#maybe i should try and get an adhd dx for real….. like actually Do It

[appleslices]

maybe cringey but whatever was watching a yt vid and the ytbuer was like “i was so overwhelmed about all the stuff i wanted to do and needed to do that instead of doing that i just paced around me house for hours” and i wasnt aware that was something other people Also did as an executive function cope…..

[squeelokitty]

Neither of these applies directly to me and I don't really want to distract too much from OP's point but I've been thinking a lot lately about the mental health provider community jumping to conclusions.

I was dx with ADHD two years ago. I should have been diagnosed at least a decade ago. I sometimes find myself wishing I were a boy because then maybe it would have been caught when I was a kid, but I'm not and girls in the 80s and 90s were terribly underdiagnosed for both that and autism. Heck my dad was diagnosed with autism a year ago at 74. There was and is a perception that if you didn't fit exactly into this set of symptoms, for both, then it must be something else (as happened to OP). There's a reason there are all those memes aimed at Millennials who were labeled gifted as kids and now have actual diagnoses (or are still trying to get one because they know Something is Wrong).

I've been medicated for depression and anxiety for 20+ years. I have been through more meds and combos than I can count. Some made it worse, some worked for a bit and then didn't, some just didn't work at all. Things that maybe should have been a sign were never taken as such - like getting fired from a job after I missed a deadline because all my attempts to stay organized failed. I was just stressed and overworked, that was all.

Several years after that, when I went to law school, it became very clear something else was going on, because I knew the material and could have a great discussion about it and the finals turned into word salad. I went to one of the student clinics for a full psych eval. They decided I didn't have ADHD, I had a significant cognitive processing speed delay (which is NOT recognized by IDEA as a disability for academic accommodations, although I got informal ones while the results were pending and my grades did a 180, and that plus the anxiety were enough to convince the disability office to give them to me anyway). He said it just takes my brain longer to churn through stuff, that's all.

Here's the thing. He didn't stop to think about whether I have the kind of training that would skew results on a TOVA test (I do). He didn't stop to think about whether my brain is really slower or whether it just seems that way because I already have 1,000 browser tabs open in my head at any given point in time and adding another bogs it down.

So fast forward 8 years and I'm struggling to get anything done and the anxiety and depression are real bad and my therapist says, hm. What if the lack of focus is driving the depression/anxiety, not the other way around? And I tell her they already told me I don't have ADHD. She looks at the report. She tells me that it's possible it's the browser tab problem, not the processing itself. Meanwhile, my psychiatrist is trying to figure out why I've just failed another med combo and looking at the results of that old eval and trying to figure out whether I'm just drug-seeking for stimulants. And she's willing to try but not willing to give me an actual dx yet so she finds a med that can be prescribed for something else, and now I have a diagnosis for binge eating disorder, which I do not have (I do have disordered eating but it's not quite that). And I still don't officially have a dx from anyone but my therapist.

But I'm off all the SSRIs. I have Wellbutrin - the only thing that has ever worked for depression - and I have Vyvanse and I'm off everything else because it turns out when I can focus and get shit done, I'm less anxious and don't feel like I'm a horrible lazy failure. Because I don't have a serotonin problem. I've never had a serotonin problem. I have a dopamine problem.

Unlike OP, I've never had a problem actually finding providers, I've been lucky that way, I guess. Like OP, I've spent a long time thinking something was wrong other than what they said. It's been two years and I'm still very angry and grieving all the lost time I've spent believing I just wasn't trying hard enough to not be a dumpster fire of a human. And if not for a therapist who has lived the same thing, I'd still be there.

As a late diagnosed autist I will say one of the most damaging but transformative experiences I've ever had was being misdiagnosed with BPD.

Everyday my heart goes out to people with BPD.

The amount of stigma and silencing they face is astonishing and sickening.

I took DBT for years. Therapists use to turn me away because of my diagnosis.

I would be having full blown autistic meltdowns, crying for help literally - but because I was labeled as BPD ANY time I cried I was treated as manipulative and unstable.

As if the only reason I could be crying was if I was out to trick someone.

95% of the books out there with Borderline in the title are named shit like 'How to get away from a person with Borderline', 'How to stop walking on eggshells (with a person who has BPD)'

I was never allowed to feel true pain or panic or need.

That was 'attention seeking behavior', not me asking for help when a disability was literally inhibiting my ability to process emotions.

There were dozens of times where I had a full meltdown and was either threatened with institutionalization or told I was doing it for attention.

My failing relationships weren't due to a communication issue, or the inability to read social cues. No, because I was labeled borderline, my unstable relationships were my fault. Me beggong nuerotypicals to just be honest and blunt with what they meant was me pestering them for validation.

Borderline patients can't win.

And the funny thing is - I asked my therapist about autism. I told her I thought I was on the spectrum.

BPD is WILDLY misdiagnosed with those with autism and I had many clear signs.

Instead - she told me 'If you were autistic we wouldn't be able to have this conversation'. She made me go through a list of autistic traits made clearly for children, citing how I didn't fit each one.

And then she told me that me identifying with the autism community was the BPD making me search for identity to be accepted - and that I wasn't autistic, just desperate to fit in somewhere.

I didn't get diagnosed for another ten years. For ten years I avoided the autism community - feeling as if I were just a broken person who wanted to steal from people who 'really needed it'.

Because of my providers - I began to doubt my identity MORE, not less.

Ten years of thinking I was borderline and being emotionally neglected and demonized by a system meant to help me.

To this day, I still don't trust neurotypicals. Not fully.

I know I'm not borderline now - but my heart aches for them. Not for the usual stuff. But for the stigma. And the asshole doctors. And the dismissiveness and threatening and the idea of institutionalization hanging over their head.

I love Borderline people. I always will. I'm not Borderline but if you are I love you and I'm sorry.

You're not a bad person. You're not a therapists worst nightmare, you are a human with valid feelings and fears.

Borderline people I'm sorry.

[blackbird-brewster]

Hello Black Bird Brewster! I'm the anon from chaotic archeologist who thinks they are autistic and am going to a dr for pain. I would like to hear any advice and thoughts you have about disclosing information to a dr about 'self diagnosed autism' and maybe how to convey my pain symptoms so I'm not brushed aside?

I grew up with weird ass parents so I've been suffering for quite a long time so I'm real good at 'masking'

Hello Anon,

Thanks for reaching out! For context, I live with multiple disabilities/chronic illnesses. My first dx on this list was about a decade ago. I am also ADHD, that was dx as a kid but I haven't actually had 'treatment' since I was like 10? A couple of years ago I realised I'm also Autistic! Self-diagnosis is extremely important and valid. Because I am a seemingly 'well-adjusted' adult there is literally NO way for me to seek medical dx for autism in my country. There's also no support or benefit to me getting a medical dx. It just isn't accessible, so that's not a thing I care about. I know I'm autistic and that's what's important.

Okay! Now for your question. Approaching any doctor or specialist to discuss chronic pain/illness is ALWAYS nerve-wracking. We unfortunately live in a world where most doctors think they are the know-all be-all of medical knowledge and as soon as you try to suggest your own findings or possible dx of what's going on, they just shut you down. Doctors are taught to 'fix' things. They are trained to deal with acute illnesses that they can slap a band-aid on and heal the patient.

When it comes to CHRONIC illnesses, they don't usually knwo what the fuck they're doing. So they tend to be dismissive because dismissing your symptoms/experiences, is easier than them simply admitting they don't have the answer: they don't know what's going on or what is causing your symptoms. The bar is so low it's on the fucking floor. All we want is to have doctors who actually LISTEN and who are open to discussion, but that isn't always the case. And I know seeking second opinions can be costly and inaccessible, depending on your situation. So what are we to do? My best advice for your appointment to discuss your pain: Be prepared!!

Start a daily journal that you can track your daily pain symptoms. Note anything that seems to make things better or worse. You can do this in a journal or use an app! I use Daylio for mood tracking and all of my symptoms. It's a great app!

Make a symptom tracked of all the things you have been experiencing. You can also do this in Daylio which is hella handy because it's fully customisable. And I can pull up my phone at appointments and immediately report 'Well after I started this medication I logged ten straight days of anxiety, so maybe we need to try something else'

Prepare a detailed medical history that you can print out and hand over as soon as you walk through the door. (This especially helps me because sometimes my autistic anxiety of talking to a new specialist makes me suddenly minimise everything in the moment. But having things pre-written helps so much!) [Here's a template I made]

Bring a support person!! Bring someone you trust, who knows everything you've been going through so they can help fill in blanks and they can take notes during the appointment. My partner takes notes for me because otherwise, I will instantly forget what the doctor said. I get so stressed about my appointments that I usually am half-dissociative during them, so having my partner there is SO helpful.

BRING SOME COMFORT ITEMS!! I do NOT go to any appointment without my favourite fidget AND a stuffed animal. Fuck what people think about it. It's the only way I can pay attention at appointments and I am unashamed to stimm in order to be functional.

The more prepared you are, the more serious doctors seem to take you. (Again, it should NOT be this hard but we're just trying to survive a medical system that does NOT want to help disabled people.)

Now, in terms of your autism:

This is entirely a personal choice. I am extremely lucky to have a GP who listens to me and is 100% supportive when I go 'Hey, I think all these symptoms could be x,y,z' I had already been seeing ehr for years when I realised I'm autistic, so when I realised it I was in the same dilemma you are in. Ultimately, I never had a sort of 'coming out' as autistic convo with her. I simply just started talking about it casually in regards to my treatment. 'Well, my autistic sensory needs would not be able to cope with that medication. Is there something else we could try?' Stuff like that. I also always have my medical bracelet on that states I'm autistic. And I'm always sporting my pronoun badges and at least one badge that clearly states I'm autistic. She has never asked about it, she just has just begun to take my autism into account as we discuss treatments. But for new doctors/specialists, I have a very clear disclaimer on my little medical document. It is highlighted at the top and it simply says: I am autistic, please be patient with me.

I will also tell doctors this up front and I try to name my needs throughout the appointment. Things like asking for them to email me a copy once they finish their full report of our appointment, or asking them to explain something further if I don't understand, or asking them for more information about treatments before I can make a decision.

I never declare 'Hey, I'm self-dx autistic and here's all the reasons why I believe this.' because that is NOT the important part. What's important is that I am able to voice what I need in terms of accessibility in regards to my autism.

If you're seeing a doctor for anything other than an actual autism assessment/treatment (like a psychdoc), then I don't see any reason why you need to over disclose things. You don't need to try and validate the fact you are autistic to a doctor who is simply trying to treat your chronic pain.

You are autistic. Full stop. You don't need to expend any extra emotional energy in order to convince other people of that fact. If you WANT to talk to your doctor about these things, then go for it. But if you're concern lies with 'what do I NEED to disclose' the answer is absolutely nothing you're uncomfortable with. I hope this helps and I really hope your appointment goes well. I hope your pain eases soon, my anon love. Please always remember that your feelings and needs are completely valid and you should never have to compromise your comfort levels for anyone. I love you. I am proud of you. I am here for you. x

[kirksfattitties]

asks you can smell the privilege and internalized ableism radiate from

(tw for ableism and other bigoted implications)

i’m bad at reading tone but even i understand that this is 100% you being condescending and trying to cover it up with smiley faces and false sincerity. and i don’t appreciate that.

before i get into deconstructing your shitty ableist argument, i want to explain the reasons i believe in self diagnosis (self-dx):

even professional diagnosis doesn’t start with a doctor diagnosing you. there has to be a reason for seeing the doctor. some people see a doctor in their adult life because they’re struggling, some people are taken by their parents, some people are referred or suggested that they see a specialist. whatever it is, you don’t just see a doctor and they magically give you a neurodivergency. people have neurodivergencies before they see doctors and even if they NEVER see a doctor.

the psychiatry system is flawed in MANY ways and to say that it isn’t means you’re denying the experiences of people with less privledge than yourself. also like psychiatry isn’t gonna suck your dick. you don’t have to be a bootlicker lol

in many places (hi hello i’m from america where our government tries to indirectly kill us by not providing us with adequate healthcare! i and many other people have many issues we can’t get fixed because simply our government cares more about the economy than us), seeing a psychiatrist or a therapist or going to a mental hospital or WHATEVER is INCREDIBLY expensive. and to assume that everyone has access and enough time/money/energy/transportation/whatever to do all of that is classist and elitist.

ANYTHING medical (including mental health) is biased towards white cis men. most studies are done on white cis men/boys. because of this, people who aren’t white cis men (or people who aren’t perceived as white cis men) are often not diagnosed. the system is racist. the system is sexist. the system is transphobic. people don’t know how to diagnose autism or adhd or personality disorders or other neurodivergencies or even mental illnesses in black people and other people of color, in women, in trans people, etc. and GOD FORBID someone be in multiple (or all) of those categories. saying “just go get diagnosed :)” is a privileged statement to make.

shocker! the psychiatry system is also ableist. if you’re already diasabled (whether it be mental or physical) and you see a doctor about ANOTHER disability? the doctor is most likely going to shoot you down. or at least be weary about someone having mutliple disabilities.

also most people who diagnose are neurotypical. they have never and will probably never experience neurodivergency so they can never fully understand it. they operate off of stereotypes of neurodivergent people and usually only stereotypical behavior of neurodivergent white cis men (which, as i mentioned before, is problematic for anyone who isn’t a white cis man). neurotypical diagnosers don’t know the neurodivergent culture and aren’t trained to recognize very common things (like masking for example).

a professional diagnosis can also be weaponized. not everyone can get a professional diagnosis because there are some neurodivergencies (such as autism and personality disorders) and mental illnesses (like depression) that can have legal and medical respercussions to have in your record. trans people can be denied medical and legal transition for being professionally diagnosed. people can lose custody battles for being professionally diagnosed. a professional diagnosis can be used as justification for taking away someone’s body autonomy (especially if that person is also physically disabled).

a LOT of neurodivergencies also have some type of symptom (or symptoms) that make it difficult to interact with people. troubles recognizing facial expressions, troubles understanding certain phrases and types of speech, paranoid about people, audio processing issues, being nonverbal in an environment that doesn’t accommodate for it, overstimulation, extreme social anxiety, discomfort in new situations, problems with eye contact, and a lot more. because like. for many nd people, interacting with people is very difficult and stressful. and hey. if you want to get a professional diagnosis? take a WILD guess what you have to do? FUCKING INTERACT with people! LIKE?? JEHDJJDKEKKDKDKDS. do you know how many professionally diagnosed nd people i know who made their appointment COMPLETELY on their own without help from a parent or family member or friend? LITERALLY ZERO! and i know A FEW nd people who have professional diagnoses! so if someone has social issues that prevent them from doing tasks like calling and making an appointment, showing up for an appointment, talking during the appointment, etc and ALSO doesn’t have familial or friend support (because newsflash! people who are friends/family of disabled people can still be ableist)? almost impossible to get a diagnosis! plus, the diagnosis process is TIME CONSUMING. not everyone can focus on a task for that long and not everyone can miss work/school for that long.

so those are the reasons i support self-dx. (although there’s probably more that i’m forgetting but i have adhd and it’s hard for me to remember things!)

so hopefully you now understand my reasons for believing in self-dx, and perhaps even you’re pro-self-dx now because before you were just uneducated on these issues and how they impact people who aren’t you.

but in case you’re still anti-self-dx and probably hate already-marginalized neurodivergent people, let’s talk about this horrendous ask (series of asks, actually) that i got sent. i feel like i can feel the self hatred and internalized ableism OOZING from this ask and into my inbox, so thanks for that i guess /s

“Sometimes people who self diagnose can take away from those who are actually nd, even sometimes from themselves.”

starting out strong with the ableism on this one by separating people into “self diagnosed” and “actually nd” people. self diagnosed people ARE actually nd

there’s not a limited number of nd resources. this isn’t a math equation of only x amount of people can be nd because there’s only y amount of resources. more people realizing they’re nd will actually MAKE more resources for nd people and will bring more awareness to being nd

even IF someone self diagnosed, and they go back on it later, what harm was done? they learned some coping mechanisms? they made some nd friends? neither of those are problematic and i think they’re both actually very helpful. i think nt people SHOULD learn more about nd people and stuff because i think that will lead to WAYYY less misunderstandings and WAYYYY less ableism

“There are many people who fake nds for attention,”

hey anon, what fucking world do you live in that nd’s are cool enough to fake having? because i would LOVE to live there. like, i literally had a post about my personality disorder (which i will not be specifying) i had to delete because people were sending my anons about how i was “scary” and “threatening” now that they knew i had the personality disorder i have. last year i left a discord server because the ableism i was recieving from not only the members of the server, but the mods as well. there are very few people i know irl who i tell about my personality disorder, but when i tell people about my adhd, they start treating me different. they infantalize me and make fun of me and use “jokes” about stereotypical adhd behaviors to alienate me and they even TELL OTHER PEOPLE without my permission. i was SEVERELY bullied throughout elementary and middle school for being nd. i have been refused job and educational opportunities as well as literal medical attention for being nd. people aren’t “faking” being nd, and if they were they probably wouldn’t be doing it for long because it’s not something that’s EASY to deal with.

kinda ironic that you’re saying people can’t diagnose themselves but that YOU can tell when someone is faking their diagnosis. that’s both hypocritical and a double standard.

masking exists. if you think someone isn’t “acting nd enough” they’re probably masking because they’ve been fucking bullied and harrassed. also you’re probably basing whatever you think nd is on stereotypes. not every nd person is sheldon cooper lol.

this is a side note but can we talk about how you’re literally just taking transmed rhetoric and molding it to fit nd people? like. you really come onto MY NONBINARY NEURODIVERGENT blog and expect me to validate your recycled “but what about the REAL [insert group] people?” ??? like grow up, elitist. you’re not better than anyone else just because you lick some boots 🥾 👅

“and claiming that self diagnosis (and this is just what I interpreted) is just as valid as professional diagnosis”

it is 😌

the only difference between self diagnosis and professional diagnosis is that a professional diagnosis can also get you medicine. not every neurodivergency needs meds and not every neurodivergency can be treated (at this time or even ever). for example, my pd (self diagnosed) doesn’t have a specific treatment but multiple symptoms of the pd (all professionally diagnosed) have specific treatments and medicines that work, so patients are given/diagnosed with/prescribed those instead. also, medicine doesn’t work for everyone! and sometimes people are allergic to or take medicines that will conflict with any new medicine.

“can really devalue the account of someone who actually has a disorder”

here we go again with that “self diagnosed” vs “actually nd” bullshit. literally just say you hate poor people n minorities and leave lol

someone having a different experience than you isn’t devaluing you, but if you’re the one who always has the spotlight maybe you should use your privledge uplift other marginalized people instead of feeling angry when everything isn’t all about you 100% of the time

“I have a second ask”

i don’t want it

“Plus it can be damaging for a person if they self diagnose wrong.”

how? what if they learn information that they wouldn’t’ve otherwise known like coping mechanisms that help them with their own neurodivergencies? that’s definitely not a bad thing

i think it’s funny that you bring up that people can self diagnose wrong and don’t even MENTION that doctors can diagnose wrong. like. you know. the people who GIVE OUT MEDICINE to people. i think it’s MUCH more dangerous when a PROFESSIONAL diagnosis is wrong. what are self-dx people with wrong diagnoses gonna do? read up on nd tips? maybe smoke some weed? drink some coffee? that’s about all they can do with a self-dx. but if a MEDICAL PROFESSIONAL gives you an INCORRECT diagnosis, they can ACTUALLY fuck you up.

“I was recently diagnosed with PTSD, a disorder which I would have never considered I’d have.”

that’s great about your professional diagnosis! i don’t know you but i’m glad you’re finding out about yourself and getting the help you want and/or need /srs

sorry if this sounds blunt, but honestly i’m not surprised you never considered you could have PTSD. based on your asks, you sound like you have a lot of internalized ableism you need to work through and a lot more research about neurodiversity you need to do. being anti-self diagnosis is a common belief among a lot of people with internalized ableism and a lot of these same people are the ones who have no issue with and even SUPPORT auti$m $peaks. many nd organizations that are run BY nd people (like asan) actually support self-dx.

“If I had of diagnosed my own symptoms and then started treating myself or taking precautions based on my self diagnosed "condition", it could of really hurt me.”

how? taking precautions to preserve your mental health is NEVER a bad idea. i’m not ptsd, but someone i care deeply about DOES have ptsd and has shared a lot of the precautions and coping mechanisms for ptsd with me and honestly they’ve been incredibly helpful. it’s almost as if different neurodivergencies and/or mental illnesses have overlap and that’s why there’s a whole community for us to be able to share these resources and information with each other!

the same person was rejected a formal autism diagnosis because of their ptsd, plus the fact that they’re transgender and the fact they have symptoms of adhd. it’s not really my place to talk about their experience with professional diagnosis, but i’ll send this post to them and allow them to add on their experience in a rb if they’re comfortable with that. but it’s almost as if their experience with the professional diagnosis process was unhelpful, harmful, ableist, and transphobic 🧐 and unfortunately this is a pretty common experience

“Also, by self diagnosing, I devalue the account of a person with the disorder l assumed I had.”

how? if someone thinks they’re nd, they have a legitimate reason for thinking so. either they have another neurodivergency than the one they thought they had, or they’re neurotypical and need to figure themself out and have a need for support. either way, they learned more about the specific neurodivergency, more about the nd community, and more about themself. i don’t see how that’s a bad thing.

if you think self-diagnosed people’s experiences inherently have less value, that is straight up ableism. especially considering that other marginalized identities and minorities have trouble getting professional diagnoses, you might also be bigoted in some other way. or at the very least, refusing to acknowledge your privilege.

“only one more I promise”

i don’t want it

“I understand that doctors are expensive and professionals can get it wrong,”

okay. if you understand this, then dm me your information so i can bill you for the cost of my professional diagnoses, the cost for my therapy sessions, the cost for my medicine, and the cost for transportation to and from all these places. PLUS the cost of the work and school i’ll be missing for these sessions. 🤲

“but self diagnosis can be really harmful to yourself or others.”

nah, you’re just ableist and a gatekeeper lol

“If you feel like you have a disorder, go see a psychiatrist, you may have it.”

[remembers when i went to a psychiatrist who diagnosed me with two major symptoms of a personality disorder and said i had other symptoms of the pd as well but refused to diagnose me with the actual personality disorder because i was a minor at the time and he told me “kids don’t have personalities so they can’t have personality disorders”. i understand being weary about diagnosing children with personality disorders because they aren’t fully developed but this dude straight up told me that i didn’t have a personality. this man literally only worked with children so that means he literally never diagnosed personality disorders. this man was literally just lazy and didn’t care about his patients. this man also refused to believe me when i told him the medicine he prescribed me made my symptoms worse and even made me hallucinate. he ignored me and refused to change my medicine so eventually i just changed psychiatrists and they put me on a new medicine that DIDNT make my symptoms worse and DIDNT make me hallucinate. also i looked it up after our session and apparently ONLY people with my pd and related ones experience hallucinations on that certain medication. it’s almost like his refusal to diagnose me and ignoring my symptoms/concerns harmed me. this man also constantly misgendered me and told me that homosexuality and transgenderism should’ve still been in the dsm. like golly, it’s almost as if being queer and neurodivergent in an extremely conservative state is harmful and dangerous. and that psychiatrists aren’t immune from being homophobic and transphobic and ableist.] but yes :) perhaps i should see another psychiatrist in this conservative state :)

“I don't want to undermine anyone's actual experiences, but it can be dangerous.”

then stop undermining people’s actual experiences :)

no ❤️

“If you feel like something's wrong, go see a professional.”

the whole point of the neurodiversity movement is that there IS no such thing as a “normal” brain, so saying that neurodivergent people have something “wrong” with them is ableist.

💰 🤲 hand it over

“I don't want to offend, I just don't want anyone to get mislead or hurt. :)”

you absolutely meant to offend. you literally said that self-diagnosed people’s experiences aren’t valid and have less value than people who have professional diagnoses

i know more people who have been (and personally have been) mislead and hurt by professionals than by simply existing as a self-diagnosed person

also i want to say that being pro-self dx is NOT being anti-professional/formal diagnosis. i think that people should absolutely get a professional diagnosis (if they are able to without negative repercussions)! being pro-self dx is more inclusive of marginalized people (like people of color, women, lgbtq+ people, people with multiple disabilities, etc). pro-self dx is simply just saying that professional diagnosis isn’t the only option

(neurotypical people and anti-self dx people don’t add anything; pro-self dx neurodivergent people are allowed to add with their experiences if they want)