#making him a bit more than just the one dimensional trope most stick with.
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But genuinely, how has no one done a full story about Ares trial for killing Halirrhothius? I've seen so many people talk about it and legit, even without any tweaking, it already sounds like it would be a pretty solid movie or book.
And even if someone wanted to "Hollywoodify* it", they really easily could do that too. Off the top of my head; either by having Ares just badly injure Halirrhothius instead of killing him and so he tries to get revenge or by having some other overly big bad using Ares' trial as a distraction to achieve whatever evil plot they could come up with.
I just really would love to read/watch this tale played out in full.
#Greek Mythology#Ares#Ares God of War#Ares Greek God#And with all the other medias doing such a poor job with his character#doing this story would be a nice way of actually fleshing him out a bit#making him a bit more than just the one dimensional trope most stick with.#* Hollywoodify is a word I use for#well#when Hollywood does what it does best#ruin things with over the top add ons:#Unnecessary explosions or super big bad dangerous villains that put all others to shame with their power#that kind of stuff Hollywood always shoves in to otherwise good ideas.
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♫FrUk :D
Thank you for the ask, I will send a few songs that remind me of fruk, a whole playlist if you may, not only one song. I also touch a few of triggering topics as I explain the nations's personalities and relationships with one another so I apologize in advance if I upset/trigger someone and will put my trigger here - Warning - mentions of abuse, alcoholism, s*exual trauma. Under the explanation there is a playlist of songs that make me think of Ukfr/Fruk, so if anyone gets upset you can feel free to skip my general headcanons about fruk/ukfr relationship dynamics. There are too many songs that make me think of different characters or ships but I collected the ones that make me think the most of them.
I know the original song is by Lady gaga but this version is too sweet and cheesy for me so I chose the rock cover by the group Halestorm since I prefer it, it sounds more genuine and rough and kinda makes me think of the dynamic that ukfr/fruk has, that some people present is as just the enemies to lovers trope or them just fighting which is.....simply unhealthy????? Fruk is much more than that and I wish people would stop seeing it as a two dimensional thing, yeah they do argue on a lot of things and it is not the healthiest dynamic however it does work in my mind because they stick through thin and thick and that requires effort and true love since a lot of people nowdays do not take time to know the other person, they just jump into marriage and have a few divorces and just argue over everything and then separate, fruk is an off and on thing where they break and make. This kind of dedication is hard to find in today's couples. I know they're fictional characters and no one really cares but I practice my psychology skills and my knowledge of people around me, and I sometimes see people with similar or almost the same characters as fictional characters, they may not have all of their hobbies but they do act the same way. And certain pairs, no offence, just make me want to gag my self due to history with bad and toxic fans but if I look at it subjectivly and never encountered mean fans from a certain ship, I would say that they ship simply doesn't work. No ship bashing but as far as I know, people with this kind of personality from this ship that I dislike, and get upset when seeing fan art of, simply just do not get along and had a hard time divorcing, it is not only unhealthy and unbalanced, it is downright abusive because both partners seek control and to have the upper hand and this is not...what romance is about???? It is about two people taking care of each other, understanding personal space and boundaries, lifting each other up and yeah, they will argue a lot, sometimes for small things, sometimes for bigger things, but generally the point of romantic relationships is not someone using you, or abusing you financially and generally being better or bigger than you. This breeds insecurity and jealousy in the other partner and makes them feel inadequate. Usually such problems are not talked over and one of the partners acts passive agressive which is what ultimaltly leads to said divorce. So yeah, people can go away with their (BUT IT IS CUTE, IT IS SO FUCKING CUTE) pairing because real life pairings and how humans communicate and develop friendships and relationships isn't based on what your mind conciders and doesn't concider cute and there are lots of factors on whether relationship will ever happen like common interests, type personality, etc and just block me so I will never hear from them and their childish mindset ever again, which is why I blocked certain tumbrl fan art hetalia accounts who produce art of a pairing I (dislike) lowkey hate, for historical reasons, for manga reasons, for toxic fans who bullied me and made me go on 3 hiatuses reason and ultimatly in real life experience and psychology and how humans and the human mind works and what is healthy and unhealthy reason. Why should I support something where certain people have been hateful towards me and these same people that act like these characters and I know in my life are on bad terms in real life? Why shouldn't I just move on to something more realistic and more healthy, that I have seen that works with humans I know first hand? I am not a clinical psychologist and I have no power or saying in this but I had to write thesis and read books by psycholgists and analyze them in high school and my first year of Uni, in order to pass the year and I have also read reccomended books by a psychologist I went to because I wanted an advice on how to deal with my anxiety and talking to people, because my condition is extremely severe but I honestly feel stuck and try to improve but also feel confused, I sometimes feel like I am not doing enough to
self improve as a human. I sometimes come off as too cold or overly bitter and angry without intending to, and it sucks.
Francis is a really manipulative person and Matthew picked up that from him while part of Alfred's agression doesn't only come from confidence in his own abilities but the fact that England him self is an overly agressive person and is very dominant or at least used to be for a very long time, now he is more mild to keep his gentleman persona but he does suffer from severe anger issues which he hides while Alfred is prone to breaking things and screaming, Arthur is more prone to being rude, sarcastic and generally mean before he loses it. Matthew and Francis do not engage in fight if they can avoid it which is why sometimes people call them cowardly I think? And Matthew is a bit prone to being a codependent people pleaser as far as I see and he seems to have severe anxiety issues. Francis albeit charismatic and beautiful, is deep down in his core lonely.
I think that part of his pervertedness, shocking people with his s*xual humour and all of this sex obsession comes from trauma in his childhood and dressing like a girl. I wouldn't explain what the trauma in question was since it is not canon but I do headcanon that he had s*xual trauma and it is partly why Hungary dressed like a guy. I don't know if this is legit, it is bias from reading too much japanese fan comics relating to hetalia or just general history of humans and how they treated consent and what is moral today, wasn't amoral or against the law a few centuries ago, but I have seen artists touch on it. I think both Arthur and Francis suffer from neglect and they weren't particularly good fathers, in fact no country is, the whole FACE family is dysfunctional and while I love all of them, I kinda pity them. I think Rome was a bit discriminatory mostly towards France and never towards his other children while Arthur had to constantly prove him self and was bullied by his brothers. While other nations have suffered from trauma too (I headcanon that Prussia was burnt on stake and people threw rocks at him due to his albinism and being left handed) something similar happened to Arthur, who I headcanon that he was burnt for being a witch and Francis went a few times through the guillotine, or Arthur still having a bullet scar on his arm from the American revolution or Francis having nightmares from that day where Jeanne was burnt and waking up in his own sweat. Arthur also must suffer from workholism and alcoholism, judging by how much he works and goes to pubs to drink. Everyone chooses their own poison and how to cope with life and many use unhealthy coping mechanisms, hell, even I used unhealthy coping mechanisms a lot in the past and I am not proud of them, in fact, I try to improve.
I can talk about their history and how it relates to their mental health and what scars they have for hours but I would bore you. You came for a song and I am probably boring you so I apologize for writting a lot of words, in advance. I basically think that fruk/ukfr is the ultimate ship for many reasons because they click, I do ship spuk/engita/asakiku and many other things but fruk/ukfr is kinda like butter and bread, it is a great combination. I never said it is 100 percent healthy, however their relationship makes psychological sense and their personalities click. I know people like to present arthur as this dumb tsundere man that blushes and says baka, or he is this garbage rat dad that no one likes or francis is presented or at least used to be this perverted sex machine that touched other countries inappropriatly or at least the 2012-2015 fans saw him this way and while he still has the reputation of a pervert, what many young people in the fandom see as disgusting, I just see as an overly lonely man that just happens to have high libido and copes with it by having casual sex and just has a sex humour, the same way some people have fart jokes humour or darker, more cursed humour, I am really glad that fans mostly left off this whole - Francis is a r**ist and will grope you, in the past, because honestly r**e is not joke and as a character he clearly understands consent and boundaries and I don't think someone like him would do such a thing. Also Greece and Turkey have even higher libido than him and sleep around more, yet he is the ''pervert'', I don't get it??????????? but fruk is just so much more than opposites attract, they have a lot in common so I can't say they're full opposites, no one is truly. I have heard people ask why does anyone ship fruk when it is just opposites attract/enemies to lovers trope and I am honestly confused, because that is extremely rough generalization to say the least, it is like saying - All men/women are the same, it is simply wrong/uncorrect. I think they ''married'' five times - The Treaty of Paris (1657) formed an alliance against Spain. The Anglo-French Alliance (1716–31) formed another alliance against Spain. The Anglo-French blockade of the Río de la Plata (1845-1850). The Anglo-French joint invasion of Qing Dynasty (1856–1860). And the last one which is their official marriage The Entente Cordiale (1904) fought together in both World Wars. As far as I remember Francis tried to marry Arthur but he refused and why he refused is up for subjective opinion but I must write a whole thesis on why Fruk/ukfr works so well and people are not here for that, they're here for the music and I will provide. I also always saw Francis as the more gentle and more submissive partner, I just love to see him drawn in frilly beautiful dresses with bows and stuff and Arthur as the more dominant, I mean as a country he was a powerhouse during the 1600s-1800s and used to be a punkrocker, usually rockers are mentally tough and that man is extremely cunning and witty so...people drawing him as this useless baka uwu overly feminine anorexic boy that looks more like a tween rather than a 23 year old guy just assasinated his character in my opinion and it disturbs me but I am just some awkward human on the internet and no one values my opinion anyway because this is the internet and many people nowdays love to have hot takes and try to gain followers through clickbait stuff which sometimes goes out of control and everything just seems more fake and shallow to me, the more old I get.Okay that was my silly rant no one asked about but I feel really passionate about hetalia and Fruk/Ukfr. Anyway, I apologize again for my long rant and going all over the place, please enjoy this playlist
PLAYLIST WITH SONGS THAT REMIND ME OF FRUK/UKFR
1 - Halestorm - Bad romance - rock cover https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ll4NJs3NBIU
2 - Queen - Somebody to love - lyrics https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zj69iA_goIk
3 - ABBA - Voulez vous - (I know everyone chooses Waterloo and while waterloo is a fruk theme, I think Voulez vous works too) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwcgMVXuBJc
4 - London beat - I've been thinking about you - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixBryyQSrD8
5 - Santana - Smooth - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Whgn_iE5uc
6 - George Michael - Careless whisper - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izGwDsrQ1eQ
7 - Robbie Williams - Feel - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iy4mXZN1Zzk
8 - Michael Buble - Feeling good - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Edwsf-8F3sI
9 - Edith Piaf - La vie en rose - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFzViYkZAz4
10 - Chopin - Marriage d'amour (Spring waltz) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFJ7kDva7JE
11 - Vanessa Carlton - A thousand miles - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERw2LuU6Jj8
#fruk#ukfr#hetalia fruk#playlist#reminds me of fruk#hetalia axis powers#hetalia world stars#trigger#trigger warning#mentions of abuse#rant#vent#fiore rosewood vents#axis powers hetalia#hetalia headcanons#personal headcanon#fiore rosewood headcanons#hetalia world twinkle#aph hetalia#hetalia 2021#hws#aph#personal problems#psychology#fans#social anxiety#A lot of thoughts#head not empty#overthinking#ranting
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i think being a ww fan means recognizing the inherent flaws in its story and characters. for every amazing character moment, theres the fact that the show has a lot of misogyny, both from its male characters and how its female characters are written and treated (ex. the whole laurie and sam arc. some of the stuff that josh says to donna). for every istotg moment, theres the fact that charlie was literally written in bc the show was considered too white (and for most of its run, was). for all the awesome political moments, for all the show presented bipartisanship, and had republicans that were sympathetic, three-dimensional characters, theres the fact of ainsleys entire introduction to the show. it has issues, real issues, and highlighting its high highs should also come with acknowledging its low lows.
Absolutely! I couldn’t have said it any better (but pls watch as i proceed to make your point bc i feel like i should respond).
For any of yall saying the moments i talk about don’t rlly matter, please notice that even if it didn’t bother you, it might have bothered other ppl/enforced steroetypes/etc.
For example, there’s one super misogynistic line that josh says that still sticks with me? as a woman, i think most times the show was sexist/anytime anybody was sexist i tend to notice in a way men probably don’t, the same way white ppl don’t notice when everybody in a room is white. it’s just something you notice. but anyway, there’s that one thing with the economy/china-us trade relationship or something in season 5 or 6 and they talk about bras, which is this whole comedic moment. but i remember donna telling josh this, and then josh going “do the Chinese even need bras?”
and i’m not Chinese, i’m desi and i don’t know what it’s like be Chinese and i’m sure there are cultural beauty standards i’m not aware of, obviously. but hearing that line made me so uncomfortable. ig it was supposed to be funny, and donna sort of reprimands him, but it made me so uncomfortable! and there are so many moments like that on the show.
there are maybe 3 recurring black characters (charlie, fitz, nancy mcnally) and that’s it. there’s angela blake, but she wasn’t there for you to like her bc she was “replacing” josh after that whole carrick business. your point about charlie being the point of diversity saddens me. i saw one asian person on the show, cathy, for like two episodes. that’s all.
and also, sam, despite being my favorite, says some sexist things! i’m gonna talk about sam because he is my favorite, but moments of casual sexism are true of just about every character on the show. the bit about “leggy blonde republicans not knowing anything”, he condescends connie tate (i thought that was kinda funny but it was in poor taste bc connie--despite not seeing much of her--was incredibly intelligent and sam speaking down to her did rub me wrong), the bit about “baton twirling” when he talks to ainsley (tho she gives a great quip back and abt five minutes later he calls her intelligent), that borderline savior mentality with laurie (i (not being a sex worker, someone pls let me know if that was more problematic than the way i saw it) would’ve been fine with that whole storyline if they just kept her on so we could see laurie put sam in his place some more. bc i liked that they said that sex work was real work and that she liked what she did and didn’t fall to some trope about being abused as a child/crazy/etc but then they straight up never mentioned her again. she was smart and she could put him into his place and i liked her enough that i wish we saw their friendship). also he hears from this one weather person/air force person, and when he sees her he goes “you look exactly how you sound on the phone” and yuck
all the same, i like sam! he was idealistic and incredibly smart and i loved all his little impromptu speeches and he had great chemistry with everybody. i was so sad when he left the show and so excited when he came back (even for like two scenes). but i know he’s problematic. knowing he’s problematic and liking him as a character can happen at the same time.
also cj and relationships is weird on this show. that whole episode where she goes back to visit her ailing father there’s this weird romance with that one guy and it’s so weird. also bill? that we never see? the ranger or whatever? i like that cj had emotions (to be strong does not equal emotionless, i appreciated her appreciation for a pretty dress/shoes/jewelry bc that’s something i wish i knew when i was younger) but that was ridiculous. when she gets promoted to chief of staff, this was a great moment to mention sexism in the workplace/the sad rarity of women in power and i honestly don’t think they did, at least not meaningfully enough that i remember it.
also there’s this whole ridicule of the michigan’s women’s caucus? not important at all, but it’s a sad how they talk down to an organization that isn’t there for mockery just because it’s full of women. it’s a legitimate thing, and because it’s full of women they constantly talk down about it.
i don’t know, but as i type this, i keep noticing more casual sexism and racism on the show. but that doesn’t mean i don’t love the show anyway. government can be optimistic (it’s not right now, but it can be) and it brought me out of a funk and i love it so, but like you said, it has its high highs and its low lows and we, as viewers, should acknowledge this.
#the west wing#josh lyman#donna moss#ainsley hayes#sam seaborn#jed bartlet#leo mcgarry#cj cregg#tw sexism#tw racism#toby ziegler#ask
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this discussion about jaime and consent makes me worried about the jb bang scene (if we ever get one lol.) like, what if it's written the grrm way? what if one of them forces it and the other is like "no no" but then they're enthusiastically saying "yes yes"? I hate GRRM.
Before I respond to this I want to firmly establish that I’m speaking from what I believe to be GRRM’s perspective and his intent based on pattern recognition in the text. I’m stepping into his shoes and explaining it from the writer’s side. My opinions about the style itself aren't relevant and aren't included.
K. Moving on.
He doesn’t write all sex scenes like that, and he already established that Jaime isn’t one-dimensional when it comes to sex. We have a hint that points to how he’d treat her during their first sex scene:
“If you bed her, though, be kind to her.”
“Kind, my lord? How … how would I …?”
“Sweet words. Gentle touches. You don’t want to wed her, but so long as you’re abed treat her as you would your bride.” - ADWD
If later on in his relationship with Brienne he tries that type of play and she doesn’t like it, he’d get that it isn’t her thing.
“There’s no harm in him bedding her, I suppose, so long as she’s willing.” -AFFC
Jaime isn’t going to be pushing for sex with Brienne… He wouldn’t assume it’s her kink… And yes, GRRM writes it as a sex play kink. Jaime and Cersei engaged in it, because that was what they liked together. It played into their intoxicating forbidden love narrative. The trope has an element of feeling power through being sexually irresistible to the men they want to bed. “You just had to have me” is a turn on. “No we’ll get caught” is a turn on. “No, no” -guides his hand to touch her- -hits chest with feeble fists- -weakly protests- “hurry yes do me now yes yes” It’s written as a game of Hard to Get that the lover is clued in on. It could be debated whether that kind of sex play is problematic or not, but for the narrative it’s written as sex play, not rape or dubious consent for either character.
If we ever see that dynamic with Jaime and Brienne, the intent would be consenting sex play. A kink. And if it isn’t her thing, either GRRM just… won’t write it, or he’ll have Brienne strongly get the message across that it isn’t her type of play, he’ll get the hint, he’ll learn what works for her and what doesn’t, and... that’ll end that.
When enabling pattern recognition though, we see the no/yes more applied to forbidden love couples when the forbidden aspects are heavy on the woman. Ex:
Asha and Qarl ([x])
Taena and her secret lover
Jaime and Cersei (they have it forbidden on three accounts: Kingsguard, twins, and Cersei is married. But most of the Exciting Forbidden Scare factor was placed on Cersei, because she’s the Queen and it’s way more socially unacceptable for women to engage in affairs)
(I’m not listing Dany and Drogo because he asked her and she said yes and there was no Faux Resistance, so it’s a bit different. And I probably missed other examples that weren’t forbidden love, but my point is that he tends to go heavy on the trope more for those who do fit into that category)
The type of forbidden love I’m referring to ties into an element of literal danger. That’s... not Brienne, and that isn’t the Jaime and Brienne dynamic.
I’m convinced by the time Jaime and Brienne bone, they’ll either be married or he’ll be removed from the Kingsguard. There wouldn’t be a forbidden situation for them at any point in their relationship, so going off pattern recognition, if GRRM were to write that sex play dynamic with Jaime and Brienne, to the extent he did with those listed above, it would be Forbidden Love.
But that won’t happen for several reasons:
1. To be forbidden, Jaime would have to still be in the Kingsguard when they bone. The genders would be reversed in their situation, so Brienne would be the one pushing while he’s still in the Kingsguard to get the, “no no I can’t,” considering where he currently is in his character development with sticking to vows. And I mean… do I really have to explain how ooc that would be for the Maid of Tarth?)
2. Jon/Ygritte and Sam/Gilly are technically forbidden love dynamics as well since Jon and Sam made oaths. But it’s more socially acceptable for sworn men to take a woman, so there isn’t the No We Can’t We’ll Be Caught excitement there as there is for a woman. The sex play dynamic is a bit different… There's a very small protest with Sam, saying “we can’t,” but that stems from his actual dilemma with making oaths and isn’t sex play. Jaime already had been sleeping with a woman throughout his years as a member of the Kingsguard, and it’s not unusual or looked down upon for Kingsguard men to sleep with women. Again, the Exciting Scare factor isn’t the same, so GRRM won’t use it the same way. If he were to write a scene between Jaime and Brienne after they’ve already boned many times, it would probably be structured more like Sam’s. With one person saying, “not now” or “I can’t,” because they’re busy or whatever reason. The other kisses them, and it’s consenting from then on. It’s not really a form of sex play.
3. Most of the JC Forbidden thrill wasn’t because he was breaking Kingsguard oaths, but because they were twins and it was an affair and in their eyes they were meant to be together but were kept apart. That’s not Jaime and Brienne. At all. Jaime will be experiencing an entirely different kind of love with different sex dynamics with a very different woman who will have different kinks and who he’ll have different sex play with. That would be intentional. It’s not saying one type is better than the other, but Brienne is literally written to be the opposite of Cersei, so I’m assuming the author will write contrasting sex scene(s).
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I think your perception of canon vs fanon Tim is really interesting, and I think your right about a lot of things, but one of the things I've always loved most about Tim was his character arc, especially through his ongoing (and into RR). Like, I think your spot-on that Tim-as-Robin's strengths were his thoughtfulness and empathy and observant nature, but I think one aspect of his character was his gradual degradation into someone a lot colder and more calculating (1/2)
(2/3, oops) and I don't think that just comes from fanon characterization. Like here we have a character who is so monumentally compassionate and loving, and whose loved ones pretty much all die, so I don't think the transition in personality comes (just) from fandom, but also writers responding to this sort of trauma for the character. And Tim, in-universe, I think decides that the best way to keep the people around him safe is by sacrificing some of that kindness and becoming a little darker(3/4) in order to save his loved ones (e.g Bruce, Tam, Steph). And I do think that that change in character also pivots the catalyst for its drama. Like where before he was just a normal kid who stepped up because he felt he needed to, parents in tact, regular life, etc, later Tim is full-on traumatized vigilante. So where the drama before was found in Tim negotiating being a normal teen with being Robin, it became a negotiation between his good nature and the darkness he felt he needed to (4/4) embody. Or even the darker person he felt himself becoming. I think one of my favorite Tim moments is in RR where he's beaten Ra's for the first time doing his tortured genius hacker thing, but Ra's attacks, and Tim realizes that he can only beat him by trusting his friends and family, rather than any of the cold brilliance he's developed. And he reads that Ra's is thinking of him as just another broody Bruce, and Tim tells him "I'm not Batman, I have friends," and wins with their help.
You’re right! And I actually love that aspect of his character arc too. I think Tim’s inner conflict with the more cold/calculating part of himself is also pretty central to his character, it obviously got a lot more focus in the RR series, but even before everyone Tim knew died he struggled with his ‘inner darkness’. Like when the Titans get sent to the future and Tim finds out he grew up to be his own worst nightmare, or any of the tons of conversations he has where he clarifies that Being Like Batman is 100% what he’s trying to avoid.
I probably should’ve clarified, my issue isn’t with the “tortured” part of the tortured genius trope, (emotional conflict is great and something the entire batfam has oodles of) it’s more the “genius” bit.
tim is smart! obviously, he’s smart. but pushing that aspect of his character until he’s a child-prodigy-genius boy who can hack anything if you give him a laptop and a stick of gum gets sort of... i can’t think of the word rn, um. Like he basically stops being a believably real person? For me, anyway.
like i said my favourite tim is Regular Kid Trying His Best. that doesn’t mean he can’t go through dark shit or be a darker character, just that his goals and motivations and problem solving ideas come from creative places that I as a reader can trace the logic of.
the example you brought up is actually really good for this! tim is able to subvert ra’s (and the reader’s) expectations, because tim is an empathetic person who has a knack for reading people, and he knew ra’s (and the reader) was under the impression that tim was fully entrenched in being a solo act, not trusting anyone, being Like Batman. and then theres the banger ass line “im not batman i have friends” like WHAT??? HELL YEAH! WHAT!
and that’s the kind of shit any person could do, if they were observant and careful and just this side of thrill-seeking. it’s unexpected but it still Makes Sense.
when tim is able to solve all his problems with the push of a button or a late night and a computer, he’s just not a believable character anymore, he’s a plot device to get the mystery from point A to point B.
so yeah its more the fact that pushing his whole ‘genius’ thing ends up flattening his character for me. so when he’s valedictorian or proclaimed the ‘computer guy’ or whatever it rings a little hollow.
also i am a little bit tired of the ‘sleep deprived coffee addict’ thing, for similar reasons in that it renders him one-dimensional.
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Updated K-drama list (3)
4 more shows DONE and there’s been some changes to the rankings...
FAVOURITES
1. Crash Landing on You
He’s from North Korea. She’s from South Korea. They never should have met, but they’ll change each other’s lives.
This was my first K-drama, and its still my favourite. The full cast of characters is great, the lead romance is ANGSTALICIOUS and its genuinely, laugh out loud funny (when its not making you cry or swoon).
Male lead: Officially the best boyfriend ever. With added dimples.
Tear-jerk factor: 4/5
2. Healer
The lives, and pasts, of a hot shot reporter, a spunky young tabloid journalist and a mysterious thief-for-hire intersect.
This was so addictive - the plot was tight and engaging, and this is one of the few shows I’ve watched where there didn’t seem to be a lot of filler. I loved the central 3 characters, and the romance was amazing. I especially loved that the male lead started off such a brooding loner, but he became super-affectionate as soon as he admitted his feelings. So many good hugs and lots of face-cradling in this one.
Male lead: Effortlessly beats up 2 henchmen while comforting his girl over the phone. What more do you need?
Tear-jerk factor: 1/5
3. Itaewon Class
A young man’s life is forever altered when he runs afoul of a powerful family.
This felt like a big step up in quality from everything else in this list, in terms of the production, soundtrack (which was brilliant), the lack of annoying sound effects, and just the overall ‘real world’ feel of the show. All of the characters were fleshed out and 3-dimensional, and they all had their ‘moment’ to shine. The story itself was gripping and so well done - some of the twists and reveals had me gasping! And what can I say about the 2 leads? I love them, both separately, and together. He is so wise beyond his years, and his journey will break your heart and inspire you. She is borderline sociopathic, but I adore her.
Male lead: Tenacious, principled, kind, innocent, caring, driven, loyal…and he can cook!
Tear-jerk factor: 2/5
4. Descendants of the Sun
A special forces Captain meets a capable and beautiful trauma surgeon. They feel an instant bond, but their jobs and philosophy on life get in the way, threatening to tear them apart.
Halfway through this show, I seriously thought this might overtake CLOY as my No. 1 fav. I absolutely LOVE the male lead character, and the romance was beautiful…but it didn’t quite nail the angst and the last minute was a bit twee which dropped it down the rankings a bit.
Male lead: A cocky, charming, absolute BADASS with the most adorable, cheeky smile.
Tear-jerk factor: 2/5
5. My Holo Love
A lonely woman falls for a holographic AI and then meets his creator...
I love the concept of this show (I’m a big sci-fi nerd), and it was beautifully shot. The lead relationship is well developed and it doesnt fall into a typical love triangle. I’ve come to realise it utilises a lot of K-drama tropes (face-blindness! shared childhood trauma!), but it does it really well, imho.
Male lead: Tortured loner genius. My catnip.
Tear-jerk factor: 2/5
6. Goblin
A 900yr old immortal guardian finally meets the ‘bride’ who will end his existence
Once I got over the slight ick-factor of the age difference between the two characters at the beginning, I really fell for this show and it’s world. It had me in tears. And I especially loved the secondary character of the Grim Reaper.
Male lead: Surprising innocent and funny for a 900 year old
Tear-Jerk factor: 5/5
7. What’s Wrong with Secretary Kim
An personal assistant decides to quits her job in order to get a life. Her boss has other ideas.
I loved the female lead in this - I’m a sucker for uber-competent people, and the actress is STUNNING. Her boss is self-centred, entitled and vain...but over time, somehow that just becomes endearing! This show also has lots of very good kissing scenes...and when he started to unbutton her shirt during one encounter, I was SCANDALISED (did I mention these shows are usually very PG!!)
Male lead: Like I said, somehow makes vanity and narcissism endearing. Also not afraid to get his shirt off and flash his 6-pack. Bonus.
Tear-Jerk factor: 0/5
8. Legend of the Blue Sea
A mermaid comes onto land to find the man she loves
The (literal) fish-out-of-water scenes in the first half of this show were hilarious - the actress is a comic genius! The romance was nicely done, and there wasn’t a lot of extraneous plot or too many characters. I couldn’t stop watching this one!
Male lead: Cocky, arrogant conman with a soft mushy centre
Tear-Jerk factor: 1/5
9. Fight for my Way
Two life-long friends decide to go after their dreams
I found this during my Park Seo Joon binge and, even though I fast-forwarded large chunks of it (I wasn’t interested in the secondary couple at all), it still made my favourite list because I love the leads - both as separate characters and as a couple. This is one of the best friends-to-lovers stories I’ve seen, mainly because you truly buy that these 2 have known each other their entire lives (their bickering and teasing feels so natural). And then when they take the next step, they’re so affectionate and refreshingly open with their feelings.
Male lead: I love his contradictions. He’s goofy and childish…but can really turn on the sexy charm; he’s a badass MMA fighter…who loves when his girlfriend sticks up for him and protects him.
Tear-jerk factor: 0.5/5
10. Suspicious Partner
A young, hardworking lawyer has her life turned upside down when she is put on trial for murder.
This has been officially bumped up to my favourites list - partly because I’m now a massive Ji Chang Wook fan, and partly because I’ve rewatched scenes with better subtitiles and it made everything10x better. Its still overly long, but the serial killer plot had some nice twists and it was central to the story, so it didn’t feel extraneous like some of these types of plots do. I really enjoyed the central romance - the 2 characters sparked off each other well and I loved their evolution from sort-of enemies to lovers.
Male lead: Its Ji Chang Wook! He’s so good at playing serious guys who are secretly big dorks
Tear-jerk factor: 0.5/5
Notable mentions
These are shows which I completed and enjoyed but they didn’t set my world on fire. Usually because they were overly long, or the plot got in the way of the characters/love story.
1. The K2
An ex-mercenary takes a job as a bodyguard protecting the illegitimate daughter of a politician. A sort-of Snow White retelling.
This started off really well, with some amazing fight sequences (hello, shower room scene!). However, the back half became too bogged down in double crosses and manipulations, and it focussed too much on the politicians. The writers did well to give these characters some layers, but they were all essentially doing bad things for the wrong reasons, and I just didn’t care about them. The show was much better when it was following K2’s journey. The romance also started off well, but was a bit underdeveloped (mainly because they barely interacted).
2. I Am Not a Robot
A man who is allergic to human contact finds companionship with a robot…or does he?
I honestly thought I wouldn’t make it passed a couple of episodes of this - the concept was just too ridiculous. But I’m glad I perservered, because it developed some real depth and some proper good angst towards the end.
3. My Love from the Star
Alien stranded on earth meets an actress soon before he’s due to be rescued.
I finally gave this another chance, and I’m glad I did. The female lead got a LOT less irritating, and I enjoyed the present-day romance and all the flashes back to the past. However, the ending was really abrupt and disappointing (which kept it out of my favourite list). There should have been 1 less filler episode in the middle, and a decent, fleshed out finale instead.
4. Her Private Life
A talented art curator tries to keep her professional persona separate from her fangirl obsession with a pop idol.
This was cute and I loved the central relationship - he was so supportive of her, and their interactions were refreshingly mature and their banter felt really natural. Ultimately, it was a bit forgettable (I’m not dying to rewatch any of it), and the last minute tacked-on childhood trauma subplot was really unnecessary.
5. Strong Girl Bong-Soon
A woman with inherited super-strength gets a job as a bodyguard for an eccentric young CEO
The lead couple in this are AD-OR-ABLE and I loved their relationship. But there was a weird tone issue in this show. The romance is super cute...but there’s a whole dark sub plot involving multiple women being held captive by a psychopath. I ended up fast forwarding most of that, and just concentrated on the romance.
6. Touch Your Heart
Star actress rocked by scandal works at a law firm to prepare for her comeback role
This starred the secondary couple from Goblin and I really like them, even though they are playing very different characters in this (more opposites attract, than doomed lovers). At first I found this too ‘cutesy’, but I’ve since realised the sound effects/graphics are a K-drama thing and not unique to this show, so I’m not as down on it as I was. I still had to fast forward a lot of the secondary romances which I wasn’t invested in.
The others…
1. Hyde, Jekyll and Me
A woman becomes involved in the lives of 2 men, who share one body
This stars Hyun Bin from CLOY and he is sooo watchable, especially as the slick-haired, glasses-wearing, uptight Seo-Jin. And the show started well...but quickly went off the rails into a convoluted, dragged-out revenge plot.
2. Melting Me Softly
Two people are accidentally cryogenically frozen for 20 years. They have to navigate the modern world and their new lives together.
Another good concept, but it ultimately descended into little more than a light work-place romance. Had a couple of good kissing scenes, but it was overall a bit forgettable.
And the DNF:
My Secret Romance
I started watching this because I was looking for something a little less PG - the characters have a one night stand in the first episode! But I couldn’t get passed the bad acting and cheap production.
Master’s Sun
I liked the premise but the 2 leads weren’t very attractive (at least in comparison to the insanely beautiful actors/actresses in the shows listed above). Call me superficial, but I couldn’t see myself spending 17 hours watching them and willing them to kiss.
#kdrama#cloy#healer#descendants of the sun#itaewon class#suspicious partner#legend of the blue sea#fight for my way#what's wrong with secretary kim#melting me softly#hyde jekyll me#touch your heart#her private life#strong girl bong soon#i am not a rob#my love from the star
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Thd Haunting anthology for the ask game! :)
Thank you, my friend!! Sorry I took so long, lol.
Top 5 favourite characters:
This is hard.
1. Theo Crain
2. Dani Clayton
3. Hannah Grose
4. Luke Crain
5. Viola Willoughby
Other characters you like:
It would be a lot easier to just name the characters I don’t like. These characters are so well-written and have so much depth. So if I don’t mention them in the next question, assume I like them.
Least favourite characters:
Peter fuckin’ Quint, Joey (Luke’s “friend” from rehab,) and Henry Wingrave.
Otps:
This show has more of my OTPs than any other. Hannah x Owen, Jamie x Dani, and Nell x Arthur.
Notps:
Luke x Joey, Perdita x Arthur (Viola’s husband,) Becca x Peter
Favourite friendships:
Theo and Shirley, Luke and Steve, and Hannah and Jamie.
Favourite family:
The Crains own my heart, obviously, but what I loved best about BM over HH is that found family dynamic the main group develops.
Favourite episodes:
Touch, The Bent-Neck Lady, Two Storms (!!!!!!!!!! this episode oh my god,) Screaming Meemies, Silence Lay Steadily, The Way It Came, The Altar of the Dead, The Romance of Certain Old Clothes, and The Beast in the Jungle.
Favourite season/book/movie:
I always say this: THOHH is a masterpiece, and THOBM is a really, really exceptionally good show. I do prefer HH, but only by a tiny bit.
Favourite quotes:
“You have loved me, so I will always be here [in your heart.]” - Owen to Hannah. I’ve heard a thousand variations on this theme, but for some reason, the delivery and context of this line broke me. I always cry.
“You loved me completely. And I loved you the same. The rest is confetti.” - Nellie to her siblings. Rip me wide open!!
Best musical moment:
I really like the score of this show, but no one song or moment sticks out.
Moment that made you fangirl/boy the hardest:
When it really disappointed you:
It never did. I think these two shows are some of the best television ever created.
Saddest moment:
Picking a top five (in no particular order,) since these are inherently sad and tragic shows...
1. Rebecca’s forced suicide at Peter’s hand.
2. Nellie’s death and realization that she is the Bent-Neck Lady.
3. Luke’s reaction to Nellie’s death - how he could literally feel it.
4. Jamie going to the lake and seeing Dani’s body and begging her to take her, too.
5. Dani having sleep paralysis and being unable to help Arthur when he has an aneurism.
Most well done character death:
I mean, they’re all really good and well-done. Appropriately heart-wrenching, shocking, and they all work in context of the plot. If I had to choose just one, it would probably be Nellie’s, since it’s the basis of the entire first season. The hints about the Bent-Neck Lady and the way we slowly get to know Nellie, and then come to love her the most right as she’s finally about to die - ugh, so good, so sad.
Favourite guest star:
Kate Siegel as Viola Willoughby.
Favourite cast member:
Victoria Pedretti is a goddamn delight. She’s an incredible actress - so raw and real and compelling. She’s a stoner IRL and seems super chill during interviews. I would love to share a joint with her someday. (If I ever share a joint with anyone ever again, thanks coronavirus.)
Character you wish was still alive:
Rebecca Jessel really deserved better, man. :( Fuck Peter Quint.
One thing you hope really happens:
Well, the series is officially on a semi-permanent hiatus. Mike Flannagan said he has no plans for future seasons in this universe. He is currently finishing up work on another horror show, Midnight Mass, so I’m looking forward to that. I would love to see more from this universe and this cast, though.
Most shocking twist:
The Bent-Neck Lady, for sure. So well foreshadowed, and still so shocking when the realization hits. My stomach dropped through the soles of my feet.
When did you start watching/reading?:
I caught this bandwagon pretty early - only a week or two after the first season premiered. I remember watching and realizing they had synced up the show’s timeline with real life - if you watched in 2018, Nellie dies that same year, and her date of death was just a week or two after the premiere. An extra little detail that made me very sad.
Best animal/creature:
There are no good animals in this show, lol. Fuck those kittens.
Favourite location:
Bly Manor is soooo pretty.
Trope you wish they would stop using:
I really hate anything with animals suffering in horror, so I just hope that never comes up again.
One thing this show/book/film does better than others:
Everything.
...
Okay, okay. The plotlines are very clever and super well-done.
Funniest moments:
Dani sleeping in the back of Owen’s car with her mouth wide open; Theo’s “I’m gonna get my fucking PHD;” like, most of what Theo said in general.
Couple you would like to see:
All I can say is that Hannah and Owen deserved Paris.
Actor/Actress you want to join the cast:
Meh. No opinion.
Favourite outfit:
I really loved the 80s and 90s looks in Bly. Dani’s jean jacket. Jamie’s looks when she and Dani are together later in life. All A+.
Favourite item:
Moonflowers.
Do you own anything related to this show/book/film?:
Nah.
What house/team/group/friendship group/family/race etc would you be in?:
I gotta go with the found family at Bly. Jamie, Dani, Hannah, Owen, the kids. They clearly had a lot of fun together, and I’m a sucker for found family.
Most boring plotline:
I gotta go with Henry Wingrave’s doppelganger. It didn’t really do much for me, and I think the episode that centers on him, while showing important exposition, was one of the weakest in the anthology.
Most laughably bad moment:
I can’t think of one.
Best flashback/flashfoward if any:
The entirety of “The Romance of Certain Old Clothes”
Most layered character:
I would argue Olivia Crain. She starts out as a creative, kind, loving mother, and is slowly unraveled by the house - but that core of goodness is still inside her, and still motivates everything she does.
Most one dimensional character:
I think this show does a great job of making all of its characters complex and interesting. I wish we had learned more about Joey, but I think she’s meant to be unsympathetic on some level. But at the end of the day, she’s kind of just Luke’s addict almost-girlfriend, and a pretty weak character among much better ones.
Scariest moment:
Ooooh, that’s tough. I think for me, it’s when Steve sees Nellie’s ghost. It’s not a super spooky episode, up to that moment. But that close-up shot of Nellie’s graying, dead face, her eyes all fucked up, her mouth gaping open unnaturally wide - and the sound she makes. Woof. Ugh. Aaaaah. It’s a lot.
Grossest moment:
The kittens. Enough said.
Best looking male:
Best looking female:
Who you’re crushing on (if any):
I’ll always be a little in love with Kate Siegel.
Favourite cast moment:
I’ve never really looked for cast content.
Favourite transportation:
Theo’s Jeep.
Most beautiful scene (scenery/shot wise):
I just think Bly is so pretty. Most of the overhead or scenery shots of it are really nice.
Unanswered question/continuity issue/plot error that bugs you:
There aren’t any. Anyone who tells you otherwise misunderstood something.
Best promo:
I intentionally avoided promo to avoid spoilers.
At what point did you fall in love with this show/book:
The end of the very first episode of Hill House!
I’m not doing anymore of these ‘cause I’m bad at answering them!!
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That was a wonderful answer. Sulik is a companion from a tribe to the south. He has his grandfather's bone pierced through his septum that lets him see spirits. He also talks in a heavy Jamaican accent. Its a lot. I had wanted to make a Native character that was related to both Sulik and Hakunin and have her have some of their abilities but as I was reading up on native representation from your post, I was worried that she would absolutely fall into that trope and thats not something I would want to put out anywhere. The part about them drawing the power from the land is what confused me cause I was wondering if there was certain criteria that fit that trope or if any Native with magical or psychic abilities was grounds for being that trope. Also you are absolutely right now that you mention it, Hakunin is a total medicine man trope. Its very disheartening.
I think Fallout is actually a difficult framework for this sort of thing, just because they've shoved Native groups under the term "tribal" and homogenized their practices as "not civilized". It would likely involve significant restructuring to incorporate something like this, as death and communicating with the dead are treated differently depending on the culture. Oh, here's an article that digs into the Magical Native trope a bit more (mind you, the language is outdated).
I'll preface this next part with the fact that I'm a white Native and should by no means be considered the final word on this subject. However, if Sulik has a Jamaican accent and presumably Jamaican ancestry, then he may fall a bit closer to the Magical Negro trope. It is possible to be more than one trope at one time, particularly if he is Native and Black.
Most of the issue with Native people having psychic powers depends on exactly how they're acquired. If they're psychic because they're spiritual and have close ties with Mother Earth and dress in traditional clothing or regalia and are the only person doing so (sticking out in the civilized world), implicitly considered to be a little backwards, there's your Magical Native. But if they were to have a sci-fi implant the likes of which Elon Musk has dreams about that gave them those abilities, and they wear their regalia at a powwow where they dance, then it's a Native person that happens to be psychic. The difference between the two is in the former, culture is part of the "otherness" but in the latter, culture is part of the person in a three dimensional portrayal.
I'm not penalizing you for wanting to make that character, because it would be fun to work with those abilities in storytelling, it's just the perception of those abilities in the Fallout universe is stereotypical. Maybe sci-fi implant isn't best example, but it worked to illustrate my point, it's not the only way to acquire these abilities.
Tying those abilities in with the land is very vague within the trope context because it varies heavily depending on which tribe's spirituality is being boiled down to "magic" and how they're portraying it. The spiritual woodsman in the PNW who lives by himself in a cabin, isolated from town, and talks of the trees as people is going to look different than the desert guide warning of spirits prowling during the night and giving you a token of protection.
I do hope this clears things up a bit, but feel free to send another ask if things are still confusing. It's a lot of information to sort through.
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What type of characterisation do u like for fics? I do find that fic from back in the day is mostly 1 dimensional but I was curious what ur issues w it where?
I’m sorry it’s taken me so long to answer this but I’m gonna be real my opinions on stuff like this have led to me being labeled toxic to the point where people have literally implied they want me and people who share similar opinions with me to leave the fandom, so I’ve been kind of hesitant to answer something like this bashing some recent characterization again. So if you’re one of those people I’m sorry and you should probably stop reading now.
opinions under the cut with some lawlight characterization stuff I don’t like + some stuff I do like:
Honestly? I try and read at least the first chapter or so of every new lawlight fic in the tag and recently it’s been impossible for me to enjoy a lot of it because when I read it it just doesn’t feel like L and Light to me at all? Like it feels like someone at some point wrote a big fic with strong characterization and interesting characters, except they weren’t much like L and Light and they acted in ways L and Light wouldn’t act. And a lot of fics now are based off that same characterization, which in turn inspires fics with that characterization, rinse and repeat. And that’s just not enjoyable to me when I’m looking to read lawlight fanfiction.
Obviously old lawlight fanfiction wasn’t all 100% perfect and there were a lot of doozies in that mix too but it felt like there were more really solid multichapter fics that might have been messy and toxic in ways but they made sense with the canon characters. And fics that did have a happy ending and some fluff thrown in were still written using circumstances that could be believable, even if it took a long time or a slow burn to get there.
To answer your question more specifically, here’s some common tropes that feel out of character to me (and I’m not calling out any specific author or saying fics that do any of these things are poorly written because they’re not and we have a lot of talented and dedicated people here):
Either one of them changing their principles and switching sides within the first 20k words and without a LOT of persuading. IMO “we’re two sides of the same coin and not that different despite both being hugely stubborn” is shit I love, “actually I’ve sided with you secretly the whole time/your magical dick has cured me of disagreeing with you/I’m willing to sacrifice the principles I literally died for in canon easily because I want to be with you” is shit I don’t love.
“We suddenly agree and work super well together as partners now that we’re in an AU and there’s no death note” doesn’t feel authentic to me because death note or no death note their entire outlook on the world is different. Light would think L’s methods are disgusting. L would think Light’s initial idealism is naive. Light believes mankind is inherently good and once you get rid of the bad that can shine, L…doesn’t seem to share that. That’s not to say they can never work together but the good shit is when it’s a long journey into understanding each other and where they’re coming from and slowly making compromises and falling in love.
L being a naive uwu tries his best baby who’s being taken advantage of by Light. Light being a misguided uwu baby who tries his best and is being taken advantage of the whole time by L. They’re more complex than that and they’re both bad people but they also both have good sides so any sort of simplification of the characters into one being a villain and one being a victim is uninteresting to me.
They shouldn’t work but somehow despite everything they do, because they’re alone and because despite disagreeing and being enemies by circumstance and by beliefs, they know without the other they’d never really be challenged or fulfilled. That’s neat. I like that. It’s messy. They’re drawn to each other even as they’re disgusted with each other.
It’s more interesting when they are their own conflict rather than the conflict solely coming from outside sources.
The 500000 fics where Light is a rebellious and progressive omega who actually secretly wants to be protected by L and feels grateful that they’ve found each other? don’t love that. I dislike omega fics in general even if there’s a couple I’ve thought were pretty alright so that doesn’t help either. It is kind of interesting that despite their differences this could be an in-universe reason to force them together. It just seems like omegafic is the lawlight default right now. Like even fics where the plot doesn’t revolve around omegaverse stuff is sometimes omegaverse and that’s ? hard for me to wrap my brain around? that’s not just a lawlight problem though that seems to be happening in a lot of fandoms
Similarly to point one, either of them being okay with losing like lol what.
yotsuba can be difficult to tackle because there’s so much going on there with the characters, but there’s so many interesting layers to explore and dive into that sometimes get ignored in favor of fluffy hijinks and that’s boring to me. from Light’s perspective L took everything from him and has made his life pretty miserable because of this whole Kira thing and catching the real Kira is the only real thing that could totally clear Light’s name and L just sort of….gives up, for a lot of it. mopes about and acts unmotivated and uninterested because Light isn’t Kira. that’s probably very frustrating for light! and fun wacky fluff or hijinks can happen, but I love when it happens in the “we got so distracted being the smartest people in the room we forgot we’re supposed to be enemies” way because that’s juicy to me
sometimes it’s the little things, too, that bother me. stuff that’ll happen and it’ll completely pull me out of the story. like L Lawliet made Naomi Misora destroy her whole damn computer after he slid into her DMs and you really think there’s any way in hell he’d have any sort of google home or siri or alexa? or casual social media, even under fake names? facebook knows everything. or light saying something or making a joke that i could never in a million years see him saying in canon because the author thought it would be funny or cute.
anytime Light is suddenly some kind of beacon of goodness champion of justice just because he didn’t find the death note. the death note didn’t make him a completely different person, he’s bitter and jaded and thinks some people would be better off dead even before getting the death note. self righteous yeah totally but actually righteous? nah man
or Light just being a fucking awful person who kidnaps and r*pes L because he lusts after him but it’s okay because somehow in the end they end up together ? i’ve seen that trope a few times and i know it existed in 2007 too i just avoided it like the plague then also.
I see a lot of AUs that are less “what would L and Light legitimately do if this was the situation or universe they were placed in” and more “i want to write this situation happening like this and i want to make it lawlight because that’s my main ship”
like, the characters that are being written are fine but if you want to write OCs right OCs. I know all of this seems really harsh which is why I put a warning about it at the beginning, and of course I know some of these problems were also prevalent between 2013-2017 and there’s tropes here that have been happening like this since the dawn of lawlight fanfiction, but since it’s happening now and now is when i’m frustrated by it now is what i’m complaining about, it could be the reason i go back to older fanfiction so much is because i had lower standards back then and it was easier for me to wade through the ones i hated to get to ones i liked and now it’s easy for me to find those again. who knows. Also I agree most fanfiction from 2007-2009 were pretty 1 dimensional.
And like, fuck me I guess but I actually like the canon characters and I joined the fandom to experience more of them and apparently that makes other people feel unsafe.
I’m not saying people aren’t allowed to express opinions that are different than me or that I Know Better Than Everyone Else or that I don’t like people posting their own headcanons or ideas or things they wish were different about the series, it’s just not my cup of tea and it’s a little frustrating that fanon is mostly all I get in fics now and that people are allowed to express opinions but only if those opinions are “people who stick too close to canon are elitist and should die and are sticks in the mud and need to leave the fandom to stop ruining things for everyone else” because like, we’re people too?
Anyway sorry this veered in a bit of a different direction and I hope I don’t lose followers over this because it’s sad to see people go but I’ve been blogging here for over 5 years and I’m not going to stop anytime soon. I also wrote most of this while having bad anxiety at like 3am last night so it’s all over the place and i’m probably going to think of like eight things in the shower later I forgot to mention because i’ve been thinking over this ask for like two weeks now.
#this is a LOT and i'm sorry#please don't all hate me for this#i promise i'm not trying to ruin anyone's fun i'm just bored of what's out there right now#and there ARE some good works too that i have enjoyed a#it's just.#hhhhh#death note#discourse
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Gotta be honest: I dislike that "OC Struggles in the RPC" post that occasionally hits my dash.
This one, right here.
In short, because it comes off very, "If you won't RP with my OC you're an elitist dick" even though I'm certain that wasn't the OP's intent.
But, as someone who has been writing the same Harry Potter OC (this one, right here) since 2001 and has played dozens of OCs in MMO settings, D&D, etc...starting from about 1988 on through now, let me just address the post point by point.
1. "That soul crushing feeling when you see 'no OCs' in someone's rules."
That's a you problem.
Nobody is obliged to write with you.
Perhaps that person has had numerous poor experiences with OC players in the past and just wants to avoid it happening entirely.
Perhaps they find it difficult to find ways to interact with OCs.
Perhaps they simply don't care for OCs when there are dozens of canon characters, including characters that are so minor that they might as well be a skeleton outline of a character.
None of those are invalid reasons and none of those are personal insults toward your OC or your writing; grow up and move on.
2. "Constantly having to dumb down your canon"
Look, if you're finding multiple people over multiple fandoms are telling you that your OC is too overpowered--just to cram it all into one word--you do need to stop and consider if they may be right and, if they are, if you care enough to change it.
There have been times I've looked at criticism I've had on Calleo and decided, "Yeah, they're right, that is a bit much" and other times when I've decided that yes, they are correct, but I don't care because I'm having fun as are the people I write with, and times where I've just plain disagreed.
It's also possible that your OC just isn't a good fit for whatever person is telling you that, and that's nobody's fault; not everybody likes the same things.
3. "Adjusting to adapted canons"
Literally nobody is forcing you to do this.
Everyone makes concessions now and again so things mesh with the group, that's part of what roleplaying is: A group activity.
If you feel as though you shouldn't have to adjust to someone else's adapted canon the problem is on your end and you're clearly not a good fit for the other player so maybe look elsewhere.
4. "The amount of your own canon and lore you have to sacrifice to do that."
Again, nobody is forcing you to do so.
This comes up a lot with people whose OCs are related to major canon characters and some of it is a big reason why it's generally recommended to not try and write those outside of established games.
In established games, the other players know this aspect of your character and, since you're part of the game, have implicitly agreed to go along with it.
For independent blogs, it does take longer to find regular RP partners because by having a backstory like that, it can feel like you're trying to force your, let's call it, adapted canon, onto canon and not everyone is going be on board with that idea or, at the very least, are implying that anyone who writes with you has to go along with it.
Again, that is not their fault and it doesn't mean you can't write an OC like that but you do need to be aware that if you choose to have something like that in your character's background, it's going to make it more difficult to find regular canon RP partners and that fact is entirely your fault, not the people who RP canon characters.
Same applies for those times when your OC has multiple rare abilities; the abilities might be canon but, sticking with Harry Potter as it's the main fandom I play in, if your character is a genius at everything, has the Standard Abusive Upbringing, is a metamorphamagus, is an animagus (usually unregistered and mastered by age 12 or so), is part-something-not-human, is a "transfer student to Hogwarts", is a major canon character's until now unknown sibling/cousin/best childhood friend, can cast all sorts of difficult magic before they even hit school because they're just that smart, is an orphan, and can sass Voldemort to his face without consequences--people aren't really going to want to write with you for several reasons.
- It looks like you haven't fleshed the character out well and are just throwing a pot of tropes at the wall to see what sticks.
- Writing with characters like that always feels like a dick measuring contest and if you dare try to hint that the OC might not be better at or just as good at something as a canon character, the most typical response is for the OC's player to get mad and tell you you're being elitist or bullying them.
5. "When you mention wanting to write a canon, people that have never shown any real interest in your OC jump out of the woodwork to encourage you to do it."
Yeah, there's no polite way to say this: If this is what happens to you, it generally means your OC is poorly thought out and can only hit one note (i.e. YOU only show interest in writing certain things; angst, shippy threads, etc...but never want to branch out to anything else) in your writing. That gets boring after awhile.
In short, your OC is probably a little boring and a little two dimensional and the reason your friends are encouraging you to write a canon is because they don't want to tell you that and know that a canon will be more interesting on virtue of you not having to make up all the source material the way you have to do with an OC.
6. "When you do it, that canon gets more attention than your OC ever did."
See #5. Your OC was probably a kinda dull one trick pony and your friends were trying to be nice about it.
7. "The alternative of that: When your first character was canon and you transition to writing an OC, people suddenly disappear."
See #5. Your OC was probably a kinda dull one trick pony in comparison to the canon character you were writing, and your friends were trying to be nice about it.
8. "Fandom OCs that outgrow their fandoms and muns tha tfeel they have nowhere to put them."
That's lack of creativity on your part, not an "OC struggle".
This character of mine has had fragments of his personalty spawn off into roughly thirty or so different characters across multiple fandoms. On occasion, I've directly ported him into another fandom, just changing the Harry Potter specific things into things that fit the new fandom.
9. "Endlessly worrying if your character is too sue-ish, even after x-amount of years."
Stop caring.
Seriously, stop caring.
Caring about that usually ends up making you kind of less than fun to write with on an OOC level and on an IC level most people take it too far in the other extreme and end up with a character that's about as engaging as wet cardboard.
Not to mention, no matter what you do, there are always going to be people who will think your OC is "too sue-ish" no matter what, simply because they're an OC.
Focus more on people who are interested in your OC and not on the people who don't like your OC (and block them if you have to). You'll have a lot less stress and a lot more fun that way.
If you can't stop caring due to anxiety, get to a therapist and get on meds or--stop roleplaying until you get your house in order. If you get that stressed over roleplaying, it's not worth your mental health to continue; just go write fanfic.
10-13. All the stuff about female OCs being held to higher standards than male OCs.
This, unfortunately, is true. It's extra true if you're a female OC that gets into any sort of relationship, platonic or otherwise, with a canon character.
It's a pretty across all fandoms thing too, and it's definitely unfair.
I know 100% that if Calleo were a female OC, he would not have even a fraction of the interactions and threads that I have with him; people would think he's bitchy, stuck up, and annoying as all hell--and he is, but he's a guy, so it somehow funny and endearing I guess.
I think he’s often bitchy, stuck up, and annoying as all hell and I’ve been writing him for close to 20 years now.
He'd also probably be written off as some kind of slut because I've always written him as being in open relationships and often having multiple open relationships going at one time.
14. "People assuming simple, stupid things"
Yeah, that's not OC specific. Not even close. It's good form to always read someone's about and rules page, even if it's a canon character, because nobody plays even canon characters exactly the same.
15. "Feeling like you have to jump through hoops to keep up with everyone else and keep your character fresh and interesting so people don't lose interest."
Again, this is not an OC specific thing. Canon, unless a series is ongoing, is pretty finite, and anyone writing any character has to keep their character fresh and interesting and not just write variants of the same thing over and over or people will get bored of them as well.
A pretty good litmus test here is to look at it and see if it's just one or two people who lost interest or if it was a whole lot of them.
If it was just one or two people, that sucks, but it happens. We've all been dropped at some point.
If it's a LOT of people, it's time to take a close look at your OC and what you're writing to make sure you haven't just turned into--well, the literary equivalent of wet cardboard.
16. "Canon blogs that shit on OCs--you realize you were OCs too right? What would the original writer of your canon think?"
Well, if it's Anne Rice, she'll probably think to send a cease & desist.
That joke aside, be glad they do; it's a big red flag to avoid them as they're likely overall unpleasant people even if their writing is good. It also saves you from wasting your time trying to interact/write with them.
Remember that part about not focusing on the people who aren't interested in writing with you? Go read it again.
17. "No seriously, it can be so discouraging writing an OC. How many ideas are you killing by snubbing OCs? The future of creative media is in our hands."
Miss me with this emotionally manipulative bullshit.
Nobody is obliged to write with you and nobody is obliged to like your OC.
If a canon blog rejecting your OC is enough to kill your ideas, that's your problem, not the canon blog writer's problem.
If you can't find someone to RP your ideas with you and you really like those ideas, I'd suggest writing fanfic.
If you really want to RP those ideas, you'll either have to keep looking until you find someone who also wants to RP those ideas, or you'll have to be willing to do some compromising to make those ideas work in a way that other players will find interesting.
If your OC always has to be center stage and the best at everything, or you only want to write ship threads, or you only want to do angst, or your OC is always being injured, nearly killed, in emotional distress, etc...all the damn time, that gets boring for everyone else really quickly.
That's a you problem, not an other writers problem.
18. "Has someone stolen my canon?"
Look, if the stuff further up on this list is an issue for you, I guarantee you nobody has stolen your canon.
In general, nobody will steal your canon; there are not infinite numbers of ideas and tropes are very common both in canon canon and for OCs.
Unless someone straight up lifted everything about your character and just changed the name and whatever face claim you're using, there's about a 0 % chance they stole your ideas.
19. "Is my canon too similar to someone else's?"
See the bit in #18 about common tropes; given that, probably.
The bigger question is does it bother you enough to rework your OC? If it doesn't, stop caring.
If it does, get to work reworking your OC.
20. "Do they think I stole their canon?"
Have they said something? Do you have overlapping RP circles? No? Then they probably don't know you exist, let alone think you've stolen from them.
21. "And what do you do when somebody does steal your canon? It can be so hard to prove and it's so easy for it to be dismissed."
If it's hard to prove, it's too generic to have been stolen unless they just did a direct copy paste.
22. "Having your OC written off because of the face claim choice - that face is constantly typecast, nobody takes it seriously, they've been overplayed and ruined."
The only people I've had, 7 years of Tumblr RP, give two fucks about face claims are:
- Control freak admins of organized games that usually fall apart within 6 months due to drama typically caused by the control freak admins. I actually had one game have the admins get angry at me because I wouldn't stop doing cosplay for Calleo's pictures and just pick a celebrity.
Bullet dodged there.
- People who are also just generally unpleasant OOC; if a face claim alone is enough to make someone not want to RP with you (and it's not a case where the person whose face it actually is has been clear about them being uncomfortable with people using their pictures in that manner), that's a red flag that that person, if you somehow still want to write with them after seeing that, will likely be incredibly, bizarrely dramatic in all the wrong ways.
Sure, some of them are fine and they just have a hard time picturing an OC who also looks uncannily like Taylor Swift, but people who have things in their rules about refusing to write with people who use certain icons should be taken as either a red flag or a, "Well, I dodged a bullet here."
Also, in case nobody has told you this: Icons are not necessary for RP. They often add absolutely nothing to the post or thread that isn’t just as easily accomplished by using words. There’s nothing wrong with using icons but, you know, run far, far away from people who require that you use them.
Maybe instead of getting into the mindset that nobody wants to write with your OC because they’re an OC, take a look at your OC, ask people to give you honest and constructive feedback about the character (even if they tell you things you might not want to hear), consider working on your OOC personality as the victim mentality or using emotional manipulation about ~*~*how hard~*~* it is to write an OC to try and guilt people into writing with you is incredibly off putting on every level.
The more someone whines and complains about how nobody wants to write with them, honestly, the less interested I become in writing with them.
You also have to put some effort in, and that includes answering submitted memes or people who write you starters (or like an open starter call from you); if you fail to do that more often than not (and no, ‘low/no muse’ is not an excuse when you use it all the time, especially when you clearly have muse and are responding to whatever Themed Thing--usually angst or shipping--you get but ignore anything else or take ages to reply to anything else), the people sending those things in will assume you’re just not interested in writing with them and will stop trying.
And, bottom line?
If even you can’t sell your OC as being interesting and write off lack of interest from others as Unfairness Toward OCs, why should anyone else be interested?
If you have an OC that’s legitimately interesting, engaging, and not based around generally disliked tropes (across fandoms those are usually related to a canon character, multiple rare abilities, the OC being able to somehow always ignore or overtly go against social norms and suffer exactly zero consequences--or worse--be adored and admired for it by everyone, and Not From Around Here, in that order), and aren’t unpleasant OOC, people will want to write with you.
If you don’t, well, that’s your problem, and no amount of posting about how hard OCs have it will make people interested.
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ADOW Hogwarts House Sorting! I think Matthew is a Gryffindor and Diana a Ravenclaw, but what's your thoughts?
Darling anon: thank you for this very thought-provoking ask! I’m sorry that it took such a while for me to answer it - and that my answer ultimately got so long that I had to stick it beneath a cut.I’ve been ping-ponging back and forth on different possibilities for Matthew and Diana’s Houses for a while now, which leads me to my first conclusion: if nothing else, I feel quite sure that the Sortings for both of these two would have resulted in a wicked case of Hatstall.But even the most profound cases of deadlock have to be resolved in a House Sorting one way or the other. And so: a slightly-rambling essay on Diana and Matthew’s character evolution, and personality tropes in two different magical universes below the cut…
First of all, I know we’re just using the Houses as a personality metric, but given that ADOW is a magical universe, I find it amusing to consider situations in which Matthew and Diana might actually have encountered the Sorting Hat as a magical artifact. The interesting thing to me is that both of them (for most of their lives) would have avoided it like the plague.
Diana, anxiously: You say that putting this hat on is a necessary first step to beginning my formal magical education? *instinctively Timewalks fifteen minutes into the future to avoid the whole thing*Matthew, coolly: As a 1500 year old French-born vampire, I could not possibly belong anywhere in a school for British witches.But let’s pretend they’re encountering the Sorting Hat early in their lives, as an expected ritual. Here, I think you’re right about Diana - she ends up in Ravenclaw, mostly due to her own negotiating with the Hat. I’m reminded of Harry’s silent plea - not Slytherin! - except for Diana, communing with the Sorting Hat, I think it would be not Gryffindor! It’s the Hat’s job to sort through someone’s potential, and I refuse to believe all of Diana’s very-present mettle would go unnoticed. But as a young girl, still reeling from the deaths of her parents, I think Diana would hear all of the bravery-bravery-bravery stuff associated with Gryffindor and think oh God, anything but that, please. Far better to end up with housemates who will understand the comfort of escaping into a good book, and the very real pleasures of research, rather than pushing her to do all kinds of extroverted joiner activities.
It’s really difficult to think about an analogue for this stage with Matthew. Eleven-year-old human Matthew - we know he liked tools and was bright and inquisitive, so maybe a Ravenclaw? But if we somehow reverse-engineer an eleven-year-old version of Matthew de Clairmont, son of Ysabeau, stepson of Phillippe, brother of Baldwin and Louisa -I mean, really. The de Clairmonts are a Slytherin family through and through. All jokes about blood purity aside (and look, who would have more invested in the question of blood purity than a bunch of vampires?), cunning and ambition is endemic there. There’s always been a de Clairmont on the Congregation? Mmm-hmm mmm-hmm.
But that’s just the family, you say. What about Matthew himself? Those Slytherin qualities are absolutely part of his character, especially in the earliest episodes. We see ruthless, calculating Matthew figuring out how to get Diana to share what she knows about Ashmole 782; we also see this side of him in action as he outmanuevers Baldwin by calling upon his fealty and obedience as a member of the Brotherhood. (Also, you don’t get a CV like Matthew’s without having a marked degree of professional ambition. Just saying.)
Slytherins have a rep for being the villains, and obviously I’m trying to push the characterization here past that one-dimensional stereotype. But we have ample testimony from the vampires who’ve known Matthew for hundreds of years - he CAN be “the bad guy,” whether you want to define that as at least two dead human women, or the selfishness that Baldwin describes and that Miriam and Marcus acknowledge, or even the whole pureblood thing. Think of the absolute certainty in Juliette’s voice as she tells Domenico, “Matthew hates witches.”So yeah, I think a young (or “young”) Matthew gets sorted into Slytherin. There’s definitely also a possible case for young!Matthew as a surprise Gryffindor - and oh BOY does that give me a whole bunch of Sirius Black feels - but mostly I could see him as a Slytherin, albeit an Andromeda Black-style Slytherin.
This is not necessarily the case for an older, wiser, sadder Matthew, however.
Don’t ask me how a c19 Matthew ends up with the Sorting Hat on his head (a very strange diversion during a hunting trip to Scotland?), but I think that there’d be a really good case for a Ravenclaw Sorting during the more “mature” part of Matthew’s life, before he meets Diana. The quest for knowledge is a fundamental part of his character, and it’s a really powerful part of what draws him and Diana together.
@burberrycanary and I have talked about this in detail, but the truly delightful part of this relationship is, well, the bits of it that AREN’T really magical or “fated.” I’m very here for the genuine attraction between these two individuals who are both curious, in their own ways, about the hows and whys of what we might call “the human condition,” inappropriate as that phrase might be here. It’s what Diana learns about Matthew’s long-standing research on creature origins - her belief in Matthew’s purity of motive - that sways her into telling him what she can remember about Ashmole 782.
(Well, fine. “Purity of motive” might not be the best way to describe everything going on in this GIF.)
(All creator credit to you, B.)
But okay, then. Ultimately, I would argue Matthew and Diana bring each other’s Gryffindor tendencies into full flower. To some degree, this is a function of narrative: they’re our protagonist characters, and we’re geared to see them as the heroes. And of course, the events that surround the discovery and disappearance of Ashmole 782 lend themselves to Gryffindor-esque displays of bravery and heroism.
But it’s more than just this Doylist explanation, I think - there’s a strong Watsonian explanation for Matthew and Diana both to be sorted as Gryffindor! Gryffindors are known for being brave and daring - occasionally to the point of recklessness (acting without thinking first). Nor are Gryffindors strangers to self-sacrifice, especially on matters of principle. And oh my goodness, feeling ALL THE THINGS and acting on them in grand ways is VERY, VERY much both Matthew and Diana, as we come to know them during the first season!Diana is a professional scholar, which makes us think “cerebral, methodical, disciplined” and makes us want to sort her as Ravenclaw. But so many of her decisions throughout this first season are impulsive and emotional! I say this not as criticism of Diana, but to argue that, no matter what her training is, her deepest impulses are Gryffindor in nature. Even before the most dramatic events of the season start, we see Diana reacting with stubborn bravery. She has zero problem telling Knox and Satu to bugger off with increasing firmness - the literal force of that “get out of my head!” moment feels very Gryffindor to me.
And of course, she’s not really intimidated by Matthew, either in his glacial professor mode or when that mask slips at the end of the first episode. In fact, he brings out a confrontational bluntness in her - “You’re a vampire”/“You’re following me”/“Is that a threat?”/“What are you going to do, rip my head off to find the truth?” - that is very, VERY Gryffindor. Once everything really kicks into gear, we see Diana following her emotional impulses nearly all the time. Feeling unsafe with witches? Seek out a vampire! Hell, let him drive you out of town, and spend the day with him. Invite him to dinner - as a starter. When the people who have been bothering you push your emotional buttons (the photographs), immediately seek them out to call them on it, and make a firm decision to try to end the conflict. Then, once they threaten your friend, unleash a torrent of magical power on them.
Diana only gets more Gryffindor from there, whether it’s her stubborn declaration that “they don’t get to choose who I love,” to taking everything that Ysabeau throws at her without flinching, to the brave romantic impetuousness that is the Hasty Vampire Elopement, to the climactic scene in which she nearly sacrifices herself to save Matthew, making an open-ended promise to the Fates.
Diana is a very very powerful, brave witch, and her magic is tied to her emotion. Better be GRYFFINDOR!Now, what about Matthew? In these first few episodes, I still gravitate towards that Slytherin classification. That exchange between them in the boathouse, where she asks if he’s going to rip her head off and he answers, “That’s not how I operate” - Slytherin, my dears, very very Slytherin. And yet. Matthew, is that true?He finds that self-disclosure is the most effective way to convince Diana to be his ally re: the Ashmole manuscript - and then he leans into it real hard.
And in this context, that’s a real act of bravery! For instance, after Gillian breaks into the lab, we learn that its existence has been a secret for a very long time - but Matthew brings Diana there only the fifth or sixth time they meet, and he spills the beans on the entire project, taking her at her word that she doesn’t subscribe to Knox’s supremacist, genocidal ideology. Emotional; brave; impetuous!As I’ve discussed elsewhere, that project of self-disclosure only accelerates, resulting in a romance that Matthew, at least, knows is going to be extremely problematic. He does attempt to deny the emotional attachment, to some degree - but it’s a small degree. Going back to Oxford against Hamish’s advice; accepting her dinner invitation; coming ‘round to her rooms the next day after rejecting her; eventually coming back to France from Oxford - please picture Matthew de Clairmont tossing his hair a la Mimi and saying “Self-control? I don’t know her.“
In one sense, this is Slytherin selfishness, but it’s also Gryffindor emotional decision-making - and bravery in the face of the dire consequences that are certain to follow. The peak Gryffindor Oxford moment for Matthew is, of course, the moment that he dashes into the Bodleian to confront (and calm) Diana as she’s in full tornado mode. There’s nothing shrewd, or cunning, or cerebral in those moments - it’s Matthew operating on pure instinct, and it’s brave, daring, and chivalrous.
I noted that Diana’s Gryffindor nature intensifies the longer that she and Matthew are around each other. The same is true for Matthew around Diana, despite the conflict engendered by the approach-avoidance paradigm before their Hasty Vampire Elopement. BTW, you notice that we never ACTUALLY get any kind of verbalized explanation for what changes his mind and makes him return to France, commit to Diana, and defy the wrath of the Congregation? Doylist explanation screams GENRE, but the Watsonian (and, I guess, based on this ask, the Rowling-esque) paradigm says: DARING GRYFFINDOR EMOTIONAL DECISION-MAKING. (Or, as @burberrycanary might put it: Soft Vampire Caring.)
Anyway, I can’t GIF things with any measure of skill, but LORD, do I need me a gifset that juxtaposes Matthew’s icy-cold "that’s not how I operate” in 1.01 with the short scene in 1.06 in which he and Baldwin come to blows within ten seconds of Matthew entering the room. Asking someone a question and then slugging them before they can answer? Has there ever been any purer form of Gryffindor nonsense?
Seriously, Ysabeau gives me EXTREMELY strong Narcissa Malfoy vibes, but her thousand-yard stare anytime that Baldwin and Matthew start mixing it up makes me think that she and Molly Weasley would have a few things to talk about as well. Ysabeau de Clairmont has been dealing with this sibling rivalry shit for fifteen hundred years, and she is OVER IT.
I’ve been (gently! gently! with love) dragging Matthew and Gryffindors here for the past few paragraphs, so I should obviously also reiterate: that heroic Gryffindor chivalrousness, in conjunction with the conventions of the genre, helps to explain so many of the things that make him work as a protagonist character. Bravery in defense of the people he loves and the principles that he has adopted? We see that time and again with how he acts, not only in protection and support of Diana, but in his care for Marcus and Miriam and Hamish and the whole complement of people who end up under the roof of my beloved Bishop house. For Matthew, this chivalry and bravery is to some degree culturally “baked in” (the man was literally a knight), but it’s clearly also a major set of personality traits.
Like Diana, there’s a lot of emotional control overlaid onto Matthew’s character, quite a deep vein of natural cunning, and an underlying hunger for knowledge that helps to explain their intellectual attraction. But when it comes down to it - he’s got those Big Damn Hero instincts, just like Diana. So again, for my money - that’s one more for GRYFFINDOR!
#adow#adow meta#a discovery of witches#diana bishop#matthew clairmont#bishmont#matthew x diana#sorting hat#asked and answered#i show my love through gentle mockery and extensive analysis#yes i am a ravenclaw why do you ask?#village-skeptic: back on her bullshit
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Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse (semi-stream of consciousness) Thoughts Part 3: Spider-Miles and his Amazing Friends/Foes
Apologies for not getting this out sooner. I’ve been/still am unwell so I was physically too energy drained to crank it out.
For this outing we’re going to discuss the characters not named Miles Morales. Spoilers ahead.
As I have said before, Miles might be the primary protagonist but he is not the sole one.
Alongside him we have the Peter Parker who died (who, in what is surely a Clone Saga reference, is blonde), the older washed up Peter Parker, Spider-Gwen, Spider-Ham, Spider-Man Noir and Peni Parker with her SP//dr mech...with a cameo by Spider-Man 2099 and 1960s Spider-Man.
Going up against them are Kingpin, Prowler/Aaron Davis, Doctor Octopus/Olivia Octavius, Tombstone, Scorpion and Green Goblin with cameos by the Lizard/Spider-Gwen’s Peter Parker and some versions of Doc Ock and a reference to Electro. Honestly there were probably more villains too I just missed them because this movie is such a feast for the eyes that you need to see it more than once to take everything in. For example my friend caught a Ditko reference I missed.
I already gushed about how impressive it is that the movie balanced so many characters so lets not go over that again beyond saying that it is honestly mind blowing that us Spidey fans got all THOSE villains (some of whom have never been on film before) in this movie and what is essentially a Carolin Trainer Doc Ock reference rendered as a really cool villainess.
For real Olivia ‘Liv’ Octavius was bad ass. If Kingpin was the Big Bad she was his ‘Dragon’ to use TV Tropes terminology. Her design was unique to Molina’s Doc Ock and her unveiling was one of the movies best twists that I really didn’t see coming. Also Aunt May seemed to know her which means in my headcanon they were like old friends and had tea together sometimes. It is also worth of note she is technically one of the relatively few Marvel movie villainesses.
Sticking with the villains for now Tombstone and Green Goblin were the least interesting. Goblin here existed essentially to serve as reference and honour to the Death of Spider-Man arc from the Ultimate comics as he is very much involved in Blonde Peter’s death and dies himself. Tombstone was just...Tombstone. He was just Fisk’s bodyguard and nothing else. Still the fact that there even exists a Spider-Man movie WITH Tombstone in it is something of a marvel. Scorpion is elevated somewhat beyond Tombstone and Goblin by virtue of his interesting redesign and the quirk that he speaks Spanish, thus connecting him to Miles. Whilst the movie doesn’t use it’s relatively even hero and villain count to just pair the characters off, it should be said that Tombstone and Scorpion do exist specifically to give Noir, Ham and Peni something to do in the second and third act climaxes.
This is not a detriment to the movie though. Although this is an ensemble movie, it is Miles movie primarily, Peter and Gwen’s secondarily and the other Spider-Heroes’ behind them. This point is accentuated when we are given their origins simultaneously in a three panel sequence. It is understood that these three characters are to be regarded somewhat collectively, sort of like the Warriors Three from Thor.
Getting back to the villains though, I have little to say on Prowler I didn’t cover last time. All I will add is that his visuals are very cool. Even though he is based upon Ultimate Prowler his look is more 616 Prowler influenced, but imagine if instead of a misguided antagonist he was a scary slightly Spawn inspired villain. So he was totally bad ass.
However hats must go off to Kingpin. He was the main and best villain of this story. It is funny this year has been oddly Kingpin focused in terms of Marvel content.
He was brought back superbly for Daredevil season 3. He was a notable figure in the PS4 Spidey game. He was the main villain of the PS4 prequel novel. He got a lot of play in Daredevil and Spider-Man comics where he was the mayor and he is now serving as a Marvel movie villain for the second time. For me personally I complimented all this by checking out Daredevil Born Again and Last Rites, two very Kingpin centric stories.
As far as his portrayal here is concerned, the central conceit of the movie again creates a potential get out of jail scenario for any direction the writers want to take with the characters. This is an AU version of Kingpin and so is at liberty to deviate wildly from the 616 version as Liv Octavius did.
How interestingly what we wind up with is an interesting rendition of Kingpin who’s deviations from his canon counterpart’s personality are relatively minor and his overall portrayal is different more in where it places the emphasis as opposed to what the specific traits of his personality are.
Comics Kingpin is defined by his cold controlled and sophisticated demeanour hiding a thuggish, cruel and raging temper beneath the surface. He is the boss of bosses, the biggest criminal ever in more way than one.
Spider-Verse Kingpin is a little more ‘street’ in his dialogue and vocal performance than we might be used to with classic Kingpin and ever so slightly more prone to making jokes, but beyond that his personality is very similar. Essentially he is Kingpin with a bit more Tony Soprano injected into him. The idea of his calm exterior hiding a cruel raging monster beneath is very well realized though via his gimmick of clicking his pen as a kind of stress ball to maintain his temper and his beating Spider-Man to death with his bare hands. Not to mention his flying into raging bull mode at the climax of the movie when things go all wrong.
Where the key deviation lies for this rendition of Wilson Fisk though lies in his motivation for the movie. Whilst various stories in comics and other media depict Kingpin’s motivation to simply rid his criminal empire of one superhero or another, or else further expand and secure that empire, Spider-Verse Kingpin is all about his family. The entire reason he is investigating parallel universes is in order to find alternate living versions of his dead wife Vanessa and son Richard. They died fleeing him in horror upon witnessing him fighting Blonde Spidey, so Wilson feels guilty and heartbroken over their deaths.
What is ingenious about this take upon Kingpin is that you could entirely see his canon counterpart doing something like this and it serves to add a note of sympathy to him in spite of his directly murdering Spider-Man and Miles’ uncle. Whilst it is perhaps not as nuanced or multilayered as the Netflix Kingpin, it still serves to make him more than a two-dimensional, black and white gangster. So as a villain he is simple, yet effective.
Kingpin, like all the Spider-Heroes sans Miles, also has a backstory flashback sequence that explains his history with his family. These are strategically placed throughout the movie and are reminiscent of the origin sequences from the Suicide Squad movie. However what worked so poorly there works magnificently here.
These origin sequences do much more than simply drop exposition for each character. Putting aside how the movie does enough to build up and endear us to most of the characters who get such sequences, the sequences are actually in aid of conveying to the audience the primary conceit of the film, that of alternate realities.
And the best way to convey this idea is to prevent the familiar with deliberate changes.
What I mean by this is that the movie sets up these origin sequences in deliberate contrast to one another and signposts this fact with repeated dialogue and visual cues in each sequence. This even applies for Kingpin as the visuals of his origin sequence are evoked for the climax wherein he briefly does see flashes of his wife and son from other realities.
As far as the Spider-Heroes are concerned though, the first of these sequences is at the top of the movie with the background information for Blonde Spidey.
This helps immediately hint that the world we are watching is both similar to yet different to the ones we might be familiar with, noticeably the world of this Spider-Man is more similar to our own as Blonde Spidey (surely a Ben Reilly reference unto himself) is a beloved and highly merchandised celebrity. Even the iconic upside down kiss with Mary Jane occurs for him with MJ upside down. A fun little in joke for the audience, or sly easing in of the idea that this Spider-Man is not the one we know?
A little of both probably, but that one scene illustrates what I mean because the second origin sequence we get is about the older Spider-Man. Like I said it plays itself in deliberate contrast to the Blonde Spider-Man, retaining the same narrative/dialogue structure within the short vignette to convey for us how this Spidey is different and thus develop his character. E.g. he is older and yet less successful, he is underappreciated and in bad shape and his marriage to MJ (whom he shares a more traditional upside down kiss with, see what I mean, it slyly hints this Spidey is more like the ones we recognize) has ended in sad divorce and he is a wreck.
Further origin sequences repeat for Spider-Gwen (she is similar to her comic counterpart, but her hang up is distancing herself from her friends), Noir, Peni and Ham.
As I said before Noir, Peni and Ham have their origin sequences play out simultaneously on the screen. This cements their lesser status within the movie compared to the other protagonists.
Collectively the sequences not only use the individual Spider-Heroes to mutually develop and build up each character on the most basic level to the audience (Spider-Man but a Looney Tune pig, Spider-Man but if he was a drummer Gwen Stacy, Spider-Man but if he was Humphrey Bogart, Spider-Man but if he was an anime girl from a mech anime, etc) but also serves to hold the audiences hand as it gets them to accept the conceit of parallel universes.
Of course the concept is first broached at the start of the movie where Blonde Spider-Man’s origin sequence concludes with him declaring himself the one and only Spider-Man (a sentiment echoed in other origin sequences too) and is then immediately followed by Miles’ introduction. We also have the topic raised in Miles classroom.
When combined with the other origin sequences, this opening obviously challenges the audiences idea that there could only ever be one Spider-Man and that it would have to be Peter Parker (a fair presumption, most audience members would be unaware of any other Spider-Heroes). This I think is part of the ingeniousness (forgive my repetition of the term but it is true) of featuring the two Peters in this movie.
See both Peter Parkers are as much positioned as deliberate deviations from the norm general audiences would expect as Spider-Ham or Spider-Gwen. Whilst one Peter is blonde and a successful married celebrity with essentially his own Spider-Cave, another is the oldest on screen Peter Parker we’ve ever had, pot-bellied and a divorcee. Outside of some video games and two 20 year old cartoons general audiences have never even seen a married Spider-Man so presenting not just one but two, and one of whom is post-marriage to boot, is a brilliant way to sell ‘this isn’t the Spider-Man you know’.
But these Spider-Men ARE Peter Parker. So if there can be versions of the Parker Spidey audiences are familiar with that are so different to what they know, the idea of Peter Parker but an anime girl or a 1930s noir character or a cartoon pig becomes easier to accept as does Gwen Stacy (whom audiences ARE familiar with from the recent Marc Webb movies) as ‘Spider-Man’ becomes yet easier to accept.
All of which build to what is second half of the question the start of the movie raises.
The question is partially ‘Does Peter Parker have to be the one and only Spider-Man’ (obviously not there are alternate versions of him as well as Gwen Stacy in the role) and, perhaps more poignantly, partially ‘Can Miles be Spider-Man’.
And this is the the most important purpose that the origin sequences serve. They are all building towards the climax of the movie which bookeneds the start wherein it is at last Miles turn to relay his own origin, allowing the movie to put to rest the question it raised at the start and cement in the audience’s minds that YES, this kid can and now IS Spider-Man.
As Stan Lee said, part of the appeal of Spider-Man is that under that costume anyone can imagine themselves to be Spider-Man. This movie embodies that message, embeds it into itself and in that sense serves the fundamental ethos of Spider-Man or him being the relatable everyman, even whilst Peter himself is not the heart of this movie.
And it did all that via having comic book style flashback exposition dumps!!!!!!!
I might have said this before or elsewhere but this is the most ‘comic book’ comic book movie I’ve ever seen! As in it is a movie that looks like and plays out like a comic book!
And just like the best comic books and comic book movies it always remembers that these stories are someone’s first so whilst it presumes a certain amount of foreknowledge (like you know who Spider-Man is) it leaves nothing to chance and organically walks you through everything you need to know. Again, those origin sequences by being placed in contrast to one another walks audiences gently through the massive concept of multiverses which no other theatrical comic book film before this to my knowledge has ever touched (sorry DC..).
Sticking with the Spider-Heroes for a moment, what should be understood is that the characterization of them is all geared towards the needs of the specific story being told, which obviously has Miles at the heart of it.
What I mean by this is that whilst the movie doesn’t give you the most detailed or faithful rendition of Spider-Gwen or Spider-Man: Noir ever they are the right takes for the movie’s story, for selling the concept of parallel universes and Miles development.
Blonde Spidey is not just hyper successful in order to contrast with Old Spidey. His success and competency (his brief action scene is incredibly impressive) is designed to also contrast to Miles inexperience and to sell him as almost a Superman/Captain America figure within Miles’ world. His death is mourned as the passing of a great and revered hero, a national day of mourning and even made me tear up a bit. This is done to accentuate the guilt Miles feels and the burden Miles feels to live up to his dying wish and shadow, the latter of which could fuel a potential sequel. His specific death scene itself is played as very different from the Ultimate comics. There his death was the grand finale (we thought) to the saga of a hero we’d been following and gave him a fittingly grand death. In the movie since his death is primarily the launch pad for Miles’ journey it is less grand, even cruel in how quick, blunt and undignified it is.
Old Spidey’s failure is not undertaken because the filmmakers believe Spider-Man is or should be some abject loser or failure, as I and others have feared. It is a direction taken because it gives him an arc for the movie. His hang up is wrapped up with his divorce from Mary Jane. But refreshingly for comic fans their separation occurred because MJ wanted children and he couldn’t bring himself to go there. It is through his tutelage of Miles (and hilarious confession to Blonde Spidey’s widow, a reflection of his student’s poor attempt to woo Gwen earlier) that he works through his issues and gets his happy ending of reuniting with his MJ. He thus has an arc intertwined with Miles even as he serves as his reluctant and somewhat haphazard mentor. If you think about it, having a version of Spider-Man more akin to the ‘default’ version would have made for a boring and underwhelming movie as far as Miles and Peter’s relationship is concerned. In this dynamic though master and student mutually grow.
Moreover his arc is interesting on a meta level as his pot belly somewhat resembled Tobey Maguire in some infamous and unflattering post-Spider-Man 3 images and Peter and MJ having a child and divorcing were in fact concepts toyed with for the aborted Spider-Man 4. All of which lends credence to the idea that Old Spider-man could very well be the actual Maguire Spider-Man. Indeed Maguire was apparently considered to be cast for this Spider-Man.
Between them Blonde and Old Peter represent something of the best and worst case scenarios for the ‘standard’ Spider-Man that broadly exists in the popular consciousness of general audiences.
Also one of these two Peter Parkers is explicitly Jewish. They have a Jewish wedding with Mary Jane which is a lovely touch as both his creators were Jewish and it has often been said the character embodies certain characteristics that recognizable within Jewish culture.
Spider-Gwen is changed into being more snarky than her earliest comics depicted her mostly because she has to be a more in control and experienced counterpoint to the in experienced Miles, serving as the subtextual second-in-command of the team. Her character’s conceit of being distant from her friends was something sort of present in her comics but is played as her central emotional problem in this movie that is also worked out through the course of teaming up with others. Additionally the film, seeking to connect her and Miles romantically (perhaps unnecessarily, but it is a sweet enough young romance nevertheless, helped by their similar age for a change) draws a parallel between how both her and Miles lost a Peter Parker. Parker in her universe was the Lizard as in the comics which further helps sell the idea of ‘Spider-Man’ being flexible.
The other Spider-Heroes are again, bodies to pad out the team and all of them are geared towards comic relief which helps balance out the team and movie over all, even if it goes against how Peni and Noir were originally characterized in their solo outings. But again this isn’t a solo outing, it is a team outing centred around Miles.
And the key thing to note here, as I noted in previous instalments is that all these other Spider-Heroes NEEDED to be in here and (to a lesser or greater extent) needed their own arcs because Miles was not going to hold the movie all on his own.
As for the other characters not much to say really. Miles parents are done well though his Dad gets more focus, a biproduct think of the movie focussing upon his brother Aaron. Aunt May has a small but lovely role as the keeper of Blonde Peter’s legacy. There is a touching scene which adapted Spider-Men better than the actual story. In the comic book 616 Peter meets Ultimate May in the relatively recent aftermath of Ultimate Peter’s death. In the movie, apart from Blonde Peter being older (meaning more years with Peter), Old Peter has also lost his Aunt May meaning the moment is much more emotionally packed as bereaved aunt and nephew reunite.
Then there is Mary Jane. Again a small role and she is somewhat relegated to a motivator than her own character but in a movie this packed where the heart isn’t Peter Parker you can understand why. You do feel bad that every (good) character in this movie got a happy ending or at least a happy final scene except her...well sort of. She is just left as the widow of Blonde Spidey but she gets a nice scene where she reunites with Old Peter. So ONE version of MJ has a happy last scene.
I will say this, the movie treated the character with respect. It is MJ who delivers her husband’s eulogy that prompts Miles into action and sums up the message of anyone being Spider-Man. It is made clear MJ was not the root of her split with Peter because ‘she couldn’t handle it’ or some shit like that. So whilst the movie didn’t give her much to do it also didn’t punch down on her or disrespect her legacy the way Homecoming did. And if nothing else how cool was it that we got not one but TWO Peter/MJ marriages on screen in a major motion picture. Take that Marvel!
But I cannot talk about the characters in this movie without talking about the three best cameos in any comic book movie.
The first was the surprise post-credits sequence where Spider-Man 2099 showed up! Of all Spider-Heroes he was the one I wanted most to show up. I love Mayday of course but I never deluded myself she could show up and in fact Old Peter’s story opens up that possibility for her more down the line.
2099 shocked me (how appropriate) and I thought we were going to get some nice sequel bait. That was until that was subverted for the second cameo that made me and my friend split our sides with laugher.
1960s cartoon Spider-Man, specifically with him and 2099 recalling the ‘Spider-Man pointing at himself meme’!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That is how you integrate a meme right!!!!!!
They even paid the 1960s show homage by referring to it as going back to the beginning since the 1960s show was in fact the first time Spider-Man was ever adapted into animation.
The third and best cameo goes to the Stan Lee appearance.
I am not ashamed to tell you dear readers that when I saw Stan Lee, even a cartoon version of him, saying in his own voice that he was friends with Spider-Man and will miss him I genuinely cried a little.
Even seeing the grave of Blonde Spider-Man shortly afterwards, a scene I’d already seen as the after credits scene for Venom, hit me hard and felt very different in a post-Stan Lee world.
And of course there was that ending title card crediting Lee and Ditko. Beautiful, no other word for it.
And given the movie’s fundamental message I can think of no more fitting way to honour the fathers of Spider-Man.
#Spider-Man#Spider-Man: Into the SPider-Verse#Into the Spider-Verse#Peter Parker#Miles Morales#Gwen Stacy#Spider-Gwen#Spider Woman#MCu#marvel cinematic universe#sp//dr#Peni Parker#Spider-Man Noir#Spider-Ham#Peter Porker#Sony#sony animation#Marvel Comics#Marvel#Stan Lee#Steve Ditko
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Top 5: things you wished would have happened with Petyr & Sansa on the show AND/OR Top 5: things you hope will happen with Petyr & Sansa in the books
WISH THAT THEY’D STUCK TO THE BOOK PLOT IN GENERAL, staying in the vale. No ramsey bullshit. No clownery. But that’s a big ask as most characters and their arc and plots experienced A LOT of clownery, so the rest of this list will avoid broadstrokes and focus on small little things that could have real easily been added in with no hassle whilst sticking to the books.
Wish we could have had the dagger pomegranate and pear scene so bad. for the Hades Persephone parallel to really jump out and for the aesthetic of it all
Wish they would have shown Petyr helping her build the snow castle at the Eyrie. and sansa throwing snow at him.
I know flashback scenes were purposely used so sparingly on the show, but I would have loved some cat lysa petyr flashbacks to riverrun. People who arent interested in petyr as more than a one dimensional villain don’t really care to look into his backstory which tragically shows he was actually quite a good person and just a lowborn boy in love (before it all went wrong and he becomes the sleazy bastard we all love now)
When they arrived at the fingers, having them on a rocky grey skied shore where petyr wades in to shore through the water, while sansa is carried by Oswell. I just think it would be beautiful scenery if this sounds dumb lmao. Like something from poldark
Things I hope for the books
sweetrobin dies and Petyr manipulates enough distrust in the court for them to come to conclusions to pin it on/cast suspicion on Harry Hardyng. I’m not sure of the intricacies to make this all work, or wether sansa and harry will actually get married, but I just feel Petyr wants away with the both of those boys.
Myranda Royce pulls something. Don’t know what. But she’s going to try to play the game and be a bit like arianne in terms of not having the experience to actually pull it off, but it will butterfly effect other things in Petyr and Sansa’s life.
petyr’s got a dream vision board with sansa’s face and a wedding cloak pinned to it, I hope he manifests and actualises that energy.
I want Sansa to really get drawn into the scheming, give me my dark princess GRRM, subvert those tropes and everyones expectations.
Honestly hope they’ll reach so high but in the end go down together in a terribly goth and romantic tragic ending that I’LL never get over. I want to feel the way I do listening to Lana Del Rey’s young and beautiful. Just LOVING the hurt every SECOND.
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Legend of the Three Caballeros thoughts:
I finished. Honestly overall, it was fun, but I wanna break it up into pros, cons, and my hopes for improvement next season.
Pros- -They throw in a lot of tidbits about different cultures. True, they end up making them a crazy supernatural version of what everything really is (that’s even cooler though kinda), but I’m surprised they knew about specific kinds of yokai, and what the word “eejit” is. There’s one culture in particular they do overlook, but I’ll get to that.
-Sometimes the humor is actually really smart and funny.
-The fact that they’ve said they’re not birds throws me the frick off?? Like, I guess it’s like how Hello Kitty’s not a “cat”, and actually? In spite of it being a joke, that’s a pretty interesting thing to touch on.
-The idea of the story itself is pretty badass.
-In the end, they do sort out everything I was worried they’d forget about; the story remembers where it went and where it’s going (for the most part).
-I know this counts as more culture, but they did end up getting a Mexican to voice Panchito again, so that’s nice.
-The ending was honestly really satisfying.
-Daisy’s nieces are awesome.
-The score is pretty good too (mostly because hearing all those different renditions of the Caballeros’ theme song was pretty great).
-The designs on everything are pretty good.
-I liked the coloring.
-They remembered some of the Don Rosa lore, and some other stuff from old Disney, and that was a fun throwback.
-They did actually mention “Ari” is an Aracuan bird (at first I thought they went “Eh, kids won’t be able to pronounce that.”).
-Speaking of, props to them for keeping the original scream he makes.
-Honestly Sheldgoose and Feldrake’s fighting with eachother was the one bit of cheesy humor I actually enjoyed. Kinda reminded me of the Disney Afternoon shows involving the Disney Ducks.
-The theme song is pretty dang awesome. It’s just their old theme from the movie revamped for an adventure show, but man do they make it work. Did you know the melody of that song is from an old Mexican movie tune called “Ay, Jalisco no te rajes”?
Cons- -I don’t like what they did with Daisy at all. Disney makes her 1-dimensional and mean a lot of the time, and unfortunately this was one of those times. She was never mad at Donald for the right reasons, and when she finally did have a reason, they didn’t address it properly until the end. April, May, and June were extremely smart and cool for typical “girl” side-characters, why can’t she be?
-Speaking of Donald, the mention of him having an anger problem came out of nowhere (for his circumstances in this show at least). His life was absolutely miserable through no fault of his own, so of course that’s going to make him angry. But everyone kept telling him it was his fault and that’s unfair. Then out of nowhere, he actually is irrationally angry at everything. It could have been written better. They kinda had that out-of-the-blue-problem thing with some other chars too. *AHEMXANDRAAHEM*
-This is my biggest personal nitpick. José is from Brazil, which is a Portuguese-speaking country, meaning it’s not Hispanic. Therefore, his name is not pronounced the way it normally is in Spanish; It’s Zho-zay. This show isn’t the only Disney program to make this mistake though. Ever since he came back in the 90s, his name has been pronounced Ho-say, so I guess people have gotten it into their heads that’s how it is. I wish this weren’t the case though, because I don’t believe that literally no one has mentioned this to any execs. I thought an awesome idea of a show like this one would be the one to break the mold, but I guess not. It mostly bugs me because, as I’ve said before, it means you’re lumping in one Latino culture with another just because Mexico is closer to the US. Brazil is the one LA country that speaks a Latino language besides Spanish, guys! Also, he’s voiced by the White Pantera guy; a Canadian imitating a Mexican. Come on, guys, you can do better than that if you already found a Mexican for Panchito! I always felt that if you don’t wanna pronounce his name properly every time, just call him Joe, like they did in the 40s.
-Speaking of José and Panchito, I personally don’t like entirely where they went with their characters in this version. To be fair, I think they’re sort of mashing up different versions of them from other renditions, like Zé in the Brazilian comics and Joe from the 40s films, and Donald from his shorts and the more harmlessly angry version in the kids’ stuff now, but honestly I think I’d like it if they reversed Joe and Pancho’s personalities; if Joe was more adorably derpy and Pancho was more oblivious and flirtatious. That goes for their voices as well. I prefer the higher voiced Joe and the lower voiced Pancho.
-One other teeny tiny thing about Panchito: I wish that signature grito he has in the show didn’t sound so fake. (“Ya-woooo!” Huh??)
-While I’m at it, I can’t say his original last name was accurate (Pistoles isn’t a real word), I can’t say I like how Disney adopted the long-ass name they gave him in House of Mouse either. Gonzales at least is a pretty boring name. Also House of Mouse is the WEIRDEST PLACE to establish canon from (the song where they made up his name is also a bit culturally inaccurate in the first place)...
-Even though sometimes the humor makes me actually laugh, most of the time, it’s far, far too cheesy and childish for me.
-My overall feeling when I wasn’t enjoying the show was that I was sacrificing quality just to see my favorite trio, and that’s not a happy feeling.
-Their songs (or at least the timing of them) weren’t the best, and they bored me a little.
-The follow-up from the first episode could have been executed better; far less like a “Okay we’re here now, cool? Cool”.
-The animation could be better; It’s a little cheap and puppety (can’t blame them though, there doesn’t seem to be much leeway with the staff budget-wise).
-There are some plot holes here and there. Technical ones.
-Little nitpick, going back to the aracuan: His noises could have been better/funnier, apart from the scream which was perfect.
-I’m reeeeeally really tired of the because-they’re-classic-cartoons-and-not-the-main-characters-they’re-dumb-as-a-post-to-what’s-going-around-them thing. I honestly think it’s far funnier when modern shows break that trope and go “Yeah, what’d you think, they WEREN’T going to notice that giant bear running around the restaurant, or hear what the main is muttering?”.
-When you read the show’s bible, you can kind of see where the flaws in character writing are. They’re trying a bit too hard to fit an age group, and are returning a bit too much to the classic cartoons’ characterization. Those were random shorts, with completely different settings, and some archetypes just can’t be done anymore.
-The show hasn’t even aired yet and Disney’s giving it the short end of the stick. As a Wander Over Yonder fan, I know that pain all too well.
-Overall it could be a better show, and for how awesome the idea is, it’s disappointing that they couldn’t make it just as awesome off-paper.
Hopes for improvement next season- -Represent *AHEM* certain characters a bit better. P-L-E-A-S-E be the first Disney show in decades to pronounce his name right at the very least, PLEASE.
-Treat the characters much much better.
-Make every episode as fun and as fair as the finale.
-Make the humor more universal.
-If the writers write something THEY think is cool! It’s not impossible to write kids’ shows that way. All that humor I actually liked? You could tell those were jokes written for THEM!
-If it’s possible, maybe cut out some of the boy-girl romance that seems to be randomly stuck in. Why did independent Xandra need a hot guy in that one episode? (I also feel like Pancho and Joe don’t need no chick.) Nothing unnecessary! Only fun! >:3c
-More cultural tidbits would be great!
-Disney gives it the space to grow, so it can become the show I never knew I needed; The Three Caballeros in a kickass adventure series with everything inbetween!
#legend of the three caballeros#three caballeros#josé carioca#panchito pistoles#donald duck#not woy#daisy duck#april may and june#mild swears#It looks like there are a lot more cons than pros but I just wrote longer sentences for the former#I can't think of any more tags...
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For the ask meme: Sayaka (PMMM), Break (PH), and Tsubaki (YLiA)
Okay, so, this took me literally forever because I talk too much XD Thank you for the characters though, handsome!
Sayaka Miki (PMMM)
Favorite thing about them: Sayaka became a magical girl to save Kyousuke and while she is a bit temperamental…she’s also a kid and one who tries to stick to her morals. She deserved so much better and I love her dearly.
Least favorite thing about them: Her inability to accept others help and her tendency to either act hastily or not act because of her fear.
Favorite line: “That’s an important decision for me to make. And If I can help it, I wanna make sure I’m doing the right thing.” and then of course the mirror to that:
“Yeah, you’re right. I guess I just don’t care anymore. I can’t remember…what I thought was so important; what was worth protecting, you know? It’s all a blank now. Doesn’t make sense anymore.”
It hurts so good. Ugh.
BrOTP: Of course- Madoka/Sayaka definitely.
OTP: Kyoko/Sayaka and Hitomi/Kyousuke/Sayaka. It’s an unpopular opinion but eh.
nOTP: I don’t really have any nOTPs generally but Kyuubey needs to stay away from all the girls period.
Random headcanon: It is canon that Sayaka brings Kyousuke classical CDs in the hospital but I also think she has brought CDs to Mami and Madoka that she thinks they might like. Since she doesn’t really bond with Kyoko and Homura in the series…I also headcanon that Kyoko finds a CD wedged in the space of her favorite dance game after Madoka resets everything.
Unpopular opinion: Oh, boy. Here we go… As much as I adore Sayaka, I am going to have to say that Hitomi was not in the wrong, regarding Kyousuke. She respected her friendship with Sayaka enough to give her notice and time to confess before her. It wasn’t the best executed conversation, but they are still young. So, really, it is not Hitomi’s fault for Sayaka’s pain because she didn’t know about her being a magical girl and she should be allowed to act as Kyousuke/Sayaka were not really together.
But anyway XD
Song I associate with her: Youth- Daughter
Favorite picture of them: Do you mean a screencap or fanart? Because this post inspired by Clow Cards is pretty rad and I love it because it hits me right in my affection for CCS and the feels. I can’t really choose a favorite picture because I like art in general. XD
Xeres Break (Pandora Hearts)
Favorite thing about them: UM. MY HUSBAND?
I’m kidding. I actually like that he is very humorous, energetic, and kind. Even if it is hidden under that “Let’s use each other.” type of mentality, he really does care about those he has taken as his. Also, he is a knight and- uh- yes, please? He is really good at combat, too.
Least favorite thing: This is probably because I haven’t seen it all the way through, but they don’t really give you much about him but other than that… it is also that he is used for comic relief more often than not. I NEED MORE INFORMATION.
I KNOW HE ISN’T IN THE MAIN TRIO BUT I HAVE A MIGHTY NEED.
He’s also a bit mean to Oz but that’s just a minor irritation I can overlook. Lmao.
Favorite line: “Ahh… I said I’d ‘answer you’- not that I would give you a straight answer.” (Because that was the funniest thing to me. Poor Oz.)
Or: “Let me give you a word of advice. A loyalty that holds fast will become a blade, and will pierce some day those you hold dear. So open your eyes wide. That is, if you… don’t want to end up like me…”
-Note: I am only going by the anime and Volume 7 so for those who may say “There’s better!”- I’m sure there is but I don’t really want to spoil myself!
BrOTP: Xeres/Reim and Xeres/Oscar
OTP: I like Xeres/Reim as a romantic pairing as well. I also have a cracky pairing that is trash but we don’t talk about that. XD (You know this though, darling.)
nOTP: Again, I don’t normally have nOTPs but in this case, Oz, Sharon, and Alice are out because I believe they are underage.
Random headcanon: Break’s love of sweets actually started because of Sharon. I headcanon that when he was still distant and feisty with the Rainsworth family that Sharon was curious about him but also a bit afraid. One of their first interactions had her peeking out from her mother’s skirt and slowly going up to Break to give him a wrapped sweet before sprinting back to hide and as he got settled. After that, he made sure to always keep them with him and it just became a habit for them to share some.
Unpopular opinion: I’m not sure what would be considered an unpopular opinion for Break?Perhaps, that his birth name does not suit him?
Songs I associate with him: I See Fire- Ed Sheeran
Favorite picture: Get back to me when I can actually venture into the tag after we finish the anime. XD But I love his face in general and pulling from the pictures I took/have on my blog: this one or this one.
Tsubaki Sawabe (Your Lie in April)
Favorite thing about them: MY SPUNKY DAUGHTER. She is feisty, caring, and is so genuine when she expressing her emotions when she feels safe doing so. She supports Kousei- even though she has no idea about piano and what it entails. She doesn’t let her feelings get in the way of being there for him.
Least favorite thing about them: She is a bit on the aggressive side and with Kousei’s history of abuse with his mother, it probably isn’t a good idea to hit him but that is an unfortunate trope in anime. She is also a bit brash and expects Kousei at times to see how he is hurting her when he has no idea but again, she’s young. Overall, her flaws are not that bad and I adore her to bits.
Favorite line: “Everyone was stepping boldly one foot at a time…while cheering themselves up, while being provoked, while being supported, trying to advance. I was the only one not stepping forward. I wish time would stop. The only one whose time had stopped…was me. I want to advance. I want to step forward. I want my time to move.”
That one hits me straight in the most tender places of my heart because I have been there, I have felt that but since I gave two for the others, I also like:
“Even though I’m upset that I lost… Even though I’m depressed… Even though my ankle hurts and my eyes are stained with tears. I don’t think I’ve ever felt worse. so why do the stars look so bright tonight? The scent of the music room in his hair. The sound of his slightly ragged breathing. His shoulder, warm and wet with tears. I am by his side. I wish we could live in this moment forever.”
BrOTP: Nao/Tsubaki and Tsubaki/Saitou are good.
OTP: Tsubaki/Kousei and Tsubaki/Watari. Honestly? Tsubaki/Watari/Kousei as well because I’m a polyshipper and if Kaori is alive, then I ship all of them.
nOTP: I don’t really have any.
Random headcanon: Tsubaki and Karoi get along very well because Kaori is impulsive and reckless (albeit for different reasons) and before Kaori was admitted into the hospital, she actually grabbed Tsubaki so they could sneak off for the evening. It wasn’t too terribly exciting but they ended up in a park at the top of a hill while it was windy and ended up screaming some of their troubles away. (This is also when Kaori solidifies her thought that Tsubaki is in love with Kousei)
Unpopular opinion: Is there an unpopular opinion about her? I guess: I do not feel like she was a one-dimensional character or a replacement for Kaori and while she may not understand Kousei, it does not make her a bad friend.
Song I associate with her: Hello/How Are You (Jazz arrange/English cover) by LizzRobinett
Favorite picture: She looks really pretty in the scene where it’s raining and she and Kousei are standing together while she drinks her drink but the one I found on Tumblr I like is this one
#kat answers the lovelies#daffodi1#my darling#ask game#long post#your lie in april#pandora hearts#puella magi madoka magica#xeres break#sayaka miki#tsubaki sawabe
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The Visitor
Pocket Books, 1995 162 pages, 42 chapters + epilogue ISBN 0-671-87270-2 LOC: PZ7.P626 Vi 1995 OCLC: 33376660 Released November 1, 1995 (per B&N)
Mary Weist has lost her boyfriend to a tragic accident, and is shutting everyone out since his death. But there’s a bigger problem, or at least more intensive inner voices telling her friends and family that there was more to it than anybody knew. Mary has her own secrets that she’s keeping from the community, sure, but she slowly comes to learn that she’s not the only one. In fact, she eventually finds out that she had secrets she didn’t even know about.
I mean ... talk about misleading back copy, right? Yeah, Tom is important to this book, but the story is about Mary, who doesn’t even get mentioned here. Tom shows up about halfway in, and his whole job was to try to make Mary realize the truth of the secret she had ... suppressed? forgotten? We can discuss it more when we get there.
Also, this book inspired its share of hate and anger when it came out. We were used to this epic about vampires, and now we have two stand-alone novels in a row clocking in at under 200 pages. Plus this one reads super fast. I think I did it in less than two hours this go-round. Maybe at the time it came out we felt cheated of explanation and exposition, but honestly? This is a tight horror/suspense story that neither gives us too much nor expects us to make up too much. Maybe the story doesn’t even need to be this long, though I didn’t feel it was excessively padded.
It opens with Mary getting ready to go to a party that she doesn’t really want to attend. It’s been a month since her boyfriend died, but she’s been talked into this party by his best friend (who by the way also wants to jump her bones). He’s got her there because her boyfriend’s younger brother also plans to go and wanted to talk to her — not about his death necessarily, but just about the guy. It turns out that the brother has felt his continuing presence, which weirds Mary out so much that she goes outside. Her ride comes and gets her after a while, saying that the host (another ex-girlfriend of the dead guy) wants to try to get in touch with him with an Ouija board. Pike Trope #1: check!
The party dies out enough that they have a smaller group to try to reach Dead Boyfriend: Mary, Brother, Other Ex, Horny Ride, and Superfluous Redheaded Twins That Supposedly Help Boost Ethereal Signal (I’d like to call this Pike Trope #2, but I think it was only in one book unless you count the short story that mentions the book). They get the board going, and it starts to talk specifically about Mary: that once, long ago in Egypt, she lived and pretended to be a god. Obviously Other Ex thinks that Mary knows more than she’s letting on about how Dead Boyfriend kicked off, and is asking specific and pointed questions to the Ouija board, the answers to which seem to throw Mary under the bus. Still, the godhood bits are maybe too subtle or unrelated if we’re assuming Other Ex just wanted to implicate Mary (and because she’s taking notes, I think we’re supposed to understand that she’s not even touching the indicator anyway). Still, she doesn’t answer questions and she leaves with Horny Ride without completing the communication.
So they go back to Mary’s house, where Horny Ride gives her a full-body massage in front of a roaring fire (Pike Trope #3), and she tells him about a story she was writing the day she met Dead Boyfriend: an Egyptian goddess is buried alive, but Mary didn’t know why or what happened, and in walking through the woods looking for inspiration she met him. So the message from the board hits close to home. After no sex, Horny Ride leaves and Mary throws on a robe and drives out to Dead Boyfriend’s grave, where she lies down and dreams about his death. (Pike Trope #4: dreaming backstory!) Evidently, they had broken into the school to precount the votes for homecoming queen, and when a frightened security guard with a shaky trigger finger found them, Mary basically told him where to stick it. So he acted all big, and she tackled him, and in the scuffle the gun went off, thereby creating Dead Boyfriend. What we didn’t know before — the real mindfuck revelation that does more to explain Mary’s mental state and personality than anything else — is that she continued to fight with the guard, specifically to press his gun against his head and force him to pull the trigger.
Obviously Mary has never told anyone this story, but it goes a long way toward both understanding her aloofness toward anything and everything now as well as giving us a little more justification and understanding for what we’ll learn as the story goes along. But for now, she gets up and goes home and goes to bed, but is awakened by a bright light in her backyard. She has to put on a new robe to check it out, as her first one is dirty, but what she finds outside is a flying saucer. Before she has time to even think about what it’s doing or what she should do about it, there’s a bright flash and she finds herself lying on Dead Boyfriend’s grave again. Obviously this is a dream, so she walks back home and goes back to bed. But when she wakes up in the morning, there are TWO dirty robes on her chair.
She goes to work and tells her boss about the flying saucer encounter, and he suggests that this is probably related to her traumatic experience (though he has the civility to accept that she does not seem to be making it up). That night she dreams of an invisible being in a desert who slowly makes herself visible to the people and shapeshifts into a body pleasing enough that they begin to worship her. There’s our Egyptian goddess! Mary’s not prepared to write this all off as either suggestibility or coincidence, so she calls up Horny Ride in the middle of the night and tells him to come right over, bringing Brother and his Ouija board so they can try to figure out what is going on and who they were talking to before.
Before they can even ask the board a question, it spells out this poem about how all love, all burn, all die. It calls this the “Prayer of the False God,” which also appears as the book’s epigraph. Pretty ballsy of Pike to quote HIMSELF in his own book. I wonder if the poem came first and he built the story around it. But the presence doesn’t hang out very long this time, and the guys leave and Mary falls back asleep. The spaceship shows up again, and she tries to call Horny Ride, but the voice on the other end of the phone isn’t him. Mary thinks it’s the Ouija board, and when she says she wants her boyfriend back it says that her desires make her nightmare continue. Whatever that means.
Back at school after the weekend, there’s a new kid. If you guessed it’s Tom, you’re right! Mary is drawn to him for some reason, and goes so far as to take him for a ride after school. They go for dinner, take a walk in the woods, and end up naked in front of Mary’s fireplace again. (Yes, Pike addresses the parents: they’ve left town for the week, even though neither one really wants to leave Mary alone.) But this time it’s the dude who stops the sexytimes, echoing her rationale for not wanting to do Horny Ride. They hang out for another day without talking, and that night the spaceship comes again. This time Mary sees an actual alien, and reaches out to touch it, which sucks her into a vision of the past.
(Aside: I’m kind of pissed off that I didn’t take this book with me to Roswell when I was there three weeks ago. Would have made a more fitting picture for the the entry, right?)
This vision describes Clareesh, a fourth-dimensional extraterrestrial being visiting ancient Egypt who wants to meet humans despite directives not to be seen. She vibrates down to a visible frequency, then reads the humans’ minds and adopts the physical form that they find most pleasing. They take her for a god and worship her as such — all except the one woman who Clareesh mirrored for a moment while getting her bearings in a human body. This woman wants to be beautiful and immortal like Clareesh, and after 30 years she starts to get peeved that Clareesh isn’t sharing her secrets. So she raises a mob against her and threatens to kill her lover if Clareesh doesn’t make with the youngifying. Obviously alien physiology is different from human, and unfortunately so long in a human body has stunted Clareesh’s supernormal powers.So there’s nothing she can do as this angry power-grabber gruesomely kills the young man and buries them both together in a stone tomb. And she can’t get out, no matter how she claws and tears her fingers against the rock.
When Mary comes to, she’s back in bed, and there’s dried blood on her sheets. Message, obviously. So the next day she doesn’t hang out with Tom, but she follows him after school as he wanders aimlessly around town. At one point a car hits a fox dead-on, and Tom picks it up and cradles it to his chest. And it wakes up and licks his face and runs away. Mary stops following at this point, and Tom doesn’t come to school the next day because what for. This pisses off Other Ex, who assumes that Mary has given him what he came for and threatens that through the power of her father the mayor, she’s convinced the police to reopen the case of Dead Boyfriend. Mary’s pretty sure that Brother blabbed some of the stuff she told him about the night he died, but apparently it was Horny Ride, grumpy about Mary’s interest in Tom and looking to get his dick wet SOMEWHERE. What a fucknuts.
She has to go to work, and tells her boss a little more about what’s been going on. She leaves out the zombie fox, but not much else. The boss, in turn, tells a story of a spirit that rose up out of the cemetery nineteen years ago, while he was lost on a walk, and read his mind looking for pregnant women in the area. The one it fixated on — one he didn’t even think of as pregnant, because she hadn’t revealed it yet — was Mary’s mom. So he figures that there must be something larger going on related to her and it’s manifesting somehow now. Mary thinks of Clareesh here, but isn’t sure why.
She goes back to the clearing where she found the alien, because she’s pretty sure Tom is going to be there. When he is, she pulls a gun and tells him to bring her boyfriend back to life. He asks if she’s sure she wouldn’t like to go back to the spaceship with him, and she’s adamant: all she wants is her boyfriend. So they dig him up, and Tom embraces him, and pretty soon they’re both moaning in pain: the boyfriend because his soul is back but his body is still dead and a month stiff and rotten, Tom because this act has drained all of his energy and he is about to die.
Whatever, right? My boyfriend’s back! Only he isn’t really happy about it. Mary takes him back to her house and soaks him in the bathtub, thinking it’ll warm and limber him up, but all it does is pull embalming fluid out. She thinks maybe he needs something to replace the fluid with, so he can properly live again. Blood! Pike Trope #4! Of course — they would have drained it all at the funeral home and now he needs some. So she calls up Other Ex and says she did tamper with the homecoming queen vote and that she’s willing to share the real ballots if they drop their investigation. They meet at the movie theater, and before Other Ex can say boo Mary fucking WHALES her in the head with a hammer and drags her home, to be blood for her love.
(I realized that I never said we’re back in a small town: Seedmont, Idaho, population unspecified because Pike has finally learned something about small towns. That’d be Trope #1.5, I guess.)
While Mary is refilling her dead boyfriend with live blood, Horny Ride and Brother drop by. They’re looking for Other Ex, who has evidently disappeared. Mary’s salty about Horny Ride being only worried about his new cock sheath, and she dismisses them out of hand. Back with (Un)Dead Boyfriend, he wants to know how she brought him back, and she tells the whole story, actually not leaving anything out for once. He explains that, yes, his soul is back, but his body is still dead, and that she has to let him go for both of their sakes. So she takes him back to the cemetery and shoots him in the head right next to his grave, which ... how do you kill a dead body with a magically infused soul? Did the bullet just make an easier hole for the soul to get out? But he’s dead again, and she suddenly realizes:
She is Clareesh, given a second chance to sacrifice herself and step away for the good of humanity rather than stroking her own vanity. And she failed.
Tom is still alive, and now she recognizes him as her second-in-command from the good old fourth dimension. She gives him her life energy and orders him to call the spaceship and leave her on Earth. Which he does, after he buries her undead body with her redead boyfriend, to struggle for another five thousand years.
The epilogue takes us back to the party, where it’s Boyfriend, surprisingly not dead, who is against the idea of using an Ouija board to get in touch with Mary, who was killed when she resisted the security guard at school. It tells them that there is nothing more to be afraid of, and then swiftly goes silent, leaving Not-Dead Boyfriend to mourn at Mary’s grave, where he thinks he hears a moan from under the earth.
The Visitor is probably too long by half, but it tumbles along smoothly. I don’t blame Pike for dragging it out; there’s no way his audience was going to be happy with an 80-page book. But it probably would have worked better in one of his short story collections coming up quick. I’m not mad at it, even as it pulls from so much of what he’s written before, because every author does that. Maybe I needed this distance from the original context, coming as it did in the middle of TWO separate book series, to appreciate this one on its own merits.
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