#especially when it comes to female characters

[sylver-drawer]

Now that the novel is officially being translated, it’s genuinely one of the worst novels I’ve read as a writer (like seriously, the format is that of a middle school grade novel), with a main character who can’t help but irritate. Lee Jihye’s actions are often hypocritical, lacking awareness and acknowledgement of those around her, especially concerning those who appear within the original “Lovely Princess” novel.

She started off with a loose goal of surviving for the first half of the novel, and when that situation is resolved the whole second half of the novel she acts carelessly without a goal or drive. Rather than a main character slowly going through development, for the whole second half of the novel she acts more as a narrator than an actual character with dreams or desires and interacts with others without any sort of meaning or consideration. It’s suddenly at the climax at the very end of the story when she has a very abrupt epitome of “Oh, all of these people who I’ve been treating as fictional characters are actually flawed people with struggles”, before returning to her carefree way of life right as the story closes. However, there is no build up to this realization—rather, it presents as a thought that comes only because the situation called for it. She only seems to easily see people outside of the novel as ‘human’—people like her maids Hannah, Seth, or the wizards of the tower, or even Lucas himself. However, when it comes to the people who appear in the novel of “Lovely Princess” she almost dehumanizes them, reducing them to ‘characters’ who have to play a ‘role’.

This can be seen how despite the amount of times she’s identified signs of Ijekiel’s feelings for her or Jennette’s depression, she brushes them off until it’s too late and Ijekiel is openly expressing his jealousy and Jennette has attempted suicide. It’s easily seen as well when you compare her treatment of Hari to her treatment of Cabel—Hari, who never appears in “Lovely Princess”, she easily forms a bond with and thinks about and mentions quite often fondly like a friend. But when Cabel appears in story, she often calls him ‘puppy-like’ (as direct call backs from her reader standpoint towards the novel) and almost always mention his status as the second male lead, constantly bringing up his role in “Lovely Princess” and acknowledging his presence as if he were still that exact character from a book. Like when she interacts with Ijekiel, she doesn’t seem to acknowledge him as a fellow peer or even the brother of a friend—but rather the ‘second male lead’ in a ‘novel’. The dehumanization is blatant, along with her romanticization of the novel itself and projecting those thoughts onto the real people she’s become acquainted with.

This becomes clear when she deals with Jennette and Ijekiel. Almost every encounter with them, or rather whenever they are together, she seems to view them with rose tinted glasses of that of a reader living through a ‘romantic moment’ between the leads of novel—rather than as a fellow human being. Just as she mentions how it took her so long to see even Claude as a human, to the very end she allows her perception of “the female lead Jennette” and “the male lead Ijekiel” to dictate how she treats the two of them. With Ijekiel, she dismisses his blatant advances because to her, the idea of “perfect male lead Ijekiel” taking a fancy to someone other than “the lovely female lead Jennette” is impossible. It’s to the point that she acknowledges that she had to snuff her own developing feelings for him out because of that perception—that a such a young love would never bloom because Ijekiel is “the male lead”.

This projection of her perception of Ijekiel leads to her inability to acknowledge Ijekiel himself, which worsens the more she interacts with Jennette. Jennette—the lovely female lead of the novel—whom Athy had grown close to as best friends (Lee Jihye’s own quote herself!), but strings along halfheartedly. Her rose tinted perception of Jennette has led to the girls own downfall, acknowledging at the end herself that she had seen the signs of Jennette’s struggling but intentionally kept turning away from it. Simply, it was because she deemed Jennette as the “female lead” of a novel. “If Jennette is in trouble, Jennette can deal with it herself”—because that’s what happens when you’re the female lead. If Jennette is getting picked on by background characters, it’s something the female lead has to deal with on her own—even if Lee Jihye, as Jennette’s best friend, had all the power to intervene. Her fairytale-like perception of Ijekiel and Jennette has led to her physically unable to see Jennette and Ijekiel having complex feelings, be it as humans, or to eachother.

This is why I think the ending for Ijekiel and Jennette in the novel is just so tragic—Lee Jihye encourages Ijekiel to go with Jennette in her exile because she still sees Ijekiel and Jennette’s relationship with rose-tinted novel-reader glasses—that it is Ijekiel’s duty to ‘protect’ Jennette, despite the fact that Jennette’s own state was a result of Ijekiel’s cruel rejection of pent up negative emotions in the first place. She fails to even consider there actually being bad blood between them, or that this perception of hers is in actuality hurting both Jennette and Ijekiel—Jennette, who to us readers has revealed how Ijekiel’s falsity hurts her more than his cruel honesty—and Ijekiel, who never had never honestly spoken to Jennette nor gotten to know her. The sidestories even reveal a bit of this future—that despite the time passed, Ijekiel and Jennette hardly look at each other. Yet, Lee Jihye insists on their repaired relationship because she herself still fully hasn’t comprehended the two of them as flawed humans who had a genuine fall out—she sees it just as it was at the end of the middle school grade novel by the name of Lovely Princess. That to Lee Jihye, despite the turmoil and grief “female lead Jennette” faced, within the arms of “her beloved male lead Ijekiel”, she was comforted and healed. Except this isn’t a novel, and Lee Jihye spoke of a relationship between two people she knew nothing about—the ‘lovely female lead Jennette’ who had been falling apart for years to depression and the lack of genuine affection, and the ‘perfect male lead Ijekiel’ who had fallen almost obsessively in love with her to the point he’d reject his ‘female lead’ in a way he knew would torture his ‘female lead’ best all while silently jealous of everyone Athy loved.

To the end, the female lead by the name of “Athanasia” or “Lee Jihye” hadn’t grown or learned anything more than she had from the start of the novel. I couldn’t in confidence tell you what her goals or intentions were by the end of the story. Rather than Who Made Me A Princess being about her, or having her as the story’s female lead, I don’t think I know any of her desires or what governed her actions in the latter half of the story. I feel as if I could tell you about young Athy/Jihye’s desire and passions, but I have no idea what pubescent Athy/Jihye’s were. She had tea parties. She attended events. She handled flowers, and was wow’d over magic, but she never genuinely took an interest in them, and their presence in a story that’s supposed to be about her is minimal. The story concludes by telling us she continued her studies in preparation as future empress, that she enjoyed certain subjects, but you never feel it nor do they show it enough to make an impact. Who Made Me A Princess’ novel is predominately written through very simple and quirky narration, character interaction and dialogue. Because it’s predominately written in Lee Jihye’s perspective of every paragraph requiring some sort of quip, the novel comes off as almost amateurish and underdeveloped, leaving a bittersweet taste in your mouth. Reading upon each sentence, I can’t help but feel grief over what was clearly an idea and concept, but poorly reflected in the writing quality. Every chapter was draining, and I often found myself asking—“where exactly is this going?”. Reflecting upon it, side by side with my own cliche fifth grade writing, I can’t help but notice the similarities in quality and tone. The novel has much potential, but comes off as a slice-of-life sort of story without a direct goal, instead focusing on aimlessness of the characters dialogue and lighthearted daily life. Perhaps that was the intent, but ultimately, the balance of story elements and the poor quality of writing ruin the story for me, ending the note of Who Made Me A Princess’ novel failing my very raised expectations. A story that had been hyped so much by the fandom, I couldn’t help but see as lackluster in almost every aspect.

[mvmnbnv]

One thing this fandom is not gonna do is make people ESPECIALLY minorities feel like we're overreacting to caitlyns behavior...especially when it comes to vi, a person who's lived all her life with what Cait had to deal with for only a fraction of a moment, and on a systemic level. I'm so over people acting like it's just a matter of "not being able to handle complex female characters" when we watch her actively gas people and hit the same girl who has trauma with being beaten by her people. Someone who she supposedly loves up until she deems her not even worthy of it anymore because she's not shaping up to be "one of the good ones" when all vi wanted was for a child to not potentially be murdered. FOH.

Her concern is conditional. Her love for vi after all of this...conditional. this makes this unrequited love bullshit they speak of even worse. She can't even see vi anymore. Literally. Like she doesn't even see a person anymore. Just another zaunite who's "easy to hate". Why tf would anyone want her in a relationship like that

[hellspawnmotel]

It's a shame about Astro Boy Epsilon 2003's design to be steeped lowkey in this "Well he's the most feminine of those seven robots so why not turn him into a girl" because his design is genuinely cute there, but also because of his more pacifist manners + caring nature, really sends an odd implication when it comes to turning of any of the famous robots from Astro Boy into a girl imho. Your comic really shined a light on that which I really enjoyed and it reminded me how while I enjoyed Astro boy 2003 it has its grounds to cover by how it changes things around

yeah I had the exact same thoughts! it's odd too that in 2003, epsilon doesn't retain the main qualities that make him such an interesting character- those being that he's a caretaker of human children, and his brief relationship with pluto. the former especially seems like such a missed opportunity given how much of a theme robot-human relationships are in the anime. we see plenty of other robots taking care of human children and the conflict that causes, so I don't see why one of those instances couldn't have been epsilon. it wouldve been a really smart way to integrate them more heavily into the plot. my only idea is the writers thought like "well if we make our only recurring powerful female robot a literal mother figure that feels pretty reductive" but it's not like the show isn't already sexist in other ways? and the consequence is that epsilon loses the things that made the audience care about him and becomes a pretty flat character. every other version of epsilon dies protecting a child. 2003 epsilon is defeated because she's worried about some random dolphins. it's kind of an emotional downgrade.

I don't mean to be overly negative though- I actually just finished watching the show last week and it was amazing. it had a perfect ending, which isn't something I can say for many things. AND most of the episodes range from "great" to "mindblowingly awesome and heartwrenching". there's so many good things to say about it- which is exactly why I get so critical of its few flaws, especially when it comes to things that felt like a downgrade from the manga. they stick out like a sore thumb! I could make plenty of complaints about the manga too (and I have, to my friends) but that doesn't stick in my craw as much because the manga is much less consistent in terms of quality. astro boy 2003 is a fantastic show and a really really smart adaptation apart from like, two things. and to be fair they're only things that will really bother you if you read the manga first, which I did. so if anyone reading this is an astro boy fan (or just likes robots tbh) and hasnt watched it for some reason...... do that. it's incredible, seriously. don't let my complaining scare you away.

[wildm00re]

haven’t watched the flash in like 100 years but got jumpscared by someone posting westallens “we’re the flash scene” and complaining about it. the post had like thousands of likes and i just sit there for a moment confused (not really, everyone knows why they’re really mad) about what was so outrageous about that scene to begin with???

all iris is literally telling barry is that he doesn’t have to face things alone, that they will always find a way to face whatever problem/enemy that may come. she is comforting and being there for her soulmate and husband-to-be???

but no, you’ll have dumbass #1 and #2 commenting things like “ok iris you go fight the reverse flash then”, completely missing the point of the scene because their own hatred for iris is apparently much stronger than their media literacy ig

[epickiya722]

"I like yuri."

Do you? You do actually have a ship of two female characters that you like? Or you have a ship of two male characters that you yuri-fy and use them to say you like yuri ships and female characters?

[sprimpfriedrice]

White dungeon meshi fans sound like this to me:

It's extremely fascinating and frightening to me how hateful some of you people are towards shuro, a man who is clearly depicted as japanese, (a man who could look like me or literally any member of my family in real life) for being a normal, complex, and flawed human being.

Why do you single him out for getting frustrated with and mad at laios when chilchuck and marcille do the same literally all the time? What's the difference between them and shuro?

Why do you feel the unnecessary need to protect these white women from a japanese man?

Do you expect that this japanese man is inherently going to have some kind of ugly negative quality that has not been once hinted at canonically? Do you know what that's called? Because i do and it's fucking racism.

You people get scared the moment a character that is a person of color isnt a quiet little model minority or a sweet mammy archetype. You grasp at your pearls the moment they are revealed to have complex personalities and histories; when they feel negative, big emotions that are literally part of the human experience. Or god forbid, when they show romantic interest in a pure, helpless, little white woman.

And when a person of color stops behaving good and docile the way you want, when they decide that theyre not going to put up with a situation that makes them uncomfortable or miserable or RIGHTEOUSLY FURIOUS, they become the bad guy. As seen countless times in the medias demonizing depiction of the Black Lives Matter protests and even of black people who get punished for just living their lives. It happens so often i shouldnt have to reiterate it to you but it somehow keeps flying over your head.

And when that dirty, conniving, perverted, slant eyed, buck toothed, stumpy little japanese man understandably snaps at the white person you guys are projecting onto and all you see is this:

So dont be surprised when i say that id rather kill myself than entrust the safety of my oldest aunts and uncles or my youngest cousins with any of you who act like this. Im terrified of what could have happened if people like you worked at the facility that my great grandmother lived out her final years in. Would you have seen her as a wild animal that needed to be subdued too when she had one of her many dementia-induced violent episode?

I will not apologize for saying that i find it deeply disconcerting to see so many of you happily posting hateful vitriol or even about committing acts of violence against a man that looks like me, solely because he was experiencing his humanity

[brynnmclean]

saw a post questioning shipping Senua and Thórgestr and started to reblog it with a tag novel-- felt weird about doing that since this is lengthy and potentially derailing, so making my own post instead. Spitballing under the cut:

First off, any time someone is like, "the real reason people ship this is because they find the dude attractive," this is SO funny to me as someone who doesn't find men attractive IRL and has fiercely loved Senua since I played the first game, like-- actually I find the dynamic between those two characters to be compelling and interesting precisely because of all the baggage between them re: their backgrounds, the rough (put mildly!) beginning of their relationship, all the things they don't talk about, and them finding a common enemy/common ground to work with. The explicit parallels between them stated in-game scratched an itch in my brain. The minute they pointed out the dark rot on his arm, it was like, "oh! hello there! NOW I'm interested in whatever your whole deal is" for me. Also, idk man, I too would follow Senua around after she knocked me into the dirt and then showed me a way to fight the giants that I very much wanted to fight instead of appease.

The idea that Thórgestr was part of the Orkney Raid that killed and mutilated Dillion is VERY interesting food for thought, even if I don't personally have that headcanon (surely there are more viking raiding groups than just the Bjorg). I think the Furies or the Shadow said something similar about Fargrimr (his kin murdered yours, you shouldn't save him, etc.) so I completely get that line of thought, but I think the game left it ambiguous enough that it's up for interpretation. Would I read fic with that premise? Yeah, I'd check that out. Could Senua forgive Thorgestr if his people were involved? Sounds fun to explore.

If (ha, when?) I write fic, I'd have to think more about it especially wrt timelines, like when did the Bjorg start specifically raiding for slaves for giant food sacrifices vs. killing people for resources and wealth? How far off are we from the old gods "dying" and the volcano erupting? Was it indeed a different group of raiders who made a deal with Zynbel, attacked Senua's home, and made the sacrifice at that time to Hela?

At the very least, I think there's a time jump between the end of Hellblade I and the beginning of Hellblade II since Senua wasn't alone on that slave ship and at least one of the (brief) survivors knew her by name. I wouldn't mind exploring that gap of time, too.

In any case I do agree that it would take a VERY long time for Senua to consciously catch feelings for anyone let alone Thorgestr with all their collective baggage. The idea of them having a relationship beyond friendship in the far off future of an AU where he survives is the only one that can make sense in my brain, personally. It would take time! Time they didn't get in the game! But I think there are a lot of different roads that could take, and some of them might be healthier than others. Shipping them certainly isn't forgetting or excusing what happened to Dillion-- or even mutually exclusive from still shipping Senua and Dillion. Or, frankly, also shipping Senua and Astridr, because I can see that ship too.

One of the nice things about all the details Ninja Theory didn't expand upon and that they left that ending so open is that the sky's the limit. I'm VERY interested in seeing fandom tackle this game as we get farther from the initial release.

[ragsandrascals]

Ann in the stage musical is not the “mom friend”

Okay no she’s the fifteen-year-old babysitter who’s been left with eight toddlers and thinks she's the mom friend-

And she is Not.

[problemswithbooks]

BNHA Ch. 429

So, I guess Toga is dead, and people are losing it.

I get why people liked her--she was actually queer, being pan/bisexual. She was representation for them and that's rare in shonen manga. But here's the thing--she was bad representation at best and insulting at worst. Nor do I think she was made queer because Hori really wanted to represent a queer girl. Himiko was always the author's poorly hidden fetish--she just was. She liked girls as much as boys because Hori wanted to draw a girl touching sexually on another girl. You can see this in how he draws her and Ochako in solo pics together.

I mean, people seem to understand this when it comes to Momo and her outfit being overly sexual or that both Himiko and Hagakure's Quirks either leave them naked or they have to be naked to use them. These are excuses to draw girls in a sexual manner. Himiko being into other girls is the same thing and that's the kindest interpretation.

Given how Himiko acts and her Quirk being heavily coded sexual desire, and therefore her use of it against someone unwilling being sexual assault, it could just being playing into harmful stereotypes of predatory gays.

As a queer person myself I just found Toga insulting. She was designed to be overly sexual and give the male author a female character that he could draw being suggestive with his other female characters. When he did flesh out her character, her backstory was eventually the trope/fear of straight people, that gay people will be so overcome with their lust that they end up sexually assaulting them.

In the end Ochako accepts this part of Toga and says she'll giver her blood forever, but as much as a lot of readers took that that as some deep lesbian confession, for me it really fell flat. Hori never really gave any of the main kids time to actually learn about their villain or show how that changed their minds toward them. Shoto only works because Touya is his brother (even though he admits he barely remembers him). But Ochako goes from not thinking of Toga at all pre-first war, to one thought about her during her speech, to suddenly caring about her so much she--given how Toga's quirk is coded, is willing to essentially fulfill Toga's kink for the rest of their lives.

It's weird and it comes out of nowhere. It's made even stranger because Toga doesn't actually change or show remorse for anything she did, which included personally hunting and murdering people before she joined the LOV. None of the death and destruction she is also partially responsible for is brought up either, something that Ochako was rightfully upset about during the first war when less people and property had been destroyed. Ochako just accepts everything about her suddenly and her past serious crimes are forgotten so they can cuddle and cry.

Am I shocked Toga died--a little. I didn't think Hori would have the guts to kill off a young girl character, especially one that he clearly got a lot of joy drawing in sexy poses. But at the same time, once he killed off Shigaraki and ended Touya's story with his slow death, I'm not surprised he went the same route with Toga.

This isn't Naruto--Hori isn't really kind to characters that do something wrong, especially if they don't try and change. Enji, Bakugo, Hawks, and Aoyama all sort of got punished for what they did. Enji is the worst off, being permanently crippled, missing an arm and burned everywhere. Bakugo's hand is damaged, his heart weaker, plus he feels bad that Izuku lost his Quirk so they can't compete the same way he wanted them to. Aoyama, despite doing way less wrong and even helping his class during the forest raid, still leaves school because he doesn't feel he earned being there yet. Hawks lost his Quirk and even though him running the HPSC could be seen as good for him, Hawks always wanted a break, but now he has one of the most time consuming and stressful jobs out there.

So, if this is what characters who actively did good things and even changed and fought to be better get, what would characters who never changed and never did anything positive for anyone but their friends/themselves get?

Before the last Arc started, when so many people said the LoV were 100% going to be redeemed I had doubts and always thought it wouldn't make sense with how the story presented redemption or treated other non-LoV villains in the past. That if the main LoV did get some happy ending where they were bffs with the main cast it would clash with how other characters had been treated.

That doesn't mean that I think how Shigaraki, Toga, and Touya ended up in the manga was well done. I think their endings fit far better then a last minute redemption would have, but at the same time you can feel how rushed everything has been since the end of the first war arc. Hori was done with this story months if not years ago, yet he was contractually obligated to finish it. Because of that I think he left out as much as possible. As much as I think he's written some pretty obsessive stuff, particularly towards women, I can't really fully blame him cutting corners or the story being shit at the end.

We know Manga authors, particularly those that work with Jump are treated like shit. That they suffer incredibly long hours at times not even getting to go home for days. We've gotten messages for Hori saying he's sick quite a few times. On top of that, weekly story telling is not a great way to tell a cohesive narrative. Ideas probably change week to week or at least month to month and you can't go back and change the last chapter no matter how much you need or want to. Then you remember he also gave a lot of ideas to the people who made the movies, which would also change his plans for how he wanted the main story to go.

The story is bad--it has been for a while, but I think a lot of people put their hopes on their favorite characters getting a happy ending, even when there were signs that probably wasn't going to be the case. I know how much it sucks when a character you love gets a shitty ending (Stain was my fav, but he got an absolute dogshit ending) but at least, knowing what I know about the industry I can't really blame Hori the way I see some other people doing. Criticize it, sure, but saying Hori hates his readers or is horrible writer isn't true. BNHA was popular for a reason--he's great with characters and the beginning of the story had some great pacing. We'll never know, but I wouldn't be surprised if BNHA could have been amazing if Hori had been treated better and the story hadn't needed a chapter every week.

If anything BNHA has taught me how much a story suffers when authors/artists are treated like crap and forced to work past burnout.

[hnnny]

Man, this Kotor fandom stuff is so easy man. Just draw Juhani and Visas literally once and you get hundreds, sometimes thousands of notes.

[sonknuxadow]

I don't understand why Sega doesn't want female Sonic villains. They either get redeemed like Merlina and Sage or are just background villains like Zeena. The closest we've had was Fiona the Fox, who was really starting to strike out on her own as a bad guy and even alluded to preparing to plot against Scourge should things go south. I don't know if we can count Surge anymore since she's kinda fallen into a grey area, but we'll see in the future.

hmm i personally wouldnt say that sage or merlina were redeemed. sage did help sonic save the world but she also made it very clear that all of her actions, good or bad, were done out of loyalty to eggman and her goal to protect him, and in both possible endings she's still with eggman after everything is over. and with merlina she was just kinda defeated and that was it. sonic didnt seem to hold any of it against her but she also didnt apologize or really do much of anything in that final scene. at least not from what i remember, correct me if im wrong.

it is true though that the few girl villains who exist in the games and idw sonic tend to be more sympathetic or morally gray while the guys are often just evil for the sake of being evil. there are exceptions to this on both sides but theres still a pattern there. and i agree we need more girl villains in general

[ghostlysundae]

Fandom spaces really have forgotten villains aren't actually supposed to be all that liked, and that includes ones you can find sympathetic. It's perfectly fine to like them and I'll never say you shouldn't but like. Maybe don't be surprised when people don't??????

[saturnniidae]

I miss being new to fandom and thinking the prominence of m/m ships was progressive instead of it actually just being people refusing to engage with female characters

[sskk-manifesto]

Ep 6!!!

[quibbs126]

Okay because my mind’s still on the subject, I have a bit of a weird question, but I just want an answer

So like, my favorite type of drama in series is usually familial drama, most often ones between parents and their children. And also usually, those dramas that I love are specifically between father and son

And now I’m wondering, what are parent-child dramas/dynamics that involve a female character usually like? As in, mother-son, father-daughter, or even mother-daughter? And additionally, are they as interesting as father-son dynamics? Because I feel like I don’t see nearly enough of them, or at least, they never give me that same amount of intrigue or they just aren’t as focused on

By which I mean specifically in my context, would they be interesting in an action based series? I have a particular taste, namely that I like my series (mostly this applies to shows, I’m a bit more flexible with games) to be more action focused, or at least have some fantastical elements to it, or else I don’t care. I’m not interested in soap opera kind of drama, I want something that would fit in an action based show

Sorry, again this is probably a weird request (and to be honest I really don’t expect answers, posts of mine like these usually get little to no attention), but it’s on my mind. I feel like I see so many interesting father-son dynamics and conflicts, but I never see one that involves a woman, at least not when it comes to parent-child dynamics, and not ones nearly as interesting

[hiitspath]

And here is where the sexist writing comes to make Karen come off as a bit vapid to me. So far the only thing she thinks about is how handsome Matt is. How she wishes she could marry him if he weren’t blind. How she wants him but the only thing holding her back is the fact he’s blind. I know she gets better but hopefully other adaptations flesh her out better.

I know this was written in the 60’s and Marvel isn’t known for being kind to their female characters. But I hope Karen shows interest outside how handsome but so sad that Matt’s blind.

Daredevil #4