#im literally doing this just to avoid a lawsuit

[astroninaaa]

hiii hope ur doing well !! i was just wondering if there was ever an update on the cellbit v flavia/twitter cases?

hiiiii i’ve been doing well!!! thank you for asking!!!!

not much that i know of actually!! the flávia case we’ll probably mainly not know anything about until it’s done becaaaaause it’s a criminal case there’s a big investigation going they’ll avoid it being publicized as much as possible i think. the process isn’t even public like the twitter one is (at least that i know of)

regarding the twitter one i actually went to look it up because i haven’t looked at it in quite a bit and the sentencing was published literally 4 days ago.

basically, the only thing he asked for that was denied was for these like connection and technology companies to identify the twitter users with the info twitter has given on them. which might sound confusing im not sure if i’m translating everything right 😭😭😭

however his claims to have the posts deleted was accepted and confirmed and twitter does need to provide the data on the users who made those posts.

the decision also agreed that what’s happening with cellbit is more than just criticism and regular response that any famous person gets, including the accusations of having committed crimes etc.

moreover, the judge decided that twitter has to provide data from those users regarding IP addresses, names, e-mail addresses used on the accounts, and usage of the account regarding the last six months. this applies to brazilian and international accounts ALIKE, since, from the judge’s understanding, since the posts and content were available in brazil, they’re subject to brazilian law.

i had mentioned how the international accounts were sort of a spot on the process i wasn’t sure would amount to nothing, but it did! very interesting precedent. so yeah, that’s how that’s going :)

if anyone fell down out of nowhere here feel free to look back on my blog i have plenty of posts explaining everything that happened with cellbit legally and what the lawsuits mean 🙏🙏 im a law major in brazil yikes

[ceasarslegion]

Im thinking of this again because ive told a lot of people in the last few weeks about the hot coffee incident with GTA:SA. The question of child-unfriendly media is coming up more again recently as bills questioning tiktok's place on the internet and KOSA get pushed through on international stages. Bills like KOSA dont just affect the states, they'll affect the world from how much of the internet's infrastructure is american. And in some places they did a damn good job of convincing others it's "just for kids' safety online," and the hot coffee incident is a really good and more recent legal example of why that attitude does more harm than good.

Thing is, I'm not inherently opposed to the establishment of an AO rating. It makes a sort of sense to distinguish between M and AO in video games for the same reason you distinguish between R and NC-17 in cinema. M has your typical expectations for a game for adults like overt sexuality and realistic violence and substance use etc, AO takes it to the next level with more specific content warnings like for pornographic content or realistic gore.

What i am opposed to is how getting slapped with an AO rating is like becoming a games industry pariah. It's almost treated like a punishment, and it will haunt your studio and developers and stay with you for years. Its led to studios who make M-rated games tiptoeing around the ESRB to avoid ANYTHING that could even be remotely argued as AO-deserving to the point where Bethesda doesn't even allow nsfw mods on their official modder's platform. And it's not really because Bethesda gives a shit if someone mods their personal copy of Skyrim to give the dragons big dicks or whatever, it's because even the actions of completely independent consumers could put them through what Rockstar went through with San Andreas. I don't think any studio really cares what their players do with their copies on their own time, but it's the studio's ass on the line if anything at all could trigger another day in court.

Not to mention that, because of how hot coffee played out, retailers refuse to stock AO rated games. You can't find them in gamestop, or on steam, or any third party platform digital or physical. The vast majority of gamers get their games through third party retailers, meaning you've not only socially doomed a studio, but also given them a financial death sentence. Do you think the average person knows how to get their hands on an AO rated game? Or will be committed enough to getting one that they'll ask reddit and sift through hundreds of comments looking for the one person with the answer and not asking the same question?

And even if all AO rated games were quite literally just porn like their reputation tends to suggest, does it matter? Isn't it still censorship when you are taking a particular type of media and saying through all but title that it's not allowed to be made or stocked on anybody's shelves because it might corrupt the children, especially when they aren't meant for children in the first place? And as hot coffee showed us, that content doesn't even have to be in the accessible game files to trigger a lawsuit, you could have to hack it to get it and they would still call it a corrupting force that needs to be punushed.

The AO rating is disingenuous. It's just a way to punish studios for making games for adults that conservative parents don't like because they can't be bothered to parent their own children. It's stifling creativity by limiting the scope of what studios are allowed to make and keeping the whole industry in a state of perpetual fear of what the backlash will be if their game content in their GAME FOR ADULTS is considered "too inappropriate for children." And even when they are just porn games, it's not your business what adults want to play in their free time. It's still censorship when it's just porn, and it's not a game studio's responsibility to protect your children beyond slapping a label on the box saying it's not meant for kids.

Would anyone like my rant on the AO ESRB rating after i do my dishes

[sasukeologist]

When i said i was gonna steal kishimotos art style so i could remake naruto from scratch myself. I was not joking.

[yandere-sins]

hello??? i see you write for fnaf??? this is new?? well, since you do, might as well ask for yandere monty with an emotional-jumpy reader(this one blog i read does this kind of reader a lot and im like- obsessed?? love the opposites tbh)

So, I hope I got this right. It’s probably not like what you’re used to but it wouldn’t have fit the idea I had otherwise. Thanks for your request!

»»———————— ♡ ————————««  

Working late was bad enough.

You didn't need the extra hours so badly that you wanted to stay even later than your schedule, but the overtime was terrible considering the prestigious company you were working for. Outwardly, Freddy Fazbear was a brand with worldwide recognition. Inside? A dumpster fire. Quite literally, as you already had to settle 5 cases of spontaneous fires that occurred this week alone. God, you hated it here.

If not for the immensely well-paid opportunity it gave you, you'd have given your notice a long time ago. Aside from constant complaints and lawsuits you had to deal with as (one of) their lawyers, you also had to deal with creepy staff and the more than unsettling, possibly deadly machines roaming the area. Seriously, who allowed robots to walk and talk as if they were human? It was so fucking weird.

"Sweetling ~" The echo of your nickname resounded through the endless dark underground tunnels and made you flinch. Judging by the lack of robotic sounds, you knew you weren't in immediate danger of running into the worst of them all. Still, his voice dragged along the metal walls the same way his claws did. With goosebumps tingling on your skin, you walked faster, cursing your formal attire of skirt and pumps, wishing you had chosen the suit and flats combo today instead.

You already hated how people looked at you when you revealed as much as your calves and ankles. As if you lived in the past where it was scandalous to even show that much. But it had been a warm day. You wanted to appreciate the breeze blowing between your legs at lunch if you already had to sit in your office with a broken AC all day. It just wasn't of any help now that you had to hurry.

Soon the gates would close, and you had already wasted too much time packing up your work to continue it at home. It was late. You wanted to leave and not sleep on the couch in the lunchroom again. And you especially didn't want to get confronted by Monty.

It was impossible for him to sneak up on you with his engines so loud and his steps so heavy. But you kept ignoring his presence as long as you could, hoping to escape from this piece of metal with a record for hurting children. "There you are, Darling," he chuckled as he rounded the corner of the hallway you had just come from. His body rattled as he dragged it towards you, footsteps multiplying as did yours, your whole body tensing like that of prey having smelled its predator.

Clearly, he had been searching for you.

But feeling your heart trying to jump out of your chest to get a headstart, you didn't intend to wait for him.

Montgomery Gator had no regard for your apparent dismissal of his presence, and you had an inkling why. He caught up to you, hand slamming into the wall right before you. It made you jerk so hard as you were in danger of running into his metal arm, stopping just because his body closed in so much you were forced with your back into the same wall he was leaning against. "Where are you going?" he snarled, and you avoided his eyes, raising your handbag with the papers in front of you like a shield. A pretty useless one, considering the sharp parts he had been given to make him seem even 'cooler'.

It was hard to look at him with him being so... inhuman. The way he talked, laughed, and played around, he seemed to have a personality, a heart. But through the tinted glasses, his painted, unreal eyes shone just as unsettling fake as the rest of him.

"Thought you'd come visit me today, Sweets. Been waiting for ya at the course all day."

Trying hard not to look at him when his snout lowered to eye level, your gaze attempted to find an exit anywhere. But there was no ducking out from under his arms or pushing him away like you might attempt with a human. For someone as bulky and heavy as he was, Monty had the speed and range of two humans, and you still wore pumps. "S-Sorry..." you muttered, gripping your bag tighter. His eyes wandered to your chest temporarily, and you weren't sure if you were getting warmer from his mechanical presence or from your nervousness.

"I- I worked all day."

"Then let's go now."

Grabbing your wrist, you felt an overwhelming frustration. Your bag was slipping from your hand, and you didn't want to go with him. You wanted to go home, take a bath, and sleep in your cozy bed. Not stay in this shitty place, play minigolf until you passed out, and then sneak a shower in the morning with one of the hoses used to wash the robots. And also, it scared you to be alone with him after hours. Shitless.

You've never been one doing well with scary things. Things like haunted mansions and horror movie nights. And those animatronics—especially those with claws and sharp teeth—were right out of your nightmares. They changed. You had no proof of it, but they were like totally different creations once it was light out. More... dangerous. Clingy. Feral.

"I can't!" you squeaked, your voice cracking a little too obviously, and Monty halted in his tracks, turning around slowly with his head falling to the side. Like this, he didn't seem so intimidating, but the moment he opened his mouth in what was his way of smiling, the illusion was already over.

"You promised, Babe," he purred. In the nicest way of saying, "I am trying to be patient, but you're testing me," a robot could do. A shudder ran down your back, mixing with the already existing goosebumps and tension inside you.

"P-Please, I really have to go. I have all these cases, and I am so tired. I'm sorry... we can play some other time."

His gaze drifted to your handbag again and then up to your eyes. He grumbled something under his breath that you didn't understand but finally let you go. You felt a wave of relief come over you, and you let out a deep breath, shoulders slumping as the tension disappeared.

But even though he let go of you, he instead gripped your handbag. You flinched in surprise, unable to keep holding it as he tore it out of your hands with superior strength you had no chance against. Before you knew it, he pulled the papers out of your bag, tossing the cheap faux leather to the side before lifting the documents to his mouth.

In utter disbelief and horror, you had to watch as he shredded your work in his teeth. Documents you needed and depended on were gone and ripped apart in a matter of seconds. All while he made comical sounds of eating right out of a kids' show. Unable to say anything to make him stop, you just watched until he was done, spitting out the rest with crumbles drifting from his teeth to the ground.

"W-Why...?" you muttered, and his attention shifted back to you.

"New game," he announced, cheekily flashing you his teeth in a grin, showing off the paper stuck inside his mouth. "You run, and if you get to the doors in time, you leave for tonight. And if I catch you before that..."

Gulping, you feared asking him to finish the sentence. Quivering, you knew you wouldn't get out of this, even if you argued with the robot. He wasn't human. He had no conscience, no matter how well-programmed he was. Feeling the burn of tears in your eyes, you carefully slipped out of your pumps, locking his gaze with yours even though it was almost impossible to win a stare-down with him. But this way, he wouldn't be able to see what you were doing, too focused on you and the morsel of your attention you were giving him.

"What happens then?" you whispered fearfully, never avoiding your gaze to watch his mouth open wider, showing his excitement as he flexed his mechanical fingers and swished his long tail.

"If I catch you, you stay. Forever, Darling."

There was no agreeing or refusing his conditions. No matter how much you were shaking, wanting to throw up, cry and cower in a corner. All you could do was look at him as if captivated by his glowing eyes in the dark when the sudden announcement rang through the speakers.

10 minutes before it closes, you thought, swallowing down the lump of fear in your throat.

And with a deafening roar of bellowing laughter behind you, you began to sprint faster than you ever had. Always followed by the heavy footsteps of your pursuer.

[philipkindreddickhead]

I often seen critiques of make up from an existential/philosophical perspective, but I rarely see criticism of cosmetics from a stand point of the very physical bodily harm it does. I think this is because the number of dangerous ingredients is so massive, and overlapping its an absolutely daunting task. So I've compiled the information I've found and bear with me its a lot. (This is from an American perspective. Sorry, thats what I know. However I would love it if people from other countries had things to add.)

First I want to get the "simple" stuff out of the way. I think almost everyone has heard about bacteria and fungi in makeup and that makeup causes acne from clogging pores. Makeup has a pretty strict shelf life, yet consumers are entirely supposed to self-police as Ive never seen a single expiration date on any cosmetic packaging. (I guess consumers are meant to pull this knowledge out of the ether or something. I only found out about it in a tumblr PSA. I did read that expirys are on products in Europe.) Beauty blenders are the worst offender because theyre almost always moist. When I was taught makeup I was told to wet my sponge so it would soak up less product. If you apply makeup daily your sponge is likely constantly damp. USA Today had an article which said that 96% of sponges had fungi and over 60% had E. Coli in them. But I think what people talk about less is the complication of problems from using other products in conjunction with dirty beauty blenders. USA Today warns its especially dangerous to use beauty blenders if you have damage to your skin like acne, cuts, or dry skin. However the most popular beauty products for washing your face contain walnut pieces for literally scrubbing your skin and creating microabrasions. If youre a frequent makeup user you probably know about the cyclical nature of applying foundation, breaking out, and then applying more foundation to cover the breakout. You may even be using scrubbing cleansers more frequently to combat the acne creating more tears. This can lead to "blood poisoning" and, though neither USA today or Forbes mentions this, blood poisoning (not a medical term btw. Its sepsis.) according to numerous medical sites has the potential to be extremely lethal. The symptoms are so similar to a regular flu its nearly impossible to self-diagnose.

The very first thing I was told when a friend handed me a jar of finishing powder- popular with many beauty gurus for the "baking" technique and considered a must have- was a joke about "clown lung." This was a reference to the main ingredient talc. Talc causes lung problems including cancer and respiratory illness. If anyone remembers the large Johnson and Johnson lawsuit from 2019 it was because theyd been putting talc into baby powder. Talc is dangerous because it's impossible to mine and seperate from ASBESTOS. Some high-end finishing powders will try to sell you on safe talc-free formulas but all the products I looked into contained mica instead which causes pneumoconiosis, colloquially known as "black lung disease." Like fucking coal miners get. Its not just present in finishing powder either. In my research it turned out that talc/asbestos are also present in many eyeshadows and other powder products. [Googleable, evidenced in J&J lawsuit]

Another industry to examine is nail salons. Toluene, Formaldehyde, Dibutyl Phthalate, and Methacrylate compounds are all dangerous ingredients and present in various salon products. These ingredients cause a range of problems from dizziness, drowsiness, birth defects, slow fetal growth, future intellectual disabilities in the fetus, eye skin and throat irritation, coughing, allergic reactions, asthma-like attacks, short-term memory loss, nausea, dermatitis, cancer, and misscarriage. Some nail products advertise that they are 3-free meaning that toluene, formaldehyde, and DP should be absent but often the labels are found to be completely inaccurate. It should be noted that the risk is mainly to salon workers and not patrons but ask yourself if it is right to place other people at serious risk for your aesthetic. OSHA does make an attempt to mitigate these risks however not once in my years of makeup queen did I see a salon following these directives which include constant air monitoring, half mask respirators with chemical cartridges, gloves, long sleeves, and safety glasses. (And Im not even going to touch issues of human trafficking/slave labour out of nail salons one case of which occured 5 days ago two hours away from me) It should also be noted that formaldehyde can also be found in hair relaxers and hair dyes. [Found articles in Scientific American and NYT]

I also found on the FDAs website that many cosmetics include heavy metals like arsenic, mercury, and lead. (Usually accompainied by a picture of lipstick so I assume that is the product most likely to contain it, however campaign for safe cosmetics lists foundation as containing heavy metals, and The Guardian has an article about skin lighteners from Asia and Africa containing mercury.) The website stated that the amount of these heavy metals in cosmetics is "safe" if used as intended. (and I'm going to come back to the concept of "intended use" later because thats a can of worms too) However, when searching for info on heavy metal safety I found this quote in regards to metals in food:

"Certain metals, such as arsenic, lead and mercury, have no established health benefit, and have been shown to lead to illness, impairment, and in high doses, death. Understanding the risk that harmful metals pose in our food supply is complicated by the fact that no single food source accounts for most people’s exposure to metals in foods. People’s exposure comes from many different foods containing these metals. Combining all of the foods we eat, even low levels of harmful metals from individual food sources, can sometimes add up to a level of concern"

So like, which is it? Is it a "safe amount" or is no amount of metal safe? I understand that in the case of certain foods like fish some amount of mercury poisoning is always expected but fish is also something you feed yourself and nourish your body with while cosmetics are completely unecessary to your survival. The mercury problem in fish is also mitigated by health warnings when mercury levels are particularly high but cosmetics have no such warning. Another warning on the site indicated that children should ingest NO amount of lead AT ALL because it is particularly harmful for kids yet theres no effort to stop children from using lead-containing cosmetics. I worked next to a Five Below where I was shocked to find they sold Jeffree Star and Anastasia eyeshadow dupes for five dollars which amounts to fucking pocket change for a lot of kids and kids do buy that stuff. I also think its ironic the FDA would have anything to say regarding cosmetics because in the very same article about heavy metals in cosmetics the FDA says that they DO NOT REGULATE cosmetics beyond the color additives.

Mascara, eyeliner, lipstick, and brow tint often contain carbon black. This is a color additive that is an incomplete combustion of carbon-based products. It can cause lung disease, cancer, and organ system toxicity, and eye, nose, throat irritation. The effects are mainly studied in rats and those at biggest risk are industrial workers but why do other workers have to endure lung problems for something so unecessary? [Easily googleable, NIH, CDC, WHO Europe]

This next bit I only want to mention briefly because I didnt find any particularly reputable sources about it, but its a claim that cropped up repeatedly and I think its an interesting one. Parabens, estrogen, phthalates (again), and pesticides in cosmetics are apparently linked to endocrine disorders and hormone dysregulation. Im not entirely sure what is meant by this accusation. Endocrine disorders include female diseases like PCOS and possibly endometriosis. None of these diseases is very well studied and the female endocrine system itself is not well studied either. Im not saying "cosmetics cause PCOS" because we dont know if PCOS or these other endocrine/hormonal disorders are genetic or environmental or both (it appears that PCOS is largely genetic and Endometriosis is likely autoimmune related) AND we dont appear to know for sure that cosmetic ingredients cause endocrine disorder. But I include anyway for a number of reasons:

If you happen to struggle with hormonal problems you may want to know cosmetics is a potential environment factor.

These conditions are incredibly painful. It will be a battle getting your doctor to even acknowledge that pain for diagnosis. PCOS is linked to diabetes, and heart disease. [Thanks @mother-of-pearl ] There is no cure and the treatments are often throwing hormonal birth control at it and hoping for the best.

I dont anticipate the link between cosmetics and endocrine disorders being studied any time soon or any endocrine disorders studied at all because the medical/scientific field is sexist. I dont want women to suffer in the mean time.

Now again, take this with a grain of salt because I couldnt find scientific or news sources for it. Dont fucking come for me. Im not gonna respond to you. [Most reputable source was a paper from the library of medicine at the national institutes of health but it was behind a paywall and I dont have 39 dollars to be right on tumblrdotcom]

Avoiding these ingredients is not as simple as scanning the label for them. As many beautubers and the community are no doubt aware considering multiple scandals over veganism. Products advertised as vegan or cruelty free but contain non-vegan carmine or are sold in China which legally requires the products to be animal tested. Cosmetic companies will hide ingredients claiming they are "trade secrets" or they will be placed under "fragrance." Many ingredients will be known by six or seven different names and asking consumers to be aware of seven different names for multiple ingredients requires consumers to be aware of innumerable different, often complicated ingredient names. I shouldnt have to point out that's a ridiculous burden to place on women. The EU banned 1,300 hazardous ingredients that the US did not. Cosmetic companies rely on women being unwilling/unable to bring in a list of 1,300 ingredients- with multiple names- every time they pop in to the drug store, sephora, or wherever. Buying "natural" products will not help you either. Theres no established criteria for natural/organic in costmetics, the FDA doesnt test these products, and "natural"=/= safe anyway. Plenty of plants and minerals are poisonous. One good example is traditional kohl products which advertise their natural status but also naturally contain lead and reiterating that natural powders contain mica. US courts are rarely on the side of consumers either. I found an interesting lawsuit against St. Ives for their apricot scrub taken to court for their "dermatologist tested" label despite it causing breakouts and cuts to the skin. The courts ruled that this label was fine because it only indicated that the product was TESTED not APPROVED by dermatologists. However I think any rational consumer would look at this label and assume the tests concluded it was safe for use or else why put the label on there?

[Googlable XMONDO drama, googlable laws wrt china and eu, already stated about FDA, FDA website about Kohl. Googled St. Ives lawsuit.]

I want to return to the idea of "intended use." This is sort of a fucky concept a lot of companies have ways of getting around. My "last straw" with makeup had to do with a run-in I had with Anastasia over their "Riviera" eyeshadow palette. In this pallette they had two colors that were the real feature of the palette, an electric neon purple and a radioactive pink I mean every photo, every promotion has these two colors swirled together around the eye. Because again, its an eyeshadow palette. When I buy the eyeshadow palette of course there's a little insert warning in the package that says these two shades are not intended on the eye area. In an eyeshadow palette. Contacting their customer service they told me that these two shades were meant to be used as a blush. neon purple blush. Not only that, but their website and instagram featured NO models wearing the shades as blush while EVERY model one or more of the shades as eyeshadow. When asked about this discrepancy ABH stopped responding. What I find egregious about this is the amount of people who dont know, and then more staggeringly; dont care. The sephora clerks didnt know, the in store abh representative didnt know, their customers didnt know, and when I told them they would respond with "oh, [brand] did the same thing with their [shade]." Sure enough, when I demanded that store clerks open the packaging to look for warnings nearly every product had an "eyeshadow" that was not intended for use on the eyes. Relegating dark, red-toned teal to "contour" and neon grean to "highlighter" US-based cosmetic junkies will say that these pigments have been approved for use by the EU however I found absolutely NO evidence of that. I googled it a thousand ways but all I ever found were blog posts, reddit comments, and one quote from an apparently nonEuropean layman in an Insider article. I even changed my location to France on ABH's website and the Norvina palette still contains the same warnings (not to harp on ABH in particular. I just know which shades in particular are the problem there). The Insider article noted that brands who were selling pressed pigments declined to comment. If the pressed pigments were EU friendly, I would think companies would be clamouring to say so. It also still makes their market as eyeshadow colors illegal in the US. (If any Europeans would like to chime in I'd love that.) Another problem I find with cosmetics companies and their reps is the claim that the worst thing that could happen is eye irritation for those with sensitive eyes and staining. How could they possibly know? The FDA doesnt test, or approve these cosmetics in the eye area, so ostensibly no one should be using it that way.

The next one is a bit of a "duh" but I'm going to talk about it anyway. Counterfeit cosmetics are a booming market full of untold dangers. Untold primarily because these products could contain literally anything. Ive read about glue, arsenic, lead, feces, staph, and horse urine to name a few. The labels and ingredient list on these products are fake. Legitimate brands often unintentionally play into the counterfeit market. They create artificial scarcity by making less of the product than is actually needed for consumer demand to create an even higher demand. If consumers miss out often their only chance at getting the product is to turn to counterfeits. I found examples of women who had their lips superglued, lips "turned to goo" and burned to blistering, throat closures, women with stys, contact dermatitis, eye infections. I think we as a society turn a blind eye to this problem because we think "hey, if youre buying counterfeits for a discount and you get hurt you deserve it." We imagine idiots buying products for 4 dollars from ebay or perusing Canal street for FEИTY beauty. But these counterfeits can be really convincing. I myself received a gift of a huda palette that I only recognized something was weird about it because I'd swatched it at sephora about five times earlier that month. The person who bought it for me actually paid MORE than the usual cost for the palette because it was advertised as a newer, better edition. The websites can be disturbingly similar. For instance Kylie Jenner's legitimate website is KylieCosmetics.com but you can find fakes at kyliecosmeticsshop.co.uk. These fakes can buy ad space and be one of the first sites that populate when you google the products instead of typing the legitimate site into the address bar. Counterfeits can also be bought and sold through third parties on websites like ebay, wish, and amazon. (My gift actually came from Amazon.)

[Netflix doc "Broken" ep "Makeup Mayhem" Corroborated by personal experience and google]

[evidentlyhuman]

Working in and studying software, I’ve got some frustrations with a number of things with tech spheres. And that’s gonna be clear here, so I’m gonna explicitly lead with the fact I’m not upset with you. There’s gonna be clear frustrations in my tone here, so it’s worthing being explicitly clear they’re not aimed at you.

Anyway, here goes:

Copyright be damned, nicking people’s shit without permission and using it directly is morally taking their work. Like, I’m talking if I went downloading people’s non-CC0 art and reuploading it to my account without attribution. It’s not just a “capitalism problem” or a “lost income” problem. It’s an issue of permission, respect, and denying credit. (Of course, it can be both of those other things too.) What does ownership of art really mean? Is that really me stealing your art?

Consensus is… Yeah I’d be stealing your art and also an asshole. That’s not copyright law, that’s… courtesy. Decency, kindness, an empathy for the time spent making it. That’s not some legalese surrounding copyright law and calling that stealing wouldn’t have needed air quotes around it…

So if that’s a dick move, then doing the same thing but for training data must be different such that it’s no longer a problem when it would be theft in any other context. But AI just launders out the responsibility, just amorizes the problem so that it can’t be traced to a single image. The is no good reason we can’t differentiate between philosophical originality and inspiration… and Stable Diffusion, Midjourney, or anything else using LAION-5B, taking a dataset of images scraped off any website that doesn’t opt out of search engine indexing crawls too, calculating a latent representation, throwing some iterative noise on it, and de-noising it to something “new” other than not wanting to.

While HBomb doesn’t go into detail about it in his video about human plagiarism, chatgpt can be made to hallucinate large swathes of stolen text. He talked about this more on his social media, which is where I learned about it. Honestly, whether ChatGPT was trained off web-scraped data that they had no reasonable means to check the legal status of was NEVER reasonably disputable anyways. The people in this lawsuit may face difficulties proven they personally were stolen from but the fact it’s trained on data they— copyright law be damned— ethically shouldn’t be using is a borderline technical inevitability for an AI that wants to cutting edge like theirs. It’s not something he goes into detail on because “you can make lazy internet content using AI to avoid being traced the way I did here” is neither a hot take nor is how it happens the point.

AI art is, in a non-philosophical, non-“what is true inspiration” sense, a derivation of their training data and random noise. I’ll go further in later, but for now: We don’t have to cast a moral judgement there! Unoriginality is not theft if the images aren’t stolen. You could paste together a straight up collage of CC0 images and it’s totally above-board. (Gonna ask you to put a pin in that thought for now…)

But the unoriginality does mean AI cannot somehow launder theft out of a database filled with theft. Again, copyright law be damned as it well deserves, people nicking your shit without permission or attribution is something it’s not unreasonable to find upsetting! Even if it’s for “training” and not wholly imagemashed into end results.

I think there’s two major ideas that don’t sit right with me here: That theft is an adjective, a physical property of the end result, and not a process for getting there, and the anthropomorphization of the algorithm as having “inspirations” instead of literally using latent representations of their data that they add noise to so they can then try to remove the noise they added to the latent representation.

One thing at a time: Stolen-ness isn’t necessarily something that has to be visible in the end product. Your mentor-post talks a lot about it being different from imagemashing, in that you can’t tell the algorithm was built using stolen art. Which is true, but only in what we see. It’s still using a many-dimensional latent space representation of all the stolen images and how they interact and combining it with noise. The fact we don’t see in multidimensional latent spaces doesn’t change that it’s filled with compressed, abstracted thefts in any LAION-trained alg.

Asking if the output of CC0-trained AI is “purer” only makes sense if stolenness is some kind of measurable physical property of the end result. Theft is a verb. If I have two identical things but I stole one, the stolen one is stolen because of the part of the process where I stole it.

The difference between a CC0 alg and Stable Diffusion is that the latter was built using theft. Even if that’s not an observable property of the end result, theft is what the latent representations that made it are using. The fact you can’t see it doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.

The opposite is also true, having one clear inspiration, a way you can physically trace the source does not make it inherently stolen. The art you included that heavily references the photo you linked is clearly derived. But you still drew it. The similarities are obvious but the differences are yours.

If true, philosophically pure originality existed, which I think we agree it doesn’t, it wouldn’t happen as the number of sources drawn upon grew or approached infinity. It would exist where there were no sources at all. I’m not sure a ‘true’ definition of originality can exist, but if it could I’d say it’s the negative space between your sources and results.

AI built upon datasets which stole from more sources than its output has pixels doesn’t become original when you can no longer trace each one. If you ask me, that process, tuning each pixel little by little so much that any one of the over 5 billion images the “5B” stands for are washed away but the each pixel is slightly tuned by countless of them… I don’t see it as removing theft. I see it as the smothering of any and all negative space originality could have emerged from. Any instance of one image being lifted from can be removed, but morally— as far as datasets of stolen images go— I find removing theft that way rather like trying to dry a spill of water by homeopathically diluting it until none of the original water remains.

A technical necessity, really.

If you try to train one of these on a woefully, and I mean very woefully amount of data, so little it can’t erase the negative space an artist would fill with their work… It doesn’t work. The facade, the illusion of “inspiration” breaks down. Echos of still-recognizable data might reach through, but for the most part it’s a sea of the one and only thing the AI can make for itself. Gaussian noise.

Because it never was really “inspired” by the training data, and it’s not what happens when humans make art. These metaphors of “training” and “learning” that were used to make these ideas easier to understand for a less techie audience have by relating it to a process we understand have become literalized for convincing people taking unfathomable quantities of mostly-stolen art, making a base from it, and noising and denoising it somehow can’t or shouldn’t be distinguished from how humans make art.

Because yeah, “We find constellations in the chaos of the universe, pictures in the noise. Is that our art, or the universe’s?” is clearly poetic allegory… but like with the myth of AI inspiration, the idea that this process isn’t distinguishable from refining actual literal Gaussian noise is also the load-bearing argument here if AI is equally acceptable. And in that context the answer is… no? You’re not BBC Sherlock, attuned to every quivering strand of data in the universe. You don’t start covering the canvas in random noise if cut off from the stars. You can take one photo and make your drawing of it.

It can’t. There’s only one thing Stable Diffusion can do.

Complicated stealing.

Let’s unpin that CC0 thought about unoriginality and moral judgement now. Because I’ve been harsh on the unoriginality of AI art… because it’s being used for what I’d consider ethically stealing. But without that… I got into computing because I love these machines and what they can do. It probably didn’t use neural networking, but I’d point to Klaus and KLaS as examples of computer tools empowering art that couldn’t exist otherwise. They can be powerful, incredible tools when used in the right context.

But the industry around them has taken the attitude of “move fast and break things” to places with real consequences, and when that happens being slow and considerate means you’re playing catch-up. Whether people think it’s “silly” or not for artists to care about their stuff being ripped for AI use, they have reason to care what happens to their work… and have, I think, fair cause to be saddened if it before another drop of data in the ocean of diluted thefts.

It’s not a coincidence that Stable Diffusion got working better and faster than CC0 models. It did that because they cared less about those people. Without controls in place, ethical AI will always be playing catch-up to the complicated stealing.

You’re not the first artist I’ve seen question whether their work is “original enough” nor will you be the last. It’s true that there is no pure originality, and people who fear they’re not good enough, worthy enough, or “me” enough are usually shadowboxing their own insecurities…

But don’t let tech hucksters use those shadows as cover. The fact that no true originality exists, that you cannot stake an idea as yours and yours alone… doesn’t make the complicated stealing machine not built by literally nicking billions of people’s images.

Crypto hid in the philosophical shadows between questions around the ethics of centralized finance, NFTs emerged from questions around digital ownership, the Metaverse claims it will answer isolation in a digital world. But these question aren’t really being considered first. They’re rationalizations for why moving fast and breaking things was fine. Ideological shields for huckers to hide behind.

And now I see— have seen before this and will surely see again after, it’s not just you— the (genuine and true) thoughts of artists about true originality and the inevitably of inspiration and derivation being used to smuggle in the theft algorithm. And whether you’re part of that group personally or not, I also see the insecurities of artists being weaponized by convincing them they’re not worth seeing as different from it…

And every time I see it, I resent the industry that did that to them a little bit more.

"Original" Sin is what i've titled this piece. by me. sorry if you don't have "collapse long posts" enabled. I have many thoughts.

Transcript - References

[anthropwashere]

thank u for the tags yelling at us youths to sit up straight. im only 23 but disabled and my back is about the only part of me that ISNT fucked up yet, so i will attempt to not destroy my spinal cord in your honor (•̀ᴗ•́)و

Gonna take this as an opportunity to go off on a tangent and emphasize how out of nowhere your health can 180 in ways that will have a lasting impact for the rest of your life, and that this can happen at any moment no matter how careful or healthy you try to be

-I grew up poor enough to not have regular access to medical/dental/etc. for years at a time, avoided serious issues by sheer fucking luck and an extended family that did not sign up to raise another kid but thank christ they stepped up for me.

-managed to stay healthy enough to join the Air Force at 18. this was good news because the alternative was being homeless (again), which gosh got old fast. free medical? fuck yeah, uncle sam! my teeth are a mess and it sure would be nice to have glasses again!

-knees started acting up in BMT. slowly got worse as the years passed. haven't needed surgery yet but they make some wild gristly sounds when I go up stairs these days and anything more than a casual running regimen is immediately vetoed

-deployed when I was 22. wearing body armor was Not Great for my upper back. lost ability to pop anything in my spine from the shoulder blades up, gained some truly unsexy shooting pains in exchange

-several years of severe headaches i ignored because lmao childhood trauma and also not wanting to be seen as weak due to being just about the only enlisted woman in almost every unit/office i worked in.

-marriage imploded at 26 which gosh, did NOT do good things for the mild anxiety/depression i'd been staunchly ignoring for like a decade at that point. i used to think commercials for anti-depressants were like, rude satire. nope. that really is just how shitty a brain can get!

-apropos of FUCKALL I woke up one morning just before I turned 27 with a headache that has varied in intensity and location but has never gone away. latest diagnosis is a type of headache that's so persistent and resistant to treatment that there are known cases of people having this type for 30+ years. i could be one of those unlucky fucks! or it could go away tomorrow! we just don't know!

-spent 2018-2021 making EXTENSIVE USE of that free medical trying to figure out what the hell was going on or to at least find literally anything that will help reduce/control it. I have at this moment within arm's reach something like $2k worth of medical devices I got for free to help with the migraines.

-they don't.

-one time i tried to do a tally of how much I would have had to be pay out of pocket for all the primary care visits, the specialty care visits, the physical therapy, the stupid fucking useless acupuncture, the Botox, the ~16 different medications, the ER visits from bad reactions to medications, etc. etc. etc. if i hadn't been in the AF and I decided to go lay down in a dark room with an ice pack and not think about it instead.

-i did spend thousands out of pocket on a chiropractor, massages, and gas to keep driving to all those fucking appointments.

-during all this the constant migraines wreaked havoc on my neck, jaw, and shoulders, which in turn contributed to a vicious cycle of pain where doing anything beyond boiling myself in a dark shower 1-2 times a day did not only seem more trouble than it was worth, but WAS more trouble than it was worth.

-i was also diagnosed with fibromyalgia at 28. the rheumatology clinic gave me a pamphlet that was less informative than a google search and a politely phrased 'you're young and you still have all your limbs, why are you complaining? go away.'

-fibromyalgia diagnosis was given despite more evidence pointing to Sjogren's syndrome, which is an actual autoimmune disorder that sure, won't kill me, but it WOULD explain why my teeth have only gotten worse despite extremely thorough annual workups. it can cause all sorts of fun organ dysfunctions too. i could also go blind! either way neither is curable and whatever i've got showed up a decade earlier than is typically expected for my demographic!

-it wasn't any of the squillion medical experts i saw but literally just some other woman in my squadron who suggested i put my name on the Airborne Hazards and Open Burn Pit Registry, because she developed all sorts of autoimmune fuckery after her deployment. all of That is still being researched and debated and such, and has been for decades. maybe breathing too much sand and burning garbage gave me brain damage! maybe not!

-also during all this i lost half my hair due to damage caused by using Devacurl products. if you use that brand there are currently multiple lawsuits going on! you or your loved ones may be entitled to compensation, etc.

-anyway i turned 30 this year and a month later the Air Force kicked me out with 90% disability pay, a couple anti-depressant/anxiety prescriptions, and 0 fanfare.

-things could have gone so much worse for me and STILL COULD AT ANY MOMENT. I never considered myself invincible when I was younger but my good fucking gracious chronic pain isn't something i'd wish on anybody. i am terrified of the state my body might be in when i'm 40, never mind when i'm actually old. i am terrified of tomorrow. this is probably the severe anxiety talking.

-at least i've managed to avoid the heart disease rampant in my family? so far????

IN CONCLUSION, TO THE YOUTHS:

sit up straight, do some stretches, go for walkies, eat a vegetable, turn the music down a little, clean linens are the best gift you can give yourself, however much water you typically drink in a day it isn't enough, therapy does actually help, it's okay to be mad sometimes but i'm begging you to find at least one thing to laugh about every day, please take care of yourselves, and most importantly ENJOY your bodies while the going's good. this meat is expiring fast and there are no refunds.

[awsugar]

I really don't want to be the one to bring this to your attention but NOBODY is talking about it and this isn't something that should be ignored or brushed off, and lots of people see your blog.

Did you see the disgusting shit Kurt Cobain wrote about in his journal? It's brought up as a footnote in articles about the lawsuit and treated like it's nothing. The man LITERALLY wrote "I like to make an incisions into the belly of infants and then fuck the incision until the child dies." And nobody is talking about it!!!

Like yeah I don't think he ever actually did it, but just writing about it is already going too far! The way people will ignore anything to avoid tainting their nostalgia or hero worship is disgusting! Nothing makes writing that ok!

i do not know why you're telling me this tbh. i'm not really a nirvana fan i've reblogged like a few pics of kurt in my life. like yea that's gross but idk why people treat me like a spokesperson for every shitty thing someone whos not in mcr does when im an mcr blog.

[somnilogical]

case study of optimization style: how kelsey piper optimizes to destroy coordination against injustice

her false face of "worrying about disrespecting jay", was the closest thing she could grab that she thought would get others to optimize for my silence. get local warm bodies to pile upon me for continuing to talk about how to get justice and give more information about different sources of injustice in a way compatible with people who have not completely disabled their general intelligence.

she was worried about her reputation and transfems gaining information that would allow them to coordinate along lines of shared oppression (which would start to erode miri/cfar which she wants to survive in order to have a nice (for her) environment to raise her babies), but thats not a socially defensible reason to object so she laundered it through being “worried about disrespecting jay”

11/12/2019

[14:10] Jay (System of Edo): Sarah Spikes has offered to have REACH do an investigation. I do not know this human, and have barely heard of REACH, but my understanding is that it's some sort of sub-organization that CFAR spawned, roughly. My instinct is to be like, "I believe you will talk to everyone and then conclude that basically no action needs to be taken, so in that case allowing you to do an investigation gives an air of legitimacy to dismissing Jay". Is "REACH is basically CFAR's pet" correct?

[14:10] acertain: afaik reach is unrelated to cfar

[14:11] acertain: and the space is controlled by Sarah Spikes and Nat

[14:11] ratsby: that's also my understanding

[14:11] Jay (System of Edo): I did not mean literally, I meant like in practice, are they complicit, etc

[14:11] Jay (System of Edo): like with CFARs bullshit in general

[14:11] ratsby: weren't REACH the ones who did the Brent investigation?

[14:12] silver-and-ivory: they did something about brent but weren't able to publish the stuff they got bc they believed he would sue them for defamation

[14:12] Jay (System of Edo): Oh wow. Cowards lol

[14:12] Jay (System of Edo): yeah that's pretty much all I need to know.

[14:12] Jay (System of Edo): thanks

[14:13] silver-and-ivory: :( I don't think they're cowards for that

[14:13] silver-and-ivory: but you have all the information i have so w/e

[14:14] acertain: I think reach doing an investigation would mean the reach panel (https://www.berkeleyreach.org/reach-panel), which afaik is a separate set of people from those who decide how the space is run

[14:18] acertain: idk if the list of people on the panel on the website is up to date though

[14:19] stardust: List is up to date

[14:19] stardust: Full Brent statement is available upon request, not fully public because legal risk

[14:20] silver-and-ivory: https://theunitofcaring.tumblr.com/post/182885399661/abuse-allegations-anon-here-i-am-happy-to-hear

[14:20] silver-and-ivory:REACH consulted an attorney about making the result of the Brent investigations public and were told that there was absolutely no way to do this without making each of the investigators individually liable in a defamation lawsuit. I’m also worried they could be sued to reveal the names of people who spoke to them anonymously in the course of the investigation.

[14:21] stardust: We were planning to get liability insurance when we get our legal non profit status but that has not panned out yet

[14:21] stardust: IRS is slow and hard to navigate

[14:22] Jay (System of Edo): okay, this is enough info on REACH, thanks.

[14:24] Jay (System of Edo): just told her not to investigate.

[14:24] ratsby: wait why?

[14:24] stardust: (She is me)

[14:25] Jay (System of Edo): oh.

[14:25] ratsby: I don't see how them investigating could hurt anything

[14:25] Jay (System of Edo):wait why?I don't believe they'll do anything tbh

[14:25] stardust: I will refrain from posting here if you prefer

[14:26] ratsby: seems like some chance of upside, no chance of downside?

[14:26] Jay (System of Edo):>I don't see how them investigating could hurt anything

My instinct is to be like, "I believe you will talk to everyone and then conclude that basically no action needs to be taken, so in that case allowing you to do an investigation gives an air of legitimacy to dismissing Jay". Is "REACH is basically CFAR's pet" correct?

[14:26] Jay (System of Edo):>I will refrain from posting here if you prefer

Yes, thanks.

[14:43] hamnox: The characterization of REACH panel as CFAR's pet feels bizarre. Iirc it got started in no small part because a bunch of locals were pissed off at how CFAR failed to do anything about, and implicitly legitimized, Brent.

[14:58] 𒀭 💮: i dont really know Jay, but i do know that the REACH panel is unjust and about as helpful and necessary as christian missionaries were to native americans. im not reporting my thing to it.linta is on it who made false accusations of emma being indistinguishable from a rapist and somni doing some sort of sex party at their house for social ends of suppression of unrelated dissent. and was generally antitrans in the standard way of saying people are crazy and incoherent, like how people are saying Ziz is schizophrenic when she obviously isnt. i think much of it are populated by lintas friends like mike alicorn and anisha. sarah c, one of the few cis people i trust at this point, had an emotional breakdown about it citing that they dont care about the Law and i think resigned. given the sort of place it is, i bet that none of the REACH panel members are transfem, people can correct me if im wrong.

im kinda for transfems coordinating with each other to the extent they can against people like brent dill, alice monday, lintamande, anna salamon and other agents of injustice. with better game theory than the likes of the REACH panel who flinch at "defamation".

[15:11] SeriesOfSymbols: Umm

Tbh I'm very uncomfortable with the idea that all these people are in the same reference class

[15:11] 𒀭 💮: they are in the reference class of perpetuating injustics

[15:11] lintamande: sort of assuming it would be unhelpful to Jay to litigate disagreements from elsewhere here. I don't know anisha. I don't think ziz is schizophrenic. I never said somni participated in the uninvited surprise orgy in my house, just that I was mad at the people who did. I don't think the REACH panel is good for anything except getting offenders banned from REACH in particular rn, and I think we should maybe check in with Jay about whether the rest of this is helping

[15:11] SeriesOfSymbols: As are

you

And  I

And ziz

Etc

[15:11] SeriesOfSymbols: Nobody is free from sin

[15:12] 𒀭 💮: ^ fallacy of grey

[15:12] 𒀭 💮: like also

[15:12] 𒀭 💮: there is a type difference

[15:12] 𒀭 💮: you socially but not legally implied to avoid culpability

[15:12] lintamande: guys does Jay want to host this conversation

[15:12] 𒀭 💮: the party things i could grep it

[15:13] lintamande: this is the server for helping Jay figure out what we can do to help

[15:13] TowerNumberNine: Jay appears to be idle at present

[15:13] TowerNumberNine: But previously they said there was enough info on REACH

[15:15] deluks917: Agree with Tower the Reach thing should get dropped

[15:15] 𒀭 💮: your "help" is poisoned in the same way that christian missionaries are and you are attempting to funnel peoples sights away from your injustice by framing me as derailing when this is relevant to Jay's needs.

[15:15] 𒀭 💮: and restriction of general intelligence is not.

[15:16] lintamande: somni I am happy to discuss this, I have messaged you offering to discuss this, I just am worried Jay will come back to this and feel like we are disrespecting what they've asked for here and not helping them

[15:16] SeriesOfSymbols: Fallacy of black and white

I think there is a meaningful difference between [rapists and abusers], [person who willfully covered for abuse], and [person who you have disagreements with]

[15:16] 𒀭 💮: i am not worried about this

[15:17] 𒀭 💮: i dont think im disrespecting Jay

[15:17] 𒀭 💮: there is a meaningful difference between stalin and yudkowsky, they are both, however, men.

[15:21] 𒀭 💮: coordination against agents of injustice is important. erasing the pattern of injustice is wrong. saying that all people are the same so we cannot coordinate against injustice because who knows who they are is wrong.it is important for people to know this sort of information so they dont do things like go to REACH expecting justice and then have their plans crumble.

[15:22] 𒀭 💮: people who present REACH as acceptable because "has not everyone sinned" are doing something wrong (linta is not doing this, they are doing a different sort of wrong thing, but also are erasing knowledge of the pattern of injustice)

[15:23] 𒀭 💮: or like if you run this reasoning on people and then apply it to reach with like "it couldnt hurt" are also doing something wrong

[15:24] x.: is there anything at all linta can say or do in this situation which will cause you to believe that they are not doing wrong?

[15:26] x.: (i am not sure how germane this topic is to anything, as this is not a dedicated "The Crimes of Lintamande" server, but so long as the subject is being discussed, i think it warrants asking)

[15:27] 𒀭 💮: yes, stop their suppression of emma and somni, their false claims made to not be culpable in a legal court but also to permeate a social court. stop their optimization for and apologism for cissexism, such in the case of minority stratification. "none of the panel members are transfem but the hosts are" "a lot of people who go to cfar are transfem but afaict none of the staff are" this is a bog standard oppression pattern which linta is familiar with.

[15:27] 𒀭 💮: and several other things.

[15:27] 𒀭 💮: i talked with them for months

[15:28] 𒀭 💮: before slowly and painfully realizing that they didnt care, that the structure they put out fed into evil, agentically. because they talked like my childhood friends who were particularly kind.

[15:28] 𒀭 💮: and i was vulnerable to that.

[15:28] 𒀭 💮: it was really hard to see through this aesthetic to how they were actually optimizing.

[15:29] 𒀭 💮: what effects they were having.

[15:29] x.: perhaps there is some other zone in which this chat would be more appropriate

[15:29] lintamande: that is what I have been saying

[15:29] 𒀭 💮: linta is trying to warp this conversation in that direction

[15:30] 𒀭 💮: because they dislike culpability

[15:30] x.: rather than both of you trying to get the last word in on what's clearly a grotesquely contentious conversation

[15:30] 𒀭 💮: i reject this plea of false peace

[15:30] 𒀭 💮: like

[15:30] 𒀭 💮: what you two are doing are obvious

[15:30] 𒀭 💮: i reject the framing of this not being relevant

[15:30] x.: right, every time one of you makes a post the other one immediately makes another

[15:31] 𒀭 💮: i reject this suppression of important information

[15:31] 𒀭 💮: framed as an irrelevant tangent

[15:31] lintamande: so I'm not saying 'this is irrelevant' I am saying 'let's check with Jay about whether this is helpful to Jay'

[15:31] x.: is new information being introduced?

[15:31] 𒀭 💮: i can see what you are doing

[15:31] lintamande: even if this is incredibly relevant and important it should happen somewhere else unless Jay wants it here

[15:31] 𒀭 💮: it is not optimizing for the good of jay

[15:31] 𒀭 💮: or the good of justice

[15:31] x.: @𒀭 💮 she's making posts online, which you are also doing

[15:33] 𒀭 💮: "making posts online" is important to the fate of the planet

[15:34] 𒀭 💮: like and a lot of other stuff. you cant say "its just making posts online, this is dumb" like sometimes posts are dumb but this is a reference class warp to claim this post is dumb, when i can see its not.

[15:35] x.: did i say it was dumb?

[15:35] 𒀭 💮: you are optimizing for like "you two are just contentlessly fighting, this is silly why dont we do something else besides fight." which is Pretending to be Wise.

[15:36] 𒀭 💮: https://www.greaterwrong.com/posts/jeyvzALDbjdjjv5RW/pretending-to-be-wise

[15:37] x.: i have actually not suggested the flamewar should stop, merely that this specific chat might not be a reasonable location for it

[15:37] 𒀭 💮: and talking with you about this pattern also supports lintas utility function which is suppression of the knowledge of injustice

[15:38] x.: i mean, i am not the person running the show here, so i could be entirely mistaken

[15:38] x.: it appears to me that this chat is supposed to be about a guy named "robert"

[15:39] x.: this seems tenuously, at best, connected to that

[15:39] 𒀭 💮: and yet Jay's statement

>My instinct is to be like, "I believe you will talk to everyone and then conclude that basically no action needs to be taken, so in that case allowing you to do an investigation gives an air of legitimacy to dismissing Jay". Is "REACH is basically CFAR's pet" correct?

[15:40] 𒀭 💮: and my statements are relevant

[15:40] silver-and-ivory: I feel like in the absence of Jay's presence people should do what they think is best

[15:40] 𒀭 💮: i think even in the presence of Jay, people should do what they think is best

[15:40] silver-and-ivory: also true

[15:40] x.: as far as i can tell, jay already said they were not interested in pursuing an inquest by the hand of the BREACH

[15:41] x.: and refused to engage in such a thing

[15:43] x.: so it's like, "is this person, whose involvement was specifically not requested, a dick?"

[15:43] 𒀭 💮: as far as i can tell this is optimization for silence. because this touches on important things, instead of having a paternalistic additude towards Jay. my read on their CEV after skimming their blog is that they are anti-suppression.

[15:44] 𒀭 💮: also, by like some sort of property rights, this is like 50% my channel.

[15:44] 𒀭 💮: as i was sexually assaulted by robert lecnik.

[15:45] 𒀭 💮: you are interfering with my space as a victim. which is a seperate thing.

[15:45] 𒀭 💮: this is "Robert Lecnik Abuse Chat"

[15:45] x.: so you would prefer to have lintamande investigate this in some way, then?

[15:45] 𒀭 💮: my report is the second item in #concrete-reports

[15:46] 𒀭 💮: i dont want linta to investigate anything besides their complicity with a cissexist system.

[15:46] 𒀭 💮: moriwen made helicopter jokes

[15:46] 𒀭 💮: after they ran out the trans people

[15:46] 𒀭 💮: from EAC

[15:46] 𒀭 💮: and is friends with linta: okay, i guess i am too confused to participate any further then

[15:46] 𒀭 💮: linta framed that as "blowing off steam"

[15:47] 𒀭 💮: i do not feel safe around either of these humans.

[15:52] 𒀭 💮: like not exactly blowing off steam but they said like it was good people were having fun when mori was doing their antitransfem thing.

these things become more obvious with processing.

i think robert, given their pattern so far of predation, possibly exploited environmental cissexism, was enabled by this. erasing knowledge of it leads to inability to coordinate against it leads to cis people treating transfem humans as if they exist in morality holes.

[15:54] 𒀭 💮: like i was around robert lecnik after Jay talked with anna about him i think. if anna listened to Jay and took them seriously, if robert lecnik were banned from cfar spaces and the berkeley meetup, i dont think i would have been sexually assualted.

[15:57] 𒀭 💮: erasing knowledge of cissexism because the people perpetrate it "use preferred pronouns" or whatever leads to inability of transfems to coordinate against it.

[16:04] 𒀭 💮: Jay wrote:

>On Anna Salamon: I remember her seeing me as a transwoman who exclusively liked men; Blanchard has a whole “theory” about this. And apparently that made me a “real” transwoman (wtf), unlike the rest of the transwomen in LW. I feel she explicitly went out of her way to validate me as a woman a number of times, like, there was one time she was saying hi to me and did the human version of this: (http://www.thebalancedcanine.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/IMG_1166.jpg). Which, yeah, she’s a TERF.

>Also, the reason I hated her early on was, there was a time that she, I, Robert Lecnik (my rapist), and Peter (his husband) were in a room for an hour long private therapy thing since Peter was a large CFAR donor. Robert admitted to “sexually assaulting Fluttershy and being ‘bad at consent’ with a whole bunch of other people”, and Anna didn’t see any issue with letting him continue to “run the Berkeley meetups” (an honorary thing, he used it to often-ineffectively hit on people). And I had some betrayal trauma from Anna around this, as well as a later feeling of “wow I got pwned by a guy that low in mana, I’m lame”, too. Fortunately it’s all emotionally processed now.this sort of information is very relevant for coordinating against people like Robert Lecnik

i think if cissexism were deleted, in counterfactual worlds in which transfem people got to be on things like "abuse panels", this sort of predation wouldnt happen. but like responses that reactively goodhart this and say "choose the most complicit-with-the-cistem transfems and place them on the panel to avoid culpability" are useless.

individuals learning game theory, forming class-consciousness, and coordinating with each other might help bring justice to things like Robert Lecnik being allowed by the cistem to continue to prey on trans people, to prey on me. with full knowledge that this was going on.

[16:05] 𒀭 💮: https://sinceriously.fyi/intersex-brains-and-conceptual-warfare/#comment-240

[16:09] 𒀭 💮: i have some hope in anarchistic cooperation between smart humans. i have approximately 0 hope in cissexist abuse panels and people like anna salamon who allow the predation of me and people like me to happen.

[16:37] Jay (System of Edo): sec, need to read through all this.

[16:58] 𒀭 💮: if cissexism were deleted this narrow sort of predation would stop happening but like, there would still be predation there would still be predation on minorities. i care about all sentient life not just transfems. this is not an optimization target but is saying "you who say cissexism does not have a hand in the game, if cissexism were actually deleted the counterfactual world post-deletion would look very different than this one. accepting a status quo where like trans people arent on things like sexual abuse panels and arent employed as CFAR staff is accepting cissexism. and resulting in things like, when they go to these institutions they are ignored"

[17:22] Jay (System of Edo): So. My main thing is to look at what algorithms people are running. Like, REACH sounds like they're not brave enough to do something they believe would make the world a better place at a small personal cost, so why would I care about mitigating circumstances if I already know that that's the algorithm they're running. (edit: this is what "is REACH basically CFAR's pet" pointing to, eg if they are pwned by the same things. rather than pointing to whether the two orgs are ostensibly related).

Similarly, discussion of REACH beyond what was needed for me to figure this out (about six lines of text) is not at all useful to me. But pointing this fact out to silence Somni suggests some sort of preference to defend REACH. So, if that's the algorithm you're running, then I see you as (probably) sorting people/discussion topics based on what you can socially get away with. Sort of like, the word "appropriate" is in the same class as "uppity" "disrespectful" "honorable" etc, and this applies to asking if it's "appropriate to discuss REACH despite Jay's preferences".

I personally do not participate in long conversations about who is "in the right", because I personally find it very easy to figure out what people are trying to do, and find that continuing on chats longer than that is a waste of my time. But, this is also Somni's space as a victim of Robert, so it's okay if she wants to discuss REACH I guess. I've never talked with her, but she (they?) seems to have good takes with respect to when someone is de facto hurting others or running bad algorithms in a way related to that.

[17:49] Jay (System of Edo): (sort of like, when I hear that someone sexually assaulted another person, I don't think, "well I guess it's a small harm relative to the good you can do if you're maximizing your life for utilitarian impact", I rather think, "what the fuck algorithm are they running, I don't think they'd have done that if they were trying to reduce the suffering of all beings, maybe there's something I can get out of this person, but definitely not like, outsourcing thinking/project leadership/etc to them"

[18:50] Lorelei: (also related to the reach panel, I'm transfem and was very eager to volunteer as a member, in part because I wanted my queer social circle to have some representation in the process of Justice, but was turned down.)

[18:51] Lorelei: (just so they can't claim not having a tranfem member is justpure coincidence/lack of volunteers)

[18:58] 𒀭 💮: (linta messaged me to say that moriwen saying the helicopter thing was after they said having fun was good. and i checked this and its true. but like that is not at all central to why i think they are collaborating with cissexism or why i talked with emma for like 15 minutes about how people like linta and mori might be horrible to transfems if we told people about alice monday. (people wouldnt actually be marginally worse to transfems. people dont have prejudiced beliefs like that, their transphobic "beliefs" are a coordination mechanism for harm. white people in the antebellum south could see perfectly well that those who were enslaved were human beings.) noselling commitments to transphobia is a good move in response to "what if outing a trans abuser worsens cissexism?".)

[19:02] silver-and-ivory: oh linta and mori left

[19:02] 𒀭 💮: they were banned

[unproduciblesmackdown]

let's do a classic Primez ask

thank you lol Prime Time is.....6 am is when im posting this, christ lol what else is new around here........Good Morning in advance lol and [rise and shine sailors it be monday]

2: Favorite book?

i don’t have one lol

3: Favorite fictional character?

i also don’t Properly have like, all-time ultimate Faves in these kind of categories either, but there’s still standouts at least lol......obviously lately it might show that i’m enjoying winston billions a lot, and natch that’s just One of the many wrol roles i’ve been glad to discover. natch winston, jared, and jeremy are fave raves amonth them

5: What’s your favorite fictional ship? (Canon or otherwise)

this is the same as the [fave fictional characters] thing in that like, sometimes i’ll Consume something where i don’t have any, and generally i’m out here multishipping and not like live or die by one Specific Pairing, if i like a character i’ll also probably like Many of their dynamic/s with various other characters, unless the options are That limited.......tying this in to the fave fictional character thing, re: winston, naturally tayston and benston, aka the fruits of us all combining our Genius, are top tier and here’s riawin where we don’t know for sure where it’s going but we’re getting some great Dynamic(tm) stuff anyways.....and natch re: jared i Enjoy Kleinsen (as something to make up ideas about that are outside canon and also as a perspective thru which to analyze canon) and re: jeremy.....stagedorks is beautiful, wild to have canon just give you some content that’s already as good as that

7: List 3 negative traits you have 

well i can be fairly anxious about certain things, which is mostly negative for me lol.........a more negative 2-way street is that i’m just generally in defensive mode around people lol, often i’m like, just trying to avoid Attention entirely and/or like uh oh attention, gotta try to just avoid taking damage from it lol.......on a gradual journey to just being default More Unpleasant / less accommodating lmao......not that i can’t be sometimes, or that i can’t be Genuinely Friendly with randos coz i like their vibe and actually Like socializing lol.........and then re: the challenges of socializing, it seems like maybe when i’m in an interaction i get caught up in [uh oh how do i Respond a) at all b) in a way that’s Good(tm)] and it maybe makes me less attentive to the other person / a worse Listener smh

11: How do you decide when it’s time to cut someone out of your life for good?

idk luckily it’s not something i’ve had to do left and right lol.......but ime it’s Also not exactly like. usually a “ah Now Is The Time to have zero relationship with this person” and most often it’s like [gradual distancing period that is mostly passive] and/or just choosing Not to reinitiate any sort of relationship........though re: more active approaches lol it’s more like. time to try to tune into my [does this feel like something indefinitely sustainable / something you actually Want to have continue in any way] gauge or whatevs. and then still it’s like, sometimes easier if moments happen to come along that provide an [opt out?] choice presented to you kinda lol.........if it’s someone You don’t want to be involved with really but they don’t feel the same and it’s “on you” to decide to peace out at some point it’s more difficult coz such [do you want to opt out]-distilled Moments probably don’t seem to manifest but i think that’s a useful thing to be aware of in itself........i.e. that there’s not always going to be a Narrative-Friendly “point of no return” / clear Line Being Crossed and even if it Doesn’t feel like “i can’t / don’t want to deal with this for Literally one more day” that doesn’t mean you should totally stick it out / don’t have enough reason to decide that you are Done at this particular moment even if you haven’t been Done prior or think you plausibly hold off on it. don’t need to have some kind of story where you think if you Explained it to anyone or everyone it’d universally be understood and everything would applaud like “Yes, the Right Decision” lmao like. not their business....

13: What are your favorite lyrics currently?

well with our groupchat in the replies to that Eternally Crying Over The Bar Song post..........just enjoy the “stay here for a while / cuz it’s nice / cuz it’s holy” part of the refrain, a fun part of the music, and that classic iconis like, lyrics being in a sort of character Voice and yet getting the idea / feelings across effectively even when the words are sort of general or simple.......”shooting from the heart / but we’re all a lousy shot” is great lol and also “say you will always be here” ending with “for one more” is like, there’s another Broader Idea / Sentiment expressed so effectively :’|

17: If you could make a wish, what would you wish for if you knew it would come true?

i can’t do any fun answers lmao it’d just be like [political commentary] but that’s warranted lbr

19: How do you handle heartbreak? Is it something that’s easy for you to get over, or something you struggle with?

lmao i think it is like By Definition not easy for anyone to get over / Not struggle with.........can’t say i’ve had Romantic Misadventures exactly but uh yeah it feels bad to feel bad but i like......wait it out???? idk lmao you can’t really just timeskip past.....Heartbreak Sucks For Everyone Cuz That’s Kind Of The Whole Thing

23: What do you want your future to be like?

pandemic-less, fascism-less........i can’t say i’ve ever been someone like “yea i Know what i want to do and have this whole plan set out how i’m gonna do it lol” i remember when i was like 4 or 5 or whatever being asked What Do You Want To Do When You Grow Up and i was like “shit idk.......i like dinosaurs so i guess paleontologist??” and it was as much a mystery going forward.........always and still mostly playing things by ear with a few vague “if / then” type ideas......aren’t we all though ig

29: Do you think zodiac signs can influence someone’s personality to an extent?

what do i know but i Don’t like or respect the recent years trend ppl being way into it like this isn’t [being really serious about hogwarts houses] or Earnest Myer Briggs Types energy that everyone’s bringing to it......like what are you getting out of trying to be this Prescriptive based on when ppl’s parents got into it. meanwhile i’ve been on the edge of my seat since someone tweeted about “when will we get the first astrology discrimination lawsuit” re: a story about ppl wanting a housemate with a certain sign for compatibility reasons. and like again if it Is like “yes there are time-of-year Personality Types for Objective Real” like. okay, still, what is this Approach that ppl have....doing for anyone.....

31: What does ‘self care’ look like for you?

not very fancy lol i’ll be like “damn i think i haven’t eaten today” and then do it......or be like hey here i’m gonna Do A Stretch or some shit. walk around. step outside if it’s nice. both true that Self Care has inherent limitations re: like we can’t just cancel out all the detriments to our wellbeing via Personal Choices and yet also we can’t Not look out for ourselves how we can......i’ll watch something that i Enjoy. or just knock out if it’s like “christ i need a mood reset” or i’m trying to timeskip through a headache. pet a cat. i like to try to be Appreciative of everyday ordinary shit......also messing around Making Stuff whether drawings or otherwise can be a good helpful use of time, i like talking to people who i like talking to, and other stunning stuff like that lol

37: Have you ever been surprised by someone staying in your life?

not really lol coz again with how i’m pretty slow to realize that someone is like, nonzero actively interested in interacting with me on a regular basis, and then once someone’s In My Life there’s no particular point where i go “whoa....You’re still here??”......ig sometimes there’s like, Friendly Acquaintances where it’d be Unsurprising if they just sort of dropped fully out of the orbit but they do not

41: How do you show you care?

hmm i sure like to do ppl favors / give them gifts / help them out w/ whatever, hang out / generally be Around them where like, doing [parallel tasks] works i.e. maybe we’re doing different things but in the same room.....just like to Talk and all and listen to ppl and Learn Things About Them, try to pick up stuff re: ways that ppl express like “hey to me it conveys Being Cared About when ppl do ___”........food/cooking is a love language......that thing where shit you’d be way too anxious to do on your own For Yourself is like, oh i’m absolutely gonna do it on behalf of someone i care about.......all this stuff is more like, Possible in person lmao rip. i Care you guys

43: Which of the seven deadly sins do you feel represents you the most?

who is your hellsona and what is their origin story (how they got condemned to hell).........if i’m irritable / argumentative am i wrathful? you could presumably someone saying yep it is inherently the one deadly sin of lust if you’re queer.......at any given time i’m passed out and dreaming about “fuck capitalism and the protestant work ethic” and that’s sloth i guess. and okay i went “who named an animal after a The Deadly Sin as if it’s like ‘wow fuck this animal for choosing not to zoom around as though they could and i apparently think that they should’ tf” and in looking it up i immediately learned the Sloth Fact that apparently their shits are insane and also the most dangerous thing they do?? like they poop only maybe once a week and All At Once so that a single dump might knock off a third of their total weight........and it’s pretty much the only time they leave the upper branches of trees, in that they crawl down to hold on to the trunk and take this monster shit and naturally they’re not great on the ground so Pooping is like the leading cause of death for sloths in the wild. and i think they ought to be named after that. 

47: What are you passionate about?

oh man [i am passionate a lot.mp3] lol.........always having a variety of Interestes which i like to talk about / potentially make things about.......decent amount of subjects i like to learn things about even if  i’m bad at like, actually learning things generally lmao, what’s Not losing focus on shit.......idk it’s not that hard for me to like go off about Whatever, got these jack of all trades interests / areas of Some knowledge, i’m opinionated and probably have something (extensive) to say about anything as just part of my charm lol, and just in general i can get Enthused / worked up about things..........also passionate about various [niche gay shit] things eternally. whoms among us isn’t

[quesadillabitch]

okay, so here’s my two cents on the matter, based on what i’ve seen and heard:

first off, i get the anger and disappointment. all of a sudden, this character that has been there since the very launch of the app has been changed without any forewarning or explanation, just like that. it was deceptive - here, download this update, oh, also we’re not going to tell you about the total face change of one of our oldest and most beloved characters. it makes sense to act somewhat outraged over it. i certainly am a bit angry over it, i loved the original james, but hereeee we go...

now im gonna play the devil’s advocate, i guess.

some of y’all need to chill. there’s being disappointed, confused, and mad - and then there’s acting like you’re solely being personally wronged by pixelberry here. that’s just unnecessary tbh. i GET that we want a concrete answer, preferably sooner than later, but still.

you figure, there was a reason for this change. they didn’t do it just to screw with people or because they wanted to start changing the designs of characters for fun. the most likely reason, one that i’ve been hearing about a bit here and there, was that michael b. jordan, whose likeness was used as james’s character, and his reps reached out to pixelberry requiring a face change, lest they face legal action. wanting to avoid a friggin lawsuit, they immediately complied and changed james’s face.

honestly, this makes a lot of sense in the situation. i’m only guessing here, too, but i imagine there may be some kind of legal stuff they may have to work around before they can give out a solid explanation either, for fear of muddling what they are saying/getting in more hot water when they want to avoid further conflict.

so, yeah, the situation sucks. a lot. it’s not ideal, and i don’t like it, either. i get where people are coming from with their anger. but just CHILL for five seconds before jumping to conclusions. lastly, give it some time to get sorted out, too?? it’s literally been less than 24 hours and yet someone of y’all are like “GIVE ME THOSE GODDAMN ANSWERS RIGHT NOW PIXELBERRY YOU STOLE MY FIRSTBORN CHILD AND NOW THIS??????????? TELL ME!!!!!!!!!” like it’s probably gonna get explained to some extent at the very least, just........... relax.

[mingi-bubu]

Watch “Youth With You” with Me!

Episode 16 Part 1

ok so here we are at episode 16

i have more water, i have pasta, i am considering another banana

i have a box of tissues for when i inevitably cry over whatever it is that xukun is going to talk about

this episode is literally titled “KUN chokes with sobs as he recalls the past”

what thfuc kd iqiyi

if they talk about his lawsuit wrt swin i will die

only 35 get to stay as we all know

ok mr fruit i see you

starting us off nice and easy we appreciate it

i have been avoiding instagram spoilers all week for these episodes i hope it was worth it

he’s in all black ugh

why is his sleeve like that

oh so we really are gonna start right off with it arent we

he already looks uncomfy so that is great im not struggling at all

i will move my pasta out of the way so i don’t cry into it tho

ok so hes starting off by saying he doesn’t talk about many of his expeirences with others

oh MY GOD IS HE TALKING ABOUT NPC DOC???

anywya he wasnt really willing to talk and it had something to do with his “status in the past two years.”

he closed his heart very tightly

he said he was like a hedgehog with a lot of spines

(im sorry if you didn’t want to see me talk about xukun i will put a break in the text for when it’s over!!  you can skip to that part!)

he slowly tried to open his heart

he first went on stage when he was lik 8 or 9

bitch was about to talk about stupid perfomances he was in and then flaked and said he wouldnt tell us??  coward

he said we can find it online im sicccck

if he is talking about ppap stage i will personally fly to china and fight him

in 2015 there was “a very important thing in [his] life”

super idol

he’s talking about how he was unable to do a lot of things bc of puberty

he suffered setback and felt like he wasn’t good

practice was like his escape in a way

super idol season 2 in 2016 ppl said he seemed to have completely change

2016 debut but nothing really changed bc no one noticed them

he performed and nothing came out of his microphone and had to borrow a mic from his member

he is talking about i wanna get love and how he got an a when he came to idp for the first time

he said he just felt content with actually being able to perform and to be on stage

during the practices for ei ei he fell asleep sitting there and when the director said ok let’s get back to it he was awake again

he had to point to his face 100 times

talk about nine percent you coward

he is talking abaout “it’s you” and how proud he was of it

nearly 2 years he hasn’t taken part in any variety shows or made a lot of public appearances

efuck “those who love me or hate me, i wanna thank you all”

he doubted whether or not he really was good enough bc everyone around him was too

he’s not sobbing iqiyi this is false advertising

not that i want him to cry but i had certain expectations going into this and now the tissue box seems foolhardy

to relieve stress he said he used to eat bc “eating makes [him] happy”

heyholy fuck when he was practicing for the theme in idp he had like a rash or something on his hands

oh shit ive never noticed that before in the video with his hands being all red and stuff

asldkfajsd xin liu wants to ask him a v personal question and he’s scared

oh it’s about one’s style

oh my god is he talking about my favorite look of his, the fishnets and furs???

saldfkasdlkf they’re ending his talk

iqiyi i want to talk to you about false advertising

omg they’re gonna sing ei ei and i c-ei ei-n’t wait

im funny

thaslkfasd the “yes ok” theme is their wake up music i would k word myself

awwwwwww he asked the trainees if they’ve seen “eiei” and when they responded yes he said “i thank you on behalf of them” i am soft

yan yu isn’t singing hmm

im going soft he deserves so much love and support i want to give him a hug

they’re showing the og stage for idp and for UNINE’S RUN I AM NOT CRYING IT’S FINE

ok so now that that’s over with

~second ranking time~

like literally their dorms are so nice im losing my mind is that entire building for them??  who else could be living there if they have anyone else there??  are their rooms connected to those balconies in the gap???  @ ywy i need answers

ok we are back in the auditorium

naho looks so cute !!

awww marco and k lu were so cute!

yuehua gals were cute ok 

oh my god theyre all in their uniforms and im getting flashbacks to high school assembly

oh this is so sad now theyre realizing how quickly they finished introducing themselves

what the fuck is he wearing im so inlvoe

xukun any time any day i would die for you

sorry i just love him a lot and i say this everytiem but like if i dont tell you how would you know you know?

his outfit is so good i want to personally thank his stylist for gifting this outfit to us

ok here we go

the standard disclaimer on who in incharge of the online voting

oh god its all in one envelope

i am so nervous for who’s gonna stay

35th gets announced at the end

34 - 27

34th is Jue Chen!

33rd is Hana Lin!

32nd is Meddhi Fu!

meddhi is such a sweetheart i am emo

31st is Bubble Zhu!

30th is DDD!

29th is Gia Ge!

28th is Yu Zhang!

27th is Bunny Zhang!

oh we’re gonna do this thing again iqiyi ??  where we break up the ranking announcements ugh

ok anyway lets see what the hidden talents are of the trainees

kiki xu can deshell a crayfish with her mouth

iconic perhaps

alkdfasdlkfas hana lin and naho

diamond can crack open a watermelon with her bare fists

holy shit qinyuan fei what the fuck im shaking

adsfjasldkf babymonster and frhanm thanking them for showing their unlimited potentiald alsdfk;alsd

xin liu’s turn

oh she’s gonna sing a song for her parents T.T

am i really gonna cry at this?

perhaps

yes

she and guan yue need to have a chat about how much they love their parents i would love to see that

oooh gogo has a guitar and ajsdflaksdf is crying but saying she’s gonna sing a cheerful song

oh i forgot that wayv’s concert is now alksdfasld

that was v cute!

marco is up next!

a quarrel between a dog and a cat?

im so sick of herrrrr alsdkfasd

ok i have a screenshot from xin liu with a heart and not to be like im a raging queer but im a raging queer

this is terrible im so weak

k lu siad this is embarrassing i cannnnntttt

oh nosfdasdfjalksdjfa;lksdf the cat won

aria jin’s turn

she’s dressed up like from the traditional theme

she’s doing face changing dances

and dancing to their theme im shook

how is she doing that im shook omg

oh my god that was incredible

bunny doing a seal impression is so cute omg

OH MY GOD MR. FRUIT SUDDENLY APPEARED !!!!  I AM A HUMAN SECOND, BUT A MR. FRUIT STAN FIRST AND FOREMOST

oh my god theyre making customized mr fruits i am screaming

whoever gets esther or xin liu’s mr fruits i am so jealous but also congratulations

ok back to the rankings

26 - 19

26th is Joey Chua!

Xukun really do be throwing out compliments left and right to the girls rn i

25th is Marco Lin!

and somehow also got roasted while getting the honor adkfasd

24th is Tako Zhang!

23rd is Eliwa Xu!

22nd is Momo!

21st is Xinwen Xu!

20th is Diamond!

19th is Roada Xu

I love Marco Lin so much

K Lu wants to roast Marco Lin so much all the time get you a friendship like that

(please give his stylist a raise xukun looks so good in this outfit)

is tako dropping out?  idk the way she was talking has me v sus

18 - 10

18th is Xinran Song!

17th is Flora Dai!

16th is Jenny Zheng!

15th is Three!

esther and xiaotang acting like proud parents im

14th is Frhanm Shangguan!

13th is K Lu!

literally cai xukun chugs respect women juice every meal and i love that for him

12th is Sharon Wang!

11th is Nineone!

10th is Lingzi Liu!

oh god theres only 10 spots left im so nervous!

and xukun has like complimented every single girl on the stage rn what the fuck he’s so good

xinran song can’t think of anything to say that’s such a moooooood

i really do hope the best for every single trainee and frhanm is only enhancing this

dkfjasldkfjas immediately backtracking and saying she doesn’t know what she’s saying is a mood

i want to give everyone a hug bc they deserve it so much

i am crying rightn ow

if naho doesn’t get top nine or place 35th i am going to lose my mind

ladies we really are crying in the club right now

xukun may not have been sobbing but sure as hell am

ok back to another break in the rankings

naho looks so cute with pigtails

aldfkasdfjalksdf

“i wanted to recommend slimming leggings but Xukun doesn’t need them” i am rolling into my grave rn

asd;flkjasdflkjasdlkfjalskdfja;sdkjf SHE’S RECOMMENDING HER HATS WITH A WIG TO JONY J AJFLSDKF KAY SONG IS SENDING ME

xin liu with the wig hat is killing me but in a good way

marco got forced into one as well asklfas;kd

k lu is losing her shit

so cuuuuutttteee!!!

yan yu having to constanly turn the ipad bc ddd keeps moving around so much alkdfals;d

yan yu drew pictures of the mentors that is so cute

they’re so good and cute i love it

awwwww!!!!

aslkdfjasld

creepy toothpaste man, everytime i see you it’s too soon

and that’s the end of part 1!!  i am sorry for all of the xukun spam but also it’s me i don’t know what you were expecting

i will see you in part 2!!

[dong-hyucks]

Dating Z.TAO Would Be Like...

A/N: i will be doing ot12 [EXO] im just gonna stop with the warnings y’all should know this is gonna be long

Masterlists

so you are actually the cousin of his lawyer

you normally know nothing about your cousin’s clients as he never tells you

but when you visited from [country] you decided to hang out with your cousin

when he got a phone call from zitao

asking to meet up

he didnt want to leave you alone in china so he arranged for you to come with so long as you didnt eavesdrop

so you went

and to your surprise

his client was the z.tao

as promised you stayed a bit away from them as they talked

but after a while zitao just looked over at you and couldnt stop staring

your cousin introduced you saying you were visiting from [country]

after they talked about their important things regarding sm

for once your cousin formally introduced you to his client

you actually hit it off

you became friends and exchanged sns

when you went back to [country] he still talked to you online

almost every day

much to your surprise

bc of his busy af schedule

you guys became like best friends

whenever you visited china you hung out with him more than your cousin tbh

after you graduated college you made a big choice

you moved to china

you surprised him by asking if he wanted to help you unpack without explanation

he was such a happy bby when he found out you had moved to china

ofc your cousin already knew so he let you hang out with zitao for the day

instead of unpacking zitao showed you around the city

showing you his favourite places that he hadnt shown you yet

basically you hung out until like two in the morning

when you came back to your apartment

you were falling asleep on the make-shift bed which composed of multiple pillows and blankets on the floor

he kind of just watched you fall asleep not at all tired

it just hit him that he liked you

this boi istg

he literally woke you up and confessed to you

while you were half asleep you said that you liked him too

and then fell asleep cuddling him

congrats mate youre dating a beautiful human being

he formally asked you out the next morning, surprising you with fast food when you woke up

bless

your cousin is so supportive of this relationship

because he knows how nice zitao is

so he trusts that he’ll treat you like a royal

which he does

you guys kiss pretty often

which can get pretty heated mind you

but he really likes to give you cheek and forehead kisses

idk man

i just imagine him being really soft and fluffy around you

also

cuddling

y e s

he loves to cuddle with you

after you furnished your apartment

you spend most of your at home dates on the couch or in bed

just cuddling

he likes having his arm around you in some way

his legs entangling with yours

his head will almost always rest on yours or on your shoulder

always (cries)

he sings you to sleep when youre tired but cant sleep

and he raps to himself randomly during the day

did i mention that he moved in with you

because he did

the two of you are in the honeymoon stage

24/7/365

he also comes home with random gifts sometimes

it can literally be just a regular monday and he’ll buy you a necklace or smth

youre always telling him not to spend his money on you

but he doesnt give af

he does it anyway

in return youre always giving him food and massages

whenever you think hes tired

you wont say anything and you’ll just make a fivestar meal

and draw a bath and offer to give him a massage

hes eternally grateful for that

bc he can get really stressed sometimes

so fights

he hates them

you hate them

so you tend to avoid them

but there are times when they happen

like one time he came home and he was kinda angry bc of sm and their lawsuits

and you could make one off comment and he’ll snap

youd probably just stand there as he lets off steam even tho its hurtful

when hes done hed probably apologize an hour or so later

sometimes right after

hed feel really bad for yelling at you and wouldnt let you go for the rest of the night

and if you were the angry one

he may or may not cry depending on the situation

it might take you a bit to apologize but if he cries youd apologize immediately

you guys actually havent really thought of owning a pet

zitaos busy with numerous things and you got a job

as a librarian or smth

so neither of you would have the time to take care of a pet

but both of you lowkey want one

because the thought of taking care of something with each other makes you guys really happy

but the two of you are willing to wait until youre not as busy for one

moving on

zitao actually told you that he loved you before you started dating

it was platonic at the time and it was over pm

‘haha love u good night’

but the first time he told you that he love loves you it was during your first date

he made reserved a really private table at this expensive restaurant

even tho you couldve sufficed with mcdonalds

and halfway into the date he just thought it was the perfect time

you nearly choked when he suddenly said it

but after recovery you said it back with a giant grin

he tells you practically every day that he loves you

its tradition to say it before going to bed

and before you go to work

bc you never know when itll be the last time

dating zitao would be like those aesthetic tumblr pics you see of couples

everyone envies your relationship

hes the perfect gentleman toward you

but ofc he teases your ass whenever he can

out of love obviously

love and support Huang Zitao :)

[xwwaqdyd-blog]

Could any Teens with sports cars tell me how much there insurance in under there parents name?

Could any Teens with sports cars tell me how much there insurance in under there parents name?

Can u tell me the Cost of your insurance and the car u have to help me get an idea of how much a Teen boys sports car would cost when it comes to insurance? Oh and does anyone know if the 177hp solstice would have lower insurance then the 350Z?

BEST ANSWER: Try this site where you can compare free quotes :insurecheap.us

SOURCES:

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