#cloudtail is ashfur's adopted BROTHER

[hiraganasakura]

Sometimes I remember that Ashfur and Ferncloud are siblings and how different they are in spite of that, and I wonder:

Do you think that Ashfur was ever jealous of Ferncloud?

Think about it. Ferncloud wasn't a warrior for very long before she got to start a family. She got the guy she wanted, literally had two litters of kits in the span between the first and second arcs and even had another an arc later, and happily spent her whole life in the nursery caring for ThunderClan's young

Meanwhile Ashfur spent his entire life and afterlife chasing after Squirrelflight, no matter the fact that she wasn't interested him, no matter the fact that she consistently chose Brambleclaw over him, no matter the fact that she had Brambleclaw's children (including both her adopted and biological litters), no matter the fact that Ashfur literally tries to kill and humiliate her family to force her to be with him and feel pain for rejecting him

Do you ever think Ashfur felt envious bcus his kind and loving sister got to start the family that his obsessive and possessive self tried to get and never could?

[yuridovewing]

“oh ha ha the theory where ashfur is dovewing and ivypools father is so cringe”

[veiledaura]

If Hollyleaf survived

Dovewing's Silence:

- Hollyleaf's encounter with Hawkfrost goes mostly the same: She's badly injured and gets dragged to Thunderclan camp by Ivypool. She forgives Squirrelflight and Leafpool, assuming that she's going to die. As she becomes unconscious, Jayfeather refuses to give up on her, working on her wound throughout the night. As her brother is on the verge of fainting, Hollyleaf becomes stable and wakes up after a few days. As a consequence of Jayfeather not being available to check on other patients, Cloudtail dies of an infected wound.

- While recovering, Hollyleaf spends a long time speaking to Leafpool and Squirrelflight. Finally, Hollyleaf asks for her mother's reasoning for keeping her birth secret. Hollyleaf asks if she should publicly admit to the death berry incident, but Leafpool declines. Her mother says a public outrage won't help, citing the Gathering where Hollyleaf revealed the secret. Instead, Leafpool wants them to learn to understand and forgive each other, by slowly building their relationship up. Millie becomes guilt-ridden seeing these interactions and kicks start her own reconciliation with Blossomfall.

- Hollyleaf has a moment with Dovewing. The grey she-cat blurts she worried that she replaced Hollyleaf and her brothers resent her for it. Hollyleaf said she can't speak for her brothers, but Hollyleaf assures she doesn't blame Dovewing and she proved herself unworthy due to her crimes. When Dovewing admits to the three losing their powers, Hollyleaf says it could be better in the long term. The three will no longer be expected to be the main protectors of the Clans and they can settle into a more casual life.

- Ivypool is grateful that Hollyleaf saved her and wants to form a friendship with her. The two she-cats mutually bond over their similar circumstances. Hollyleaf suggests to Ivypool, that not being a part of the prophecy, could be a blessing in disguise. Hollyleaf had witnessed first-hand, the expectations that prophecy cats can put on themselves. The black she-cat wonders if she hadn't mistaken herself as the third cat, for so long, perhaps her fragile ego wouldn't have cracked under Ashfur's influence.

- Hollyleaf encourages all the trainees to redeem themselves, despite how hard it seems. However, since Hollyleaf is being asked to make all these speeches about redemption, it makes her realise she's still got a long way to go. Her nightmares about Ashfur's murder return and she wonders if she needs to go into self-exile again, to continue her atonement. Since she passed on her underground fighting skills, Thunderclan didn't seem to need her so was she staying out of her own selfishness? Jayfeather snaps her out of it: Pointing her out her family wants her here and leaving again, would hurt them more.

Bramblestar's Storm:

-After Jayfeather makes her promise to stay indefinitely, Hollyleaf needs to regain normalcy with her family. In the tunnels, she expected to die young and didn't see a future for herself. While her grand gestures of atonement are important, she needs to consider the everyday too. At first, she can be overly serious and isolate herself. But she learns to open up and have fun around her brothers over time. There are glimpses of a simpler time before it became so messy.

-Hollyleaf reaffirms her connection with Bramblestar. At one point, he pulls his adopted daughter aside. He recalls how her brothers already heard this, but she never got the chance after the tunnel collapsed. He promises his heart will be open to her but he understands if it's too awkward to consider him a father. Either way, he will respect whatever Hollyleaf chooses. The black she-cat snorts, saying she would never choose Crowfeather over him. Bramblestar winces, wondering if it should be obvious.

-Hollyleaf asks why Bramblestar lied about Ashfur accidentally slipping into the stream. He admits he panicked slightly and thought she'd been in self-exile for long enough. Hollyleaf acknowledges how he risked his ranking for her, but she must be judged alone and not use her family connections to gain an advantage. At that point, Hollyleaf's clanmates had figured out Ashfur's death was purposeful. Most cats didn't particularly care after discovering Ashfur's crimes, only judging Hollyleaf for not trusting Firestar to uphold justice.

-Bramblestar asks if Hollyleaf still has her childhood dream of being a leader. He remembered how she followed him as a kit and said she'd become like him. The black she-cat declines, saying she can't trust herself with that power. Hollyleaf feels sorry for her younger self and doesn't grow into the cat she expected to be.

-When Squirrelflight announces she's pregnant, Hollyleaf is overjoyed. After a while, her mother noticed slight doubt on her face. Being told to be honest, Hollyleaf admits she has irrational feelings of being replaced. Squirrelflight ensures her emotions are only natural after the trauma she suffered through. She ensures they can work through them as mother and daughter.

Crowfeather's Trial:

- Hollyleaf would see the similarities between herself and Breezepelt. Additionally, as the one to expose the secret, she feels somewhat responsible for Breezepelt. Therefore, she feels obligated to set the record straight with him. She details how she killed Ashfur to Breezepelt and the two help each other realise where they went wrong. Crowfeather is shocked about Hollyleaf's crimes, feeling even more of a failure of a father.

- When he realises Hollyleaf is already reconciling with Leafpool, he feels pressure to speed things along with Breezpelt. Besides helping Breezepelt's redemption, Hollyleaf feels wrong to have a long-term friendship with him, due to Jayfeather's discomfort. She wishes Breezepelt the best but says it's best to live their separate lives, as they did before the secret's exposure. While this is all going on, Nightcloud refused to speak to Hollyleaf at all, blaming her for telling the secret. After Crowfeather's Trial, Breezepelt would go on, to make serval hypocritical statements: calling Kin defectors and Squirrelflight traitors. Hollyleaf would glare at him in disbelief, wondering how he could be so unaware.

- There's a moment, where Hollyleaf wonders in on Leafpool and Crowfeather speaking at the border. The mother and daughter thinks it's his right to know and Hollyleaf confesses the death berry incident to him. Crowfeather flinches, wondering how he'd feel if Breezepelt tried to kill him directly, instead of his half-siblings. Hollyleaf states her actions overshadow anything her parents did against her. So she says Crowfeather should be forgiving her, not the other way around. Crowfeather says only the victim, Leafpool, can decide if she deserves forgiveness or not. Crowfeather says it's impossble not to feel some disgust at Hollyleaf's crime; but he'll react to it as a fellow warrior, not as a father, as he never earnt being called her 'father'.

A Vision of Shadows:

- Hollyleaf is working hard to be a good daughter to Leafpool and Squirrelflight. She'll go out of her way, to do helpful things like replacing their nests or collecting herbs. She can be overly polite around them, thinking they've been criticised too much already. This annoys Squirrelflight, as she knows her daughter is natrually headstrong and says she should have the guts to be herself. The black she-cat would be the middle point between her two brothers: Jayfeather has unresolved feelings, while Lionblaze has let go of the past. Hollyleaf tries to get along with her mothers, but there would always be the occasional awkwardness, not forgetting the past.

- Hollyleaf is struggling to find her place in the Clan. She doesn't want to get involved in too many battles, fearful she could kill again. Additionally, she doesn't want any authority she could potentially abuse. She asks Bramblestar to never consider her for deputyship and vows she'll never return as a Medicine cat apprentice. For a while, she tries training under Daisy as a permanent queen. Though she learns the position isn't right for her, not having the patience for so many kits.

-When Leafstar creates the mediator rank for Tree, it sparks her interest. It could let her avoid hurting others and the job requires memorization of the code, which she already has. She works with Tree, to become Thunderclan's first mediator. This inspires the remaining Clans to train their own mediators. For Shadowclan, Strikestone steps up as he blames warrior life for his loved ones' deaths. Icewing becomes Riverclan's mediator to repent for her Dark Forest training. Finally, Heathertail volunteers due to her caring nature and experience with angry toms.

- Hollyleaf helps to raise Sparkpelt and Alderheart, while Squirrelflight grieves for her lost kits. Out of her litter, she would be the closest to her adoptive siblings. Hollyleaf is quite protective of Alderheart, reminding her of Jayfeather when he was a weak kit. She likes to ensure that Jayfeather isn't too harsh on his apprentice, reminding him of their parallels. Hollyleaf and Sparkpelt are the most alike, with Sparkpelt claiming she's a "mini-me" of Hollyleaf. The two even become mentor and apprentice, at Sparkpelt's request. Hollyleaf is determined not to disappoint Sparkpelt - She can waver between being strict and soft-spoken, as she desperately tries to get the balance right. Even after her warrior ceremony, Hollyleaf assures Sparkpelt that she can always ask for advice.

- Hollyleaf has some moments in the Darktail and Onestar conflict. When Onestar compares his situation to Hollyleaf and Breezepelt on the possibility of convincing Darktail to stop - The black she-cat dismisses it, saying Darktail is truly too far gone. Hollyleaf encourages Onestar to fix his past mistakes, but he needs to be prepared to make the hard choices if he goes down that road.

Squirrelflight's Hope:

- As a mediator, Hollyleaf joins Tree in his missions, to negotiate with the Sisters peacefully. Due to her past, Hollyleaf doesn't feel like it's her place, to assume she knows better than the Clans. So Hollyleaf feels compelled to act in an offical capacity. So when Squirrelflight starts going against Bramblestar's orders, Holyleaf can't trust herself to join her mother. She simply says to Squirrelflight, 'I hope you know what you're doing'. Though when the Sisters are driven out of their camp, Hollyleaf can't stand aside at that point. She helps evacuate the sisters' kits, including helping with Moonlight's birth.

- As Squirrelflight and Bramblestar argue over their politics: Hollyleaf feels it would be nepotism if she used her position as their daughter, to voice her own politcal opinions to them. Instead, as a mediator, Hollyleaf sets up a meeting in a calm setting, for Squirrelflight and Bramblestar to have a proper heart-to-heart. Also, Hollyleaf acts as a middle-man for other family members: She asks Tawnypelt, to start supporting Bramblestar with his relationship struggles. Then Hollyleaf relays Sparkpelt's story, of her panicking due to her parents aruging.

- When Leafpool dies, Hollyleaf blurts she wishes she'd taken her place. Though Squirrelflight counters that Leafpool wants Hollyleaf to be happy and she needs to live on, for her sake. Hollyleaf and Jayfeather spend more time together, due to their shared grief.

Broken Code:

- When "Bramblestar" first starts his code-breaking agenda, he questions why Hollyleaf isn't more happy about it, considering her old dedication to it. Hollyleaf utters she can't let her dangerous obsession resurface. She states that as a mediator now, she must be able to see the warrior code critically. She gets suspicious of "Bramblestar", noticing he's never cared so much about the code before. She warns him about how that type of obsession can be all-consuming.

-Hollyleaf is the first cat to be exiled, due to her criticisms of "Bramblestar". She attempted to gather the mediators from the other Clans and convince him to stop his cruelty.

- When she discovers Ashfur's identity, she makes it her personal mission to defeat him. Though Hollyleaf refuses to join the rebels, saying she won't fight against anyone else, not even the Imposter's supporters. She swore she wouldn't kill anyone else. Her sole target is Ashfur. Instead, the mediators create a refugee camp for the Imposter's exiles. They guard the most vulnerable while others fight their fellow Clan cats.

-Hollyleaf is shocked when Lionblaze kills Harstar, dragging him off his victim. When he is appointed deputy, she tries to voice her concerns about his bad headspace. However, she is outnumbered, so she is forced to accept it.

-Hollyleaf volunteers to enter the Dark Forest, thinking innocent cats shouldn't need to sacrifice themselves. She briefly encounters Stonefur in Starclan. He recounts his execution and says it was truly sad to see another Half-Clan internalise that hatred. Holyleaf promises she'll make the younger generations less biased towards Half-Clan cats.

- Ashfur taunts Hollyleaf for her hypocrisy for killing him and leaking her parentage anyway. She responds it was wrong for her to take justice into her own hands, when she killed Ashfur alone. But at the same time, Ashfur shouldn't have expected to go scot-free, considering his own crimes. Ashfur is bitter that Hollyleaf got to live on, when he didn't, claiming she's as bad as him. Hollyleaf remains realistic, acknowledging she's a killer, but affirms that Ashfur's crimes vastly outweigh hers by now. She hits Ashfur to his core when she says he's in the same leagues as Tigerstar.

-Hollyleaf feels incredibly guilty when Bristlefrost dies, feeling like she failed her friend Ivypool.

- When Ashfur is cornered, he plays his trump card against Hollyleaf. He exposes Hollyleaf as Leafpool's attempted murderer. The black she-cat was shocked since Leafpool wanted to keep it between them. Even after Ashfur fades away, the damage of Hollyleaf's exposure is left. Though her family understood why Leafpool herself chose to keep it a secret, they still felt betrayed. They weren't surprised due to Hollyleaf's other crimes but it was still disappointing. Some loved ones take a while before they can speak to her again. Meanwhile Hollyleaf's more distant relatives, like Lionblaze's kits, refuse to acknowledge their kinship with her.

- When real Bramblestar returns, he decides it's pointless to exile her again since it's been so long and she's already punished herself that way. Instead, Bramblestar explains that many warriors feel unsafe, sharing their den with a killer. He thinks it's unfair to force them to compromise. Bramblestar allows Hollyleaf to remain in Thunderclan, but she must have her own isolated den, outside of the camp boundaries. She can return to camp to receive assignments, but she just can't sleep there anymore. As for other permanent consequences, she's banned from Gatherings and mentorship.

Starless Clan:

- Hollyleaf supports the warrior code changing, arguing that some rules do more damage than good. She points to her broken family, saying it could've been avoided with proper protocols. She says good mothers like Leafpool are unfairly forced to give up their kits and branded traitors.

- Hollyleaf fosters Flinchkit and Flamekit while Sparkpelt grieves. Flamepaw comes to see Hollyleaf as a mother figure. Sorrelstripe still nurses them but she's more hands-off, wanting to give Hollyleaf space to bond with Flamekit. Flamepaw has a mostly good relationship with Hollyleaf, much better than Sparkpelt. However, he has underlying doubts about her, knowing her murderous past. He is aware that Hollyleaf is the black sheep of the family and fears he might be the same. He knows he gets the occasional worried looks from his clanmates for being so close to Hollyleaf. Sometimes, he has overdramatic fears that he'll hurt Sparkpelt, as Hollyleaf did to Leafpool, artificially drawing comparisons between them.

-When Flamepaw struggles to find his place, Hollyleaf wants to help her nephew. She suggests the mediators could train him to become her successor. However, he shuts her down. He says Hollyleaf is doing the very thing he's trying to avoid: Using nepotism to get a special ranking. Hollyleaf claims mediators aren't glorious, and distrust is still aimed towards them. Though Flamepaw refuses to humor the idea further.

-Nightheart becomes bitter at Hollyleaf's choice to raise him. He argues that their clanmates look at him strangely because the resident murderer decided to get close to him. Hollyleaf mutters she was trying to help Sparkpelt, but Nightheart isn't fully convinced. He says her past makes her unfit to be a foster parent, and she shouldn't use kits to reconcile her own guilt. While Nightheart's words were excessive, Hollyleaf knew he was partly telling the truth.

-Alongside Tree, Hollyeaf tries to convince Tigerstar to leave Riverclan alone. They partly succeed, as Shadowclan warriors are slowly withdrawn from Riverclan camp.

-On one occasion, Hollyleaf overhears Berryheart trying to guilt-trip Sunbeam into abandoning Nightheart. Reacting to this slander against Half-Clan families, Hollyleaf gets into a brief fight with Berryheart.

-After Nightheart matures, he believes he was too harsh towards Hollyleaf. So the next time he sees her, he apologises. The black she-cat admits she should give her nephew space and rethink how her reputation could affect her loved ones.

[bonefall]

Okay so a convo made me remember that Icecloud and Foxleap become apprentices 4-5 moons after the three, which means Ferncloud either had four litters so the three could nurse while also having kits so much younger than them, or she just so happens to have milk despite not having kits OR her last litter was really held back. Mostly bringing this up because obviously Squilf and Leaf still can't nurse the three in BB and I was curious if Ferc was still going to nurse them since I know you gave away her last litter or if someone else will do that or if there's a definite answer for this detail yet.

Daisy did it! Her kits were recently weaned, but Sorreltail at the time was nursing FOUR kittens. That's a lot for one suckler to handle, so Daisy would help out which kept her milk coming.

So Daisy has it handled. Ferncloud is still reeling from horrifically losing THREE children in a short period of time. At this moment in time, she didn't feel ready for more.

But, anyway! Foxleap and Icecloud are NOT DustFern kittens in BB. They were shuffled. This is because Ferncloud has waaaay too few surviving kittens while Brightheart and Sorreltail exploded the gene pool. Their kits in BB are;

Dustpelt x Ferncloud:

Spiderleg (ALIVE)

Shrewpaw (Car accident while chasing a pheasant; Squilf's guardian angel)

Lurchkit (Destruction of the White Hart)

Hollykit (Ditto)

Birchfall (ALIVE)

Seedpaw (Drowned)

Lilyheart (ALIVE)

Ferncloud is the Educator of ThunderClan until her death in TBC. She lives long enough to confront her little brother, Ashfur, who is now from a younger litter. Dustpelt died in the Battle of the True Eclipse, while defending his last litter from Dark Forest warriors.

Additionally, Spotfur and Duststripe (prev. Sorrelstripe) are now Birchfall's kittens, in trade for Dovewing and Ivypool to go into the Firekin family. Toadstep is also still alive; the husband of Lionblaze.

Lilyheart hasn't had any kittens yet, though. I'm still holding on to Leafshade and Honey...something i forgot her name. ThunderClan is already pretty full of cats and she really didn't need to have them so young. Plus, she got seriously traumatized from how Seedpaw died, and she's the sort of mature person to realize she doesn't want to be responsible for young lives when that's still affecting her.

Brightheart x Cloudtail

Whitewing (alive)

Foxleap (Battle of the True Eclipse)

Icecloud (Born after the BOTTE, named after Iceheart, alive)

Snowbush, Ambermoon, and Dewnose all still exist, but were adopted to other couples! They're going to show up in other Clans. Cloud and Bright kept a single kitten from each litter.

Foxleap is probably going to be younger than he is in-canon, because I feel like he often gets lost in the massive Po3 Apprentice Generation. So, he'll be somewhere between Po3 and OotS, interacting with Dovewing and Ivypool as they grow up.

Icecloud, also shuffled in age, is also going to end up with a bigger role in AVOS-era stuff, he's transmasc and a fast friend of Alderheart when he joins ThunderClan after being raised by his mother Jessy as a kittypet. Him and Lilyheart make up Alderheart's misfit friend group.

(In general I think ThunderClan feels less bloated if the births are spaced out better.)

Sorreltail x Brackenfur

Cinderheart (Alive; travelling with Fallenleaf)

Honeysnake (survived the adder; killed in the BOTTE)

Poppyfrost (Alive; inventor of gardening)

Molepaw (Greencough... angel name is Moleflight and he is constantly fighting Jayfeather)

JUST having the infamous Brackenfour. No more; BB!Brackenfur was killed in the Battle of the FALSE Eclipse at the end of Po3. Sorreltail is living for a MUCH longer time; she's still around in the current arc, preparing to retire as Head of Kitchen Patrol.

[bonebabbles]

bonez i’m in the trenches rn… warriorcatshubofficial on instagram made a reel asking who everyone’s favorite adoptive parent is and 50% of the comments are saying gray wing…

tbf who else even is there. it's bad out here. All the adoptive parents in WC;

Sharp Hail. Beats his adopted child and fucking hates him.

Leaf. Spends the vast majority of a book yelling about how babies shouldn't eat until their mother kisses him.

Thushpelt. Precious baby boy, but only knew Bluefur's kits for like... 5 minutes.

Bramble "i can depend on my little pogchamp to understand that ashfur beating the snot out of her brother is totally okay" Claw

Lizardstripe, who was demonized for not wanting to be pregnant and accuses a child of stealing milk. Said to bite babies in a dream bubble that cannot canonically exist in tandem with the retcons they made 2 years later.

Nice Foster Mom 44 who is nice to their charge but barely shares 4 words with their "child."

Petal who takes the children that her favorite boy murdered, so that he wouldn't murder the kids too

Clear Sky, notorious favorite boy, who gets given the child of Micah, who he murdered.

Like yeah Gray Wing is constantly yelling at Thunder to go hang out with his abuser, and pining over how he's not Turtle's kits' Real Dad because they all love Tom the Wifebeater more than him, but at least he HAS scenes with them I guess. A couple nice ones where he gives piggyback rides, even. And the narrative frames him as better than nothing. So.

Anyway all of this to say the best adoptive parent is Brindleface, who was Nice Foster Mom #1 but was ACTUALLY relevant to Cloudtail's story. Cloudkit didn't even know he wasn't clanborn until Fireheart started scolding him about it! All other answers are incorrect. Praise Brindleface.

Honorable mention to Riverstar, who was given Moth Flight's Hydrophobic Child in the most dickish possible move, and yet managed to help him out. Crying shame that Spider Paw didn't have a big role in Riverstar's Home, much as I like Drizzle it was a complete waste to not have Riverstar's adopted son go on that trip with him.

[cowcowwow]

DESIGNS FOR THE SILLIES IN MY POWER OF STARS AU!! Explanation on what it is under the readmore >:3

SO!! It takes the idea of the Three Prophecy and twists it

The meaning of "the power of stars in their paws" literally means the three can interact with Starclan/Ghosts/The Dark Forest, even being able to make them physical in the real world >:3

But the "three..." let's just say. They're not who Starclan thinks.

Lionblaze has the ability to control rocks/ground! It sings to him, tells him stories of long lost paws and time. He finds himself drawn to the caves

Jayfeather has the ability to control water! He is deeply afraid of it, even if he won't admit it. There's something about it... that feels alive, alive, alive.

Dovepaw can control air!! Sounds and smells carry stories to her, and it can be very overwhelming. She wants to fly away. She doesn't know if she can.

But they're not the Three, no no no :3 Starclan realizes this when two others gain powers,, Hollyleaf and Breezepelt

Breezepelt has always felt on the verge of bursting. He wants to live, but feels trapped. After going on the journey with the triplets, he feels more seen. Finally, after saving Jay from drowning and talking to Hollyleaf, he decides to become a healer. But his story doesn't stop there... one night he finds Holly bleeding out, and desperately drags his friend to the Moonpool. Stepping into it and putting Holly in too, both suddenly feel right. Hollyleaf's wounds close, and Breeze feels alive. He can control flames.

Hollyleaf finds herself drawn to the plants Jay and Breeze use to help her. They grow and become something new, something beautiful. Holly can control plants.

So there's Five Stars, not Three,, who's the Three then? Who has the Power of Stars in their paws?

None other than the prophet Sol, the ghost expert Ashfur, and the young recruit Ivypaw.

If the Dark Forest and Sol and Ashfur can just get Ivypaw to truly join them... well. They will have more power than even the Stars.

The Stars: Lion, Jay, Dove, Holly, Breeze

The Three: Sol, Ashfur, Ivy

Kin of Firestar's Kin:

Ashfur: Kin to Cloudtail (adopted brother) who's kin to Firestar

Sol: Kin to being a kittypet which is kin (or akin, ha) to Firestar

Ivy: Kin to Whitewing who is kin to Firestar (technically she's kin of his kin of his kin, but the books did it with Dove so we let it slide for now)

:3!!!!

[wc-confessions]

(About Cloudtail not being Ashfur's brother, sent by a different anon)

Doesn't. Doesn't Cloudtail deeply grieve Brindleface's death ("as if she's his mom") and even suggest an immediate raid against ShadowClan during the announcement of her death?? and Brindletail even says Cloudtail is her kit, even if he isn't hers by birth, in Firestar's Nine Lives ceremony?

Yall... He's their brother. I'm pretty sure Ashfur is even shown to be close to Cloudtail during the whole time when Ashfur's being bitter towards Squirrelflight. Like. Yes Cloudtail gets pissed at Brambleclaw for an unnecessary comment about kittypets, but Ashfur was very neutral about the whole "kittypets" thing because he KNEW Squirrelflight's dad was a kittypet and his foster brother used to be one. A character can hate a kittypet and still be close to one. It's called being a hypocrite.

Ashfur being Ivy/Dove's dad, aka being mates with Whitewing, would be weird even if he didn't see Cloudtail as a brother. Because Whitewing is basically the same age as Squirrelfight. Ashfur is even older than Brambleclaw (was apprenticed before him).

Just because y'all don't acknowledge adoptive family doesn't make incest suddenly ok.... this is such a weird take to have. idc if theyre fictional its still weird!

.

[notwarriorswiki]

Does Cloudtail still get adopted by Brindleface if she's his mentor?

She's a mother-figure of sorts, though it's not accurate to call it "adoption". He doesn't consider Ashfur or Ferncloud his brother and sister, but does view Brindleface as someone he deeply loves and trusts. She didn't nurse him, sure, but she still makes a huge impact on his life and they're extremely close.

By the time Cloud is brought to ThunderClan, he's already weaned in this rewrite, so he doesn't need someone to nurse him rather Fireheart always watching over him and the other queens lending a paw as well.

Cloudpaw is not the easiest apprentice to work with though.

[oakshade]

sorry if you answered for this ship before. What's ur opinion on Ashfur and Cloudtail? The adopted brothers? I really like it and can imagine Cloud comforting Ash post Squirrel breakup and even post fire scene. Being an Ashfur apologist "My bro can do no wrong ever!!!1!"

It'd be really funny to me bc Cloudtail is pretty closely related to Squirrelflight I imagine he comforts Ashfur about it and she hears and just

[hopalongfairywren]

I always liked the idea of Ashfur being obsessed not only with Squirrelflight, but with having his very own biological children. His own direct lineage. It's not just that Squirrelflight left him, it's that she gets to have kits of her own and he doesn't. Of course, he sees kits more as a status symbol rather than just wanting kits for the sake of lovingly raising anyone. He lets the three go because they aren't Squirrelflight's bio kits and in his mind, they aren't worth the trouble of then having to deal with the fall out of the three and possibly Squirrelflight's deaths to cover it all up. He wants to erase Squirrelflight's 'children' as revenge for denying him his own with her. But she doesn't have any, at least in Ashfur's mind, so he settles back for the good old revenge via exposing her publicly, letting her and her family shatter. Also because then it can be less the over all narrative of the book saying 'adoption isn't as valid as bio parenting' and more of, well, Ashfur the antagonist saying that. Also yes I'm aware of Cloudtail being Ashfur's adopted brother, however in this take of him I see them both falling somewhere during or after Firestar's quest, and that rift only growing as Ashfur adopts the mindset that the only 'true' kind of family is biological, and his jealousy at how all of his clanmates have their own, except him.

[gougarpaw]

“I don’t care! I’m going to be the best warrior in the Clan. I’ll fight any cat who says I’m not. I’ll be brave enough to kill outlaws like old Brokentail.”

Cloudtail is a long-haired white tom with blue eyes.

notes:

- Son of Princess + Oliver, adoptive son of Brindleface, brother of Zack, Taylor, Nami, and Livy, adoptive brother of Ashfur and Ferncloud, spouse of Brightheart, father of Whitewing, Ambermoon, Dewnose, and Snowbush

[marmotclaw]

Cloudtail

Name meaning: Soft fur, usually white, agile and balanced

Heavy, snowy-white tom (he/him) with blue eyes. He has fluffy, thick, and long fur.

Voice claim: David Spade

Family and Education

Mother: Princess

Father: Oliver

Adopted Mother: Brindleface

Adopted Brother: Ashfur

Adopted Sister: Ferncloud

Mate: Brightheart

Daughters: Whitewing, Ambermoon

Sons: Dewnose, Snowbush

Foster Daughters: Lilyheart, Seedpaw

Mentor: Firestar

Apprentices: Rainwhisker, Cinderheart, Toadstep

Unofficial Apprentice: Brightheart

Temporary Apprentices: Flametail, Cherryfall

Personality

ESTP

Chaotic moral

Social

Platonic Love: Ambermoon, Brindleface, Cinderheart, Dewnose, Ferncloud, Firestar, Lilyheart, Princess, Seedpaw, Snowbush, Toadstep, Whitewing

Romantic Love: Brightheart

Friend(s): Daisy, Dappletail, Patchpelt, Rainwhisker, Sparrowpelt, Swiftpaw

Mixed feelings: Ashfur

Enemies: Tigerstar

Favourite food: Starling

[silverdawn1498]

Warriors Series Three Rewrite

The Power of Three Changes

-Lionkit is now red-and-cream

-Feathertail is now Ashfur's mate, and they are the parents of Foxkit and Icekit

-Cinderpaw is now named Songpaw after Ravensong

-There is no Tribe or Ancient sub-plot

-After finding out about Brightheart neglecting Jaypaw, Dawnstar takes him as her own apprentice

-Graystripe and Sandstorm return and it turns out they became mates during their journey home

-Jaypaw accidentally dreamwalks into the Dark Forest where Spottedleaf leads him back to StarClan and try to force him to become a medicine cat which he refuses since Dawnstar believes in him and told him about her experiences before the Clan where disabled cats can hunt and fight as well as normal cats

-WindClan is attacked by dogs and Dawnstar sends a patrol to see if they can help or if WindClan has it covered, the patrol is needed to defeat the dogs

-ShadowClan's accusation of ThunderClan taking in non-Clanborn cats at the Gathering has Dawnstar snap at Blackstar and says that she and the other 'non-Clanborn' cats will leave which surprises all four Clans since Dawnstar is the most loyal and passionate cat they know

-Dawnstar says that if she proved herself over and over again to the Clans then why can't the others, and all of the Clans agrees

-Jaypaw dreamwalks into Dawnstar's dream and finds out about the prophecy but also that Dawnstar is confused about which kin since she adopted Cloudtail when he was a kit so that makes Whitewing her kin as well

-Songpaw breaks her leg, but Cinderleap comforts her by saying that Dawnstar never gave up on her when the rest of the Clan did

-Lionpaw is visited by Tigerstar and Brambleclaw finds out which he then warns his 'son' about the dangers of the Dark Forest

-Lionpaw discovers his power after kittypets from the Greenleaf Twolegplace attack the border patrol

-Jaypaw reveals the prophecy to his siblings and about Dawnstar's confusion about which cats the prophecy is talking about

-Sandstorm gives birth to Bumblekit, Briarkit, and Blossomkit

-WindClan attacks ThunderClan, and Feathertail and Dawnstar's and Blackwhisker's newborn kits are killed by accident

-Dawnstar attacks Onestar and tells him that he will pay for the deaths his warriors caused

-Jaypaw gets his warrior name: Jayflight and is now a full-time fighter since his lack of vision makes it hard to hunt precisely

-A fire breaks out and the remaining cats head towards the Twoleg nest, but Jayflight, Hollyleaf, and Lionblaze are trapped

-Mapleshine reveals that the three are not her kits before a black-and-white blur knocks Ashfur off of the branch, the blur is revealed to be Swiftstep with Dustpelt close behind

-Dustpelt says that Dawnstar sent the two to search for them

-The three escape and they are all escorted back to the Clan where Ashfur is interrogated by Dawnstar and reveals everything

-Ferncloud surprises the Clan by slashing her brother's face and reveals that Feathertail loved him much to his surprise since he took her as a mate to try and get over Mapleshine which failed

-Foxpaw and Icepaw disown Ashfur as their father

-Dawnstar strips Ashfur of his name before exiling him which he retorts by saying that the Clan will pay for this

-As Sol is taken prisoner, Purdy is invited to join ThunderClan as an elder since he is older now than when he first met the journeying cats

-The other three leaders arrive to talk about Sol's punishment

-Skypool reveals to Hollyleaf that she knows that she killed Ashfur and that she is the three's true mother

-Hollyleaf reveals at the secret at the Gathering, but all Lionblaze notices is that her eyes are now dark blue instead of green

-Hollyleaf reveals that she was the one that killed Ashfur and threatend to kill Skypool before running into the tunnels just before it collapses

-Dawnstar reveals to Blackwhisker that she knew the three were Skypool's kits and wonders if her silence was worth it

-He tells her that it was up to their daughters since it wasn't hers to tell

-A barely visible figure is watching the Clans as it wonders about what will happen to 'the balance'

[bonefall]

if adopted kits are taken as seriously as bio kits, would ashfur even go for squilf at all considering hes brothers with her.. cousin? i think? whatever cloudtail is in relation to squilf n leaf

Cloudtail and Brindleface are two that have been a thorn in my side since I started reworking the tree and I'll get to what I'm planning with them specifically, but in summary-- an adopted child only counts one way. Allonursing is a common Clan practice and not every kit suckled by someone else becomes that person's child.

(I had to do this because I would have run out of cats and had to ban ALL same-clan shipping. Not to mention how I also try to get rid of steep age gaps on top of this)

So Cloudtail is not Ferncloud and Ashfur's fully adopted brother. He was suckled by Brindleface but raised by Fireheart, and was extremely close to Ferncloud growing up. He's Firekin, not Brindlekin.

But otherwise, when it comes to what I allow and what I block, I have Three Strict Rules

Rule 1: Three Generation Separation

I completely eliminate cats who are first cousins, which means they share a 1st degree grandparent. For an example, that would mean Swiftpaw and Brightheart are banned as a couple-- first cousins through Goldenflower and Lionheart.

Squirrelflight and Cloudtail are also first cousins.

Second cousins, cousins once removed, I usually allow those. Clan populations are too small for me to be stricter-- not to mention that Clan culture prioritizes "pure blood."

I have one MAJOR addendum, which I like to call Onestar's Exception.

I ban an ADDITIONAL 4th generation if two or more siblings are alive to remember the great-grandparent. This is because when I read Onestar's Confession, Onestar actually thinks about how cool it is that Heathertail is becoming mates with Breezepelt, his sister's grandchild, making them first cousins once removed.

It made me so uncomfortable I made the addendum on the spot, and committed to Onestar being an only child (son of Larksplash and Cloudrunner).

This also banned Dewnose x Sorrelstripe, which is why Bay and Myrtle are both sireless now.

Rule 2: Two Kit Max

A couple can have as many kits as they like, but only two are allowed to go on to have descendants of their own. All others will either have no kits, or a dead-end lineage.

So, for example, the BrackenSorrel couple had Poppyfrost and Cinderheart, so Lilyheart will not have surviving children, Nightheart is not her grandchild (IF she stays a BrackenSorrel child, since I killed her dad before she was born OOPSIE).

This prevents LionCinder situations where half of the Clan is descended from one fecund couple... though sometimes it causes headaches, like the ToadNettlePool couple, which I decided early on was going to count as ONE big litter because I'm not dealing with the headache of quantifying half-siblings.

The exception being that a cat can leave their home clan to have kits somewhere else. So, Dovewing, now a LionCinder child, does not count towards her parents' limit because she moved to ShadowClan.

(Spotfur and Sorrelstripe, btw, are getting traded over to Birch/White in exchange for Ivypool and Dovewing)

Rule 3: Queen's Rights/Sireless Litters

I have the right to eliminate a father. Sireless litters are allowed, and it's against the code itself to question who fathered a queen's kittens (This is not respected when the Clan swings towards Thistle Law).

I do this a LOT and it is extremely helpful. Brindleface's kits are sireless. Sorrelstripe's kits are sireless. Blossomfall's kits are sireless. Morningflower's kits were sireless. Rosetail's kittens (Spottedleaf and Redtail) were sireless.

So... Cloudtail

I WANTED to save Cloudtail as an adopted sibling because I really love the concept, but keeping that would be undoing two major things.

First, Whitewing and Birchfall would be first cousins and ergo banned. I would have to un-dad Whitewing's children which... it doesn't feel right, they're such a good background couple. Plus, without MORE fixes, it kills Ferncloud's bloodline. Birchfall is her ONLY surviving reproductive child, Spiderleg's bloodline through Daisy was a dead-end.

(one of my other fixes, though, is saving her grandchild Rosepetal, Cherryfall is dying instead. so check ME OUT world, i managed to save ONE ferncloud descendant. hold your applause please /s)

Second, like you mentioned, it would utterly eliminate the Ashfur/Squirrelflight drama. That's too iconic and fuels conflict in two arcs- it's such a MAJOR canon event that I have to fix around it.

So, something had to give and I decided it was Cloudtail being formally adopted. He is VERY close to Ferncloud though, and helps her raise her little brother Ashkit when Brindleface is killed.

[canon-notcanon-warriorcats]

I really wish Daisy had more interactions with Cloudtail and Brightheart after the end of the second arc. I really like how mature Daisy was willing to see Cloudtail more as a friend and how she comforted Brightheart and told her Cloudtail really does love her but after that they don’t really talk much

right they should've become like a best friend group and become a trio

they could've used it as like a foil to the whole thing with ashfur, squirrelflight, and brambleclaw where when squirrelflight and brambleclaw became official ashfur got pissed and separated himself away from brambleclaw who had always been his friend instead of dealing with it healthily and stayed friends

unlike brightheart, cloudtail, and daisy where even if daisy had unrequited feelings for cloudtail she was mature enough to stay friends and get over it healthily and still have friendships with the couple

wait why am i thinking of an ashfur x daisy au now where daisy talks to ashfur about how he's not taking his break up well and is dealing with it unhealthily and she saves him from spiraling into an envious asshole simmering in his own toxic waste for years

and then they grow feelings for each other and get together and they have rosepetal and toadstep and maybe ashfur, daisy, cloudtail, brightheart, squirrelflight, and brambleclaw become a big close friend group

and squirrelflight canonically mentors rosepetal and cloudtail canonically mentors toadstep (and ashfur canonically mentors lionblaze) so that would be such good symbolism that ashfur and daisy trust their kits with and still are friends and have good relationships with the cats they had crushes on even though the feelings weren't reciprocated, they've grown and gotten past those feelings and all of them are good friends and love each other like a big family

[froody-matriarch-of-bleu-cheese]

Ashfur and Cloudtail being bros. Ashpaw was so loyal to Cloudpaw in the Prophecies Begin.

On another topic, another thing I feel is OOC for imposter Ashfur is the elder neglect/elder abuse. He had never abused elders previously and even under the argument we never saw how Ashfur felt about elders so the Erins had freedom, and he has no scruples when it comes to Squirrelflight and his imposter agenda.

Brightheart, Brackenfur, and Cloudtail are Ashfur’s piers, and he was an apprentice alongside Bright and Cloud. Him and Cloudtail had a close brother relationship. So I thought it was off that he was mistreating them with this being said, them being the cats in the clan he’s most familiar with. He was screwed up in the head, but he had friends, and he didn’t have no morality whatsoever when he was alive.