#but byler makes me insane about this concept

[oceanic-sunsets]

this post is making me ask once again if any of you in the tag knows/has written a byler fic of them navigating how to become a couple after being years for so long and repressing their feelings... also attaching my tags bc if you haven't considered it i'm begging do u see the potential...

[greenfiend]

hello! your theories are absolutely crazy and i love them- i’m truly convinced that the one with hopper is accurate. however, i was wondering if you had a favorite theory? one that you think is more likely than others? (i know most of them go hand in hand, but i wanted to ask anyway)

Thank you thank you!!! I honestly feel like I’m Joyce Byers sometimes trying to explain these theories. 😅 Because, anon, I *know* people will think I’m insane and reaching but… I see the plausibility. I also just like to look outside the box, and expect the unexpected. Remember how difficult it would have been to predict Vecna during seasons 1-3? It’d be nearly impossible (but there were clues…)

Regarding my favourite and the most likely- flayed Hopper without a doubt. That theory still drives me insane! While watching season 3, I can now pinpoint when David Harbour is playing flayed Hopper and regular Hopper! His expressions are over-the-top and his voice is less deep while flayed. Regular Hopper? He’s more calm and stoic (but he has his moments too). During one of the regular Hopper scenes, the Major makes a comment: “why so serious?” 🧐

(Side note, I *get* why David Harbour is so giddy about Byler- he literally plays Will at times. Lmao).

The concept of flayed Hopper (and others) is clever on grander scale too.

Because, think about it:

- Season 2 featured Will being flayed by the mind flayer. Season 3 featured Will doing the flaying. It’s the reverse!

- Textually, we see the other William (Billy) going around “flaying” others in season 3. While, subtextually we see our favourite William (Will) doing his own flaying too. Of course, Will’s “flaying” is a lot less sinister, and a lot more funny/adorable.

- Will says he’s “not gonna fall in love”- yet he LOVES love. He’s going around playing Cupid with not just Hopper/Joyce but the other couples too; he’s living vicariously through them. (Notice how Will suddenly appears in the shot below when Lucas says the “right” thing to Max.)

(If anyone is interested, I’ll elaborate more on how Will is the love guru in season 3.)

But yeah, I also just have SO many questions about flayed Hopper too. Is Will aware he’s doing this? Is this ST3 Will doing the flaying or a future Will? Is ST3 a whole ass simulation created by Will? Is it just Will’s world and everyone is living in it?

“Welcome to my world” - Will Byers

(Look at this little guy playing with his “pawns”.)

I could go on but I’ll stop for now. Haha.

Thank you for your ask!!!

Also- anon (and anyone else), if you’re interested in joining my theory community group just message me and I’ll invite you!

[robynrocksforbrains]

AU concept:

If anyone wants to use this as inspiration for drawing, a comic, a fic, literally anything, feel free to. Take creative liberty wherever you want, but tag me so I can see it because I'm insane about it :)

It's a platonic madwheeler speedster AU. Set in the DCU.

Lots of madwheeler siblingism, Mike is an idiot and Max is an instigator. They get their powers because Mike is doing something stupid involving electricity and Max is enabling him at the time of the particle accelerator explosion. Because they're at the same place at the same time, they end up being affected in the same way, and therefore both become speedsters.

So here's the general stuff:

Max is Zoomer (kind of a given) (not to be confused with Zoom), her suit is red with green accents, her lightning is white

Mike is Zipper (Zip for short) (credit to @piper-yipee for the name), his suit is blue with yellow accents, his lightning is green (yes this is entirely for byler reasons)

(I know that lightning colors have different causes in DC canon, but for this AU that is not the case, I'm just choosing lighting colors based on what I want. Cope.)

Zipper and Zoomer I mean COME ON IT'S PERFECT

Established lumax

Slow burn byler because I said so

Once they discover they have powers they go a little crazy about it and Mike immediately wants to be a superhero while Max tries to stay levelheaded about it and reason with Mike that he doesn't know the first thing about being a superhero. Mike ultimately concedes that he doesn't know the first thing about being a superhero and he shouldn't just jump into something like that.

Something happens, whether it be an accident or a crime doesn't really matter, but Mike and Max are there when it happens. Even though they decided that neither of them were gonna jump into anything, they can't stand by and let people get hurt when they know they could do something about it. So they save the day.

After that they decide that they wanna use their powers for good but that they need to be smart about it

They decide to tell Dustin about their powers. He's a super smart science guy and he makes suits for them and has the time of his life learning about the speed force

They decide that they are NOT telling Lucas and Will (they're gonna find out eventually though)

Other stuff:

Will, El, and Lucas are also metahumans, but their powers manifest at a later date.

Will: dimensional awareness (like Vibe), erebokinesis (the power to generate or manipulate darkness or shadows), heliokinesis (the power to bend and control sunlight)

El: I don't have a specific preference, but anything similar to her canon powers would be interesting

Lucas: I also don't have a specific preference for him, I just think there's not nearly enough superhero Lucas content and I need more. Maybe vibrokinesis?

Willel siblings obviously

Once Will learns about Mike and Max's superhero activities, he insists on helping Dustin design better suits for them, because although they may be functional they could look so much better and Will is an artist so

The superhero squad is called The Party because obviously

That's all I got for now, I think, I'll probably edit this post as I think of more stuff. HOWEVER! I do know how Will learns about his powers and Mike being Zipper. This is heavily based on how Cisco discovers his powers in CWs The Flash.

So, Will ends up being in the wrong place at the wrong time while Zip and Zoomer are fighting some villain. Mike isn't fast enough and he isn't able to save him, Will dies. (They're very much in love at this point but neither of them has confessed). Mike obviously loses it. He's holding Will in his arms and the only thing running through his mind is some theory Dustin had about the speed force and time travel. He doesn't even think about it he just starts running. He ends up two days in the past and manages to prevent Will's death. He intends to take this to his grave, no one knows. Not even Max or Dustin. But then Will starts having flashbacks to the timeline where he died. He keeps reliving his death, and every time he sees Zipper, mask off, so really he sees Mike, begging him to just hold on. And maybe even telling Will that he loves him. And Will feels like he's going crazy. One day he can't take it anymore and he tells Mike about it, and Mike ends up coming clean about everything because he's tired of lying to Will. Will doesn't really know how to feel about it, he tells Mike he needs some space to process it. He's not mad at Mike, he's just really confused and overwhelmed and he feels slightly betrayed because Mike kept his whole superhero life from him for as long as he did. Obviously they work things out in the end and Will joins the superhero squad.

That's all for now folks

[castlebyersafterdark]

is this a safe space to say that older byler art always makes me feel unhinged bc older mike looks so hot? 😭 like jfc he is treating will RIGHT in life and in bed. the finger under will's chin? phew. my fave design fr

so much so that every time I see similar ones the vision gets clearer. like these:

https://www(.)tumblr.com/greenfiend/749131092412563456/hello-firstly-i-wanted-to-say-how-much-im-been?source=share

https://www(.)tumblr.com/solisevart/748698715155546112/please-plspsls-can-you-post-a-close-up-of-the?source=share

i hadnt thought about older byler looks much til some started hitting and now I see it clearly. they grow up so gorgeous I know it!

Oh you know I REALLY love older Byler. It's just such an important and dear concept to me, you know?? The idea that they find each other young and stay together, it's Mike and Will forever, "for the rest of our lives" and that they're a team. They're so in love. A gay couple that got together as kids in the 80s and got to live and grow old together? Beautiful and sweet. I know they're fictional, but the concept is so important to see.

And it doesn't hurt that they are just stunners for life, as well. Older Mike is always sooooo fine. Older Will is just gorgeous too, but thinking of an older Mike who find confidence and contentment is also a lovely thought. And him and Will having passion and a really full and active love life well into the future - siiiiiigh. Yes yes yes. All great art you linked to - but also the one you're referencing makes me a little insane as well, they're so sweet and sexy and ahhhh older Byler is incredible. Hope more people come around to it, I know for some reason some aren't into it.

[starsarefire824]

Sorry to unload Byler into your askbox but I am going *insane* with the concept of Mike knowing and understanding that he likes Will, even before the Big Reveal(tm) and the only reason that he hasn't acted on it is bc he has internalised some wild homophobia/self hatred and like maybe he also has some vague idea that Will is possibly queer and yeah it's fine if it's his friend and he will defend him until death but god forbid Mike is queer

No worries anon! I don't mind at all. I am actually going to go on a very long rant about this so buckle up. (Sorry everyone)

I think Mike's feelings revolving around Will are extremely complicated. I am wary of the idea that Mike knows and understands his feelings for Will directly. I think that the repression is real for Mike unfortunately.

That being said, I think that people's opinion's of Mike's behavior in season 3 and 4 being the way it was is because he's straight is completely wrong. If anything, it just proves to me more that he's queer. (I am a bi mike truther, and I think that having any positive bi representation is always a wonderful and a much needed thing, but in truth, I am not too attached to any, specific idea for him. Gay, bi, pan, unlabeled. It doesn't matter to me. He is queer lol) I do love the idea of him being bi, because I think it explains some of his back and forth and confusing behavior that we've seen from the beginning. I also think it is a very real reason as to why he is so confused and repressed. As someone who didn't have "the revelation" until my twenties, but also have had some very complicated relationships that didn't make sense until after I had that realization, I honestly really feel for Mike. I get him.

That’s why I have to laugh when people say if people's opinions on Mike and Will are based on subtext then they are looking too much into it. What people like that don’t understand is literally most queer people’s lives, especially when they are young and coming of age IS ALL ENTIRELY SUBTEXT. And the time period this show takes place in only exasperates that.

Things are never said out loud, true feelings are veiled with other issues, people are jealous and they don’t know why, they can’t figure out why they want that one friend all to themselves, why does it hurt so much when they choose to be with someone else? The way Mike acted in these seasons was very deliberate imo. He’s pushing Will away on purpose in season 3. And why is it exactly, that Mike can never balance Will and El emotionally when they are expecting and asking things of him?

So to answer your question lol after this tangent just keeps getting longer, I’m not convinced Mike truly knows why he feels like he needs to do that in season 3, but it doesn’t change the fact that his behavior is and can be very normal for queer kids figuring out their shit.

In that season, it's entirely to do with repression and nothing to do with him not wanting to play d&d anymore. So yes, internalized homophobia and self-hatred and denial of feelings is strong in Mike's character. Much more so than Will. Will has his issues and definitely has a lot of pain and feels like a "mistake" sometimes. We can see that shown to us in the destruction of castle byers scene. But as far as self-awareness and accepting himself for who he is, Will has never had too much of a problem with that. Will has never tried to be someone he's not. He has never given into a relationship or a situation because "it's what you're supposed to do" or to hide himself in anyway. I feel like Will is pretty unapologetically himself, even with his insecurities. That's why, imo, he receives the brunt of the bullying out of all the boys, especially in the beginning of the show. He doesn't change his clothes or his hobbies or his quiet sweetness. His true self never falters. The only time I can think of a time where he does anything like that is when he dances with the girl in season 2. But who's the one that pushes him to do it? That had more to do with pleasing Mike than it did with trying to be untrue to himself. And we've seen obviously from the scene in the classroom in season four that Will has most certainly not continued to do that as he's matured.

As for Mike, I think that season 4 something shifts a little bit. I think that Mike had a bit of a revelation at the end of season three and I think that being separated from El and Will really made him realize some things. Is he ready to face what that actually means in his relationship with Will? No, not in my opinion. But the way he so quickly and honestly responds to the fight in Rink-O-Mania (one last push for Mike to push Will away) and Will's support regarding El's letter in Jonathan's bedroom to me really is showing how Mike's feeling. He wants/needs things to be good between them. He wants Will in his life. He wants things to go back the way they were in season 1 and 2. He finally gives Will the attention he has so desperately asked for for two seasons all while struggling with this "issue" of telling his girlfriend he loves her. I think that the uncertainty and push/pull he is feeling is actually painful to watch. Because Mike does love El. And as Finn Wolfhard said, "he just wants to be normal." Normal is telling your girlfriend you love her. Normal is being in a relationship with a girl. Normal is not choosing your best friend over your girlfriend. Normal is putting her first. And so he does go through with it, but I really deep down believe that that is not what he really wants. I really think that since the end of season 3 Mike has realized that he also wants to spend his life in the basement with his best friend. Has he figured out that that love is romantic and that his feelings are sexual? I don't think he's completely figured that out yet. But I do think we'll get some more scenes of Mike having ??? in season 5, even before the Big Reveal. And i think that internal homophobia, self-denial, and refusal to accept who he really is all played a part in Mike's struggle.

[andiwriteordie]

You should write the Merlin Byler au, I say, bc I'm a little shit like that 😘😘😘 . Imagine it, really, bc this means that, what, Nancy is Morgana? Will as Merlin, who literally never told anyone about his magic bc they all died (Lancelot doesn't count bc he died just like. Later. I have so many feelings about Lancelot ngl). Also Mike as Arthur, a pompous and arrogant prince who hates his dad but loves him but also hates him. He isn't sure how he feels about magic except that he's been told his entire life that it sucks. Also he gets insanely jealous that everyone likes his manservant more than him low-key. That's what he's jealous about, obviously, not the fact that he's in love with his servant pfft. He's a little silly smh

Then again, AUs don't have to be one-to-one, just like. Them in the universe... 🤔

Also also. I have Never watched Merlin (in full, I watched the first few eps) but I know. Everything that happened and read too many fics bout it??? Lancelot and Merlin friendship that Arthur is insanely jealous of is so funny to me wow

Man. Now I wanna read fics for Merlin again (the fic writers that kinda dragged me into the fandom deleted all of her fics rip)

OH I SEE THE VISION. I SEE THE VISION TOY!!!! UGH THAT WOULD BE SO FUN???

also i just am realizing. this would probably make el gwen because of the arthur/gwen relationship. and like i'm kinda giggling at the image of like... mike's closest friend having magic and also his girlfriend having magic. except will and el don't know the other one has magic either. magical threat comes up? and sometimes it gets dealt with, which is nice! will gets a break when el deals with it, and vice versa for el. they don't ever really question it, bless their hearts. mike definitely doesn't question it.

i feel like if i ever did do a merlin/byler kind of au, it wouldn't exactly be one to one because merlin is so niche, but just like... the concept and setting of merlin where magic is illegal and stuff, and will has to hide it from mike who's the prince, etc. etc. just all the goodness and angst that comes with the show but then adapted to fit the stranger things canon.

also hear me out: morgana!el because she gets manipulated by henry and/or brenner and truly believes what she's doing is right, but then through meeting like will and the others, she gets redeemed and helps save the day in the end? but also like. willel getting to fight with their magic before that happens would be so so so fun.

ok literally this is making me want to return to reading and writing merlin fics!!!! it's just so good!!!

(also yeah i watched part of merlin when i was like 12... and i was on tumblr when it ended and all that so i knew the plot and stuff... and then i just like fully watched it this past year, so i'm in my merlin renaissance this year lol)

[strangeswift]

I actually think it is important to be be 'controversial' sometimes because it clears your mind. I am speaking from personal experience. After reading same things over and over again in the tag and seeing the same takes, it blurs your mind and it is like you join a caddle. Then you kinda need to step back and think more clearly and reading other takes and readings help you to clear your mind. I've changed my mind on many things because of that and I believe I have a better understanding in things now than before. Like. I am not gonna get blindsided by what happens next on the show because I do not agree with most popular byler takes (that are reaches most of the time). I still read those things but I am open to different or 'controversial' takes and ideas that are not widely accepted by the bylers in the tag.

Hi anon!!!! Oop I went on a rant so hold on lemme put a read more. Warning I talk about byler doubt (just the concept of having doubts nothing specific about it) towards the end.

Okay anon I agree and this makes me feel good about posting opinions that go against the grain. So thank you for saying this, because I'll be real even though I am confident in my takes, sometimes voicing them comes with a level of anxiety. Here's the thing. The tag likes to act like there are certain things we know for sure are going to happen in S5 (byler endgame being the biggest thing obviously, but there are lots of other more specific things, byler related and not) and the truth is: We Don't Know Anything For Sure!! And I think it's wise to be prepared for the possibility that things work out differently than we are expecting. And this goes for fandom discourse as well not just theories like I think the tag is a bit of an echo chamber, like you said. It truly is easy to get sucked it. I've always been extremely skeptical, that's just how I am, and sometimes I forget that just.. not everyone is as skeptical as I am. Don't get me wrong, I have been sucked in before too. There have been instances where I held an opinion, then when I examined it further I realized it was just rooted in the fact that everyone else held that opinion, and I didn't actually agree with it. But generally I take anything and everything with several grains of salt, which is why like you said it's probably good for me to talk about my opinions when they differ from the norm, because it offers an alternative line of thinking. I do keep my mouth shut about most things because I like to be liked, but yk... I also. hmm do I wanna talk about this.. eh fuck it. I think the biggest thing that makes me "controversial" to some people, other than disagreeing with widely accepted theories, is that I have on several occasions voiced my Byler Doubt™️. And honestly there's a reason why I do sometimes talk about it. I realize that there's no point in dwelling on the possibility of byler not happening, it's depressing. And I would never put doubt in the tag or anything like that. But here's my thing. When I was a smaller blog and didn't have the platform I do now, NONE of the big blogs ever EVER expressed any level of doubt. The narrative was "having doubt is bad, endgame is obvious, if you don't find it obvious you are media illiterate, stuck in heteronormativity, or just plain stupid." And I vehemently disagree with that. Frankly? I find 100% confidence to be a little bit unrealistic, but I would never ever think someone is any less intelligent for having 100% confidence! But I digress. My point is, I suspect there are many people, like me, who have doubts and who feel very isolated. Having doubt is literally taboo, which is insane to me. It's cult vibes is what it is. Anyway. Now that I have a big enough platform that I more or less can kind of say what I want and not get blacklisted, I almost feel a responsibility to occasionally be like hey by the way, I have my doubts! Just so people know. Because it doesn't make you stupid. It makes you realistic. Okay rant over sorry <3

[medilies]

Echo Home - from Will's Spotify playlist

Watch me slowly go insane over a song, and make many dubious jumps in logic to connect the lyrics to byler, even though it doesn't really tell us anything new...

A lot of this analysis you could argue is a reach, apart from this:

So, in the album Ash & Ice by The Kills, there's a little symbol associated with each song. The one for Echo Home, in Will's official Spotify playlist, is - oh, look, a telephone.

Specifically a blue telephone, which is double points for supporters of the colour theory. And where are (blue) telephones linked to Will in the show?

That's right, at the end of season 3, and phone calls between Will and Mike are a central point of their s4 Rink-O-Mania argument. There's also the first ep of s1 when Will calls for help, but the lyrics of the song don't really fit. So I think it's safe to say the song is addressed from Will to Mike, and is likely in regards to the distance that grew between them in the year before March 1986. ("This past year [...] I feel like I lost you")

Side note: I love how the phone is a perfect symbol of their miscommunication issues.

Analysing the lyrics though this lens, there's a few interesting things that crop up (though it's entirely possible this song was selected purely due to the phone symbol, angsty vibes, and the fact it fits Will's music tastes):

"I'm flowing with the waters

I'm spinning into orbit

So won't you come on home

And make it alright

I'm drifting in the same old boat

With a different crew"

There's a strong sense the speaker is lost and listless, without a strong purpose/drive, because someone important to them is no longer in their life. They aren't able to move on, and think having that person back would make it all better (sound familiar?). The line "drifting in the same old boat/ With a different crew" is probably referring to the move to Cali - but again that Will doesn't feel like he's changed much internally.

The line "won't you come on home" or "won't you echo home" is repeated several times. I think it's really interesting that Will is asking Mike to come home when it's Will that moved away in the first place - it could suggest that Mike is the one that withdrew emotionally, and it also links to the weirdness around the concept of home with byler, like when Mike took Will 'home' to his basement in s2.

Okay, and this is more of a fun thought than a serious suggestion, but wouldn't it be cool if the lines

"And if I take a turn for the worst

And I call you on the phone

Will you echo home when I call

Won't you echo back and make it alright

Won't you echo home and make me fine"

were referring to Will calling Mike from Cali when he was struggling with the anniversary effect?

Alternative meaning: Mike's mental health issues?

Okay, this interpretation is a massive leap and less coherent (and even more depressing), but a couple lines had me thinking...

References to water, with mention of drifting in boats and the very first line "I'm flowing with the waters". That reminds me of Will's fake body floating in the quarry - which was very traumatic for Mike to see - and maybe something else that happened there....?

"And it's a long long long long drop/ From the rocks to the pearls, we got so lost [...] for so long" Yup. Mike's cliff jump, aka one of the top ten signs someone is Not Okay.

This song could be about the moment Will finds out Mike nearly died when Will was in the Upside Down. Also, this line is about dropping 'from the rocks to the pearls', descension through ascension, (kind of the opposite of the famous Miles Morales falling upwards shot), and if you really wanted to relate it to byler it could suggest that Mike drops from being close with Will, or from homosexuality (seen as 'the rocks', lowest of the low, at the time), to heterosexuality when he dates El - it's seen as an acension or the right thing to do by society, but it only causes Mike conflict and confusion. Following on from that, the line "we got so lost [...] for so long" could show Mike feeling lost due to heteronormativity, or that Mike and Will had started to lose each other from s1 when Mike jumped off the quarry cliff.

"You can keep your own dear life

You can lose it all if you wanna

But I can't keep you out of mine, oh no"

This could be Will acknowledging that he can't stop Mike either from ending things with Will or even from ending his own life, but he also could never bear to let Mike go.

Bonus references:

"We were dancing to a beat of our own/ Flying with our speakers blown". Could link to Mike and Will dancing to a (homosexual) beat of their own in younger years, before societal expectations and comphet drove a wedge between them. Also could relate to Mike/Will 'flying around with all the other fairies' as Troy puts it, just as Mike flew when El saved him from jumping off the cliff.

"Maybe you went out of your mind" Crazy together reference, anyone?

I apologise in the very likely case that someone has said some of the exact same things!

[willbyerssupremacist]

ok so after reading the script like 78 times i've come to the conclusion that they're definitely building up byler endgame, so read this so i can help yall stop doubting what is right in front of you.

it specifically states that jonathan can see will is hurting. obviously, we know this, but think about the implications of this for a second.

mike and will's friendship is seemingly repaired by this point, so clearly being friends is not enough to stop the hurt.

many believe that will can just move on or that he'll be okay stepping back for mike and eI, this scene clearly shows that this is most likely not going to happen.

so what next? is will expected to suffer forever? seriously, they could've done anything with his character. they could've just had him be gay but no, they made him in love with mike.

will is in love with mike and he has been since they were kids. this is a once in a lifetime kind of love. really, why else would they have made will specifically in love with mike if it wasn't going to be endgame?

i mean cmon, it's literally common sense. you have this love triangle, right? two of the members have this unhealthy relationship that's clearly not working. the third person, usually a protagonist or an underdog, watches as the love of his life slips away believing that they will never have a chance. what usually ends up happening? the couple in the love triangle will break up and the protagonist will end up with the person they love.

i know that eI is technically the "main character", but they've specifically made this aspect of the plot in will's perspective. he is literally in every single milkvan shot EXCEPT for the one that clearly shows that their relationship is falling apart. come ON. eI is seemingly hurting from her and mike's relationship too, yet they barely acknowledge this and make her entire storyline about independence, ARE YOU KIDDING? it cannot be more in your face than that.

not to mention the imagery and dialogue. will and mike had like 400 heart-to-hearts this season showing a real, pure, loving relationship, romantic or not. their words to eachother are so poetic it literally makes me feel like i'm going insane because how does nobody else see how romantically coded these scenes are???

and the lighting?? the framing?? all of their scenes are beautifully framed and lit. the desert scene? god the lighting was unreal, and them on top of the car? they showed like 60 different angles,i played it back the other day and i was shocked because they have never put this amount of detail into ANY mitochondria scene. then the van scene, same thing. we get a mirror shot??? the beautiful lighting shining on will?? and then we get the pizzeria scene, AGAIN with the bizarre yet creative angles??? and then the couch scene at the end with the angelic ass lighting. and finally. them standing next to eachother on the field. COME ON.

it's so blatant at this point that i'm 99.9% confident in byler endgame. the duffers are smart and this is a beautiful, clean storyline that they have laid out.

it is so obvious yet the general audience refuses to acknowledge the possibility because this is a queer couple. which is exactly why the duffers are clever for going about it the way that they are. the general audience hasn't fully caught on but once it's revealed people are going to put the pieces together and realize that it has truly been built up strategically this entire time.

people doubt the duffers too much. "you're putting too much faith in th-" no. these talented writers that came up with the entire concept of one of the most popular shows today are not going to put random clues in or reveal a storyline like this for no reason if it's not gonna lead anywhere. they're smart, they're clever, they want us to analyze.

[demadogs]

why you bylers want to make mike and will live a miserable life? in the 80s it was a crime to be gay,if they got together they would be like in prison. grow up kids 😌

i find it interesting how my mlvn/antibyler anons have evolved over the last couple months. before volume one came out it was all people telling me the concept of believing in either of them being gay and liking each other was absolutely ridiculous and that i was completely delusional for anything i pointed out that could be evidence for why i thought so. then volume one came out and i got some mlvn anons telling me its all queerbait bullshit, so they were admitting that they do see the queercoding at least on wills part but hoping its just bait. either that or they still denied wills painfully obvious feelings. then volume two came out and the duffers and actors confirmed wills feelings so they couldnt deny that any more but still called me insane for thinking mike liked him back.

and now i get messages like this. where people are pretty much admitting that they do see the queercoding for both of them and are no longer denying that its there. i still get antibyler anons but its no longer “youre SO insane for thinking this could ever happen!!” now its more like “this might be happening and im PISSED about it so im gonna try and find a way to make you look bad for wanting this!!”

same for the deranged antiwill anons ive gotten where people are hoping he dies. never got any of those before volume one but now that will canonically loves mike and they see that as a genuine threat to their precious mlvn they want him gone. the fact that they want him dead proves that they may reluctantly see mikes love for will now. because one of their biggest arguments for byler not being endgame now is them insisting that will is going to die, not because mike could never love him back.

[nances]

ik this has already been discussed here but it's still appalling to me how some of the tiktok bylers r some of the insanest most chronically online mfs one can encounter

they'll bash people for not being mlm and under 18 while shipping byler and their favorite target is specifically "jobless 20yo bi women on tumblr" as if they don't copy most of our analyses word for word ??

most of them are 14-year-olds that likely started watching ST this year and while there's nothing inherently wrong with that alone, there's a problem with how entitled they act. you can't gatekeep shit that wasn't yours to gatekeep to begin with 💀

i've been in this fandom since the age of 13 and shipped byler since i was 14, do you expect me to suddenly stop caring about it? like? sorry for.... aging? i guess? like most of y'all were under 10 when byler first became a thing, show some goddamn respect 😭😭

like i said i was 14 when i first started shipping it and if it wasn't for the ""jobless bi women in twenties"" (most of whom are closer to 30 now if not there yet) on tumblr who provided brilliant analysis on season 2, i probably wouldn't have noticed most of the shit that's being discussed on here now, all thanks to them. now im obviously taking more of an analyst's role too since i'm grown up, more observant and better with words than i used to be.

do you also want the cast to stop shipping them since most of them are nearing their 20s too?

newsflash, most people don't suddenly switch off their interests to become parents and have a full time job when they turn 18. yes i work, and yes i enjoy stranger things and byler as a concept, no i won't stop caring about it just bc i'm 19. the show's literally written by 2 men nearing their 40s.

the "mlm fetishism" argument is insane too. mlm fetishism is wrong obviously but literally none of us do that, the characters are literal minors... if you think shipping mlm ships is inherently sexualizing then i hate to break it to you but you're the one with issues💀 i personally don't ship it because of the mlm aspect alone but more so because it's the only thing that makes sense in terms of narrative integrity like you've got people with whole ass degrees in film and tv saying it makes sense.... and i'll keep it real with you it's literally the only mlm ship in stranger things that i care about because it has a lot of canon potential and i'd likely ship it even if it was straight

[strangertheories]

Hello, it's the anon who makes the short asks super long again. Here to talk about the same thing as last time, the Twitter script polls.

The options are getting more and more ridiculous, plus they're also still blatantly ignoring ronance too. They added two Angela scene options but they couldn't spare a space for at least 1 ronance scene out of so many shown in S4????

Only decent options (imo) are Jonathan and Will, and maybe Mike's monologue (for different reasons ofc)

Do you think they're trying to stretch out how long they can do the script polls by adding these wacky options so they can keep our attention longer? (To be fair all this anticipation for the polls has got the ST fandom waiting for content instead nothing till we get S5)

P.S.

Aha, this one isn't quite as long as I usually make it!

I'm personally voting for Johnathan and Will, but the Angela gets hit by a putter option is very tempting. Because this means originally they were golfing and Will sadly golfing in a vaguely homosexual manner is very funny to me. And how would Eleven get golf humiliated? Would she get golf balls chucked at her? And the concept of Angela getting bashed in by a golf club is kind of insane, I feel like that's why Eleven got arrested for attempted murder because that is seriously lethal. I have so many questions about that scene. However I really want the Johnathan and Will scene so I will hold off on voting for Angela getting golfed.

I'm aware Byler shippers like myself want the Mike monologue but I really don't think it'll give away Byler or anything because they wouldn't put it as an option if it said "Mike actually doesn't love Eleven and wants to smooch boys" for spoiler reasons. It's just going to say Mike loves Eleven or else they wouldn't put it as an option. And then the Byler fandom would have a couple of days of misery before becoming optimistic again because that is what always happens whenever there is a Byler setback. I don't think it means Byler isn't canon, just that they're not going to reveal it, so let's get some Byers family and gay Will content for now. They also haven't put options for any early season Mike and Will scenes yet and whilst I'd vote for them if they pop up, I don't think they'll confirm Byler.

Also the lack of Ronance is just! I want to see there scenes so badly and I swear they must be getting more requests for that scene, especially considering how we got Steve and Eddie in the woods. Personally I'd like the officially friends scene but all of the scenes at the asylum would be cool too. In terms of them stretching it out, I'm not sure why they'd do that (maybe for more attention or so fans are satisfied for longer?) but it does seem like that's the case. That or their sources for which scene are very poor.

Thanks for the ask again (: