#it doesnt matter if its as bad as we think its going to be | Explore Tumblr posts and blogs

emoboybrony · 1 day ago

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Thanks for the thorough response! (Honestly i wasnt expecting people to even read my long ass post) i love healthy fandom discourse and long debates over different interpretations. I find enjoyment from media by dissecting it and figuring out what makes it tick and you cant really do that without multiple views and interpretations.

I will admit my language in the orginal post was very over the top and purposeful shit posty in nature. Even if i did mean and still agree what i wrote i still could of put it alot more thoughtfully. So let me clarify i do see laurence as a character deserving of empathy. I think reducing him to a literal irredeemable monster is just as reductive as reducing him to a poor little baby who can do no wrong. Both make his character just inheritly unintresting to me.

But i will argue a couple of your points.

1. Aphmau "leading him on" doesnt really work as an argument because even if she made the first move, context clues are a thing. There is a point where, if we are to see laurence as an emotionally intelligent character, he needs to get the hint that they are not in the space to engage this way. Not only that, but a lack of concrete boundaries doesnt make his constant testing of them understandble to me, its a classic issue of "you need a yes, not just a lack of a no". Its inherently irresponsible to keep pushing without at least checking that it is accetable first.

(Also, side note because my friends just pointed this out to me, aphmau only kissed laurence because he was going on a murder spree and was trying to snap him out of it. That adds a whole new context to that scene which i will circle back to)

2. I have my own read and opinions of MCD Aarmau (made a whole spotify playlist about it with my friends) but in a nutshell, i dont view it as explicitly romantic. I read it as a senario where aphmau was so isolated from everything happening, and aaron (as a former lord) was the only one around who could truly relate and give advice about what she was going through. This could be seen as a happy ending or "better", if it werent for the fact that aaron proceeds to explode before they could really work through what was actually between them. Ignoring that this guy who she clearly had an intimate and trusting relationship with, a relationship she will now never get closure on. Leaving her with two children who will now be without a father. Not only that, but aaron kind of accidentally leaves her with a complex, how whole letter basically advises her to put her people first no matter what, which isnt great when shes clearly struggling under the weight of it all.

3. While it is easy to empathise and understand why laurence would feel hurt at the people he loves treating him like hes dangerous, its kinda hard to blame them when they are objectivly correct. Even if you want to argue its a self fulfilling prophesy, he is the one doing the fulfilling. It doesnt really matter how much of a bad time someones going through, as soon as you start punching walls its an act of abuse. You cant really blame people for treating it that way.

4. This is where it gets real tricky im gonna be honest. But it is an undeniable fact that, regardless of the context and explanations provided by the canon, the information is being delivered to an audience that lives in reality. A reality where patriarchy is a thing, and misogyny is a thing. Where people attempt to justify mens abuse and murder of women. "He had trauma" "she lead him on" "male loneliness epidemic" these are things that exsist in our real lives and are going to inform how we consume fiction. It is also going to have an effect on how artists write their fiction, intentionally or not. It is very hard for me to see these reasons and explanations for laurence's charcter and not immediately make connections to my real world experiences as an afab person perceived as a woman. Take the werewolf wedding, you could see that as aphmau blurring the lines sure, but you could also see it as a woman being in the cross fire of a mans violent outburst and having to choose between her bodily autonomy or her personal saftey. In my opinion, there is no way to seperate laurence's actions (or garroth's tbh) association with real world violence against women, because that is the context this fiction resides in. There is no way to not plainly see the correlation without employing some truly staggering cognitive dissonance or just pure distilled ignorance. In this way i could be biased, but imo its would irresponsible of me not make a mental note of it. (No accusations from me against anyone, dont get it twisted. This is more my personal philosophy when it comes to media consumption, not a standard i hold other people to)

Again thanks for responding! I honestly found your input really intresting to read. To add a lil note to point 2, i actually think your persective of aphmau withholding closure to her and laurence's realtionship (although i dont really agree) does add a fun tragic irony to the idea that aphmau never got closure on her attempt at a relationship. Ill definitely be putting that in my back pocket for future fics.

Ill admit ive never been that into laurence (any his variations really) but something has been really bothering me since rewatching parts of MCD.

What really caught my attention about MCD Laurence is that he starts out as this well adjusted, loyal knightly and charming guy- and then after he becomes a shadow knight you just see this slow decay of him. Like hes slowly losing parts of himself and its causing him to become more and more unstable to the point where by the end of season 2 hes honestly kind of terrfying.

And ALOT of that is reflected with how his relationship with aphmau starts to shift. He goes from this sweet, suave and honestly pretty silly personality, to being so obsessive and vindictive towards her.

Theres this one scene, at the end of ep 95 S2, where aphmau has just essentially seen a ghostly image of aaron and is really shaken up by it. Laurence comes to sit with her and ask her about it. And at first, it genuinely seems like hes just trying to get her to open up so he can support her. But then it quickly spirals into him demanding to know why she cares about aaron so much and why shes greiving so hard for him, like its a problem. He becomes so aggressive and condensending to the point where Garroth has to intervene and he walks off.

In this moment you see how far hes really fallen, he goes from semingly reasuring and gentle, and by the end of it hes disrepecting a dead man, who gave his life to save both his brother and supposed love of his life, who he travelled and fought along side with for months, who close to the end of his life was taking care of an orphan (something he comlimented in aphmau), and hes thowing all of that out the window because hes taken Aphmau's attention, due to the fact he fucking died.

After that happens, aphmau has a conversation woth vlyad where he basically tells her that laurence has to accept what he is and go to the nether or else hes gonna go insane, and that the only reason he came back is because hes "chasing a fantasy". Aphmau responds by suggesting they get cadenza over so that he can be with family, and vlyad says she can do what she wants but implies its pretty much inevitable that laurence is going to hit a breaking point. And hes completely right.

Before laurence even gets to speak to cadenza, he eavesdrops on the conversation where aphamu reveals shes pregnant, and just immediately peaces out, out of fear that hes going to MURDER HER.

Not to mention that in that conversation, cadenza herself tells aphmau not to tell laurence because shes scared of how he would react. He has gotten so unstable that his own sister, who loves him more than anything, can recognise that he is a danger to some degree and shes RIGHT.

All this paints a stark contrast, the laurence we first met vs the man he has now become. Its tragic because its this inevitable downfall brought on by an act that was completely selfless, him sacrificing himself that got him turned into a shadow knight in the first place.

Even this is eventually tainted, his selfless act becomes a selfish one as he seems to cling to aphmau's love and affection as an emotional crutch. Aphmau obviously loves and cares for him deeply, but not in an explicitly romantic/sexual way. And if she doesnt love him the way he wants, then why is he suffering through this? Why did he bother to sacrafice himself at all if theres no reward? Its honestly horrifying how pretty much everyone who loved and respected him, makes what should be incredibly out of place predictions on him, but they always end up being right except for aphmau. She cant accept that hes changing and theres nothing she or anyone else can do change that. Its gut wrenching.

This all lead me to beileve that i didnt give enough credit to his character. I love this. This is the type off tragic story telling im here for. Theres so much more to this character than i ever expected.

Heres the thing.

Why the fuck do laurence's biggest fans seem to just completely disregard this? If you believed a good portion of the fandom, laurence is just this sauve uwu sad boy who was unfairly rejected and ignored by a woman who demamded the world from him.

Im dead serious, i saw people saying that laurence "deserved better than aphmau", that he deserved someone who recognised the sacrafice he made. Which like- there is so much to unpack there.

First of all, aphmau did recognise his sacrafice, she did love him and try to support him in the best way she could, even when literally everyone around her was saying it was a lost cause. She did everything she could for that man and forgave so much of what he did while struggling with the calling and she got nothing but shit for it.

Second of all, no the fuck he doesnt?? As illustrated in the examples above he did not respect Aphmau's boundaries. He did not respect her feelings. And by the end, he didnt even respect her bodily autonomy. Lets be honest here, he basically abandoned everyone he apprantly "loved", because bro tapped it before he could. She loved him so much, but because he wanted something she wasnt willing or able to provide, that being explicitly romantic and sexual attention, he just didnt see it. To try and argue that hes the real victim here, is in the same vain of "nice guys finish last". Him being kind, compassionate and selfless- shouldnt be reliant on whether or not this woman will fuck him or not. That is an insanely misogynistic way of thinking.

But most important to me in the context of this analysis- what is there to like about laurence with this interpretation? What possibly sets him apart from the gazillion other brunette pretty anime bois? Am i to gay for this? Is there something im not seeing?

I understand fanon can wildly divert from canon, and i understand that alot of this is probably down to the fact that i find dissecting and critiquing canon more intresting than reinventing it through fanon. Im locked into the Baldurs gate 3 fandom and i had the same experience there (laurence fangirls got NOTHING on Astarion girlies). But both experiences have left me with the same question- what draws you to a character, when all you do is boil them down to their most generic aspects?

I find Laurence intresting cause we are seeing this man crash out and become a monster in real time. And i dont see how he is worth even an honourable mention, when you take that away.

What is there left to be compelled to?

#aphblr #laurance zvahl #mcd laurance #i love love love healthy discourse you have no idea guys

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