#gretchen rainart

[rwby-confess]

Confession #358

[evenmorefatallyobsessed]

Hazel’s sister…so we’re getting a tall and Thicc girl named Gretchen. I’m looking forward to this.

Here she is Gretchen Rainart

Hazel's little adorable 7 Foot tall sister (See, she's a whole foot smaller then him)

[rwby-encrusted-blog]

RK AU Idea: the Brawling Bakers, Hazel and Gretchen

Hmmm. Good basis, but ...

~~~~~

Blake: It's the Witch of the Yeast!

The tall, broad shouldered woman rolled her shoulders and cracked her neck, slinging her heavy crossbow over her shoulder

The Witch: Aye. You four are new. Are you looking for the way out?

Weiss: Yes.

The Witch: Well, I know part of the path. Unfortunately I don't know where the exit is either.

The Witch: You all must be hungry. Come. How did you find your ways to this place, Anyways?

Yang: *Thinking she looks somewhat familiar* We used magic to make bridges from Atlas to Vacuo, we got knocked off by some bad guys and now we're here.

The Witch: So you know of the Relics? Dah. I was supposed to be one of those Maidens. I got attacked by some Scorpion faunus, my Semblance went crazy and I found myself here.

Ruby: You were supposed to be a maiden?

The Witch: Yes. Given you aren't flying, none of you are?

Ruby: N-No ... Um. One of our friends from Beacon - do you know Beacon academy?

The Witch: Know It? I was top of my class! But, About your friend ... I can guess where that story ends. Where Their Story ends.

Weiss: Yes, and it's ... It's happened twice. Both of them gave themselves t protect as many as they could - to keep the powers out of another's hands.

The Witch: Well, I'm sorry ... That's horrid to hear. Y'all are real strong to keep pushin' on when they're gone.

Blake: You seem pretty young for someone from a Hundred-fifty year old book - but also was on remnant long enough to go to Beacon.

The Witch: Dah, that's the Ever After for you. I just miss my brother.

Weiss: You had a brother?

The Witch: Aye. his Name was hazel. Strong little one, all we had was each other growing up. I can only hope he's alive and well.

Yang: *Stops walking* H-hazel? You Disappeared listening to Ozpin?

The Witch: *halts, turns to Yang* Aye? What about it.

Yang: Is your name "Gretchen Rainart?""

Gretchen: ... You've met my brother? He's alive!?! IS he alright?!?

Yang: I- I- *Deep Breathe* I don't know how much you know about Ozpin's history, but he was fighting an Immortal Witch - someone named Salem. She is very strong, and very dangerous. Me and my friends were in trouble and he ... He saved us. he got us out of there.

Gretchen: ... Ah .... That ... That hurts to hear ... I am happy he did good with his life ... But that ... I haven't expected to see him again, but to know ...

Yang: I'm sorry.

Gretchen: No, don't be. It is better I know now that later. I- Let us keep moving ... I need to ... think ... about that.

[rachetmath]

Jaune VS Hazel

Okay, it’s time I talked about it. Let me finally get this out of my chest. Whether you agree with me or not, I don’t care. A Jaune vs Hazel fight should have happened in volume eight. Understand the number one reason is because these characters oppose each other well. This is due to not only their similarities being Salem and Ozpin as well as the Hunting world in general.

First, let’s take a look at Hazel’s character. Hazel had a sister named Gretchen Rainart, who wished to become a huntress. He didn’t approve of her wish, so she left without his regards. She soon died on her training mission causing Hazel to be alone. Hazel was soon visited by Salem who not only told him everything but he killed her many times to no avail. Soon Hazel joined her team despite knowing what she planned to do. He does betray Salem though. Now it’s time to go deeper.

Hazel only mentions his sister. This leads us to assume that their parents are gone. Dead probably, due to being in the same field of Gretchen’s interest. They were hunters hinting why Hazel didn’t want his sister to become one herself. This is similar to how Jaune’s parent with the only difference being Gretchen earning her spot while Jaune didn't. 

Due to their parents' deaths, it was up to Hazel to not only watch after Gretchen but provide for her. Hazel does so with his body by becoming a test subject for dust experimentations due to being able to block out pain. This means Hazel already had a lot to burden and only managed it because of his sister. And after Gretchen’s death and knowing it meant nothing he gave into despair. Eventually, this leads to his hatred towards Ozpin and losing faith in the world he created.

Next, let's discuss Jaune’s character. Only the important details though. Jaune cheated his way into Beacon due to wanting to be a hunter like his father. Jaune soon befriended and was taught by Pyrrha Nikkos, who sadly died in the Fall of Beacon. Pyrrha was Jaune’s friend. She was there for him especially when others didn’t believe in him. However, being chosen to become a maiden and having to choose after the Vytal Festival by Ozpin made her a bit distant. Not to mention the added pressure from her peers. Jaune, tried as he might, sadly wasn’t able to be there for her. After the fall, Jaune may as well once again feel alone. Jaune soon wanted revenge on her murderer, Cinder Fall who works for Salem.

However, on the journey to Heaven, after Qrow suddenly appears and tells him about how the world came to be and how Pyrrha was chosen to burden the maiden’s power by Ozpin no less he grows angry. Because regardless of it being Pyrrha’s decision, she was given a very short time to decide. Not only that Qrow told him this after they were just attacked by one of Salem’s forces. And to spit on Pyrrha’s death even more he finds out that Salem is invisible and Ozpin had no way to stop her. Yet despite all that information he still stands by his friends and doesn’t give in to his sorrows, unlike Hazel.

This is how Jaune and Hazel’s characters are alike. Both the people they cared about were killed. Sadly their deaths meant nothing. Both hated Ozpin and had to learn about Salem’s curse which made their lives even more difficult. However, that’s where similarities end. Despite both being disgusted with how Ozpin operates they took two different paths of going about it. Hazel sides with Salem, killing in both his sister's and Salem’s name because he lost all faith in humanity. Meanwhile, Jaune still fights Salem, along with his friends, keeping his faith in humanity. So if these two were to fight, how would it go down? How would have they encountered each other? Well, let us talk.

Jaune and Hazel's encounter with each other should happen inside the whale. Jaune and his team along with Ace-ops enter with their objectives being; to retrieve Oscar and The Relic Of Knowledge and destroy the whale from the inside. Jaune tells Ren to go with Ace-ops while he and Yang look for Oscar and the relic. Jaune and Yang soon split up as well to cover more ground. Hazel after getting the information he needed, could’ve summoned Jinn and attempted to kill Oscar.

(Okay now let me repeat this, Oscar, realistically, should not have escaped without his friend’s help. I understand he told Hazel the truth. Hazel got mad at him because whether he wanted Salem to win or not, what Oscar did was display himself as a coward. By definition “a person who lacks courage to face danger.” I understand it takes courage to tell the truth but this is not with your parents or your friends This is your enemy. Someone who is hired to hurt you. By telling them the information you not just putting your life in danger but others as well. So Hazel has no reason to let Oscar go nor keep him alive because one he displayed weakness. And sadly, Ozpin, so far has done more harm than good.)

Hazel then encounters Jaune but they don’t fight immediately. Jaune soon asks where Oscar is with Hazel's response to Jaune is why should he care. Hazel expresses how Ozpin so far causes more problems than provides solutions. How the hunters fail to do right for the people. And how Salem may be the best option to fix the world. Only for Jaune to counter him.

Jaune counters Hazel by explaining the people fighting outside in the war. How even though Ozpin may have caused the mess Oscar shouldn’t be the one to pay for. And even though we don’t know much about Salem, Jaune still mentions the many lives Salem has ruined. Hazel doesn’t feel that way as soon brings up Pyrrha, whose death everyone should know about by now, and how she was fooled by the same lies as everyone else. This soon angers Jaune so they brawl. The match would have gone down as Jaune’s first official fight. In this fight, he would have had no teammates to back him up and he would be alone.

The battle between Jaune and Hazel would have been of strength and willpower. Jaune would have to work with what he has at his disposal. Having to adapt, dodge, and maneuver around Hazel’s dust arsenal and attacks. Probably has to maintain a good ranch and close the distance to take advantage of Hazel’s semblance. All while having to take the beating and get back up from it afterwards, due to Hazel being physically stronger than him. But Hazel is not without weakness.

Hazel has a lot of dust at his disposal making him a force to be reckoned with. Also despite not having much screen time, Hazel has shown to have incredible endurance. Being able to insert dust into his body and taking a lot of punishment, due to his rapid healing of his body and his semblance. Proving Hazel seems to always manage to outpace his opponents. Not to mention his experience due to having fought other, probably more experienced hunters like Ozpin and Ironwood. This has been mentioned by Cinder, who said in volume five that he or Tyrian would have been sent to deal with any other remaining hunters. But Hazel’s semblance, though blocks out pain, causes Hazel to be reckless making him more accepting of attacks instead of dodging them. He could have his work cut out for him due to Jaune’s supposed potential (and maybe a bit of plot armor and unknown skill set).

This fight would've had incredible stakes, with Jaune only having a limited amount of time before he and Oscar could both possibly die. They would have been killed by Hazel’s hands or be killed in action by an explosion. Regardless, of whether Jaune could convince Hazel to help or win the fight, we have to admit that Hazel would have pushed Jaune to or above his limits. Proving that Jaune came far from the boy we met at Beacon.

Both men have suffered due to the hunting world. A world that Ozpin had a hand in creating. Whether intentional or not Ozpin was still responsible for the death of their loved ones. However as Hazel is trying to destroy the world and remake it into Salem's image, Jaune on the other hand is trying to save it and probably change it for the better. Hazel wants to kill Oscar if it means getting rid of Ozpin while Jaune wants Oscar alive due to him and Ozpin not being the same. The fight could end with both men understanding one another but one coming out on top.

Jaune might as well have inherited Gretchen's spirit to stop her brother from making a mistake. Restoring Hazel’s faith in mankind and showing him despite the circumstances can still do the right thing. That he can still fight the good fight. And if he still dies, at least he would have passed his will and dreams down to someone. And Jaune being an Arc, wanting to keep his word as well as being in the hunting game longer than a farm hand could be a better choice than most. 

And this is why I think Jaune and Hazel should have fought. Not only because it would have been an incredible end to Jaune’s Arc of missing Pyrrha. As well as possibly giving him a different perspective on the situation. Now proving he can fight on par with his friends, Jaune would be more determined than ever to stop Salem and her forces. Even if he has to work with people he doesn’t like.

Bonus: (Look let me explain. Whether we like it or not Ozpin has done more harm than good. Whether it be due to the amount of people who died or how all of Remnant has suffered due to his existence. Ozpin knows all the relics' names and how they work. With that knowledge, he could’ve used the relics in many ways. However, we need to take account of the different kingdom circumstances.

With Atlas, using creation to make a floating city, the people of Atlas have grown arrogant. Relying on technology and becoming insensitive to other people like Mantle and other kingdoms. Then with destruction, he might as well be the cause of Vacuo becoming the most dry and territorial wasteland it is. And his allies, so far, might as well be his biggest mistake. Leon betrayed him and sold his kingdom out. While Ironwood is willing to leave thousands to die and probably leave Remnant as well to fend for itself.

Understand I don’t favor Salem. However, I can’t deny because she is immortal she has seen all that humanity and Ozpin has done. Whereas she probably has done nothing wrong besides rule the Grimm. But we can’t expect her to fully control them. Especially with a lot of negativity in the world Remnant whether it be due to racism, classism, or ignorance. And whether we like it or not the hunters so far have died and failed to maintain peace. If I were Hazel, I side with her too because I would rather trust the world to an immortal woman than a man who takes a year, a century, or a millennia to come back and help. I’m sorry.

Also if you think Yang should have fought Hazel then let me ask you something. Do you want a Hazel vs Yang fight or a Yang vs Neo round two fight? More importantly, we’re talking about Yang. The same Yang who stopped a Manticore. Took the fist of a mech suit and destroyed it. Hell during her yellow trailer, she punched Junior, who might be the same height as Hazel across the room. Volume three punched three people into a rock. Don’t even me started on her arsenal. The sad truth is Yang would no doubt bury Hazel.)

[free-urban-clown]

the funniest rwby headcannon i've heard to date is that Gretchen (Hazel's sister) simply just had no landing strategy. She just got launched and went *SPLAT*. i love that discord server, some of the strangest people i exist near.

[strqyr]

ya know... considering how pretty much all things hazel are in some way informed by gretchen and her death... i wonder if hazel using dust as he does could be a hint towards gretchen having been the spring maiden, i.e. he saw gretchen use her powers ( possibly thought them to be her semblance ) and mimicked that the best he could with dust crystals?

[dragynkeep]

No but imagine: Salem adopting Hazel and Gretchen, training them, then sending them out as double agents against Oz. Gretchen wholeheartedly believing in Salem, hello maiden candidate, but Hazel starting to be convinced by Oz; when it comes time to attack, Hazel hesitates which gets Gretchen killed. So now it's not just revenge, it's doubling down because that means (trusting in) Oz killed her, and turning on Salem would mean accepting Hazel caused his sister's death and losing his mother too.

goddd it would've been so good. there are plenty of ways to have salem entrenched in the plot without showing her & doing this with gretchen / hazel would be a really good way in doing so, especially to give some validity in him blaming oz yet still siding with the woman who is indirectly responsible for his twin's death.

plus y'know, the added trauma of salem seeing them as her replacement children only to find out what she did to her actual children. the horror. it's so good

[therealmofamorus]

Ask

Original Male Stud AU

Is it true that when Gretchen first met Jaune... she grew instant attraction towards her newest student? Or is that false and it took longer than that?

The moment she set her eyes on tall, scraggly, blonde...her heart along with her pussy ache with the strong urge to rode him like a wild stallion.

[rwbyazre]

Has there ever been a incident in azre's past history where members of salem's council perished due to infighting?

Quite a few times, usually because Salem's council fosters ambition and lack of interteam harmony like Ozpin tries with his group, since Salem merely sees them all as means to an end. She'll make sure they all work together, but if she isn't there to force it, the group will fall apart easily if the wrong people are there.

Right now, her council is sturdy enough that they would all work together without much prodding from Salem. Except for Cinder.

Cinder is the one crack that threatens to break the council, which pushes Salem to check her ego and ambitions to make sure they don't exceed her own goals. Problem is, Cinder is her most dangerous when denied something, and the ones in danger the most right now are Gretchen and Kaanchana.

If they or Salem make any suggestion that they want the Maiden powers instead, Cinder will kill them.

[evenmorefatallyobsessed]

So now that you’ve created this new timeline all I can think about is Coco, Velvet, and Isis acting as gatekeepers and managers for their favorite Prof’s harem. So many pictures and story possibilities.

Oh, oh no, they are not the gatekeepers for Jaune, not by a longshot. Prof. Arc's team is...

Himself as leader he is teamed up with his partner Glynda Goodwitch. Thumbelina Peach and Gretchen Rainart (Who he saved from dying using Aura Amplification) The only team who stood on equal footing to STRQ Team ARGT (Argent)

[bestworstcase]

any thoughts on team strq that you haven’t already touched on? like their relationships with each other and oz? you talked about how they’ll play a role in volume 10 but im wondering if you have any other insight into their characters

gestures vaguely in gretchen was the spring maiden and all things must die is about how raven feels abt summers betrayal <- related to whatever’s going to happen wrt team strq in v10 and onward because imo "what exactly happened to the last spring maiden?" and "what exactly happened to gretchen rainart?" are central narrative questions on the same level of importance as "what happened to summer rose?" just less obvious because gretchen/spring isn’t connected to any of the main characters the way summer is…

…but gretchen is hazel’s whole motivation, the last spring maiden’s death is what shattered raven, and in v8 the narrative specifically 1. informs us that salem herself personally tracked down hazel and let him kill her over and over again for HOURS before he tired himself out, and then started talking about his sister, and 2. asks why? why did she do that? why did she choose hazel, specifically? (the answer oz suggests is that hazel is just easy to manipulate, which isn’t really an answer at all. how did she even know about gretchen?)

and then like. the spring maiden vanished “over a decade ago” (so within the last 10-20 years). summer disappeared about 12 years prior to the start of v1. gretchen’s death is less concrete but 1. she and hazel were twins, 2. she died between 17-21 at the oldest, and 3. character ages are really hard to gauge but hazel seems to be in between cinder (mid 20s) and team strq (who must be at least 38 if yang was not born while they were attending beacon) which would make hazel… probably in his early thirties. if he’s 33 at the top of v4, then he and gretchen would have been beacon student age… 12-16 years ago.

interesting how summer’s disappearance, the last spring maiden’s disappearance, and gretchen rainart’s mysterious death on a training mission all happened right around the same time, isn’t it. 🤔

shrug. neither raven nor hazel are prominent enough characters for their respective "what happened?" bereavements to be so narratively important… but if gretchen was spring and she died in connection to summer’s last mission? all three big questions turn out to be really the same question. it clicks together suspiciously well.

assorted miscellanea:

i think both the ‘poly STR’ and infidelity angles wrt the tai/raven -> tai/summer drama are both a) pretty boring ways to interpret the known facts and b) working against the text itself. i also (with apologies to the rosebirds) remain unconvinced that summer/raven was ever… a thing, ravens doomed unspoken little crush on summer notwithstanding.

what DOES interest me abt that whole . mess is the turnover. i think its very unlikely that raven and tai dated through most of beacon (because of the whole "learning how to kill huntsmen" thing) and i would bet yang happened at most a year or two after the team left school. depending how long raven tried to stay that’s like, at most a 5-6 year long relationship that ended evidently because raven felt inadequate as a wife/mother. summer being the rebound, ruby being two years younger than yang, and summer leaving when ruby was about three would similarly suggest a relationship of at most 4-5ish years, by the end of which, as we saw, summer seems to have been very well-practiced emotionally masking around tai.

taking that into consideration with… everything we know about yang’s childhood after summer left, the very quick rebound from raven to summer, and tai’s… at best, insensitivity and emotional immaturity in v4 its kinda. well ok. he acts like this NOW, in his late thirties or early forties, and still thinks the really quite mean prank he pulled on his new roommate on day 1 at seventeen is fucking hilarious, he presumably was like this in his twenties too. raven left her relationship with him feeling deeply insecure and inadequate, summer did not feel able to emotionally confide in him before she also left him, and neither woman’s relationship with him lasted more than five years. interesting.

there’s a lot of speculation out there (mostly: summer/qrow and summer/raven secret parentage nonsense) that takes the very fast rebound and (since v9) the emotional disconnect between summer and tai in 9.10 as textual evidence for summer never having been romantically involved with tai at all, which to be blunt is an unserious and countertextual way to interpret the story, but like. gestures at raven. this happened TWICE with the same guy, back to back.

or there’s the somehow even more off the wall take that wah poor tai got strung along in loveless relationships by these cold-hearted women :( which. hello???

anyway i want to know how summer rose feels about him with fourteen years of hindsight because from where i’m sitting, with the facts we have available, it sure does look like tai is perhaps the common denominator. shot in the dark based on his characterization in the present and the way he talks about raven now? i’d guess charming, bit of a hopeless romantic, fairweather partner who deals with conflict by blaming the other party. tbh.

as for. qrow. his relationships with tai and summer are harder to get a read on than raven (with whom he has a fairly straightforward "siblings who both feel rejected by the other and deal with it by being prickly and jabby at each other" situation going on) ’cause like on the one hand qrow clearly admired summer a lot and he and tai have some… unspoken resentment under the surface but on the other i really don’t get the impression that summer and qrow were especially close and while tai seems to have a problem with him, the opposite doesn’t seem to be true.

qrow’s the one who stuck around and kept trying and wanted raven to come back, and his dedication is specifically because he felt like ozpin (not his team) gave him a place to belong. it’s. hm. between his semblance-related social aloofness and the romantic entanglements of the other three i get the impression that qrow tended to be sort of the odd one out but also the one who most wanted them all to be a real team. which i imagine fueled his devotion to ozpin.

what else…

oh the hero/monster complex with regard to summer and raven is SUPER interesting. the silver-eyed warrior and the bandit training to kill huntsmen. i think—this is very tentative speculation bc it’s based mostly on fractals and why i think summer joined salem—but i don’t think summer ever particularly bought into the black and white fairytale way of looking at the world except insofar as she felt the pressure herself. we know qrow stayed because ozpin gave him a place to belong; i think raven stayed because summer treated her like a person instead of a weapon.

[uncaught-coolfish]

in honor of yang living her best romcom life while ruby spirals in vol 9, heres my ranking of rwby siblings worst to best.

1. cinder/step sisters - i think cinder is cool for murdering her family, good for her

2. rainart twins - sir, how are you serving the lady who controlled the monsters that killed your sister. justice for gretchen, she died with the braincell, leaving her brother a dumbass

3. schneeblings - not winter mirroring jacque and slapping weiss while weiss holds a loaded gun to her brother's face, the kids are not ok someone check on the schneeblings

4. light/darkness - kinda awkward when your bickering traumatized a girl and her boyfriend so she tried to usurp your throne and then you ended up wiping out humanity haha

5. branwen twins - raven, i love you, but she really left her brother and family to play walmart wild west. what.

6. ruby/yang - for this month, we celebrate a girly who prioritizes true love while her sister is having a breakdown <3

7. albain bros - rip to fennec, they're a theater duo and it just aint the same when your brother isnt there to burn down society with you :(

8. arc siblings - jaune really out here pretending having sisters is a tragic backstory, this is why younger siblings dont deserve rights

9. malachite sisters - they share clothes and talk mad shit about people behind their back with each other, good for them

10. alyx/lewis - when he's back, he turned around and waited for alyx but she never passed through. time moves on, he's gone but his hope for his sister to reunite with him lives on in a story where she comes home. in a world about fairytale, lewis wrote a story where his sister, flaws and all, is a hero. hands down, the only siblings that matter.

😭 alyx and lewis deserved better they rlly are the best sibs now that I think about it

[notmaplemable]

To Be Continued

Weapons of Summer Love Part 6

Nora: So why did Ruby run through here like something was on fire?

Jaune: Well she said something about the forge before she did.

Yang: So something is probably on fire.

Ren: Speaking of the forge, do you have any specific design plans for your new weapon yet?

Jaune: Well it's probably going to be a lever action rifle. Something about a magnet to stick it on my armor.

Yang: Thought of a name yet? You know Ruby isn't going to let you not name it.

Jaune: I haven't come up with one yet. Usually my family prefers to use old Valean for our weapons.

Jaune: Milo and Akouo mean "to speak" and "to listen" respectively. I guess I could go with something like that since I'll be using pieces from them in the weapon.

Jaune: But nothings set in stone yet.

[teganstable]

rwby studios hc pt 5

Kali Belladonna

Was there ever any doubt? I mean, come on for kali absolutely Shakira all the way I imagine her singing this dancing to this and making Blake feel embarrassed because she plays it regardless of who’s over.

Ghira Belladonna

OK, so Ghira would absolutely love Phil Collins and he’d probably take inspiration from this song and make like a campaign ad for Faunus rights and I low-key can see it being one of the best things to cross the face of remnant ever

Jacques Schnee

In the words of Blanche Devereaux, eat dirt and die trash.

Cardin Winchester

I imagine Cardin literally blasting this so often that it drives everybody around him to insanity.

Vernal

She'd hide it, but she would have like eight different Lady Gaga playlists

Hazel Rainart

Rip Gretchen Rainart you would have loved to see your brother sing this while he was brooding in his room. Ngl tho hazel while absolutely nuts strikes me as such a country guy hehe

Mercury Black

Mercury would be Dominic Fike’s biggest fan he would pay for tickets and he would actually cry if he got up to the front row like his dream is so to meet Dominic Fike he also would write Dominic Fike fanfiction and try and sound just like him.

Robyn Hill

Robyn would lowkey highkey sing this about winter but she’d also have this in a secret playlist of hers.

May marigold

This would absolutely be in mays playlist I think it like reflects how may sees the world also she'd probably sing it trying to get the rest of the happy huntresses to join in at like a karaoke bar

Harriet Bree

Can’t convince me otherwise this would absolutely be on Harriet’s like work out in the morning playlist, and I could see her if drunk enough singing this.

[strqyr]

pretty much all we know about gretchen is what ozpin told oscar: that she enrolled at beacon academy despite her brother's wishes to become a huntress, and that she tragically lost her life on a training mission.

if ozpin knows something more about gretchen that he isn't telling, the show hasn't given much of a reason to suspect anything outside of a general "well, ozpin keeps secrets, so... who knows?" everything about gretchen seems to be rooted in becoming a huntress, whether she was ready for it or not—that is what oscar focuses on and asks hazel about after ozpin's explanation: "did she know the risk of being a huntress?" "she was only a child! she wasn't ready!"—, and thus hazel's desire to see a new world where the academies are no more.

now, ozpin's explanation is vague in a sense that he never states the cause of death. gretchen being a huntress-in-training who lost her life during a training mission implies grimm, but it's never actually stated so; if he is hiding something re: gretchen's death, that's what i'd be focusing on, since if he's blatantly lying, why didn't jinn bring it up? why didn't ozpin come clean later on during their captivity inside monstra, where hazel also played a major role? if hazel knows more, explaining why he blames ozpin so strongly, why never bring it up?

is ozpin hiding the whole truth of what happened to gretchen, or is he hiding a small part of it by omitting a detail or two, and if so, why? is he taking the blame to protect someone else? a question of greater good? the same as lying about lionheart's role in the attack on haven?

and that's why i'm now questioning if gretchen was a maiden. it would neatly explain why she was, supposedly, allowed to attend beacon when she "wasn't ready"—nothing new for ozpin there, and gretchen could be a combination of ruby & jaune in that way—but if that's the case... why never bring it up? they wouldn't need to specify which maiden she was if that's considered to give too much away (i.e. if she was the spring maiden), but any explanation from ozpin akin to "gretchen was a maiden and that's why i allowed her to attend beacon even if she wasn't ready, bc the risk of her being hunted down was too high and beacon was the safest place for her" surely couldn't hurt?

it also has a chance to make "no more gretchens, boy" ring a bit hollow, especially if gretchen was the spring maiden and involved in summer's mission, bc of what happened to penny afterwards; how is anyone supposed to prevent it from happening again, when no one knows what exactly happened to gretchen in the first place?

so. the academies. oscar asks hazel if gretchen knew the risk of being a huntress, to which hazel—who desired to see a world with no huntsmen academies—replies: "she was only a child! she wasn't ready!"

"they're supposed to be the defenders of the world," says glynda. "and they will be," says ozpin, "but right now they're still children. so why not let them play the part?" and it's a nice statement... if they weren't a part of system created by oz that encourages children as young as thirteen to pick up a weapon, and to learn how to fight.

why start training your "defenders of the world" when they're still children? what's the rush, why not wait when they're older?

is there more depth to what happened to gretchen, or is it exactly what it says on the tin: that the system is broken, and it needs fixing?

[dragynkeep]

Who’s that guy in the top right?

This one?

That's my design of Gretchen, who was the twin to survive in AZRE instead of Hazel.