#i had enough of this “Stolas is a victim bullshit”

[doctor-failure]

Hate to say it, but the audience was manipulated again. I get it, Stolas is heartbroken and depressed, but he is not the victim here. During the whole series, he acted like a horny owl around Blitz, never actually speaking with him about feelings. Directly. O wow, why is Blitz seeing himself as a novelty and a sex toy for Stolas? Blitz can process feelings. He is not a psychopath. With Fizz, they also had a conflict based on misunderstanding, and they resolved it. By speaking. With their mouths. Stolas just ghosted Blitz for 2 months, then dropped the L bomb and shuts Blitz out when he didn't get a reaction that he wanted. He just imagined how things must go, and when they didn't, had a tantrum.

Blitz is the real victim here, and fuck you Stolas, go to therapy and learn how to talk with people.

[dyssonant-skyline]

Full Moon Spoilers: The Final Scene

I have some thoughts.

Okay let me start with saying, the Stolas & Blitzo conversation should not have been relegated to the last 5 minutes of the episode. I think the rushed nature of the conversation doomed any chance of it being a satisfying exchange between these two characters that covers the full reality of their situation. I’m listing this up front because a lot of my grievances could have been resolved with more time, which the team spent on 15 minutes of lead up that I believe were ultimately unnecessary to the show's central plot and actively hinder the direction the showrunners want the story to go in.

During the episode he acknowledges that Blitzo is in a horrible situation. He states that the deal was wrong, implicitly acknowledging guilt for thrusting it unto Blitz and trying to resolve that by giving him the Azmodean crystal. He has decided to end things, and goes through with it even though he displays clear interest in Blitzo’s advances.

Then what does he do when Blitzo assumes that Stolas hasn’t changed? When Blitzo believes that Stolas, the person who he has only had transactional relations with, is setting up a new kind of transaction? 

Instead of further ensuring Blitzo and trying to clear the air. He throws a tantrum. When things didn’t immediately resolve in his favor. Then he immediately goes into blaming Blitzo for only thinking about sex in their, again, transactional relationship. This gets worse because Stolas doesn’t wait to establish a healthy non romantic/sexual relationship before insinuating that he is still interested in Blitzo sexually, opening Blitzo up to misunderstanding his intent… then not being willing to clarify his intent.

“I have wanted you for so long, the fact that you couldn’t believe that I might have these feelings about you, that your first instinct is that it’s always about sex… that’s enough to know what this is.”

My brother in christ, you confront him about this during the sex deal night and don’t expect him to expect sex? You give him ~10 seconds to react to this information before deciding you don’t want to deal with his emotions anymore because they aren’t what you wanted?

The monologue that Blitzo had after that was completely justified and extremely gratifying to hear.

“Fuck you Stolas! You spring this feelings bullshit on me, are you fucking kidding?” - “Can I get a fucking minute to think after everything you put me through?” - “You can’t just dismiss me like that.”

After that sincere outburst, instead of Stolas recognizing what Blitzo is saying and taking some accountability or apologizing… he reacts with

“I didn’t realize you think so low of me.”

HUH? What happened to the transactional deal not being right? Surely if he knows he isn’t right, he knows that Blitzo would probably have a pretty low opinion of him? Breaking the deal doesn’t make his victim required to forgive him, especially not within 5 minutes.

Sidenote but: Stolas’s desire for immediate reconciliation is compounded by the fact that Stolas buries the lead at the beginning of their conversation. He keeps things vague with statements like “I need [the grimoire] back permanently” and “I’ve made up my mind” that lead Blitzo to believe he is being fired. I don’t really believe that the way that Stolas talks here speaks to his character, it reads more like bad writing in favor of a misunderstanding to get Blitzo worked up. It doesn’t seem in character to dwell like this, you could argue it is nerves but I’d argue there is no positive reaction to those first few sentences and Stolas isn’t socially inept enough to fail to realize that.

Honestly, if they were gearing up to have Stolas as a villain still and if Blitzo hadn’t had an apology cut off, I would have loved this exchange as it characterizes Stolas as a villain very well. It shows that Stolas still doesn’t care about Blitzo, just the version of Blitzo he has built in his head in excruciating detail. It shows that despite Stolas trying to make amends through words and actions, he still can not face the hurt that he has caused his victim and will run away when confronted with them. Unfortunately I’m pretty sure the writers are just going to make Blitzo into the one that Stolas hoped would fall into his arms immediately. So whatever.

[tessastarlight]

Oh boy…This lady makes Cersei Lannister look like a fucking Saint. She’s also useless when it counts. She never contributed to the family or participated in childcare. All she does is sit around the house throwing parties like a spoiled rich wife and has the gall to yell and swing at her own husband who’s done nothing but gave everything to his family. She even hired that fine ass snake dude to kill him. And don’t forget she almost threw a plant at her own daughter.

What’s empowering about this scene is that an abuse victim finally stood up for himself after years of torment and humiliation. Owl boy has had enough of her bullshit. Tbh, characters like Stolas really means so much to me.

I understand why he kept the abuse hidden. It’s the same reason why I endured my stepdad’s mental/physical abuse/SA for 8 fucking years. Didn’t want my mom to be heartbroken and my brother to hate his own dad. Hell, I wanted everything to be ‘normal.’ But now I realize how damaging this was, and what it does to me and my mental health. I had the strength to escape that monster. But I digress, I’m really glad that Stolas is taking all that toxicity out of his life, even though he’s at his lowest. And I’m also glad that he never take his trauma out on Octavia. It’s never the child’s fault. He loves his daughter and he would always fight for her no matter what. He targets his anger at the right person: Stella.

[ravenwitch45]

What do you think of Stella not fighting back when stolas is yelling and just accepting it?

I've explained why she doesn't really care, cause she has a back up plan but like... I wish she did fight, cause her acting all calm just doesn't sit right and I know why, she doesn't deserve to be calm after her victim, and yes Stolas is that, he is a victim, stood up to her for the first real time in years cause he has finally had enough of her bullshit. I honestly want to see her grasp at the shards as her plan breaks apart, I want to see her suffer as she made Stolas suffer and I hope it's worse.

I don't want calm, I want broken down and suffering, cause she deserves every last second of that fate.

[floralkittygambler]

Reposting for reasons

Response to Honest’s post here: Doing this to spread this awareness more as I know theres a bit of a rift in the critical community - plus I really fucking go on. Im PISSED and I do apologise however it NEEDS urgent addressing. I know people will hate me for it but Im used to hate and honestly? Hating rather than helping to solve the issue only furthers my fucking point here. So yeah this is so more people are aware (no offense to any of those involved in said rift either, but this is an important message. Thank you for understanding and if I can do anything to make all sides comfortable, then please message me and I’ll do my upmost.) “ More awareness of this is needed. Even if it’s your favourite, you can’t justify their shit but rally against another’s shit. Have people tell you you’re experiences arent real or invalid because, like Husk, people have - in real life - shipped you with someone you are far from comfortable with but you still treat them like a person. Because you have basic respect. And people force you to accept harassment, touching, stalking, advances for THEIR satisfaction. People use you for their fantasies. But you’re just a ‘tsundere’ for it. Or you have addiction issues but people think being with another addict will ‘save’ you because you’re apparently too incompetent to save yourself. Love isnt some magic fuckin cure so stop romanticising it as a fuckin saviour. It’s gross and fuckin creepy. Get stalked and have someone NEVER accept your no just because you show youre still decent enough to not treat them shitty or any different from anyone else. Try having someone way older or way younger (both in morally fucked up ways) advance on you and people encourage that. People you’re supposed to feel safe around.

People touch you when you pull away or show discomfort. Follow you home. Have pictures of you and wont accept you dont like them like that and it’s not ‘playing hard to get’ or ‘the thrill of the chase’. Fuck. OFF. In fact, Im not only disappointed in the fandom. Im disappointed in the entire team who some should know better from their OWN personal experiences - or at least the bare minimal of being a fucking adult. Im disappointed in especially females (sorry idk whether girl or woman is more appropriate here-) who statistically are more likely to have experienced something similar at some point in their lives think this is a cute gay moment. No. Angel is made out as a fucking predator - Im not saying he is, Im saying that his persistence is very fucking unwelcome like one. People like Husk dont need that fucking invasiveness. They/We need patience and someone on our level. Angel’s I know are the fuckin polar opposite - and some of them I know are very sexually harassing, including unwanted touching. It’s a shitty way to present gay people. Gays are fuckin people. Some are cunts and some arent. It’s a HUMAN thing. But considering the shit theyve been subjected to, presenting a gay as a victim only to also show them as a perpetrator is insulting! And for those Ive seen argue this about how people like AD wouldnt know how to express their love normally and whatnot? His pig. His best friend. He’s in his fucking 30s. There are literal real life criminals who get molested as kids and then go on to molest kids. Not all who grow up like that turn into nonces. Stop just fucking STOP justifying and romanticising this bullshit! I used to see the good in AD but now he makes me fucking sick. Especially with my verrrrrry fucking real traumas and connections. But fuck me, eh? Because this fictional guy matters so much more. Fuck real victims. And whilst we’re at it, fuck AD too when it suits your fetishes! Sarcasm aside, the fans and the team need to straighten up their abhorrent behaviour. Stolas. Fucking clearly having an affair, knowingly fucking up his daughter’s mental health and bribing a guy into sex who only wants the book and nothing more. He even has a fucking warning button over Stolas- Guys, how do you think any of this is cute? Even the team gross me out- I genuinely see potential and talent and it’s all gone to shit to satisfy horny teens, horny adults, and literally everyone who doesnt for the life of them understand being an adult is more than sex, drugs, violence and swears! I REALLY want to keep enjoying HB/HH but it’s getting harder and harder with such ignorant and bordering lazy creators (note: lazy as in wont do the fucking research or actually listen to real criticism and victims), such despicable fans (yeah, some HDers fuckin mocked that they triggered my ED, yet they had the fucking NERVE to support Angel’s potential ED AND laugh and blame me for me getting treated so badly for actually having the balls to call Angel and the teams hypocrisy. I got told to kill myself, that my problems arent real - oh but Angels apparently is! Which... They *are* but AD isnt real so technically only onlookers will suffer and not a drawing  - and they just excused their toxic behaviours. These people are like “aww poor angie babey!” yet fuckin INSULT sex workers. All this red in Hazbin yet it feels everyone and they mama colour blind. The issues are getting worse and fans are outright becoming EVIL, VILE, Vindictive little bullies - from kids to adults. You SHOULD be ashamed of yourself if you conduct yourself in such a manner. And you need to readjust your attitudes and behaviours because the only fuckers getting hurt are actual fucking victims. Ever been violated and been gaslit so much you STILL fucking question it’s reality? So you drown that shit out yet somehow it’s effects still hit you? Fetishise it. Make it your uwu gae couple goals, you’re no better than people believing Harley and the Joker werent toxic af. If this shit happened to you, most of you would actually SEE where we’re all coming from. Also, stop making gay a fetish - you’re like those creepy old men in the alley heckling lesbians to make out so they can wank off. Gays, no ALL the LGBT+ are fucking people too. So dont give me that bullshit then start turning everything just gay or just straight to mentally wank off to. It’s degrading and dehumanising. And yes, fiction does effect reality. You crush on a fictional character? Mourn one? Support one? Hell, fuckin jerk off to one - that’s affecting reality. Remember how in fiction all blacks were treated as villians? Look how theyre treated IRL. JAWS, great classic unfortunately their was a spike in shark killings over a fucking movie - the shark in the movie wasnt even real for the most part because they dont behave like that! (Also the animatronic was so shit they genuinely had so many issues - I think they even took to naming each one! Some fun trivia there!). Tiger sharks are more nasty than great whites as tiger sharks will hunt and eat a human. Great whites prefer seals and dislike human flesh, they just mistake us for seals. Hell, theres the toothless basking shark - theyre often SWAM WITH by divers for being so friendly. Yet Jaws made people think all sharks are bloodlusting over humans. Slenderman was created for a fucking contest and that influenced a stabbing (NOT Victor’s fault). Watch a horror movie that isnt based on a real life event and tell me that at least ONE has left you peaking over your shoulder. Stella may be a bitch - we dont know for certain - but try getting cheated on. Y’know what? Try growing up in such a broken home like Octavia. Yeah reaaaaaal fucking cute now, huh? Funny how as well y’all petition for male victims to be taken seriously then laugh when fictional males experience this abuse, further adding to stigma. You can be hit on by the hottest mf on the planet but if you arent interested, that should be respected! Also we’ve all been inspired by at least one fictional character so yeah. Yknow, since I was little Ive been fighting for sex worker and homeless rights. But HH/HB treatment of both leave a bitter taste in my mouth. I’ll still fully support sex workers and the homeless, but that’s the fucking effect this show is having. Bearing in mind I wont ever share everything Ive been through - and I shouldnt fucking have to in order to be believed and validated (obvs proof is required in a legal case but that’s a whole other topic). Why should I share MY fucking pain especially when you fuckers have belittled and triggered it more so? We have our rights to our secrets but fuck ME you lot NEED to start acting appropriately and like decent fucking humans. ‘iTs HeLl’ yeah and welcome to Earth- the team and yourselves live HERE. You obide by THESE rules. And as someone with beliefs (and a LOT of ancient fucking texts and studies on this shit) their Hell isnt even a proper Hell! It’s closer to purgatory and even then it’s not. Regardless, it’s a poorly built world with the lore consistently changing per episode and tweet, with many plot holes, and is apparently easy to get into - even via accidentally watching porn according to a stream. If youre gonna parade youre a fucking expert and research into demonology and use real believed figures, at least get THAT right. In fact, Lucifer and Lilith (and Stolas tbf) are ESPECIALLY risky as theyre a lot more complex than most easy access texts will tell you. Likewise, Stolas’s first introduction and main focus is sex. He’s one of the FEW Goetia demons that dont have some involvement in relationship issues at ALL. He’s known for astrology, crystals and herbs but hes also known to aid MONEY troubles (it’s lesser known but it’s true! HB Stolas is an insult to the Prince). Turning Vodou into something evil is vile considering it’s powerful and liberated slaves. Pentagrams are nothing to do with Satan, they’re magic based sigils. Upside down cross is the symbol of a SAINT. It’s just some edgy attempt to trick people into believing they know more than they do. Also you should NEVER dabble and doodle sigils without knowing the meanings or respecting what they behold. Vox and Val, real fuckin cute way to make them look like a stupid fucking highschool drama instead of a fucking SEX TRAFFICKER (note: real pimps often target YOUNG folks too - aka minors - and groom them into sex work. Theres different types of pimp. Viv has shown barely any understanding of ‘the game’ and its a fucking insult to injury. Yes we KNOW what a fucking pimp and prozzie are! We dont need to see it. We need REAL AWARENESS.) and a fucking scheming bastard of a CEO salesman botman. And yet even THEN lets go a step further and make some yandere wuv on boyfweind aboose! Fuck off- Now I love a good anime but these tropes are getting fucking dangerous now. And unrealistic to real love and relationships. Kids nowadays know fuck all on a healthy relationship (neither did the fuckin 50s tbf) and Im seeing more romaticism and glorifying abusive situations. Like the show ‘You’. Ok, there’s a fuckin bloke online who slaughtered innocents and kidnapped yet people commented how cute he is on his IG and that they want to be kidnapped or killed by him next. Dont believe me? Look up Peter Manfredonia Connecticut and the comments people left him and then tell me why shit like whats being presented in HH/HB ISNT fucking concerning - because it is. For a series about redemption, it’s brilliant at the opposite (Quote from the creator herself, Viv has posted that it’s influencing her bad choices. Even as a joke, proof’s in the pudding). And the overall focus on sex in the way Viv does is so immature and really creepy, and this is from an ADULTS perspective. From one adult to another, Im concerned as to why any of them think this is a normal fixation. Then again they’ve hired quite a large amount of dodgy folks and even a child. Most of this shit gets avoided with a basic background check like most companies run. I DO like Hazbin. Or the premise. I love some of the cast and spite the others. In Helluva, I just like a tiny portion of the cast. And I critique it so harshly because Viv DOES need a wakeup slap, grounding to reality, people who arent going to big her up or kiss her arse for once and shape her up to be the best she can be. The actually reach and even surpass her potential. And to reach where you need to be, there’s a lot of harsh lessons youll face. That’s life. Shes chosen one of the most HEARTLESS industries and if she blocks out critique as ‘hate’ then she’s not strong enough and wont last. It’s just another unprepped YanDev again (except I dont believe Viv to be a nonce. Even with her dodgy past and dodgy present, I think her perspective on sex and relationship with sexuality is FAR from healthy BUT I dont believe she’s a pedophile. Ive bled my fair share and so far, I just think her sex perspective isnt healthy or mature for her age. But there’s little to nothing to suggest actual noncery - dont worry about accusations there. But YanDev is totally a dirty predator. Just clearing that up). Viv NEEDS some harshness and stability if she wants to do things right. And it’ll make her fucking cry but if she loves these projects as much as she claims to, then you’ll sacrifice blood, sweat and tears for that shit. Even the strongest points are mediocre at best when properly observed. She CAN do more, but she’ll have to face the harsh music. Viv wont see this, but if she does, I dont care if it upsets her. Why? Because this is that much of an issue - something she’s cultivated - that she needs to take action and not ignore it or be secretive about it. She needs to grow up and get tougher skin. Im not saying this to cause her pain. In fact, I wouldnt waste my fucking limited time if I DIDNT care. Trust me, I have duties to be met at a certain quota every single day. I say this shit only because I give a shit and care. If we met, she’d fucking hate me. But people like me are good for shaping people up to their potential. And we arent always this ‘tough love’ either. But when someone needs that level of harshness to help themselves, we’re not afraid to lose people or cause upset if the results end up being the best for them. If she ever saw this, she needs to re fucking evaluate her message, her story, and those she’s choosing to welcome into her circle. And all Im seeing is one rookie mistake after the other. Her paid patreon discord. Just like the messages Honest has posted on her side of being harassed (not in Vivs fyi), Ive experienced shit and bullying and even stay silent on their for being attacked for a group I fuckin paid to be in and yet I feel isolated. It’s all arsekissing and ‘thank you viv’ (thats an actual channel-) and it feels like a place of borderline worship and people trying to appease her 24/7 whilst kicking others with different opinions down. There’s so many I love but I aint kissin yer fuckin arse. Ask the closest friend I have - we’re fucking raw and wont just side with each other just because. We’ll call each other out if we think they’ve fucked up and then help each other build themselves up better. Because real fuckin people who actually care wont just want to be adored by you. They’ll care enough to point out your bullshit and help you, even if they upset you at the time. They’re real and upfront with you. People like us arent always the easiest to be close to either because we arent afraid of upsetting someone if it’s in their best interest and to help them. Likewise, we dont go out looking for fights either. Most times, we’re fuckin soft bastards- All this shit listed is the fuckin surface level of the real life hell of this fandom. And unsurprisingly, those who experience little to no toxicity have always been higher on that popularity ‘food chain’ - enough admirers and shared opinions that people wanna arse kiss regardless of their OWN feelings as well as neutral perspectives. I’d say you’re the lucky fans, but you’re not. You’re sheltered, and that isnt always the best way to be sadly. As for the fans. If Ive upset you. Well... I dont care. Because many of you have actively sought me out and weaponised my traumas against me. You never cared about my feelings then. Why should I care about yours? Im not doing this out of malice. Im fed up of humans behaving so pathetically yet claiming to be high and mighty. Most of you have been arseholes to those in and out of the community. The victims and non-victims alike. Hardly any of you considered once my real suffering. You put a drawing over a life. Many lives. You had the audacity to tell me Im full of shit. Some even using my real traumas to make a mockery of me and those Im around with a very similar history. Some with traumatic histories that differ from my own. You hardly ever considered the real lives of those effected. So no, Im not sorry for having the fucking balls to this day to still stand up for our rights and give us a voice that’s long been stolen. Im not sorry for being a fucking victim. Im not sorry for saying what desperately NEEDS voicing. And Im not sorry for not conforming to you or any fandom just to belong. We deserve better than to constantly be your fuckin arse monkeys (well... the trope is butt monkey but yknow-) and to be mistreated, misrepresented and harmed by you. You’re no different to the school bullies who give speeches on anti-bullying day. And I hope every single one of you starts looking into yourselves and improving. PS: Depending on the texts you read, Lucifer is said to have been redeemed or to be redeemed. Fun fact to haunt yalls with~ “

[magaprima]

Part 1 Episode 9 Thoughts

“Did you feel it too?”

The way Lilith leans in through the door, only a crack, the way she announces herself with a question, giving Sabrina the full chance to hide what she was doing. Sabrina must seriously think Ms Wardwell is the most trusting, oblivious witch ever if she didn’t know she was returning a stolen book. Also the way Lilith pushes with the questions like ‘But surely you heard the dogs?’; she is trying to get Sabrina to admit what she’s done, so they can move on to the next stage of Satan’s plan. 

“It was exhilarating. Positively lifegiving”

I like Lilith describing the sound of all the hell hounds and the dogs in Greendale howling etc as being something life-giving, not just because I feel this is her throwing in her bits of honesty, but just the idea that something so powerful, something tearing the curtain between worlds, is something that is exhilarating to a witch; I love it. Because it’s that thing of the old ways, the magical ways, worshipping the raw power of the earth and all it’s many realms and worlds, finding exhilaration in what mortals would find terrifying. I just love that.

“Now, you weren’t thinking of borrowing my Book of the Dead without permission were you?”

Her emphasis on borrowing, the way she raises her eyebrows, Lilith knows perfectly well how that choice of words is going to make Sabrina extremely uncomfortable, make her wriggle with guilt. 

“Not when all you need do is ask. Take it”

And that’s the final knife. I would have just lent you the book, Sabrina, you needn’t have added stealing to your many crimes. Look how trusting I am and how giving, and you have betrayed me. She is twisting that knife right in, just to make sure Sabrina would come running to her in the end. 

Which is exactly what happens. Although, when Lilith opens the door she looks genuinely shocked to find Sabrina there. Either she didn’t expect this to happen so quickly, or she was genuinely expecting someone else...in which case, who? Another pizza boy? 

But seriously, this whole scene where she lets Sabrina in is a bit weird. Because when Sabrina walks past her, we don’t see the glare like we did in the Exorcism episode, we don’t see the smug smirk of success, Lilith actually maintains her genuinely concerned and shocked expression and I’m puzzled by this. It either means, like I said, that she wasn’t prepared for it being so soon, or has there been something going on in the room before Sabrina arrived? Has she had another visit from Satan? Or are we seeing those first flicker of doubts in Lilith that we do see growing from the Part 1 finale onwards (the first sign of doubt in the Witching Hour finale, is her killing Stolas when he suggests Sabrina would be Queen)? Is Lilith no longer feeling so willing and confident in leading Sabrina down this path? Is she starting to question things? Is this the first flicker? Even if it only lasts for a mere second or two?

When Sabrina is apologising for lying and stealing the book, it occurs to me that much like when Sabrina thanked her in the Exorcism episode, and I said it’s probably the first time anyone has ever genuinely thanked Lilith, I think this is also probably the first time anyone has ever genuinely apologised to her. I argued consistently that the reason Lilith behaves the way she does for the majority of Part 1 and the large part of Part 2, is due to her experiences. Victims who have never experienced true love, affection, appreciation, kindness etc, rarely display it to others, because they have no basis of experience to draw on. Lilith has only known, for like 90% of her long existence, manipulation, abuse, anger, control, violence, disappointment, impatience, punishment etc, so that’s all she’s able to display herself confidently. Sabrina has had her experience gratitude, apology....softer emotions, ones that involve genuinely appreciating and caring for the other person. I do believe Sabrina, by her behaviour, played a significant role in Lilith regaining who she once was and standing against her abuser. 

“I understand. We’ve all done...unspeakable things to help the ones we love”

The way Lilith says this, the way she avoids Sabrina’s eye briefly, the way her gaze turns to the corner, the way she looks to the ceiling avoiding emotion, I feel she’s speaking the truth here, and I feel she’s thinking about things she’s done to help Lucifer. Unspeakable things. Things that, perhaps, are not in Lilith’s innate nature, but have become part of her being, her habit, in order to satisfy Lucifer. She may even be thinking about the point she became a demoness. She might be thinking about someone she killed. I don’t know what she’s thinking of specifically, but I definitely believe she is thinking of stuff Satan has made her do. 

When she describes what Limbo is like, Lilith seems to be going off into her own world again, and I feel confident she has been there herself, she has done that journey and remembers it. But why would that give her that haunted look unless....she lost someone to limbo? A very long time ago? Thousands of years ago perhaps? I’ve theorised that Satan has gotten rid of people she’s befriended before (platonic or romantic), just as he gets rid of Adam 2.0, so maybe she went into limbo for one?

“And poor Mr Kinkle’s brother”

Ah there’s the feigning-caring Lilith we know so well. You can hear her just slathering on the emotional prosodics here.

The way she stands up first, and looks down at Sabrina, waiting for her to stand too is a nice visual showing us that Lilith is very much the one in the driving seat here; she is leading every part of this development, and though Sabrina thinks asking to go to Limbo is her choice and idea, it’s in fact Lilith’s manipulations leading her to this point. Although she does slightly exhausted when Sabrina leaves. Exhaustion from ‘finally she’ll sign the book after this’ or exhaustion from ‘I’m so tired of this shit’ or both?

I love the red thread joining them for many reasons. For one it’s said a red thread joins those whose fates are entwined, and Liliith and Sabrina’s fates are definitely entwined, it’s also another modern witchcraft nod, and also it’s a nod to Greek mythology and the Labyrinth.

When Sabrina thanks her this time, Lilith can’t look her in the eye. She can’t meet her gaze when she’s showing genuine gratitude and she knows she’s giving her bullshit in return and has nothing to be thanked for. It’s only a flash of a moment, but it’s yet again telling us about that deep-buried humanity that still exists in Lilith somewhere. It’s quickly obliterated in the next moment when she smiles with uncontained glee behind Sabrina’s back as the girl opens the portal to limbo. It’s also perfect comic timing when she immediately straightens her face as Sabrina turns around. 

“I’ll be waiting right here for you”

Sabrina looks so young, like a lost child, when Lilith gives her this reassurance. She trusts her, relies on her, she thinks her favourite teacher is the one person who is always there for her, and will keep her safe while she’s in Limbo. And yet she’s the very one making sure she goes there. 

“Painful, but there’s one path left for you to follow”

I know Lilith is talking about Sabrina telling Harvey the truth, but it’s an interesting and great choice of words she uses here. Only one path. This is so much foreshadowing for Sabrina having no choice but to follow the Path of Night, that’s not even foreshadowing. It’s sunny-straightforward-telling. This might even be a full on slip of the tongue for Lilith because she’s just so convinced that once she breaks up with Harvey, Sabrina will run straight to her Dark Baptism. 

“Sabrina’s primary tie to the mortal realm, Harvey Kinkle, is about to be severed”

Lilith does really underestimate Sabrina’s friends here. And it’s very revealing about Lilith’s logic. Currently, and for a very long time, the only important person in her life has been Lucifer, he’s really the only long term relationship she has, the long term friend, even if it’s one way and abusive. So through Lilith’s realm of experience, she sees Harvey as being Sabrina’s only tie, just as Lucifer is hers. She doesn’t have friends herself (which, I’ll cry about that another day) so she underestimates the effect and importance of Sabrina’s. 

“Satan be praised, she’ll have no one to blame but herself”

There is truth in this. Although Lilith has been whispering in her ear, and although the Weird Sisters did kill Tommy Kinkle, Sabrina has made all her own choices. She could have chosen to listen to her Aunts and to Ambrose who guided her differently. But she chose to listen to Lilith because she was saying what she wanted to hear. It could be reasoned Sabrina had already made up her mind to resurrect Tommy, she just needed one adult to give her confirmation. She perhaps would have done it regardless, we don’t know. But it does mean that Lilith has been clever enough, that Sabrina would have no choice but to blame herself. I mean in Part 2 she does attack Lilith saying ‘I did all those things with you whispering in my ear’ but Sabrina still did those things. No amount of whispering could convince me to do something I didn’t already slightly want to do. 

Final note for the episode; Lilith smugly gets to successfully drink out of a straw without missing it.