#comic written by a white person who loves being racist

[tonixe]

I saw you were looking for The Boys requests. Please I beg of you ANYTHING between Firecracker and reader. She’s so beautiful and I need to be with her so bad! Literally anything you want to write. It’s just that NO ONE has written for her!!

♱ — country girl — ♱

A/N: Thank you for ur request, I also agree, nobody is writing about Firecracker, our country girl needs some love <3.

WARNING: cursing, tw: abortion, firecracker as a person, tw: tek knight, this might be crackfic sorry.

PAIRING: firecracker x reader

WORD COUNTER: 974

It was so boring at the Tek's Knight party, you were mindlessly taking glasses of alcohol served on a platter to guests that attended, mostly the room filled with important, rich, people of America.

Like you want to be here with these superficial assholes and fucking racists, you had better thing than to be here in this party but you were forced to attend. Most of the members of the seven were here, including you. Here you are, in a party filled with old people who controlled the country, you looked up at the seemingly staring Tek Knight portrait that was on display, "Creepy" You muttered, before you gulped down the content in the glass, swiftly placing it on the waltzing waiter passing by.

It was going to be a while till you were able to leave the party. It was an event where people were the best dressed and for you, the best dress was your costume, shut up and stay still while people talked to you, talking about nonsense and political matters you didn't care about.

You just nodded with a smile.

Tap your fingers on your glasses, looking for anything that can occupy your time. It wasn't the worst, free high-quality alcohol was being served, and interesting-looking food was being served around the party. You looked around the room of guests, and your eyes quickly landed on Homelander, Sage, and Neuman. You quirked your eyebrows at the scene, before taking a sip of the champagne in your glass.

"Hm," You exhaled, swirling the liquid in your glass. The sound of heels clicking on the floor took your attention. You looked up from your cup to see Firecracker walking by you, you didn't get to know a lot about her only to know that she was involved in pageants, hate Starfire maybe a pedophile. You kept your eye on her with amusement as she walked toward the group of supes.

You were way too curious about how the interaction was going to play out, especially with her introduction, it was almost comical.

Everyone in the group just stared at her awkwardly, it was all truly funny and made you laugh a bit. Then Sage dismissed her straight, I guessed it was something snarky towards her. You watched her as walked away quickly, it looked like she was upset about what Sage said. "Trailer trash, huh?" You gulped down your maybe 10th glass of the night and placed it on the walking waiter's tray before you strode to the dessert table.

You recognize the greeting butler of the house taking the cake. “Hey, are you going to take that?" You asked the butler holding the chocolate cake in his hand. "Yes, Miss H/N" He stated, “Would you like a slice?” He questioned, “No, actually I’ll take the whole cake” You shot him a smile, grabbing the cake from him. “Thanks for being such an American patriot” you exclaimed before you walked out to follow Firecracker.

You stepped out of the room where the party guests were. You followed Firecracker, you wanted to keep your steps as silent as possible maybe to surprise her a bit, maybe this was a bit creepy, a little at least. You hid behind one of the white columns, hearing the door behind her close with a 'click' sound.

You stepped out into the hallway, with the cake in hand. You paused for a moment when you reached the door. Before putting your ear near the door to hear sniffing coming from her you backed away. You hesitated to knock, so you just waited on the side of the door until she opened up.

Propping yourself up on the wall, it was a couple of minutes until she opened the door. It was evident she was crying with her tear-stained cheek and the reddening of her irises. Bounced off the wall, "God were you crying, you look like shit" You said bluntly, her brows furrowed when she heard the comment escaping you.

"Shit, my bad, cake?" You prominently offered the cake to her, she looked at it and then at you, "Is this a joke?" She said with her strong accent shining through as she spoke.

Narrowed her eyes at you.

"No, actually this was from the good of my heart, I saw the exchange between you and you know sage?' You said you heard her groan as you talked.

"So, are you going to tell me to drink Everclear or SunnyD" She exclaimed.

"Of course not, I was going to tell you to drink some Dr. Pepper and Jack Daniel" You grin at her smugly,

She furrowed her brows more, you got her pissed, "Jokes" You put up your free hand defensively, "But seriously, I saw you upset and what better way to calm down than with cake, especially chocolate cake" You grinned pointing at the chocolate cake in your hands.

"What in god green earth would make you think I would eat cake with you" She crossed her arms, "Geez if you put it that way...I just wanted to support a friend in need, since you are part of the seven, you know..so cake?" You offered her again before she looked at you and the cake.

"Fine"

..

"You know Sage is like a slithering snake, I just should known" Firecracker grumbled, taking a spoonful of cake and shoving it in her mouth, you hummed in agreement.

"The whole thing with the show and live cast with the starlight bullshit, should of fucking know" Firecracker finished,

"How did you...I mean she even gets information about Starlight abortion?" You asked, stabbing your fork in a piece of cake, Firecracker just shrugged it off, "I mean you took those punches like a champ" You said bluntly, Firecracker glared at you.

"Hey Y/N" You turned towards her,

"What?"

"Fuck you"

[jesncin]

As the number one J'onn fan(s) what do you think of jli. I find him so funny in it and he really gets to show off his leadership skills and his funny side. Sorry if this has already been asked before I love all your work.

We're very happy to be called the number one J'onn fans, thank you. This hasn't been asked before so no worries!

I have complicated feelings about J'onn in JLI. On one hand, JLI is a beloved team and absolutely got people to become fans of J'onn. On the other hand it popularized those fans into liking a version of J'onn I personally (half-affectionately) label "meme J'onn". He's got more humor and a chance to shine as the stoic straight man to everyone's silliness, but in the process he's undeniably flanderized and pigeon holed into that role. I categorize him under "Nostalgia J'onn" right there next to DCAU J'onn. I get that people enjoy J'onn as team dad, but the reason he's getting phased out a lot is because being a team player with weak solo potential doesn't keep a character relevant.

I think that's why I struggle discussing his character with MM fans who primarily like him through the DCAU or JLI, they like him for what he brings to a team, and the impression + intrigue he gives off as a potentially interesting character. It's why many (generalizing) DCAU + JLI fans loudly wonder why we aren't getting more Martian Manhunter content from DC. "I haven't really read any of his solos but he seems so cool and powerful and funny in the League stuff" yeah because if you actually read any of his solos you'd recognize how he falls a part the second he has to hold the whole stage himself.

This is a necessary tangent but it's also hard to enjoy how his character is written in older comics when you headcanon him as Black or Black coded. So much of MM fandom is nostalgically attached to J'onn playing team therapist straight man. Which, is a common role white people love tokenizing the One Black Member of a Team into. JLI introduced the whole Choco/Oreo thing with J'onn, which would lead to Ostrander flanderizing it later in his solo. Oh, J'onn is genetically predisposed to be addicted to cookies and then becomes hulk-rage level of violent when they're stolen? That certainly pairs badly with how Black and brown people are profiled through racist drug policies as being "more violent". Oh, this is considered an endearing part of MM lore that his fans love pointing out any chance they get? Because they don't really know anything else about him? Ugh.

I generally have a hard time with team comics because I like jumping into my niche character solos to see how they really tick on their own. Especially when it comes to J'onn, my brain just keeps flipping the pages until I spot a green man lol. But I am trying with JLI since it's so beloved! These overall things just get in my way of fully enjoying it.

[thedevotionaltour]

oh we all saw that slur replacement patch post didnt we

YEP what prompted my post about that was friend davie vernard getting an ask that was like (still unknown to me if that was a funny anon from a friend or genuine) going homestuck is queer history die mad about it and it's liiiike. i think my summary is so much about bc since it was a homestuck prompted post it's like. so much i think of a lot of fandom discourse around that could be snipped if we didn't try to pretend homestuck is something other than what it is. don't pretend it isn't a comic with offensive elements It Is. plain simple fact. product of time and author views. but more than anything what i mean by that is alongside that comment is i wish we stopped trying to market homestuck as like crazy cool queer webcomic and that's why it's important but rather acknowledge that if we wanna approach it this way it's important bc it was huge for WEBCOMIC HISTORY!!!!!!! what makes homestuck stick out within pop culture is how it functioned in the webcomic sphere and the large influence it had!!!! if we acknowledge it for being significant in like pop culture history for that as opposed to trying to go wait noooo guys my interest is secretly progressive or can be made that way i think ppl would give homestuck a lot less flack. it's like how undeniably important movies and literature in history also has like, horrible views on race and misogyny etc etc. they're inescapable in a lot of things though that doesn't detract from it's like, significance or even fan enjoyment As A Thing. i think that's really hard to grapple for ppl who don't necessarily engage in like the actual history side of fandom and entertainment bc they're so used to it as. well i don't know i don't know how to describe what im saying but it's like it feels so personal to them instead of going this is a thing i like but it also exists in a far broader context than me alone. this isn't quite it but i really don't know how to say what i mean im so so sorry. im not saying homestuck is this evil thing that should never be spoken of im just asking others to not act like hussie doesn't have some terrible views reflected in offensive writing and statements he's made about his comic and through his comic.

like god knows i love a lot of shit that doesn't age well and is quite offensive. my current biggest example for this is literally the comic kick-ass. as much as i rag on it i do in fact really enjoy this comic. it appeals to a lot of my cynical superhero loving nerd senses. i don't kid when i call my interest in comics my cishet white guy nerd interest, bc even though comics are for everyone, this comic appeals to that extremely particular part of me. it is the embodiment of annoying white nerd comic. however. this comic was also written in the mid 2000s by white guy mark millar. is is very offensive and relies on a ton of offensive edgy humor. it is terribly racist and homophobic and many other things. i do not let this detract from my experience and engagement with it however and rather let it inform me on how to approach it and what type of people i can recommend it to. it's far more ephemeral in comparison to like, the huge impact homestuck has, but it's my Personal Experience Comparison.

tldr we should stop trying to make things we love things they are not in order to get others to look at it too and by denying what goes on in them takes away from a lot of meaningful discussion to be had and also makes people understandably upset with you.

also i wish we for real acknowledged how homestuck functions as a comic history thing i think that has more value than going but my queer comic. at least for homestuck. bc while i know there are in fact queer elements in it i also know it's So Complicated and i don't know enough to touch on it. but for real. fandom and entertainment and comic history is cool and also if you talk about it that way i think everyone will cut that fandom some slack bc hate it or love it it has an undeniable place within comic history in the webcomic sphere. so you at least have an accurate history defense on your side. Ok I'm just repeating myself a bunch now SORRY

[rikomoriyama01]

kinda inspired by that response u did to someone else's post. but like. it just reminded me of how different Americans see nationality/ethnicity/race to other people, and how it can come through in the things they write.. like especially fanfiction. like how everyone who isn't a white American (and sometimes even those that are) can just become stereotypes. nicky is repeatedly a victim of this, ive read so many fics that just 'exaggerate' the fact that he's Mexican, even though it makes no sense! nicky has lived in America and Germany his whole life, his dad's a racist and his mum barely speaks to him, he'd be almost completely disconnected from Mexican culture realistically, and u can kinda see that in the books. but in fics, they make him like only eat stereotypical Mexican food, speak Spanish, listen to music in Spanish... like it's nuts. they do it to riko too except he becomes the Japanese mafia racial stereotype instead. Jean suddenly being obsessed with all things French, ranting about baguettes, even though canonically he has no good memories of France and seemingly wants nothing to do with the country or culture. it drives me crazy. like. even with neil 😭 he's canonically white and American, lived in America his whole life, but suddenly a British mother means he has a strong British accent and complains about how people make tea.

am I crazy?? its like almost comical levels of stereotyping, you'd think they'd be doing it for a bit, and that post just kinda reminded me of it.

the neil vs Jean British vs French thing is crazy too. I've never heard a British and French person argue over their countries under the age of like 60. but in so many fics, usually raven neil fics, its all they wanna talk about. wtf!!

everybody who could be classed as even slightly not "100% American" suddenly becomes a stereotype. and yknow the thing that rlly gets me? the accents are always exaggerated and always mentioned. nicky has a strong Mexican accent, neil has a strong British accent, and so on... but the "100% American" characters can be from varying parts of America with widely different accents (and cultures), but you'd never know it because the writer never mentions them even having an accent. it's just so blatant and shameless, and they don't even seem to realise they're doing it. they'll have other Americans in the comments being like "I love your British neil 🥰🥺" that is not neil. that is a stereotype.

even the books themselves to a lesser extent do this... like I'm pretty sure Jean having a French accent is mentioned. which isn't bad in and of itself, but a lot of the foxes are from different parts of America but again no accent differences ever mentioned. :/

all of this in every fucking fandom just for the record the og post we talked about was written by non American but it's just .. fandom think that is repeated by people as stupid fucking joke like yes it is very normal for immigrants to move to different country and still care and cultivate their traditions but then you look at how fandom represent it and like ... the rest of the world sees you and thinks you are fucking weird for handling it this way ✌️✌️✌️

[brw]

isn’t the grim reaper an openly racist white supremacist

I'm not going to sit here and lie by saying no, but I'm also not going to sit here and lie by saying yes, either. Eric Williams / Grim Reaper is a F-tier Marvel Comic villain whose only justification for staying around past V&SW/WCA is his relationship with Simon, who is already a C-tier hero. This means he does not have a consistent characterisation within these issues, and because Eric is kind of a lame villain all things considered, nobody particularly cares about having a consistent characterisation the way they do with big name villains like Ultron.

Anyway, yes, in the V&SW and WCA plot that sought to put the question of Vision and Simon's relationship to rest once and for all, Eric was racist. Not mutant racist or robot racist, capital R Racist. This was mostly a character detail specific to this arc; it never came up before, and I can't remember any extensive times it really came up after. Of course, it is powerful subtext to his relationship with Nekra, and if you're analysing that relationship it's a major component of their dynamic. Outside of that, writers have always focused on the fantasy racism against mutants and synthezoids rather than real world Actual racism, probably because it's easier and more comfortable for writers to do. Does it make sense for his character that he would be racist? I think so, yes. With a man as abrasive and ass-backwards as he usually is portrayed, it's not much of a stretch (although his racism, while not benign, has never really been put at white supremacy levels, so I'm not sure where that's coming from? His rhetoric has never really went down those avenues, or at least I've never read them as such) but equally it does take away from the most interesting parts of Eric's characterisation, and while I do love this arc it's definitely the beginning of the end of interesting Eric characterisation and shows the move from being a F-tier, but narratively interesting and complex character to being Guy With A Scythe Hand and a death motif.

You see, one of the more interesting parts of Eric's characterisation was that despite being incredibly unstable and abrasive, he was very genuine in his love for Simon and his desire to right the wrong of his death. Villains motivated by love above all else weren't particularly common in Avengers comics at the time, and throughout the initial run of his appearances there's this sense that if things had been a little different, he could have been a force for good. He protects Vision repeatedly when they meet each other, and for those early appearances seems largely hesitant to actually hurt Simon. Simon even says this at the end of the V&SW/WCA arc.

There's this idea that in another life Eric could have been a force for good instead of one for evil, that his motivation is true and genuine and it is just the warped ways he's attempted to reach his goals that are the problem, that I personally found really interesting with Eric. Martha even says if you'd asked her when they were children, she would have said Eric would be the hero, implying again that he wasn't just demented and murderous from birth, the way writers after have retconned him to be.

Simon also suggests that in another life, Eric could have been a Nazi hunter.

Ultimately Eric is not a character consistently written, because of his obscurity. If Englehart wants him to be racist, that works. If Roy Thomas wants him to be a shambling corpse of a man who has lost his soul after one too many dealings with death, why not. If Frank Tieri wants him to be a master manipulator who in turn gets his strings pulled by those more experienced than him, that's what's going to happen. If Remender wants just a generic psychopathic demented murderer, that's what he's going to be, and nobody is going to complain or say otherwise. And if I want Eric to be a Greek tragedy, well I can do that too.

[dew1s]

kay so i know you haven't asked me, but there's been something that's been bugging me, and it's about the batfandom.

for the most part, i DESPISE the batfandom.

the main reason: "It's ALWAYS racism"

every. single. time. someone. in. the. batfam. is. a. poc. there's. racism.

"oh, cass doesn't have enough personality! it's because the writers are racist!"

"damian is portrayed as feral because he's brown!"

"signal doesn't have any other hairstyle because he's BLACK and the writers are AFRIAD cuz they're RACIST!!"

bruh.

idk if you agree with them, and if you do, i'd love to debate you! (amicabaly)

and it seems to me that there's such simple explanations, especially for the damian one.

maybe (and here me out on this one) it's because. . . he was raised by the laugue of assassins. who kill people. and he's basically a baby and we all know how babies are. it's so simple. also, damian is a pretty grumpy-looking kid, and it's easy to show grumpy people as feral.

anyway, yes, i don't want this to turn into a rant, though i fear that it has regardless, so have a good day! and one question-who's your least fav dc character?

This is a great ask!

Now I'm not gonna deny that there is racism in dc comics because there definitely is.

I can't necessarily speak on Duke and cass although I think cass does have a personality so I'm not sure where fans are getting that from lol and Duke is one of my favourite batman characters and I think hes really well written despite not being including in many comics.

However I can definitely speak on damian. I don't have an issue with how damian is written. It makes sense that he acts the way he does. He was raised to be a weapon and praised for his ruthlessness. Of course he's gonna act 'feral'. And his character has developed a lot over time. I'm happy that he isn't a copy and paste of the other Robins.

I do have a problem with how damian is drawn though. Talia is brown. Bruce is white. Realistically Damian should have a skin colour in the middle. So why does he look identical to Tim? Why does he have no ethnic features. It's a bit irritating for the only arab robin to have that aspect of him erased.

And don't get me started on Grant Morrisons character assassination of Talia.

I don't think it's fair to blame everything on racism but there is definitely some remnants of racism that come with a franchise so old.

And I think Juni Ba's 'The Boy Wonder' is a really well written Damian story which I would 100% recommend. (Sneaking in a plug for a really good comic >:] )

Anyway that's my opinion :)

And when it comes to least favourite dc character I've genuinely been sat trying to think of one but I can't think of any. There's loads that I'm indifferent towards and ofc I hate characters but not in the sense that they're badly written if you get what I mean. Maybe I'll come back again later when I've thought of someone. But I'd love to know who ur least favourite dc character is!

[semper-legens]

27. Thank You, Jeeves, by P.G. Wodehouse

Owned: No, library Page count: 263 My summary: Thanks to his insistence on playing the banjolele, Bertie Wooster has been 1) kicked out of his flat and 2) dumped by Jeeves. But not to worry. He's out into the country, where nothing can go wrong! Except maybe love triangles, wacky escapades, imprisonment on a yacht, forced marriages, and a distinct lack of butter. Just his lucky day. My rating: 3/5 My commentary:

You know, despite my usual tastes in literature and my general predilection for the stuffy English gentleman, I've never actually engaged with any Jeeves and Wooster. I've seen clips from the Steven Fry/Hugh Laurie show, as every English person is legally required to, but I've never actually sat down to read any Wodehouse myself. Well, one of my coworkers is currently working her way through Jeeves and Wooster, and decided that I'd like it too. So, on her recommendation, I've gone in blind with this book. Let's see what it's like!

First off - Wodehouse's voice is delightful. Archaic without being impenetrable, sardonic and drawling, punning and witty in all the right ways. I was charmed and captivated from the start, not less because of how full-on it is right out of the gate. It's a very droll writing style, the kind that was definitely a spawn of the 30s; I can't imagine someone writing like that now except to satirise. Still, it's wonderfully charming. And Wooster himself is well-characterised as a complete brainless twit. He actually had a lot more heart than I was expecting from what I knew of his character, but he's still a big idiot who doesn't ever help himself out of any situation at all.

Also, like, I know calling Jeeves and Wooster gay isn't exactly the hottest of takes, but it surprised me just how gay it was. Seriously, Jeeves says that he's got a policy of never working for a married man. I can't be the only one reading implication into that. And he's always at Wooster's beck and call, even in this book where he's not technically working for him. (More on that in a bit.) And Wooster is not all that put out that the eligible young lady who is also his ex in this book isn't into him. In fact, he goes out of his way to avoid getting into a relationship with her! Any tension between them is coincidence and awkward encounters. Just…so gay.

Unfortunately with literature written in the early 1900s, and particularly literature by white people, you're gonna get some racism. In this book, it takes the form of the banjolele and the blackface. The former is the inciting incident for the novel; Wooster has to move to the country because he has taken up playing the banjolele, a cross between a banjo and a ukulele. Everyone hates the noise, but it's the instrument itself that's brought up as being the problem. Jeeves, in particular, hates it. The racial connotations of this can't be ignored - the banjo is associated with black Americans, where obviously the ukulele is a native Hawaiian instrument. But more egregiously, Wooster spends half the novel 'comically' in blackface. There is a never-seen troupe of minstrels referred to with the n-word - whether they are actually black or white people in blackface is unclear from the text, but apparently that was the contemporary term for blackface performers. And every person who sees Wooster in blackface assumes he's a devil and screams and runs away, again 'comically'. Look, I know this was written in 1934, but honestly I don't care. This is just straight-up racist. The idea of Wooster being blacked up is treated as hilarious rather than insulting, and of course not a single actual person of colour shows up at all. It leaves a sour taste in my mouth, the casualness of these stereotypes and this behaviour. It's just bad. (And apparently, the TV episode based on this book also had the blackface in 1991. Plus ca change…)

Next, we're off to the Arctic, where there's a haunting on a beached ship…

[trickstarbrave]

i have a lot of thoughts about "problematic" media and the dumb fucking "pro-ship vs antis" discourse that are probably disjointed bc i am half awake

for one i wanna preface this with: i think it is good actually to critique problematic elements in any media. movies, games, comics, tv shows, even fanfiction. if you think me saying something is "problematic" means i think it should be outlawed and banned and i personally want you, a fan of that thing, to die and i support suicide baiting you, you are just as braindead as the people you claim to hate. you are annoying. this post is not for you and is in fact also about you. you are a tar pit.

there is a vocal minority of people who do in fact see any depiction of something bad and think it has to be condoning it. they are genuinely few and far between, but they are VERY vocal, and typically very young. but i think after looking at how these people thing and present arguments, i really understand why they think this

depiction, if you are something with any critical thinking skills, does not inherently condone or condemn its subject matter. it can condone it, yes, but it can also condemn it. typically a story is mature enough to depict certain things, it is doing so for a reason and has a lot of nuance and shows if it condemns or condones it in indirect ways. for example in a very clear cut way: slasher films show a killer murdering people. they are screaming and dont want to be killed and try to stop him or run away. it is supposed to make you, the audience, feel bad and go 'well i wouldnt wanna get killed'. but at no point does someone look at the camera and go "killing people is wrong and should not be condoned. people dont like being killed".

this gets a bit more messy in other topics that are commonly normalized or go under the radar like racism and abuse. ultimately i think many stories that are "problematic" arent really done that way on purpose, hence why i dont believe in attacking the people who made that story for these things. a lot of times these things sneak their way in subconsciously or by pure carelessness. example: i do not think all of the designers for skyrim are racist white supremacists who intentionally made this story to be a perfect recruiting and radicalization tool for white supremacists. skyrim is a story about fantasy pop culture vikings in fantasy pop-culture viking land where you kill dragons. however there are also elves, which oppose the fantasy pop culture vikings and the vikings hate, and a civil war where many of the fantasy vikings want to purge and non-pop culture fantasy viking out of magical fantasy viking land. that shit is like catnip to white surpremacists. they love that shit. ultimately skyrim is just written badly. at no point was that the INTENTION behind the game, but it has been used to radicalize a lot of white guys and also is still beloved by white supremacists for these reasons.

ultimately that example is one most people im talking about wouldnt even get though, because it requires a lot of thought, understanding of how white supremacy operates, how we even got the concept of "vikings" in our larger pop culture (it was nazis, lol) and that those concepts are wildly inaccurate, etc. instead these kinds of critiques go after very overt depictions of subject matter or literally children's media.

and i think there is a very real reason why they do this i have come to realize: not only do they not know how to critically think, actually trying to think critically even in the slightest is mentally exhausting to them. by this i don't mean "ha ha they are stupid and lazy" i mean they genuinely dont understand critical thinking. at all. like they lack media literacy entirely. ive heard dumb takes from these people like "symbolism is trying to hide/bury the themes of a story" or "because the abuse in this story is metaphorical it doesn't count". they dont understand the parts of a story and why they are utilized as literary devices and actively resent having to think about the things presented to them.

this is a larger cultural issue. i see it beyond just self aggrandizing, black and white morality faux activists. you can see it in spaces of pretty much any political view or in any community: a lack of understanding of how to break down information and stories to evaluate it. we all have a tendency towards bias and they familiar and things that make us comfortable, but these people are on a whole other level. thinks like metaphor are seen as nothing more than lies and detraction used to obscure information rather than help build information up. understanding nuance, personal flaws, deeper intentions, and how you actually convey complex information is completely beyond them.

they live, ultimately, to just drink up content and media while having to think as little as humanely possible. they crave exciting stories but with extremely simplistic meanings and those stories just don't exist. because confronting these topics means rethinking their entire world view, be they extremely insular "leftists" or right leaning morons. it means admitting maybe they are not always right and perfect in more complex ways than simple mistakes a 4 year old would make. even when people like to bitch and moan that "depicting something doesn't mean you inherently condone it" they don't give examples on how you can tell. they don't talk about how personal biases can contribute to a story condoning it when the author does not consciously believe it. unconscious biases aren't even necessarily harmful, but going unchecked they can evolve to full on bigotry, born out of a refusal to admit you can be wrong about things and things are allowed to make you uncomfortable without being a personal attack on you.

because again, this thought pattern exists to preserve the ego and to think as little as possible. admitting things have nuance means admitting EVERYTHING can have nuance. that maybe the people who hurt you are not all irredeemable monsters or that you were the villain in someone else's life. that people you love to attack for moral superiority are complex individuals with their own lives and experiences.

this thought process is ultimately AGAINST accountability too. things are bad because they are bad. there are no pieces that give it nuance, the existence of them is either morally good or morally bad. which means if you think of yourself as morally good, as we all like to, that means you can never, EVER admit to doing something "morally bad", intentionally or not. i saw it recently with mods for a community refusing to admit they did something racist (attacking a black woman and making her life miserable) and would instead rather burn the community down with them while whining about they feel "unsafe" because people said that behavior was unacceptable, wanted them to apologize to the person harmed, and put steps in place to keep it from happening again. which is basic accountability. but that requires thinking about your actions, why they happened, that it doesn't make you an irredeemable monster who can never be better ever, and accept responsibility for what you did.

it is protection of biases and your own beliefs rather than challenging them. to think critically we need to know how to break these things down, evaluate them individually, how they work in a larger whole, and why these things are being told to us. maybe people refuse because they are comfortable in their biases. maybe people are comfortable in their biases and dont like acknowledging them because they dont understand critical thinking and media analysis. maybe its both. i dont really know.

all i know is it is annoying and maybe we really need to by and large teach people literary analysis and critical thinking skills from the ground up. because i cannot keep looking at the same brain dead takes in every community about how symbolism exists to obscure and metaphors are actually lies because "why not just be literal" and watch people make the dumbest moral arguments on both sides of any debate

[spider-xan]

I liked Spider-Gwen at first, but then actually read the comics and they weren't. That Good. She is a good character in ITSV/ATSV, but idk I still feel indifferent about her. And she's been, once again, relegated to just The Love Interest by the majority of fans. Regular Gwen is Peter's love interest and Spider-Gwen is Miles' love interest. Nothing else. It wouldn't bug me if people weren't so obsessive about her, most fans are like "Gwen HAS to be there she HAS to we NEED Gwen!!!!" and it's very annoying. It especially annoyed me that people were drooling about the fact that Insomniac might (or might not) include her and make her Miles' age, so they can be together. Completely disregarding the fact that Hailey exists.

I like her design and all, but she's very meh to me, speaking as a woman myself. Beside the things I've mentioned, my biggest gripe with her that she feels like a completely different character and not a variation of Gwen Stacy. With alternate versions of Peter, while they feel slightly different, they still have the character's essence. The only thing she shares with the OG Gwen is the blonde hair and name, she might as well could've been an OC.

Yeah, this actually is p much how I feel about Spider-Gwen as well tbh! I actually do remember when she debuted and it was coming off hot from the massive spike in mainstream popularity she got after the first TASM film came out in 2012, and I think a major selling point was that her comics would explore what if Gwen lived and got spider superpowers - so I was surprised when I read the comic and aside from having blonde hair, a strong personality, and a cop father, she was basically a new character, rather than if 616!Gwen had a different life; I know a big Spider-Man fan on here wrote a really good meta post examining why Spider-Gwen fell flat for her that I don't have the link for on hand right now, but I remember it discussed the odd choice of taking away Gwen's science skills from 616 when that was a trait that set her apart back in the 1960s and would have been interesting to explore if she had spider powers.

But yeah, like, I would consider myself on the flexible side with adaptations instead of being a strict textual purist, but I agree that you do have to keep a core spirit to a character or else they may as well be a new character with a superficial resemblance, and that's what Spider-Gwen felt like to me - if she had been branded as Spider-Liz Allen or just a new Spider-Woman, I wouldn't have thought of her as actually being a Gwen with someone else's name.

And yeah, you're right that Gwen in general often gets reduced to a love interest who doesn't exist independently of Peter or Miles. (My controversial TASM opinion is that she's not really written as an independent character so much as the perfect girlfriend for nerds.) In Miles' case, it also happens in reverse where the non-Black fandom struggles to think of him as a character separate from Gwen, in stark contrast to how Peter is not treated that way by fandom unless they're hardcore shippers who only ship - and then yeah, you get misogynoir like people screaming, 'Where is Miles' girlfriend??', re: Insomniac Spider-Man 2 while posting a picture of Spider-Gwen and erasing Hailey.

Anyway, yeah, I agree she does not and should not be in everything, and it honestly bugs me when people try to point at Miles by comparison and act like she's on par with his importance when she's not - Miles was groundbreaking and still important to this day on a meta level bc he was an Afro-Latino Spider-Man who became THE Spider-Man in his universe and took Peter's place originally amidst a lot of racist backlash to that change in the (Ultimate comics) status quo, whereas Gwen is far from the first white woman Spider-Woman, nevermind the only one, like, no, she is not the Miles Morales of (white) women.

[nearmidnightannex]

Normally, I'd just delete this, given other issues that have been noted. However, as this is a reblog, and I don't see any way to delete that, let me append some caveats, instead.

First, it will be interesting to see how this all winds up. However, as Bleeding Cool notes in their article "Bill Willingham Replies To DC Comics' Reaction To Public Domain Fables": ...Bill Willingham, choosing to state that his comic book series Fables was to be considered public domain, when it is using almost entirely public domain characters anyway, was chutzpah of the highest order. From Snow White to Jack Frost to Red Riding Hood, albeit given a noir filter, that was kind of the point of Fables at DC Comics. They also note that the specific caveats that he adds -- that the stories themselves are NOT public domain -- may not actually be how releases to the public domain work (which, one suspects, will be Warner/DC Comics argument when this goes to court, which it almost certainly will).

Apart from that, cheering for Willingham may be difficult, as he is ... a deeply problematic person to cheer for. From that same article:

...And also, the internet rediscovered that Bill Willingham is a prominent right-wing conservative commentator, who has written for Breitbart, attends conservative comic book conventions, and has expressed pro-Israeli, anti-abortion and anti-trans opinions and sympathies, sometimes in the comic books themselves, as well as participating in a rather controversial comic con panel at the time... -- Henry Barajas: ... Letting Hansel and Gretel fall into public domain is not noteworthy… The problem with the comic book industry is all of you blindly supporting a bigot just because he's letting Hansel and Gretel go into public domain. Racists supporting racists. -- Jennifer de Guzman: "I'm not saying a misogynist, transphobic right-wing comics writer who once wrote for Breitbart deliberately tricked people into thinking he's some kind of hero of the working class, but I am saying that the only part of that I'm not sure of is "deliberately." -- Biskeletal: As someone who really loved Fables, Bill Willingham being into climate change denial stuff is baseline disappointing, but him liking transphobic rhetoric feels extra sh-tty given the work of Lilah Sturges on the Fables universe.

As I mentioned to @violetimpudence, I'm treating this on the stopped clock principle ... albeit a stopped-clock with some unusual damage. Is he correct that the company should not be allowed to abuse people who sign with it? Well, yes, clearly, although what those abuses actually were is unclear at the moment. And that's pretty much where the clock stopped. Is he correct that he can release something into the public domain when much of what he was talking about was already public domain, there are some parts where he has clearly no right to release them without DC's consent, and it's not clear what actually can be released to the public domain? That will likely be decided in court. Beyond that ..... eww. Ick, even.

HOLY SHIT WHAT???

[imperiuswrecked]

What is the difference between fanon Namor and well written, in character Namor?

Fanon!Namor - misogynistic, alpha male, Chad, will fuck anyone and not care about them aka womanizer, racist, arrogant asshole to the point of him being super cruel for laughs, straight white male self insert fantasy, rapist.

Canon!Namor - noble, confident, respects women, has both good and bad sides; can be soft and emotional, can be hard and closed off emotionally. Arrogant as fuck but backs up his arrogance with his character, like yes he knows he is the best so you peasants should fawn at his feet, has a kind heart, is cold/cruel to those who have harmed those under his protection/are not worthy of his respect, hates bullies and nazis, flirty and charming, loyal, honest to the point he doesn't sugar coat his thoughts, deeply lonely and tragic.

A lot of people think Namor is this weird creepy incel who sexually assaults women and treats them like trash, and makes other men look like Betas, when he isn't and has actually only been in three long term romances and each time they ended (with their deaths) it hurt him alot.

Or people think he is racist because he drowned Wakanda when he was possessed by the Phoenix Force.

Or people think he's a bad character because they personally don't like his character traits: Does Namor have character flaws? Yeah, alot of them, he's headstrong, one of the most arrogant characters you will ever meet, he isn't shy about killing people he deems necessary to kill so you won't find him conflicted about murder, he is not a humble character even if he does have moments of being humble. People who don't read his comics by writers who get his character won't see the moments he lets down the salty crusty shield around his heart and shows his softer side, he deeply cares for his people, he cares about the oceans, and wild creatures/animals. He likes animals more than he likes people. Namor has severe emotional trauma, canon ptsd, and suffers from bouts of depression. He suffered bullying and abuse as child for being half human/atlantean. He was canonically raped by his wife's murderess. Yet no matter what happens he still puts the lives of the people he has under his protection before his own, he'll use his own body as a shield for those who need it, and he never gives up.

People will read Namor written by writers who don't know his backstory or character beats and never read a comic where he plucks a baby flamingo out of polluted water and looks on in horror at the devastation humans have done to nature, or carries dying atlantean children in arms, or vows to watch over his friends grave, or stands up for his friend others deem is a monster and want to send them into space because Namor knows what its like for others to treat him like a monster, or they don't see his fun impish side, or a bunch of other little moments that make up who he is. They don't see that a lot of the times when Namor is angry at the surface world he has legitimate reasons to be upset and isn't just some crazy sea king.

All they see is a cold cruel sneering king who wants to fuck a married woman and drown wakanda.

I usually judge how writers write Namor by how they have him treat women, because Namor is one of those characters who was raised by a single mother, he connects with women more than with men characters, alot of his supporting cast had a lot of dynamic women. Fans who get upset that Namor was mean to their faves are weak. Namor isn't going to like or get along with any men characters who hasn't proven themselves to him meanwhile he is generally more trusting of women.

Namor isn't an easy character, and not everyone vibes with a character like him. I do, and I deeply love Namor's character.

A lot of Fanon!Namor is a result of people not reading his comics and seeing what a complex and interesting character he is so they reduce him to one or two traits. Marvel Writers are not exempt to their Fanon!Namor writing, because there are writers who do the character really well in a way that lines up with the general 80 years of characterization and others who just want to use him for their plots and not care about his character.

It's frustrating as a fan to see this constant trashing of his character from fans, and from Marvel, but I honestly feel sorry for people who don't get to see what a morally complex and interesting character Namor is.

[soleminisanction]

You seem like youre frustrated with her character the same way I get with her too.

I think see the potential of the character she could be and should be with the correct writing and stories.

I really didnt like her Batgirl run either. There are bits and parts of it I do like and concepts of things there I love but I really dont care for it.

I also wish she wasnt used as a marketing tactic during "run" as Robin. If they were actually serious about it, they wouldve written her run differently and hopefully better.

Thats also the problem with all comic book characters, they have so many different writers with different ideas of what to do with these characters. Unfortunately some of them dont like the characters they write for. I know that Dan Didio hates Steph and never wrote her well because of that. (He also hated Dick Grayson and wanted to kill him off too)

Characters like Steph really are up to interpretation how they are supposes to be personality wise. Recently i havent been liking how shes been written for certain comics (Batgirls, Wayne Family Adventures)

You and I similar to seeing a character we want to be better. I see that she has all this potential to be a great character and love her despite all the garbage writing shes had over her 30+ years of existence

The lack of good stories is a part of it, yeah.

It's also the fact that, while she's hanging around not telling any stories of her own, her ability to do so often comes at the expense of other characters. Like a few months back, they randomly shoved her into a Titans line-up when she's never been a Titan, not once in her entire career, while the actual Batgirl who joined the Titans, Betty/Bette Kane, was nowhere to be seen. And she's part of what ruined YJ 2019, getting forced in awkwardly purely because a bunch of her stans spent months harassing the creators on Twitter, spewing racist epitaphs at the new black characters and demanding that she be included in a team she wasn't solicited for and, again, had never been a part of, purely because Tim was there and they decided he wasn't allowed to have a life without her.

And speaking of that last bit, don't even get me started on the Tim Drake Pride Special again or we'll be here all day. It is genuinely offensive how many people demanded that Tim's coming out be oriented entirely around the feelings of his straight ex-girlfriend.

That's why I can't read Batgirls, either. I can't stand the way they write the relationship between Steph and Cass, it's got no teeth, and perpetually reduces Cass to Steph's "Kato," the hyper-competent Asian sidekick who does all the actual work for an inept white person. Even the issue where they tried to make a big deal out of, "Ooo, this is a special CASS CENTRIC ADVENTURE, we're doing it COMPLETELY SILENT with NO WORDS!" turned out to be all about her running around trying to find Stephanie, and then they copped out with the gimmick and made it so the only words in the book were Stephanie's, talking mostly about -- surprise! -- herself, how great she is and how much she loves being a Batgirl.

Ugh. Spirit World can't come fast enough.

Honestly, when it comes to her run as Robin, I think the story itself could've been just fine if they'd left it as it was and just, hadn't made a big freakin' marketing deal about "OoOoOooOooOoo, the GIRL WONDER, how SPECIAL!!!" They didn't do that with Carrie. Or Tris Plover. Hell, at the time a few people pointed out how silly it was for them to make such a big deal out of her being a girl when Carrie Kelly is the most well known alt-Robin period and the co-star of one of the defining texts of the age.

But, y'know, Carrie was a short-haired butch tomboy with thick glasses who fought with a sling-shot, while Steph is the single most gender-conforming Bat-femme since Betty Kane and is consistently drawn to show off her child-bearing hips so. Yeah.

The part that honestly needs fixing is War Games, which I honestly think is still something that Steph needed to happen, because it did lead her to a moment of growth that she desperately needed (even if Chuck Dixon and Bryan Miller later ruined it.) I think you could fix that story up with just a few adjustments. But, hindsight is 20/20 and all.

I do have to caution a little against attributing malice where ignorance or incompetence is more likely, though. I've never seen any evidence that Dan Didio "hated" either Steph or Dick; rather, what he saw them as was expendable. By all accounts I've ever heard, when he was editorially mandating Dick's death in Infinite Crisis, he legitimately didn't know that Dick used to be the original Robin, he just knew that Nightwing wasn't Batman or Robin and thought that made him expendable enough to kill off for shock value. It took Geoff Johns talking him out of it at literally the last minute to get him to see sense.

(Seriously, you can tell that the page was drawn off a script where Dick got full-on murdered, and the original floppy release didn't have the hilariously awkward page they inserted into the collected editions where Dr. Mid-night promises to save him. It's kinda funny in retrospect.)

Stephanie was the same way, it wasn't that he "hated" her, he just didn't care about any character introduced after the silver age and thought that killing her off would be more ~shocking~ than letting her live and learn a lesson. Didio wasn't evil, he was just bad at his job. Your standard incompetent white guy failing up.

[mermaidsirennikita]

Yeah this needs to be talked about more, the amount of articles, podcasts, youtube/tiktok videos or just online comments that I saw after season 1 came out that just assume the Bton books were diverse because the show is? And the fact the new marketing push around the books is not disabusing people about that notion, mainly through the new covers (both regular and the show tie-in ones).

It's a really complicated, thorny issue in some ways and very simple in others. If I look at Just Romance Novels (which is obviously a niche, just zeroing in a genre for the sake of discussion) the genre is still dominated by product from white authors, largely with characters written as white. While it's diversifying (far more slowly than it should be) a lot of the older "proven success" books are written by white people, about white people. I don't think it's wrong to cast diversely if you're adapting those books--and on a practical, "people putting food on the table" level, I want actors of color to have as many solid, well-paying opportunities as possible.

At the same time, there are still so many authors of color neglected. Not all of whom wrote people of color on the page, of course, especially in historical romance--Sherry Thomas and Stacy Reid are two historical romance novelists who write about white characters, and it's no surprise that the potential adaptation of Stacy's works would be cast more diversely. There's a level of tracking how expectations have changed when you look at how Sinful Wallflowers was presented as a book series, and how it could be presented as a show.

And like, I'll allow that we're in the midst of a sort of "boom" (who knows how long it'll last) of period pieces cast more diversely than they would've been even 15 years ago. The approaches are often different and individualized. The Great has people of color playing characters who'd be literal white Russians "in real life", and it's literally never commented on, which I think many would prefer for a show like Bton. BUT, most of the lead characters are white, with Orlo (who I think did not get the strongest writing from jump, though Sascha wanting to leave after s1 didn't help) and Arkady (who I think is hilarious and finally got more screentime in s3, but he could've gotten more from the beginning... so much Velementov screentime should be Arkady screentime) being two of the only truly prominent people of color onscreen.

Then you have something like Sanditon, where Georgiana gets better writing than many people on Bton, but the show obviously never knew how to really confront her background, made the racist old lady the peak comic relief, and never prioritized Georgiana the way her white counterpart Charlotte was prioritized. Georgiana got an afterthought of an ending after being humiliated by the narrative several times.

One of the shows that handled this best was Tom Jones--Sophia is treated as this gem of a girl whose grandfather and aunt love her, but clearly aren't fully sure about how to solidify her safety as a Black woman of means in England. There's a very tender scene where she discusses her father enslaving her and her mother with Tom, and the show doesn't shy away from Sophia's mixed feelings on the entire thing. There's a heavy implication re: her being made to perform whiteness with face powder, etc, but nonetheless this is not dominating Sophia's storyline. She gets to be the swooning girl who falls head over heels and is desired by a good man and upheld as his ideal in every way. She confronts conflict, but she does not SUFFER, and she is not MINIMIZED in favor of white women in the story--Sophia is really pretty explicitly like, The Woman of that piece. Presented as the most beautiful, as not flawless but good and deserving of love, as a true classical heroine whose personal narrative is actively expanded to match Tom's. The only thing I find prominently weird (after one viewing) is that she and Tom never had like, a sweet wedding night scene, as we saw Tom have sex with three different white women onscreen, of of which was like.... the core villain. I would've liked to have seen Sophia get the full physical adoration there, onscreen, and it did stand out a bit that she didn't.

So those are adaptations with growing pains, not getting everything right, but some being better than others (and Bton being the bottom of the barrel, there).

Then there are things that are unequivocally wrong, and not a part of growing pains as adaptations navigate between what sells and what diversifies and what works, and one of those unequivocally wrong things is selling the Bton books as diverse reads. Those books are some of the most conventional Regency romances out there; you don't even get a lot of economic or class diversity, let alone any racial diversity. Almost everyone in that series is upper class. Even Sophie is the daughter of a nobleman. And I'm not saying it's wrong to write about those people, but for the books to now be sold as something they're not, when the author didn't even think people of color could get HEAs in her Historically Accurate World... is the worst kind of capitalism.

That's part of the extra ugliness (on top of all the obvious ugliness) here. Julia Quinn was against what she's now profiting from. It's not just picking a white author's works to be emblematic of diversity they don't represent; it's THAT author's works. And I think that making Queen Charlotte from all this, putting Julia's name on the cover (I am.... 90% sure that book was ghostwritten, with input from Julia and Shonda, but go off) just adds to all of it.

[namorthesubmariner]

Namor's comic version was coded as a racially ambiguous biracial man of color, he identifies more with his mother's native people than with his white father. I was one of the fans who heavily wrote about and posted about Namor maybe being played by an asian actor because of how in the comics he is east asian coded, but I'm very happy with his Talokan/Mayan background in BP:WF.

I write about it in this post with examples from the comics that clearly show Namor wasn't meant to be white, but rather a fictional biracial character since day 1 all the way back in 1939.

with interviews from people who recognized Namor's "Otherness"

Even Marvel Comics writer, Saladin Ahmed points this out

Namor's been portrayed with his father's white skin for decades in the comics but he was also portrayed with darker tones, and yes you guessed it, usually when he's being made a villain/more villainous.

Namor's appeared in Fantastic Four animations as well, and let me tell you how glaring the difference is.

Fantastic Four: World's Greatest Heroes feature Namor with the F4 but there is no ReedSueNamor drama, and this is what he looks like, while Othered, he does have much lighter skin than 1994 animation

Meanwhile the ReedSueNamor drama is VERY HEAVY in Fantastic Four (1994) and Namor is at his most visible POC character design before Wakanda Forever.

Do people see the optics now? After Namor fans have been saying how bad this is for years??

Namor fans have been going "this isn't good" and we get shut down because "that's just namor" or "namor isn't a MOC" etc. Namor fans get harassed because we DON'T want Namor to be used for ReedSue drama.

Like the entire ReedSueNamor drama is based so heavily on Namor being the Exotic Other savage POC male who kidnaps White Woman Susan, and White Man Reed needs to save her. Like I don't know how to make it more clear than that. Marvel Rivals CLEARLY took Namor characterization from Fantastic Four related media because thats the only place he's written like this, not from his own comics.

The entire thing is racist as fuck. Not to mention Namor is never written like this with his actual love interests, and respects women in his own comics. He literally is written differently when it comes to F4 comics. Wakanda Forever Namor is much closer to his comic personality than anything to do with the F4.

I follow your Twitter, and it's really upsetting how Rivals is handling Namor.

Obviously, we can see them wanting to stick with the Ryan Coolger version of Namor, but with the recent interactions with the Fantastic 4 Namor fans, both old and new are going to be suffer.

And the fact people are denying how badly he was written says what everything you need to known. To me that says "the writing doesn't isn't racist even though we clearly made him in a racist way"

Cause literally when I first saw Namor before Black Pnather 2 I assumed he was Asian with how some depiction give him the double eyelid. And the way he was written to be used for Reed and Sue relationship gives a bad taste.

With all the out of context images that have been shown about Namor and Sue keeps getting worse, cause how you doing to tell me Reed planning to divorce Sue and the way to solve this issue was for Namor to SA Sue to prove his love for her. You are telling me that isnt bad writing if this was publish in more recent years fans would be upbringing arms on how this was handle.

And don't get me started on people saying the "AUs/non mainstory of Namor and Sue still prove how awful he is." That like saying Reed is actually a villain because he was The Maker in this issue and thus proves he evil.

That's not the same thing. I can guarantee you many fans of Reed would be upset that you are calling him evil because he was Evil in this alternative universe. Same shit with Namor fans

The whole situation is so upsetting because literally everyone in this Godforsaken fandom has common sense and just follow whatever the hivemind says. Everytime I bring up this Issue, some ass goes "All that to defend a rapist" ARE U DENSE??? The anti-intellectualism in this fandom must be study. At the end of the day, ppl are just afraid to be proven wrong and Godforbid they cannot use Namor as a clutch to be racist and sexist anymore.

[eviltothecore13]

I hate that people see “Marvel” and think “MCU” now instead of all the great things the comics have done over the years.

Marvel comics had Spider-Man cheering on anti-Vietnam-War protestors in the 60s and the MCU gets US military support and funding?

Tony Stark in the comics (while still unbearable in the hands of SOME writers) is canonically bi and had alcoholism handled actually seriously and not made into a joke in the original Demon In A Bottle story whereas the Iron Man films chose to portray it as him making an idiot of himself at parties lolisn’tthatfunny instead. Not to mention that the reason he was written as a weapons manufacturer initially in the comics was that Stan Lee knew his audience was mostly fairly progressive young people and was deliberately choosing the person they would hate the most, as a "can I convincingly make this guy become a hero?" challenge--and the story is meant to be about a weapons manufacturer realising the horrible consequences of his actions and deciding to stop making weapons and use technology for good instead--but the original anti-military script of the first Iron Man film got edited beyond recognition because of that US military funding thing, and the films sort of waved vaguely in the direction of him no longer making weapons and then forgot all about it and had him keep doing it? (Also they expected us to laugh at him making a rape joke. WTF.)

They made canonically Jewish-Romani characters into white Christians working for HYDRA. (They also added a whole “oh HYDRA and the Red Skull just worked with the Nazis to gain power, they didn’t agree with the bigotry” thing presumably either so they didn’t have to address themes of bigotry and show their heroes fighting bigots, or to tone HYDRA down enough to sell merch of them, or both--when comics!Red Skull was very much explicitly a fanatical Nazi racist homophobe etc. I’m pretty sure they even tried to sell “Hail HYDRA” merch.)

I keep seeing talk of the X-Men joining the MCU and I just...do not trust them to adapt Magneto properly at this point at all. Or to adapt stories like “God Loves, Man Kills” or similar classic X-Men stories.

For that matter, while I’m not keen on some of the recent direction of the X-Men comics (WHY did they have Xavier and Magneto on the same council as Sinister, NO even remotely sympathetic character should work with Nazis, ESPECIALLY not a Jewish Holocaust survivor! also they seem to have practically made Xavier and Moira McTaggart into scheming supervillains at this point and like...they were both morally grey but I don’t think there was ever any need to take things THAT far...especially with Xavier it also kind of ruins his whole dynamic with Magneto, Magneto is meant to respect/even admire him to some extent and that doesn’t work if Xavier doesn’t have a single admirable trait...I know he was always secretive and did some morally questionable things but him and Moira both feel like different characters recently to in, say, Claremont’s era), they DO have Logan/Scott/Jean as a canon poly relationship, and also Kate Pryde--somehow I don’t think MCU will ever really have an explicitly bi Jewish pirate woman protagonist...

And yet people think of the MCU when they think “Marvel” and you see it in posts like “can’t believe anyone expects to see men kissing in Marvel” when we’ve had men kissing in Marvel for decades, it’s the MCU who won’t portray the characters they’re adapting properly...will “Marvel” ever stop being associated in people’s minds with “movies that are mostly CGI that have an explosion every five minutes and don’t pause to spend much if any time on character development or emotional moments”?

[martyrbat]

Of creature of the woods give me your wisdom. I really want to read batman comics but I have no clue where to start it's so overwhelming *dies*

omg hiii <333

super sorry for how late this is, i been busy all day !!!! im beyond honoured you thought of me to come to for Batman recs !! but i MUST give credits to my friend instead because their list is how I got into Batman comics!!

this !! is a great Batman reading list for a general use/reference! i know it can be super intimidating at first but you are SO brave and can do it! I promise it gets easier once you start getting into the swing of things! North did a great job in picking the comic issues/arcs so you can get a variety of stories and i can 1000% vouch for their recs!! (i think my personal favourite is Dark Knight, Dark City fyi!!)

another list from them :)

admittedly, I skip around in comics A LOT and just take a glance at a wiki to make sure im a starting a mini story arc in the right spot/it's just a standalone. but north's lists helped me when I was first getting into comics to make it a little less scary and i still look at it for a general use/remember my favourites! if you're just starting to read Batman comics, i cannot recommend them enough !!! :33

another friend of mine has this rec list too and some great for Batman Black and White recs too:

part 1, part 2, part 3

Matty's are great if you're looking for other adventures/different little stories and examples in how writers use the character! take a peek and see what catches your eye :)

AND a quick reminder (as always) to be mindful consuming any media but especially comics! and especially Batman related ones! Batman is a wonderful character and when written correctly, he is a symbol of unwavering compassion. BUT unfortunately the comic book world is a breeding ground for fascist, racist, and antisemitic storylines. be thoughtful in what you're reading and use your head to recognize signs of when the writer is using comics and these characters to push their disgusting propaganda.

three widely known examples are Grant Morrison, Frank Miller, and The Court of The Owls:

Morrison is one of the most known writers for modern-ish Batman. however they played a large hand in retconning Talia al Ghul's character and being a racist piece of shit so everyday i imagine their head blowing up

Frank Miller who's just a straight up fascist. He's largely praised for The Dark Knight Returns trilogy which can be avoided entirely (and should be, imo). you may have Batman: Year One get recommended which, again, i think is unnecessary (especially for just starting out). but if you're going to read it, be mindful of the writer.

(i'm unsure of how much you do or don't know – but if you want to see a short leadup to Bruce being Batman; I'd recommend The Man Who Falls (which is written by the iconic Dennis O'Neil) instead! Batman's origins has many stories and factors and this combines a lot of them into a nice, tidy story while adding a few other elements i like :))

and Scott Snyder's Court of the Owls entire arc is one of the worse cases i can think of; to where i knew of it before i ever touched a comic. Hallie did a wonderful explanation talking about it here and i recommend everyone to read it. even if you already have, refresh yourself and read it again.

If you're just getting into Batman comics i know that can seem like a lot to take in! But this is just to give a warning and reminder that comics are an artform that can and have been used as a propaganda and political piece. For better (police abolishment, his care and belief all life is precious/deserves to be saved/the belief and hope anyone can change for the better) and for the worse (racism, anti-semitism, police militarization).

I hope my friends lists helped in narrowing down where to start and you fall in love with this character too :) feel free to dm me or ask for my discord if you ever want to talk on them/have any questions!!! <3