#new52 outlaws

[splooosh]

Blackfire and an Outlaw

Timothy Green II

[cloakedsparrow]

Red Hood and the Outlaws #8 (New52)

we don't talk about them nearly enough

[leoruby-draws]

Little siblings are terrors, 9 out of 10 scientists agree! Wanted to post some Dick and Jason interactions, so here they are.

For that first pic, wanted to draw the brothers hugging it out, but realized that Jason giving Dick a lot of grief about it was funnier. But they do love each other, Jason's just a brat is all lol.

Second pic is Dick getting some revenge, look how little Jason is in his booster seat lol.

Third pic is a cheeky little reference to the New52 outlaws, the controversial team-up between Starfire, Roy and Jason. Starfire here seems to have fun humoring Jason lead the 'rescue mission' here, perhaps she knew Dick wasn't actually in trouble. Roy's just being dragged along for the ride. Dick doesn't seem too appreciative of being rescued here, but as I said, little siblings are terrors.

Anyways, hope you like this!

[mysterycitrus]

if you could erase a comic authors works and have them be written by anyone else (of your choosing), would you erase scott lobdell or tom taylor?

tom taylor is a performative egotistical hack with an annoying twitter account but id still keep his work over a literal sex criminal who unabashedly hates women and set abolitionist discourse in comics back about two decades

ive talked about it before but my personal ideal run would’ve been an outsiders book set in space, with roy and kory and dick as the mcs. outlaws is bad for the same reason that most of the new52 is — they supplant comic canon with lots of text boxes insisting that characters have a pre-existing relationship, and spend no time actually establishing or portraying it. we see this now even tho it makes no sense timeline wise (jason and roy are besties even though roy is at minimum 7+ years older than him and was on the titans with dick?)

because dick and kory and roy all have long standing relationships together and with each other it would’ve made for a compelling story. there’s so much baggage and so much love there. if u got someone like winnick who can be (occasionally) trusted not to turn books into a batfest we could’ve gotten quality roy and kory character moments too, something that functionally did not exist in outlaws autonomously from making jason look cool. or id get gretchen felker martin to write a jason book cause at the very least she seems to understand the inherent hypocrisy behind his personal politics

tbqh id rather we talk about how dan didio facilitated not only the terrible treatment of babs, roy and kory, and basically every legacy character outside of bruce but also kept lobdell on as a writer despite the numerous allegations against him and the unquestionably toxic environment he created in comics. it’s not a coincidence that the moment didio was booted lobdell followed suit on the same shoe

[disniq]

Hi so uhhhh, not actually making any sort of relevant point about anything but I saw you guesstimating Jason's kill count and I have to justify the fact that I went panel by panel to hand count his kills SOMEHOW so like have the data please!!

Skipping dear Filipe's moldering corpse due to uncertainty, we start with Lost Days

Human Trafficking Truck Driver Ian, Egon, Steel Beam mercenary crew estimated at least five strong, three more of his teachers, eleven nameless russian mobsters, a cousin and a running buddy of a russian mobster: 23 people

Under the Red Hood

Eight heads in a duffel bag, four thugs with Freeze (Freezy boy does not die), Two confirmed on panel delivery man kills (Five-ten more suspected but we won't count em), Ten goons in the doorway when he swings the minigun on them as he and Onyx retreat, five more goons, Rocket launcher blast kills "most" of a security team with at least three members left alive so we'll call that three kills (far more deaths are implied), shoots a guy holding a lit molotov catching him on fire, then kills Captain Nazi (yay), forces Black Mask to kill six of his men, forces Some Guy to fight Black Mask to the death for him, and finally dear old Black Mask's PA is thrown through a window (his cycling class will miss him dearly): 42 people

(So, yeah, your ballpark of about a hundred give or take sounds about right, he's only got ~65 on panel, confirmed notches on his knife by the end of UtRH, and the implications seem to imply between 20 and 75 kills off screen)

That Time He Kidnapped Mia

Short and sweet, he only ices a pack of "brain donors": 5 people

Brothers in Blood

Two human traffickers, three more drug runner goons, two more goons later on: 7 people

Red Haired Foolishness Phase part one

Starting the running with two cops, lightning bug assassin, six mobstery big wigs, a guy, Flamingo: 11 people

Red Haired Foolishness Phase part two

Littleman Beaver's brother and his brother's fourteen goons, fifteen of his fellow inmates, then the grand poisoning of eighty-two people (well he poisoned more but we only get eighty-two confirmed as dead): 112 people

This is not even slightly a complete list, so consider this final number a lowball of:

Two Hundred people even!

as Jason's body count... at least pre-new52, don't ask me what's going on over there in modern canon, idk

Hope this was entertaining/useful to you in some way!

Best wishes -redhoodinternaldialectical

This is an amazing reference, thank you so much for sharing!!

I can fill most of the later stuff, because there's tragically little of it.

Nu52's attempt at giving Jason a concrete kill count was laughably low;

Red Hood and the Outlaws (2011) #21

Rebirth was mostly non-lethal, with the notable exception of the gang Jason uses to establish his new edgy loner lifestyle after the famous rhato 25 beatdown from Bruce.

RHATOs (2016) #26

I count 11 of them, and I think it's safe to say they're all dead.

But then he teams up with Batwoman, and then Bunker, and then becomes a teacher at Lex Luthor's school for potential supervillains so it sort of tapers off again.

And then... there's the piece of shit dad he killed in Cheer in 2021.

Batman: Urban Legends (2021) #1

As far as I'm aware, that's the last time he killed in main continuity.

When will my son return from the war

[redbird-tf]

Sick day redemption 

Jason todd x (platonic) younger reader

Summary: jason finds you sick at home after missing patrol, and has the chance to relive his favorite memory.

Word count: 519

Notes: based on comic in red hood and the outlaws new52

Warning: none

Jason grew worried as he looked back down at his watch, it's been 30 minutes since you said you would meet him at the usual rooftop for patrol. You had told him you’d be running a few minutes late, but this is more than a few minutes. Jason looked around one last time before letting out a frustrated and anxious huff, leaving the rooftop.

“Y/n?” He called out quietly entering his apartment through the window. The breeze made the room cold, and the room pitch black. He heard a sneeze and quickly flicked on a light, it was dim but bright enough for him to see your outline on the couch. You sniffled again and your body shivered from the cold. Jason closed the window cutting off the breeze, but then froze.

He remembered a time like this. When he was still Robin, he had gotten sick on his way to patrol with Batman. Alfred refused to let him leave the manor, even if he was already in suit, and called Bruce to let him know. Jason thought Bruce was going to be disappointed in him when he got back, but to his surprise, the Batman came home early. When Bruce stepped into the living room Jason had begun to apologize. Bruce stayed quiet for a second before asking Alfred for some popcorn, somehow this made Jason more anxious and confused on top of that. “Taking the night off once in a while isn't a crime Jason” Bruce stated taking a set next to him. “Thank you, Alfred,” Bruce said taking the bowl of popcorn “So what do we got on,” he asked turning on the TV. Jason smiled as he sniffled, he leaned against Bruce as he began to relax. Jason had never felt so safe.

Jason smiled before returning to the present. He walked down the hall to grab a blanket. he stood behind the couch as he laid it over you. “Mm, Jason?” You grumbled as your eyes peeked open. “What-what time is it,” you asked frantically sitting up “12:30 am,” he said calmly “Oh no, I'm sorry i was getting ready, but then i felt sick so i sat down for a second and-“ he cut off your frantic explanation “y/n, it's ok, it's not a crime to take the night off,” he said placing his hand on your shoulder, “i think this calls for a movie night” he smiled walking into the kitchen. “Popcorn for me, and tissues for you” he joked sitting next to you.

You laughed before letting out a cough, “So you're not upset?” You asked turning towards him. “No” he replied softly “which movie should we watch?” He questioned starting to list off movie names. He flinched slightly feeling you unexpectedly lean against him. It took a few seconds for his shoulders to relax again as he stared down at you.

your body completely relaxed against his, he watched as your chest moved up and down as you softly snored. His expression changed from shock to a calm smile, wishing he could stay in this moment forever.

[roseworth]

Rose Wilson: New52 and Beyond

i couldn't find a good list of all of rose's appearances after flashpoint so i made my own 🥰

now listen to me. most of these suck so bad. do NOT read anything on this list if youre not already a rose fan, instead check out my pre52 rose reading list first <3

the ones that i think you should read are in bold and my personal favorites are italicized. i would strongly recommend not reading any besides those because everything else is mostly unreadable and terrible

tldr: this is ALL of her appearances in order, but i recommend only reading the bold or italics. ok lets go

Superboy v6 #1-7, 32-34

The Culling crossover (Superboy #8, Legion Lost #8, Teen Titans #8, Teen Titans Annual #1, Superboy #9, Legion Lost #9, Teen Titans #9)

Ravagers #1-2, 6-12

Deathstroke v2 #19-20

Red Hood and the Outlaws v1 #39-40

Deathstroke v3 #4-7, 13-20, annual #1 (especially #7 and #18-20)

Deathstroke v4 #2-10, 12, 14-18, 20-29, 36-41, 44-50 (especially #2-18, #36-40, & #44-47)

Dark Nights Death Metal: The Last Stories of the DC Universe

Robin v3 #1-11

Deathstroke Inc #6-7

Shadow War crossover (Batman #122, Deathstroke Inc #8, Robin #13, Batman #123, Deathstroke Inc #9, Robin #14, Shadow War Omega)

Dark Crisis #3, 5-7

Wildstorm 30th Anniversary Special

Batman: the Brave and the Bold #1-6

Knight Terrors: Ravager #1-2

Joker: The Man Who Stopped Laughing #9-12

Gotham War: Red Hood #2

(posted November 2023 and probably will not be regularly updated lmao)

[cuephrase]

What are some things introduced new52 to current day that you like and think are an overall net positive for batfam continuity? (As in, it's not uncommon for me to see fan things that mainly focus on post crisis/pre flashpoint stuff but still incorporate new comic aspects, such as slightly changed family dynamics/new developments, and it's interesting for me to find out what different people think is and isn't worth keeping from what got added after the reboot)

ooooh this is a fun question!!

i was going to say i haven't read that many n52 and onwards runs, and then i realized i have actually read most of the ones i want to, i just haven't read any batman/'tec/batgirl/or duke's runs yet. (i read like...half of We Are Robin, Joker War, and i've read batman from where zdarsky come in so like have also read Gotham War.) (might read Catwoman?? not the point.)

since we're sticking strictly to net positives, i'll include something that i like, even if i have criticisms of it, but i won't get into those criticisms so we can stay positive!! (future cue, so this is kind of a lie but i swear i didn't go overboard.) i'm going to include stuff as minor as like costumes bc why not. also nothing is going to be in order of like what i like the most to what i like the least, just fyi. also, probs not definitive, knowing me i will forget something lmao

New52 Era-

tim's red robin costume. that suit is *chef's kiss* imo. i love that he has wings. i...i don't know if i necessarily want it back rn bc i am sososososo in love with his current robin costume, but i do adore the n52 red robin suit

i personally like that they went ahead and made jason less villain, more anti-hero. i think him trying to reintegrate with the batfam creates some very compelling crises

dick as Agent 37!! which...okay, no criticisms nvm. michael janin's art tho >>> okay well actually maybe sometimes i wish this was like elseworlds/black label instead of mainline but

might be a bit of a reach, but i really enjoy the first handful of arcs in n52 b&r and the relationship dynamic they established for bruce and dami

i like that tim and jason are somewhat friendly. i think it makes sense. for a lot of reasons. this is a somewhat controversial opinion, which i understand. but this is where i stand

did i like anything else from this era specifically?????????

OH

DUKE!!!!!!! i loooooove him very happy he was added

Rebirth Era-

the outlaws, specifically jason's relationship with bizarro. (i enjoyed artemis a lot too!! tbh, haven't read these guys outside of this run tho so zero clue how accurate these portrayals are, so grain of salt?)

the return of dick's fingerstripes!!!!!!! best part of tom taylor's run /hj

TIM'S ROBIN COSTUME AHHHHHH. i'm sorry i love that suit way too much

love damian's current robin costume, although...does he have combat boots rn still? can't remember. if he doesn't, they should give those back

damian + jon's relationship, ik it gets obliterated by the stupid age up, but super sons is still very special to me

tim being bi!! now do kon dc you cowards

alfred's death. i refuse to elaborate. i could, but i shan't (this is not alfred hate tho i swear)

i'm forgetting something rn i know it

oh yeah, i do like tim being robin again. IK. IKKKK. no, i don't think he should be robin forever. no, i don't think dami is a bad robin/shouldn't be robin.

um...i liked dick getting shot in the head. the ric era is not how i would've wanted the aftermath but

i don't want to comment on anything super recent, but i do think there's stuff going on rn that could end up being net positives

the titans being reassembled. jury's out on their location but, i do like that they're back

i'm not counting yj because they're not doing anything with them rn, but they should ugh

i think...i think that's it? there could honestly be a lot more that i'm forgetting. i hope this was interesting!! if there's anything i didn't mention that you're curious about, or something i did mention that you'd like a more in-depth answer about, please feel free to ask!! i'm curious what you consider net positives anon, you should shareeee

[necrotic-nephilim]

re: your thoughts on new52 version of jayroy because roy harper was done so dirty that I can’t stand that ship, but you can make it good and I appreciate it

I have a vague idea for a jayroy/outlaws rewrite that leans into roy’s pre52 characterization because honestly I think they could have a decent friendship, like you said Roy isn’t a stranger to working with people he morally disagrees with. Roy also has a habit of taking people under his wing when he think they need support (I miss grant) and I think that if he saw Jason at his worst, angry, violent and hurting, then he’d still try and help him even if he wasn’t his best friend’s little brother.

I think that a romantic relationship between them would be a little harder to justify when you keep to Roy’s original character, he knows a lot about trying to fix people with love and just how much it doesn’t work. sleeping together casually is one thing but dating is another, and rule number 2 for recovering addicts is don’t get into a new relationship, is it the same for recovering villains? He can’t be that person who takes advantage of someone at their lowest Or be a conscience for someone, talking them down from bad decisions. I imagine that Roy sets pretty firm boundaries early on, and Jason doesn’t push him on this since it’s supposedly just causal.

The best way to shake things up between the two of them is to add a third person to the mix lmao, things would never progress past the fuckbuddies stage without some drama. You’ve gotta add Dick or Tim or Helena or Donna or Bruce for some spice

first of all, for you to just passingly mention the idea of HelenaJayRoy without any further thoughts how DARE you anon that was the most enlightened thing you could've said- /lh

BUT YES I AGREE. i think Outlaws *could* have worked, which is the most frustrating thing about it. i don't think Kori was the right pick, simply bc *why was she there* but i do agree, you *could've* made Roy work. there's this belief in Outlaws that somehow Jason is the one saving and helping Roy get back on his feet and Roy is leaning on Jason. but for me to make it work, it'd *have* to be other way around. like you said, with Roy being the one trying to take Jason under his wing and set him on the right path.

bc when it comes to superhero teams, a lot of times you can shove just about anyone together under the right justification or circumstances. so Jason and Roy working together could *easily* be pulled off, i just think they needed another more grounded, street-level vigilante/anti-hero to balance them out instead of someone like Kori who either feels like the deus ex machina solving everything *or* incredibly nerfed so the plot doesn't just revolve her fixing things instantly. really a lot of picks could've worked, but i *love* the idea of Helena. just bc i'd give anything for DC to give us a proper comic team-up between Helena and Jason. on a surface they *seem* like they should work well- lethal justice, protector of the marginalized, driven by vengeance. but i could see them heavily clashing and arguing over schematics and each other's methodologies. so putting someone who doesn't believe in murder at all like Roy in the middle is fun. especially with Roy finally having some semblance of adult stability after his addiction and having a child, he'd naturally fall into the role of being the one in charge, trying to guide the others. he has a habit of wanting to help others get their lives back on track bc well, he knows how it feels to be at rock bottom and feel like everyone gave up on you. there's definitely levels where Roy could sympathize with Jason, and possibly even agree with him. Roy's storyline with addiction existed to be meta-commentary on how parents fail their children going through addiction by not providing communal support, so a lot of Jason's feelings on how he was failed by Bruce (and adult heroes fail their sidekicks as a whole) can be reflected in Roy's experiences. Jason's beliefs on how sidekicks shouldn't exist and superheroes don't do enough is something Roy could possibly even agree with. i would've *loved* to see an Outlaws run acknowledging that Roy is far more emotionally mature than Jason and trying to help Jason out as Jason doesn't want it.

and like the said, that makes the relationship more fun. bc even if feelings develop, Roy's not going to jump on them for fear of taking advantage of Jason and potentially backsliding Jason's progress they've made inch by inch. it makes their friendship and relationship far more slow and careful. and adding Helena, imo, is a lot of fun. bc while she agrees with Jason's lethality, she'd have a bit more emotional stability going into the team. this is a woman who has a full time day job as a teacher and has worked on the Birds of Prey. while she doesn't have the teenage sidekick experience, she certainly has a level of "real world" experience, and a closeness to growing up around crime and tragedy. while Helena also has her emotional misgivings, they're very different from Jason's. a lot of Helena's character is driven by feeling trapped as a little girl, paralyzed by fear, witnessing a tragedy she can't stop. and Huntress is her way to try and break free of that. she's running from her trauma in a way, where as Jason is running *at* it. that's the difference. Jason wants to boldly face his trauma in bloody ways and force everyone else to face it too, even if it means that's all he'll be, bc that's all he sees himself as anyway. Helena wants to escape it and prove she's bigger than it. she doesn't want it to be her defining trait. sure she got her vengeance, but she tried to move on from it and make her identity something more.

so i think she could provide a level of stability to the relationship in that she'd try to force Jason to move on from the worst of his feelings. his trauma is always going to follow him a little, but he can't keep letting it define him. especially when they're all trying to work together on a team. it makes the three of them getting together a lot of fun bc there's balance in all directions. Roy cares about them both and has getting very comfortable with working with them, and they all have clear, unspoken feelings. i think it's fun if Roy is trying so hard not to take advantage of Jason while Jason is pissed that Roy thinks Jason isn't in the mindspace to make his own decisions about what he wants. i think he'd make a move on Helena just to prove his point and get Roy to finally cave and join in. Roy knows Helena won't take Jason's shit and won't let Jason go off the deep end just bc he's upset, she's very no-nonsense about it all to contrast Roy's more gentle attempts to reasoning.

anyway now i have a new rarepair idea ty anon i'm in love with you. i usually say i don't ship Helena/Jason just bc i think they're too intense for each other, but with Roy in the mix there's a really good balance that makes it work *so* well. i'm going to be thinking about this forever.

[redpenship]

i made this a long time ago but here: my sorting of which robin certain sonic characters would stan

full justifications under the cut:

dick grayson tier:

sonic - blue-themed and likes the bird motif jewel - she's boring jet - toxic nightwing stan who swears hes better than the other robins at literally everything and WILL get mad if you say that tim is a good detective within earshot orbot - dickbabs shipper who fights with dickkori fans online silver - grew up on teen titans go (its still airing in the future) knuckles - doesnt know there are other robins

jason todd tier:

shadow - he's just like me fr (died and came back) rouge - he's just like my friend fr (edgy loser) charmy - thinks the idea of an ex-robin who kills people is really cool (he's six) rough and tumble - they think jason is right and criticize batman's no-kill rule in youtube comment sections storm - unironically enjoyed new52 red hood + the outlaws cubot - hes just like me fr (father figure is mean to him)

tim drake:

starline - relates to tim trying to fix someone he admires tails - kid with a cool older brother complex vector - grew up with robin tim and still hates damian for replacing him whisper - friends died eggman - gets beaten up by kids way younger than him

stephanie brown:

belle - dad is a villain big - likes her purple costume

damian wayne:

amy - thinks it's cute when he kills people zavok - really into grant morrison wave - talia defender that supports damian by proxy cream - animal lover omega - violence is always the correct answer to a problem blaze - relates to his struggle to be his own person in the shadow of responsibilities placed on him

duke thomas:

espio - can turn invisible + forgotten in most major arcs

carrie kelly:

tangle - youthful optimism mimic - believes 9/11 made frank miller a better writer metal sonic - dreams about aiding in the defeat of his world's blue boy scout

[evasive-anon]

Just a reminder that the New52 really did give us the best Jason xmas special with RHATO Annual #2. This story had every thing: little bby outlaws being violent cutie pies, they get grounded by batman. they escape on the t-rex in the batcave and steal santa's sleigh, they find a war in the north pole, Mrs. Claus is a giant gingerbread woman who fights with rolling pins, they beat up possessed rabid reindeer, fake Santa calls Jason a very bad boy. Its like an unhinged fever dream and I love it. Are some lines cringe?? 1000% but I am willing to ignore that.

Also, Jason's narration about Kori being so strong followed by her going feral and saying she'll bite just means a lot to me.

[beeceit]

alrighty, I went through my dc universe infinite history (keeping in mind, this does NOT include stuff I read on other sites or stuff I own physically. For example, somewhere I have a nearly complete collection including all of the new 52 Birds of Prey run)

The Boy Wonder #1-4 The Long Halloween #1-13 Robin Lives #428, #1 #2 The New Titans #1, #43-45, Annual #3, #60-65 Batman (1940) #402, #426-429, #440-443, #448-449, #652-#660, #663-666 Batman Urban Legends #6 #10 #4 #5 DC vs Vampires #1-12 Batman/Superman World’s Finest #1-6 The Titans #17-#18 Detective Comics (2016) #940-971, #1000 Blackest Night Batman #1-3 Red Robin #1-26 Teen Titans (2003) #1-55 Nightwing (2016) #1, Fear State Impulse #1 Young Justice #1-12, 80 page giant, #40 Batman Gotham Adventures #1 Batman (2016) #130-150 Batman and The Signal #1-3 Nightwing (1996) #100-103, #106 Adventure Comics (2009) #3 Batman and Robin (2011) #31 Red Hood and the Outlaws (2016) #1-9 Joker: Last Laugh #6 Batman: Battle For the Cowl #1-3 Azrael: Death’s Dark Knight #1 Gotham Gazette: Batman Dead? #1 Convergence: Batgirl #1-2 Batgirl: Secret Files and Origins #1 Detective Comics (1937) #734, #819-827 Blackest Night #0-1 Green Lantern (2005) #43 Superman (1987) #70 Red Hood: The Hill #1-2 Robin (1993) #175-182 Tim Drake: Robin #1-6 Knight Terrors: Robin #1-2 Robin (1991) #1-4 Teen Titans (2011) #1 Robins: Robins Being Robin We Are Robin #7-8 The Batman Who Laughs #1-7

growing up, new52 birds of prey was my first and only subscription to a comic, but we'd go through the $1 back issues bins all the time and just pick up whatever had a cool cover and that behavior definitely stayed with me lol

[leoruby-draws]

On and on I go posting, well today I'm gonna post about John Moore aka Rankorr, called Jack sometimes as well. This is a long post btw, just warning you! I haven't posted much of him really but I wanted to figure out how best define his personality in my au and how to approach his and Jason's working relationship.

Jack is a Red Lantern, you can read about him in the new52 Red Lantern book. His powers come from a red ring, which is powered by the emotion of rage and wrath. Seeing as Jason also has anger issues, this was one major reason why I decided to put him in the TrWh Outlaws. I did consider other options for the Lantern expy (mostly Kyle) but Jack felt more interesting and unique to me.

But in the comics he never came off as too angry, like he's angry sometimes but never to the extent needed to justify why he's the only human chosen for the red ring. He's shown to be able to create light constructs, most other red lanterns can't really do that, so that might be one reason. I wonder if the way he deals with his anger is why he can do that?

His character never got too in depth, honestly I felt like the writers didn't have much interest in him, esp once Guy Gardner got in the book. But I liked him, and thought he had potential. I was intrigued on how he handled his anger issues, which is not at all. He tried really hard to repress his anger,not the best way to deal with that. Btw, his origin story is kinda similar to canon, seeing his grandfather killed. He grew so angry and spiraled until one day a certain red ring appeared...

Also I noticed he was in Oxford university for a literature degree, he seemed to like books. I like the thought of him and Jason bonding over that.

Speaking of Jason, Jack tends to take an almost 'advisory' role to him, he has no interest in leadership. He keeps trying reel Jason in and force him to plan things out or make his plans less insane. But I imagine in the heat of battle Jack gets just as crazy due to the effects of the ring, perhaps thats why he harps on caution. He thinks Jason could be a good leader but he takes issue with his 'selfishness' and recklessness. You can see in the pic above Jack gets pretty caustic with his words, one way his anger manifests. But Jack and Jason really do see elements of themselves in the other, whether that helps them bond or agitates them depends.

Jack is, btw, older than Jason by about 2 years or so and is among the oldest of the team, another reason why he might try to act more responsible.

Here's a small plot point I thought up for Jack, when I was wondering for reasons for why he in particular got the ring. One reason is perhaps Atrocitus wanted a spy but also had the idea to make that spy a child. The idea is that a child would be less suspecting and also less likely for the adult heroes to attack as well. There's been quite an uptick in child heroes in this universe, and it seems some villains are taking advantage of it.

The idea for someone trying really hard to reign in his anger and be a hero is also struggling to deal with being a spy sounded very interesting. I imagine he would struggle with being pulled in two directions, can his fellow teammates help him out of this situation?

Another doodle going a bit more into depth for Jack, namely his relations with others. I really like the thought of Guy Gardner being a sort of mentor figure for Jack, you know Guy used to work with kids, tho that changed in new52 I believe (ignoring that for my au ofc). You can see his stress concerning Atrocitus, being forced to be a spy. But in a lot of ways Atrocitus did try help John (in his own weird way), so Jack has added guilt in not being loyal to him either. Poor kid.

Looks like Jason grows aware of Jack's duplicity, Jack can't stand Jason's hypocrisy (Jason's a bat through and through), but Jason's gonna end up helping him anyways. Bleez, another red lantern, isn't much help tho. Jack and her do end up friends, but she keeps trying to lure him to the dark(red) side.

Here's Jack with his friend Kimberly, just like in the Red Lantern comic he saves her from a creepy stalker. Jack has a hell of a time trying to keep his Red Lantern secret from her, but she can tell he's hiding something tho she's letting him tell her in his own time. Should be noted that Bleez is aware of Kim and dislikes their friendship, she doesn't like that Jack's loyalties are divided. She might also have a crush on Jack but since everyone's a kid, I wouldn't really call it much of a love triangle.

I also wanted to make a friendship between Jack and Owen Mercer, Boomerang Jr. Owen's more carefree and wayyyy less repressed, so he'd make a fun foil for Jack. This friendship's obviously inspired by Hal's and Barry's (Green Lantern, Flash) friendship, tho the dynamic's slightly flipped. With the 'flash' of this duo being the more irresponsible one, tho Jack isn't nearly as put together as he thinks.

Finally here's an older drawing of Jack, when trying to figure out how to draw him outside of his red lantern persona (think of this like concept art ig), the upper right doodle still makes me laugh.

Sorry that was so much, I just never had the chance to post about this character, so I kinda overdid it.

Still hope you like it! On to the next drawing tomorrow!

[creetchure]

I’m new here. What’s wrong with JayRoy. Aren’t they buddies? Genuine question.

Hi hello! Preliminary disclaimer: you ship what you want, its none of my business. Also i dont know how new you are so if it feels like im overexplaining im sorry

Now im gonna get into the reason why most longterm comic book fans who dont stick to the batfamily usually dislike ja/roy.

First, lets look at why this ship exists at all. It stems from the comic book red hood and the outlaws (2011), where Jason, Roy, and Kory are all on a team together. Ignoring the fact that a lot of the New52 has been retconned since, though Roy and Jason being friends was still canon as of red hood and the outlaws 2016, that lineup originally didnt make a lot of sense. Pre-crisis (before the first DC reboot in 1985), Jason was a 12/13 at the time where the Titans were all somewhere between 18 and 20. He did hang out with them a few times, but wasnt in any way childhood friends with Roy or any of them. Very much a kid hanginh out with his big brothers friends. Post-crisis, that was almost entirely retconned, making roy and jasons interractions very minimal before rhato2011, where theyre suddenly bffs.

Second, it kind of does a huge disservice to Roys character. Bear in mind that while ive read a lot of Roy comics, it was a while back, so some details might get lost in the sauce. Mostly, he would not fucking do that lmao. The pillars in his life have always been Donna Troy, Dick Grayson, and Lian Harper, his daughter. Before n52, he just. Didnt give much of a shit about Jason Todd. They also retconned his history of addiction to have something to do with Jasons death, which, in my opinion, takes away from the real reason it happened, and his relationship with Ollie. On top of that, a petty nitpick I have is that theres no way in hell Roy would get close to someone who threatened his sister at gunpoint.

In RHATO, it honestly kind of feels like Roys just there to be Jasons best friend. (Side note: jason DOES have a childhood best friend. Outlaw Eddie Bloomberg,,,,,,my missed opportunity,,,,,)

In conclusion, Ja/roy isnt like. A problematic ship. If you want to read about it, good for you. Its just kind of very obviously written by people who dont care about Roy as a character, and potentially only skimmed the wiki article to get the gist of his story.

[figofswords]

whats wrong w post new52 jason todd im not hip

everything reboot through task force z is written by scott lobdell who is a creep of a human being and can't write for shit. also, jason was really at the start of his redemption journey post-under the red hood, and the reboot cut off that emotional arc. jason and the outlaws had potential because i do think pairing him with roy harper (who has had similar themes throughout his arcs and is another black sheep of his superhero "family") was a really fantastic idea but unfortunately it was written by lobdell who doesn't plan story arcs, apparently doesn't do research on existing character lore, and cannot write realistic characters or dialogue to save his life. 

i will point to the "Cheer" storyline in batman: urban legends 1-6 as an actually really good modern take on jason, but that's a short story in an anthology series. his more major appearances are dogshit. i haven't read task force z even though it's a new writer because i frankly do not care for the suicide squad as a concept and i don't like the team he's been paired with (bane??? come on). it feels like another way to lump him into a very un-nuanced antihero role without examining the things that make him a complex and interesting character. lobdell's run did a lot of damage to his character and continuity and putting him on task force z is not where that is going to get fixed.

honestly the only really good jason writing (aside from cheer) is by judd winick (under the red hood, etc), who was responsible for his resurrection and who took a subtler approach to dealing with the complexity and managed to craft a really layered, compelling, and most of all believable character. just compare jason's encounter with tim in teen titans 29 (total crap, bad writing, cartoonish villainy, zero nuance and poor characterization - not lobdell, but lobdell is not the only guilty jason writer) and his encounter with mia dearden in green arrow 69-72 (winick again. complex, interesting, actually in line with jason's characterization, subtle!!!!). again, lobdell isn't the only guilty party - grant morrison's jason immediately before the new 52 reboot is completely off the rails in terms of cartoonish villainy - but before new 52, jason's story was predominantly handled by winick and was restricted to appearances in other comic runs. he didn't star in his own run until red hood and the outlaws, which means it became the authority on his continuity and character post-reboot, which is unfortunate because all of it was written by lobdell. who didn't get fired for forever because he was in with the boys gang at dc. which is crap.

anyways. sorry to go off i just have a lot a lot a lot of feelings on this matter. tldr new-52-and-onwards jason sucks because scott lobdell is a shitty writer. holding jason in my hands and sobbing baby boy what did they do to you

[crashcitycentral]

Jason Todd 🤝 Bart Allen =

Risking it all for their best friends

[The first image is showcasing an exerpt from 'NEW52 RedHood and the Outlaws 1' where Jason (Right) is breaking Roy (left) out of a heavily guarded prison that could have ended in his capture or subsequent second death]

[In the second image is a scene from 'Impulse (1995) issue 6' Where Bart learns the his best friend Preston is being abused by his mother while in costume and is fully about to talk to the Vice Princible and Authorities about what he'd seen, giving away his secret identity in the process.]