#it's just one of those things where people view their interpretation of a subject as analysis when. those two words refer to different

[deancrowleycas]

Favorite Shots Per Episode ✩ 1.06 Skin (3/3)

cinematography analysis and queer reading under the cut

It's of course very obvious that the shapeshifter is functioning as a mirror to Dean, but I still find it fascinating how this is depicted in the cinematography. Because the director isn't using physical mirrors, despite them being such a popular trope in horror for showing the true self or the mental state or metamorphosis of a character. The only time where you sort of see one is in a foreshadowing shortly after the establishing shot with the side-view mirror (which I absolutely love):

But for the rest? Not really. I always wonder if interpret waaaay too much into certain frames, but I am kind of obsessed with how Dean and Becky are divided by the crime scene tape in this shot. Becky is the victim. Dean, well Dean? He's the monster. Kind of. I think a lot of the reflection in this episode happens through what Dean is not also, and he's are not living the lives of 'normal' people. I love how the directing of the episode shows early on that Dean does not belong to that part of society, just like the shapeshifter.

I mean I obviously am doing a queer reading of that (being queer myself), with the monstrous and othered bodies in media being those that are not conforming to various aspects of white cishet society. But I am going to say - the implication that there is a sort of inherent tragedy to Dean's life, not just a sense of not belonging because of his 'lifestyle' but also the fear of being monstrous enough to destroy other people's bodies and livelihoods? Ugh. It hurts, and it's sadly coming back in anti-queer narratives to this day. But yeah, as I said, Dean is portrayed in a way that is disconnecting him from the rest - also from Sam who is the link to this 'normal' life by knowing Becky and who has kept Dean from 'being himself' by pursuing his own dreams and conforming to the exact society that Dean is not belonging to, letting Dean behind in a position where he's neither free to be himself nor enough to be someone else -, and that is giving him a sameness to the shapeshifter.

Dean has to hide the queer part of himself, in a desperate attempt to be accepted, mirrored by the monster of the week: "So maybe this thing was born human but was different, hideous and hated...until he learned to become someone else."

I think that's why I am also obsessed with these shots. Because both the shapeshifter and the shapeshifter as Dean are getting one, revealing their true self underneath the mask that is this body, a body that is subjected to other people's ideas and is projected on and isn't their own. But also the eyes are mirrors? The body part described as the 'mirror to the soul'. It's a little cliché and on the nose, but I find it way cooler than just working with physical mirrors, you know?

And yeah, when it comes to reflections, of course, we cannot forget this scene:

Which is Dean seeing himself, but more so is actually Dean seeing how he is perceived by others. It's not a depiction of his actual self, it's a depiction of the concept of him. We know this, we know Dean is not the 'bad guy' that is televised nor is it an accurate portrayal of him. But I think that it serves to show the audience how media is a place that can shape ideas and construct norms, and it also serves as a way to remind Dean that this is how he will be reacted to if he dares to 'become' monstrous. If he dared to be like the shapeshifter, the outcast, and put his own being over his responsibility to conform. Despite his brother Sam being allowed the same egoism - but Sam's egoism is striving to conform, he's lawboy@stanford.edu you know, and Dean's egoism is striving to be free, to regain control over his body.

And then we have this shot.

Followed by this shot.

Dean 'killing' this reflection of himself, this part of himself in favor of serving and saving. He's a freak, but he's not just a freak like Sam in that he's currently living the hunter lifestyle and didn't really fit into Stanford. Because - well, he's different than Sam. Queer. He's isolated, alone, born hated like the shapeshifter if he ever lived his true self, yearning to be loved. The shapeshifter literally says it: "All he wants is for someone to love him. He’s like me. You know, everybody needs a little human touch now and then. It’s so hard to be different." I think this episode hits so hard for me because you can see Dean's self-hatred, especially in that last shot, Dean's internal struggles that he hides so well under his hero-esque facade. But also how he is ultimately a loving and caring person, putting everyone's happiness above himself.

I think despite this episode reading like being queer is an inherent tragedy at first glance, it walks a fine line in actually trying to convey quite the opposite. Dean is other, but the other isn't bad. Yes, he does good by suppressing himself, so does that mean he has to act according to others to be happy? I don't think that is what the episode is saying. I think it is more an example of Dean's 'monstrosity' being not the same as the shapeshifter's monstrosity in the end, that despite all the sameness they aren't one. That despite what society depicts him to be, evil and harmful to others, he isn't this mirror image projected onto him. He isn't what was shown on those televisions, or in a wider sense, the media. He isn't what is hunted down by the SWAT team, or in a wider sense, institutions in power. Dean's self IS good. Dean's self IS caring and loving, despite his fear to pursue his own dreams and be free, and it's not coming through his actions of suppressing those desires, but because he ultimately is neither those 'normal' people nor the shapeshifter, but his own truth. So yeah, while I think this episode definitely walks a dangerous path by having Dean continue to live this old life in the end, the cinematography in this episode also functions to reveal how - while horror is a love letter to the monstrous, represents counter-narratives and helps to deconstruct normativity (like in this episode!) - the monstrous is often instrumentalized to suppress and oppress and depict victims as an inherent danger to the established systems of oppression. Dean's true self isn't bad. People are just made to believe that it is.

[fipindustries]

Out of curiosity, what was 4chan like? I mostly know it as the place Nazis hung out.

i think this is very hard for me to answer, because i liked the place. i had a strong emotional conection to the place and because of that i am very biased and i have very rose tinted glasses about the whole affair. i can try to communicate what it was like for me to be in 4chan, i could say that it was a place that was "harsh, but fair" or "grimy but honest" but im worried that wouldnt be an accurate depiction of what 4chan was like. maybe it was that, long long ago, before 2014. but that is definetly not what it was in its last years

i always tried my best to be as honest as possible whenever i reference 4chan in my art, whether that was fan.tastic, or my /co/venture comics or episode 9 of jennyffer, so if you take a look at those you might get a decent idea.

this is all further complicated by the fact that 4chan wasnt just a single website. you heard that joke about how america isnt just one country but actually a bunch of different states in a trenchcoat, each with its own diverse and wildly different cultures? much like maine is not the same as alabama is not the same as oregon is not the same as california is not the same a utah. /co/ was not the same as /tv/ which was not the same as /mu/ which was not the same as /x/ which was not the same as /t/. every single board in 4chan could be very different from every other one. places like /pol/ were very much "the place where nazis hung out" but places like /tg/ could be fairly chill places to hang out at. /d/ you just went there to look at the horny pictures and maybe have a semi ironic gender crisis, /tv/ was kind of pedo central, and /po/ is just a delightful little space to talk about origami.

but what was the general experience of it all? the resulting ghestalt?

first you have to start with a base background radiation of cynicism. and i dont mean jaded, wizened cynicism borne out of life experience, i mean curdled, teenage acerbic cynicism that seeks to view everything under the worst light and read the worst possible interpretation of everything because the world sucks, man.

thing is, when i say background radiation i mean it in the sense that after a while its easy to tune out. a little harder to tune out was, you know, the rampant racism transphobia, etc. and i think im not wrong in saying that it has gotten a lot worse in the last few years. i am very good at not paying attention to that (not necesarily a good skill to have) and even i had a hard time going there these last few years because of how aggressive it had gotten.

now the thing about negativity and cynicism is that there is a reason why people flock to it. because it can be funny, it can be incisive. anton ego said it best when he said that critics live of writing down negative criticism because its fun to write and read. and being on 4chan could be really fucking funny. they were really good at coming up with memes. they were good at the witty retort and the funny take downs. again, you had to go through a lot of boring, tedious half assed negativity, but you could always find something to laugh at or be amused by. this, of course shone at its best if there was something that you were hatewatching. lord i remember the got threads or the true detective season 2 threads. holy fuck that was a lot of fun.

but also beyond that, because these people are humans, they couldnt help but occassionally genuenly enjoy things. if you had a general (a perpetual thread exclusively dedicated to discussing one specific topic) you could find very positive praise and interactions there. the /sug/ threads dedicated to steven universe were genuenly fantastic, as well as the /madmen/ threads.

and while we are on the subject, i am the kind of person who tends to find excessive negativity more tolerable than excesive positivity. that's one reason i cannot fucking stand reddit or most discord servers. and on a more personal note, i feel more comfortable around people that are unpleasant and aggressive and offensive because then i know i dont have to watch over my behavior with them as much as i have to with people who are too squicky clean or who care too much about not stepping on toes or not making people uncomfortable. of course this comes at the price of hanging around people who are unpleasant to be around so, you know, to each their poison.

also, this was at its worst on the more popular boards, dedicated to the more mainstream hobbies like video games, anime, tv and movies and so on. places with more niche hobbies like /po/ or /ck/ were more populated by genuine hobbists who just wanted to talk about their interests. and even in the more mainstream boards if you found a niche enough topic where most trolls wouldnt be interested in participating, you could get fantastic discussons about a thing you couldnt really discuss anywhere else. another place to have nice interactions would be on OC threads where the anons would make stuff for other anons to see, whether they be an art thread or a music thread or the musical events or any other kind of creative collaborative effort. usually in those spaces they were more interested in participating and getting things done.

so yeah, i would say that modern 4chan was definetly a cesspool of bigotry and negativity in the more general broad areas but if you could find a specific thread talking about a specific niche hobby and you were lucky enough that they liked the topic you could find echoes of that old romanticised 4chan of times past where they were edgy and agressive but fun to be around.

personally i think the best board was far an wide (again, for 4chan standards) /tg/ tradicional tabletop games and rpgs. the best combination of big enough that there was constant lively discussion but chill enough that they werent intolerable to be around. if i had to guess why its because unlike most hobbies rpgs make you hang out and collaborate with other people and put a lot of creative effort for the sake of others which forces a minimum ammount of sociability in you.

[rainbowrocketquotes]

LGBTQ+ Headcanons for Pride Month

Late as fuck but I've been Busy™ so uhh.

These are my opinions and they are subject to change! Feel free to dicsuss your own opinions in the replies but if y'all start arguing with each other in there I swear.

Giovanni

I dont know why but he and Ariana give off the vibes of that couple who have a joint sugar baby in a pseudo-polycule.

T4T silverspawn is my bread and butter but also I'm a multishipper so that ranges.

Imo he's either straight but an ally or a closeted bisexual that hides it behind allyship. We all know that guy.

Archie

Unlabelled. I don't make the rules, sorry. /j

No but on a serious note I think he just doesn't care to try and explain. He gives off the vibe of "guy who experimented heavily in college and kind of forgoes labels now" because he knows what he wants and he doesn't feel the need to try and define himself to other people.

I also am a fan of the trans Archie headcanons but I personally still don't see him labelling himself any which way in any regard tbf. He's just chill.

Maxie

Boykisser.

I don't really care which way he gets labeled most of the time but this guy likes men. Or at the very least he has definitely dated a man.

I don't really like the trans Maxie headcanon as much as some of the other trans headcanons for characters because I just feel like it buys too much into the common fandom tropes of "one member of popular ship must be afab and the other must he amab" with Hardenshipping being an incredibly popular ship, and "skinny white man = trans" being the most common trans headcanons. I'm not saying anyone who headcanons Maxie as trans is doing it for those reasons, and I have NO PROBLEM with people who headcanon Maxie as trans. Like, I'll still read fics and look at art where he is, and I don't mind it, I just don't like it personally for those reasons, and don't headcanon him as trans.

Cyrus

Abnormal views on gender/sexuality because of his time spent in the distortion world.

I personally don't think he cares what pronouns he's referred to by because he thinks it's a waste of time to correct people on something so trivial as a set of words, and he doesn't care how people percieve him.

In regards to sexuality, I also think he doesn't bother with labels, or really care about anything like that in general. I think he's probably on the asexual/aromantic spectrum, but it could also be interpreted as him just being closed off and weird like he is.

Personally I think if he bothered with labelling, he'd be Demiromantic. I'm not sure if he'd be cis or not but he probably still wouldn't care about pronouns or anything.

Ghetsis

Gay and homophobic /j

Honestly? I have no idea. I think he's probably very against the idea of wasting time with romance, especially in regards to what N is doing. But I don't think he'd be generally homophobic or transphobic. Probably just romancephobic /hj.

That's not to say I think he's necessarily on the ace spectrum, but I think he thinks he has better things to do. That he's against the idea of romance as an idea for the purposes of his ideals. He's a cult leader who wants to manipulate and use his son as a means to rule the world. He doesn't care what gender or sexuality N labels with, he just knows that by getting a partner he'd be straying from the plan he's trying to fulfill. Shrug.

Colress

I don't think he cares, but like in a different way than Archie doesn't care. I don't think he's explored his gender and sexuality enough to be comfortable forming his own opinion on how he identifies. He's scientific and needs proof one way or another, but won't actively go out and get the proof because he doesn't care that much. I.E., unlabelled. Doesn't care about his own pronouns.

Definitely is a "I assume you are bisexual until proven otherwise" truther, tho.

Lysandre

Very stereotypically flamboyantly gay, obviously, in the same vein as every Disney villain ever. I know I just said I don't fuck with stereotypes but not for this one. This idiot is home of sexual. Full stop.

Probably cis? But the kind of cis guy who would do drag for fun iykwim.

Guzma

Pan or Bi, 100%. Just screams sexual frustration like that. I physically cannot explain it but he just is.

Gender wise, I'm down with pretty much any headcanon for him. I think he's cis but cool with any pronouns in the way that a dude who is just comfortable in his masculinity is. Like if you call a guy who's normal "she" on accident he'll probably be like "haha, I'm a dude," and move on. That's Guzma.

Lusamine

Heteroromantic Bisexual. I cannot explain it, either, but she just gives me vibes.

"Every woman wanted to be a man at some point, Lillie, it's normal", and never elaborates. Probably Cis, but I'm squinting at her very hard.

I'm also cool with the transfem headcanons for her but sometimes people lean too far into the "trans people are always villains" thing and it gets... Weird!

! SURPRISE BONUS ROUND !

Rose

General cishet vibes from this guy, though I won't disregard any queer headcanons for him. I just think he and Oleana have some weird het situationship going on over there.

British /j

Volo

Some kind of gender something idk /ref

I don't know what he is but he definitely is not Cisgender and I can tell you that with confidence.

I think he's probably demiromantic or demisexual but I have a general feeling that he's somewhere on the ace spectrum. Idk if that's cliche or weird but I like this guy and I get vibes™ from him.

Also I know this is my Rainbow Rocket acount but I! Like Volo!! Contrary to popular belief!!! Legends Arceus is one of my favourite pkmn games.

Sada

Still have not finished Scarvi!! But she's bi. Have you seen her? She's bi.

I wouldn't mind a t4t headcanon with her and her husband but I don't outright hc her as transfem. I might, once I finish the game, tho.

Turo

Once again have still not finished Scarvi! But he's also Bi. Maybe homoromantic or demi on the side, but he definitely is Bi.

Might be a flavor of nonbinary, but that could just be the vibes I get from his weird little cunty outfit.

[nyerusnova]

Glad to see that Tim being a giant Dick Grayson fanboy is finally being highlighted again, and sparking more discussion especially on their early relationship! (Please gimme more!!! I love them so much, augh!)

Probably as a result of that surge, there seems to be reciprocal chatter on the topic of how young Tim actually felt towards Jason, too. It's honestly pretty interesting, because it's more nuanced than it appears at first glance.

Which means it's very fun to dissect! ✨

There's a degree of subjectivity to keep in mind, because readers are going to have different interpretations of the same scenes, or will pull from entirely different scenes than one another to form their individual view on this topic. That's just how it is in comic book fandom, for many things! Regardless, in this case... if the scale ranges from the extreme of "Jason was Tim's Robin" to the other extreme of "Tim actually hated Jason [as Robin] or thought he was a loser that got himself killed" — the actual truth is closer to the middle, as is often the case.

At least, in my opinion.

Mainly I want to focus on those relatively early days with this post, to highlight Tim's initial(-ish) feelings towards his heroes, and touch on the point at which they really begin to change. This turned into a very long post, though. Brevity is beyond my skill, so grab snacks and water lol. Transcripts for each image will be posted at the very end under the cut.

So, the two storylines I want to cover are "Rite of Passage," which is rolls into "Identity Crisis." (NOT to be confused with the major crossover event "Identity Crisis™" which came years later, and is where Jack Drake dies.... But it sure is an interesting coincidence that Tim deals with the loss of each parent in two similarly named stories!) These take place before Tim is even Robin, and I'll be considering them as one arc for this post.

Detective Comics vol. 1 #618 (July, 1990) -- Pages 1 & 2

"When Gotham needed him, he was there. When the Batman needed him, he was there. He was a hero."

"One day, I'll be as good as Jason. One day I'll wear the suit."

To start off, we have this opening from "Rite of Passage." Tim is still in training here, mainly helping Bruce with minor stuff from the cave. His parents are off traveling, alive and well as of these next few pages. He's still bright-eyed and full of wonder. An extraordinarily weird but ultimately innocent kid.

So his view on Jason is positive and fairly simple: a hero, and someone to look up to as Robin. Clearly, Tim here doesn't think Jason was deficient in his role, either as a protector of Gotham or as Batman's trusted partner.

Moreover, Tim already held Dick in very high regard because he was amazingly skilled before he became Robin. To Tim, that's not something he'll ever be able to achieve. Meanwhile, Jason wasn't like that. He was a regular kid without crazy acrobatic training since practically birth. Yet he still went on to be a hero—which is obviously motivational for Tim who finds himself in similar shoes.

It's true that Tim only ever knew or thought of Jason as Robin, and idolized him in that regard. But that's kind of all that mattered to him at that point, because he was this kid who was utterly star-struck by his heroes. Even if he's technically aware of their shortcomings as people, it's overshadowed by the hero-worship.

It was kind of the same with Bruce as Batman at first. (Which was still enough for Tim to risk life and limb to help his beloved hero, before Bruce even knew his name.) Dick was the only one Tim had any sort of "personal" relationship with beforehand, so there is an extra level of attachment—and hence why it was the nidus for his obsession with Batman. Yet even then, it wasn't like he actually knew anything about Dick as a person until later. Until then, Tim's ideas of him were all he had, too. With Jason, Tim just didn't get to know him at any point before his return (oof), apart from what he heard over the years secondhand (also oof).

Ultimately, it's the loss of innocence—along with the ricocheting bullet that is the unresolved guilt of those around him—that begins to change Tim's perception. Not just of Jason, but of things in general.

Batman vol. 1 #455 (Oct., 1990) -- Page 13

"I know why they do it now. Why they put on the suits, and the masks, and go out into the night. They're angry, they're full of rage. They want to hit back."

Losing his mother was a major shift for Tim, obviously. This is right after the previous storyline, and Tim's had the worst week or two of his life (so far). His monologue here is a reference to what happened to both Dick and Jason. The unbearable pain of loss, the rage masking the grief underneath. And importantly, that he feels both of them were justified in their anger. (And Bruce too, indirectly.)

The major theme of the aptly named "Identity Crisis" is to mirror aspects of Dick and Jason and Tim's lives—to show how they converged onto the same tragic road. It's something that Tim notices early in the story, and was frightened by. Now, horrifically, it's become a part of him as well. His parents are gone, and he was entirely helpless to do anything about it. Dick was the same way, Jason was the same way. The cycle is repeated.

In particular, the part about him wanting to go to Haiti for revenge—for his mother—sort of struck me as being an intentional parallel to Jason and Ethiopia. It's a bit of a stretch, especially in isolation, so others may see it differently (e.g. the angry ramblings of a grieving child that does sound like something anyone might say). But it always stuck out to me because of how much Tim is compared directly to Jason in this arc. More on that below.

It's not something I can really give an accurate feel of because it's a lot of subtle things that begin to add up, so I'd encourage folks to read this arc themselves to see what I mean. (Or maybe you'll still disagree which is fine too lol.) Again, many things are in reference to both Dick and Jason in relation to Tim, but it's weighted more on Jason's side.

Batman vol. 1 #455 (Oct., 1990) -- Page 18

"You think my anger will boil over, the way Jason's did. I can assure you, it won't!"

Tim's grief has begun to pull away the veil of idealism that enshrouded his heroes in his mind. It doesn't apply only to Jason, but to the rest of them. Plus add the fact that Tim's keenly aware that he's being managed, even if the adults around him are careful to not outright say certain things. He still knows.

Bruce, Dick, and Alfred are all worried about Tim potentially turning into "another Jason." They (and mainly Bruce) caution Tim to not ignore his emotions, but they're still concerned that he may be overly eager to prove himself in order to cope, and could get hurt or killed as a result. While they aren't wrong for their caution—especially at how unsettlingly similar all the circumstances are—they aren't very subtle about the elephant in the room.

Imagine how that would affect Tim's perception of his predecessor, especially when he's in the midst of a traumatic event he hasn't had time to fully process. The negative association is pretty much inevitable.

Tim's known from day one that he's walking in Jason's shadow, and now it's become inescapable. Tim went from seeing Jason as a goal to reach, to feeling that unless he surpasses him, he wasn't going to be taken seriously by anyone. However, as of this arc, Tim doesn't even fully come to that point yet.

Batman vol. 1 #456 (Nov., 1990) -- Pages 14 & 15

"Drop-outs don't make it. And dead heroes are no use to anyone!"

It's really easy to take away "Tim totally thought Jason got himself killed" as the main thing here, but I think that's missing the forest for the trees.

First some context: Bruce has gone out on a mission to get Scarecrow, and expressly forbade Tim from doing any shenanigans. Meanwhile, Tim is grappling with wanting to prove himself and trying to help Bruce from the cave, all while trying to deal with his emotions. At some point, he falls asleep and ends up having like... exhaustion-grief hallucinations of Dick!Robin and Jason!Robin who confusingly caution yet encourage him. The main theme of this part is facing your fears.

Depending on how you want to interpret the intent of Jason's dialogue here, you could go several ways with it. Ranging from "writer's feelings towards Jason" to "a peek into Tim's mind as his fears manifest as visions of his heroes" or some mixture thereof.

Though Tim argues with Bruce that Batman needs a Robin, we're shown that Tim is understandably scared of joining Batman's "war." He's still not willing to let Bruce go it alone, though, and that's something he feels more strongly than his fear.

Meanwhile, hallucination!Jason's warnings are a lamentation of what happened to him in a way, but it actually exactly describes Tim's current situation even more so. Unlike Jason, Tim is under-trained, under-experienced, doesn't even have a suit of his own yet. But like Jason, he can't sit by and do nothing while someone he cares about is in danger. Tim knows that if he goes out there, he will probably get himself killed, and it will be his own fault. So he's about to disobey Batman's orders, and fly right into danger. If that got Jason killed, then Tim—who is in a way worse position experience-wise—has every chance of ending up the same.

Like... it's about Jason, but it's also about Tim. It's Tim's worst fears made manifest, via the representation of why he is even here in the first place (Jason's death).

That's my theory anyway, but perhaps this is an overly charitable reading of this scene on my end. (Not that I think that makes me wrong lol.) However given that Grant wrote both parts of this arc, and the beginning of which is especially favorable towards Jason, it certainly is something to ponder. I have a lot of thoughts on it I can't expand on here tbh but perhaps that'll be another post.

Anyway, returning to the point of the similarities vs differences between Tim and Jason: since this is the arc that solidified Tim as the next Robin in comic continuity, it makes sense that the writers really pushed the comparisons between the two of them, specifically. (Even though Dick was pretty similar, as going against Batman's orders is the Robin thing to do, it's not his shoes Tim is directly filling.) So making Tim's "debut" story arc mirror Jason's "swansong" is an obvious narrative choice.

To drive home the parallels, I wanted to include this panel from just a few pages prior to the "daydream":

Batman vol. 1 #456 (Nov., 1990) -- Page 9

"The suit is magic."

That so distressingly close to Jason's famous "being Robin gives me magic" line (Batman #385, page 6). Given all the previous context, it's hard for me to just dismiss it as pure coincidence. Even if it is, the point still stands. Tim is shown having the some of the same heartbreakingly naive views as Jason once did, right in front of Jason's memorial, just as he's about to go and run off into the night against orders.

I think that speaks for itself. There's a lot to take away from it, if you so choose. Especially given the context of that specific Jason arc.

Alright, back to the main course:

So in the end, Tim actually goes out in civvies and a ski mask because if he fails, then at least he wouldn't bring shame to Robin's legacy™. When he gets fear gassed saving Batman, it's once again both Dick and Jason that he hallucinates encouraging him to push past his fear. (Shout out to the fact that he's literally more afraid of tarnishing the legacy of Batman & Robin than he is of dying.... I'm sure this will not be a recurring thing for him in the future.)

Tim's ideology is shown to be similar to Jason's, and the actions Tim ultimately takes are similar to Jason's... but the outcome is different. And it really isn't just "Tim succeeded where Jason failed." At least, that's not what I took away from this. Rather, Tim had no reason to succeed any more than he had to fail, just that he did. Luck combined with caution because he knew what happened to his predecessor, and the fact that Batman was there to finish the job all made the difference.

You could say (and I know some will) that it's just classic Jason character assassination and the writers trying to implore readers that this new kid is different we promise pls don't hate us look how much better he is! But in this case, that feels like it undermines the whole point of this story. It doesn't fit with what the characters actually say.

Thus, we return to the question of how Tim felt towards his predecessor. And the answer is different from where we started, because Tim is different. Not that different though. Because even though at this point Tim—like all the adults around him—has probably attributed Jason "going off on his own" being what led to his death, Tim still thought of him as a hero to look up to. It's about Robin, first and foremost, yes. But Tim is fully aware of the people who made that suit mean what it does, because it's all intertwined.

Batman vol. 1 #457 (Dec., 1990) -- Page 20

"I mean--Dick made it into a symbol the whole world knows. Jason gave his life for it."

Even further, Tim thinks of it in terms of Jason having given his life for what he believed in, for the legacy that now falls to Tim. There's a sense of gravitas there. He's afraid of failing both the Robins who came before him.

Ultimately do I think Tim adored and loved Jason on the same level as Dick or something? No. It's not comparable. (Dick was like part of some of Tim's earliest memories and everything! They have a really unique bond ok.) Yet Tim was also far from thinking poorly of Jason so early on. Frankly, it seems that Tim thought of Jason as a noble hero and a cautionary tale. Yes he took risks and sometimes went too far, generally stuff that Tim doesn't want to repeat and all that. At the same time, Tim still saw him as someone whose legacy and memory was worth honoring.

It's complicated, which is why I like it so much—because it feels real. Having conflicting feelings towards someone is... so human. Especially someone you never got to know, yet who plays such an integral role in your life via the shadow of their death. How can you feel anything but complicated towards them?

It has to be said that, yes, Tim's views—even before Jason's return—change over the years. He becomes more jaded as a person and is surrounded by people who are even more jaded than him... and who often mention Jason as the "failed Robin." It's something that's hung over Tim's head all the damn time. The curse of the Robin mantle.

So it shouldn't come as a surprise that Tim's idea of him becomes more akin to "sounds like a skill issue" as the years go by. All bets are off after Jason's return, and the Titans Tower Incident™. At that point it's firmly "I am better than you, loser" lmao.

And... that's all without getting too into things like authorial intent and general "moods" of different DC writers towards Jason at a given point. Or retcons that played a role in his characterization and how other characters talk about him, depending on what "era" you're reading. That's way beyond the scope of this post though!

TLDR; even though young Tim Drake was obsessed with Dick Grayson as Robin, he still looked up to Jason Todd as well. He didn't think of Jason as a cringefail loser until later. :)

(image dialogue transcripts under cut ↓)

Dialogue Transcript for Image 1 (Detective Comics vol. 1 #618 -- Page 1):

Narration box (Tim): When Gotham needed him, he was there. When the Batman needed him, he was there. He was a hero.

Dialogue Transcript for Image 2 (Detective Comics vol. 1 #618 -- Page 2):

(Scene continued from previous page)

Narration box: But he was nothing special, really. Just a boy, who was taught--trained--brought to his full potential by someone who knew how. Just a boy... like me. I know I can do it. I know I can. One day I'll be as good as Jason. One day I'll wear the suit. One day I'll be a hero.

Dialogue Transcript for Image 3 (Batman vol. 1 #455 -- Page 13):

Tim: I hate him! I hate him! I know why they do it now. Why they put on the suits, and the masks, and go out into the night. They're angry. Full of rage. They want to hit back. They want to fill the hole that's burning inside them.

Bruce: There's more to it than that, son. Much more.

Tim: I know. It's just--I feel--like going to Haiti myself and strangling that creep with my bare hands!

Bruce: The Obeah Man will spend the rest of his life in a prison hospital. He's history. Forget him! But don't fight against your anger. It's natural. Accept it. Live with it. One day it'll be your friend.

Dialogue Transcript for Image 4 (Batman vol. 1 #455 -- Panels from page 18):

Tim: Because you think my mother's death has upset me too much. Well, it did. But I've taken your words to heart. I can cope. You think my anger will boil over, the way Jason's did. I can assure you, it won't. But that doesn't make any difference, does it? Why can't you have a little faith in me?

Dialogue Transcript for Image 5 (Batman vol. 1 #456 -- Page 14):

Narration box (Tim): Blast it! My head's starting to swim. I'm about ready to give up. I almost wish I'd never heard of Batman and Robin!

Vision Dick: Heroes never give up, Tim.

Vision Jason: You know that.

Tim: Dick--! Jason Todd!

Vision Dick: You're training to fight in a war, Tim. It'll last all your life. No matter what, you have to go on fighting.

Vision Jason: Drop-outs don't make it. And dead heroes are no use to anyone! I thought I knew better than Batman. I thought I could run before I could walk. I killed myself, Tim. Because I couldn't wait. Because I couldn't think it through.

Dialogue Transcript for Image 6 (Batman vol. 1 #456 -- Page 15):

(Scene continued from previous page)

Vision Dick: Think, Tim. Concentrate!

Vision Jason: You can do it.

Both: You can do it!

Tim, waking up: What--? Robin...?

Narration box (Tim): I must have been daydreaming. They're right, though. There's a solution to everything. I can find it! So here I go again... Whim. Caprice. Doing something without forethought.

Dialogue Transcript for Image 7 (Batman vol. 1 #456 -- Panel from page 9):

Narration box (Tim): The suit is magic. It gives you power. It hides your weakness. It makes you give it everything you've got. It makes you a hero. If only I could!

Dialogue Transcript for Image 8 (Batman vol. 1 #457 -- Page 20):

Bruce: Are you afraid of it?

Tim: No. It isn't fear. It's more... the suit carries so much history. I mean--Dick made it into a symbol the whole world knows. Jason gave his life for it. Failing them--what they fought so hard to build--that's what worries me!

Bruce: I appreciate that, Tim. That costume weighs a whole lot more than any symbol should... and I'd be failing you if I expected you to bear that weight. So... let me know what you think.

Narration box: A mask has a double edged, he said. It hides your own anxiety as it strikes fear into your enemy.

[yuseirra]

Supplemental interpretation of Mizi’s character (Scene-by-scene breakdown of the new comic)

This post is a follow-up to the previous analysis I wrote last time! I think reading this will help things make more sense~

It's really, really intriguing to interpret characters with layers to them. I really enjoy doing that!

Before we begin, when doing character interpretation or psychological analysis, here’s a helpful tip—

It’s important to pay attention not just to how the character evaluates themselves, but also to how other characters react to them.

For example, if someone has a tendency toward self-loathing or self-deprecation, what they say about themselves might not be all that accurate—even if they’re the ones saying it. That’s why we need to keep in mind that a person’s self-evaluation isn’t always something we can fully trust.

Sure, sometimes crucial aspects of a character’s inner world only come out through their self-perception—but often, it’s the people closest to them, their overall behavior, and how others view them that end up giving a clearer, more fair assessment.

You know those moments. Like when a hero saves tons of people but still says, “I couldn’t do enough. I’m not good enough…” Or the opposite—when someone hurts a bunch of innocent people and says, “They had it coming. I was just doing what was right!”

So while a character’s internal monologue matters, we also need to take a step back and look at what they’ve actually done—their past actions, and how others respond to them—if we want to get a fuller, more accurate picture.

At the same time, we really need to factor in the situation they’re in. The emotional pressure someone feels when they’re in a stable and happy state is very different from the kind of feelings that come out when they’re in a chaotic, extreme state. That difference totally affects interpretation.

So overall, it’s about putting all of that together and looking at the full picture.

And that’s exactly why this new Alien stage comic is such a great one to analyze...

Of course, my interpretation is still subjective, and I could totally be wrong! But this is a topic I really care about, and I genuinely enjoy digging into this kind of stuff. It’s something I take seriously.

I feel pretty confident in my ability to break down complex psychological layers. I might be biased toward interpreting people positively, but in this case, I think I’m reading it well.

So! Picking up from the last post—let’s break things down scene by scene.

Here’s the situation:

Mizi had rushed onto the Blink Gone stage to try and save Till. But Till ends up dying right in front of her eyes. Mizi is devastated—mentally falling apart while staring at Till’s blood on her hands.

Then she sees a hallucination of Sua.

Sua is someone Mizi couldn’t save either—and she’s also the person who mattered most to Mizi. So this whole moment overlaps with the memory of Sua’s death.

But then Mizi suddenly thinks something strange:

“Feel like a waste?”

That word—“waste” (in the original Korean: 아깝다)—is super important. Depending on how you interpret it, it could completely change how you see Mizi.

So here’s where it gets interesting:

From a reader’s perspective, Mizi saying “what a waste” to herself could be taken as: “Ugh, another useful pawn gone. Shame—I’d been grooming that one for a while.” Basically implying that Mizi is cold and calculating, and everything we’ve seen of her so far was just an act.

But if you look into it a bit more, that interpretation doesn’t really hold up.

If that were the case, Mizi wouldn’t be crying so hard, crushed by grief, and hallucinating dead loved ones. Even if she felt some practical loss, she wouldn’t be emotionally wrecked like this. She wouldn’t be experiencing this level of human sadness and pain.

So Mizi’s emotional reaction to the situation is just as important as what she says. People don’t think the same way when they’re in a stable state vs. when they’re emotionally overwhelmed—it wouldn’t be fair to judge both from the same standard.

Mizi might be judging herself, thinking: “I was just using people, wasn’t I…” but if you look at what she actually did—her behavior—it doesn’t line up with that harsh self-judgment.

And we can get a better idea of what Mizi really meant by “waste” through the next scene, where she gets confronted by that guy who hits her.

He calls her “cunning,” saying boys and girls can’t be real friends—and accuses her of pretending not to know that Till liked her, just so she could keep being close with him.

What the boy is saying is basically, “You’re stringing him along. You know how he feels, but you’re acting clueless. You’re fake.”

While saying it "must be nice," being her, pretending to be sweet and all innocent, getting people to love her, he slaps her across the face. (Just before this, he remarks on how guys and girls always end up “mating,” and Mizi rightfully calls it kind of gross.)

Now here’s where Mizi’s immediate reaction matters:

She says sorry to the boy who just slapped her face and calls her disgusting and filthy.

She tells him, “I’m sorry for upsetting you”—but she’s also confused, like, “What exactly did I do wrong? I don’t get it.”

Then she says again:

“It’s a shame.” (in English, "It's a shame" / in Korean, again, 아깝다< it's the same word in the original KR version)

What’s behind that, you may wonder:

It is that Mizi tried. She genuinely made the effort to be kind to everyone. When there were things she couldn’t respond to or reciprocate, she just smiled and played it nice. To her, that was her way of being considerate. She really put in effort.

So from her perspective, the fact that her kindness didn’t work here—that it hurt someone instead—that’s what feels like “a waste.” and "a shame" It’s like:

“If you’d stayed like the others— believing I really was to be completely innocent, not knowing anything—it would’ve been easier between us. But now I’ve ended up hurting you. That sucks. That’s a loss for both of us.”

Her saying “I don’t know what I did wrong” —it’s that she really believed she was doing her best. So if that’s still seen as manipulative or “fake,” it just invalidates all the effort she put in.

She’s thinking:

“But I tried! I acted that way to be thoughtful! Everyone was happier that way. I thought no one would get hurt if I just smiled and played along. But now this guy’s saying I’m two-faced?”

“Then… what was I supposed to do instead? I don’t get it. This really hurts.”

That’s Mizi’s heart there at that scene. The way she’s been acting—that’s a core part of her identity, but it wasn't acknowledged and it gave her pain.

So she runs away crying.

And from this point, Mizi starts to have serious doubts about the way she’s always acted.

She ends up telling Sua about what happened—because she’s upset. She just needed to talk to her closest friend about it.

But even then, Mizi says stuff like, “I'm sure I did something wrong,” and “He’s not a bad person, really.”

Part of her really believes that, and part of her wants to believe that.

She wants to think that maybe, if she had handled it differently, the relationship could’ve stayed okay.

So she tries to focus on the good things in life to pick herself back up, saying stuff like: “And right now, I’m just happy because I’m with you, Sua. I'm sooo happy!”

But Sua’s not in the same emotional place. Because of what she’s been through, she's distressed. Moreover, she’s not the type to force herself to act cheerful just to lift the mood.

So Sua replies: “I’m not really happy. (...) You don't get dragged around like me.” And then adds: “Must be nice(being you) right?”

She doesn’t join in Mizi’s effort to stay upbeat. Instead, she takes Mizi's efforts as something 100% genuine, that Mizi "has it nice"

The reason Mizi reacts so strongly to that—“Must be nice”—is because she’s not. Not at all. Her head is a mess, her heart’s a mess, and for Sua to not see that—to not notice how much effort she’s been putting into staying cheerful—makes her feel overwhelmed with anger and sadness, even just for a moment. Moreover, this line also brought her back to that time when that boy earlier had called her out for being "manipulative" and supposedly having her way with people acting innocent because it happened to be phrased the same way.

It’s like… she’d really hoped Sua would understand her. And in that moment, they just didn’t connect. That’s where the despair came from. Mizi really treasures Sua, but even Sua didn’t notice how hard she’s been working to stay bright. Instead, she just assumed Mizi was feeling carefree and smiling for real. So Mizi snapped.

But then right after that moment, when she hits Sua out of that emotional outburst, she’s hit with the crushing thought that she just did to Sua what that boy who slapped her did. And that fills her with intense self-hatred. What’s wrong with me? I shouldn’t have done that… She starts beating herself up inside.

Their facial expressions in that scene are pretty intense and eerie… but emotionally, that’s what’s going on.

After that, Mizi starts to believe—Maybe I really am as manipulative as that boy said I was.

And then, what she does next is go find Till. This is something really worth paying attention to.

If Mizi actually had the intention of using Till, then she would've kept pretending she didn’t know anything, acting all innocent.

But instead, she goes straight to him and says it plainly:

“Till, you know the one I love the most in the world is Sua, right? Is it that hard to not like me?”

Mizi really does care about Till. Maybe not in the same way as she does for Sua, but as a friend, she cares deeply. So she thinks she needs to be honest with him. She tells him—I can’t give you what you want. Even if you love me, I love Sua. So wouldn’t it be better for you to not to love me?

Why? Because that boy had called her manipulative for keeping her feelings hidden. And now she’s scared—If I keep pretending nothing’s wrong and just act like a normal friend, maybe Till will end up feeling betrayed too. She wants to prevent that. If she didn’t care about Till, she wouldn’t even bother.

And the thing is—Till already knew. He knew Mizi had feelings for Sua. (Side note: yup, I called this in my earlier analysis!) So Mizi was never leading Till on or anything; he just liked Mizi because that's how he felt about her.

So in a way, Mizi and Till have a pretty healthy relationship—they both know what’s going on between each other, and they acknowledge it. But Mizi’s head is all tangled up from what that boy said, and it’s making her question everything. Was I just using Till this whole time?

When she tells Till that she loves Sua, and he says he still likes her, Mizi asks him:

“Why do you like me so much, anyway?”

Because she doesn’t believe she can give anything back. She doesn’t think she can return his feelings… even though Mizi, just by being herself, is already a light in Till’s life—she just doesn’t realize it.

Till, so sincerely, just says, “Because… you’re pretty…” He’s simply being honest about how he sees her. But for Mizi, that ends up reinforcing all the wrong thoughts.

Because the part of her that worked so hard to be cheerful and sweet—what she now sees as “fake”—is exactly what Till is saying he likes. So she thinks, He’s rejecting this honest version of me. Even he loved the version of me that pretended to be pure and happy. If I want him to be happy, I have to keep pretending. That’s what everyone wants from me. I guess I have to live my whole life putting on this mask, tricking people...

And that’s why she lets out that hollow laugh.

Then she ends up viewing all her past efforts—being kind to people, staying cheerful—as nothing more than:

“I did all of that for myself. Just so I could survive. I used everyone.”

But that’s completely the opposite of the truth. She actually put up that cute and cheerful energy for everyone around her.

If everything she did at Anakt Garden—living with the other kids from a young age—was really just her cold calculation to survive, then she wouldn’t be hurting this much now over Till, over Sua, or anything else.

If it was all just part of some scheme she set up, she’d be smirking right now going, “It all went according to plan. What idiots.”

But instead, Mizi’s in a place where she’s seeing hallucinations, hating herself so much she’s breaking down.

She’s thinking, Maybe everything I’ve done was just for me. Maybe I’m selfish. And she’s lashing herself with those thoughts. That’s how much she hates who she thinks she is.

But the truth is—Mizi really did want everyone to survive. Till, Sua, Ivan, Hyuna—all of them were precious to her. That’s why when Luka provoked her with Sua, she lost control and didn't care about the whole contest. If she only cared about winning or surviving, she wouldn’t have been furious about it, she wouldn’t have snapped like that.

Mizi cares and has a big heart. That's why she broke down when Sua died. That’s why she looked so relieved and lit up when Till reached out to her in the Blink Gone Stage, That's why and how she risked her life to fire a gun and save Hyuna, while nearly having gotten hit by a bullet herself. What really took place just before this comic was that Mizi couldn't bear to leave Till behind, so she snuck back into the alien stage show and held out her hand to him. She was nearly killed herself, and had barely escaped with her life, and yet, she returned to that stage for someone else's. That's so far from taking advantage of others, it's a choice she wouldn't ever have made if everything she did was just to survive.

Mizi using others for her own ends? If that really were to be the case, then when Hyuna saved her, she wouldn’t have joined the resistance or risked going back to the stage to help the other children.

She RISKS her life to save others, and actively jumps in to help. That's what's consistent about her, and it's what describes her as a person.

If she had really just been using the other kids, they all wouldn’t care about her so much. They wouldn’t try to protect her the way they do.

Mizi is devastated right now because nothing turned out the way she wanted. She couldn’t save anyone. And thinking that it’s all her fault—thinking she failed to save them—feels like a punishment she deserves. This is how and why her thoughts are spiraling this way in this particular comic.

[oishitea]

Random QL Superlatives 2024

Got tagged by @baseballmomlesbiandad and yeah, I definitely have been wanting to do one of these, so let's do it before the year is out!

There were so many shows that happened this year, I literally had to make a list by scrolling through mass post editor to see what I had watched. I cannot keep time straight (or my watching habits lol)

Favorite New BL Pairing

TopMick

I think several people can agree with me, they swooped into this last quarter totally unknown and Every You, Every Me stole all of our hearts. As SunDol, PinFirst, XNamping, BlueSian, and PunInn???? All of those???? And both of them dealt with different flavors of queer men (and gender expression) so well. I would gladly be a third for XNamping or BlueSian in the fic of my dreams - I was drooling over each of them (BlueSian, you horny bitches, you made me feral like nothing else 🥵🫣). Namping especially, baby, you live in my heart forever. Honorable mention to Fiat Patchata, boy I've missed you! The Gifted lover in me will always miss my son Korn and Fiat was fantastic as him, and I loved seeing his characters here too.

Fave Guy Who Was In Everything

Title Kirati

I only watched Wandee Goodday, Kidnap The Series, and Pluto The Series with him in it, but he also was in We Are, Ploy's Yearbook, and Perfect 10 Liners. His 2024 schedule was booked! And for good reason. He's showing a fair amount of versatility and I have enjoyed every character he's gotten to play so far. I chose Blue to show though, because as someone on the ace spectrum, his character being an understanding partner to an asexual character meant so much to me. Plakao deserved it, and we were not disappointed.

Top-tier Crossdressing

P'Jessy/Jessie

The MomentTM, Miss Thang, Star of the Year, my pookie, sweetheart #1!!!!!!!!! We need her back. Just one chance???? I am blushing and giggling so hard as I write this asdlfkjclbndfldkfsdljd 🥰❤️💕😘😍💞💖💘

Most Comforting Watches

1000 Years Old/Monster Next Door

WeTV really put out some of the cutest couples (Caged Again is getting everyone on board hehe) and both PunYoh and GodDiew are so special to me. Let's give it up for the weakest vampire Pun and his collection of umbrellas, and his enduring love for Yoh, a silly boy obsessed with aliens. Big win for autism. Meanwhile, we have one of the sweetest romances by way of God and Diew learning how to communicate with each other and enjoy who the other person is despite vast differences in their personalities. Save that turtle though.

Best to Worst Grandma Awards

Jack's Ama - Jack & Joker: U Steal My Heart/ Ai-Oon and Oab-Oom's Yaai - Pluto The Series

Ama - I wish she'd adopt me. She is so understanding, hard-working, patient, supportive, and badass. A few months with her and my life would be sorted. And I'd do anything for her in return.

Yaai - Waste of a caretaker. It took me so long to even find a gif. I'm sending you back to the Laws of Attraction universe where you support your puppy dog grandson and his insane lawyer boyfriend, and play dress-up with Silvy Pavida Maya.

Gift Show of the Year

Meet You At The Blossom

UNCENSORED CHINESE BL IS OFFICIALLY IN!!!!! Boy was this whole thing fun. The hype beforehand, seeing the censors attempt to make it flop and getting the opposite effect, and getting one of the most unhinged shows for our viewing pleasure. Mercenary malewife x jingle bells for braincells, collarbones and torture, aphrodisiac sex, toxic yaoi, murder and betrayal, several kisses, and a happy ending!!!!! Sign me the fuck up a million times. Personal thanks to @guzhufuren for doing all the PR, where is your paycheck?

Unexpected Topic of the Year: Euthanasia

Spare Me Your Mercy/Every You, Every Me (implied)

I'm not here to really discuss the subject itself or which show did a better job with it, especially since Every You, Every Me left that factor up to interpretation (I'm including it anyway, even if it wasn't intended). What I appreciated in both shows was the empathy they showed toward the people whose conditions toward the end of their lives left them wanting to choose for themselves how things would end, and they showed loved ones around them supporting their decisions. I'm not an older queer who was around for most things regarding the HIV/AIDS pandemic, but the use of queer characters for these stories does hit a particular chord in regards to how important respecting the choices of the dying and their supporting circle should be.

Lookalikes?

Toh - Secret Crush On You/Kluer - This Love Has No Long Beans

Seng and Aon should do a show together as brothers. I am constantly on my actors-who-should-play-brothers agenda (ask @thisautistic), and they're on it. I could've added a lot more here, but I'm currently watching Secret Crush On You for the first time and immediately went 🫵 when I saw Toh. Also both of these boys are so precious to me.

Prettiest Mindfuck

Uranus 2324

I waited to receive this film for months and months and months after it was announced and then released and boy did I RECEIVE. FreenBecky really get to show off their chops in this. I loved how it straddled the line between sci-fi and psychological thriller on top of the sapphic romance. Kath and Lin are both fantastic characters in every single storyline. I especially enjoyed the part where they have guns with a bonus of Lin getting a knife. When do they get their action gl?

My wishes for 2025 in no particular order:

GIVE MEN MORE LONG HAIR. Namping and Sian were fantastic, Top Piyawat really gave us so much. I also found out that Sailub Hemmawich used to have long hair and I am so upset it's short now!!!!

More butches in GLs. Short-haired ones even. Jeab Lalana, thank you for existing; I am so excited for 3 Minutes 2 Love.

Give Papang a lead BL role! I'm going to apologize to all the PapangPodd girlies now, while it's great that they're a secondary couple, I just wanna finish the business he had with Pepper Phanuroj in Dangerous Romance. Pepper deserves a lead BL role as well! I'm excited with whatever is going on between him and JJ Chayakorn in The Heart Killers, and hell JJ can join Papang and Pepper. If GMMTV can come through on more polyamory like they're hinting at in Pluto, then we should have this. PapangPepperJJ 2025? Wow. I had some opinions there.

On that note, more polyamory in general

Boun's vampire show???? Is it still happening????? Pretty please????? Also can they get Boss Chaikamon to stay in it somehow? 🥺

All the Chinese QLs. Drown me in them until they absolutely take over my life

In my wildest dreams Oreo Puwanai gets out from Wabi Sabi and joins Yacht at GMMTV so we get the WaanTul story continuation I need desperately

I know everyone is saying this but: COOHEART ADULT ROLE 2025!!!!!! POR FAVOOORRRRR. DÁLE UN PROYECTO ADULTO 😤

Get my man Peter Knight back on my screen. Just wave a scene of him being a dj at a bar or something to get him interested, idc

Dancer BL! Like I previously mentioned in a post about Fiat, we have enough dancer boys to put in the bracket for this!

If I already mentioned you, considered yourself tagged (if you wanna). Also tagging: @sunshinesanctuary @loveable-sea-lemon @firstkant @writerwithoutsound @shubaka @benkaben @scarefox @dommingjeffsatur @chaotic-aro-incarnate @poetry-protest-pornography

[v0idund3rth3v3il]

https://www.reddit.com/r/progressive_islam/s/1401QvzC6v

These are not my words, please use the link if you want to see the author.

Explanation to verse 7:81 or the "Anti-gay" verse.

People often bring up verse 7:81 with out any context to show why the Quran forbids gay people and thinks that gay sex is haram, I'm here to give the full context and show why their wrong.

For those who don't know, verse 7:81 say's something like "Indeed, you approach men with desire, instead of women. Rather, you are a transgressing people." Which sounds bad alone until you actually take into full context what it means.

The verse is talking about the village of Lot who were actively RAPING men, not just having sex with them (a major problem in the world back then as both the Romans and Greeks were known to rape other males). As in their lust had become so overwhelming that women weren't enough anymore, they had to attack visitors (a big no no in Islamic culture) and rape them even though they where guys. The people of Lot where so depraved that they literally tried to rape angels before being wiped out so it's a warning against the depravity of rape instead of homosexuality in general as no where in the Quran, unlike the bible, does it say anything against gay sex.

The verse literally right before it say's something like (plenty of translations but roughly) "How do you commit such a horrible that NO ONE/THING BEFORE YOU HAVE COMMITTED". This can't mean homosexuality as we know homosexuality in animals does exist and homosexuality was very well known to just about every person on the planet as shocker, gay people have always existed. Historically speaking, the Code of Hammurabi , which ordered society in most of the Tigris-Euphrates Valley for more than a thousand years, has nothing to say about homosexuality. The laws of Eshunna and Egypt are also silent on the subject with us knowing that there were ancient Egyptian gay couples including a Pharaoh who was more then likely bi. The Hittites forbade father-son relations, but that was part of a general rule against incest. The Assyrians thought it shameful for a man to repeatedly offer himself to other men, and also prohibited men from raping males of the same social class, but all other male-male sexual relations were ignored. These are all states that were around centuries before Sodom and Gomorrah were apparently destroyed destroyed. The much more rational explanation would be they made an entire society based on rape of men and other "abominations" to a point where they would kick people out for wanting to stay "pure" (line 7:82), something that no group of people before them have done.

Now people will often say "if it's bad raping man then it's ok if we rape woman right?" well no. This is because when you take it with the previous verse and the verse after it, it's clear that these people wanted the pleasure of doing something that no other group of people had ever done which was the mass rape/normalization of rape of men. It's absolutely horrible but the rape of women was a lot more normalized back than and so wouldn't fit with the previous line of them doing something that no group of people/creatures had ever done before. That also explains why they didn't except Lot's daughter (which could be interpreted as him trying to save them because the angels didn't take to kindly to wanting to be raped) as they got their rocks off by doing what no other people had ever done which was to mass rape men, not women which again, is also disgusting but a lot more normal back then.

To go more into Islamic history courtesy of u/cold-blue, The grand mufti of the Abbasid caliphate in the mid-9th century, Yahya ibn Aktham, was a known homosexual, and viewed a few verses through the gender/sexuality lens.

One of them was the verse where Allah says He prepares males for some, females for others, and mixes the males and females. I’ve read that ibn Aktham once said that this verse confused people because it alludes to sexual preferences. He also said that the heavenly cupbearers mentioned in the Quran are sexual rewards like the houris. (Whether or not homosexuality is allowed in Jannah was debated, and some came to the conclusion that it is, and the only reason it isn’t in this life is because the rectum is dirty.)

The Ottoman empire, the last caliphate of the Muslim world, not only didn't care about gay people (unlike the Europeans) but actually had art depicting it.

Another is al-Razi. While he didn’t outright say that homosexuality is allowed, he allowed gay couples to be together sexually so long as they didn’t have anal sex. He was concerned with homosexual men committing suicide over their innate feelings and said that if there is risk of that, and the man cannot change himself from homosexual to heterosexual/survive in an opposite-sex marriage, he may be with his beloved (a man) so long as he does not transgress the limits (in his opinion, anal sex).

One of the transmitters of the Quranic variants we have today (of which Warsh and Hafs are two) was a man named al-Kisa’i, who was also a known homosexual. So one of the seven qira’ats came from a gay man.

There was another man ALSO named al-Kisa’i, who was a historian in 1100 CE, and he said in his Stories of the Prophets (Qiṣaṣ al-'Anbiyā') that the people of Lut were specifically MEN WITH WIVES who raped other men, not homosexual men, lining up with what we know historically.

And speaking even more so on the physical element, the male "gspot" is actual in the anus which even if you find gross, is a design of Allah and not a flaw. Why would he do that if homosexuality is a sin?

The reason homosexuality is so hated in the Islamic world is none other then the heretical Salafi and Wahhabi movements (actually considered heretics for most of the time they were around including their top scholars, not my opinion, and the only reason their not now is because of British) and because of Europeans as homosexual relationships were generally tolerated in pre-modern Islamic societies, and historical records suggest that these laws were invoked infrequently, mainly in cases of rape or other "exceptionally blatant infringement on public morals". Public attitudes toward homosexuality in the Muslim world underwent a marked negative change starting from the 19th century through the gradual spread of Islamic fundamentalist movements such as Salafism and Wahhabism, and the influence of the sexual notions and restrictive norms prevalent in Europe at the time: a number of Muslim-majority countries have retained criminal penalties for homosexual acts enacted under European colonial rule.

People often only bring up verse 7:81 and don't bring the verses directly previous or after it nor does it take into consideration the histography of their actions and the verse. It would be like me saying a book said "...kill all black people." but not elaborating and saying that the line previous to is says "These people were so horrible that they would regularly chant..." and the line after it is "I can't believe they would say/do something so disgusting." with the entire context of the book being that they would kick out anyone who didn't want to kill all black people. They only say's that the book said to kill all black people. It's very disingenuous to say the least.

To further prove my point, the word "sodomite" is often used to mean the rape of another person through the ass, not consensual sex between the two. If you google "sodomized" than you'll see rapists, not a loving consensual couple. Even the Arabic words for "sodomite" and a gay person is different as sodomite is literally translated into "lut" well a gay person is translated into "shakhs mithliu aljins".

To get more philosophical about it, sex is not some fetish which just develops in people, it is the most primal human desire that a person can have. So why would Allah make a group (there's homosexual animals as well) a certain way and then say not to follow the most basic desire they'll ever have right after wanting food and water but then say the rest of that group can follow that desire after they get married? People can control their desires until marriage as the Quran makes clear, they don't just never have sex. So why would it be any different for a gay couple? This is like saying that sex with it self is haram.

Finally, people often forget the fact that Allah is an all loving and all knowing being so why would he make certain people that he hates or want's other people to hate aka be "phobic" of when in the Quran it's made clear that we should be loving and affectionate? Now even if after all of this people still believe homosexuality is haram, Allah is said multiple time to be all loving, all understanding and all forgiving so as long they are good people and don't commit a truly horrible sin (shirk aka worship of other false gods, rape, murder, hurting others, you know, the classics) Allah will inevitably forgive them for giving into their most basic human desire especially if it's with a loving partner with in a marriage so why would anyone else have a problem with them?

I'm not gonna add a tl;dr because I worked waaay to hard on this for it be condensed into a few sentences and I really want people to read it and fully understand where it's coming from.

[meraki-yao]

Now I'm curious to know all the "candies" between Nick and Tay 👀 lol I don't ship them but I also find it interesting that some fans really ship real people together and gather evidence or proof of it. If its fine with you to share it pls do 🙏 but if not its also fine :)

Huh...

Actually, sure! I kinda wanted to share some of these at times but again I understand that rps is a complicated subject.

A couple of quick prefaces though:

1, If you’re uncomfortable with the subject, again, please don’t read under the post

2, I don’t have all the candies because I really just view them in passing, so I’m just gonna write/translate the ones I’ve seen, remember and find at least a logical speculation

3, I need to reiterate this in case my position in this gets misunderstood: Me writing about “candies” isn’t because these are MY opinion or things *I* found or *I* believe in them being evidence. I am just a translator and messenger.

4, (this one is gonna sound a little academic lol) Two things I realized when thinking about this “candy eating” culture is that Chinese people have a very difference understanding of platonic/romantic affection/relationships with the Western world, and that they look at the candies with rose-tinted glass. Chinese/Asian people are generally a lot less affectionate with their personal relationships, for example friends wouldn’t say “love you” to each other if they’re just friends, nor would they expand their friend group to the others easily or other stuff. And these people who look for candy go into their “investigation” already with the belief that “they are together”, everything remotely resembling a close relationship will automatically be interpreted as romantic. I thought about it a lot, and honestly among the “candies” I’ve seen, most of them are a matter of interpretation: yes those are things couples will do, but it wouldn’t be weird if friends did it too. So they’re not that seriously or up for further speculation. There is I think only one “candy” that I can’t quite say the same, which I will explain and elaborate on in this post. 

5, Please remember that the people who do this do it in good nature: something I didn’t make clear in my post yesterday, which is on me, is that the fans do want them to be together, but they’re not like… yandere level or something. If they’re just friends the fans won’t be upset or betrayed or anything, they just prefer to see them as romantic. They don’t mean any harm, and they don’t cause any harm because China is physically and digitally too far away for them to actually fuck shit up, and they understand the lines of parasocial relationships: those who met with Taylor during his China trip in December know to, and didn’t bring up this in front of him. They know where to draw the line, and whoever doesn’t and starts becoming a problem gets kicked out of the community. This is meant for fun.

6, Ok Future Meraki here, turns out, there’s a lot to translate, a lot more than I anticipated Jesus Christ and I do want to get this post how within today and make it a reasonable length, so I’m just gonna do two events and the one that I mentioned in 4. If yall want a part 2 let me know.

Ok with that being said, the main event under the cut:

In December they made a whole article about “candies” from December, and to quickly summarise (again noted that all of this is speculation, I didn’t and can’t fact check them, and I’m just a translator) (also this ended up way longer than I anticipated so for photo reference if you can please go to the link of the original article):

Academy Gala:

Nick and Taylor both attended the gala: Since the strike ended up to that point, the two times Nick attends a public event, Taylor’s there too (GQ men of the year and Academy Gala), and for both times he’s wearing Cartier’s Tank Must Watch (remember this watch, I’m gonna elaborate on it later because it is the only candy that even I can’t say it’s a matter of interpretation)

In various pictures of the night’s party that other people took, the boys can be seen together in the background

How the photography worked that night was magazine photographers wandered around the venue and randomly found people to take some relatively candid photos: so people who were walking/sitting/in any way sticking together would be photographed together. So best friends and married couples would be photographed together, which is what happened to Meryl Streep, Greta Gerwig, Saoirse Ronan, and Christopher Nolan, Cillian Murphy and their wives. With that logic, Taylor and Nick were caught by the photographer together TWICE, in clearly different places. Later Korean fans (with the same “candy-searching” mindset) read the time on Taylor’s watch in the photos: one was 8:30, one was 9:50. The implication is that they were together for at least that period of time (nearly 1.5 hours)

In both photos of the boys together, Nick’s elbow is…straight up leaning into Taylor's chest. In a photo with Kaia, Nick’s friend and co-star from Bottoms (Brittany), there’s visible space between Nick and Kaia but none between Nick and Taylor (… okay I’m gonna pop in with my own opinion on the latter one real quick: I really think that one is just Nick being a gentleman)  

During that night, Taylor re-posted an Instagram post from July onto Little Red Book: but the things is in the comment section of the original Instagram post, Taylor teasingly pretends to not know Nick; and according to the posting time and the time calculated in 3, Nick would have been watching him post that to Little Red Book.

Nick got a photo with Taylor’s friend Jay Ellis (Jay and Taylor follow each other on Instagram, and Taylor comments under Jay’s post), even though Nick and Jay don’t seem to have any direct connections. Kaia and Taylor started following each other on Instagram after the event.

While other people who got photos with Taylor posted them, in Taylor’s Instagram Post for the night: He only included his photo with Nick, the rest are all solo portraits of himself. Not only that: he edited the background of the photo so it’s just them, and proceeded to put the photo in the middle of the post.

a bunch of Taylor's good friends, including Taylor’s cousin went to like Nick’s post for the academy gala night. Taylor’s sister Ash shared Taylor’s post to her stories: 2 photos of Taylor himself, and the one photo of Taylor and Nick. Taylor mentioned in a past interview if he had any emotional or relationship (I don’t know which one is the right translation, the original wording is 感情) issues, he would talk to Ash. (please note that I didn’t not and don’t know how to fact-check any of the things mentioned above except for Ash’s Instagram)

Conclusion/ Speculation (okay the academy gala part alone took me 40 minutes what the fuck): I cannot reiterate this enough: THIS IS JUST SPECULATION DO NOT TAKE THIS SERIOUSLY but under the assumption that Taylor and Nick are a thing, the serious of shenanigans that happened that night, especially with the family and friends stuff in 6,7,8, was interpreted as they announcing it to their personal social circle. AGAIN THIS IS SPECUALTION DON’T TAKE THIS SERIOSULY 

Taylor’s China Trip

On 7th December, Taylor had a photo shoot at the GQ gala venue, but spent the rest of the afternoon taking photos and signing things for fans. Among those, one was the photo of him and Nick from the academy gala just three days ago. He was visibly extra happy and showed off the photo to the crowd, unlike the other photos which he simply gets it, signs it, and then gives it back.

This day was also the start of “Taylor giving Nick/Henry a moustache”: throughout the trip, he drew on four photos of the two of them

(This one is a … really big stretch) among the four, one of them was the GQ magazine shoot, and he first drew the moustache on Nick’s face, giggling “I’ll sign on Nick’s face”, signed his own signature, then just when he was about to give the magazine back he suddenly changed his mind and said “wait wait I wanna do something on my face”, and then drew a crown on his head while muttering “crown prince”. And the thing is… historically, George Villers had a moustache. And then he drew a moustache on Nick and a crown on himself. Also, one of the most popular Chinese RWRB fic on AO3 is called “The King’s Palace”, and the premise is putting Henry in George place as the social climber and the Duke of Buckingham (it is literally George’s character with blonde hair and a different name), and Alex as the crown prince who ascended to the throne and is also utterly infatuated with Henry. So… yeah.

When he drew the fourth photo, which was the piano scene, the fan who asked said “Oh you’re so nice to Nick!” and according to their description (there’s no video), Taylor blushed a little and said “yeaahhhhh” with a big grin

While Taylor was in China people were stirring shit up on Twitter about him, and during the Twitter drama, Nick liked Taylor’s Academy Gala post.

The boys liked the same video on Instagram but from different accounts (a video about a pony in the snow)

During the trip, Taylor was seen wearing a white button-up with blue stripes. Nick has been seen wearing a shirt that looks identical before.

Cartier Watch (aka the one that makes me do a double take)

Taylor used to wear a lot of Cartier watches until he started wearing Tagheuer last July due to a commercial partnership

Nick likes wearing Omega watches. In fact, Henry’s watch in the movie is Nick’s own omega watch. He also has a commercial partnership with Omega.

But then starting last year, both of them were seen wearing matching Cartier’s Tank Must Watches (the silver on with a black surface and a sapphire crown): Taylor can be seen wearing it in the 5th photos of his September post, while Nick can be seen wearing it during the GQ gala, the Academy Gala, in Milan during fan interactions, and last weekend in his TIOY co-star’s Instagram story.

And the thing about this watch is (and here is where I need to reiterate that I’m just translating, I didn’t fact check this) 1, watch is a typical thing to give a lover, and you must be familiar with their wrist size 2, Cartier is a pretty romantic brand 3, the price of this watch is closer to what Taylor’s used to wearing but much cheaper than Omega 4, This specific watch is a popular watch to give a partner/lover, 5, David and Victoria Beckham’s relationship was discovered because paparazzi saw the Cartier watch he gave her and connected dots together

Jesus Christ at this point I should consider getting a part time job in translation

This was fun but this took me so much time, it’s ~2000 words long

Again, all of this was found and speculate for fun, and mean no ill will, and haven’t, and won’t harm the boys, please understand that and don’t take this took seriously. If you find this interesting and want a part two, let me know.

[agalychnisspranneusroseus]

On the Helen of Troy thoughts RE, to RIAAU Marcy I have thoughts about the nature of how Andrius and Marcy are, the abuse Marcy experiences at Andrius' hands. (only tangentially related to the original post no I read over it) CW warning for discussion of parental/spousal abuse . The conflation of Andrius as Menelaus is... well the love and combined horrible possessive control fits so well even transfered from a marital to parental relationship, the feelings overlapping in the same sense, as awful as that is. The idea of 'love' but one coloured by immense and horrible control, on subject to him, her importance to him both as a part of his family, as his daughter who he cares for, the cynical importance she plays in the continuance of newt rule (to the point where she thinks she is a newt most of her life) as both his heir and the Core's vessel and the pain that results is just.... AAAAAAA. There's a real parental love there in canon, (and i suspect in the au) but that doesn't stop Andrius going through with what he does, just like many abusers do genuinely 'love' their victims, and their victims love them back. It doesn't change the fact that there is abuse and coercive control and a sense of ownership there, even if he's twisted himself into thinking it's all for 'her own good'. The idea Marcy going to war against her father but still loving him in her own way despite all he's done, and knowing how he has hurt her and would continue hurting her if he could it... god it hurts. Separate content warning for discussion SA of a child by a parental figure (apologies for reading too much into your AU and hitting an overly heavy or triggering topic if raising it was not intended) There's the other reasonably foreseeable implications are conflating father and husband. I don't see S/A as a thing literally happening in text, and how he views Marcy (as a daughter, despite how horribly he treats her). But if there's an allegory intended there, the preparations for The Core seem like one. How Marcy is groomed to see getting in the tank as normal when she's too young to understand what's going on, and being taught that it's a good thing. How she feels about the port implant in her neck in the aftermath and how that impacts how open and intimate she feels she can be with Sasha and Anne. How she probably doesn't know how to talk about what exactly happened to her at first, or know to reach out for help from others as a child. Those just hit close to that kind of abuse and it's consequences to me. Similarly, there's a case to be made for Andrius having experienced similar treatment at the hands of his own father and The Core, and thinking this is a good thing as a result, that he is showing his 'love' and preparing her for 'her future' like he was prepared. Unwilling and unable to see how he was hurt. That doesn't justify what happened, or make the actions any less immoral, nothing can. But the idea that Andrius is just continuing how he was shown to parent, and that hurting the people he cares about. And Marcy then having to grapple with that as she grows up.

You hit the nail right on the head! Don't be scared of potentially triggering interpretations because, while I don't feel confident writing a whole SA allegory, the implications write themselves even in canon, and the "preparations" aspect very much resembles grooming in the sense that Marcy is gradually forced to naturalize harm towards her body, autonomy and personhood. She's very much aware of what's happening to her during most of her life, and has come to see it as necessary at worst and a great honor at best. By the time she breaks free, unable to tolerate it any longer, she feels incredibly guilty for letting it go on for so long. She doesn't feel she gets to complain when she consciously accepted something she later went back on. Despite being horribly traumatized, she's convinced herself she's not a victim of any kind. You know. Because she "wanted it". Because she "enjoyed" being so deeply connected to the Core. Because she "consented" to her body being used for its vanity project.

There is one key element of, er, incest that doesn't have any paralel in the story, so it's not a clean allegory, and that is the specificity of the boundary-crossing that comes with SA within the family. While Andrias hurts Marcy horribly, there is no specific "great taboo" he's breaking, unless you count any kind of child abuse as some sort of taboo, in general? But again, it lacks the specificity. Marcy doesn't feel the lines between child and parent have been blurred by an exaggerated attachment, not exactly. Though you could make an argument that the inevitable enmeshment that comes with multiple consciousnesses being assimilated into a single being could represent something like that? Idk it feels like a bit of a stretch.

But yeah, the parallels are very much general blanket-feelings of control, gaslighting, loss of bodily autonomy and, well, if there's such a thing as non-sexual grooming, this is that, yeah.

It will take Anne and Sasha a lot to fully earn Marcy's trust, because even if Marcy desperately wants to feel comfortable with someone else again, she's gone through a lot and her nervous system has been in fight or flight mode for years.

[hillbillyoracle]

It has taken a long while for me to understand that right wing religious seminars are just as popular in the Fundie community as leftwing ones are in the (fragmented) liberal Menno community, and because of where I live, we don't have a lot of them. The Bible says a lot of contradicting things, and there are few things that Christians agree on.

But I keep reading your post and I still would like more information, if you are willing. You don't seem to know what we don't know, and you're taking quite a bit for granted as common knowledge.

Here is my question: What is the logic behind the things that aren't in the Bible, and the things leftwing Christians interpret only as metaphors? The interpretation of Revelation that is so incredibly common regarding spiritual warfare on Earth? When and how did the Antichrist come into play? Disregarding what I believe or don't, what does that even mean? What are they talking about? Why are they so deeply afraid to the point of constant war and such legalism? Even things like the Umbrella of Authority I find confusing, because in my church community, everybody is always equal regardless of gender, and women have always held power in the church's history.

The purpose of their getting involved in politics is to assuage fear and enforce their values, of course. But how did we get these values in the first place? I know you were inside of it, so you will never see what it's like for us from the outside, what we don't know about them, especially people who have been persecuted by various forms of fundamentalists for generations but still try to welcome exfundies openly. But I read your post again, and I guess I just need to keep trying.

You don't seem to know what we don't know, and you're taking quite a bit for granted as common knowledge.

100% true. I'm really struggling with it in the conversations I've been in lately and it's something I'm trying to correct so I appreciate your patience.

I also think part of it is a limitation of my current perspective as well. When I've gone line by line and explained things, it usually leads people to become more entrenched in their negative beliefs about fundies which in turn makes them behave in ways that ultimately fuel their whole bit. So that's why I focus on more overarching aspects.

But if you think it'll help, I'll give it my best shot.

Here is my question: What is the logic behind the things that aren't in the Bible, and the things leftwing Christians interpret only as metaphors?

Biblical literalism has been around for a long long time so I can't speak to all of it.

What I do know is that the thread of it that current day fundamentalists in the US at least have ties to started in the late 1800s as a reaction to the rise in prominence of scientific explanations of the world - think Darwin's work, germ theory, and the discovery of the electron and eventually radioactivity.

What this basically lead to was some Christians believing that a scientific view of the world was compatible with religions and some saying that the Bible took precedent over human modes of knowledge. So the "logic" of Biblical literalism in conjunction with the latter idea was that if God's word took precedent over human knowledge, he would make it very clear - very literal for us

Key to this group's understanding of Christianity was the belief in Christ's miracles as literally happening. With the rise of scientific explanations, there was now this whole new language for trying to discredit those miracles and making fun of people who believed they literally happened. They were a favorite punching bag whenever the scientific community had scandals exposed in particular - "Sure we've basically tortured human subjects in the name of science but at least we don't believe Jesus literally healed the sick, can you imagine?" These groups saw this lack of regard for human life and responded by relying more on God's word which they regarded as perfect in a way humans were not - which essentially meant more literalism.

And you can debate that all you like but that's more or less the basis of it to this day, whether modern fundamentalists know it or not. It's this idea that God wants to be known so why would he obscure himself behind metaphor? And the literal meanings of his word come before all other types of human created knowledge because humans are sinful and faulty and his word is perfect.

The interpretation of Revelation that is so incredibly common regarding spiritual warfare on Earth?

So the interpretation of Revelation varies dramatically between fundamentalists churches. I spent my early years in one that didn't place a big emphasis on it but regarded it as literal and in the future. I spent my middle and high school years in one that regarded Revelations as having begun sometime around the industrial revolution and believed it was already playing out slowly but gaining steam (insert steam powered joke).

Spiritual warfare also varies. Some people think it is angels and demons fighting all around us. Some people think it is in the battle of ideas. My early church believed in the former. My later church believed in the latter. The categories aren't exactly neat and tidy unfortunately.

So it's tough to speak to since it's not terribly unified. I would say in general the literal reading of revelations stems from what I wrote about just before this - why could God obscure himself if he wants to be known?

A common belief I ran into was the idea that a purely metaphorical reading of Revelations was born of fear and a lack of faith in the truth of the Bible. It was kind of a litmus test. People who were unafraid to imagine this terrible future and believe it was real and could happen to them in this lifetime were more faithful than those that wouldn't.

I think it makes sense if you remember a lot of people who left mainline traditions left in part due to difficult experiences which church complacency. The urgency of a literal reading of Revelations speaks to them.

When and how did the Antichrist come into play? Disregarding what I believe or don't, what does that even mean? What are they talking about?

The antichrist is a literal translation of a word made up of the Greek roots for anti and Christ. Its in John's letters:

Who is the liar? It is whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a person is the antichrist—denying the Father and the Son. - I John 2:22 (NIV)

This was the one I heard quoted the most but there are other instances too.

I'm less well versed in how he came to have the lore around him that he has with fundamentalists but poking around it looks like it definitely didn't start with fundamentalists. My guess it is a holdover from before their break with mainline Protestantism that took on a new form when it came into contact with biblical literalism. A figure who is against or put in place of Jesus is common in other denominations, my guess is there was a conflation of this figure with the Beast in Revelations due to similar language being used for both.

But that's a guess.

The big "thing" with the antichrist is said to be positing himself as savior of mankind. That's why scientists and the like often get pegged for it. He's also said to bring a quickening to the end of days.

I'm realizing I'm probably taking a lot for granted here. I'm not sure how to explain the antichrist. He's just a real bad guy and he could be anyone. He's the Red Scare but a literal person.

Why are they so deeply afraid to the point of constant war and such legalism?

I mean I don't know what to tell you there. Life is fucking scary.

One day, I'm laughing with my mom. 24 hours later I'm in a hospital watching her on a ventilator and not recognizing me. That's scary.

One day my body more or less worked and the next day I woke up and my hands were in so much pain I couldn't move them. At 24 years old. That's scary.

Think of all the things you can't control that determine the course of your life - war, famine, disease. That shit is scary.

That's admittedly is my generous response.

That initial fear has been coopted by prominent figures who basically draw the line from more universal fears to anxieties people have about their place in the world and then to things like gender and sexuality - things that can be controlled.

The legalism is as much a way to understand it as it is a reaction to it. It's rooting in this idea that if we were to live in alignment with God's word, much of the terrible things we're experiencing wouldn't be happening (which is false but it's compelling to some people).

Even things like the Umbrella of Authority I find confusing, because in my church community, everybody is always equal regardless of gender, and women have always held power in the church's history.

There's also lots of verses about women needing to be quiet and obey their husbands and not wear certain adornments and the list goes on. While yes, individual women have carved out and held on to power in the church, they're more the exception than the rule when taken over the course of the church's entire history. Which is just to say that women's place in the church in any denomination is complicated.

For instance, look how many fundamentalist women have run for office and won. They're playing to a particular archetype within fundamentalist Christianity as the secondary protectors of the family. They tend to focus on issues relating to children for that reason. They have power but it's within the narrow confines of what a woman should be.

Umbrella of protection can be more "natural law" flavored or more "mystical" flavored. I was in a "natural law" family. And that idea held that obedience to my parents but in particular my father was the model by which I would learn to obey God. If I didn't obey them, then I wouldn't know how to obey God. If I didn't know how to obey God then I would sin and bad things would happen to me.

I knew a handful of people who were in the more mystical flavored version but to be honest I'm not completely clear on how that worked. My impression of it was that I guess the dad as the head of the household was granted a certain measure of power to protect his family but he could only use if they obeyed. And in return he was supposed to only ask for their obedience where their safety mattered not merely on a whim but that's not usually how that played out.

The purpose of their getting involved in politics is to assuage fear and enforce their values, of course. But how did we get these values in the first place?

There's a theological component to this answer and there's a political component.

The theological component has to do with that literal reading of and primacy of the Bible. It's read not only as a description of what's wrong with the world but also how it's supposed to be. Their reading of it emphasizes themes in the New Testament as Jesus being the sacrifice that would restore order to the world. So they in turn see an emphasis on Jesus and order to be key to dealing with what is wrong with the world (i.e. whatever scares them). Part of their view of order also emphasizes family in imitation of the holy family.

The political component is that in the middle of the 20th century, conservative strategists specifically started courting big figures in the fundamentalist movement. Both were eager to get fundies more involved in politics but for slightly different reasons. Fundamentalist leaders saw it as advocating for good and a way to distinguish themselves from mainline denominations which weren't generally that politically active. Conservative operators saw how fired up fundies could get as revivals and similar and wanted to funnel that toward their political aims.

There was a shift in how fundamentalist leaders talked about money in particular during this time, emphasizing it as a means by with to do the work of the lord and a sign of God's favor when earned justly. Conservative messaging to their new base emphasized impacts on families and it's the emphasis they still lead with.

So where outsiders see contradiction, it's generally not seen as contradicting when looking through the lens of protecting and benefiting the family. Guns - allow you to protect your family. Regulations - limit how well you can provide for your family. Immigrants - are a threat to your ability to provide for your family. God came into the world via a particular kind of family and we were supposed to live in imitation of that - hence the opposition to queer people and trans folks.

Obviously I don't agree with that and obviously it's more to do with people just being biased and afraid but that's the underpinning by which those fears get organized into a political system of values that we see playing out right now.

I know you were inside of it, so you will never see what it's like for us from the outside, what we don't know about them, especially people who have been persecuted by various forms of fundamentalists for generations but still try to welcome exfundies openly.

You're right that I don't know it the way you know it. That's for sure.

But I would also point out that I am queer and trans and realized both of these things while still inside the church. I got persecuted from within and I got persecuted when I got pushed out. So while I don't have the intergenerational aspect you speak of, I have definitely been and currently am persecuted by them in my daily life so I have a small insight into what that can be like. It's hell, it really is.

I appreciate you wanting to learn. I hope this post is a little more enlightening. It's the truth as best I know it but I know I'm missing information myself.

[canonizzyhours]

One thing I do find fascinating, is that everyone who watches ofmd for the first time has the opportunity to interpret the show however they see fit. And while everyone is different, and will connect with different characters for different reasons. There are certain aspects that, once you decide to delve deeper, have to be viewed in either good faith or bad.

When I first watched the show, I didn't really have many opinions of it, other than the normal kinda baseline interpretations. Of course I loved it, which is why I'm here now, but I'd not considered any of what was shown, further than the surface level.

I maybe had a unique experience, having been able to power through s1 and s2 without pause. But it got me thinking, could I have had the opportunity to join the canyon, had I been subjected to more of it once I entered the fandom space? After all, if it is merely an interpretation that is supported by the text of the show, then it is valid for me to look at both arguments and decide where I see myself fitting no?

The problem with that is, I simply couldn't make my brain comprehend why anyone would come away from the show seeing Izzy as the "special guy", "the main character", "the most interesting in the show" etc. I would have to have gone so far against the text to make myself believe and feel comfortable with those interpretations, that it wouldn't have felt like my thoughts anymore.

Once I started reading meta, I saw takes from both sides. And it just became very noticeable that some people are just good at arguing, using big words or complicating sentences to make you think like you're reading a good analysis whereas really, they're just media illiterate. And once you realise that, reading meta about the actual show becomes a lot more enjoyable.

I'm not exactly sure where I was going with this, I guess I'm just baffled how some people can come away from watching the show and end up in the canyon despite what they're shown in text, and having plenty of excellent meta analysis at their disposal. I didn't have to search hard for good takes, they were just there. In my opinion, it would be harder to avoid them.

#431.

[moonchild-in-blue]

Massive thank you to you and everyone else who calls out how shitty it is to get mad at peoples interpretations. Sleep tokens music is romantic. Its also toxic. These statements can coexist. Its not your business if someone plays bloodsport or vore or hell even atlantic at their wedding. Youre not them, you dont know what the music means to them. If you see a weird take just roll your eyes and move on, its not a big deal. Absolutely sick and fucking tired of all these "why are you calling this romantic/sexy? Youre stupid and a terrible person!" takes like fucking relax. Media literacy is important yes. Respecting that this music is dark and personal to vessel is also important. Same goes for respecting how people relate to the music in dark ways. But as long as people are not saying things directly to vessel or fans about how their individual trauma is sexy then just chill out and respect peoples different interpretations. It sucks that i cant talk about how i view certain songs without being called horrible things and having really fucked up vitriol aimed at me. Yall need to grow the fuck up and get over yourselves. Im not thinking of your personal shit when i call a certain song romantic/sexy, i dont even know you, sometimes im thinking of my own trauma actually lol. Lets all discuss this music maturely where we respect each other and what each of us as individuals bring to the table for interpretation, stop making this fandom toxic as hell for anyone who doesnt agree 100% with your own interpretation. (Also the whole "youre not allowed to say this song is romantic/sexy" thing is very dismissive of some peoples trauma in itself, it ignores how messy someones feelings toward their abusers/toxic partners can be. Pretty fucked up to call a trauma survivor stupid or a terrible person because a song reminds them of their positive feelings towards someone who hurt them) Anyways yeah, just tired of people being so harsh because they refuse to see other peoples perspectives. I genuinely think one of the most toxic aspects of this fandom is the vitriol over different interpretations, people act like outright children at times with it im ngl, especially with more sexual discussions. It also feels infantilizing towards vessel at times, hes a grown adult who put romantic/sexy elements in his music and he doesnt need people trying to protect him from those themes. Im rambling but this stuff pisses me off so much, this fandom needs to do better

Context post for the clueless ones - regarding my tags/replies

Here's the thing - I've been in fandoms for many, many, MANY years. This type of discussion isn't anything new nor unique to Sleep Token, but it sure does make a comeback quite often. It's tiring to keep repeating the same things over and over, but that's what fandom is all about isn't it?

Someone needs to say something, and I am not one to shy away from uncomfortable conversations like these. Something something, build your own community, be the change you wanna see, etc etc.

I've said pretty much everything I wanna say already under that post, but for the sake of clarity, and because I can't keep my mouth shut apparently -

Under the cut for length - you know the drill:

Music is art. And art is subjective. Meaning, each individual will have their own personal connection and interpretation of a given piece of art, which in this case is Sleep Token's music.

Did Vessel write the songs with a certain intent or meaning? Most likely yes! It's not hard to connect the dots and guess what events/emotions might've transpired and served as inspiration for them (accuracy to personal life is irrelevant and none of our business, but it's also no rocket science to understand what's been said).

Can we establish a base meaning for any given song, or better, can we have a general consensus of what a song is about based on its lyrics and themes? Absolutely! Not every song is like that, but we can all agree there's a lot of recurring themes of past relationships and mental health struggles.

Is it wrong to diminish the songs to one basic element (eg. the sexual undertones) and/or completely disregard the bigger, more important theme? I'd say it is.

Giving Atlantic as an example (which as a lot of you know, is my most favourite song of them and very dear to me): this one has some very blatant references to suicide and depression. Regardless of whether it is based on irl events or not (none of our business!!!), it is extremely heavy and emotionally charged. I find it incredibly disrespectful when people say random stuff during the rituals when he plays this one.

Or for example, how certain people reduce Sleep Token to "baby making metal", instead of acknowledging the insane (insane!) variety of genres and the profound lyricism they present.

Should we limit our views, and by extension, those of others, to surface-level interpretation, without allowing room for different views and interpretations, either fictional lore based or not? ABSOLUTELY NOT.

Vessel himself said to "not restrict ourselves to labels or genres because music transcends it all" (paraphrasing here). It's literally their whole thing. It's very hypocritical to be shouting from the rooftops about "media literacy" and assuming people are stupid or idiots for not understanding the basic, surface-level meaning of a song, when Vessel himself constantly writes in metaphors and half-truths.

I've touched on this a lifetime ago on one of my analysis, but if you *actually* look at the lyrics, you'll realise Vessel hardly ever says what he means. There's always something else behind his words, something he purposefully keeps hidden. It really sneaks upon you sometimes! I'm over a year in and I still find something new everyday on their music. That man has a way to weave in a hundred and one statements under a single sentence, that is just truly beautiful to study.

Is, say, The Love You Want, about a man (Vessel) mourning the fact that his love isn't reciprocated? Yeah! Is it about someone who, despite knowing they can never receive from their lover the attention and affection and care they want, will stay by their side anyways? It is!

Is it about bitterness, spiteful accusations aimed at the one person who should love you fully? Or a reflection of how little self-regard the singer has, so much that they are willingly and actively choosing to stay in a sinking one-sided relationship, because the alternative is too painful to bare? Can you flip the switch and see it as someone who is obsessively pursuing another person, and painting themselves as a victim? All of this, yes!

You can even eliminate the romantic aspect all together and apply it to a relationship with the self (past or future, or an alter ego), or a parental figure. The options are endless. There isn't one universal truth when it comes to music, and as such, all of these takes are 100% correct.

Many statements can be true at the same time - it doesn't make one more true or correct than the other. Simply different. The way we connect with music is very much dictated by our own life experiences, and no two people have lived the exact same life.

Can you prefer a certain way to look at a song, or completely disagree with certain takes? Absolutely! I know I sure as hell do! That's normal and expected and part of the fun in being in a community such as ours. More people means more ways to look at a song - isn't that just wonderful?!

Now, this is very obvious for most of us, but some people, especially in the younger rage, have been taught to look at things in a very black and white way. Not to be that person, but the truth is that the rise in awareness of social issues and "pc-ness", is slowly starting to eliminate the possibility of things being flawed and nuanced.

If you're wrong, you're awful. If you're right, you're obnoxious. Made a mistake? Get cancelled. Grow from your mistakes, but not like that. Learn from your actions, but change your whole personality in a day otherwise you're problematic.

You know what I mean.

Life isn't black and white. Art isn't black and white. Music isn't black and white. What may seem like a toxic, dark, obsessive depiction of a relationship to you, might translate to the deepest and most truest of loves to me. I can acknowledge something is Not Right, while still drawing my own conclusions.

Is Blood Sport a sad af song? Yeah! Definitely not the first thing I'd think of when in a happy relationship. But maybe that's the point. And maybe I do. And that's okay, and none of anyone's business. "Okay but The Apparition isn't a good example of a healthy and romantic-" TO YOU! Maybe that's what love looks like to me! Maybe I just happen to be into it! And what about it?

Maybe to me love comes with all the ugly sides too. The violence, the despair, the self-doubt. Who are you to dictate what I can or can't think? I highly doubt Vessel would go 🗣️ "WRONG! NO! ABSOLUTELY NOT! >:::(", so why would you?

You can, and should, discuss the songs with others! Maybe some people do genuinely need a fresh pair of eyes to help them get to the juicy core of the songs - that's why we're here! To discuss, and exchange ideas! You can, and should, call people out when their engagement with the music is being harmful to others (joking and laughing during Missing Limbs? No bueno. Speculating about Vessel's personal life? VERY no bueno. Choosing a potentially weird song to walk down the aisle? None of your business + not your wedding + you weren't even invited + none of your business. Notice how I've been repeating that. Notice again).

You shouldn't, however, shame and ridicule others for having different views from you.

I think, rather than engaging in pointless discussions and start accusing people of being this or that, we should all exercise a little "don't like? scroll past". Is it harming you or others? No? Then scroll past! Is it an awful, truly horrendous take about something you're really passionate about? Okay! Disgusting! Scroll past! Good for them! 👍

Also - keep an open mind. We're all doing this living businesse for the first time, no one holds all the answers to everything. It's okay to change your mind. It's okay to say the wrong thing and backtrack. It's okay to make a mistake and learn and grow.

You know what's not okay? Being a dick to others because the thing you like is being misinterpreted. It's hard, I know!!! You can block people! You can scroll past! You can look at pictures of your favourite vessel and cleanse your brain!!!! I know I do!!!!!

And this is a last afterthought but - you don't get to complain about the fandom you're in if you're doing nothing to change that. I see many, maaaaany of you bitch about this and that, while having 0 engagement aside from the bitching. Like?? Maybe if you spent more time reblogging cool art or gifs and less time whining about literally everything, this would be a much more pleasant space!! And I DO get to be a little petty here because I sure do try my best to make this a fun and nice community. I am allowed a little bitching 😌

Anyways, tl/dr: don't be a dick; don't like - don't engage; keep an open mind; gaze upon the vessels. Peace and love yall 💙💫

[violetrainbow412-blog]

Day 11: meet cute

Masterlist flufftober 🎀

A special one, I really enjoyed writing it. Reblog if you liked it!

Spencer walked through the gallery in silence, paying attention to all the paintings and trying to give them his own interpretation. For some strange reason, being in those places relaxed him greatly and right now it was what he needed most: a well-deserved respite after a long day of work.

“Good night,” he greeted a young woman, who was attentively looking at a painting.

The woman he saw couldn't have been more than thirty years old and her clothing was... how to put it? Something eccentric. All the clothes were vibrant tones and she wore a woven bag with uneven parts, who knows if it was on purpose or not.

“Good night,” you murmured just as kindly, keeping your hands in the pockets of your colorful jacket.

The painting in front of you was, in short, something grotesque. But it wasn't in a bad way, it had a certain special touch that made it… Spencer couldn't even describe it. It was very good, but to some extent uncomfortable to look at. Almost like a ritualistic crime scene that he was so used to: beautiful, but at the same time terrifying.

"Do you like it?"

“Huh?” the man asked, fearing he had misheard the girl next to him. She nodded toward the exhibit and her brain filled in the blanks. “The painting? Yes, I think it's very good. I'm afraid I'm not a great connoisseur of artistic currents, but from a very point of view this could be part of The Black Paintings, Francisco de Goya's collection”

“I know them,” you said happily. “My favorite is that one about Saturn devouring his son. You know, the one where they're eating a…” you started to say, making signs with your hands that he understood immediately.

“I think art is very subjective, like everything in the world. Some people may consider the Mona Lisa a masterpiece and others may appreciate more the style of Van Gogh or the cubism of Picasso and they are all right. Each person enjoys art things that reflect the content of their soul and I think that is the beautiful thing about paintings, don't you think?

“You know a lot for someone who is not knowledgeable about art” you smiled, feeling captivated by the way the stranger next to you expressed himself.

“Actually I say that I am not a connoisseur because I don’t want to offend those who are. I've only read a couple of books on the subject and... well, I love coming to museums, but that's all”

“Honestly, I think it's very ugly,” you said suddenly, turning your head slightly to observe the painting “It looks a little strange on the bottom, whoever did it should improve their technique a little.”

Spencer felt strange hearing such a cruel comment coming from a person who seemed to be sweet, but he figured you would have your reasons for holding that opinion. He considered leaving there but his attempt was interrupted by another presence, this time a man dressed in an elegant suit who approached you.

“Miss Y/L/N” he greeted you cordially, while you shook his hand “I see you came to appreciate our exhibition, do you like the light we put there? Does it help the colors of the work or do you want us to change it to a warmer one?”

“Oh, don't worry Frank. I like that one, it makes it look gloomy” you answered nonchalantly “You just should put it somewhere else, I'm not very proud of this one in particular”

"What are you talking about? Many people liked it. Isn't it good, gentleman?” he asked, turning to Spencer who was watching the two of them curiously.

“It's beautiful,” he confessed. He actually thought that, he wasn't saying it out of commitment or anything, and his response made you smile sheepishly.

"Stop. Everything is perfect here, thank you for giving it a home in your gallery”

“And there will be more spaces in the future, think about it,” the man murmured, squeezing your shoulder warmly and friendly. “Have a good night, excuse me.”

“Goodbye, Frank.”

The two of you watched the man walk down the hallway until he got lost in a turn and then the agent turned his attention to you.

“So you're an artist?”

“I try that” you laughed. He took a look at you and then at the picture in front of you, as if he had a hard time believing that you were the creator, of course due to the difference in styles that both elements had “But I like that people don't know, so I can hear honest opinions. And I appreciate yours, you are very kind.”

"I only say what I see"

“Would it be very bold of me if I asked you to be my model one day?” you asked cautiously, hoping not to scare him with your request.

"A model?"

“I really like your jaw,” you exclaimed, pointing a finger in the air at the line you were talking about. “And the way your hair falls. They are nice to paint”

“Well, I…I would be flattered,” Spencer said, not knowing how to react to what you had just said. Something like that had never been suggested to him and he felt strange, but excited at the same time.

“Do you want to write me your number?”

“I can give you my card,” he stammered, digging in his briefcase so he could give you the piece of paper. When he extended it to you, you analyzed it with curiosity.

“Dr. Spencer Reid. FBI” you read, quite impressed “So we both got a surprise today, huh?”

"Definitely"

“I'll call you,” you promised, pocketing the card warily and rewarding him with one of yours. They were simpler with hand-painted details and with fewer titles, but it would be useful for him to contact you “And who knows, maybe the next time you come it will be you who is in the gallery.”

Spencer blushed at the thought and smiled at you, wondering how possible that was. You responded to the smile with pleasure, because unintentionally you had just found the one who would permanently become your muse.

taglist: @navs-bhat @reidwritings @tricia-shifting14 @spencerslove @vivian-555 @r-3dlips @rhiannonhippiegirl @taygrls @simp4f1 @sdddoobydoobydoo @taintedstranger

[scoobydoodean]

what the FUCK is wrong with sam fans . this is kind of a genuine question .

I mean for some of them it's definitely connecting your personal life experiences with the experiences of a character from a TV show to a degree that is not healthy.

Identifying with fictional characters is completely normal and intended—it's what makes certain stories stick out to us over others. Using fiction to cope with and work through ones own personal trauma is not an inherently bad thing either—it can be therapeutic and perfectly healthy. But you can take this too far and reach a point where you totally lose perspective on a story being a story and can no longer interact in fandom spaces without being harmed emotionally. This emotional harm happens because you have begun to believe that the character is actually you. Not only does this make you feel as if others speaking with authority on the character in a way that challenges your own perceptions is an invalidation of your own emotions and experience... it means you begin to receive any criticism of a fictional character as a criticism of yourself, and that is not a position you ever want to place yourself in.

Art is art. There are objective aspects to it (the medium, the colors, what it literally depicts) but what it means is subjective. Art can be personal to you, but it's also personal to everyone else who observes it and likes it. It does not exist just for you to interpret and identify with or to suit your sole sense of its meaning. You cannot impose the personal meaning you place on a piece of art on everyone else and demand they view it through your personal lens. To do so is to misunderstand the purpose of publicly shared and experienced art.

We all have moments where we find our feelings about art are so incongruous with someone else's that it isn't enjoyable to view that art side by side with them. However, if you have reached a point where you find yourself claiming that those people's perceptions of art literally cause emotional harm to you, and that the onus is on them to censor their thoughts and feelings about art to protect you, you should not be viewing that art publicly. In fact, you should really be questioning whether you have a healthy relationship with the art itself and whether you actually like it. Life is too short to spend it fixated on something that you think you like, but that is actually slowly sucking you into a pit of despair.

[irontragedyreview]

I know I said I wasn't going to write about bnha for a while, however there is one (of the many) that makes me hate the ending but this particularly bothers me so much in the interpretation and the way it was executed, Izuku being a teacher during his retirement years. I'm going to be honest, I don’t call what I write below as an analysis or it will be handled objectively, because in truth I’m going to put a little of my own experience on the subject, not from a professional point of view (I’m not a teacher) but as a student at the different educational levels that I have attended.

I want to start saying that I love the idea of ​​Izuku becoming a teacher, this isn’t a post that seeks to spit on those who decided to choose teaching as a job, but rather the hateful way in which at least the leaks and many interpretations make this election looks like his biggest failure. The main problem with this decision was made hastily (like almost the entire ending), because it’s just a passing decision to then see Midoriya again in his modified hero suit.

It’s the end, everything needs to be closed, we have a window of time to see the UA years, the graduation and how the embers are extinguished, to bring us to the reality that Izuku has accepted that without his quirk he can’t be a hero, grateful for the wonderful dream he was able to live, but now looking for other alternatives consistent with his current situation. This is a direct call to the first chapter, there are two moments where we can see the alternatives and the pain of a dream that can’t be fulfilled, first a panel with him trying to hold back his tears while telling himself not to be surprised that he knew that his dream was impossible and he had to be realistic, the second time when after the whole debacle with All Might, Bakugou and the pro heroes, he’s already resigned and said that it was time to think about his future with a small smile. At that moment Izuku had agreed to look for another future, which was stopped when Toshinori appears and tells him the iconic words "You can be a hero."

Quick reminder, people who complain about Midoriya's passivity and that he didn’t train and prepare for UA being quirkless, remember that from what we can see Midoriya is a child who has suffered bullying for much of his formative years, with shitty teachers and that he’s practically isolated for his classmates (he has no friends in Aldera), ignoring this information and how it affects his confidence and character development is simply ignoring an element that accompanies the character throughout the manga, it doesn’t help that Horikoshi has ignored all these details in Midoriya, but the basis is that, if no one believes in you, it’s difficult to believe in yourself, especially without external help or support. That said, the decision to stop being a hero without a quirk isn’t new, previous chapters with Bakugou in the hospital and the embers left it clear that he was not going to continue being a hero.

Everything said above is necessary so that I can explain everything else, the decision to be a teacher is not bad, with a better developed and with more substance than 10 panels would have been wonderful and that is for several reasons. First, characters can change, a first goal can lead to another one, it’s satisfying to see when a character believed that the goal to be achieved was one but then discovers that the journey he took I took him to a different place but that isn’t bad, the sacrifice of the ofa is the reason why he becoming a teacher it doesn’t need to be negative, the problem is that it makes it seem that way and that it must be fixed. In FMA Ed renounces his alchemy for his brother and while this is bittersweet, the words are to remember that what is more important than his alchemy are his loved ones, he has people around him, his alchemy isn’t the most important thing, especially because that makes him get his brother back. I think this ending wanted to start with this idea but in a horrible way because Izuku doesn't seem happy just content, especially because from what we see Midoirya feels alone because everyone else is partially fulfilling the dream he had all his life and move away from him, this could have been fixed if there were more relationships in those panels, him interacting with other characters such as faculty staff or other people (outside of Aizawa), because part of growing up is meeting different groups of people, the class A may be important but they aren’t in his daily life and they seem to have more of a relationship with each other than with Midoriya, this also weakens their relationships because he can only be part of the group at the end when he is one of them again, the quirkless Midoriya doesn’t seem to have a place in class A without keeping up with them, intentionally or not, it weakens the relationships between the characters. Although, it’s okay to understand that adult life won’t always allow you constant contact, none of this indicates that there are efforts for actively finding. This was honestly a big negative point, it doesn't take away from the fact that class A invested in a suit so Izuku could have his dream again, but being a respected teacher with friends who are around you isn't horrible either and that all this happened in secret because 8 years old, it feels cruel.

Second, I would have liked to see what kind of teacher Izuku is because I think he has the qualities to be someone great at it. One of the things that this new career brings is that Izuku can and I want to know if he became a better teacher than the ones he had, because Aldera’s guy, Aizawa, Toshinori all of them were bad teachers for Midoriya and in general for other characters. Before anyone says anything, when I say they were bad teachers, I'm not saying it because they didn't show favoritism or served everything on a silver platter, but because they were incredibly negligent. I don't have to talk about aldera’s guy, right? He saw how Bakugou directly attacked his desk and let it go along with the mockery of the class when he talked about his dream of going to UA (fictional character or I don't expect him to rot in hell). Toshinori, look, I love Toshinori and his relationship with Izuku, it’s obvious that they care deeply about each other but that doesn’t mean that he wasn’t a great teacher for Izuku, from his drop-in guidance on ofa, the secrets, the way that he found out about Nighteye and Mirio, Toshinori may care for Izuku deeply but he wasn’t a good teacher or mentor for him, it doesn't help that he had no preparation for the role.

Aizawa, to begin with I’m an Aizawa critical so I’m not going to sugarcoat his character but either defenestrate him, truth is that beyond the dadzawa fics, Aizawa is a bad teacher at least in his way of being, I don’t deny that he cares about his class more because everything he has experienced and  his relationship with Class 1 A is different from the others, but that doesn’t mean that his teaching and in many cases his reactions are negligent or irrational for someone who claims to be rational. Let's talk about his first moment as a teacher and I don't say it because of the false threat of expulsion, but because of how he handled Midoriya about his quirk, at first we are told that he doesn’t read the students' files to not have preconceptions of them or whatever, but what kind of teacher doesn't read their students' files to know what are those details that they should take into account and help them improve. His first words about Midoriya being reckless and becoming a burden are out of line and cruel not just for a student in his first year but his damn first day. Aizawa's words may be true, the heroes are in constant danger, and everyone must collaborate so as not to be a burden in dangerous situations, but don’t read that your student is new with his quirk and make a preconceived idea due to an antipathy towards All Might shows that rationality is a facade for being an idiot, you’re their teacher guide them and read the damn file, that would help you understand how to help them improve and not undermine their self-esteem in the process. Bring Midoriya and Bakugo together in a final exam, because in his words "the responsibility for their bad relationship lies with both of them" and considering how Bakugo exercised physical violence previously and again in an exercise that was being monitored but there was never call?  As a teacher, when you see two students have a rocky relationship and one of them tends to react violently, the idea isn’t to put them together in a final exercise but to treat them separately and then together. Aizawa is supposedly a certified teacher (unlike All Might) but the pedagogy necessary to deal with children is obviously not part of the UA curriculum. These are the most impressive ones that make you consider how bad teachers the UA has and its selection exam.

The great irony of all this is that Endeavor was the only one who actually listened to his student and advised accordingly, the irony of this shouldn’t be lost.

Having said all this, I would have liked to see Midoriya, who has a good predisposition with children and who has had bad experiences, be what he would have wanted them to be for him. I say this as a person who has great respect for the teaching profession, but I can recognize that not all teachers deserve to be one and use their position of power to humiliate or mistreat children in their care. Over the years but especially in primary and high school, these types of teachers can deeply mark a student. At university I have the option of leaving class and I’m able to defend myself, a child usually tends to respect the power hierarchy even in a counterproductive way. But I have also had good teachers and it is those types of teachers who can help in difficult moments and help create and shape futures, I have met people who deeply loved their profession and made it their priority not only to teach classes but to help children. Of course all of those named above (except the Aldera’s guy, you suck) were not trying to humiliate their students, but it doesn’t mean that they were not good teachers or there were many interactions missing. Before anyone says that Aizawa and All Might protected them and would give their lives for Midoirya and all their students in general, I’m talking about them as teachers in the exercise of their profession, they are also heroes and of course they don’t want to see them die to their students, that doesn’t mean that they can bad teachers due to negligent treatment of them.

I would have really liked to see what type of teaching he imparts, how he’s training the new generation because that is where you can see a change, especially from his own experience. I would have liked to know if he uses his analysis to help them improve, if even after he became a hero again he stayed at his job because he can truly make a change both by saving people and teaching at the UA. This is a plot that had a lot of potential for the character but it’s a bad taste in the mouth that the chapter itself takes it in such a sad way and even the fandom classifies it as a sign that he’s a loser, the only loss here is no see how heroes can be changed from within, as well as Ochako. Through teaching, Izuku can create a future to form different heroes, who can even achieve what he could not. Izuku as a teacher would not be so horrible if Horikoshi had not really used this idea for 10 panels and without wavering in his daily life and this happens because he developed this possibility in a last chapter and gave an ending that is cowardly because it doesn’t close plots and leaves to the viewer with the say don't show, the society of heroes felt the same way because in the end beyond Ochako, not even Shoji interests me because his work is "yes he did a lot, believe me" and that is due to how the plot of heteromorphic discrimination was practically forgotten.

Well, I think I said everything I wanted to say and it makes me sad that a profession like this feels like something of a loser when I have great respect for the people who get up every day to teach their students, especially those who do it because they really believe that they are creating a future and above all at such low salaries, at least in my country.

[lakesbian]

can I please hear more about how sy and jamie don’t have the usual wildbow "no homo" vibe.

i'm extremely interested after seeing the quotes you pull out.

so when i call something a Wildbow No Homo Moment i'm referring to the moments where his writing demonstrates disdainful, spiteful, defensive insecurity about the idea of characters he's envisioned as straight being viewed as gay. when he did shit like write lisa literally turning to the camera after hugging taylor to tell people not to get the wrong idea & forum post about how all of the undersider girls are straight and "pandering is pandering," the clear message was that he thought characters being interpreted as gay would automatically ruin the meaning of their relationships: turn them into something cheapened and emotionally shallow, something silly and stupid and inferior to a normal, meaningful friendship between two normal, heterosexual women. it says a lot abt how he was viewing the idea of his characters being seen as gay (& obviously viewing gayness itself) as like. a grubby, vapid, self-centered, annoying intrusion onto his Well Written Female Friendships. it's fundamentally refusing to take the possibility of his main characters being gay seriously, and demonstrating that refusal by mocking and rejecting the possibility at every opportunity.

now to be clear. this isn't touching on the subject of whether or not we should get after wildbow for other complaints about jamie. but sy and jamie do not have that specific brand of wildbow no-homoing going on, at all. there's not that dripping spiteful insecurity about the idea of them being interpreted as gay--they're literally constantly holding hands, snuggling close, talking intimately together, etc., and it's never followed by sy turning to the camera and going "OH BOY I LOVE BEING HETEROSEXUAL AND SURE HOPE NO ONE INTERPRETS MY PLAYING FOOTSIE WITH JAMIE AS MEANING I'M GAY FOR HIM!" in fact, jamie is gay, and he is severely in love with sy, and it is taken as serious and meaningful and interesting and worthy of heavy narrative focus and emotional contemplation. you could call it bad taste in other ways, but sy being straight and confronted by The Difficulty of it is already not the same thing as wildbow blowing airhorns and going "fuck you for wanting to imagine characters as gay" every 3 seconds. also frankly sy sitting up for several hours at 2 am trying really hard to mentally turn himself gay for jamie is so. well i can't even call it funny even though it might sound that way in a void. but it's so Something that i'm inclined to grant wildbow clemency just to see more of whatever the fuck is going on with those two