a certain character just make the scenes about them no matter the context, like a black hole.

Im sorry this is all over the place, im not really good with words and i used to be pretty active in both fandoms but now its really hard because bakugou and Jiang cheng stans are overall tiring to deal with and they seems to grow up in numbers everyday and yeah… 👍

Have a nice day and week!

Hi! I've never read it but it sounds interesting.

I always try to tell Bakugou stans, it's not the fact that Bakugou's an awful person. I don't care about that. Fictional characters aren't real and can be liked for whatever even if they're vile pieces of shit. It's okay to like a vile piece of shit.

What's not okay is creating that vile piece of shit and then brushing over and never calling out their horrible actions. What's not okay is everyone around them condoning their behavior. What's not okay is pandering to them over their victims. What's not okay is never making them face consequences for their actions. What's not okay is constantly putting them on a pedestal for doing the bare minimum.

Look at Vegeta (RIP Toriyama). Vegeta is always getting humbled and called out. He is never going to surpass Goku because never getting what he wants is part of his retribution. Considering his actions, he should be worse than Bakugou. But he's a way better character because of how the narrative and the other characters treat him.

(You can even compare specific instances. When Bakugou rushed ahead and attacked Kurogiri and got Thirteen seriously hurt, no one said a thing to him and he still won all his fights. He faced zero repercussions. When Vegeta let Cell absorb 18, he immediately got his ass kicked and had to get saved by Trunks and Krillin. Vegeta's actions always affect him terribly, Bakugou's actions always affect everyone else terribly while he gets off scott-free)

DBZ came out decades ago and it still created a better character arc than a 2010s-2020s manga. Horikoshi could have easily given Bakugou a proper redemption arc. He chose not to

[anti-katsuki-lounge]

I always remember how when Todoroki pointed out that without him and Izuku intervening, Ida and Native would have died, and the chief didn't refute him. Motherfucker really doubled down and said they were still in the wrong.

Ok, so for a long time, the Police Chief scene bothered me and now I know why: Hori’s trying to push a message but uses the wrong scenario to do so.

In this scene, he’s trying to criticize vigilantism, which is an understandable stance to have. That’s what Tenya’s arc is about. It’s about how people shouldn’t be allowed to inflict their own sense of justice onto others and instead there are rules in place that tells us right from wrong. Tenya saw that Stain nearly killed his brother and decided that the appropriate punishment was to kill Stain. He learns at the end of this that his emotions shouldn’t get in the way of the law. Whether this is a message you guys agree with is up to you.

The thing is though, Izuku and Shoto weren’t out playing vigilantes. They weren’t looking to kill/apprehend Stain by their own nor were they even hunting for him to begin with. What they did was learn that their friends were in trouble and immediately rushed to help. While Japan doesn’t have an outright “Good Samaritan Law”, they have a law that serve as the equivalent of said laws:

"An act a person was compelled to take to avert a present danger to the life, body, liberty or property of oneself or any other person is not punishable only when the harm produced by such act does not exceed the harm to be averted; provided, however, that an act causing excessive harm may lead to the punishment being reduced or may exculpate the offender in light of the circumstances."

Both Shoto and Izuku shouldn’t have gotten into trouble. Both aimed to avert a form of danger to Tenya’s life, which was Stain. You can argue that they might’ve used excessive force, but Stain was an S class villain at the time and neither Izuku or Shoto were aiming to kill him. I think hitting Stain with some fire and super powered punches is acceptable force here as long as it doesn’t cause permanent damage to Stain, especially seeing as Stain had to be knocked unconscious or else he would’ve continued being a threat. Now, you can argue that they didn’t call the cops or a pro hero but they didn’t have the time too do so. Gran Torino and Endeavor had their hands full and we all know the cops would’ve been too late. Ultimately, they were well within the law to do what they did.

Now, I get why they couldn’t get credit, cause if they did, Tenya’s actions would’ve had to be exposed and he could’ve gotten into some serious legal trouble, but the Police Chief shouldn’t have talked down to Izuku and Shoto nor should he have told them that they were wrong at any point.

[super-paper]

The sudden uptick of people who are now convinced that “Tomura never wanted to talk with Izuku/has never actually wanted to be saved or associated Izuku with the idea of being saved/was only thinking about Izuku in the first place bc he hates him and he’s actually just been fantasizing about kicking his ass this whole time(???😭)/etc” is funny, in a way— bc from what I’ve seen pretty much everyone has been disregarding how the incident pictured below is one of the most 100% damning moments we’ve gotten in the series so far:

Like, just to hammer things home:

This scene is followed immediately by a scene where he doesn’t hesitate to unleash Decay (after he gets warped to the UA coffin). Hori draws further attention to Tomura’s initial resistance by having AFO tell him “not to interrupt him this time” before he tries using Decay again— and this time he is able to use it without any interference from Tomura.

TomurAFO also has enough fine control over Decay at this point that his allies would not have been in danger if he had unleashed it when the battle first began. Which leads us to our next point…..

I’ve seen people argue that Tomura was intervening to save Dabi, and I can see how the paneling might’ve lent to this particular interpretation when the chapter first dropped— but in my honest opinion, the sequence of events reads more like: AFO realizes that Tomura isn’t going to let him use decay → AFO tries to order Dabi to unleash hellfire on the heroes instead since that’s the next strongest AOE attack on their side → Dabi says “fuck you old man I do what I want” and proceeds to do exactly what AFO wanted him to do anyway while screaming about Endeavor (my son who is never gonna beat those C rank intelligence allegations… 😭)

Nothing is outright text yet, sure, but this is still something that needs to be asked: if Tomura truly doesn’t want to talk with Izuku, truly doesn’t want to be saved, and truly hates Izuku just the same as everything else— then why try so hard to resist destroying what he supposedly hates? What’s the motivation here? Why not let AFO wipe all the heroes out and then just focus on getting his body back after the dust settles?

Izuku’s presence and absence are the key elements of consideration here— and if I may be blunt, certain parts of the fandom going well out of their way to repeatedly downplay the effect Izuku’s presence has on Tomura is more than a little disingenuous at this point.

All that being said—! I really need someone to call Tomura out about this scene eventually because the subsequent meltdown both in universe and out of it is going to be so, so funny.

[doodlegirl1998]

I do love send my thoughts here. And I was thinking about the trope the fandom loves to use in fics. "Izu is kidnaped" which I guess could work

But back at the day when Izu solo arc begins...many people were throwing jokes (if it wasnt "hahaha Inko or Ochako will beat him up" then it was "he is going to be kidnapee) and the butt of the joke is Izu needing be saved by friends....

But...BK was kidnaped and people use this to shit on Ayoama...

If Izu kidnap happened...then yeah it would serve to "look at BK saving Izu. He cares" or another joke.

What is my point here? I just dont get the hype for "Izu is kidnaped"?

Hi @mikeellee 👋,

Thank you :) I like answering your asks and hearing your thoughts too.

I think the hype for this trope in fanfics is so that the characters have an opportunity to show how much they (mainly class 1A and Dadzawa) care for Izuku and what lengths they would go to to get him back. It's largely a wish fulfillment story thread relating to the wish to see Class 1A as a family.

However, saying that, it is a very weird juxtaposition to see how fans leapt to dunk on Izuku or make jokes during his expense during the solo arc. Saying things like,

"I bet Todoroki is going to be so mad Izuku didn't confide in him about OFA then ran away. Right when Todoroki needs him after finding out about Dabi too. What a fake friend. 💔."

"I hope Bakugou tells Izuku off and beats some sense into him - how could you leave your soulmate behind, Deku? 🧡💚"

"I bet Uraraka is going to be so angry at Izuku for leaving her. I hope she yells at him and drags him home to UA for a shower! Stinky boy!"

"I hope we see Inko hit Izuku with her slipper for this! Haha."

None of this is funny to me. Izuku essentially was told flat out by AFO that he is a target of his. Izuku left his friends, his mother and his dream school because he felt they would be in danger by association with him. This decision hurt him immensely to take yet most of the fans fail to see this. Class 1A themselves fail to see this and claim mostly that he is looking down on them, while also allowing Bkg (someone openly hostile to Izuku) to lead them in a fight against him instead of approaching the situation empathetically like a friend would. Ok Hori, who is looking down on who here?

Class 1A, like the fans in their majority, only think of what they as Class 1A want in relation from Izuku, so they beat him down (literally and figuratively) -Bakugou gives a shit apology all about himself then Izuku collapses from exhaustion. And they drag Izuku back to UA.

Contrast with Bakugou's kidnapping - no one in the narrative and few fans outside of it recognise Bakugou's own fault in the situation. They use it to shit on Aoyama instead when;

Aoyama still, regardless of being the traitor, gave Izuku Shoji and Todoroki an opening to save Tokoyami and Bakugou from the LOV.

Bakugou refusing to leave the fight/retreat back to base even when named as a target of the LOV, only aided the LOV's kidnapping of him. Him retreating would have made the LOV's job much harder to kidnap him - if not outright prevented it in the first place.

The LOVs interest (mainly Shigaraki's) was only peaked due to Bakugou acting like a rabid Dog and UA being dumb enough to chain Bakugou up and present him to the press instead of fiegning illness for Bakugou or something.

TLDR- the fandom hype for the trope of "Izuku is kidnapped" is wish fulfilment for Class 1A as a family trope, Dadzawa trope (mostly) and some BkDk fans (those who like to see Bkg as Izuku's knight in shining armor in fics.)

How Bkg and Izuku are treated in their absences from UA (Izuku's solo arc and Bkgs kidnapping) contrasted by both the fandom and the narrative is gross.

Bakugou plays more (indirect) fault in how his kidnapping occurred and it is wrong to use this moment as a way to shit on Aoyama.

Izuku plays less fault in what had occurred and always had good intentions about leaving UA. Class 1A failed to show empathy to him in this situation and the fandom focused on everyone else's possible feelings about the situation rather than Izuku's. Which is sad especially as Izuku is meant to be the MC.

But I can't entirely blame them either... How long has it actually been since we have seen the story give Izuku's feelings any insight?

[the-nysh]

I have seen people on twitter that izuku shouldnt be treating shigaraki like a person that he needs to stop

(Tip: don't listen to those twitter takes, you'll have a much better time with the manga.) Cause this should be long established: how the designated 'villains' are human (victims - of society, circumstances, or even their own quirks) desperately in need of help (saving) too. Even Uraraka fundamentally understood this with Toga when she saved her from her despairing rampage, by treating/accepting her as the person she's always wanted to be (when she'd always been rejected as a 'demon'/'deviant' to even live as herself.)

And Shigaraki (Tenko) we've seen is one of the biggest trauma victims who was never saved (with great resentment), only exploited and explicitly groomed by AfO to become this - his personal Vessel of Mass Destruction. Where now Shiggy himself denies (outright refuses/rejects being saved or seen as human) and practically everyone and their mother (in-universe) expects and advises Deku to be prepared to kill him. This transcendent inhuman 'monster' as they in turn call him. But Deku is the only one who's seen the trapped human child Tenko still suffering within, and is adamant in choosing to use OfA as a power to save. Not to kill, as that is just the simple easy way out. That of course, most people in-universe (and apparently those on that side of the twitter-verse) expect of him and want him to do too. And that is precisely why this has become Deku's biggest challenge!! To do the opposite of what's typically expected, as his own brand of new gen hero. As a difficult battle not of power, but of clashing egos: to save the one who refuses to be saved and threatens to destroy all.

Which is proceeding exactly as Hori said it would from his 2022 Jump Festa message:

He’s the greatest obstacle in Deku’s goal of “saving”. Saving and Destroying are both born out of ego. Whose ego will win in the end? Is it even a matter of winning or losing? How will things go? What shall I do? What am I supposed to do??

So naturally we (the audience) should be cheering for Deku to succeed as the type of hero (who saves - Tenko included) that he's chosen to be. (And to what extent shall he be pushed and hindered by hurdles towards that goal? That is up to Hori's execution to decide!)

[ipsen]

touka and/or chie hori for the character asks pls pls

Touka and Chie! What a delight. (sorry about the wait. am tired)

Under the cut! I don't like taking up space.

Chie first!

one aspect about them i love

Her attitude! She's a free spirit and that's really admirable. Not a lot of people have the confidence and outlook she has to do the things she does (namely leaking CCG documents).

one aspect i wish more people understood about them

I don't do deep dives in the Chie fandom, unfortunately, so I don't think I really have anything here. I guess I wish she had more influence since she's an integral aspect of TG's overall world? Humans who aren't necessarily anti-human, but rather they clash with the "necessity" of the CCG, either through outright opposing it (she steals from them) or just overall vibes (doesn't let someone's status as ghoul or human define her opinion of them).

one (or more) headcanon(s) i have about this character

Studied software engineering, but not in college. Turns out you don't need university to gain the knowledge that a degree supposedly gets you!

one character i love seeing them interact with

Shuu "Let's Launch a Cyber Attack on CCG Servers with Piss Poor Equipment in the 24th Ward" Tsukiyama. I settle my case.

one character i wish they would interact with/interact with more

I'd say "women" as a general catch-all, but that's kind of cheating since TG doesn't like when women speak to each other. Hm... I wonder what her relationship to Kaneki was like. Maybe it's explored in the novels, but I haven't read them, so I have no idea how they actually interact. I'd also like to see her talk to Hinami because Hinami always needs more friends.

one (or more) headcanon(s) i have that involve them and one other character

In the event she were to meet Urie, he'd ask her for photographs to give him inspiration for his next art piece, and she'd ask him for his art pieces to inspire her where to go next in her travels. Very tranquil type of relationship.

--

Now for Touka!

one aspect about them i love

Her penchant for observing and understanding the people around her. It goes hand in hand with her ability to reach out to people and form connections with them, regardless of any existing friction between them. Her conversation with Amon in re 117 is particularly beautiful, because of how she encourages him and how he encourages her in return. Kindness begets kindness.

one aspect i wish more people understood about them

Her penchant for observing and understanding the people around her! Even Ishida himself kinda forgot that part of her (or rather, he put that part of her on hold), especially after re 125. Like, the Dragon arc could have been completely avoided if she had a bigger role in the narrative, but she basically gets put on standby (despite demonstrating a proactive attitude for those she cares about) until it's too late.

Because of that standby, I think people call her personality in re cardboard, which it isn't, but it comes off that way. I actually love her more in re because she's mellowed out a lot and has matured since the original series.

one (or more) headcanon(s) i have about this character

I think I said this before in an old post, but I think she has a stash of biology books lying around somewhere in preparation for her attendance of Kamii, a thread that never got revisited from the original series. Adding onto that, she collaborates with Kimi and the science team post-re to finally achieve that dream of hers (I treated myself when writing Holometabolism as well with this).

one character i love seeing them interact with

Again, saying "women" is cheating, but I have to say Hinami, who she ties with for 2nd favorite character in TG. Big Sister Touka is my favorite brand of Touka. Also Ayato. I love sibling interactions in general.

one character i wish they would interact with/interact with more

Kaya Irimi. This series is oversaturated with ukaku ghouls, but I wanted to learn more about Irimi after the Owl Suppression arc. Little Sister Touka would also be a good side to see.

one (or more) headcanon(s) i have that involve them and one other character

If it were up to me, I'd put Kaya and Touka in the same apartment, upon which they welcome Hinami with welcome arms. I just think the OG Anteiku crew would be a lot more close-knit than canon thinks they are. Minority solidarity, you know?

--

That's everything! Thanks for the ask

[redwingedwolves]

Sour Grouse, Corpse Reviver, and Sugar and Spice for the ask meme? :3

Hey, Auriel! Thanks so much for the ask! I'm gonna answer this for Keigo!

Ask Game

Sour Grouse: Is there something about the way your F/O is treated or characterized in their source that bothers you? Rant about it!

Honestly? I'm actually pretty happy with the way Hori treats Keigo in the manga, but one thing that I don't really like all that much is how he clings really hard to another character that I outright despise. And it's not just because I dislike this character, but because this character is just an overall really shit person. Keigo in canon seems to have a really big hero idolization of this character and I can't help but wanna scream at him over this. But all in all, it's actually a fairly overlooked fact thankfully so it actually doesn't bother me too too much.

Corpse Reviver: Do you notice any specific categories, types, or trends with your F/Os? What are they?

Honestly? I probably do, but I'm so horrible with being able to name things like this that I can't really tell you exactly what they are. XD Thinking about it I guess a very common trend with him is his self-sacrificing. He has several times tended to jump headlong into something without any real care for himself. Other than that, I can't think of anything to name just now. XP

Sugar and Spice: What three items/concepts would you say "make up" your F/O, metaphorically speaking?

This is basically like the previous one... I'm totally shit when it comes to listing specific things like this. XD I guess, if I really have to list off three things that I think 'make up' Keigo, I'd say they're 'fast', 'facade', and 'optimist'.

[ultraericthered]

He never outright promised anything, but from the most basic read on what the fundamental themes of the overarching narrative seemed to be at that point, readers cannot be blamed for thinking that the current generation of heroes were being set up to surpass the old generation and redeem that generation's failures not only by saving the world from a bunch of villains out to destroy it all (which is routine for superheroes and would not spark any major societal change) but by saving the souls of those very villains and reconciling their differences with them as human beings regardless of their labels, even if the villains would still have to face justice for all their atrocities (which they would). After all, if the mark of a true hero is saving others, what could be more heroic than saving the enemy from themselves just when they're on the brink of self-destruction?

There were plenty of directions Hori could've taken it so that this be achieved. There were even ways they could fail to achieve it that would've been more narratively satisfying than what we were given. But I think the moment the "final war" was on, the characters and story were written into a corner where their options were limited save "kill or be killed", and even then we ended up with not a single hero death while the four most major villains all died (in Dabi's case, he's dying slowly and agonizingly!), with the one hero death that really should've been final and had no coming back from - Bakugo fucking exploding his own heart - being reversed with little consequence.

I just do not approve of much of anything Horikoshi did here in the final stretch, and please keep in mind I'm a fan of the LoV but not a "uwu poor babies they deserve better" stan (and similarly a fan of Endeavor but not a stan who would ever make excuses for him.)

I’m curious about what was supposed to be the moral of bnha story?

He gave us villains that we couldn’t help but feel compassion for them. Complex, traumatized children that we wanted to help and then… dabi is alive but suffering without even being able to move, twice was killed, toga sacrificed herself and Shigaraki died without ever being free. I need someone to explain to me what was the point of all that.

[meeko-mar]

anyway I'm sure this is not the definitive end for BK and I'm gonna keep telling myself that hahaha

But Oh my lord I'm getting off this spiral train here and getting some sleep.

What a nice way to spend the first few hours of my WEEK LONG VACATION FROM WORK </3

[darkcircles4lyfe]

Rivals and Heroines: a lesson in expectation

I’ve thought for some time that Horikoshi is most likely knowingly taking advantage of the fact that most people see BNHA as predictably shounen, in more ways than one. Stories can receive a lot of recognition and acclaim for dismantling tropes outright, but what about a story that pretends to play along? Previously I've had a hard time presenting evidence for Horikoshi possibly having hidden motives, but now, after ch 348, I think I have a slam dunk. What used to be little more than my musing about what kind of writing I would love to see has become a subtext so obvious it’s basically just- textual. 

Now I can finally lay out how we expected these past few chapters were going to go, vs how they turned out: 

Toga + Uraraka + Izuku in a fight together looked at the very least like it would = Izuku finding out about Uraraka’s crush. Even I thought this. I called it “inevitable.” And whether folks wanted it to happen or not, that looked an awful lot like a setup for canonizing them as a couple. It would be pretty cliché and ill-timed, but what do you expect? Of course a shounen would do that. My optimistic prediction was that it would be an opportunity for Uraraka to dismiss the whole thing once and for all, but I knew what was far more likely: Toga acting as a catalyst for Izuku and Uraraka discovering they have feelings for each other, because Toga likes both of them too and of course she’s gonna gush about that and make them flustered. 

But let’s talk about that word, “likely.” Based on what? Not Horikoshi’s own pattern of writing, but of those around him. It’s “likely” because shounen media is always heteronormative, usually reducing female characters to their romantic potential, and generally prone to neglecting the overall narrative complexity of a romance subplot. He’s a boy. She’s a girl. Can Hori make it any more obvious? But if you consider Horikoshi as one individual storyteller, it all falls apart. Suddenly there is no basis for assuming anything. (I have talked about this aspect already so I’m just gonna link to that.) 

Now let’s talk about what actually happened. BECAUSE NONE OF THAT^ ACTUALLY WENT DOWN. Bless her, it was Tsuyu who really came through and personified how brutally our expectations were defied. She arrives at the last second just as Toga is about to reveal Uraraka’s crush, which obviously cannot be a coincidence. She’s all like nope! Now is not the time! Izuku doesn’t belong in this fight, and Uraraka can handle it herself. While technically this could just constitute a tease, like, “whoops! guess you’ll have to wait for the big reveal until later!” The dismissiveness of it reads a lot more final. This is self-awareness on Horikoshi’s part, showing us he’s conscious of the cliché. Through Tsuyu, he is telling us that it all ends here. No more coy blushy flirty immature shallow nonsense. No more stringing you along. No more red herring. Because it’s time to show you what’s really going on. This is the chapter that reframes everything. 

There’s a whole cyclone of ideas circulating in this chapter and all the other moments it harkens back to, spinning around each of these characters, who are learning from each other. These are the real reasons all of them had to collide in this moment together. They are as follows-

1. A lesson for Uraraka: villains are people worth saving

This idea was first mentioned by Toga, technically, as she wonders in the wake of Hawks killing Twice, whether any of the heroes think of villains as people. Izuku also independently arrives at the idea of saving Shigaraki. Uraraka has a less concrete inkling toward that conclusion, and it is ultimately Izuku’s perspective that gets her to realize she wants to save Toga, and that it’s a valid goal. 

2. A lesson for Toga: love is kind

A seed of this idea was most likely planted by Twice, because he cared for her and showed her kindness, and his death broke something in her. But the world has rejected her, so she rejects the world. Her parents never showed her love, so she had to define it for herself based on the desires of her quirk. If Uraraka can find out about how Toga is mourning Twice, she can use that knowledge as a tool for uncovering Toga’s desire to not only become like her loved ones, but to value their wellbeing. Toga also deep down wants someone to value her wellbeing, and to accept her. This could play out a number of ways, and tbh my prediction confidence on this front is not strong so I won’t dwell on it, but I did notice one thing: In the midst of Toga confessing to Izuku and asking him her question, Uraraka is panned over to two times: 

ya know, in a Realizing Things kinda way. The first is ambiguous, but in the second, she’s having a flashback to when Toga asked her that same question, noticing that when she and Toga had their confrontation during the first war, Toga approached her in the exact same way. It may seem obvious to us, but perhaps Uraraka here is realizing for the very first time that Toga had romantic feelings for her.

3. A lesson for Izuku: the depths of admiration

Up to this point, Toga’s idea of love has only been explained to Uraraka, because Toga says the two girls are alike in that their love for Izuku manifests in wanting to be like him. Now, Izuku is prompted to look inward and see if he can relate to admiring someone the way Toga does. In the moment, the first person he can think of whom he admires is All Might, but Toga wasn’t talking about that kind of admiration, she was talking about romance. Izuku is currently incapable of conceptualizing the depth of admiration beyond his fanboy comfort zone. 

Let’s get into the details of 348 here. Izuku says he “can’t imagine wanting to share the same heart and mind as (All Might).” What a romantic phrase, “share the same heart and mind.” He knows what Toga is talking about, but not who he would apply it to. He admires All Might, but not like that. This shortsightedness is also highlighted at the beginning of the chapter, where a narrator calls Izuku out for being, despite his heroic accomplishments, essentially still (as I heard JP twitter calling him) a virgin otaku (lol). He’s oblivious, awkward, inexperienced, and possibly in denial. The whole narration sounds affectionately chastising, wistful and almost nostalgic looking back from some hindsight. 

Now... the question on everyone’s mind: if this is a gag meant to point to how Izuku is oblivious of and/or awkward about Uraraka’s feelings (assuming that all of this was supposed to lead to them being a couple, as was our expectation), then why, oh why, was the phrase “kuso nado” (translated in officials as “damned nerd”), used by the narrator? That’s Katsuki’s phrase, obviously. So Katsuki is the one calling him oblivious to someone’s romantic feelings, almost as if this is something Katsuki already knows about him, from previous experience, and it is relevant to their own relationship? This is what I was talking about with speculation turning into blatant subtext. There really is no other explanation for this. It’s just. Right there.

So anyway, the whole All Might comment reiterates how Izuku is really out of touch with romantic feelings. Uraraka could relate to wanting to “share the same heart and mind” with someone, but Izuku says he can’t. And yet, that is not exactly the crux of the irony, or else Uraraka would have been the narrator at the start of the chapter, maybe referencing how she originally called him plain, not “damned nerd.” I swear, this is so cut and dry. Actually, when you think about it, Izuku’s obliviousness has never been a source of dramatic irony for Uraraka’s crush in the first place, like, ever. It’s never, “ooooo if only he knew~” it’s just, “ooooo you like him~” and that’s it. On the contrary, Izuku never knowing about her feelings can hardly be his fault considering Uraraka intentionally shoved down and ignored them.

(edit: turns out the “same heart and mind” line is a mistranslation ! luckily it doesn't really affect much)

 On the flips side, obliviousness and misunderstanding have always always ALWAYS been a part of Izuku and Katsuki’s relationship. Oh boy, let me count the ways. From when they were little kids and Izuku tried to help Katsuki up out of the river and Katsuki mistook it for being looked down on, to the bullying, to Izuku having to tell Katsuki about getting his quirk from someone else, to Izuku having no idea how All Might’s forced retirement was weighing on Katsuki, to Izuku being embarrassed to admit he saw Katsuki as his image of victory (*ahem* a level of admiration more personal than what he had for All Might!), to Izuku hiding the fact that emotions related to Katsuki triggered Black Whip, to Katsuki being unsettled by Izuku’s self-sacrifice, to Katsuki sacrificing himself, to Izuku running off to fight alone again anyway, to Izuku being shocked by Katsuki’s apology.... every. step. of. the. way. 

I feel like a broken record but seriously everything is all so obvious now. There is nothing tongue-in-cheek-shipping-brainrot about this. This isn’t rivals being accidentally homoerotic, or a female character being neglected by a misogynistic male author. I practically have no choice but to assume that Horikoshi has been planning a complete 180 fake-out and Izuku and Katsuki are about to be canon instead, or at least left open. I truly do believe now that this whole time, narratively speaking, Uraraka has been masquerading as the heroine/love interest, while Izuku and Katsuki have been playing rivals, all in service of Horikoshi leading us to expect this manga to turn out like any other shounen. But now he’s finally starting to show his hand. It’s like a trope-defying plot twist. I know a lot more of y’all can feel it now too. I bet even the homophobes are about to jump out in a big way, from the sudden insecurity. It’s. I’m. I dunno what to say, man. This is really wild and I can’t believe we’re here.

Folks, the end is nigh. I can’t wait.

...And that’s all the hyper-analyzing of quotes I got in me today, yep. No more. That’s definitely it. 

(major spoilers for Blue Flag/Ao no Flag under the cut)

pshh, crepes.

That’s not even a romantic trope, as far as I know. 

How do you even share a crepe, anyway? Like, you take a bite, and then they--

wait

b-but no, it’s not like there’s a shounen manga out there that made everyone think it was just a het romance with tragic one-sided gay pining form the main character’s childhood best friend--

but then it turns out the main character just needed to figure himself out as he grew up--

and then him and said childhood best friend end up MARRIED?? hah.. haha, what?

[fedzkun]

Villain Hunt Arc Meta: All For One’s Horrific Guide to Methodically Breaking Down Your Local OFA Holder

Ft. Turning the ‘Overpoweredness’ of OFA into a Setback, and AFO’s Successful Manipulations Of Midoriya Izuku

In which I also give AFO too much credit for all the pain he’s probably caused, and theorize that his plans to break Izuku actually started getting enacted even before he’d escaped Tartarus.

(A.k.a. me loving the angst because this is really good angst writing, but also hating it because the manga doesn’t come with a Angst with A Happy Ending tag unless you count Izuku’s ‘this is the story of how I became the greatest hero’ which isn’t really a guarantee of happiness )

So. What an arc! In the span of ten chapters (starting from the end of the War arc) Hori delivered a full-on Villain-looking, Vigilante Midoriya Izuku. Congratulations, Horikoshi, for finally introducing Akatani Mikumo!

The fast pacing and lack of breather panels are so fitting for this arc truly. AFO never gave them a moment’s rest. Yes, from henceforth as he’d promised... It’s always going to be his turn.

Izuku is making amazing progress with unlocking the full power of One For All. In his words, his abilities might as well already be on par with what a healthier All Might could do, and with no recoil to boot. Plus, there’s only one last quirk to unlock. For villain fights, I don’t think we need to worry about him losing, or him breaking anymore bones at this time.

Which, some might argue, makes Izuku too ‘OP.’

To start with, I want to talk first about the ‘overpoweredness’ of the One For All quirk. It’s a wonderful quirk truly, having inspired and amazed so many because of its sheer power. Used well, it could grant instant victories and restore the people’s wavering faith to the heroes. Because with a quirk like that on your side, everything’s going to be alright, right? There’s always gonna be that bit of hope that something is still strong enough to stand against the looming evil...right?

Yeah. That’s what the people who’d lived under All Might’s Era of Peace thought so too. History repeats.

OFA’s ‘OP-ness’ is both a great blessing and a great burden.

Here are some points on how the narrative has made OFA's 'overpoweredness' a setback:

1. All For One—that bastard—exploits the urge that comes with OFA. Just as ‘AFO the quirk’s’ goal is to steal OFA, OFA’s job is to defeat AFO, and Izuku is sacrificing himself to its cause.

Here’s another thing I want to point out: The conclusion that the heroes drew about AFO planning to capture Midoriya Izuku alive? In rereading, I’m starting to believe it’s nothing but a mere assumption of his plans. Aside from the deal made with Lady Nagant—of which I think AFO didn’t take seriously anyway and set her up for failure— (and while we as readers are already aware of his true intentions to wear Izuku down) it’s weird that nowhere had AFO directly mentioned to Izuku that he’s going to kidnap him and take his quirk from him.

2. OFA made Izuku so brilliant (e.g. Pros and former Pros alike going “This kid...”) that they really can't help but place all their hopes on him. Sighs. In an ideal world, this would be a dream come true of Izuku getting his due credit for all his heroic achievements Pro heroes have started to do to Izuku what they’ve done all their lives to All Might--which is to put him on the pedestal, while they fall back to cover him like guards/safety net. Hence, falling back to the One Pillar Model mindset.

3. OFA makes Izuku untouchable, not only to the villains, but also to his allies. Prime material to reinforce isolation. And if Izuku doesn't want to be caught, he won't make it easy for either side.

4. OFA IS SUS AF, OKAY? What are the Holders doing?! While gaining access to them makes it easier and convenient to have personal trainers in handling OFA, the vestiges prove to add a lot to Izuku’s mental load. If they’d allowed Izuku to come to the point of being caked with blood and filth, they’re not doing very well at guiding him. Realize that most of their arc interactions with Izuku is Quirk Talk. They, of all people, should know how AFO’s machinations work! Hey First, for the love of god, warn Izuku! He’s showing so many signs of being manipulated that you should be picking up on. please /sobs ;;

Tbf, like, I’m pretty sure that the Holders haven’t been as mentally okay either, which would feed into Izuku’s current mindset.

Now that the setbacks have been listed, let’s dive in to AFO’s plans to toy with Midoriya Izuku.

PHASE 1: Pre-Tartarus Breakout

Speaking of OFA being sus, there’s something that has been niggling at the back of my mind.

All For One basically tells Izuku: “You were my main interest that entire time I was in prison”. So, to pass the time in Tartarus (since he can’t use any(?) of his quirks), AFO has been doing nothing but apparently daydreaming and designing a personal hell for the Ninth Holder during that entire period. HOWEVER, it also made me wonder…

…Even before he’d broken out, had AFO made any moves at all in enacting his plans to break Izuku?

Yeah?

And here’s the kicker: he says that before Blackwhip bursted out.

AFO is a master manipulator. Assuming that Izuku doesn’t have any latent AFO quirk (for whatever reason *coughs* maybe dfo if you're a believer) or that Quirk Singularity has anything to do with it, what is the trigger to Izuku suddenly having access to Blackwhip?

I’d argue that it is All For One himself.

Why? What’s his goal? If you notice during the Joint Training arc, Izuku is feeling pretty confident about his progress. He’s rather happy and feeling blessed, and he is making leaps and bounds with base power OFA.

AFO can’t have that. He can’t allow the Ninth Holder to become too emotionally stable, or else he’d have a stronger will. So by somehow activating Blackwhip, AFO makes Izuku feel like he hasn’t made any progress with his quirk at all. During the evaluations, Izuku mentions that he still needs a lot to work on, and while not all of it is visible, with the way he behaves, it’s pretty evident that his self-confidence has taken a rather large hit.

But, wait! If AFO had tampered with OFA during the JT arc, paving the way to unlocking the rest (like he’d also done during the War arc when he tried to ‘steal’ it then), then wouldn’t AFO be sabotaging himself since he’d be making Izuku a more formidable opponent?

Sure. Except that the quirks inside OFA are mostly useless when it comes to the mental part of the fighting. The only thing they’re useful for is for the current Holder to be able to play keep-away in the physical realm. And AFO could easily just find counters for those through his work on Tomura.

You know how else the situation becomes advantageous for AFO? With every quirk unlocked, Izuku’s goalposts keep on getting away from him, and Izuku will always feel like he isn’t ready or prepared enough. Izuku will push and push himself to master OFA to its fullest, to become more powerful, at the cost of his mental/emotional stability and physical wellbeing as he wears himself down.

And every time Izuku grew more powerful, and became more ‘OP,’ he is burdened with all the aforementioned setbacks that came with it. He could be the most powerful person in the world, but it’s all for naught if he doesn’t take care of himself. This plan is both a high risk and high reward on AFO’s part, and as of the moment, with a bloody Izuku staggering all over, AFO is visibly reaping these high rewards.

PHASE 2: Post-Tartarus Breakout

He’s going to toy with Izuku until Izuku fucking breaks. What follows is his series of actions that instills the desired responses from Midoriya Izuku. Let’s see how the master manipulator plays this game of chess, shall we?

Izuku’s plan: Reach out to villains and try to save them.

AFO’s counter: Kill off those who turn their back against villainy and/or acknowledge Izuku as a true hero.

Izuku’s resulting response: Stop reaching out to villains. Gain an instant victory and move on.

After all, what do you get when you block a hero from showing sympathy? You get an unfeeling living weapon.

---

Izuku’s plan: Work with the top pro heroes to bring down AFO.

AFO’s counter: Make plans that will serve to highlight how the top pros are just slowing Izuku down. (e.g. Making moves while it’s raining, so as to divide them, but also to bring out No. 1 Hero Endeavor’s "slowness" in the rain. Nope, I don’t think that’s a throwaway line at all.)

Izuku’s resulting response: Grows more reckless, often leading the charge.

---

Izuku’s plan: Track AFO down.

AFO’s counter: Lead them to dead-ends. Or when they do supposedly reach something, endanger them.

Izuku’s resulting response: His tunnel vision worsens, as he grows more desperate.

---

Izuku’s plan: All Might following him around is okay since it would help All Might from worrying so much, and Izuku could simultaneously keep an eye on and protect All Might.

AFO’s counters: There are a lot to really fuck with this bond, damn you AFO.

Taint that passing the torch memory of ‘You’re Next.’

Declare that All Might no longer interests him. Liar. He outright stated before that he’s one for keeping a grudge

Send another assassin to Izuku [Underlying Message: You yourself are a walking danger zone to those whom you dearly care for.]

Izuku’s resulting response:

Interpret that memory of ‘You’re Next’ as taking up the position of being AFO’s shiny new plaything, and therefore supposedly sparing All Might from the torment (Unfortunately, making Izuku push AM away is just part of the torment ;A;)

Think that AM is no longer in the direct line of fire as long as AFO focuses on Izuku

Finally, push his last line of morale support away, and completely isolate himself.

Btw, I wonder how All Might feels about Izuku using Nana's quirk to get away from him.

---

The suffering doesn’t end.

Izuku’s plan: Save people.

AFO’s counters: (possibly offscreen) Send more villains and assassins to torment Izuku some more with the knowledge that he can’t save them. Sending villains out also puts innocents in danger.

Izuku’s resulting response: He won’t stop for anything. He won’t sleep, won’t eat, won’t slow down. He will always do his best to save as long as someone is in danger.

His body will keep on moving and moving and MOVING on its own.

--- All For One is very effective as a supervillain. He has managed to make the heroes think that his only goal is to capture Izuku alive for his quirk. He has Izuku right where he wants him: dancing to his tune at the palm of his hand, utterly toyed with, left with no escape in sight.

Psychologically vaulted.

.

.

.

PHASE 3

And so, if Izuku is being manipulated to drive himself further and further into self-destruction, what then is there left for All For One to do?

So much more. Because, my god, I think AFO has mastered the art of traumatizing the OFA Holders.

All For One once told All Might, “I will destroy all that you’ve protected.” And boy, is he delivering. He's definitely not done with AM btw.

First, he destroys All Might's image. And he is manipulating Izuku to drive himself to that point. To looking into his absolute worst.

And when that point arrives, AFO will hammer the final nail home.

Something like...

BEHOLD

JAPAN’S SYMBOL OF PEACE.

And oh, how it'll hurt. To see All Might's pride and joy be flaunted about as looking nothing like a hero to the masses, for him to be so utterly humiliated.

"See what I did to All Might's successor."

AFO will be banking upon the possibility that the angry masses will not want to be saved by whom they're tricked into viewing as someone that's the cause of all the pain. Izuku might have the willpower to stay true to his resolve, but with him on the verge of total breakdown, what would happen when he is shunned by the very people he is trying to help?

I once wrote a post about how the current events seem to be a bastardization of Izuku's wildest fantasies: he's working with the top pros, he has the most powerful quirk, and he's working with All Might (whom technically acts as a sidekick to him rn).

AFO has warped all that into a never-ending nightmare. And Izuku...

Izuku is really in need of saving.

Last thoughts:

Let me just say that it shouldn't be a competition about who gets to get through to Izuku. Right now, he’s gonna need all the help he can get, and it can’t be delivered by only one or two people. Saving Izuku is going to be a team effort, a solid support system that sees Izuku as their classmate/friend/student/actual person that they care about. And there’s sufficient space for that.

More hands reaching out means more chances to catch him if he falls.

[sapphic-agent]

i really appreciate your anti bakugo posts, because i don't like him. and people saying he misunderstood like??? he doesn't need to take 300+ chapters to give a half-assed apology I'm in another fandom where there is a character extremely like bakugo, and his stans treat him the same when in reality that character is the worst. Like, they treat him as short of misunderstood saint and underdog when he isn't. but the difference is how the writers treat them in canon; while Hori is trying to make Bakugo looks more likable with his plot armor and the fact that he only faces a slap on the wrist on his horrible actions.

while the other writer is like: Nha. He got the unhappy ending he deserves and he and the MC will not reconcile and he gets no bitchs. while the MC gets his happy ending with the person he loves and travels the world. like that character was so bad that they needed to soften him in lots of the adaptions; because he was that bad in the story narrative. both of them wrote about extremely angry characters, but the way that they did them is extremely different in the narrative of the story. like as someone with anger issues, since i was a toddler, the why fandom says that "he angry character it isn't his fault." is making me unironically mad. like; i can say lots of things in angry fits but i apologize like immediately after i calm down. taking accountability and facing consequences for your own actions is,,, suppose to be normal. sorry for the rant. I'm tired of my friend telling me that bakugo is misunderstood character (we have been going on it since the 1st session was released so like... 5 years)

Hi there, I'm so glad you like my posts!

The fandom certainly does victimize Bakugou a lot, doesn't it? People will point fingers literally everywhere else: his mother, his teachers, society, etc. But never towards Bakugou himself. Never holding him accountable for his own actions. One time when discussing with someone, they tried to tell me that Bakugou is aware that what he does to Izuku is wrong...

Okay? Then why doesn't he stop? That isn't the defense they think it is.

I think a great example of how to handle a character like this is what they do in Bojack Horseman. Bojack had a shitty childhood too with parents who were actually abusive. But the show stresses the fact that while his childhood is a reason for his actions, they are not an excuse. He also doesn't get a happy ending. He lost everything he ever had that was important to him: the TV show that made him famous, his money, his house, his close relationships- all of it.

Now obviously nothing Bakugou did was as bad as Bojack. And I don't necessarily think that (narratively speaking) he should have been expelled or had his life ruined. He was still a kid after all and I don't think he was ever at any point irredeemable.

But Bakugou never had to work hard to redeem himself, people just... let him. Ignored his behavior and the way he treated everyone (not just Izuku). I've said before that he continued to treat everyone like shit and got away for it because of comedy which severely undermined Horikoshi's attempt at redeeming him. This could have easily been rectified by giving Bakugou a moment of clarity whenever he did this. Even if it wasn't outright "sorry" it could have been an internal monologue where he shows regret for lashing out. It would not only make it clear that he's actively trying to be better even if he doesn't change immediately, it would have made him way more realistic.

I, personally, don't mind anger issues and his anger isn't why I dislike him. I mean, it can be annoying as hell but that isn't why I think he's a bad character. I've liked a ton of characters with anger issues (I have freaking Santana Lopez in my pfp lolz) and as long as they're well-written I've never had a problem.

[makeste]

I saw this take on twitter about Hana & Kacchan having “reverse parallels” and since they both have apologised to Tenko/Deku (but one was more or less sincere and the other was absolutely sincere) and they said that, while Hana moved away from Tenko, Kacchan ran to catch Deku. There was also more to the thread abt Kacchan & Hana’s differences. They were sorta trying to argue that this is a clue that Hori intends for Bkdk to be sibling-like/brotherly. As a bkdk shipped, I’ve accepted that it makes sense.. cause it’s an established fact that Tenko & Deku parallel each other. Tenko having his own “Kacchan” makes sense. Tho yes I am a little sad since I’ve held a little bit of hope for romantic bkdk becoming canon. I just wanted to ask your opinion if Hana was really meant to foil Kacchan or was it just a reach?

okay so I have a couple responses to this.

1. while it's true that Horikoshi has woven a lot of deliberate parallels between Deku and Tenko's characters, that doesn't mean every single thing about their lives and every single person they interact with is a part of those parallels. which is to say that no, I don't really think Hana and Kacchan are meant to mirror each other in any kind of significant way. Hana's apology to Tenko was under completely different circumstances than Kacchan's apology to Deku; I really don't see any connection between the two situations. you might as well be trying to compare Hana to Endeavor, or Deku, or Hawks, or Aizawa, or any other character who's apologized to anyone over the course of the story.

2. please pardon the forthcoming rant, anon -- and I hope you know that none of this is aimed at you in particular -- but for me personally, this whole obsession with ships becoming canon is one of the most exasperating types of discourse there is. like, don't get me wrong, I totally understand people wanting to see their favorite ships validated by the author, and not to mention there's also the issue of having more LGBTQ+ representation. but speaking as someone whose own orientation (aromantic) has almost no representation in fiction whatsoever, it gets frustrating to see so many people dismiss non-romantic relationships as being an inferior type of ship, to the extent that calling a relationship "sibling-like" is now a commonly-used attack in ship wars. so many people view romance as this completely transformative element, to the point where two characters can literally tick every other box on the intimate personal relationship checklist, and none of it will matter to some people unless they actually confess their love and kiss.

and again, I'm not saying I don't understand it, especially since queerbating is a thing. it's one thing if a writer is genuinely just trying to portray a close friendship, especially in series where romance isn't really a focus. but it's another thing entirely if a writer is deliberately hinting at a romance in a blatant bid to attract a larger queer audience, while all the while having no intention whatsoever of having those hints lead anywhere. the issue, I guess, is that it's not always easy to tell which scenarios are the former, and which are the latter. and of course, you also have people who think that the former is a type of cop-out as well, because the thing is that romance is always viewed as the default. so for a lot of people, allosexual and alloromantic relationships are the only ones that get considered as far as representation goes.

but you know what, I'm just gonna say it; even knowing where people are coming from, it's still discouraging to know that so many people are so dismissive of aro and ace relationships that the thought of a favorite ship not becoming romantic in canon is considered a profound disappointment. and it's even more discouraging that the thought of a rival ship becoming canon is considered such an existential threat to some that they will literally use "oh, they're just like siblings" as an argument against the ship, rather than a point in favor of. because siblings are a downgrade. friendship is a downgrade. any kind of close relationship that isn't inherently romantic or sexual in nature is less important, and that's just how it is.

so yeah, that's kind of a pet peeve, ngl. especially since the truth is I actually do think Bakugou and Deku's relationship is very akin to siblings. and so I do sometimes get weary of not being able to just outright say that without having to first pepper the statement with all kinds of disclaimers so that people don't think I'm invalidating the ship. I feel like I have to walk on eggshells if I ever want to talk about their relationship in terms that I can personally relate to.

but I mean, here's how I look at it. they've known each other since they were small children. they call each other exclusively (or almost exclusively) by childhood nicknames. they have an openness and an unspoken, almost taken-for-granted trust in each other to the point where they'll share closely guarded secrets ("I got my quirk from someone else") and personal vulnerabilities ("why was I the one who ended All Might?") with barely a second's hesitation which they would never share with anyone else. they have a comfortable little bickering type of rapport ("I'm getting stronger"; "well I'll just have to get even stronger then"; "you'll never surpass me"; "we'll see about that") which they can fall into with ease and which looks weird af to outsiders, but is "normal" to them and something they're both grateful to have.

they're so intimately familiar with each other's personality and behaviors that they can predict them with perfect accuracy. they're so in tune with each other that they can whip up elaborate coordinated attacks right on the spot in perfect sync. their admiration for each other is so strong that they each think of the other as being the epitome of winning and saving, respectively. their mental images of each other are so vivid that they subconsciously mimic each other's speech patterns whenever they start falling into a particularly strong Win or Save mindset themselves. they take no small amount of pride in showing off for each other. they go apeshit any time the other is in danger or hurt. and each of them would literally die for the other if it ever came to that.

all of that is already canon. on just about every metric imaginable except for "now kiss", the two of them already have a canon intimacy that rivals just about every other great relationship out there. and so to say that none of it actually counts unless there's an actual love confession involved frankly just boggles me. again, maybe it's because I have no personal vested interest in romance myself, though. I'm literally just not wired that way, and so I'm really not the best person to vent to when it comes to these kinds of concerns.

but look, no matter what happens from here on out, these two care about each other on a very deep and personal level. they're going to continue to be a part of each other's lives no matter what. and each of them, no matter what, will continue to occupy a space in each other's lives that no other person can fill, regardless of how we or Horikoshi or anyone else choose to label and define that space. and so in my book, that's already a win.

anyways, apologies again for the impromptu rant. again, this wasn't particularly directed at you in any way; if anything it's mostly just a generic response to the constant shipping discourse in this and every other fandom, and a more detailed explanation for why I personally don't like to get involved in it. this is just one of the myriad reasons why I try my best to stay very far away from BnHA twitter lol.

[abla-soso]

Maybe toga is a 'child-coded' character because she's literally a 17 year old child? Or maybe shigaraki is because he's been manipulated in isolation since he was a child by the big bad?

And even if terrorism is evil and the wrong way to do things to the bnha world, if the heroes win and the villains are gone, nothing will change enough to prevent the destruction of their world by the things the heroes won't even acknowledge. The quirk doomsday that's brought up every like ten chapters or so, that only the villains accept as truth?

There are no other options, because every alternative way was shown to be infective and ignored or outright crushed and assassinated by the heroes. And this isn't only an opinion, it's just how the story is playing out on the page.

Maybe they are FICTIONAL characters and I'm criticizing why Hori CHOSE to write them this way?

Nothing about the villains' personalities or circumstances is accidental. Hori deliberately wrote them as "child-coded" (ugh, I fucking hate this term) in a way that would force readers to feel sympathy for them, and I'd say he did it in a superficial and insulting way. And I don't have much respect for the opinions of fans who easily fell for Hori's silly and manipulative writing, sorry.

Stop giving browny points to terrorists who use the truth about society to justify their own terrorist acts, that's dumb. Stop saying terrorism is the only way to fix shit, that's false. That's also terrorism apologia 101. It's really fucking disturbing that you're trying to give moral justifications to literal terrorism.

It's pretty fucking dumb to pretend that only the villains spoke the truth about hero society. As if vigilantes don't exist! As if good heroes don't exist! And frankly; if only the villains are telling the truth, then that's a very dumb writing choice and we as readers should criticize it.

And be more frank, I don't buy "child-coded" as an excuse for reducing a villain's moral agency or punishment, nor do I accept it as a valid concept in the first place. Hawks was just as abused and traumatized and indoctrinated as any villain, yet everyone in the fandom judges him as an adult who is fully responsible for his actions. Why not give him the "child-coded" treatment, too? Why not interpret him as an emotionally stunted person with toxic yet uncontrollable coping mechanisms? Or is this bullshit excuse only ok for the villains but never for the heroes?

[itsclydebitches]

I kinda wonder, what could bakugou do (hori write bakugou to do) to make him less popular with the "anti" crowd. Like He was a horrid child no doubt and people who try to put blame on Deku or lessen the terrible shit bakugou did aren't great. But as we don't rly see it, we have to assume bakugous behaviour wasn't stopped, we only ever saw his mum "punishing" him when he was being rude after getting kiddnapped. Nothing will excuse what bakugou did, but he has stopped? He's overall a harsh person but he's not harrassing and bullying people anymore, specifically not deku, he's trying to attone for what he did to deku and has now apologised for it. His behaviour was never viewed as justified or good in the series, he's a scary figure in middle school, we're not meant to like his behaviour, so the series itself hasn't justified his actions.

As someone who relate to both bakugou and deku more than I'd like to admit (never told someone to jump tho, that's fucked lol) so I can 100% understand not liking or even hating bakugou but as someone who's not 15 anymore, looking back I also made a lot of really shitty decisions and like bakugou have tried to make up for it, and like deku I was 'friends' with people who hurt me.

Is there anything he can do for the "antis" to just dislike him rather that be "anti"?

(I'm very sorry if you've talked about this somewhere, you can just tell me to look for it if you have, I'll continue to look for your posts on the subject)

Hey there, anon! I think I’ve spoken about this only tangentially and/or in my main Bakugo meta, which is too big for anyone sane to read. So yeah, let’s chat here!

For me personally—and that’s all I can ever do: speak personally. I think it’s important to keep in mind that there is no single solution to please the “anti” crowd. Each fan will be looking for something slightly different in Bakugo’s character, much of which might contradict what a “stan” is currently enjoying. Given how charged a character he is, I'm not sure it's possible to get the entire fandom to like him—what I’m looking for hinges on having a different reading of the story than you seem to. Meaning, I think the series does justify his behavior. Not in any overt, super obvious way like having all the characters go, “Wow, Bakugo! I sure do love how you threaten people all the time. That’s super cool and heroic!” Things are rarely that straightforward. Rather, it’s in a more subtle, but consistent manner that paints a rather conclusive picture across hundreds of chapters.

Simply put, Bakugo is continually rewarded for his actions. Or, if not outright rewarded, his actions are ignored in a way that implies silent acceptance. Characters may not always like what he does... but they're willing to let it slide because Bakugo's heroism was always treated as a given, not something he had to earn and prove.

With the ever necessary disclaimer that I’m not fully caught up yet, here’s a list of some of the things that stood out to me in the first half of the series:

Bakugo’s bullying made him the most popular kid in school.

Bakugo’s bullying was ignored by/outright supported by the teachers.

Bakugo’s bullying did not hinder him from getting into U.A., one of the most prestigious hero schools around.

Despite acting horribly throughout his time at U.A. too, this behavior was continually ignored by the teachers and other authority figures around him.

Bakugo’s struggle to realize that other people aren’t “trash” doesn’t hurt his achievements in any way. He still gets top scores, still wins the tournament, etc.

Bakugo’s behavior gets him special attention from All Might, the greatest hero and Bakugo’s personal idol.

His behavior doesn’t make others dislike him in any manner that’s taken seriously. Everybody is still willing to not just put up with Bakugo, but—in time—start treating his behavior as a quirk (no pun intended lol) that they’re secretly fond of, rather than something he should legitimately be striving to change. Kirishima is the most overt example of this.

This is compounded by his behavior constantly being framed as humorous. Much like with Mineta’s perverted actions, characters might superficially go, “No, that’s bad!” but the story never demands any significant development because then we’d lose the “joke” of Bakugo screaming in rage at the slightest inconvenience, threatening to murder someone over nothing, constantly belittling everyone around him in a “funny” manner, etc. When fans talk about development of a manga character as archetypal and extreme as Bakugo, most don’t really want to see significant change to his base personality. Because then that would result in someone who doesn’t look like the “real” Bakugo: someone nicer, more even-tempered, more mature, etc. But for those of us who were never drawn to that personality in the first place, the continued acceptance of his rude, egotistical, and violent behavior is discomforting. The easiest comparison I can draw is between this and Bakugo’s mother slapping him. That slap is meant to be another “joke”—we see it constantly in shonen anime, something "humorous" you shouldn’t take too seriously because haha, it's just an overprotective mother—but many fans do take it seriously, using it as the basis for a whole “Bakugo was abused and this explains his behavior” reading. Well, I take the “joke” of Bakugo’s threats and insults seriously, especially in a story that starts with something like telling Izuku to jump off the roof. In the same way that many fans want others to treat Bakugo’s mother as a serious topic that has had a negative influence on his development, I want the series to take Bakugo’s everyday actions seriously as a negative influence on… well, everyone around him. But it doesn’t. His base personality is grudgingly adored.

The above two points are seen most overtly in Izuku, who never wavers in his respect for Bakugo despite how Bakugo treats him. Not just prior to U.A., but during their training too. Izuku, as the protagonist, is the emotional heart of this tale, so when he talks about how inspiring Bakugo is, it encourages the reader to see his behavior as inspiring too. Rather than, as said, something that needs to change. Izuku's continued friendship with Bakugo, his adoration of him, and his acceptance of the way he's treated has severely warped how the entire story sees Bakugo's actions. After all, if #pure Izuku can see the good in Bakugo, why can't everyone else? He must not be that bad after all.

I could get into detailed analyses of all the above—like how Bakugo was the one comforted after attacking Izuku outside the dorms at night and how the messed up relationship he has with Izuku is upheld as something to nurture; how the remedial courses he had to take were made to be rather silly, thereby undermining their supposed importance to his development; how Bakugo’s kidnapping had nothing to do with his flaws, but much of the fandom uses it as a way to dismiss any appropriate consequences because, “Hasn’t he suffered enough?” etc.—but in the interest of keeping this within a readable length, I’ll leave it at that. The point is that Bakugo has always been privileged when it comes to his behavior, resulting in others either outright praising it, ignoring it, or demanding that he change a miniscule bit, which always keeps him far below the standards of both his peers and the expectations of a hero. Everyone in 1-A must learn to be even better than the good people they already are... Bakugo needs to learn that other people aren't dirt at the bottom of his shoes. It's never been a particularly impressive development when pit against the rest of the class. All of which can make something like an apology feel pretty hollow. Yes, he’s apologized and I say with all seriousness that that’s great! But how does that apology stack up against 300+ chapters of content? As Bakugo’s words highlight, he's been a really awful person up "until now": he was consumed by Izuku being “miles ahead of [him],” he “looked down on [him]” because he didn’t have a quirk, he “didn’t want to recognize that,” he “hated that,” “grew distant,” “tried to beat you down,” “opposed you and tried to show my superiority over you,” and ends it all with, “it probably doesn’t mean anything telling you all this” before finally getting to the “I’m sorry.” This is basically a laundry list of how horrible a person Bakugo has been for the entire series, with an acknowledgement that this apology is coming really, really late. This is the moment where I could START to like Bakugo, depending on how he acts form here on out, but that pivotal moment arrived after six years of content and in the final arc of the story. It’s too late. Bakugo needed this kind of self-reflection and positive action 250+ chapters ago so he could (hopefully) grow into a better person across the story, not at the story's end. What we got instead is 322 chapters of him being a really horrible person, but the story going out of its way to excuse or even praise that behavior the majority of the time.

As a quick comparison to end on, I think what Bakugo needed was what Soo Jin got in True Beauty. You don’t need to have seen the drama to follow along. The tl;dr is that she has a lot of the core qualities of Bakugo: an all-consuming drive to win that was created due to abusive parents with high expectations, resulting in her bullying a peer to a pretty horrific extent. The difference between them is how the story frames their actions. When Soo Jin becomes the bully she loses everything. Rather than succeeding academically, her grades plummet, making it clear that this anxiety and self-doubt (things the fandom keeps insisting Bakugo is struggling with, but that rarely ever show up in the text) is actually impacting her day-to-day life. Her best friend drops her because she’s not going to support her choices. The boy she likes rejects her. She’s eventually forced to start over somewhere new - which importantly separates her from the girl she was bullying - and get some distance from her parents, resulting in the growth needed to become a healthier, happier, good person again. So when Soo Jin apologizes to the girl she hurt, it feels earned. The story continually recognized how horrific her actions were and put her into a place where she either had to change, or continue losing at everything else that was important to her. Bakugo? Bakugo doesn’t lose. Oh, he claims he does because he’s comparing himself to Izuku constantly, but that’s just him thinking in extremes. He still wins academically. Still wins many battles. Still wins at having friends. Still wins by maintaining the prestige of being a U.A. student. Still wins by getting All Might’s attention. Still wins by receiving Izuku’s respect and an agreement to maintain this rivalry that Bakugo is so obsessed with. Bakugo comes out well 99% of the time, he just thinks he's "lost" because he can't stand not being the absolute best.

For me, the story needed to have Bakugo face consequences for his behavior, not receive rewards and/or have others ignore it, and that revelation/apology needed to come way, way sooner. For me the issue is not a specific action that Horikoshi can have Bakugo do in the next chapter and them bam, I like him now. The problem is Bakugo’s entire concept, how he’s received by the entire cast, and his run across this entire series. "Entire" is the key word there. Which is why the “But he’s apologized. What more do you antis want?” reactions don’t sit well. What we wanted is a better written redemption arc across those 300+ chapters, not a single scene that’s meant to have us forget all the other problems inherent in the story. At this point it’s a far more complicated situation than, “Bakugo just needs to do X, Y, and Z and then we’re golden.” At the end of the day, Horikoshi failed to make me like him as a person and I’m pretty sure he isn’t going to change Bakugo enough to make him likable to me. Bakugo was never the sort of character I’d be inclined towards without a serious, nuanced redemption arc, but sadly, a core, crucial part of that redemption arc took six years to arrive. At this point there’s no way to change the problems in Bakugo’s writing for that huge chunk of the series and not enough time left in the series, it seems, to do the work we should have seen across the entire run. Honestly, idk if the Bakugo we'll get going forward is someone I can just dislike as opposed to being really uncomfortable with, but my money is on there being too little story left and too much investment in upholding Bakugo's base personality for that to happen. I could absolutely be proven wrong! But I think the problems are structural and needed to be better dealt with from page one, not hastily patched over in the final hour.