#how is preferring a lesbian ship ’misogynistic’

[quillkiller]

Jily better, regulus being lilys “shorter dyke gf” is gross and unrealistic and frankly, misogynistic

ok caveman

[lylahammar]

can I be real I think that people are kinda catastrophizing about the ao3 m/m tag surpassing the f/f tag for dungeon meshi.

like I've been seeing soooo many posts the last few days lamenting about how fandoms are misogynistic and will always prefer mid yaoi ships even if the main ship of the series is lesbian and the women are well written........ but yall realize that the m/m tag surpassed the f/f tag because it's 3 different m/m ships that just barely outpaces the f/f tag which is almost entirely taken up by just farcille? I literally see nonstop farcille content and love for the women on here (I can't speak for twitter or any other social media wasteland bc I don't go anywhere else lmao). Everyone take a deep breath, trust me I get the fear but the dunmeshi fandom is appropriately filled with woman enjoyers I promise

[chaifootsteps]

I find it funny how Hazbin Hotel and its stans praise its representation so much but when you truly look it into

The "representation" ain't good on many levels

The main lesbian couple? So little chemistry people prefer the straight ship between a misogynistic villain and his henchwoman

The gay men? They are simply fetishized to please the fujoshi creator and her fans

Chubby people? The only main one we have is written to be annoying and that's it

POC? You can't even tell that some characters are black

Representation of religion? You could change the names of the characters that come from the bible almost all the versions and nothing would change because Christianity is treated more like an aesthetic

People who are victims of SA, Work placement abuse, and even people who harm themselves as a way to cope? It gets downplayed a lot even Angel's whole arc gets diminished when it can already end if Charlie just asks Lucifer to kill Val BUT NOT EVERYONE HAS A FRIEND WITH HIGH STATUS AND POWERS VIVZIE

This is why I end up losing interest in shows when "representation" is a selling point cuz it feels like it never feels about representation but gaining brownie points

I'm actually sitting here trying my legitimate best to think of anything Viv's done a good job of representing.

I'd say adoption, except Loona's physically abusive to Blitzo and it's played for laughs. Maybe disability, kinda sorta, except for those disgusting joke subtitles for the actual hearing impaired.

[eddiesfagbriefs]

Truly hope one day you look back on proudly proclaiming yourself a homophobe and laughing about violence on queer people and can say "wow i sure was an immature person back then with deep seated internalized homophobia i hadnt worked through yet." <3

anon can i tell you something. it’s a bit. it’s always been a bit.

the very first post i made in this fandom (when i had 30 followers) made a bucktommy send me a paragraphs long ask detailing how homophobic buddie shippers are, so i started calling myself homophobic because i thought it was ironic that they went into the inbox of a gay man and called me homophobic because i prefer one gay ship over the other.

the entire time i’ve been in this fandom ive seen bucktommy shippers harassing and starting smear campaigns against my mutuals, who are mostly lesbians, because they dislike a CANONICALLY racist and misogynistic character. just this week, three of my mutuals have been the target of such campaigns.

it does not matter if someone online says your favorite fictional character should die. you all did it with taylor kelly and none of you had a problem with it then! but when you take JOKING posts about the FAKE death of a FICTIONAL MAN and use those posts as reasoning behind threatening a real life person with violence? you need to step back and think about what you’re doing here. there is no reason to be so upset.

like, we all see the difference between joking about killing a fictional character and threatening actual violence, right? right?

because i’m not the one to pull this shit with, and i didn’t take it as a joke.

[correctproseka]

Ok but- and I am saying this with respect for your point of view bc I think you are correct on a wider societal level- I keep seeing this argument of 'There is more m/m fanfic therefore this fandom is lesbiphobic and misogynistic' and it has bothered me for a long time. As a queer girl myself, asexual and somwehere on the aro spectrum, who has many wlw ships and enjoys looking at art for them... I don't enjoy reading wlw or straight fics bc I subconsciously project myself into the relationships too much (this is also why i generally avoid reading straight romance books lol). When I read mlm fic, there's a degree of separation from me that means I can enjoy it without getting anxious about imagining myself in that position.

I'm not trying to be like 'oh woe is me i cant read yuri', im just explaining my own reasons, and trying to get across that other people have their own reasons for what they enjoy- ranging from long winded explanations like mine to 'idk I'm attracted to guys and I like writing about them'. People have preferences, and that comes across in most fandoms, even in heavily female casts like prsk. Like I mentioned, lack of wlw content IS an issue.... when it comes to mainstream media. But when it comes to fanfic... the majority of writers are queer, many are women, hell, some of the most prolific writers of mlm fic I know are lesbians. People have their own reasons for writing what they like, and they do it for FREE. I think it's silly to say a fandom is misogynistic when most of these fandoms are full of queer female writers writing what they want to write.

And again I say this with respect because I do see where you're coming from- instead of saying 'write less mlm', because absolutely one will listen to that.... say 'write more wlw'. Write what you want to see in the world! More fics are always a good thing!! And if you don't want to read about guys, that's what the ao3 filters are for lol.

If you actually read all this, thank you, I really appreciate it. Sorry for yapping in your ask box LOL I just wanted to express my opinion on this topic bc it's something that I care about a lot. Also, like I said, while I don't read fic for it I still love wlw ships so..... ANHANE YURI FOREVER 🌈🌈🌈🌈

See, the thing is, i agree with you, but is that really the only reason for A LOT of people?

What im advocating is not for people to write less mlm, is for they to look at themselves and wonder why they like it more, i know a lot of people who claim to like the boys more for this reason or that, then turn around and act completely misogynistic 5 seconds later, some of them in this fandom, even.

Im just saying that in a fandom with way more girls than boys, it makes not much sense how much more content of the boys there is.

The ao3 filters exist, yes, but they dont stop me from having barely any content even on bigger wlw shipps, from rereading the same fics over and over again because that's all I have for days/weeks, months even on the leoni/mmj side of fandom.

Sincerely, I have myself over 50 prsk fics, only one includes mlm and that one is a multi, focused mainly on platonic ships, and is still somehow my most famous fic.

I see your point, really, and I agree with it, but it only comes so far in a fandom like prsk where there's way more girls, or Alien Stage, that my friend got me into and the girls have been canon for so long but the boys have nearly always been more famous, even before they became "canon". As a wlw enjoyer its tiring to see this over and over again in every fandom im in, you know?

Plus, its not just not writing girls, its how the fandom ACTS with them. Saki as just a fodder for Tsukasa angst, Honami might as well not even exist, Mizuki themselves exist only to be a friend to Rui to a lot of people, An and Kohane? They're only backgrounds on Akitouya, that is when An doesn't get in between the ship, of course. Emu can't even be shipped with one of the boys, because she's a child obviously, but she can be shipped with Nene, just leave her to the side its alright.

Its a lot of double standards, and not only "not writing fics", the fics are just a quick way of showing what I mean.

[anghraine]

I just wanted to say how much I appreciate your Austen postings. It's hard to deal with all the heteronormativity in the fandom when I can't relate to it - "Who's the hottest Austen man?" I couldn't care less! - but then I feel guilty because hetero women are marginalized in media, too. There can be space for everyone, and I'm glad you provide some balance.

Oh, wow—thank you, anon! I really appreciate hearing this, honestly. Austen is both my main fandom over many years, and one of the most deeply alienating fandoms I've ever been in because of that intense heteronormativity. It's not about whether people in the fandom ship het or whatever (obviously my own OTP is a het juggernaut!), but there's this whole pervasive atmosphere that assumes Austen is for straight women and that straight women's romantic and/or sexual preferences define all perspectives on her work.

I don't want to understate the impact of misogyny on either straight women who love Austen (there are a lot of misogynistic stereotypes and assumptions around them) or on Austen's general reception in modern pop culture. There's no problem with straight women (and straight people of other genders too!) being in the fandom, but heteronormativity underpins so much of what goes on and what is assumed that it's this ... loud background noise that would be pretty intolerable if not for my handful of queer friends in the fandom.

Anyway, I'm really glad if my grey-ace lesbian Austen stan monologuing has made the fandom even a bit less alienating for some others than it has often been for me. And I appreciate you reaching out to tell me.

[blubushie]

not knocking anyone's preferences but i've noticed that it's usually the hardcore heavymedic shippers who push the medic is gay headcanon so adamantly. like, do whatever you want but i've seen some people get borderline biphobic and dare i say misogynistic about it (because how dare a woman even breathe near their precious gayboys)

Nah yeah fucken oath. I've seen it too. The only thing close to it that I've seen is people's insistence that Sniper is gay (this coming from SniperSpy shippers AND SniperScout shippers). But the ship police handling the case of Medic's Sexuality seems to largely be HeavyMedic shippers. As a bisexual man who leans gay more than straight, I think a lot of it is just people fetishising MLM and aggressively defending their gayboys. And MLM fetishisation runs rampant in fandom anyway.

Also people really dislike Zhanna because they seem to think she comes between Demo and Soldier instead of... iunno a polycule situation. I've seen some fucken heinous misogynistic takes about her.

Or they mash Pauling and Zhanna together despite Zhanna Loudly Disliking Pauling. Even if you HC Pauling as a lesbian, I don't think it speaks well that you immediately ship her with one of the only other women she spends time around when their chemistry is so bad. It's not even toxic yuri it's just Zhanna Does Not Like Pauling. I especially don't understand it when the Admin is right there. TF2 fandom afraid of old ladies apparently. Youse never seen your nan's tits have you.

[zorilleerrant]

For the ask game, ship you’ve unwilling come around to!

Oh, I have so many NoTPs in every fandom, and, unfortunately, a ton of them tend to be canon or popular in fandom! The ones that bother me so much I had to block the tags are Dick/Babs, Tim/Kon, and Spike/Buffy. I think those are the only ships I currently have blocked, but some of that is just because the other ships are less popular (or fewer people I follow care one way or the other).

With Dick/Babs, it's that I love their dynamic as childhood friends or as young superhero friends, and if they have romantic entanglements on top of that it feels like it's invalidating the friendship. There's a lot of 'this boy and girl are friends so they have to date' (see also: these two queer boys/girls are friends so they have to date) and it gets its ick on ships, even though generally I do enjoy a friends-to-lovers arc. It's also a little creepy to me that Babs was originally Bruce's love interest, and then infantilized to be Dick's love interest - the same reason that Kori/Jason and Raven/Damian bother me so much. Also, Babs is a lesbian. I really just prefer them as mlm/wlw solidarity and not in a bi4bi way.

Tim/Kon and Spike/Buffy are more a problem with the fans than any of the canon material. (Which is why I ship Tim/Kon in the HBO Titans universe, which I haven't seen many people being mean about.) I see a lot of Tim/Kon fans hating on Bernard and Tim/Bernard and also hating on DC in a way that honestly feels pretty homophobic. I don't think that's their intention but it really sounds like the same arguments people who just don't want canon queer characters at all make. I also see them hating on Steph and Tim/Steph sometimes in ways that are pretty misogynistic (and also biphobic) and I just don't like it.

Spike/Buffy is like... I enjoyed the dynamic on the show, where they were both unhealthily codependent and toxic to each other. Two people who think they're in love or have the potential to be in love because they won't address their own problems is my jam! Of course, most of the shippers seem to want to treat it like a real (or especially a healthy) relationship instead of a toxic situationship. There's also the problem that, like, they keep defending why Spike 'deserves' to still be in a relationship with Buffy after assaulting her, sometimes with pages long essays, and never once mention how Buffy might feel about that. Completely ignoring Buffy's opinion on the whole thing feels, to me, even more nonconsensual than the original incident (which I was willing to chalk up to bad writing and ignore). So now the merest mention gives me the creepy crawlies. This is most canon ships on BtVS, tho.

Most ships I'm open to, tho! I especially enjoy hearing about rarepairs and anything that couldn't happen in canon (crossover ships, etc.) because I can roll it around in my head until I understand it. Which is why even stuff that squicks me at first I'm willing to give a chance if the story sounds interesting enough.

[sky-is-the-limit]

The bucktommy shippers really don’t understand anything related to this show to a baffling degree. A lot of them have literally just started watching the show since bi Buck became canon and they just have no clue what they’re talking about. I have been here since the beginning of season 3, and have been a dedicated Buddie shipper not because I just want to see men kiss but because they genuinely have the potential to be an amazing queer slowburn and their chemistry is top tier. Anyway I just want to say a few things.

Firstly, we don’t dislike the finale because of one 55 scene bffr. We dislike the finale because it took away a daughter from a lesbian couple and gave her to a straight couple (albeit probably temporarily), because the pacing was super weird and nothing seemed to have any emotional weight, and because they brought back a geriatric racist misogynist freak of a man for no reason.

Also the “Ryan doesn’t want Eddie to be gay” stuff is nonsense. Ryan is literally the person who came up with Buddie as a shipname, I’m dead serious him and Oliver were discussing what it would be and Ryan picked Buddie! He’s been supportive of the ship since the very beginning. He’s always said that he’s open to the possibility of Buddie happening. Him referring to Eddie as heterosexual means literally nothing because Oliver was also obviously not calling Buck bi before it became canon in the show. Ryan calls Eddie hetero because that’s canon, he can’t just say whatever he has to stick to what is shown in the show. Also they’re very conveniently forgetting the interviews with Ryan that were released after the finale in which he says that Eddie is no longer looking for a mother for Chris, that with Buck he can see what it’s like to have someone at his side to always have his back as opposed to how it was with his ex-wife, and he also used the word partner and referred to Eddie’s future love interest in a gender neutral way.

On top of that Oliver is a very transparent guy, he’s an actor but he can’t pretend to like people or storylines for the life of him. When Buck was together with Taylor, Oliver made it very clear how much he hated that ship on his social media. Now with BuckTommy he never shares or interacts with anything from that ship, the only time he did was some fanart of their first kiss and that makes a lot of sense because that’s when bi Buck became canon. But since then, not a word from him, the only things he posts and interacts with are Buddie related or just more generally related to the whole show. It’s very clear what his preference is, and even though he isn’t the writer he’s still number 3 on the call sheet and if he cannot be bothered to put his all into BuckTommy scenes because he hates that ship, eventually the writers won’t really have a choice.

Also anyone with common sense can tell after that finale that Buddie are endgame, it’s so incredibly clear which ship has the chemistry and emotional depth to last in the long-term, and it’s not the ones in that 55 second scene.

I hear you!!!

My main concern with this entire discourse, is that people are putting words into the acotrs' mouths and share it as factual.

I don't have much to add due to my extremely limited (to zero) knowledge but yesterday I watched another episode from s6 (I tune in whenever they show a random episode at 2am 😭) where Buck passed out on Eddie's couch as he was getting them beers and that was such a cute, intimate scene!! I can definitely see the chemistry between the characters.

[sneezemonster15]

I find it so funny when people try to dissuade people from shipping same sex pairing by using the "We need more representation of close and intimate male friendship. People need to stop making everything gay" excuse. But the reality is that the friendship who is truly under representated is male/female friendship. Ask anybody if 2 guys can be friend? Of course! Ask if 2 girls can be friend? Obviously! Now ask if a a guy and a girl can be friend? "Well, hum ... not really ... the guy probably want to fuck the girl if she is pretty ... the friendship isnt real." Clearly society lacks representation of healthy male/female friendship. Tv shows, anime etc ... give the MC a whole harem of girls (girls who are supposed to be just friends and he thinks of as only friends at the beginning) pining for him or love the trope of the good guy friend who is waiting for the girl to stop dating assholes and finally notice him. Which also lead to the gay best friend trope bc its the only guy who can be the girl's friend.

Representing male/female friendship not only help against heteronormativity but also misoginy. The idea that women arent fun to be around and are boring perpetuate the thought that women are just good at being fucked, at being wifed etc, and not fun enough to just have a good time doing friends stuff ... So men end up thinking they can only return romantic or lustful feelings toward women.

All that to say that those people clearly do not care about friendships representation. They are just annoyed that people prefer same sex pairings to the holy straight pairings. And "feminist" women who cheer because their queens finally got to get the dicks they wanted are advocating for the wrong thing. Celebrating their faves girls being used as sequel factories or for disney happy ever after the heteronormative and misogynist society craves so much, isnt the big flex they think it is.

Well said anon.

Yes, I agree there is a dearth of healthy and realistic m/f friendships in media and they are surely underrepresented. Lately, more creators are portraying m/f friendships in their films/series etc. But yeah, it's such a stereotypical thing to reduce m/f relationships to romantic or lewd isn't it?

I liked how the character of Amy in Gone Girl talked about the Cool Girl trope. How men wanna see women they wanna hang out with in a certain way and outwardly, it seems this is a fun girl, with a free, liberal and casual devil may care attitude yet still have their personalities revolving around the desires and fetishes of men. I also liked how again, the character of Amy in a film called Chasing Amy portrayed a similar issue, even though the film has its own problems. How men see lesbian women and even though their sexual interests don't intersect, men nevertheless feel righteous about constructing sexual fetishes around it, objectifying lesbians because women, by the simple grace of being women, simply cannot do without men, that their whole existence is nullified if men aren't in it.

A male/female relationship which is platonic and based on equal terms can do so much to give some resolution to this issue.

As for the 'feminist' fans in this fandom, it is interesting to see how Sakura or Hinata stans think cheering their faves is a holy act of feminism while understanding nothing about feminism and female representation in media. It has created such a toxic environment in this fandom, and I am sure others. To a huge extent, I blame the industry because the target group of this genre is so impressionable, it's so easy to misinterpret things, especially with how these women are written. While I get why Kishi did it with these two female characters, given they would be paired up with his two main (and clearly gay, living in a homophobic world) characters for the sake of the sequel and that he writes other female characters much better than theirs, it still is very problematic. Because they were never condemned in the actual story. They were never called out. Never made to face consequences for their actions. And this, THIS, makes their fans so insistent about the apparent goodness of them, while sweeping the rest under the carpet. While it doesn't take a genius to spot their faults, it certainly takes a certain level of understanding of narrative, visual language, themes and understanding of the world.

I can talk about narrative subversion till my lungs give out but unless one shows an inclination to learn how narratives are built, they would keep sticking to their token understanding of concepts such as representation and feminism. Which is such a sad phenomenon. It is almost hurtful how so many fans are so willingly tone deaf and blind, all because of some shallow relationship they wish they had. It's amazing to me how well fortified their delusions are. How strong their willingness to be courted by a hot popular boy. How fine they are with having their fave character revolve around some guy for the most superficial of reasons. This is what their understanding of feminism amounts to. All this nonsense for some cheap self insert.

Even Sasuke stans who are anti SNS. They prefer thinking of Sasuke as some cool, badass, revolutionary man archetype who sleeps around and struts with his massive dick out. And this is how they facilitate their Sasuke*fem reader smut. These Guevara extremists who think homosexuality only exists in western societies, who also consider themselves uber feminists, who think Sasuke casually slept with Karin (because why wouldn't he? He is a man and he has a dick and a willing girl is around, it all makes sense lol), are fine with self inserting into a female character, as long as the badass revolutionary would casually fuck her and then throw her away or let her die without a second thought after his demands have been met. Because yay, feminism. Like irony goes to anti SNS and SS/NH to die a horrible death.

Hinata stans would get triggered at SNS posts or anti NH posts and share the same four Spanish panels of photographs of Naruto with his family because that's their understanding of a happy family. Orchestrated studio pictures. Because gay men living in a het marriage have never been clicked. Because gay men in het marriages don't exist. That's their extent of understanding a relationship. A family picture. It is certainly not a flex.

Just look at how SS apply all sorts of mental gymnastics to justify Sasuke staying away from his family for 12 freaking years. Like you can certainly feel bad for SS stans who even after Gaiden, had the courage to ship this ship. The levels of desperation. And to what ends? What is even their payback? Where is their reward? Kishi certainly isn't giving them any.

You know sometimes I feel shipping is a strong word for what I feel for the story. Because Naruto is just a love story about two boys. If I want them to be together, is it shipping? Shipping is such a fandom term. If that's what the story has led me to, to hope for the two main characters to have a resolution that the entire narrative has painstakingly led me to, is it really shipping? I am just an ordinary reader/audience who wants a good ending to this story. The way the creator wrote it. All I did was to follow what he wanted me to see. Is it then shipping or just a natural conclusion to the story? To want them to be with each other?

As for those fans who say 'we need more representation of men being friends, stop making everything gay' are so fucking silly. Like damn, don't we have enough representation of platonic male bonding? There are entire tropes based on that dynamic. Cop buddies, bro code, band of brothers, big brother mentor, bromantic foil, bros before hoes, brother from another mother and this goes on and on and on. I can count like forty films and twenty books off the top of my head that use these male bonding tropes. Just say you are a homophobic piece of shit. Why circumvent facts? Like we live in a patriarchal, heteronormative world and suddenly stories about men being friends are in jeopardy. Like c'mon, cut the utter bullshit. Lol.

There are only a handful of sane voices in fandoms. Because the rest of them leave and I totally understand why. Hehe. But while you are here, do what you can and then get out. This shit is not good for anyone long term.

[chaifootsteps]

I know a lot of the fandom already shits on BlitzStrike but I think that Blitz x Verosika gets more shit from Stolitz fans especially when people prefer Blitzsika over Stolitz and they try to say shit like it's just because it's straight or some shit despite the fact Blitz is pan and Verosika is probably also bi or pan since it's been implied she likes women but it was also shown in the most misogynistic way with Blitz's line about her "smelling like fish" which is actually a derogatory insult towards sapphic women so shows how much Vivzie respects not only women but lesbians especially and how apparently it's homophobic to prefer a ship over the popular gay ship just because it's "straight passing" because you can't be LGBT and attracted to the opposite sex apparently but then again criticising Helluva has always been "homophobic."

I even saw a commission artist say they refused to draw "toxic" ships like Blitzrika but they were perfectly fine with drawing Stolitz since they were a major shipper but you know what's funny? Blitzrika is actually more healthy than fucking Stolitz ever was! Sure they may hate eachother and are toxic but they are exes so it's perfectly reasonable that they hate eachother and it's only because Blitz fucked Verosika over and they had a major breakup but here's one thing that will piss Stolitz fans off... BLITZ ACTUALLY LIKED VEROSIKA! and not only that... HE ACTUALLY WANTED TO HAVE SEX WITH HER! Sure we may not know what their relationship was fully like but it was clear they actually had mutual feelings for eachother and Verosika liked Blitz so much she literally got his name tattooed on her! And clearly the reason she hates Blitz so much is because he used her! Sure Verosika may be a bitch but she has ever right to hate Blitz for what he did to her and there isn't any bullshitting around that even in the show! And it's clear Blitz feels bad for what he does for how he reacted when she called him a "wreckless heartbreaking freak" or how he still has guilt in his subconscious because if he didn't give a shit about Verosika. Why would he feel bad? Even if he hates her he still clearly does feels some remorse for what he did. And this is shit you can gather from the fucking subtext in comparison to the actual screentime you get with Stolitz. Blitz has been shown more times to have actually been shown to care about Verosika than fucking Stolas? What does that tell you?

Even if they have a fucked up relationship this was only after they broke up in comparison to whatever the hell Stolitz has going on! At least Blitz actually chose to be with Verosika and they clearly had consent! You know it's bad when toxic exes somehow have a better relationship than your so called main forbidden gay love story. Yet the fandom thinks an yaoi sex slave ship is somehow healthy gay representation but exes who happen to have had a messy "straight passing" relationship and now resent eachother over something the other did and are now toxic towards eachother and yet it's clearly shown they do still care about eachother on a surface face level which is something that is actually happens in real life is a homophobic straight ship?

I don't even ship it but I'd take it any day over what ever the hell Stolitz is and them getting back together would actually be much more believable than Blitz having feelings for Stolas will ever be. I honestly think it would be funny if someone pointed out that Blitz has been shown to love Verosika more than he has Stolas as while I do agree BlitzStrike is probably the best ship. Verosika is the only character that Blitz has so far been show to have actually had mutual feelings for unless Fizzarolli counts? But then again they have that weird sort of foster siblings implication going on so who cares? And even then there was still more evidence before Season 2 that Blitz had more feelings for Verosika than anyone else especially Stolas and I am not counting attraction since Blitz is almost always horny so whatever. Still Blitz feeling remorse and even showing that he at one point enjoyed spending time with Verosika is more convincing than whatever love confession they make Blitz give to Stolas.

Sorry for this awful rant.

No need for apologies, Anon, it was a good rant.

Striker, Verosika, Fizz...at this point, I would ship Wally-goddamn-Wackford with Blitz over Stolitz. Anything, anything but that.

[arggghhhsstuff]

Here's your reminder that straight up trashing on lily evans because you prefer james in a mlm relationship is Not Okay and deeply rooted in misogynity. She is a fictional character whose only action was to protect her son with her life. She did nothing wrong; she just saved her son by loving him. That's literally it. That's all we know about her. That and the description made by remus later in the books: a loving and kind woman. Now if you don't like her character, that's fine, I don't care. I don't necessarily agree with you but I won't come at you either. But don't you dare shit on her just bc she's a woman getting 'in the way' or your favorite mlm ship because that's fucked up on so many levels. And don't get mad at people calling out your behavior, because it is misogynistic.

I think many people in the fandom aren't ready for this conversation, but it has to be said: This fandom is deeply, deeply misogynistic. It has a problem with female characters, not matter the era we're talking about. They are ignored, underestimated, left out in favour of male characters. It's not a mistake or an oversight: it's decision, a choice made by writers and artists to not focus on the girls.

Like, do you know how hard it is to find a fanfiction where a woman is the main character? And it's even worse if she's in a wlw relationship. I don't think i've ever read a 'marylily raising harry' fic, when we have dozens of fics where harry is raised by wolfstar or jegulus. No hate against those, they're great, but come on. Don't tell me you don't see a pattern here. It's the same as everywhere else: people just don't care about the girls. It's exhausting. It's fucking exhausting and I'm sick of seeing the same bullshit over and over again. Like. I am a queer teenage girl. I would like, too, to see myself represented by and in a fandom constituted (mostly) of queer individuals, just like me.

But no. It's like the world is not aware of the existence of lesbians. They exist! They are very much a real thing and would like fics where they are represented, for fuck's sake. The worst part is that I'm not even surprised; angry, yes, and disappointed, but bot surprised. It happens every time.

[mushed-kid]

saw a tiktok and wanted to this myself, so…

my mighty med/lab rats/elite force lgbt+ headcanons

(including all the roles i wanted to add, not just the mains)

Kaz:

- Bisexual, very open and casual about it, (Often refers to himself as gay because it comes naturally and the difference isn’t that important to him)

- Cis guy, but he also doesn’t care that much (as in he would wear a skirt or dress, he just doesn’t)

- Doesn’t come out, he just lets people figure it out (“If you don’t know I’m gay yet, that’s on you”)

- Not afraid of getting into yelling matches or fights with homophobes for himself or his friends

Oliver:

- Trans ftm (come on, you guys also watched Oliver Hatches The Eggs, right? They were trying to send us a message!)

- His mom had refused to believe him at first, but when he didn’t stop claiming he was a boy no matter how many specialists and doctors she brought him to, she just accepted it

- She went full ‘you’re a boy’ mode, and he wasn’t allowed to do anything she considered slightly girly at all, (he was just glad she didn’t hate him, but now he’s very afraid of seeming feminine because he thinks people won’t see him as a guy anymore)

- Sits the Elite Force down to come out, but he works himself up about it and is so filled with nerves that he starts crying (the others panic thinking something is seriously wrong)

- Kaz is the only one that knew from before because they’re best friends

- Bonds with Chase about being trans

- Gay with comphet (because of his mother making him believe that was his only choice)

- Because of that, he hasn’t come out as gay (because he doesn’t know he’s gay yet), and sometimes he comes off as slightly homophobic (also due to the fact that he has very fragile masculinity and thinks guys can’t be feminine)

- The others get mad at him, but he doesn’t mean anything bad, his mom just kinda sucked (and it’s hard to shake some of the things she’s told him)

- Very afraid of homophobic and transphobic people, which is why he takes so long to come out to his friends

Skylar:

- Bisexual with a preference for women or lesbian with comphet

- I like her and Oliver so I hc her as ‘Doesn’t really care because it’s not a thing on Caldera’

- Cis girl

Alan:

- Cishet

- Idk what more to say about him

Gus:

- Gender fluid

- Pan maybe? I imagine him swinging every way because he really doesn’t care about gender

Horace:

- Cishet

- Supportive, but very confused about everything (he always uses the wrong labels when talking about someone)

Jordan:

- Cis

- Aromantic (She thinks it’s gross)

Stephanie:

- Cishet (Though she does kind off have a weird thing for Gus so I’m not so sure)

- Will hang out with gay people just because they’re gay so she can seem like a good person

Tecton & Megahertz:

- They’re gay and dating (I think this ship is kinda funny so… it’s canon)

- They’re both cis

Captain Atomic:

- Cishet

- Slightly homophobic

- Also very misogynistic

Chase:

- Trans ftm (the constant joking about his height and how girly he is in lab rats? A Sign.)

- Came out when he was very young, he always knew

- Raised in a basement so you’d think he didn’t know about transphobia for a very long time, but he did, (Mr.Davenport talked to him about it and he researched it thoroughly)

- Bisexual

- Tries to avoid homophobic and transphobic people, and just ignores them, but it doesn’t always work. Sometimes he’ll just take it because he doesn’t want to fight, and it makes the other worry about him a lot

- Other times, Spike comes out and he goes crazy on them, and people leave him alone for a while after that

Bree:

- Lesbian with comp het (she thought she was straight because that’s all she knew, and then she thought she was bi because she liked girls, but then she realized she didn’t like guys)

- Cis girl

- Will verbally kill a homophobe

Adam:

- Everyone assumes he’s straight, because he never came out as anything else (he just doesn’t really care about coming out at all)

- He mentions something about a guy he likes/dated back in high school and everyone is super shocked

- “I thought you guys knew”, - “We thought you were straight!?” - “I never said that either” - “fair enough”

- Cis guy

- He’s not transphobic, and only makes those jokes about chase because he genuinely forgets chase wasn’t born a boy. (Chase thinks that makes him his biggest supporter even if the jokes sting)

- Will beat up anyone that says or does anything mean to his siblings about it

Leo:

- Straight

- He/They (idk if that counts as non binary?)

- Would start fights with homophobes and then realize he’s fucked and needs help

- Got bullied for being gay even if he isn’t, definitely came home after being picked on and trying to hide his injuries from tasha (who notices and calls the school right away)

- Will still start fights with homophobes, now knowing that he can take them

Marcus:

- He’s an android so technically not cis, but he’s a guy (he fucking hates it/its pronouns because he’s not just a machine)

- Aromantic & Asexual (he’s very indifferent to both relationships and sex)

- Doesn’t really do relationships, but if he did, it would be more like his partner in crime (real crime not pranks)

- If he did get an evil sidekick of sorts, he’d probably be gay

- Will claim to have any gender of sexuality if it’ll help him out of anything, no matter how small

- Will also accuse anyone of being homophobic if it helps him in any way (Douglas hates both of these)

- Outing someone is the one thing that he doesn’t do (Douglas is so proud of that one)

- Will start a fight with anyone at any time, and realizes beating someone up for being homophobic won’t get him in trouble sends him on a mission to find every bully at school

- He claims it’s just because he won’t get in trouble, but Douglas knows that deep down he cares (because he does get in trouble at school, just not at home)

Donald:

- I want to say cishet, but trans ftm is calling my name from afar

- Straight and borderline homophobic (he supports the people he knows and cares about, but in itself he thinks homosexuality is wrong)

- Will use his kids sexualities to look even better in media, with no regards for what they feel about it (They hate it)

- Outs people, but also tells his kids he’s proud of them no matter what and supports them, so they’re not very sure what he really thinks

- He’s just weird about it

- Will pretend he didn’t hear the homophobic or transphobic comment toward his kids if it means avoiding a conflict

Tasha:

- Cishet

- Very supportive of everyone

- Calls out homophobes and tries to inform everyone she knows about how important it is to be an ally

- Starts a group with some other moms to show support (the others think it’s a bit much, but she’s just being nice so they let her)

Douglas:

- Bisexual, but evil about it

- Strictly dated other bad guys/villains that he worked with, so most of his relationships sucked and ended badly (see; Krane and Giselle)

- Trans ftm

- Has a lot of kids, but honestly doesn’t know who any of their dads are

- I want Adam, Bree, and Chase to have the same dad, but I also kinda wanna say Adam has a different one, and that Bree and Chase are twins

- Daniel has another dad again, and Douglas realized he couldn’t raise the kid alone, so he had him adopted to keep him safe

- Will piss off a transphobe and run away from the fight

Perry:

- She/They

- Will rip a homophobe to pieces without breaking a sweat (she also knows a guy, so getting rid of any evidence is easy)

…..

and that’s everyone i could think of!

[cassiopeianscribe]

(For context, this was said to "prove" that certain straight ship is more #feminist than certain lesbian one).

This exhibit shows why Utena is one of the wide category of things that I always assume to be brought up just to show how #progressive and #feminist you are. Because that's the only thing of its kind that you know about, or the only one that you managed to familiarize yourself with (through clenched teeth, probably). And the reason you managed to do it is half of the time to devalue every other one while feeling righteous and like an #ally.

"Tokenstanning", as one person said (maybe not one, but she is whom I got it from).

You know, those people who will cover in dirt every strong (whatever it means) female character and then pull a card "I am not a misogynist, I like Ripley, why can't more characters be like her?" Or people who bring up Le Guin as the paramount of female fantasy writer to explain why every female writer whose style deviates from her is unworthy and actually secretely misogynistic (more misogynistic than male author of whatever doorstopper is en vogue right now). Or even better, Madeleine Miller. And they did so with rowling before they understood that open calls for trans genocide is wrong (only to tokenize trans women to advance whatever they want, but it's the whole other thing)

Back to yuri. Firstly, it was said about ship, so implication here is that all people who like the idea of those characters being in love are actually like this. There are some works that look like that, but it's not about any certain work. Also, why would people who want women to stay virginal and untouched prefer them being in saphic relationships to being actually virgins? And why is your first thoughts when seeing girls being gay is "oh, it actually doesn't count" even if you attribute it to the author?

Secondly, deeply personal fuck you. You assume that any lesbian romance that isn't extremely sexual is actually targeted at straight men, and not on saphic women who just don't like to read stories with a lot of sex in it. You (or maybe other people, idk, lesbophobes are all the same to me) also think that any media where girls do have sex is actually targeted at straight men, and not at horny saphics. And if the media doesn't have explicit scenes, but characters being sexual is mentioned a lot in whatever way, you will still put it in either box, or maybe say that no woman will ever write a story where characters' feelings are so bluntly stated, and girls don't think such things in the first place, so obviously it's not for us.

Just fuck you.

[speeedyquick1245]

Vent time: I’m not a big fan of Blackinnon simply because I’m a big Wolfstar shipper but it’s a little weird how people act like there’s something objectively bad about this ship. Like cmon we ship important canon figures with random oc no names already with Jegulus, Marylily, and whatever the heck the fandom likes these days. These ships are pretty much the same amount of grounding but are praised and considered far better than blackinnon because blackinon is simply a straight ship. There really is nothing better about any of these ships than blackinon.

I really hate how this fandom popularized the opinion that straight ships by default are boring or worse just because they’re straight. No it’s no true and it’s an immature thing to think considering that straight trans people and bi people exist in this fandom that proclaims to be very open to queer people. 2nd of all it it’s very shallow take because it ignores that straight ships aren’t bad because they’re straight but because sometimes they’re written from a very male gaze way that’s unequal and misogynistic.

I feel like a lot of black lash for blackinon is also with how Marlene is a lesbian in popular fanon which is why I also don’t really like this ship overall but people have to understand that at the end of the day it’s a headcanon. Marlene doesn’t have a confirmed sexuality. It’s all fanon so she can be anything. Along with Wolfstar shippers. I love Wolfstar to death but cmon at the end of the day Wolfstar isn’t canon so people who ship siriuswith someone else isn’t like objectively bad or anything. For a fandom that talks constantly about how with fanon people can do whatever they want it’s really interesting to see how much this fanon will stress adherence to whatever is popular fanon and bash on other ideas and works that don’t. At the end of the day all of marauders discourse can be solved with no it’s not just better or anything it’s just personal preference really.

[adelle-ein]

The sheer insistence that “preferences” in fandom exist in some kind of apolitical void and aren’t affected by racism and misogyny is fucking insane to me.

Like I have had a lesbian bitch at me for not centering f/f in a fandom enough and call me straight....Once. Exactly once. It kinda sucked and it was pretty rude that she couldn't be bothered to go look at my bio before calling me straight for loving a single m/f ship. Now how many people of all genders, some of whom definitely knew my sexuality, have been openly horrible to me for not prioritizing men or m/m or m/f enough? I can't even count it. On this platform alone I can't even count it. How many times have people, unprompted, told me that they Just Don’t Like any female characters? Or gotten mad about a text post that says “women” instead of “men?” Or just seen “I wish fandom cared more about women” and gone into a frothing misogynistic rage? Special shoutout to every gay man who has happily told me, a lesbian who likes and writes about men sometimes and they know it, that they as a gay man can only like and write about male characters because of their sexuality. More invalidating than the One Single Rude Lesbian by far.

Seriously, though, idk how lesbians have the reputation for being sooooo rude and demanding in fandom spaces, none of my lesbian moots have ever ever EVER tried to revoke my gay card for writing BD2 m/f nonstop for two years, and yet random people love to make all kinds of assumptions about me and just outright bully me for the horrible crime of not catering to men enough. There are BD people who STILL think I'm not catering to men enough because I picked the wrong man and don't care about Seth/Tiz/Ringabel/Yew lol

And don't even get me fucking started on how fandoms just oh-so-coincidentally never happen to like the dark-skinned characters. Yes, you just hate this brown character because he's mean and rude. You love the white character who's much meaner and ruder. That's just your taste! It means nothing! It's a coincidence and how dare anyone even imply otherwise??? I feel like at least some of these people will own up to the existence of internalized prejudice in other areas, but then when it comes to fandom they just stick their fingers in their ears and pretend it's not happening. Because fandom is sacred and perfect and any criticism of it is being a Mean Anti or whatever...

But yeah I am so fucking sick of misogynists and racists taking precedence, always, in every space. and I’m even more tired of their pathetic, nasty, rude, hateful excuses!