#crack meta kind of

[i-dreamed-i-had-a-son]

Honestly I understand why Megatron is obsessed with Optimus Prime. Megatron is doing his darndest to run an evil army, but because it's an evil army everyone is constantly betraying him. He tells them infighting is destroying them, heck, he's even tried to be empathetic, and they turn right around and attack either each other or (more frequently) him. Is it any wonder he's almost happy to see Optimus on the battlefield?? At least with him, Megatron knows what to expect--bro will be there to fight him every time. Simple! Consistent! An opponent who's actually in front of him instead of behind his back! What a relief...

In short Optimus is basically Megatron's comfort item and I don't blame him for that

[foursaints]

barty characterization is so troublesome because he is at his most canonical (and most compelling) when treated with utter seriousness & placed squarely in context of an austere, repressed upper class childhood leading to patricide… he is not goofy! his prevailing theme in canon is the violent denial of his bodily autonomy - the living body horror and tragedy of his stint under imperius!

so the fanon version of barty as a sleazy trash-talking fuckboy with a tongue piercing is…. uncanonical. there’s literally zero basis for his fandom treatment as hogwarts’s resident dirtbag and in fact it makes no sense… but it’s such an entertaining direction to take him that i would argue fanon’s reshaping made him more interesting? or has given us more opportunities?

like the fan decision to shove hp canon’s most tortured martyr-machiavel into a thrasher hoodie is objectively hilarious and ripe for exploration. basically my point is that true barty enjoyers can juggle both interpretations at once, explore the inherent contradictions, and decide which better suits their purposes for different scenarios. also i would like to see canon!barty and fanon!barty making out

[amber-laughs]

there is just no universe where catelyn likes jon i’m sorry. she knows about R+L=J? ned made traitors of her and her children, put jon’s safety above their’s and is now an even bigger threat to their lives. she hates him. Rhaegar wins and he’s prince jon? he’s still the product of the event that the entire country had to go to war for and probably got her father killed in the process. at the very least she resents him. maybe even hates him. modern au? he’s just the cousin with the teen mom that gets high with her son in the basement and sneaks arya razor blades or whatever. she hates him!

[tealvenetianmask]

I'm fully convinced now that this is the reason Blitz referenced his therapist calling him gross:

Someone (probably Millie) set him up with a therapy appointment, or multiple- because of his everything- and he agreed to go to humor his friend but spent the whole time messing with the poor therapist instead of . . . you know, talking through his issues. I'm talking false stories, sex jokes, murder jokes, the works.

The rest of the quote here is "If we keep being obnoxious, they'll eventually slip up, and we'll get a chance to get out. Let's just keep fucking with them until they get so frustrated they stop thinking clearly-it usually works."

So what if this is the approach he took to therapy?

[victorie552]

Ok, so Noldolantë, "The Fall of the Noldor" is a lament composed by Maglor about what happened before, during and after First Kinslaying at Alqualondë. It's such a good song that it's played regularly in Aman and Valar listen to it often (I swear, I swear it was in the Silmarillion I just can't find it now).

It's also a more or less common fanon that Maglor continues writing Noldolante through the whole First Age. Makes sense - it's about fall of the Noldor, and Noldor did a lot of falling back then.

Headcannon time: So my first thought was that Noldolante must a long, long, long epic of a song. So it probably has many parts, right? Iliad has 24 books/parts, somehow I think Noldolante would be at least just as long, and there are longer epics. And again, just like Iliad, unless you're a scholar, in the daily life you don't really listen to/read the whole thing, just reread and repeat the most dramatic fragments. What I'm trying to impress upon you all is that the story would have different segments, or chapters, if you will.

And if Maglor continues to write the story during the FA, there would absolutely be a moment in the lament where the OG Noldolante becomes Noldolante 2, and even Noldolante 3. There may be the same musical motif or something, I decided that Maglor IS that good of a bard to keep it all consistent enough so you know it's all the same story, but the style changes a lot - it's been 400 years in the making, let The Music Elf have fun!

So, Point 1: Many, Many Parts, basically Maglor's FA WIP

My second thought was that, while Feanor invented his alphabet, elves learned their history mostly through oral tradition aka songs and spoken stories. Noldolante is definitely a historical record, where a historical event was archived for future generations.

(It was a also a way to deal with grief, guilt and blame Maglor and all Noldor have faced regarding First Kinslaying - free therapy! But that's not what this post is about)

Archived.

My 2.5 thought was that Noldolante isn't just recallings of how pretty and horrified the beach looked during the murdering or how mad and sorrowful the sea was at everyone during the voyage or even how awesome and charismatic Feanor looked during his speeches that every single Noldo was ready to fight Morgoth barehanded in his name - no, this is a record of who killed who, who got killed by whom, and how.

Noldor and Teleri knew each other (were friends, even!) before the First Kinslaying, so I'm confident that after a lot of interviews, detective work, and cross-referencing, Maglor could and would create a very good... name list. Practically every Noldo and Teler present during First Kinslaying would get a stanza in a song, more if he killed someone, most if he killed many people. Killers and killed would show up twice, first in a fragment listing the killers and their victims, then in a part listing the victims and their murderers. Basically it's the same thing twice, but from different POVs. With when, where and how included.

(It was seen to be in bad taste to compare kills during Maglor's Regency, when most of his interview-part work happened. People did it anyway. There were a Saddest Kill, Funniest Kill, and Weirdest Kill discusions. There was a Tier List. These were weird times to be a Feanorian Noldo.)

(It WAS in Bad Taste, but at least people talked about it. I cannot stress enough how much free therapy this lament provided)

(Little did they know, when Teleri started getting reembodied in Aman, they had very similar discussions, but more in a "I can't believe he killed me like THAT" way. Long, long, long after the First Age. Noldolante is a gift that keeps giving)

So, Maglor had all the historical grith and no common shame to create a "We Killed All These People And We Feel Bad About It" banger of a song, and every Noldo had a very personal reason to at least remember the fragments they are in. It's a hit on a scale never seen before.

(I'm not sure how to tackle the issue of Nolofinweans and Arafinweans learning about Noldolante after crossing the Ice. But there were discussions. There was anger, there was "????", there was controversy. Basically, the song got bigger and bigger rep no matter what your opinion on it was. By the time of Mereth Aderthad it was an important cultural and political piece and at least Fingon's forces were included in the main song. It had parodies.)

Point 2: Archive Function/Kill count storage. Cultural phenomen, every Noldo included

This is where my personal nonsense begins: Main Noldolante was done, there was nothing more to say about First Kinslaying, all killings and deaths were well documented.

But the Siege started. And the Noldor kept dying.

It was less dramatic than it sounded - between the big battles the siege was maintained, but orc raids also happened and sometimes one to few Noldor died in skirmishes. The legal procedure was to document the death of a fellow elf and send a word to king Fingolfin. The cultural procedure, technically started by Feranorians but adapted by many more, was to send the name, common characteristics and cause of death to Maglor's Gap. After few months, King Fingolfin would send reinforcements, short condolences and financial compensation if they had family. After few months, family of an elf would also receive a personal lament for them and a place for them in a Noldolante.

Yes, every lament Maglor created in that time was technically part of the Noldolante. Noldolante 1.5, if you will. Laments make in that time were very customized, and simpler than Noldolante Main, but were still considered a part of the same song. Of course, nobody was expected to know and remember laments for every single Noldo, younger Noldor born in Beleriand could even only know fragments about their family members. Only Maglor would ever know Noldolante in full, but it was understood that everyone had their place in The Song.

The results of Great Battles were harder to document, but Maglor did that. Of course, Dagor Bragollach was hard on him personally, but he worked his way through.

(High King Fingon forbade creating laments for his father. There were no songs for Fingolfin. Apart from in Noldolante, of course. Of course. Maglor did not share the lament with anyone, but he sat long hours and many nights with a blank paper before him, looking at the candle flame and thinking of the past and the future. The song unsung, but there)

Nirnaeth was... Maglor was never more hated and more approached at the same time than then. Still, Noldolante grew and grew, as if people knew the end was near.

It was Second Kinslaying that destroyed the myth of Maglor's song. Feanorians didn't know the Sindar they killed, but surely, they couldn't just left their names unmentioned like they did with orcs? So, Noldor talked, but the battle happened in caves - it wasn't uncommon to find dead bodies in empty rooms, with no witnesses to what happened. Surviving Sindar didn't want to share any names, even when Maglor strong-armed some into talking with him, and good for them. Maglor made a big lament anyway. Maglor, wild, with no shame and dead brothers, with legacy crumbling around him. Noldolante, with holes.

After Third Kinslaying, Noldor didn't want to talk. Lament for Sirion didn't have any names. Clearly, songs weren't a way to go anymore, it was always about live witnesses. And so Maglor raised the twins.

Lament for Maedhros was sung repeatedly. There was no one to hear it.

Point 3: Only Maglor knows Noldolante in full. But that doesn't matter, because everyone knows the important part: the Noldolante is finished. The Star of Hope rises in the West and the story goes on. The Fall has ended.

[moongothic]

You know I have discussed in the past how I think it's quite likely Dragon is just Very Straight and that could've been a key, deciding factor in The Dragodile Divorce, but it is worth also considdering that the entire relationship could've been compulsory heterosexuality for (pre-t) Crocodile too. Like Croc could be straight and be exclusively attracted to women and he simply just... didn't figure it out until he had his gender shit sorted out

And, IDK, Dragon divorcing Croc because he's not into men is absolutely tragic and painfully real, but there is also something deeply sad about the idea of Crocodile being the one to divorce Dragon because he's the one who realized he wasn't actually into men

[13eyond13]

I love the way that, in addition to his origin story with his over-sized sword and the scar on his nose, the flashbacks to Guts's childhood show how much of his insane work ethic and reckless self-endangering abandonment in battle were all kinda ingrained into him by his craving for attention and approval from shitty father figure, Gambino.

Random nice mercenary guy: "Don't overexert yourself, kid. Just do what's needed. 'Cause if you die, you lose everything."

Gambino: "It's your first battle. Work hard!"

Guts: [throws himself into battle so hard he nearly dies multiple times, fixating on pleasing Gambino the entire time]

Gambino: "C'mon, hurry up! Work! Work!"

Guts: [gives Gambino his entire earnings, Gambino tosses him back a single coin]

Guts: [more motivated by this one mild bit of encouragement than anything he's ever experienced before in his life]

[ladystoneboobs]

on this week's tully tuesday, ok, i cannot defend the trout sigil, but the interesting thing about their coat of arms is that the colors not only reflect their geographic domain (mud red for the red fork of the trident and blue and white for the tumblestone flowing into it), it also mirrors the family's Signature Look of red-brown hair and blue eyes. what other house has that matchup of banner colors and physical looks? certainly not any of the other great houses. the starks have grey eyes but not naturally snow white hair. the lannisters have golden hair but not crimson eyes. the baratheons have black hair but not yellow eyes like a sith lord or the bully in a christmas story. the greyjoys also have black hair but no yellow/gold eyes either (that we know of. nobody can say for sure what's under euron's eye patch). the arryns may tend to blue eyes like jon arryn and harry the heir, however, i think we'd know, even with so few of them in canon, if any had pure white hair from childhood. the tyrells have neither green hair/eyes nor gold hair/eyes. the martells have neither hair nor eyes that are orange, red, and/or gold. the targaryens had red-eyed (but white-haired) bloodraven, an albino outlier, and black-haired family members favoring their dornish, baratheon, strong, etc. heritage but none of them had red eyes (that we know of), and all those are exceptions not conforming to the Signature Look of the incestuous blood of the dragon with their pale hair and purpleish eyes. that trademark true targ coloring could only be reflected in banners of a violet dragon on a silver field or vice versa.

but no, no, with the tully banners grrm just had to triple the significance with geographic locale, family hair/eye coloring that just somehow matches the rivers where their castle is (did this look only develop after axel tully built his stronghold at that strategic location? or did their banners already reflect their looks before they became associated with that river meeting too? did the present coat of arms come after riverrun was built, or was it just a serendipitous act of destiny for it all to match up that way?) plus all the fish symbolism relating to catelyn. (no, i'm still not really defending the trout bc that part doesn't really extend to the rest of the house the same way.)

[sweetandglovelyart]

It’s a little bit late for Valentine’s Day but here’s the reveal of my cursed Kirby crack ship as promised: it’s Dyna Blade/Captain Vul and I envision their relationship dynamic as being like Donkey and Dragon’s relationship dynamic in the Shrek movies.

[allieinarden]

I love a story where the most startling thing you could ever tell the cast would be who the main character is. For instance, Fry thinks Leela is the main character, Bender thinks Bender is the main character, and Leela doesn’t even know it’s a story.

[meyerlansky]

...some follow up thoughts to this post. does GALE care about rank? inasmuch as anyone in the 100th does, which is a pretty low bar, but i feel like gale might actually give enough of a shit to be an impediment to curtbuck in the way it DEFINITELY is not an impediment for curtbucky.

on the one hand, no, because of the RAF fight. i cannot square "let his lt take on a fight he stepped up for" with "cares about rank like a lot a lot," personally. in which case there shouldn't be a huge issue with OTHER flagrant violations of rank and fraternization etc etc

but on the other hand. gale definitely cares about HIS rank and Being A Leader more than bucky does. again, not a high bar, but gale and jack have THE strongest protective instincts over their men out of all the brass we see, especially early on, and gale definitely has like... i don't wanna say a paternalistic outlook on being a major, but he Cares About His Men in a way bucky just... doesn't, as much? where bucky disengages to cope, gale engages MORE, takes on more of the responsibility of leadership. he checks in with dickie and bosser, he takes losing 350th crews REALLY personally, we all know i'm deranged about him circling the RAF fight like a guard dog, etc. plus they constantly have curt flying with gale, so i assume they did a little adaptational change and made curt 350th instead of 418th, which makes gale curt's DIRECT commanding officer and not just a higher rank, if my understanding of squadron command structure's accurate. so that's an added layer of complication that's not there for curtbucky.

and then somewhere in the middle is the way gale does shit like steal curt food and go against what i assume is procedure to keep curt in the air at trondheim at the risk of at LEAST the rest of the squad, if not the entire formation. and if bucky hadn't agreed with him on dropping back to keep curt safe, i don't entirely buy that gale would've accepted that loss either. which is kind of another point in favor of "doesn't care about command structure," but not respecting up isn't the same as taking advantage down, y'know?

so like... it gets a little fuckier with curtbuck. CURT doesn't care, obvs, but thinking about it i CAN see gale getting twisted up over it, at least a little. maybe not enough to stop him, though? like, this is fanfic, of course it's not gonna stop him, but does that WORK. god why does he have to be such a tough nut.

[1337wtfomgbbq]

Uuuh, I like this too.

Between Mary instilling the daily brushing in Dean and Dean passing that knowledge onto Sam. Imagine lil Dean going, "that's how mom taught me," to Sam while he teaches him his daily brushing routine.

(And that routine may be ideal, may not be ideal. Because Mary may have been taught the best technique by a dentist, and she may have taught it to Dean the way the dentist explained it to her, or a variation of it. And Dean himself, due to the fact that he was a KID🤌 may have taught Sam a variation of what he learned from Mary).

And about this I wonder just WHAT the dentists in question told Mary and/or John. Because I remember between the two dentists I was with during my life (of 28 years) they had extremely different information. (The one I was with during my childhood and teens didn't even tell my mom that kids and teens get two professional dental cleanings per year for free on our insurance until we turn 18🤌)

(Like, flossing for example. I know my mom DID NOT teach us to floss, or more specifically I did not assume that habit from her. I only started flossing daily like 4 or 5 years ago.)

The professional dental cleaning situation is different for sure since we talk about the US. And I have NO CLUE about what insurance the Winchesters had before YE bbq-ed Mary on the ceiling and everything went to shit. Likewise, I have no idea if John kept up the two yearly professional dental cleanings, or if he only went to the checkups, or what the hell was going on.

But for some reason my brain is going haywire about this.

Also, if Dean suddenly had 17 cavities after Chuck takes him out from under his protection... how are Dean and Sam dealing with dental hygiene and checkups in general, because by the time of the Pilot they are 26 and 22 years old. Meaning they are responsible for themselves. So, how often do they head to the dentist? Do they do checkups? Do they only go if they have an emergency (aka aching tooth)?

Yall, I gotta talk about teeth for a second.

Because every time I watch some kind of media and people have exceptionally great teeth I wanna know why (in the context of the media). Like, Pirates of the Caribbean. Why do some of them have great teeth, why do some of them have bad teeth? What is the historical background for dental care here?

And today it hit me about Supernatural. Both Sam and Dean have great fucking teeth. Which means that John must have made sure they take good care of their teeth. He must have made sure the boys get annual check ups with the dentist.

And before yall John haters hit me over the head with headcanons like, "Dean had so horrible teeth he got all of them capped at fucking 26 years old" or, "John wouldn't get either of them braces" hear me out. Neither Sam nor Dean as their younger selves are shown to have bad teeth. Not in Something Wicket (1x18), not in the After School Special (4x13), not in Dark Side of the Moon (5x16), not in Bad Boys (9x7). They are both shown to have perfectly normal, if not exceptional, teeth.

Also, neither Sam nor Dean as their younger selves, seem to have major tooth displacement so I think neither of them would have needed braces in the first place. I could see an argument being made for either of them (though I think Sam more likely) needing a grinding teeth guard to help with nightly grinding of teeth due to stress.

Sorry for the long rant but for some reason dental care lives rent free in my head.

[m4rdb]

imagine if they eventually show shauna's mother after people making up headcanons for years where they already decided her name and her being a nurse and treating jackie like a second daughter and then she comes on screen and she's a bitch

[devouredbysnails]

hannibal has some pretty shit taste in art though. primavera? you mean to tell me he dedicated countless hours of work to recreate that wack ass guy with puffed up cheeks like a blowfish? swan upon leda? the bird rape? not to mention: the antlers and tusks and horns? at this point just verbally admit to everyone who enters your home that you want to fuck.

i know he's literally a serial killer but what is wrong with him?

[lunanoc]

PART II: KING MU OF ZHOU AND THE QUEEN MOTHER OF THE WEST

(to see previous disclaimers and context here’s part I of this madness)

blanket spoiler warning for the books once again

fair warning, some of the bold connect-the-dots crack theories are going to start creeping in here, but more meta here we gooo

continuing where we left off with the various versions of the story of king shang of lu dmbj gives us, the wang family powerpoint lesson, besides giving us the third account of those, also introduces new key players, both one we know but did not know of their potential connection to king shang of lu, and a new one that offers an entirely new perspective on this subplot of dmbj lore: king mu of zhou and the queen mother of the west

what the wang powerpoint and the subsequent discussions between li cu and members of the wang family tell us about king mu of zhou and the queen mother of the west is not only interesting in itself, but also ties closely into both king shang’s and iron mask’s story, as well as the overall dmbj lore. i try not to go too far in trying to see possible connections with later books, notably here queen mother’s ghost banquet, because i don’t have the full context for those, so i won’t go into too much detail on what’s essentially a tenuous crack theory. however, for the record, the queen mother of the west as she’s described in sand sea part III could potentially tie into what we learn about the zhang family’s origins at the tail end of queen mother’s ghost banquet, namely that the zhang family are descended from a group of people millennia old (think xia dynasty or older, which makes sense given they were likely also the ones who built the original heavenly palace and the bronze gate in the shang dynasty c. 1600 BC, but that’s a tangent for another time) who ventured beneath the kunlun mountains, ate from the qilin fruit tree (aka the equivalent of the queen mother of the west of chinese myth’s peach tree), and rather than immediately turning into monsters like many who tried did, were special enough for some reason that they gained longevity instead at the cost of eventually, after maybe initially millenia, then progressively centuries, turning into monsters. some of those people then eventually ventured out from beneath the mountains into the vast world, later to form what would be known as the zhang family. but that’s all i’ll say on that

but back to king mu and the queen of the west

to start off, i feel it’s important to be aware that king mu of zhou isn’t a fictional character created by npss, rather he’s a real historical figure who actually existed and was an emperor of the western zhou dynasty (1046-770 BC) while it was at its peak (he himself probably reigned somewhere between 976 and 918 BC). as it happens, his connection to the queen mother of the west also isn’t something created by npss. references to the queen mother of the west go very far back (think shang dynasty mentioned earlier) and she’s one of the more prominent mythological figures in chinese tradition, who among other descriptors, is said to possess the secret of immortality in her garden of magical peaches that grant longevity in the kunlun mountains. either the queen of the west herself or her peaches make several appearances in chinese literature, maybe more famously for a western audience in journey to the west where sun wukong eats some of them and is punished for it

even the story of king mu of zhou and the queen mother of the west meeting is a retelling of another piece of fiction called the tale of king mu, son of heaven, dating back to at earliest the warring states period (since the original copy of it was found in a tomb dating back to the tail end of it). like in sand sea’s rendition of his story, historically king mu of zhou did travel a lot because he enjoyed making territorial conquests, to the extent that king mu of zhou is the one who ultimately expanded china’s territory both east and west beyond the central plains. in the fictional story of the tale of king mu, son of heaven however, king mu of zhou specifically seeks out the queen mother of the west in the kunlun mountains to gain her secret of immortality, and while she ultimately invites him to her jade pool for a banquet where they exchange gifts, she doesn’t give him one of her peaches

in the wang family’s version of this story, it’s explained to li cu that king mu of zhou didn’t care much for politics and preferred running around china as he pleased, ultimately seeking out the queen mother of the west for her famed elixir of immortality. where this version of the story diverges from the myth is that they supposedly ended up falling in love (Sand Sea Part III, Ch. 133, King Mu of Zhou)

king mu of zhou sought out the queen mother of the west because there had been legends even during king mu’s time of her having had this elixir of immortality for a very long time, which tells us at the very least that according to this story, the queen mother he met with was likely the queen mother of legend, or the one chinese mythology equates with a deity to some extent. she’s even further described as having dominion over all the kingdoms of the west, and that her great kingdom spanned from the kunlun mountains to even the qaidam basin, which is where tamutuo is located. i feel this tells us that the queen of the west of tamutuo and the queen mother of the west from king mu’s legend are one and the same. the fact she’s even referred to as “young” despite the breadth of her legacy reinforces the idea that there might be something unnatural about her

you could argue that maybe “queen mother of the west” was an inherited title, and that her kingdom of tamutuo was a matriarchal society that had had many queen mothers, but the fact is there’s no real supporting evidence of that any more than there is of the opposite despite the arguments put forward, so really, you could argue in favor of both. i like to think she was the queen mother of legend, if only because it creates, thanks to the inclusion of the kunlun mountains in her territory, a strong connection in some capacity with the first people cursed with intolerable longevity mentioned in queen mother’s banquet, but once again, take with a grain of salt

slight tangent, i will say however while i’m on this topic that i strongly feel that the zhang family are meant to be depicted as one more of many human corruption motifs that are rampant in dmbj. this is something for another meta, but i would argue that beneath the tomb raiding and the conspiracies, the core theme of dmbj is that “humans are more terrible than monsters”, and so the narrative provides ample examples of human corruption causing others far more misery than any tomb creature ever could. as per their origins talked about in queen mother’s ghost banquet, it’s possible that alongside their knowledge of whatever secrets of the universe they’re privy to, and their subsequent need for control over china’s destiny through the ages, the ancestors of the zhang family had initially ventured out from under the mountains to seek a cure for the side effects of their terrible curse, and gradually discovered that the bronze and jade of the meteorites could potentially provide that. maybe the queen mother of the west was one of their descendants, and perhaps one of the rare people who stand to succeed in that quest (that we know of at least considering she’s presumably still alive in some capacity down there along with chen wenjin and other members of the xisha expedition). just food for thought, but anyone who’s read that far feel free to give your thoughts on queen’s banquet related ideas!

the wang in charge of instructing li cu admits in the course of his tale that they had to make some assumptions (so this means you have to consider this bit to be a little handwavy admittedly) about what exactly the nature of the relationship between king mu of zhou and the queen mother of the west was, and settles on them having fallen in love despite king mu having “invaded” her kingdom and he did  invade it, because we conveniently have a single reference to this man outside of sand sea in book 5, when wu xie and xiaoge find murals in the ruins around wu sanxing’s abandoned camp that depict king mu’s invasion of tamutuo that was clearly hostile and was met with responding hostility (Book 5, Ch. 25-26, The Third Night: Relief / The Third Night: Déjà-vu)

it doesn’t mean that these narratives are mutually exclusive and can’t both be true, and that after having been defeated, either party asked for a truce that led to something else, but it does already suggest there might be more to this story than what we’re told of it. this idea somewhat confirms itself, again hinging on believing that the wang’s narrative is one close enough to the truth to be reliable, when li cu calls the romance spin on king mu’s and the queen mother’s story into question (Sand Sea Part III, Ch. 145, The Truth of the World). li cu suggests that the poem she supposedly gifted king mu (which i’ll get into in a little bit), as well as maybe the queen mother of the west herself and her secret of immortality, are all concepts fashioned and embellished by king mu of zhou to facilitate his grand plan which i’ll touch on later, all because he saw “the truth of this world” in the queen mother of the west’s kingdom, and sought not to reveal it to the world, but to conceal it, and build an entire nebulous plan with it at its core

i don’t feel like the queen of the west herself is a fabrication considering both the multiple references to her interspersed throughout various dmbj books, as well as tangible proof of her existence re: tamutuo, but the idea that king mu of zhou might have been the author of the tale of king mu, son of heaven and the subsequent romance plot derived from it in dmbj universe is something i can believe so long as you assume he believed it was one more component in his masterplan. i’m hesitant to call dmbj magical realism because magical realism is very much a western genre of literature and people would do well to remember that western constructs aren’t universally applicable, but dmbj does use a number of structural and thematic elements that magical realism also uses, and this subplot is no exception. contrary to what some might think, npss actually does a significant amount of research when he writes these books, and a lot of the supernatural or fictional tomb elements aren’t so much explained through handwavy science as they are derived from well-documented real historical events or figures, much like magical realism is heavily grounded in reality despite slightly deviating from it in believable ways. dmbj is deeply informed by chinese culture and history, more so than just using it as the backdrop to a fantasy adventure story: they’re integral parts of the plot, which i think is part of what makes dmbj so difficult to navigate without extensive knowledge of that backdrop (which i by the way don’t pretend to have either, my own knowledge is very much surface level all things considered)

in light of this, as far as the queen mother of the west goes, considering the relatively reliable outside account of a hostile invasion we get from the ruins of tamutuo itself, and then li cu’s own take on king mu’s and the queen mother’s relationship, while the romance spin isn’t necessarily entirely false, it does leave a lot of question marks as to what exactly king mu saw in the queen of the west’s kingdom. that he was given the gift of longevity is highly likely given he’s still alive centuries later, along with other key elements of the wang family’s story i’ll get to in a bit. however, the uncertainty in the nature of their relationship does potentially make the queen of the west’s motivations for offering king mu longevity if not just as uncertain, then potentially a little more sinister, since while she might have offered out of love, if we assume all her experimentations weren’t geared at gaining immortality for herself, but rather curbing the side effects of it, then her gift was very much a poisoned one as she knew full well what would happen to him if he used it. for all we know, king mu might have, on defeating the queen mother’s kingdom, inflicted the “truth of the world” and the curse of longevity on himself, and none of it was never a gift at all, but the consequences of his own actions. but all of this is just speculation in the end as there’s no solid evidence pointing in any one direction. in any case, the only potential insight we get into the queen mother of the west’s thoughts come from maybe the vaguest source yet, a poem she supposedly composed for king mu that she gifted him when they parted, and that merebear translates as follows:

White clouds in the sky, the hills emerge. The road is far away, between mountains and rivers. The child who is not dead, can still come back.

knowing how many layers of meaning can be crammed into classical chinese poetry, i had to go find the original text and investigate further, so let me also provide that:

白云在天，山陵自出。 道里悠远，山川间之。 将子无死，尚能复来。

full disclaimer before i continue, poetry and its nuances are notoriously difficult to translate in any language, and i’m not at all claiming to be proficient enough at the chinese language without outside resources to help me to ever claim to be an expert, but while merebear’s translation isn’t technically incorrect, it has a few possible double meanings missing and some word choices i’m not quite sure i understand, but this is only my own humble contribution (with some creative license in the english rendition) that anyone with better knowledge than mine is welcome to correct or add on to as this isn’t so much an attempt at retranslating as it is pointing out a few possible added implications:

白云在天，山陵自出。

the white clouds are in the sky/the heavens, the lofty mountains/the great tombs emerge of their own accord. 山陵 can also be used, and has been in chinese literature, to refer to tombs of people of significant importance as usually big tombs tend to form burial mounds, hence why it can also refer to ‘hills’

道里悠远，山川间之。

the way forth is distant, it winds amid the mountains and rivers ‘mountains and rivers’, mountains especially, are commonly associated with the chinese concept of immortals called 仙 xian that even has the radical for mountain in it, in part due to their reclusive nature. i would link the interesting study i have on that but it’s unfortunately not in english, though feel free to ask for it anyway if anyone is interested

将子无死，尚能复来。

one who leads does not die, he may yet return 将子 in this context technically means ‘general’ and 将 can even refer to the chief piece in chinese chess which you know. keeping that in my book of crazy convenient zhang parallels re: the qipan zhang

make of this what you will, but if nothing else, it does suggest a bit more explicitly that the double meanings are indeed referring to immortality and potentially tombs, though what nature of tomb is the real question in that case

we then go on to learn from the wang powerpoint presentation that king mu never returned to visit the queen of the west once he returned home, but that contrary to how things may seem, despite having being recorded as having died at the age of 105, king mu in fact did not died, meaning at some point after he’d taken the queen of the west’s immortality elixir, he faked his own death and disappeared somewhere. both the wang instructor and wang xiaoyuan (the girl who peeks at li cu out the window) confirm that according to the third and  final account of king shang of lu’s story, king mu wasn’t dead at the time of those events, as he worked together with king shang and iron mask to find the jade burial armor (Sand Sea Part III, Ch. 134, Deception)

this means he was spectacularly old by this point considering the warring states period starts at earliest in 476 BC. and king mu supposedly died around 918 BC. you do the math, but he was very very old. and to be honest this also somewhat feeds into the idea that the longevity curse (because it very much is a curse) used to last much longer before the side effects started to pop up, because if we’re to believe the wang family’s version of these events, then king mu was clearly still sane and not (or at least not entirely) a monster if he was still actively enacting the things he had planned

and so king mu, now long-lived because he took whatever immortality elixir the queen mother of the west gave him, had to face the consequences of that choice, yet rather than seek her out to find a way to quell the side effects of longevity (which he could have done and would have just ended up in the meteorite with her, although if he didn’t go to her, it gives a bit more weight to the idea that their story wasn’t necessarily a romance and/or that ulterior motives were involved), he went his own way to find something to save himself from turning into a monster, and eventually settled on finding a jade burial armor, which according to the wang family also came from the queen mother of the west’s kingdom. besides implying it’s likely that the jade armor is in fact made from the meteorite jade, it’s just one more thing to add to the long list of things tied to the heart of dmbj’s lore that end up having some form of association with the queen mother of the west. fun tidbit regarding this that’s not entirely relevant to anything (but it just adds more fuel to the crack theory), there’s an inscription on the belt of the green-eyed fox corpse where the qilin blood clot that wu xie accidentally swallows in book 1, and that merebear translates as “ruler of yinxi”, that reads as follows (Book 1, Ch. 21, Green-Eyed Fox Corpse):

阴西宝帝 or yinxi baodi

once again, take this with a grain of salt because this is an inscription that wu xie sees while he’s presumably under the influence of the green-eyed fox’s illusion, and instantly recognizes it as “a spell to ward off evil spirits”, so it might not mean anything, but if you had to find some kind of sense in it, while the characters together don’t really mean much of anything, separately they can mean:

阴 yin

opposite of 阳 yang, one of the two opposing energies in taoism and representative of many things, but namely of the feminine

西 xi

the west as cardinal direction

宝 bao

treasure, precious

帝 di

supreme being, often used in the titles and names of emperors such as huangdi (the yellow emperor) or qin shi huangdi (the first emperor of china). fun fact, wu xie during sand sea is often referred to as 邪帝 or emperor xie by the chinese fanbase in reference to how powerful he was during that time

i’m not saying this is meant to translate into a reference to the queen mother of the west because the association of characters is a bit strange, but again. food for thought (and a lot of creative license)

the wang powerpoint then goes on to explain that king mu’s objective, once he’d secured the jade armor, was to ensure both that he would be able to come back to the world fully rid of the side effects of immortality, and be able to do so safely, secure in the knowledge that the legacy of his findings would remain intact for him to find again. and so to do that, he essentially makes certain that chinese tradition incorporates the necessity of entombing people with a number of valuable things, and supposedly instigates this during the spring and autumn period (which is the period that precedes the warring states period and is generally considered to be one of extensive intellectual prosperity, confucius was a contemporary of that time for example) by, as the wang instructor implies, at least partially pushing to prominence things like the classic of rites (or lijing) that among other things promotes rich burials. while li cu calls into question the idea that king mu’s plan solely aimed at disseminating information for the sake of keeping his own acquired knowledge in circulation, since king mu’s further objective was also to use grave robbing to spread whatever information best served concealing “the truth of the world”, it’s clear that his plan was meticulously thought-out

the wang instructor himself admits this, though he quickly adds that king mu’s plan, crafty as it was if desperate, failed to take into account the possibility that he’d one day meet his match in the person of wang zanghai, who essentially hijacked his plan for his own purposes. i feel this seems to imply that things were going pretty smoothly for king mu of zhou until then, which would then call into question the first two versions of king shang of lu’s story if we assume king mu was the original wearer of the jade armor, albeit more recently than those stories presented it, but this is also where i start veering into big wild assumptions and crack theory territory. i won’t be get into the box with the baby or the particulars of the feud between the zhang family and wang zanghai/the wang family because while it’s tied to this, it also branches off into something else that’s probably a whole other meta and this is long enough as it is

it’s also worth noting that king mu of zhou, as well as instigating his masterplan, not only hid an elaborate map leading to the queen mother of the west’s kingdom only perceivable if you soak the stone slab it’s on “with a certain liquid” (which if you remember what happens in both book 8 in siguniang when wu xie and xiao hua gut a pig, and in tibetan sea flower where it’s wu xie who bleeds his special blood to reveal the secrets inside the bronze gate in tibet, gives you a hint at what the nature of that liquid might be), but wrote the details of his plan down on what’s called the yellow lu silkbook, not to be confused with the silkbook that wu xie pulls from “king shang of lu”’s coffin in book 1. merebear speculates it might be the silkbook that the photocopy jin wantang brings to him to kickstart the entire plot belongs to, and in my opinion that’s a good guess. it might also be one of the many silkbooks the lao jiumen pulled out of siguniang during the greatest joint tomb robbery in the 1960s. who knows really

all i can say about this particular part of the wang’s powerpoint lesson and the connection it shares with the multiple versions of the story of king shang of lu is that assuming the wang family’s version is both the most complete and the most accurate, then “king shang of lu” has a direct connection not only to king mu of zhou, but to the entirety of dmbj’s overarching plot. and while knowing who’s who at the end of the day doesn’t amount to much when much of dmbj’s story deals with the present day cast bearing the brunt of the consequences of their elders’ and older generations’ choices, i want to go further and say that this story potentially further cements connections and solidifies dmbj lore rather than complicate it

(wild conclusions tbc in part III of this madness)

[nclson]

can't make fogs one of those 'are you ___'s type' things bc it would be 24 free spaces and one that read 'have you ever in the past been mad at him for anything in the whole world?' and if the answer was yes then he wants to smooch so bad