#even as a haladriel enjoyer

[oroniel]

RoP gave us a kiss that was full of emotion but entirely devoid of romantic subtext, and next episode we're going to get a sword fight so charged with romantic and sexual tension that people are going to actually lose their minds.

Adar is simultaneously praising the beauty of a woman (Melian) and a man (Elrond), while also simultaneously praising the beauty of a Maia and a half-elf. While also caring for his enormous family of uruk children. He is a person who literally changed his state of being from his birth-form in order to obtain the life, and children, he wanted.

Sauron's talking about some messed up masochistic relationship with Morgoth, and crying when Adar recalls how beautiful he used to be. He's doing all kinds of fascinating line-crossing when it comes to gender, like he's just decided to conjure up your worst evil non-binary nightmare as he flirts with Mirdania, minces around in his pretty dress and hair-bow, acts like a clique-y mean girl when Celebrimbor calls him out in front of the other smiths, and then slaughters guards with expert swordsmanship and sorcery.

Meanwhile Galadriel is effortlessly switching from armor to fairytale princess dresses, expressing unbridled rage and endless compassion, being maternal to Theo and a mentor to the Numenorean guard as she tutors them in swordplay, and generally projecting a female character who is, per Morfydd, not raised to feel ashamed the way women are in our society.

This is queer Tolkien. It's messing with our culturally encoded understandings of the signs and signals of relationships, gender, family, and friendships. It's messing with our understanding of how we define the potential of individuals and relationships.

Am I confident that they're doing all of this consciously? No.

But am I any less delighted by it?

Also no.

It is so fun and I love it.

[saurongorthaur9]

Potentially unpopular opinion for the ROP fandom:

I really wish people/interviewers would stop pushing the Hot Sauron and Haladriel stuff directly into Charlie's face.

I woke up this morning to drama in the fandom about Charlie (yet again) very politely deflecting Haladriel questions, as if this is some sort of insult to the fandom and shippers. And I know it's not going to stop, but I wish it would.

To make it very explicitly clear, make all the stupid sexy Sauron and Hot Sauron memes and jokes you want within the fandom. Ship Haladriel to your heart's content and create glorious fanfiction and fanart of them making out as they ride into the sunset (or as they simultaneously attempt to kill each other, if that's your vibe). All great. All fantastic. Everyone knows I'm a huge fan of sexy Sauron both inside and outside the ROP fandom, and I am a thorough Haladriel enjoyer at this point.

But I really, really, really wish people would stop pushing it on Charlie himself.

It just makes me so sad and uncomfortable for him. I saw the interview yesterday that I'm pretty sure was what caused everyone to be up in arms where he was being shown Sauron memes and fan posts and a lot of them were very Haladriel/shippy. He is obviously SO uncomfortable with those and the "Hot Sauron" comments. You can see it in the difference between how he answers questions about Sauron's motives or psyche or his research into Tolkien and how his eyes light up and he gets so animated and he just starts gushing vs when he's asked for the millionth time if Sauron has feelings for Galadriel and he gets quiet and reserved and gives a short, diplomatic answer.

And he's been so gracious and polite to the shippers and about all the shipping questions that he keeps getting asked. Each time, he gives basically the same answer: that he doesn't personally see it as romantic but that he's happy people care enough about the characters and story to be passionate about what they see in it. He's not going to suddenly flip a switch and start passionately shipping Haladriel.

I personally like to view it as Sauron (particularly as Halbrand) having some genuine feelings for Galadriel: genuine sense of connection, genuine sense of shared purpose, genuine attraction on both a spiritual and physical level, and yes, even some genuine admiration and love, mixed in with the complex mess of other things Sauron feels, which is why he's a great, complicated villain. The fact that this doesn't 100% line up with everything Charlie has said that he feels about the character is fine with me. I respect Charlie's opinions and the clear thought he's put into portraying that character. But I can also have my own thoughts and perceptions of the character and story apart from that, without needing him to validate them.

I know this isn't the first time an attractive man playing a charming, sexy villain has been inundated by thirsty fans (I remember Loki's Army very clearly) and that some level of it is to be expected. But he's clearly put such thought into portraying Sauron and I'm so grateful to him for that, so I'm sad to see him having uncomfortable questions shoved at him that reduce everything he's done to "what do you think of being Hot Sauron?" and "Do you think Sauron and Galadriel should kiss?" And I'm even sadder to see fans reacting negatively to him simply because he won't validate a particular ship or perspective.

From everything I've heard of fans who have gotten the opportunity to meet him, he's an absolute sweetheart and very kind and appreciative towards his fans. I hope dearly that I can meet him some day and tell him how important it was to me to see Sauron portrayed on screen as such a wonderfully complicated character. But I truly hope that the constant barrage of nagging for him to openly endorse Haladriel and the backlash whenever he gives one of his reserved, diplomatic answers about shipping doesn't sour him to his fanbase. He's given us a gift that I wouldn't have even dared dream of only a few years ago; why can't we focus on that instead of whether or not he's enthusiastically pro-Haladriel or not?

[ringsreforged]

Natalie's *deep* Haladriel thoughts - BEWARE

Pau - When you read this later, let me know if you want me to move it to my personal account, yeah? If it even still exists...

I’m not really sure what this post is going to end up being. A defence of the show and the separation? In part! A critique of the show based off leak spoilers and my own gut feeling? For sure! A desperate ramble in an attempt to get my head in order? Absolutely!

I will say before we dive in that I’m absolutely a Haladriel shipper, but the way I ship isn’t always in line with fandom. I ship what I see as part of the narrative because it’s the narrative, and everything else is a bonus. I make this distinction because I think this is why I’m so okay with a lack of scenes when some others are not, and I don’t want to come across preachy. I don't think I'm in any way superior for this by the way. In fact, I wish I could be more *normal*!!!!

If you came to this show for Haladriel alone, and simply want to see them share scenes week to week – that’s your prerogative. I’m not trying to say you shouldn’t feel that way. What I might try to say is that I don’t think that makes the shows bad or suggests that the writers have baited with this relationship. I think that’s ultimately what I find frustrating…

But anyway, let’s get into whatever this is. A reflection on expectations, a five-season arc, and those STUPID spoiler leaks…

AND THERE WILL BE SPOILERS. STAY AWAY. HISS.

Alright, so this post is mostly brought to you by a sinking feeling I have that the leak spoilers are real. Because everything in that episode 7 promo matches up.

STOP READING if you don’t want to know the spoilers. And honestly? STOP READING IF YOU THINK YOU WANT TO KNOW because living with this knowledge has truly made this season less enjoyable for me (credit to it, then, because I still think it’s incredible). IF I’M MAKING YOU PANIC, STILL STOP READING because there very much is a world where these spoilers aren’t that bad in context…but I prefer to keep my expectations low…

Have you gone???

HAVE YOU GONE?????

SPOILER TALK

Okay.

So, the leak spoilers say that there is no kiss between Sauron and Galadriel (which, honestly, I have no great issue with – more to come on that later). Instead, the kiss is ELROND AND GALADRIEL, and I absolutely do take issue with this.

I can only hope and PRAY that it works in context, but I can’t get my head around it. And yet, the promo…it’s all falling into place. Elrond will be sent to discuss terms with the orcs before the battle. He’ll see Galadriel in chains, and he’ll ask for a moment to say goodbye. Adar will allow it because he’s a gent like that. This is where we get the chin touch with the thumb everyone speculated over and then…HE LEANS IN AND KISSES HER TO PUT A NEEDLE IN HER MOUTH? SO SHE CAN RELEASE HERSELF LATER??

To clarify, most of this is my spec, but THE KISS TO PASS HER A NEEDLE IS A REAL LEAKED SPOILER THAT NO LONGER SEEMS FAKE.

It's just…so convoluted and weird??? Does he store needles in his mouth like a squirrel? Why couldn’t he have slipped the needle into her hand??? WHY ARE YOU PUTTING ELROND’S LIPS ON GALADRIEL’S?

And look, maybe this spoiler IS still fake! But the details were so specific, and everything about the context seems to be accurate, so that feels like it would be a bonkers coincidence to me. Maybe when we actually see it play out, it will be fine.

But that does bring me back to the Haladriel of it all, just briefly. With my whole heart, I do not need them to kiss. After season 1, I didn’t think it would be possible, and I’m okay with that. But if you’re willing to let ELROND’S lips touch her, then MY GOD, you could have let Haladriel have ONE kiss where she’s trying to distract him or some shit. OOF.

My only relief is that it happens next week, so we can hopefully get it out of our systems and enjoy the finale.

That said, if these leaks are true then that also means the finale leaks are true. Now, I actually never wanted to see any of these spoilers (hence me making it VERY CLEAR what this post is about, because I wouldn’t inflict this stress on anyone unwillingly), so once I got the Elrond kiss details, I tried to get away without seeing much else. But there was some information on the big Haladriel scene.

I’m actually not going to detail it here, because – overall – I think we’ll still super enjoy it (just…lower those kiss expectations) AND because I don’t think all of it was spoiled. At the end of the day, there will be plenty to unpack, they’ll be back on our screens, it will be meaty, it will be layered. I’m really looking forward to it, in general.

My one fear is that it’s a season 1 finale repeat. And again, that won’t necessarily be bad per se, but it will feel a little bit underwhelming. Now, I’m not somebody that wants a true corruption arc for Galadriel. Normally, I love that shit, but not in this IP and not with this character. I want to see her explore her darkness, I want to see her face it and accept it, and I certainly want to see her be tempted…but I don’t expect or believe we'll ever actually get the whole ‘dark queen of Mordor’ vibe. Prisoner? Maybe. But not an actual dark queen.

That said…surely this scene doesn’t play out the EXACT same way as season 1? Sauron shows her a vision, she’s tempted, but ultimately resists and tells him she’ll never be at his side. I just don’t get why we’d repeat that, when there are so many other options that still keep Gal on the side of light.

I keep coming back to Galadriel’s line to Elrond in episode 4 – when it comes down to it, he has to choose to defeat Sauron and sacrifice her. I feel like if I hadn’t seen the leaks, then I would be 1000% expecting this to be the outcome. Especially with how Elrond’s theme comes in at the end of The Last Temptation track. He comes upon the confrontation but chooses to do the thing that will harm Sauron in the long run, rather than the thing that will save Galadriel.

I hope so badly for this, but I do worry that it will go the other way. What if it parallels Gandalfanger’s destiny/friend choice, and Elrond chooses her because THAT is how light wins or some shit? Not that this will be a bad scene by any stretch – I love their relationship and want to see their FRIENDSHIP (grrrr) reforged…but, again, the S1 finale! Sauron left her in the water, and Elrond was there to save her.

There’s also Galadriel’s conversation with Adar in the most recent episode – you succumbed, I resisted – but I guess this could go either way? He succumbed, so she resists. She insists she’s able to resist, so she succumbs. URGH. MY HEAD.

There MUST be a difference. SURELY??? Like, this season has been so well written…I just can’t comprehend the copy and paste.

Again, this isn’t anything close to a deal breaker for me. I firmly believe the showrunners when they say this relationship will remain the core of the show, but…hmmm. Okay, on that note…

DAMAGE CONTROL – MOVING ONTO THE DEFENCE OF THE SHOW

So, this is where I want to get into some stuff that I just…don’t agree with that I’ve seen being thrown at the show by shippers. And I’ll reiterate here that I’m truly not telling anybody what to feel. You can hate the show for its choices and feel how you feel. You can express yourself in your social media spaces, and if anybody doesn’t like it they can mute/block/unfollow. This chunk isn’t really aimed at you guys.

This is more for other people like me, because I’m cursed to be somebody that generally wants to just…enjoy things for what they are, while also being susceptible to the mood of others. I want to scroll tags and have a good time, rather than see negativity because it lowers my mood (this isn’t just ship related by the way, I really love this show overall…it’s just this tag that has been impacting my mood most this season). Regardless of the nonsense that might be in episode 7, and even if the finale scene is a repeat of S1, I’m still going to want to focus on enjoying what we get, enjoying the narrative being told etc. So, for those of you that have a little sinking feeling in your gut after the first half of this post, hopefully this second half will help.

This isn’t a ‘typical’ ship. This is a true ENEMIES ARE ENEMIES dynamic where the bad boy is ultimately going to be (is already) pure evil, and where our heroine is the embodiment of light. There are certain things that we just have to accept when it comes to loving this dynamic as part of the show – there will never be another season like season 1. Nor should there be?

Do I wish for s3 to have them in close proximity for at least a few episodes? Of course! Do I think it’s possible with or without finale spoilers? Absolutely (given how quickly characters travel from place to place on this show, they could end the season at opposite ends of Middle Earth and this would still be on the cards…). I’m also anticipating Season 4 as a good time for them to be in full MIND PALACE mode – where the rings are all ringing, but Galadriel hasn’t yet worked out how to shut him out yet. By season 5, there might just be one final scene before the final battle. But, again, I really do think there needs to be a little bit of acceptance of that. Or, at least, expectation of it.

Something I really want to push back against is this idea that Haladriel was baited or teased, but the writers don’t actually care for it. Honestly, that’s nonsense to me on a couple of levels.

First of all, almost EVERY dynamic this season has been reduced to a handful of scenes here and there. The most consistent relationships have probably been Annatar and Celebrimbor, and Durin+Durin+Disa (off the top of my head). Elrond and Durin (probably the other most popular dynamic of S1) have been apart all season, Elrond and Galadriel have too. Isildur popped up to say hello and we might not see him again.

When you actually stop and look at this season…Sauron and Galadriel had to be separated. She could not be anywhere near him while he’s working Celebrimbor, and there’s no world in which they were ever going to change that narrative. And yet, the Sauron and Galadriel dynamic has been consistent across the season. With Galadriel predominantly (and depending on how the finale goes, I may have thoughts on this), but it has also been easier with her because people have talked with her openly about Sauron. It’s been harder on his side, but the fact that Mirdania seems to have been cast to look like Galadriel honestly – right now – feels like it was done with the express purpose of giving Sauron a Galadriel reference.

Again, I’m not saying you have to like the lack of scenes, but it’s not bad writing to respect the overarching narrative of an ensemble show. Galadriel’s season has been all about him, and we’ve had countless insights to make that clear – building up to their final confrontation. If Sauron was running around mentioning Galadriel every five seconds with Celebrimbor or with the dwarves, it would be horrendously out of character.

This next comment is…somewhat dependent on the finale…but as somebody that loves Elendil and Miriel, everything in Numenor has been somewhat crammed in. I would firmly argue that the Galadriel/Sauron dynamic across this season has been treated with care and reverence, all building to a climax designed as the high point of the season. Will we be 100% satisfied? Who can say! But it IS what the season is building to.

I think this brings me around to a particular gripe I have, and maybe the people that believe this came to the show after S1 had fully aired or something…but there’s this idea floating around that the showrunners don’t like this dynamic and are just giving it crumbs to bait people into watching. This makes me want to scream.

These showrunners literally took a few lines about Galadriel being tempted by Sauron and PITCHED THE ENTIRE SHOW OFF OF THAT. The Tolkien estate wasn’t only pitched by Amazon BUT CHOSE THIS PITCH OVER ANYTHING ELSE. Season 1 was written pretty much like a prologue centred around GALADRIEL AND SAURON HAVING A PERSONAL CONNECTION WITH ROMANTIC UNDERTONES…and guess what?

They wrote all that…they filmed ALL THAT…before knowing anything about the audience reaction! That was ALL the showrunners, the writers, the directors, the actors. They ARE the narrative. They are not bait.

Does that mean the fundamentals of their dynamic will always please you, individually? No, of course not. Some people want outright romance, some people want soft Sauron, some people want Dark Galadriel. Will they kiss? I doubt it. Do I wish they would? Sure! Will they be separated again next season? Probably! Will I also wish that they could at least be stuck together for a run of episodes again? Absolutely!

But the idea that any of this is bait, or unimportant to the show drives me a little bit bonkers.

I guess my personal feeling of frustration comes from the fact that I feel so lucky they are exploring this show from the perspective of this dynamic, regardless of specific details/scenes. I’d bet my house (I don’t own a house) that every other pitch hinged on Elendil or Isildur as the protagonists of the show. Now, I love those dudes, but just IMAGINE? The fact that we’re on this path at all is still WILD to me.

ANYWAY, this is what happens when Paulina goes on holiday and I have nobody to ramble too. Sorry for the explosion, but I’ve been dreading the stupid kiss spoiler since I stumbled on it after EPISODE BLOODY 3 and so I needed to vent somewhere.

TL;DR: You are welcome to feel the way you feel, and if you hate everything you go right ahead, but maybe this makes sense to somebody. IDK. IDK.

[galadriel-blue]

I want Celeborn to be present in The Rings of Power and here’s why:

A lot of people love Celeborn more than I thought, so it gave me the confidence to post why I want him to be in the show and what I think his character should be like. Hopefully this is coherent. There may be mistakes despite me proofreading it 100,000 times haha! I kind of rambled here, but I hope my fellow Celeborn enjoyers like my random thoughts nonetheless. Share your thoughts with me because I'd love to hear them!

(p.s. I finally watched the new episodes, so this post will have small mentions of The Rings of Power Season 2, so if you don't want spoilers, don't read!)

I don’t care when they introduce him. I’m secretly hoping it’s soon, but if it’s not, I simply hope they bring him in eventually. But when they do make his introduction, I hope they do it well. And by well, I mean that I hope they don’t water down his character, and his relationship with Galadriel, just to make Sauron the better love interest.

Now, do not jump to conclusions about my opinion just yet. I am not slandering the ever-popular ship of Haladriel/Saurondriel. It may be true that I have a love-hate relationship with the pairing, but that is a topic for a different post. If I am completely honest, I don’t see anything romantic between Galadriel and Halbrand/Sauron. I can recognize the undertones, which I sort of mention in this post, but I personally see the pairing as a non-romantic bond. If you are a Haladriel/Saurondriel shipper, know that I love you and appreciate you, and even though I have complicated feelings surrounding the ship, I am eating up all of the content that is being created for it. You guys are amazing. Seriously.

With that disclaimer out of the way, I will now discuss my thoughts…

When Celeborn arrives in the Rings of Power, I want him to be like Halbrand/Sauron, but slightly to the left. Let me explain.

What makes Sauron and Galadriel’s dynamic so appealing is their bond. How they have been and become connected by fate to be the opposites to each other. He binds her to power, his power, and she binds him to the light. It’s such an interesting connection: Two people, two enemies, bound together by some unspeakable force, bringing them closer in a circle that seems like it’s unbreakable. Many find romance hiding between the lines, and while I do think there is a romantic temptation there, it’s been doomed to fail from the start.

Because when we face it, we see how one-sided it is. Sauron may hold love for Galadriel, but it is only in the way that she makes him feel about himself. She was the first one to forgive him, despite her not knowing who he was at the time, and she was the only one who made him feel like what he was doing was good. His desire to keep her for himself is entirely selfish. He may promise her power, but it’s not her own. It’s his. And even if she did join him, there would be no sense of equality between them. He would always hold more, and in turn, he would hold Galadriel back. Even if at some point he did (or does) feel a true romantic attraction for her, it still would never work because his lust for power, and love for himself, will always be stronger no matter what Galadriel makes him feel.

But it is tempting for Galadriel to want this power because he twists it so beautifully. He is a deceiver, and he catered his deception to her desires. Galadriel likes to be in control. She likes to be strong. She likes to be a leader. Combining that with her stubborn nature and her unsteady, grief-stricken mind, it is no surprise that she fell under Sauron’s spell. Not to mention, he turned himself into exactly what she needed at the time. Someone who pushed her, someone who didn’t hold her back. Sauron became the most ideal partner in the most toxic way because he only became that for her in order to achieve what he wanted. He was using her the whole time, regardless of the feelings he developed as he got to know her, which makes their dynamic so incredibly complex.

Because that’s what evil people do. They convince you that they are your friend and that what they’re doing to you is good, and when you contradict them, they cast the blame onto you. “Sauron lives because of you.” Suddenly it’s Galadriel’s fault for finding a connection with him in the first place. Because she resisted him, it is now her burden to bear all of his hatred inside of her. She’s the one to blame. He makes it her fault that he lives because she was strong enough to push the darkness away. Now he is making it a point to haunt her with darkness wherever she goes by filling her with guilt.

And part of her hates him for it but part of her wants him back. “I felt it too.” She keeps thinking back on that moment because it felt good to be understood for once, after thousands of years of people telling you that you were wrong and that you needed to stop. She felt loved and seen with him.

So basically, I want Celeborn to be Halbrand if Halbrand was just a bit softer and wasn’t a master manipulator hiding behind the guise of a nice, attractive man.

Galadriel and Celeborn are bound by an invisible string too, they just don’t know it yet. The Silmarillion describes that they “had great love between them.” I don’t want the show to erase that. We saw how she spoke so fondly of Celeborn as she reminisced with Theo. She spoke of a glimpse of who she was before the war, with a faraway look and tears in her eyes. Galadriel was a woman in love, one who danced outside in fields of flowers and had a sense of humor, even as she was watching her beloved being sent away to a battle they did not believe would last so long. She thought she lost her love.

She literally thinks Celeborn is dead, and it tears her heart apart. Because in my mind, Celeborn was the only other person who truly saw her, other than Finrod and now Halbrand. And Morfydd even said it in an interview where they asked her about Celeborn. She said that there is a part of Galadriel that isn’t awake because she believes her husband to be dead. Because of his supposed death, the quote, “softest part of her” has been closed and hopefully Celeborn will return and make her feel safe again. How tragically sad and romantic is that?

Galadriel’s heart is lonely. She doesn’t know Celeborn is still out there. That’s another reason why it was so easy for her to open her heart to Halbrand. I feel like a part of her saw what she used to have in Celeborn in him. Then, it was so easily torn apart, and she was hurt again after being built up. What a blow to her self-esteem and her mind.

In Celeborn’s character, I want him to be similar to Halbrand in certain ways. I want him to be clever and strong. Perhaps even a little bit stubborn himself. I want to see him as a man who pushes Galadriel to be the best version of herself and keeps her in check when she starts running too a bit too fast, (but not so much that we take away the spitfire that Galadriel is) as Halbrand did for her on Numenor. I want to see him as someone who challenges her brain. Allows her to make plans but helps her navigate when things become difficult. I don’t want Celeborn to be someone who holds Galadriel back because her steadfast nature is what I love most about her. Her ability to be emotional is something I want Celeborn to support. I want him to be a bit of a dork who loves his wife no matter what. I see Celeborn as someone who is sweet, tender, and kind, but that doesn’t take away from his own strength. I want him to be all of Halbrand’s best traits because then we would see why it was so easy for Galadriel to fall sway to her enemy’s schemes. It would also just be super interesting to watch how two different people, with similar personality traits, both had a connection (and fell in love if you like the Haladriel route) with the same person and both followed different life paths. Celeborn as good and true despite the darkness in Galadriel, and Halbrand, is the darkness among the light that Galadriel holds.

This is why I hope they cast someone who looks like Charlie Vickers a bit because maybe she found comfort in a “familiar” face. It would make sense why she was so quick to trust Halbrand if she saw the traits of someone who loved her the most behind his eyes.

And here’s another thing. I don’t want Celeborn to be used to diffuse Galadriel’s personality. I keep seeing arguments (mainly angry YouTube men) use Celeborn to hate on Haladriel and to make Galadriel fit their ideals of what her character “should be” in their minds.

All of the dudebros sitting in front of their computers, arguing against Haladriel/Sauron by using Celeborn as their point of reason (“Why add enemies to lovers?? It doesn’t make sense to the canon blah blah blah”) only want Celeborn in the show to reel Galadriel in. They hate Haladriel because it denies canon, but they want Celeborn to be the main focus instead of Galadriel, because strong female characters can’t exist in the Tolkien universe without a man apparently.  And they use “canon” as their scapegoat, but what’s the deeper message they’re spilling? They can’t stand seeing a female character being badass (excuse my language) without a man to back her up in the way they want to see it. In their eyes, Galadriel is supposed to be soft, ethereal, quiet, mystical, and never fighting in armor. They want her to be their perfect male fantasy of what a mysterious woman should be. But are we forgetting how she banished Sauron in The Hobbit? Everyone acts like Galadriel was never a fighter, but we see her use her immense power to send away to greatest evil she’s ever seen. Where is the logic??

These people who insist Celeborn be introduced, simply to be the “proper love interest because that’s what canon says” are completely missing the point of his character. Their version of Celeborn is soaked in prejudice because they want him to be the stereotypical man to hold Galadriel back and take away all of her stubbornness and strength (I.e. the parts of her that make her such a relatable character for me). That is not the Celeborn I want.

I want a Celeborn that enhances and supports the traits that Galadriel already had from the start of season one, and the traits she will continue to have as the series progresses. Heck, I want these traits that she possesses to be the reason he fell in love with her in the first place. Galadriel is feminine, and regal, with an heir of beauty, but she is also clever, quick-witted, and even quick to anger. She’s not a picture-perfect woman, and I love it. And I bet Celeborn loves it too. I’ll say it again: “There was great love between them.” Great love comes with knowing every part of a person, even what we consider bad, and loving them despite of it. Regardless of how they bring him in, or if they do at all, I want him to be a strength for her, without getting rid of all of the parts of her character that made me love her in the first place.

The difference between Galadriel and Halbrand and Galadriel and Celeborn is that while Haladriel’s dynamic is centered around selfishness (from both of them desiring power and possibly each other so much so that it blinds them) Galadriel and Celeborn could be centered around selflessness. I mean, we see it in their story. When Galadriel eventually decides to go to Valinor, Celeborn doesn’t make her feel bad for leaving. He is understanding and compassionate. He respects her decision. And she respects him for staying behind. He returns to her eventually, but in their time apart there is no hatred.

I am not saying that the Haladriel ship is selfish, I am just saying that the two characters are selfish. I am analyzing the characters in the ship, not the ship and the shippers, so please keep that in mind.

Both Galadriel and Halbrand/Sauron are obsessed with each other (albeit in slightly differing ways) which makes them do things they can’t control.

Galadriel pleads with Elrond to help her in S2. “I can’t let him in again.”

“He never left Galadriel.”

She knows the control Sauron has over her is too strong. She knows it’s bad, but she still wants it. It’s unhealthy and wrong, but the heart follows where it wills when it is weak. Galadriel needs support and I hope we will eventually see Celeborn provide it.

The thing I am most afraid of is that they will turn Celeborn into an easily dislikable character, simply because they are following what most of the fans want. It’s not a bad thing to cater to an audience, but if they butcher his character for the sake of it, then I will be greatly disappointed. I want Celeborn to have just as much depth as Galadriel, and I want their relationship to have as much depth as Haladriel does. I don’t want Celeborn to be perfect, and I don’t want Galadriel to be either. I want their relationship to have flaws, but I also want to see the great love between them.

Galadriel is going through some complicated emotions. She’s experiencing the most dramatic situationship of all time. Perhaps that will hurt Celeborn in some ways, watching how his lover is tempted by another man, and I want to see that. But I also want to see him strengthen her in the process, by helping her through it instead of abandoning her. Even though it hurts him. Even though it hurts her. Because let’s face it, the best relationships are built on communication, and when one person makes a mistake, you don’t just get up and run when things get tough. You battle through it. The good and the ugly. Until one day, your connection is stronger because of it.

To sum it up, I ship Galadriel and Celeborn, and I can’t wait to see their dynamic onscreen, whenever it ends up happening. I just hope they do it right. I feel like such an unpopular TROP fan when I talk about them, because in all honesty, I favor Celadriel much more than Haladriel/Saurondriel, and we all know between the two what the most popular ship is. That’s not to say I don’t get excited when I see moments between Galadriel and Halbrand that could be interpreted as romantic, or when my friends post Haladriel fanfiction with so much enthusiasm. I eat that stuff up because I love it when people get excited about what they love. I just hope there are people out there who will be excited when it’s my ship's turn to shine, or when I gush about the Celadriel fanfictions I am bound to post.

 Like I said before, I have complicated feelings about Haladriel/Saurondril that I will explain at some point, (and again, I am not a Haladriel hater by any means) but I want to explain my opinion of it right because I just know some people will come after me if I say something that disagrees with them. I want to be delicate okay-

I don’t even know if I explained my thoughts on Celeborn clearly, but I hope I can find some people who understand where I’m coming from with this. The moment Galadriel talked about Celeborn, how he saw her dancing, and how he looked like a silver clam in his armor, I fell in love with the ship. That may make me the odd one out, but perhaps I’ll discover some people who feel the same about them.

Feel free to discuss your thoughts with me! I’d love to hear them! (If you disagree, make sure to make your point respectfully please-)

[everlusts]

i personally prefer s2 haladriel mainly because i adore the dead dove mindfuck they’re embedded in each others minds and can never erase it dynamics (although the execution itself is another story lol) but at the same time im fond of s1 as a whole much more not just ship wise but in terms of plot enjoyment does this even make sense idk

[neyafromfrance95]

Many shippers are moving on from haladriel. There is no fanfic or fanart from the second season. We have all given up.

no, not all, anon! sauron will always be writing and drawing that self-insert x galadriel fic even as he floats as an disembodied spirit!

lol, i mean, unfortunately, now we have the third of what we had in s1, fanworks-wise. which is sad bc haladriel has a great fan content potential.

but some big brained people shipped sauron x galadriel even before trop, so i don't see why people would stop shipping after a season of s/g mirroring each other, it being confirmed that galadriel has taboo feelings for sauron and that sauron is obsessed with galadriel and nothing will ever replace her for him.

tbh, this is why i say endless "discourses" and doom & gloom mentality are poisonous to a fandom's longevity. "how can you ship an immoral/dark ship?"' - link them this video essay, or better, remember the essay and don't feel the need to make excuses for yourself, so just ignore the rage baits! "but what about celeborn & celebrian?!" - don't care, period. "it is not lore-accurate!" - we are talking about trop and it's its own thing, period.

they don't kiss or become an official couple? hannigram wasn't freed from a "queerbait" accusations till the very final scene yet we still shipped it. each tried to kill the other, hannibal was an evil incarnate who tormented will, will was married with a kid, hannibal hooked up many times and tried to "replace" will. yet the whole show was about their power play that was er0tic in subtext! the same as it is with haladriel! the whole show is one big haladriel parallel and a metaphor about the light and the dark having an eternal battle and dance!

anyways, if you do ship haladriel and do want fans to create for it, then please interact with the works! hype them up! let's not sustain our fandom on the frustrated screams into the void, but on the common enjoyment of the material that we are given and the potential it has!

[rey-jake-therapist]

I love how no matter how much Charlie Vickers tries to stay out of the shipping stuff, ultimately he is the one who ends up contributing to it the most (his cognitive dissonance and trying to handle PR is hilarious to watch). And I say this as not even a shipper but a casual enjoyer haha

He didn’t get to see Morfydd acting as Sauron-playing-Galadriel while on set (he was in hair&makeup getting back to being Annatar after filming his Halbrand bit). So after seeing her performance during the finale screening, he was like, of course it was interesting to see how she interpreted my performance as Sauron but I would give her a few pointers (I’m paraphrasing).

Mind you, Morfydd was playing Sauron-pretending-to-be-Galadriel as smug, all smirking and twinkly eyes, and slightly annoyed and condescending when Galadriel continued her attack. So what feedback could Charlie even give, hmm? That Sauron should have been more emotional? Vulnerable? Interesting indeed. 2x08 could have been better but it’s fascinating still.

I always say that for someone who insists that Haladriel is not romantic, at the end of the day he's the one who describes them in the most romantic way. And his discourse has very much evolved, as he went from "Nope, they're not romantic at all and I hope it will be clear for everyone that it's not!" (I recently found an old interview where he said almost exactly that *crying*), to "I mean, after all, why not ? There's nothing in the lore that goes against it, and it's really cool that people ship it even if I don't see them that way, so just 'ship away' yay !" in the span of a year or two, so... Who knows, maybe next year he'll be like what Mads Mikkelsen is for Hannigram, and will profess Sauron's eternal love for Galadriel ?

I'm kidding of course. But the evolution of Charlie's discourse is certainly the result of a change in the PR campaign orchestrated for TROP. They also went from "No, no romance here ! Galadriel and Halbrand were friends, it was all platonic !" to "Sauron really loves Galadriel" and "Galadriel was obviously in love with Halbrand". And now there are also the social media managers who keep ship baiting ever since the finals came out. That's why I generally don't take anything that actors say seriously: they are trained to lie, to stay vague, to not engage in theories and shipping but also not to discourage them, etc. Also Charlie has proved to be a very good liar in the past, like when he said he "didn't play it that way" with Miv while Miv confessed it was actually his idea to make it "more ambiguous".

I don't remember the part where he said he could give Miv a few pointers, just that he trusted her to do a great job because she's such a fabulous actress :) And also that he found interesting, that it was how she saw him play Sauron.

I think she nailed it personally. Even disguised as Halbrand, Sauron didn't show any sign of vulnerability of emotion... To the point that many of us thought he was mocking her feelings for Halbrand. Now I tend to think that he really just wanted to make the point across that they weren't as different as she claimed, but the way he repeated his speech from the log scene, but without any of the emotion his voice and look expressed then... It was a bit painful to watch, really. The only moment he showed some genuine emotion was after he stabbed her !

So, since he played Annatar/Halbrand this way, it made sense for Morfydd (and Charles) to keep that line, imho. I have no idea what points he could have given her. She seemed perfect to me ;)

[buffyfan145]

Word of warning we just got a ton of possible leaks about season 2 of "Rings of Power" coming from The One Ring Net source. However, I will point out while a few of these seem possible this reminds me a lot of other "leaked" things for my other fandoms, especially DC and Marvel movies/shows, and most of those turned out to be false and fans just posting things for their own enjoyment. However, this is how it first leaked that Halbrand was Sauron before season 1 aired. Some of these do match scoops/spoilers we've gotten from Fellowship of Fans an interviews with the cast, but some of these are so out of left field. I'll post a breakdown under a cut of the major ones but you can see the post in full here. But I will point out some of these would be massive changes to the lore that even I'd be shocked if they do it, so again we'll see.

So the first thing that matches what FOF and even Charlie Vickers teased is that season 2 is going to show a lot of Sauron flashbacks and tell his side of the story and that we'll be in on his plans the whole time. But according to this post the Mairon version is a separate actor and that Gavi is actually the Annatar version but Halbrand/Charlie is still the main one going forward.

They're saying the Tolkien estate gave Amazon more access to "The Silmarillion" and we will see all the Valar, Maiar, Eru (he's just a voice though so we won't see a person), Melkor/Morgoth, Mairon (even called this name), Gandalf/Mithrander (who is Daniel's The Stranger), and even Ungoliant as we get this full backstory in the show.

Halbrand will go back to the dwarves and reveal he's Mairon to them and they truth him because of Aule.

It'll be revealed that Sauron/Mairon had a son and Adar killed him, which was why the line Adar said about "a woman or a child" was said in s1. No idea who the boy's mother is but possibly Amelia Kenworthy's character. This is a huge departure but would be interesting to have Sauron/Mairon/Halbrand actually have been a father and the 2nd Maiar besides Melian to have children.

Gandalf/Mithrander will also have flashbacks, including that he almost sided with Mairon, and even introduce Shadowfax.

Tom Bombadil and Goldberry will appear, which we already saw a leak about this possibly happening last year.

Supposedly Halbrand/Sauron does keep up his infatuation with Galadriel but actually goes back to Eregion not as just Annatar but as Celeborn!!! 😮 So they don't rescue Celeborn after all but it is Sauron/Halbrand and it's making it sound like there's romantic scenes between them but again it's actually Sauron/Halbrand with Galadriel and not Celeborn. I know some of us Haladriel shippers have written this exact thing in our fics and if this really does happen that again hints that Sauron/Halbrand really could be Celebrian's biological father which I would be shocked if the show did this even though I'd also love it. LOL Then add in if they do this change where Sauron had a son that died and possibly ends up having a daughter with Galadriel. It does sound like the real Celeborn does come back too at some point so if this happens this is going to be interesting, even though I know a lot of the purists and regular LOTR fans might hate it.

The season does end with Sauron forging the One Ring, which FOF has also been speculating. The thing is if Galadriel will be with him when he does as FOF reported on her being captured by Adar during the Battle of Eregion with this also confirms happens in the last 2 episodes.

They're also saying too that the season will also end with Galadriel making a choice to save either real Celeborn and/or Sauron/Halbrand as Celeborn, which again could point to above that she gets captured and then decides to stay with him. So this is going to be very interesting if any of these turn out to be true.

[maul-of-shame]

Hey, just want to say thank you for your post following the TROP rumors and all. Especially for your paragraphs saying that Haladriels are not the entire audience of TROP 😭 I'm a haladriel/saurondriel and I am feeling so burnt out because loud voices in our shipping ranks are constantly telling us to "produce content non-stop" to "keep the team's eyes" on the ship and I hate that this is draining me of my enjoyment... I'm afraid to talk, comment on their posts, tell them they're wrong for doing this because they are "loud" voices in the shipping ranks and I feel very alone... You post hits the nail on the fact that we, shippers, are not the "entire" audience and that we can relax so thank you so, so much for being level-headed and for making this post 😭😭🙏🙏🙏

A haladriel/saurondriel shipper.

Hey there, thank you so much for reaching out!!

First, let me say how sorry I am that you’re going through this.

Shipping should be a fun, creative outlet where you can explore stories and connections that make you happy—not something that feels like a chore or a high-stakes game to keep a ship “relevant.” It’s incredibly unfair that anyone would put this kind of pressure on you (or any shipper, really).

A quick note before I dive in: This post isn’t about shading anyone’s ship, whether it’s Haladriel, Saurondriel, Elrondriel, or anything else. I’m coming at this as someone who loves fandom and believes we should be able to enjoy our spaces without unnecessary stress or pressure—regardless of what ship we’re sailing on. This is about broader fandom dynamics, not ship wars or personal preferences. So whether you ship Haladriel, Elrondriel, or even something rare like Gil-galad/Sauron (hey, no judgment here), this applies to everyone.

I’m just an Elrondriel (Elrond/Galadriel) shipper sharing observations about fandom dynamics I’ve seen—it’s not tied to any specific ship.

Hot take but, just because some voices are loud doesn’t mean they’re right.

Being the loudest in the room doesn’t make someone the smartest, the kindest, or the most insightful. It just makes them loud—and exhausting, if I’m being honest.

I’m not a Haladriel/Saurondriel shipper, but that doesn’t matter.

Nobody deserves to feel like their fandom experience is being dictated by others, and it breaks my heart that you feel like you can’t even comment or speak up for fear of backlash. Your voice matters, and your enjoyment of your ship matters. Please don’t let the pressure steal that from you.

Shipping isn’t supposed to be a war for visibility—it’s about celebrating the stories and dynamics you love.

And let me just say, the whole idea of shippers being the sole “eyes” on a show is nonsense.

Sorry not sorry.

Like I said in my post, while ships might be a part of the fandom, nobody is the entirety of the audience—not Haladriels, not Saurondriels, not Elrondriels, not anyone.

The team behind The Rings of Power isn’t sitting in a council chamber of Lindon tallying ship content like it’s some sort of fanfiction popularity contest. Trust me, they’re not lurking in the shadows of Mount Doom, whispering, “Which ship reigns supreme?” They’re focused on the bigger picture—crafting a story that weaves together epic arcs, characters, and lore while keeping the show engaging for a global audience.

At the end of the day, what truly sways their decisions isn’t a battle of ships but the cold, hard numbers (Bezos’s precious, if you will). Ratings, viewer retention, and the broad reception of the show will hold more sway than who’s penning the most fanfiction or tweeting the loudest.

It’s the Fellowship of metrics, not a popularity contest in the Prancing Pony.

You know, I think it’s important to note something about the loudest voices pushing these kinds of demands: more often than not, they’re loud because they’re insecure. Truly secure and confident people don’t feel the need to shout their opinions from the rooftops or guilt-trip others into action. The ones making all this noise about "we have to do this," "be active on every platform," "produce endless content," etc., are likely projecting their own fears and anxieties onto everyone else.

And that’s not your burden to carry.

Frankly, this level of seriousness they’re bringing to the table is exhausting—and unnecessary.

We’re talking about a TV show.

Some of these folks are acting like if their ship isn’t front and center, the Eye of Bezos will turn its gaze upon them and smite their content from existence. Spoiler alert besties: it won’t!!

Seriously, these people need to chill out.

They’re treating this like the War of the Last Alliance when, in reality, it’s more like a friendly debate in the Green Dragon over a pint. It’s okay to be passionate, but when you’re marshaling your forces to “produce content non-stop” and acting like Galadriel preparing for a battle against ultimate evil, you might be taking this whole thing a little too far.

The thing is, nobody—and I mean nobody—is sitting there in a dark tower, tallying how much fan art or fic exists for one ship versus another. Amazon isn’t crafting their narrative based on which tag is trending. This isn’t a race to Mount Doom; it’s a TV show meant to entertain, inspire, and occasionally frustrate us.

By all means, love your ship, create content, and engage with others—but maybe let’s leave the doomsday rhetoric and One Ship to Rule Them All vibes in Mordor where they belong.

It's supposed to be a piece of entertainment meant to bring us joy, inspire creativity, and spark meaningful discussions—not a battlefield where everyone has to prove their worth or risk their ship "sinking." The sheer pressure they’re piling on isn’t just unproductive; it’s counterproductive. It’s alienating people like you who just want to enjoy what they love in peace.

And let’s be real: there are so many bigger issues in the world than fandom dynamics. Who has the energy to turn their hobbies into a high-stakes competition? If the energy they’re pouring into pressuring others was instead spent on, I don’t know, actually creating content they enjoy, the fandom would be a much healthier, happier place.

At the end of the day, you don’t owe anyone your time or effort just because they think it’s essential. The pressure to be "active" on every platform or constantly churning out content isn’t sustainable, and it’s not what makes a fandom thrive. What truly matters is passion and genuine engagement, and if that means stepping back to preserve your joy, then that’s 100% valid.

So, don’t let their insecurity or intensity rob you of the enjoyment you deserve. Focus on what makes you happy, and leave the rest to sort itself out.

So take a deep breath. You don’t owe anyone constant content, and you certainly don’t owe anyone your silence. If those loud voices in your ship’s ranks are draining you, it’s okay to step back. Your enjoyment and mental health come first. And if you ever need a break or someone to rant to, my DMs are always open Anon!

You’re not alone in this, even if it feels like it. You that you deserve to enjoy your ships your way—no pressure, no strings attached, no loud voices dictating the terms. Sending you the biggest, warmest hug (and maybe a cup of lembas tea, because we all need it sometimes). 💛

[rxyl]

im literally unable to fully function anymore like all i do is replay every haladriel scene in my head.

sauron was. making the rings. because he knew. that SHE THOUGHT. galadriel fucked up with the southlands. he prob got the idea in his head to make HER queen of middle earth aka more important then her own king who pushed her into early retirement when he was lying in a pool of his own blood waiting on galadriel to stumble across him in the damn road...........only for her to open up about her stupid dead husband and he zoomed in with his super good hearing so he also thinks her stupid dead husband is dead how convenient she's SINGLE (thinks bc i think celeborn is not dead and just off working through his own horrors from the war. i say this because i think sauron having a meltdown over celeborn just out and about would be like that episode in the sopranos when tony's mistress drives carmela home and therefore would be good television. i really dont want celeborn to be dead esp as a haladriel tragedy ENJOYER. theres nothing more idolized then a dead boywife like every potential flaw is scrubbed over and its boring). he helped out with the forge for her. even when she blocked him on all platforms he was still on a mission to bring her along with ruling middle earth. like it wasnt until the s2 finale when he had to get drastic and bind her to him. he's literally winning the war idk how the elves arent more scared that even though they never fought him in any battles he somehow won and got everything he wanted.

also the scene where she first confronts him about being maybe sauron in 01 x 08 she opens with "no, on the raft you saved me/ you brought the numenorian army/you fought by my side" and he rebuttles all of it and at first i agreed bc yeah thats what we SAW??? but then in s2 opening with him first spotting her on the open ocean we learn that the scene does not quite match up with how galadriel experienced it so now its unclear. and we see more of his side of things regarding manipulation via sorcery with celebrimbor so yeah now im doubting it just like galadriel was. what was real???? not all of it??????? the forge? he was on the verge of tears. how badly did he want to touch her hair in there. and HONESTLY even tho s2 wasnt as good as s1 i appreciate that the stories regarding the rest of the cast were still very sauron-centric IE elendil helping his blind queen (galadriel being BLIND to the MARRIAGE HE IS PROPOSING!!!!!!1111 lmao) nori and gandolf learning they must part from one another (goodbye guy who i insisted wasnt evil ) isildur catching feelings for an enemy only for her to go back to her stupid husband (LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO)

theres so many shots in s1 where he's off focus but in the corner of the screen/galadriel's mind. LOOK AT ME!!!!!!!!!! im unwell i need s3 now.

[maeday1551]

Fic snippet

Already posted on twitter but sharing here too as motivation for me to finish it. The haladriel brainrot is real. I am resorting to writing to work on my emotions about it all. :D

This is a snippet from a Five Things fic I have had percolating in my brain for years now. Five Times They Met at the Door and One Time They Didn't. This is from a middle chapter.

+ + + + +

"How goes the quest for peace?"

For a moment, he could mistake it for the echo of a memory but the sound was oddly distorted— heard as if he were underwater and the speaker just above the surface. The voice mocked him, even more than it had when she'd first spoken the words.

"Galadriel."

He could not help the smirk that lifted his expression. He could not hold back his enjoyment of her, even in this low moment.

He could sense her at the periphery of his vision, disappearing if he looked too close. He let his vision unfocus and could then pick out the shape of her. Dainty steps, her elegance effortless, as she slowly set about circling him for once. Her figure was clothed in a plain white dress, her hair bound, plaited in a crown around her head. The Commander, going into battle. He could not see her face and it chaffed.

She spoke no more but he knew she was still there, waiting. She came no closer, but he could feel the edges of her pressing against his mind. A strange sensation, for once, normally she was pulling from his grasp. He had missed her.

"Did you find yourself reminiscing over your better days?" He asked, gesturing at the Numenorean jail cell. It could have been the same cell she had been led to, all those years ago, but some things had changed. Torn down, the statues of his brethren. Torn down, simple comforts extended even to prisoners. There would be no mercy given here, the walls said. Only retribution and the taste of despair.

She still did not speak. He let his thoughts rake against her mind, brought close to his by her own will. It felt like touching a reflection in the water, his expectation diverted. She had gotten better at this, it seemed. Who had taught her, he wondered?

"I will tell them to keep a cell ready for you. They are so easily agitated, you know. Fearful of all, but especially of their betters. The Valar. The elves. Who knows where their ships may sail, in their quest to test their own mettle."

Again, her voice echoed to him, the sound of distant waves crashing and her tones tumbling as if flung from a tempest. "Are you threatening me from a jail cell, Sauron?"

He couldn't help it, perhaps he was tired. He flinched at the name and knew she could see it. Perhaps he'd let his guard down too far, especially around her. She had a way of making him desire that. The moniker was vexing at the best of times but worse somehow for the way she spit out the word. He could feel her satisfaction at seeing his distaste but he was starting to see her more clearly now. He did not turn his face towards her, lest she pull away again.

He willed his voice to be even. Mild. "I have never threatened you."

"Lies." She hissed, and at last she was in front of him, her voice clear of the sea and her eyes ablaze and piercing him to his depths. For a moment, she resembled the drowned maiden, highlighted by lightning and hair drenched and tussled by wind and sea—but after a moment her figure resolved back to only Galadriel, angry and scowling at him. The only thing missing was a dagger.

He merely smiled at her.

"There you are."

+ + + + +

[ponycactus]

Except the haladriel I'm totally agree, like yeah, there are parts that I don't like, I don't have to cry on twitter making a statement with "objective" reasons why everybody should think like me and if don't they aren't true Tolkien's fans.

And even with things I don't like the elves haircuuuut it's a very enjoyable series! It is beautiful, is entertaining, it doesn't need to be exactly like The Silmarillion says to actually have fun

I also wanted Sauron to be a hot big ass gothic D'x

Me: writing a whole ass post about how fans in this fandom (and in fandom in general) should chill the f*ck out and learn not to take everything too seriously (we have enough haters to deal with) and joke more about things.

Also me: deleting the post, because really who forking cares.

Me, again: Let me look at these two hot people being hot instead.