#mlvns i mean lol

[eddieydewr]

“why would the duffers build up mlvn for 4 seasons only to break them up”

where’s the build up??

[emblazons]

I have no idea how Mike got caught in the terrifying crossfire of being compared to and conflated with Hopper & Brenner in El's mind. Nope. Not even one. 🙃

[thewrongmoon]

Was scrolling through tiktok today and found an unrelated to st video about dropping a show when a couple you don’t like gets together and one of the top comments was “me when mike and Will get together in the final season of stranger things.” I was like wow okay at least they’re acknowledging it’s inevitable now that’s character development I guess

[love-byers]

I was never on board for m*leven as a ship because of season 1, what do you mean you’re gonna throw a super powered girl, who escaped from a lab, that knows nothing about the world into a romance???

It’s not healthy for her, she didn’t even know who she is as a person and only started exploring her identity season 2 on wards. Idk the shop never sat right with me because of that.

yep i 100% agree and i was only 12 when s1 came out

byler was not even in my stratosphere when i first saw s1, and i felt the same. completely honestly, i was hoping mike would be gay just because at the time i was tired of straight people and just wanted some queer rep. idk why i picked mike but i did lol

but i got over that quick and didn't hate mlvn or anything, i thought they were cute. but still i felt like their kiss came out of nowhere, like it genuinely shocked me. and i really don't know why, but i just didn't like the scene. something just felt off about them.

and overall i felt the same, that el literally knew nothing about the world or relationships and was jumping into a romantic relationship after being free for a week. it just didn't feel healthy. and at the time, i didn't like the scene where el asked mike if she was still pretty. i mean im not saying HORRIBLE TOXIC ABUSIVE like of course its not that, but in the long run for their relationship i just didn't like it. i didn't think el seeking validation from mike like that was setting up a long healthy relationship. like we see el see nancy's picture and call her pretty, and later she goes in nancy's room and looks at all her pictures from throughout her life, and it makes her sad. she wants to feel that way--like a normal, pretty girl.

then when mike dresses her up to go to the school, she feels pretty. she asks mike if she looks pretty, and he says yes. she's seeking validation from him. and later when her wig gets messed up and she looks at herself in the waters reflection and tries to put it back on, it infuriates her, because she doesn't feel pretty anymore. and when she sees mike again, she once again seeks out the validation. she was worried that mike wouldn't think she was pretty anymore. it really makes me think that el did not love mike, or the other way around. she latched onto him because he was the first person to show her kindness and make her feel normal. they kissed after a WEEK. thats not love, thats attachment. jumping into a relationship because of complex trauma and attachment without having time to consider their actual compatibility as a couple.

and yes yes yes i know they're 7th graders, they're not going to be perfect, but this is a television show. we only get to see a sliver of these relationships in the long term, so what we do see needs to be building them up and making them likable. there is no time to break them down and build them up again. thats just not how you write a love story.

[carigm]

ABOUT THE NEW PICTURES!

Some new pics from set got released today, and although it’s nothing too exciting, I think it’s worth pointing some things out.

Why so many goddamn bikes? Is everyone in Hawkins riding bikes? 😭 We don’t even have this many main characters lol

I’ve already seen people making jokes about this and the “3 waterfalls”, but in case people believe an ai lip reading in which Mike supposedly utters the words “you gotta improve your motivation”, according to that lip reading they were talking about leaving Hawkins (the local village lol) and finding a place with 3 waterfalls. As you can see, this is a map of Hawkins. So it doesn’t even fit the Mlvn ai lip reading nonsense.

And last we have this pic of little Mike. This is the most interesting thing they shared imo. This picture we’ve already seen in the show before, it was on the Wheelers’ picture mantle in S1, if I’m not mistaken.

Here they’ve placed it on top of two vinyl records. Was it arranged like this just for the picture? If so, what are the implications or what are they trying to hint at?

1. Music will be important for Mike next season because he will be targeted by Vecna.

2. The two records are Treasure Island and Swiss Family Robinson. Originally, these are novels. Both of them feature characters ending up in deserted islands, and they both also feature a character that ends up going back to civilization/society at the end of the journey. Jim in Treasure Island, and Ernest in Swiss Family Robinson.

Here’s a description of both those characters.

They do kinda sound like Mike don’t they? It’s worth noting that Ernest is the second child and he has an older brother (sibling) who’s an excellent shot. I mean…Ernest also abandons/leaves his family at the end of the story.

3. The Swiss Family Robinson inclusion could also be hinting at something else, and imo this is the most likely thing. A couple of months ago, someone leaked that the Wheelers’ house gets completely overtaken by the UD, and the Wheelers’ basically become homeless (I think they end up at the farm). This leaker mentioned the scene was an action packed scene that also featured some members of the party being there, and that it was also Karen’s first real encounter with the UD. Out of all the leaks we’ve gotten, I always believed this person because from little tidbits we’ve seen their leaks are the only ones that seem to match up. Now what is the main plot of the Swiss Family?

A family being shipwrecked and basically becoming homeless.

If I had to put my money on these clues meaning anything, I would say this is the most likely.

Although perhaps we’re looking too much into it and the picture is a hint to us getting a younger Mike flashback? After all, those two records were probably from when he was a kid.

So many possibilities.

[greenfiend]

just saw this and...

https://x.com/ElMikeWheelers/status/1816760812423319933/photo/1

Hey anon! I think it’s important to remember that screenshots out of context don’t mean much and that the Mlvn kiss is absolutely nothing like the Han/Leia scene.

(Watch the full clip here)

Yes both Han and Mike had a surprised open eye expression when being kissed but…

They also have a proper kiss afterwards.

I think that confession anon is a tad extreme, but I do think that we are meant to find the Mlvn kiss… just… strange and a tad uncomfortable. Especially because we don’t actually see Mike like this at all afterwards…

(My apologies for this nightmare inducing image. Lol)

[mikesmelodrama]

eleven doesn't need a boyfriend to be happy. (an analysis)

some mlvns say bylers hate el but that just isn't correct at all?

the argument is near always that "wanting mlvn to break up means you hate el because she's happy with mike"

now, first of all: did you ever stop to think whether mike happy with el?

because maloobans also say things like "just because will likes mike doesn't mean mike has to like him back."

okay! with that same logic, just because el likes mike doesn't mean they have to stay together. their relationship has been rocky for a while. mike has trouble saying he loves el. if els feelings are unrequited in s5 (which i don't believe because i think she realised she doesn't love mike at the end of s4 and neither love each other anymore), it wouldn't make sense to keep them together.

second of all: is el the happiest she can be with mike? in s3, we see el finding herself with max who says "there's more to life than stupid boys." and el IS happy without mike, but i believe she was still in love with him in s3 and that's why they got back together. however, i think mike wanted to stay broken up at the end of s3 but was caught off guard by the love confession

i'm not even gonna get into the shitshow that was mlvn in s3 but y'all have seen it, so...

third: i'd assume most mlvn shippers are straight - therefore they're watching the relationship through a heteronormative lens, and thinking that el would need a boyfriend to be happy is a heteronormative idea.

some melvins say they want mlvn to get married and have kids, which is also a heteronormative idea.

i don't necessarily like eddie but in his wise words: "forced conformity is killing the kids."

so, what do we learn from this?

el needing to be in a relationship goes against the idea stranger things is trying to push. the idea that stranger things is saying over and over over again is that you don't need to be "normal" according to society.

for example:

dustin is disabled. will is gay. lucas is black. max is (likely) disabled in s5 if she wakes up. joyce is a single mom. robin is gay. jonathan is bullied. murray believes in alien conspiracies.

obviously, all of those things (except the alien conspiracy lol) are normal but in the 80's they weren't treated as such, or even now.

with characters like that, is ST really going to push a relationship like mlvn to be endgame? NO.

you don't need to be in a straight, unhappy relationship because it's what society wants you to do. you can be a freak, and just because a boy and a girl are friends, doesn't mean they need to be together.

also, "boy finds traumatized girl in woods, takes her under his wing, they fall in love, end of story."

does that sound like what's best for el? because when you think about it, el doesn't need mike and vice versa. she hasn't needed him since she moved in with the byers, because she has a loving family & friends. mike isn't the only important person in her life.

and having els arc to be diluted to being some nerds superhero girlfriend with very little personality of her own wouldn't be a good way to end s5 on.

having mike just be rude to will for no reason and magically figuring out all his troubles with saying i love you to his girlfriend (that can't possibly have anything to do with him being queer, can they?) and them being happy forever wouldn't be a good way to end s5 on.

what el needs is to be independent and learn what she likes without a boyfriend she's heavily codependent on. SHE DOESN'T NEED A RELATIONSHIP AND ISN'T READY FOR ONE.

the truth is, she doesn't know enough love and healthy relationships to be with mike while being independent and figuring out her own identity. i honestly believe even canon elmax would work out better than mlvn, even though i'm a single, independent el truther at heart.

hope you liked my little ramble!

i really hope we get platonic elmike in s5 cause we were ROBBED 😭

[spicybylerpolls]

i cant ignore all the lord's work he has done as the captain of the byler ship.

even if noah wasnt gay i think he would be fully invested in this pairing, i mean imagine being second to el (and millie when doing interviews) for YEARS because your love story is a spoiler? YEARS. for a kid actor? props to him man, this is big work to keep a secret.

and because this is spicy central after all, from what ive seen of him, he doesnt seem the kind to shy away from getting a little bit weird with it. like, wasnt there a pic of him eating a cracker from in between sadie's toes while she was in character in the hospital with a cast on for max? and there's countless videos of him eating food/expressing how much of an epicurean he is. like that cast game where they all blind put their hands into bowls of different stuff! he was loving on the shaving foam lol. thats someone who isnt afraid to dive in and enjoy the sensuality of the world.

i just think he would want will to have a proper love scene - after so many years, i think he would think will deserves it, and deserves for it to be shown on screen. it doesnt have to be Sexy with a capital S, but the scene should still exist and the whole storyline of attraction and shame get its due diligence. i think by being coy and omitting this kind of scene, the overall impression would be that his shame was correctly placed.

its like the duffers saying 'go will! embrace your gayness! but we dont wanna see that ew'

its not even about censorship or younger fans or offended people. thats just one small portion of fandom. young teen fans are welcome - i would have watched ST at your age too (and been attracted to mike and will for sure, they're good lookin lads) - but theyre not the main demographic that would tank the show if the duffers ended up offending them by making byler too explicit.

i dont think it's about what we fans 'want', in a good or bad context. i see a lot of mlvns saying 'why do you want mike to be a liar?' its not about what i want, it's about letting these characters have and do and be who they are meant to be. the writers are in service to these characters and the story. we viewers are just along for the ride.

These are all very good points! Not including some kind of scene, even if only implied, could send an unintentionally strange message... especially since they've already gone there with the straight couples.

Byler having sex would def be an antidote to shame.

Lol @ "go will! embrace your gayness! but we dont wanna see that ew!" It reminds me of the Byler meme where Mike rejects Will by saying, "I know I said crazy together, but not that crazy."

[emblazons]

I got an ask a while back where I talked about this, and hard agreed.

I don't have any qualms with people headcanoning characters any way they want to, and its their right! But with this...on top of all the disinterest she shows in girls in general, Mike having "lost feelings" for El only to realize he has/has always had feelings for Will feels (dare I say it) a little cruel narratively, even though it happens irl.

That, combined with the whole "star crossed lovers" imagery...like. What is "star crossed" about Mike just not loving her romantically? there are plenty of people I just want to be friends with / people I've lost feelings for, and that didn't make us star-crossed.

Now, if I was gay and trying hard to care about someone a specific way that just wasn't in my nature, and that made me terrified to admit to the person because I loved them, just not like that...well.

since ppl are talking about it one of the biggest reasons i think mike is gay and not bi is bc el this entire series has always thought that it was her. that she was the problem, the monster. if mike is bi then that means he was romantically in love with el but either fell out of love, or just likes will more than her. then she would still be stuck in the cycle of thinking it’s her, and that she wasn’t enough for mike even after him gassing her up about being a superhero/ “the most incredible person in the world.” (which narratively is confusing too and wouldn’t make sense).

if he’s gay she would finally have another moment of realizing it was never her. and it was never her own actions that made their relationship rocky like she might believe. mike being gay would help el understand why he acted the way he did since s3 and their relationship would only flourish and not have unresolved pieces floating around. she would be happy for mike and will too.

[wakeupthemembersofbylernation]

why do you think byler is less popular than mlvn on instagram?

on tiktok, tumblr, twitter and pretty much all other platforms byler is the more popular ship, but for some reason mlvns is more popular on instagram.

This is a good question! I’m not sure there’s a definitive answer, but if I were to take a stab at it, maybe it has something to do with the age demographic/type of fan on each platform?

Tumblr is very gay platform, and it’s also a platform for theorizing, so it makes sense that Byler is more popular here. Mlvn just kinda exists right now. There’s not much to theorize about. Like if you really believe that the monologue fixed everything and Mike and El will live happily ever after, then okay. It makes sense why a lot of them believe Mlvn will get married young and have children, cause where else is for them to go? All the other ships have unfinished business, even Jopper, the ship that’s probably in the best place after S4. They still have to figure out how to work together as a couple with a blended family.

Byler is inherently exciting to Tumblr cause it’s all about theorizing and anticipation. And it’s queer. Age demographic-wise, it seems like Byler Tumblr is all over the map too: from millennials who’ve been through this before with other ships that turned out to be queerbait to Gen Z adults my age to younger Zoomers who are truly excited about a ship becoming canon for the first time. There’s probably some of Gen Alpha here too, as well as people from Gen X. This shows that Byler is exciting and appeals to a wide range of folks.

With TikTok, it’s a younger skewing platform, and fandom-wise, there’s an emphasis on edits as well as Byler theorizing. And honestly, Season 4 genuinely didn’t give Mlvns that much to work with when it comes to edits. I mean, Will is in most of the shots. And Mlvn theories don’t seem that exciting. The GA already sees Mlvn endgame as the foregone conclusion, and he monologued to her. What else is there to theorize about? Since TikTok is a newer platform, it seems like there’s just less Mlvn-loyalists making content there, and Byler shippers have just taken it over. This is in large part due to Stranger Things as a whole exploding in popularity during summer 2022 and a lot of people switching sides to Byler during that time. There was a lot of content to create. I also think to some extent angsty edits perform better. And Byler obviously has a lot of angst.

Twitter honestly seems like the biggest war zone to me, which is why I stay away from ST Twitter for the most part. There’s just a lot of petty fights and arguments. Clearly we have a strong presence there, as evidenced by us causing the whole Byler script fiasco in august 2022. Mlvns there seem to be the most toxic, and I’ve noticed they always have Regina George tendencies (a lot of them have PFPs of Millie, Regina George, Barbie, or Olivia Rodrigo for some reason). I don’t know if it’s true that there are more Bylers than Mlvns on Twitter, but if that is true, that’s once again because Byler is just more exciting lol.

I think Instagram is a weird creature overall. It’s older than TikTok, so the fandom presence was likely established in 2016 when Mlvn mania began. It’s not really algorithmically based in the same way (with clear trending topics), so I think it’s easier for people to just follow and interact with accounts they support. I’ve noticed that a lot of the Mlvn accounts are Fillie accounts or Fillie-adjacent accounts often run by young girls (but not always- there are older fans too).

They tend to overly romanticize Mlvn and genuinely see it as the height of romance, even denying that they have any problems whatsoever. And they tend to bombard ST comment sections with extremely overzealous pro-Mlvn stuff, sometimes bordering on bizarre. Maybe part of this is due to IG basically being Facebook for younger millennials/older Zoomers? I think it’s a substantially more normie and less queer space than Tumblr. It’s also picture-based, so Mlvns often post screenshots from the show and pictures of Finn and Millie.

And obviously reddit is pro-Mlvn to an extreme too, with Bylers basically been exiled to the Byler subreddit. But there it’s largely middle-aged men who can’t fathom their favorite nerdy 80s nostalgia show becoming “woke” and gay.

[starbylers]

I just have to make the point that even legit leaks can a) absolutely be taken out of context. Like imagine pre s4 hearing ‘El plans a date for her and Mike, and Will thirdwheels them’, or ‘Mike finally tells El he loves her’, none of that gives you a comprehensive picture of the actual story and all the nuances within those specific events. For example it’s extremely possible that idk Mike is at some point very protective of El…like duh, he does love her and she literally almost died again at the end of s4 😭 or even something less dramatic and more just sweet. May I remind you Stancy s2 full on kiss and say they love each other and then break up later lmao. I just mean to say there are ways things could come across very pro-Mlvn while being wildly out of context. And b) any leak is coming through numerous filters. The original source, how accurate/detailed what they know is, how they communicate it, how the recipient interprets the information & decides to relay it sometimes based on their own agenda lol. I personally recommend never taking anything at face value even from possibly reliable sources 🫡

[wiseatom]

How do you think Joyce will feel about Will and Mike dating? Like, what kind of mother will she be in this scenario? And how do you think Hopper will deal with their relationship, initially and in the long run?

so the thing is i simply think there is nothing more joyce byers wants in this world than the happiness of her sons, and i think that she has seen mike wheeler treat her son w love and tenderness and care and authenticity the entire time she has known him, so she would be Delighted to see will have something he clearly thought he was never going to have, even if she had any reservations about it. i think joyce definitely has opportunities as a mother, especially where jonathan is concerned, but i do also think that in terms of how she would treat byler, i think she'd make an effort to tease will about it the way she does jonathan with nancy in s3? like the breakfast scene in the first episode. i think she would make it clear that she is comfortable w the relationship through teasing. almost normalize it through sweetly poking fun at him? just to give will that reassurance that yes, she really does love him even if that means loving the boy he brought home in kindergarten in more ways than what everyone else thinks is okay.

the hopper/will relationship is genuinely one of my favorite things to think about, and i know a lot of people have Opinions about hopper, but also like. i simply love a flawed character!! i do!!! i think his good outweighs his bad, and i could go on about s3 characterization, but that's not what you asked, so i'll save it! i think hopper loves will and mike both so much individually that i cannot see a scenario where he doesn't support them together. since he's gotten involved in the byers' lives, he has been a champion for will's safety and will's happiness. even on a surface level, he has gone out of his way to protect him and make sure will knows that he is in will's corner. obviously he's had more of a plot with mike, but i think he has, for the most part (aka ignoring s3), really made an effort to understand mike and has come to accept him by the end of s4. i think this guy just genuinely wants mike to be happy yk. i think it depends on how the mlvn breakup goes, and what cards mike plays, but i also can't fathom a scenario in which el holds resentment towards byler happening, yk? i don't think she's going to be jumping for joy, i think it's going to take time, but i think there's going to be a *finn voice* mutual understanding and acceptance there, and i think that seeing that, coupled with the fact that hop loves both will and mike and wants to see them happy, will make that transition easier.

i do think hop learned his lesson in s3 lol but i think similar to joyce, he'd apply similar rules that he did to mike and el so that they reinforce the idea that mike and will's relationship isn't Wrong yk. so they definitely get the 3 inch rule, and hop def acts exasperated over mike's existence, but i think there's also an undercurrent of, "you let me know if anyone messes with you" and "i've got your backs no matter what." i just lov hop <3

send curious anons (or don't) <3

[will80sbyers]

One of the things that made me stop reading analyses in the Byler fandom is how people just tend to pick 'parallels' that they like while ignoring or dismissing other parallels that do not suit their takes. Especially the most/more obvious parallels that are put on the show. For example Byler being paralleled to other romantic ships show that byler is also romantic but apparently Mlvn being paralleled to Byler and other romantic ships don't count as a romantic parallel. Mike being paralleled to Vickie apparently isn't a parallel because it doesnt support the intended *parallel meaning*. They literally framed Vickie and Mike in the same way and gave them same lines while paralleling Vickie's ex and El, and Will/Robin.

People will analyze all Byler scenes back and forth to show how it's romantic meanwhile completely ignoring Mlvn's romantic moments on the show. Even when Byler itself literally parallels Mlvn..... And it happens all the time not just with parallels but with other stuff like framing/editing or set design clues.

And these are not even ''minuscule details'' or ''subext'' stuff that you have to analyse. They are like the most obvious parallels that the show put.

Dont get me wrong, i like finding clues and reading analyses but they just kinda feel extremely... disingenuous sometimes when you just pick stuff that you like while ignoring other stuff just bc it doesnt support your argument.

Yeah, I get why you feel like this!!

I don't understand the point of ignoring those parallels too, the existence of byler-minteven parallels is part of why I can't think Matrioska is not romantic, that and like also the framing of their scenes where they are framed with a romantic meaning very very often, especially in the first seasons but also in season 4 they have some moments framed as romantic too!

I didn't stop reading the theories because of that though, I hear people out many times even if I don't personally agree and I like seeing all the little details that maybe could be intentional... But I do stop reading the theories in the posts when they are phrased in a way that sounds pretentious to me or seems like they are saying that if you don't think that then you are stupid, but even in that case I just ignore it as long as there is no biphobic idea involved I'm fine with people ignoring what they want to ignore in the show... I just don't care xD

I think it's also a thing about a different interpretation of stuff, I tend to not be able to ignore the big picture of what I see all together, so stuff like the "boys only" thing or the drawing in El's room etc doesn't seem like a good enough reason to say Mike is gay to me I see it as sort of general queer coding for Mike like saying "from now on for you it's only one boy aka Will"

But I also see him as acting genuine with El and also liking kissing her a lot in s3 and other people watch that and are convinced he hates it because he moves her hands...so I just think it's all about the subject that is watching for some things and it can never be super objective because of that unless you are literally the writers

But you know, I still think they all should be allowed to ignore what they want tbh even if I think taking that into consideration gives the best fair judgement on the show if you try to be the most objective possible by looking at everything... but like I'm not here to police people about what they should talk about in the tag so I just skip it and continue my day lol I get annoyed if the arguments used are clearly born from biphobia, for the rest I don't care much tbh

in the end it's not that important if he's gay or bi or just queer the important thing is that he's happy and kissing Will Byers next season

But I definitely still think he's a messy bisexual until they confirm he's not, because that's what makes sense to me for now 🌈

[carigm]

Today Millie had a fan panel in which she answered that her ideal ending would be Mike and El getting married and Will being happy and confessing to Mike (lol) and ofc the Stranger Things fandom kicked up the old Byler vs Mlvn war once again, regardless of the fact she doesn’t write the show. But I want to break down some points here about things I’ve been noticing today, but also for a while and that I think need to be discussed. Keep reading if you want.

I’ve seen a lot of hostility towards Byler and Bylers on Twitter lately, saying we’re delusional and don’t know what we’re talking about. This always seems to be the go to argument even tho it’s all in the narrative. Today it got really bad after Millie’s comments and even people that were merely disagreeing with her opinions got called everything from delusional to misogynistic.

IF the Duffers suddenly decided to ignore everything they’ve carefully crafted and put into their narrative that doesn’t make anyone delusional, it just makes them terrible writers. Who would be doing a great disservice to all three characters involved in the love triangle.

There’s been an insurgence (on Twitter) of so called “Will stans” who seem to be completely fine with the idea of mlvn being endgame because “Will can just get another boyfriend” Not only is this insulting to what the writers have already established for Will’s character but it’s also a defense and endorsement of the worst kind of lazy/bad writing that could graze our screens.

The Duffers CHOSE to tie Will’s character arc to Mike’s and El’s.

How do you expect them to undo that and create a well fleshed out character that’s deserving of Will, in 8 episodes that we know are not just gonna be dedicated to Will’s supposed love interest, because there’s a shit ton of stuff to resolve?

If this was the route the Duffers were going for, they could’ve clearly given Will a love interest last season (like with Robin) or two seasons ago (like with Dustin) And yet somehow, people think it would be totally okay for Will to get the most meaningless romance of all time as the writers ignore the same story they’ve created.

Another point I’ve been seeing a lot from these people is “Mike won’t come out. Let it go. He’s just a very unlikable character” What does that say about the quality of the writing and content you’re willing to consume then? You’re okay with characters being poorly written? And please someone explain to me how Mike’s actions, especially in S4, make any sense unless he likes Will.

The more people try to simplify this story the more plot holes and inconsistencies it creates.

The funny thing is that a lot of these “Will stans” used to be Bylers themselves but are so deathly afraid it won’t be endgame that they’ve started to use the same rhetoric mlvns use every day to justify what would be atrocious writing.

And this next thing might be controversial but I think it needs to be said.

So many people on Twitter have hit those who disagree with Millie’s opinion today with “y’all are misinterpreting Millie’s words” and let me tell you, no one has. She’s been saying the same stuff for forever and quite frankly she’s never had a coherent thought about Will. Which is fine, at the end of the day that’s not the character she plays. However, I haven’t forgotten how last year (at another panel) she was asked about Byler and said it was just a reflection of Finn and Noah’s friendship and that was what people were seeing…

Whatever the fuck that means, I guess.

Again, I’m not taking her answer today too seriously cause truth be told she’s been saying some version of this since she was around twelve, and has even at times said she was joking about it. If a wedding were actually happening she wouldn’t be able to say it cause I’d literally be a spoiler, even if she doesn’t have the scripts yet or doesn’t know I’m sure there’s things that would be off limits for any actor to say at this point.

But this defense squad that formed today begging for us to not misconstrue her words because “she really cares about Will’s character” is laughable.

Her answers regarding the topic of the love triangle have been anything but nuanced. If she doesn’t want to get into it or address it, that’s fine. It’s her choice.

But of course, mlvn stans are gonna take her answers seriously, as well as those who are now “Will stans” who basically ship mlvn too.

And to me there’s a fundamental flaw regarding the ship wars in this fandom, which these people don’t seem to grasp. At this point, it isn’t so much about “which ship is better” but “which outcome isn’t violently homophobic”

That’s it.

I don’t care how much you ship mlvn, this is the undisputed truth here.

But when your lead actors act like it’s not a big deal, it’s no surprise the fandom doesn’t give a shit.

I can only hope the Duffers were smart enough to see reason and were able to write the only outcome that won’t set television back around 10 years or so.

And hopefully one day, when S5 is out, we can get a more in depth and honest conversation with the actors about all of this.

As for me, I’m gonna lay low and not give much of a fuck until we start getting those Reddit leaks, which were very much accurate for last season. I’ll take a peak at those, and depending on what they look like, I’ll stay around or dip completely.

If you read all of this, thank you.

[noahschnappinfs]

I’m a byler and i would get really excited when any of the ppl from the st cast would give us hint about byler being endgame and noah was really the one who fed us the most, but considering the way these bylers have treated him during the past months I really hope he doesn’t do shit, infact even if he says mlvn endgame i wont mind a bit because I would love to see these bylers who participated in this antisemitic and homophobic abuse against him for months to have a breakdown lol

yes im being petty and mean but idc those ppl deserve the worst

and yes i love byler to death but i hate majority of the bylers

you’re so me lol i have to be very honest with you, i kind of like that a big part of the byler fandom already hate him now because if sadly byler actually doesn’t happen, he already got rid of them and he can move on.

[erikiara80]

favorite/least favorite Byler and M!leven scenes?

Ciao, anon. Thanks for the ask.

If you follow my blog I hope you know that I'm not a fan of Mike and El as a couple. I like a few scenes, but I don't think their relationship is good for them or that they're actually in love.

Ok, if you're still reading, let me explain.

I never found them cute, not even in S1. When I watched it I didn't understand why the writers were writing such a good story set in the 80s, but with El and Mike it felt like I was actually watching an 80s show with the typical story, boy and girl kiss/end up together because... boy and girl must date. It felt wrong to me. It wasn't what ST was about. Now I understand that I was supposed to feel that way.

That being said, El and Mike are beautiful, complex characters, so these are the scenes I like.

1. El would (understand). Ok, not saying this is a Mlv scene, but Mike can be vulnerable with Will and say how he really feels. And I love what he says about El. He's right. She would understand. The funny thing, is that I think she would (and will) understand Will much better than how she understands Mike.

2. I feel for them here. El's been isolated for so long, and Mike misses her and feels guilty for what happened to her. Interestingly, Castle Byers is playing here...

3. From one look you can see the joy, the relief and all the pain this kid must've felt. Amazing (one of Finn's best performances)

4. If I remember correctly, this was actually Millie being exhausted, not El, and Finn helped her. But it's in the show, and I love it.

This s pretty much it.

My least favorite mlvn scene: 3x01. How they left their friends on Weathertop, and them making out and laughing at Hopper's face. Lol, those little shits.

With Byler, it's the opposite. There's only one scene I don't like. The dnd campaign in S3. I know it's important and even foreshadowing of events in S5, but like the rain fight it reminded me of something that happened to me. That's all I'm going to say.

Now, my favorite Byler scenes...

1. Probably my favorite scene of the show, imo one of the best and also Finn's best perfomance. The shed scene is such a pivotal moment, when we learn, along with Will I'm sure, that asking him to be his friend was the best thing Mike has ever done. It all started with Will and Mike. Their bond is special, and it's forever. They were the ones who started the first party and they will start a new one together.

2. You can feel how much they need each other and want to be close again. A precious moment that almost made me cry.

3. He's quiet today. Four words that mean so much. The fact that Lucas says He's always quiet informs us that Will and Mike's relationship is different. That Mike knows Will better that the rest of the party and that Will opens up to him. And Mike does the same, as we see in the Crazy together scene.

4. Mike's head on Will's heart. Adorable

5. Another little moment that is so important. Just a Not possible, a flirty look and Mike's smile. They don't need anything else. Steve would've felt it, the electricity.

6. Speaking of Mike's smiles, the ones in the van are something beautiful

7. Crazy together. What else can I say?

8. I love Will's sweet voice here: "It was you guys who saved me. It was you guys." Mike tries to hide a smile (he's so happy that Will is saying that he helped save him) Then Will's flirty: It always is, isn't it?" And Mike melts. It was too much for him.

Honorable mention:

And this (Gif credits to Celebslive)