#but also how great would it be if people had the same amount of discourse

[fourteentrout]

I say we stop or at least combat the gwynriel elriel discourse by completely 180-ing and shipping Azriel with every available MALE character. Azris? superb. flawless. no notes. im obssessed. lets go futher. Azriel x Tamlin. This one I'm genuinely considering. Hell, Azriel x ANY of the unmated High Lords. I've seen people suggest Beron (though I personally would never be able to like him, maybe getting dicked down by the hottest torturer of all time could spark a change of character). Azriel x Keir if we're sticking with the route of villain crackships. Azriel x Lord Devlon. Azriel x Jurian (shooting someone in the heart with a weapon sure to kill them can be very romantic actually). Azriel x Thesan AND his lover. Double wing duty for the Dawn Lord. Azriel x Graysen, elain's shitty ex fiancee. Shit, just give Az all the shitty ex fiancees. He can fix them, probably. or at least use them to help himself. Let my boy get some man power, maybe he'll stop practically jizzing his pants every time he smells elain if he's too busy getting railed til the walls come down.

[elexuscal]

the longer i stay in fandom, the longer i think a huge amount of bad takes and discourse come from an... abundance of identifying with a character

to be clear, i don't think it's bad to identify with a character. far from it! i think that's part of what makes fiction so powerful.

and it's only logical people often attach to a blorbo because they're just like me, for real. a person will see some element of themselves-- their race, their gender, their sexuality, their hobbies, their family life, their specific flavour of neurodivergence-- and something just resonates. it gives them a way to explore and name this important part of themselves, a part they maybe didn't even know existed before it.

and everything is well and good until some split between them and the character shows up

because of course, no character, except an explicit self-insert written by yourself, will ever be a perfect 1:1 for your own experiences. so sooner or later-- maybe in canon, maybe in a fanwork-- your blorbo diverges from your lived experience in a huge way.

I think this is why shipping culture in particular gets so toxic. While it is by no means the only way to indulge with shipping, a significant portion is 'if i was in that character's shoes, i would choose X'. the fight becomes for your own self-identity.

but this gets expanded in other ways. a character who is revealed to be black when the majority of the fandom had just assumed they were white. or revealed to be queer, or maybe the 'wrong' flavour of queer. or fuck, even some more innocuous part of their backstory, one that's nonetheless so meaningful for SOMEONE, but now it feels like the story is saying, fuck you, we're doing something else

i don't know. i just feel acknowledging this perceived-attack-on-identity helps me understand why people react it what seems to be such outsized way to canon and fanworks alike.

at the same time, i think it's a really important thing to check in yourself.

it's nice, to see a character who you identify with. who resonates with for being like you. but it's also nice to acknowledge and appreciate the way characters are not like you at All. how great it is to get insight into this totally different lived experience. and to muse on how wonderful that recognition might be for someone who does have that background.

[bird-inacage]

Net x James: An important reminder that BL partnerships consist of two individuals and they are not just a single entity.

So the Netjames news has been a notable bombshell in the fandom of late, and I've been quietly observing this as it unfolded earlier this week, particularly the varying reactions and discourse around it.

In his statement, James explained that his current career goals are moving in a different direction, which has resulted in him pulling out of 'Love Upon a Time', and by extension his acting partnership with Net. He wants to explore his other avenues as an artist, whereas Net is presumably focused on acting for now.

With BL partnerships, we often see the two co-stars tied at the hip. Its part of the gig and it comes with the territory. They don't just work together on their project, but they do a huge amount of activity (both public and private) outside of that. They travel, perform, they do fan meets, press events, and spend a huge amount of time together as a twosome. So we get accustomed to seeing them as a united entity, which means news like this tends to hit harder because it feels akin to a divorce. This is one of the pitfalls of the Thai BL industry. When you create a narrative around two people who exclusively come as a package, it makes it incredibly difficult for both the actors themselves and fans to accept or make peace with any possible deviation from that. I think it's natural for any actor or artist to desire collaboration with different people: to develop their craft, to further their experience, to broaden their versatility. If sticking to only one working partner 'for life' doesn't work for them, I completely empathise with that.

In their recent Instagram lives, Net and James were clearly sad and their feelings still very raw. This led to a lot of speculation regarding any ill-feeling or fall out between the two. But such accusations can be harmful. Even in an amicable or mutual break-up where ending a relationship is in both parties' best interests - the two people involved are still grieving. Being brutally honest and transparent with someone close to you, that things can no longer continue as they are, isn't easy. If fans feel upset, just imagine how difficult this is on them both. When you've been nurtured as a partnership from the get go, your co-star whose always been at your side provides a sense of safety and familiarity. And the prospect of now moving forward without them is a scary new unknown. On top of that, they probably feel an immense amount of pressure and guilt in digesting the potential fallout and response from their fans. There will be trepidation in how well their careers will fare in the immediate aftermath.

Despite this, there are also positives to be taken from this decision. Arguably, Net and James were still in the early stages of their partnership. Bed Friend really put them on the map as a couple. So for James to come forward with this realisation now, before they got too established as a pairing was a responsible thing to do. I'm sure the last thing anyone wants is for their favourite artists to feel stuck or obliged to continue working together, which would undoubtedly lead to feelings of resentment eventually.

So respectfully, these instances are not to be taken personally or to be deemed as a betrayal of your support. After all, what we know of these artists is only a very small piece of their identities as people. It's okay to be devastated, but be respectful of their wishes. You can choose to continue supporting them as individuals, or choose to no longer support them at all - either way, you are perfectly valid and entitled to your choice, just extend the same courtesy back and be mindful of casting unfair judgement on their choice.

For me, it is admittedly a shame because I did see great potential in them both as a pair, and they had fantastic chemistry which could have been nurtured with more time and experience. Regardless, I truly believe they both have immense love for one another, and I wish them both the very best. They've just come to terms with the fact they no longer share the same vision for what they want in their careers. And that's okay.

(I will always be grateful that they gave us THIS iconic moment).

[briarpatch-kids]

Seeing the latest discourse I feel like there needs to be some sort of. Disability dictionary? To outline "these are the terms with legal definitions that are not up for debate" and "these are the terms with general definitions that can be interpreted in x y z ways." Like the severely disabled thing, you were using the legal definition/understanding of the term, while that other person was using a social understanding of the term. They do absolutely deserve better help and the situation they're living in is abysmal, not being able to afford what you need to not live in pain every day would be horrible for anyone, but. They didn't seem to be understanding how the definition of "severely disabled" you were using had actual legal basis and guidelines for qualifications of the term and hence help. You weren't arguing the level of care and accommodations they would definitely benefit from, more just pointing out that legally speaking you two have different experiences, and only yours qualifies for the help offered in our current support systems for in home care. Which frankly that sucks! People who would benefit from care and higher level mobility aides should be given them, even if they can "do without" if they absolutely have to, even if they're in pain. But that isn't how the system works and it's not how "severely disabled," as a legal term, is defined. So many distinctions like these don't seem to be common knowledge. The scope of disability is wide and many people belong in this community, but if most people aren't on the same page on how to use the terms that already exist, it makes it harder not just to find people with similar experiences but also to just. Communicate with other people in the community. A lack of shared understanding of community terms can really create massive obstacles for mutual understanding and community organizing. I wonder if anyone's made a dictionary for things like this, and if they haven't, maybe it can be a community project...?

I feel like that would be awesome, but I also want to be nowhere NEAR the discourse of writing it. I'd imagine a whole lot of people like the one I dealt with earlier would want to control the narrative and the amount of arguments and stuff would be SO exhausting.

Ideally it would include things like "here's when I should have started using a manual wheelchair" "here's when I should have started using a powerchair" "this is what needing a ventilator feels like and heres why/how I got mine" and stuff like that from people with experience. Or like "this is how a disability assessment works and this is what theyre going to ask and what each question means" and "here's how to get aide hours in [country] and what qualifies for them."

Basic stuff for people new to disability and worried about what's going to happen or don't have any idea how it all works. It would be great to have multiple voices with a variety of circumstances and disabilities. Maybe a little section with different people and how they live just to give a picture of like... what life with SMA or a spinal cord injury or whatever is like. The good and bad and what kind of goals and hobbies they have and what they're interested in. The part that scares a lot of disabled people is the future and seeing people just out there living helps so much with that.

[wavesoutbeingtossed]

The whole discourse about the privacy/secrecy/support thing has been sitting with me for a few days (I mean other than it always does to a certain degree) thanks to all the excellent discussion happening and I know I'm not saying anything that hasn't been said a million times before, but I think what we're seeing and what we're going to learn (e.g. from TTPD) is that it wasn't just the support issue, but how it was shown/handled.

We've all gone out of our way to show that introversion =/= lack of support. Someone can be shy, reserved, etc. and still show up for their partner, whether in public or at home. To chalk any of the differences up to the clash between introversion and extroversion is unfair to folks who count themselves among either tbh.

@thisisctrying said something the other day that hit the nail on the head about how if that support had been offered in private, there very well may not have been a Joever to begin with, or at least not at this point in time. (Sorry for loosely paraphrasing, and for namedropping you! Long time listener, first time poster.)

If this were a case where the "shy" partner said, "I am really uncomfortable with the spotlight personally and do not want to court it, but I will support you in your ambitions and offer you whatever you need to make them happen and make the glare bearable," I suspect that would have gone a long way to making Taylor feel seen and comfortable in pursuing her goals in the way that she now has. Again, that might have been more akin to the balance that seemed to have been struck around 2019 from what we can see, but even speaking in a general sense, there are lots of couples out there, celebrity or not, that have similar approaches where there are highly driven people and busy careers involved.

(A famous example being Dolly Parton's marriage. Tbh I know next to nothing about her and Carl, but she's always heralded as an example in this regard, because her husband is famously uncomfortable with the spotlight and hasn't accompanied her to public events in decades, but she's said that she never minded that because that was always work to her, and what was important was that he supported her in pursuing all her career goals and basically ensured she had a place to call home to return to at the end of the day.)

We're kind of in a brave new world with her current relationship because it felt like, at least at the start, we were maybe watching her figure out her boundaries in real time as to what she was comfortable with or not and adjust accordingly. Like so many have said, I fully believe the extreme privacy thing was initially driven by herself and her experiences in 2016, and she needed that quiet time to recover from all of the things and figure out how to exist in the world again.

Stating the obvious, it seemed like eventually privacy was equated with secrecy, turning the relationship and the celebrity into the elephant in the room and something to never be spoken of to the outside world. People are free to choose whatever works best for themselves and their relationships, and for some the separate public lives might work, but the “kept me like a secret but I kept you like an oath” theme is all over her work and it’s clear that it’s a sore spot for her, because she’s been made to feel shame just for the life she leads so many times in the past.

What I’m trying to say is that it’s pretty obvious something Not Great was happening behind the scenes, which didn’t just amount to “she wanted to be a public celebrity and he wanted to be a private hermit.” (Also, in case anyone forgot, this is a person who also chose a public-facing career who also has to engage in press for it, but I digress.) As her career reached new heights post-folklore, if she had the support at home to do all the things without judgment and with encouragement, and in turn offer the same support to her partner, she may have very well lived just fine with that, not unlike Dolly Parton’s case.

By reading between the lines in all the press since, as well as comments on tour and general ~vibes~ with TTPD teasers, it seems like one of the issues was that that was likely not the case. There was all the stuff that we saw — the reticence to acknowledge each other in the media (particularly on one side), the lack of public support even at events at which they were both in attendance for their respective jobs, the great lengths they went to not to be photographed together at events they attended yet no problem taking pictures with other friends and coworkers, the jobs that separated them, the withdrawing from the public even for work accomplishments, etc. Which could all be manageable if a couple chooses to do so together and are not inherently a sign of trouble in themselves.

But what we’re seeing now I think is a reflection of the things we weren’t seeing then, and it seems to indicate some very deep hurt. (I know, call me Captain Obvious.) And like so many have been saying, it feels likely that that part of that hurt is rooted in that very lack of private support where a person would expect it from their partner. Obviously as a Taylor fan blog I’m going to be more inclined to understand her side of a story, but tbh, it’s also because… this is sooooooo common, and something I’ve experienced in my friend group. (@taylortruther is right when she says most breakups are the same one way or another lol.)

One partner is resentful of the other’s success, or resentful that the other’s priorities begin to evolve as new experiences unlock new goals, or feels the other’s ambitions are not worthy of pursuit, and coupled with perhaps their own struggles in the same domain, it’s easy to see where that can chip away at the other partner’s morale and faith in the relationship. I know I’m just speculating here, but I also don’t think it’s totally unfounded. (Again, because a) I’m picking up what she’s putting down and b) it happens to sooooooo many women even among us dull normals.)

With all the pointed mentions about how much Taylor feels supported in her current relationship and how she in turn loves to offer the same show of support to not only her partner but other loved ones, how she’s stepped out more in the last year to a whole host of events, how she’s mentioned feeling like she locked herself away for years and she’s just proud of her partner and happy she can show up for him even if the chaos around it is unsettling, it paints a picture of what perhaps was happening before last year.

To feel like you’re all alone in carrying the weight of the relationship (or burden of it), of twisting yourself into knots to accommodate the other person’s boundaries (or insecurities) but not feeling reciprocity for your own has to be so painful. (The idea that it may have been even darker and to have a partner not only be unreceptive to your own needs but even perhaps resentful/dismissive/belittling of them is even more painful to think of. I guess we’ll find out when TTPD comes out if that was the case, too.)

At a certain point, that lack of acknowledgement will force your hand to be able to reclaim yourself. And it feels like the further removed Taylor in particular is from it, the more she moves from being sad about the life she felt she gave up by leaving, to angry at the life she felt she was giving up by staying. Especially being in a relationship now where it seems like everything comes much easier, where she can be open about the person she’s with and show up for them, all the stuff that seemed as challenging as climbing Mount Everest in her past is nothing more than a molehill at best in her current life.

TL;DR: I don’t think it’s privacy that inherently spells doom for a celebrity relationship like this; it’s the mutual support and respect that does. If Taylor had felt that in the later years of her previous relationship, I think we could be seeing a different, though not necessarily unfulfilled, person right now in 2024, who’d be happy on tour but whose personal life would look a little different. But it seems like by losing that support she lost parts of herself, and we’ve seen her reclaim that in spades in the last year, and perhaps to degrees she didn’t even realize she could from before all the Bad Stuff started happening in her young adulthood.

I know this was extremely long-winded and unnecessary, especially about total strangers we only know through scraps fed through the media, but I just always bristle at this idea that issues like these boil down to “personality differences,” as though one person wants to live in a city and the other on a remote island, or some shit like that. The whole support (and gender tbh) issue is one that’s just very close to my heart because again, I have seen it play out with so many of my friends in long term relationships and marriages and I just think people in relationships (and women in particular in some circles) deserve better than to feel like they’re being, well, tolerated.

[aronarchy]

Compare:

Those takes come from a view where racism/antiblackness must result from individual “feelings” or nebulous internal “prejudices” rather than specific systems. That’s bullshit. If someone chose to own slaves under a racial slavery system then he was automatically racist. If someone chose to own a vastly disproportionate amount of property and live a bourgeois lifestyle while others were forced to starve then he was automatically classist and furthering their exploitation. If he's a white person chose to remain aristocratically rich under a system of racialized white supremacist capitalism then he was automatically racist. That’s what racism and classism are. It doesn’t matter whether he had other “ideals” or “feelings.” Clearly he didn’t respect them enough to hold the ideal that he was morally obligated to give up his privileged lifestyle to stop exploiting them. Does he think all this great human progress just occurred just because? Do better conditions appear out of thin air? No; wealth has to be redistributed (or, more accurately, seized back) for there to be more equality.

This is also why “but what about a person with a hypothetical psychologically ‘race-blind’ exploitative antagonism existed, what then” carries a false premise. Even if you, personally, might be “race-blind” in a vacuum, you do not live in a vacuum; if you go with a “default” then in a racist world the default will be racist. The mere ability to hold such a removed, detached individualized “ideology” or nebulous set of “beliefs” distinct from “real,” grounded ethics is already a product of privilege and indicative of privilege (as well as oppressiveness). The oppressors have always had varying “ideologies”/dispositions of this sort; they have the luxury of being able to hold these ~alternative views~ because they have a privileged vantage point where it all isn’t personal, it’s all low-stakes. But liberal “equality” or egalitarianism isn’t actual equality. This is condescending and useless.

It’s gross how many (almost always white) liberals try to justify owning slaves (“historically”). Fuck “it was just a product of their time.” People have ethical obligations no matter what time they’re in. And there will always be at least some people who (actually, radically) resist the dominant narrative, even if they are less visible or not heard. The exploited classes often/usually understand that their exploitation is wrong; they feel the trauma and the outrage themselves. Even some people of the privileged classes will dissent. “But I just had privileged foisted on me against my will I totally couldn’t help it or change anything” is the coward’s way out, is unrealistic, and denies agency.

(These are also the same types of people who take huge offense and clutch their pearls at statements like “all white people are racist” and claim that as justification for promoting entryist racist talking points in return like the specter of Black liberation activism going too far/being extremist/unreasonable now, but at the same time set up their premises so that that would be the logical conclusion from their scenario given a more honest use of definitions and interpretations, which is pretty ironic. Which is it? Was/is it not all white people, or yes all white people they couldn’t help it though it was just a product of their time?)

I mention this although this was said in a context of analyzing fiction because the OPs indicate they believe this is appropriate in any context in general, and people in general do not restrict this analysis to just fictional characters; these are extremely common talking points about real people, real-world situations and scenarios, and IRL oppression, both historically and in the present. These myths are taught in school and peddled in public discourse and sold as policy. They are dangerously wrong and need to be discussed and challenged.

[utilitycaster]

Just wondering.... why is the Imodna codependency such an issue meanwhile no one had a problem with the codependency between Widobrave?

Hi anon, this is a great question!

I've actually covered this - I don't think their situations are as comparable as many people think! Here's the post about that in case you haven't seen it. And, as the anon in that post points out, Widobrave did get a lot of pushback and hate, actually. It sounds like you might be very new to the fandom, so I want to give some gentle advice: it's worth being careful about assuming a certain form of discourse did not occur. Often, it has. I understand it's difficult to prove a negative (ie, that Widobrave did not receive hate) and it's even more difficult to do so via the Tumblr search, but Caleb and Veth's relationship was frequently criticized, diminished, and treated as not just insistently platonic, but also strictly familial. But back to the original question: I think that Caleb and Veth far more quickly built other relationships and were able to express anger with each other - Veth's outburst towards Caleb in episode 48 is a standout moment that resulted in a greater understanding, and I think I'd feel much more positively towards Imogen and Laudna as a potential romance had Laudna been able to make the same accusation, that Imogen's people did this. Was it a fair accusation from Veth? No! But it eventually cleared the air, whereas Imogen and Laudna keep sweeping everything under the rug, ignoring that the rug is now so lumpy they can barely walk without failing.

Another reason is simple numbers and recency. Widobrave, as of this post, has about 280 fics on ao3. Imodna has 1,085. This increased popularity may indeed lead to increased scrutiny. We're also, as the previous paragraph hints, talking about a ship that is in an ongoing campaign, so you're going to see far more posts talking about it than a ship from a past campaign, simply because it's still unfolding and is the subject of current discussion! Recency bias is a very real thing, and it can be difficult to adjust for, but when making this sort of comparison, it is vital to do so.

I would also be remiss if I did not address the elephant in the room, which is the nature of the fans who ship them. I'm sure this question is intended in earnest good faith, but I'm afraid I've gotten a pretty significant amount of harassment specifically from people who ship Imogen and Laudna together and don't like anyone who points out the flaws in their relationship. I've never received the same from people who shipped Caleb and Veth, despite never really shipping the latter, and indeed, and this is obviously my limited experience, but the people I follow who do ship Widobrave often embrace the flaws and conflict inherent in the ship. There are many Imodna shippers who are wonderful - especially those who do like to explore the flaws and codependency and how it might one day resolve - but, understandably, those few bad actors attempting to ignore the lack of development in the relationship or even worse, advocating for it, have really been very unpleasant to deal with. As a result, it's led me to consider more deeply why I find Imogen and Laudna's relationship uninteresting, romantically, and so that's probably another factor in why I specifically have explored Imogen and Laudna's issues far more than Caleb and Veth's. (For me personally, it's also that I was a lurker for the first year of the Mighty Nein campaign; I was binging Campaign 1 concurrently and didn't finish until July 2018, and didn't make this blog until around New Year's 2019, so I've written comparatively fewer thoughts about early Campaign 2). But getting back to the previous point, I think something people who send hate or baiting questions on anon may not always realize is that it often has the opposite effect as intended; it leads people to defend their opinions, and in doing so often strengthens their convictions as they find more evidence, which leads them to make even more posts!

Anyway, I hope this helps - obviously, this is only my perspective, and I sincerely hope anyone else of whom you ask this question extends the same good faith, honesty, and openness to other perspectives that you are bringing. I do however urge you to at minimum attempt to find some discussion from the era of early Campaign 2 to get a better understanding of how Widobrave was treated, just to ensure better responses to your inquiries. Anyway, welcome to the fandom!

[canonizzyhours]

Similarly to one of the previous takes on here…

I wasn’t in fandom spaces between s1 and s2 so I wasn’t exposed to the Canyon takes at the time. Once the teaser and then the trailer dropped I was really excited. On the first day episodes 1-3 dropped, before I could even watch the episodes , I got spoiled that Ed was ‘’really unlikable this season’’.

It was gutting to read because he’s my absolute favorite and it put me on edge as I was scared watching the show would change my view on him. To hopefully help calm down the anxiety that comment brought on, I went looking for other comments. Maybe this was just one bad take, right? Wrong move, what was I thinking? So many negative comments about Ed! Takes after takes of how Ed was an abuser to Izzy, how he had gone way too far so they simply couldn’t root for him anymore and was now unredeemable in their eyes.

How could the writers make him this unlikable as a protagonist in a romantic comedy show?

It took me until the day before episodes 4-5 came out to to rip the bandage off and watch the episodes to see for myself what I thought and I was actually surprised at how much I disagreed with those people. I thought Ed dragging the crew down with him was not great (couldn’t care less about Izzy though, in my eyes he deserved it after season 1), but I could absolutely see the vulnerability and the deep depression that was plaguing him. It was such a nuanced performance that I empathized with him so much. Unlikable or unredeemable was far from words I would use for him.

It made me wonder if something was wrong with me because I didn’t feel the same as so many of the takes I’d seen. Was I missing something? And then after that, when I tried participating in conversations and express how I was feeling about Ed’s but also mostly Izzy’s storylines, I was often met with a lot of pushbacks and people being super defensive and demanding me to explain myself as if I owed them anything and it was sooo draining. I hate using the word gaslighting but some of the things those people do by basically establishing an alternate version of this show and bullying people who don’t play along, is truly something else. I think it’s then that I realize I was dealing with people that couldn’t handle opposing Povs, and I was over it. I ended up blocking Izzy’s tag and blocking users on every social media platforms because I just couldn’t deal with it anymore. It’s still blocked to this day.

I love season 2, flaws included, but the amount of discourse around Izzy is honestly ridiculous at this point and it really took away from my enjoyment when the show was airing. I wish he wasn’t such a talked about character, he takes too much space for someone who was actually pretty boring in season 2.

Anyways, RIP Izzy… I guess.

#35.

related posts: #31, #29

[glamrockmrhippo]

My take on the Avantika Fan Cast Situation as a black person.

I’m going to be talking about the whole Avantika being FANCAST as Rapunzel. And you may be wondering, Jude, what does Avantika being fancast as Rapunzel have to do with being black in fandom spaces? My Dear Reader, I am asking you the same Question.

Let’s recap: Sometime in February 2023, someone started fan casting (meaning: Not a real casting, but someone you could see playing the character in a live-action.) Avantika, an Indian American actress (Known for Mean Girls the movie musical, Spin, Senior Year) as Rapunzel. Mind you, Disney hasn’t even greenlit any kind of tangled live action, bur Alas….some people believe everything they see on the internet. Recently, this discourse has come around on TikTok and thus bringing it to my attention.

So of course, all the racist white Disney fans are crying, screaming, peeing their pants because she doesn’t have pale skin, green eyes, and blonde hair. This has offended fans so much that they’ve resorted to (once again) threatening to cast a white woman as Tiana. Huh?

What does Tiana have to do with this? She’s not white nor is she Indian, by all means, black people didn’t have anything to do with this debate. Black people are just always on their mind no matter what and they can’t WAIT to bring us up in conversation or like, as a “Gotcha!”

The response to “What does Tiana have to do with this?” is met with “Y’all so sensitive it’s just a comparison” or “You guys are always playing the victim” as if they’re not the ones shitting bricks over a FANCAST.

I’ve also seen a good amount of people chastising black people for ‘settling for recasts’ and telling us to create our own original roles for POC. But let me remind everybody that every time that does happen, it gets called woke or forced diversity and is held to painfully high, almost impossible standards. Especially if it’s a show/movie/book not set in the one genre we’re shoehorned into or if the black character isn’t the token character.

I will be making a whole other blog post about colorblind casting and how it results in racists on the internet dogpiling onto black actresses. But in my opinion, things like this only matter if race/culture had a role to play in the original adaptation.

Movies like: Moana, Raya, Tiana, Merida, Mulan, their race or culture was important to the plot.

Movies like: Cinderella, Rapunzel, Aurora, Ariel, Snow White, Belle their race or culture was UNimportant to the plot.

All of the blonde haired girls are scream crying about representation as if they don’t have SEVERAL live-action Cinderellas, Aurora, Tinkerbell, Ariel, etc.

Not only that, but most of the disney movies came from CENTURIES if telling and retelling in different ways. If you don't like one retelling you can ALWAYS read a different one.

Not to mention people saying she wouldn't be great for Rapunzel but she would be a great Mother Gothel??? Hello? I thought we were crying bc Avantika isn't German or White.

While black people have one black princess who is a frog for most of the movie. Be so for real. At the end of the day, Avantika is NOT cast as Rapunzel and probably won’t be.as she’s going to be playing Princess Gauri on DIsney’s television adaptation of A Crown Of Wishes by Roshani Chokshi!

[bewires]

Fic 20 questions

tagged by @gallifreyburning! Thank you!

1. how many works do you have on Ao3?

130

2. what's your total Ao3 word count?

1,107,429 which is a startling amount. A lot (a lot) from the lockdown years.

3. what fandoms do you write for?

The old guard, top gun maverick, stranger things, star trek...ao3 will tell you i have also written a lot for supernatural, but that was a decade ago

4. what are your top five fics by kudos?

chrysalis

incurable

say the word (& I'll be your rennaissance man)

offer no absolutes

(don't) blame it on the moonlight

5. do you respond to comments?

I really really try to but it gives me a kind of social anxiety where I feel like a dick for saying the same thing over and sometimes that stops me from doing it until I feel like it's been way too long and I can't possibly answer now. I appreciate every single comment so so so much though!

6. What is the fic you wrote with the angstiest ending?

I don't really do angsty endings. I vaguely recall writing some angstier supernatural stuff back on livejournal? Or I guess I have some joe/nicky/booker stuff in TOG that ends on an angsty note.

7. What’s the fic you wrote with the happiest ending?

Probably say the word (and I'll be your rennaissance man) which is just high-octane fluff all the way through. but pretty much all my fic ends happy.

8. Do you get hate on fics?

Yeah but basically entirely related to all the dumb top!joe discourse stuff. So only people who wanted to send me or others threats for...idk writing about joe topping and bottoming versus only topping. hard to take seriously.

9. Do you write smut? If so, what kind?

Yes!

10. Do you write crossovers? What’s the craziest one you’ve written?

I think I have crossed over every major teen fandom of mine with TOG, so I did a star trek, a torchwood and an SPN one. Although I'm not sure when it stops counting as crossover and starts counting as fusion.

11. Have you ever had a fic stolen?

Not as far as I know, but i could be wrong

12. Have you ever had a fic translated?

Yeah once or twice

13. Have you ever co-written a fic before?

Yes, a few with @dreamtiwasanarchitect! Great experience

14. What’s your all time favorite ship?

I can't answer this lol. Changes with the hyperfixations

15. What’s a WIP you want to finish but doubt you ever will?

The choose your own adventure Joe x Nicky one, i wish i had the time and energy for it

16. What are your writing strengths?

I would say dialogue. And maybe, if this makes sense, conveying what a character is thinking and feeling out of the perspective of another character who is nominally oblivious to it

17. What are your writing weaknesses?

Describing scenery/physical characteristics/logistics of where what is. I am not a visual thinker

18. Thoughts on writing dialogue in another language in fic?

Depends on the context and whether it's understandable for the audience

19. First fandom you wrote for?

Tamora Pierce's Tortall books. fortunately, these fics are probably no longer findable on the internet.

20. Favorite fic you’ve written?

In terms of ambition, right where you left me which I co-wrote with @dreamtiwasanarchitect. The process of outlining and writing that one kickstarted my ambition to write my own actual book (a thing that exists out in the world now). In terms of style, I'm really proud of how (don't) blame it on the moonlight came out in that you really don't need Nicky's perspective because it's so obvious.

Tagging @regina-del-cielo @nicolos and anyone else who wants to!

[safflowerseason]

Late to the party, but I just finished Succession. Holy shit, what an ending. Anyway, I enjoyed going back and reading your takes from when it was still airing. Do you have any other morsels or headcanons to share?

Hey! Thank you so much for writing in with a Succession question!! I love it! And I'm glad you enjoyed my little takes and recaps...I didn't have the time to do full-on recaps for S4 like I did for S3, unfortunately, but I had such a great time watching in real time. I'll truly never forget watching 4.03 with the rest of the internet. I literally thought Logan's death was being faked until they told Shiv.

As for morsels/head-canons, oooh...compared to other viewers I don't have a ton of very specific headcanons about the upbringing/adolescence/early adult-hood of the Roys, beyond the few hints the show dropped. Apparently there was some debate early on about how far apart in age Kendall, Roman, and Shiv are (as well as whether Shiv or Roman was older, before the show confirmed Shiv as the youngest in S3)...I always assumed they were supposed to be quite close in age, five years max between Kendall and Shiv. The show itself is a bit blurry on the specifics of the backstory/everyone's timeline, though. I also wished we got more of the relationship between Logan and Caroline...we actually never (or barely) see them interact directly, and yet they seem to loom so large in each other's lives.

As for interpretative morsels...I actually haven't gone back and watched the finale again (if you can believe it) because it was soo good and devastating I literally haven't been able to work up the emotional fortitude. There was a great take here I saw that the finale didn't leave you with the same SHEER ADRENALINE RUSH of the other finales, which I will agree with but ultimately I think it fits with the show's overarching thesis that "everything is bullshit, especially billionaires." There's nothing about the finale I feel that will keep being re-litigated by fans (à la Veep)...there seemed to be some discourse about Shiv's ending and whether or not it fit with her character's arc (I think it does, but would love to hear your take!)

I will say that I was always interested in the decision to have Logan take up with Kerry in S3...I love the character of Marcia so much that the rise of Kerry was like a personal affront to me, lol, but I was also intrigued by how Marcia didn't seem threatened by Kerry the way she was by Rhea (or even Shiv). And it's also a relationship that Logan seems very passive about, and we never really hear his own take on it (except when he chickens out re: Kerry's audition tape for ATN). All the "facts" about what they do come from Kerry (or from other people, like Connor with the smoothie revelation). Like obviously, he seems fond of Kerry and is attracted to her (although I don't believe he was actually considering divorcing Marcia, not when he has literally just had to pay her a ridiculous amount of money to stick around in S3), but we don't see anything to indicate why he's okay letting her take on such an outsized role in the management of the business. (I also thought Brian Cox adopted an almost...fatherly air around the actress, which I guess would make sense due to the age difference...it wasn't like they had blazing sexual chemistry!) Is Kerry a symptom of Logan's growing passivity as he ages? A sign that he's getting old and predictable? Are we supposed to take away something about Kerry's naivëté, that she pins all her professional and personal hopes on an aging billionaire in ill health? Is she a parable in that sense? It's fitting for Succession, though, that a lot of the "intimacy" of the "romantic" relationships on the show take place offscreen, so in that sense I think the mystery is a bit purposeful. And the writers were always interested in "inverting" clichés to a certain degree (ie, the CEO having an affair with his much younger assistant)...but I guess I'm not sure how they inverted it in this instance, other than the incredibly ruthless way Kerry gets excised from the inner circle (a scene which will live in infamy!) as opposed to continuing the drama of their relationship after Logan's death.

That's one of the first things that comes to mind when I think about S4, but I'm sure there are many others, and would love to hear your specific thoughts about the season! My favorite episodes were, personally, 4.03 (Connor's Wedding), 4.04 (Honeymoon States--my pick for funniest episode of the season), and 4.09 (Church and State). My favorite season finale is probably S3, All the Bells Say...I think S2 is probably a tighter episode narratively, but my god, the emotional devastation of the S3 finale. You simply can't beat it!

[littlekingbergara]

wait, anon, as a long-time Shane Stan since 2017 and someone who doesn't really operate a Shane/watcher blog, I think I can kinda answer this! And also the part about people who LOVE him being quiet about it.

I get the sense that Shane is much more uncomfortable having the traditional Youtuber/fan relationship than even his co-founders and that kinda spills out into how I engage with him. Like he just doesn't do as much to encourage parasocial relationships (not to say that Steven or Ryan *do* or even that I think parasocial relationships are bad necessarily depending on how you approach them). BUT I can kinda tell that he would prefer people talk more about his content and content only or at least is a bit more comfortable with that. I know barely anything about his life and I think that's by design!

Having said that, I don't think the people who have him as their favorite are necessarily as quiet about it as one might think but it comes out in different ways. The amount of credit and praise he gets for Puppet History is overwhelming (quite frankly I don't see people praising Ryan's genius for example in the same way for BFU or Ghost Files but that's a different topic for a different time). I think a lot of people channel their love for Shane into their love for his content or his one-liners. So, really the fandom freaking out about Puppet History is their way of showing their appreciation for Shane if that makes any sense.

Finally, I also think that a very small percentage of Shane stans throughout the years, back when people were more traditionally loud about him in a Youtube parasocial way (think 2017/2018 and then also when Watcher was launched), gave us a bad name. :/ There were a few that were not... great about Ryan, especially back when Shaniacs vs. Boogaras was a real divide. Not to say that all people who had Ryan as their favorite were perfect angels but there used to be a lot more discourse in the fandom about the way that people who loved Shane would talk about Ryan. So, I think some became more hesitant and that has carried over to today.

Sorry for the word vomit! I just go to thinking!! I engage in the fandom very quietly these days but I still adore Shane and am glad others do too. :)

yeah i totally get what you're saying about love for shane being channeled into love for shane's content. we all love puppet history and are very aware of how much shane puts into it and how he makes it special.

i wasnt active in fandom during the beginning of unsolved and still dont venture into tags very much but i do remember seeing some people being like... outright hostile in regards to the whole shaniac vs boogaras thing. aaand interpreting it as which guy you like better which i have gone off about before and probably will again. and of course the racism.

great insight! don't apologize!

[struggle-but-its-all-ocean-floor]

I'm here to once again complain about kpop redditors. Does kpop reddit suck? Yes. Have I found a better place to read kpop opinions? No. Twitter is a mess, Army Twitter isn't generally very critical of BTS, in any way, and tumblr still isn't the best place for kpop discourse. So, since I don't know many kpop fans, reddit it is.

Now, on this specific occasion I want to comment on the discourse surrounding BTS's solo careers. There are several bad takes I keep seeing that make me question if those people even know BTS.

V is more interested in an acting career / V is not interested in music. He did one (1) drama and has only in passing mentioned acting again, so why are people fixated on him acting and why do people think he doesn't want to do music? He has the most solo songs out of the vocal line, almost all of them self-written, and he's always recc'ing songs and sharing snippets of stuff he wrote. Does that seem like something a person with no interest in music would do?? On the same vein...

Jin wants to be an actor. / Jin isn't interested in music. He would rather shoot variety content. He literally said in the 2022 Festa that what had interested him in acting in the first place was the opportunity to try different things, but since he's already doing that as an idol he doesn't have an interest in acting anymore (he didn't say it couldn't happen though). Also, Jin did variety to make Army happy and to promote his music. He's too shy and loves to perform on stage so I doubt he's going to ditch music to become a full-time variety entertainer. He's also written several songs. Just because he's not as full of passion for music as some of the other members, or because he also likes food, alcohol and gaming, that does not mean he wishes to quit being an idol. He's worked too hard and come too far for kpop stans to say he'd rather just act.

J-Hope will be the most successful long-term. / J-Hope has the most solo potential. I know redditors love to hype up the least popular members in a group, but this is bullshit. So far, there is nothing that indicates J-Hope will be the most popular member. People used to say this because he released fun songs like CNS, but JITB is not GP-friendly. Yes Hobi is a great dancer, has great stage presence, is a good rapper, is charismatic, etc. but every member has qualities and if J-Hope isn't the most popular member among Army is it really likely that he will become the most popular member worldwide? Imo, apart from CNS, he hasn't made a lot of music that would appeal to a very broad audience, he hasn't even danced much as a solo artist, and his personality isn't any better than the other members. I don't know the future, but the amount of people who even now say J-Hope will be the most successful member long-term makes me think this is another case for over-hyping the "underdog" and undervaluing the "overrated" members.

Suga is only successful in SK. / Suga will only be successful as a producer. That That was a hit and Suga didn't just produce the song, he featured in it and is one of the reasons why the MV and song are so great. He also featured in Girl of My Dreams which did well internationally and has been receiving international coverage by attending NBA games and now the Valentino collab. Plus, D2 was really successful considering it's a pre-Dynamite release and is not pop. Suga has amazing stage presence, many people love his fast and aggressive rapping the most among the rap line, he's real, honest, and straight-forward in a relatable way, he talks about real issues in a relatable way, he's great at promoting their sponsors, he's charismatic and masculine yet cute, he knows how to make exciting yet accessible music, etc.. Stans often say he will be the most successful of the rap line but since popular takes are frowned upon they also say he will only be popular in Korea or that he might just become a producer. In how many different ways must the man tell you he wants to be on stage and making music for a really long time for you to get it?

JK may become the most successful soloist but only because he makes generic pop music. / He works better in a group and only his collabs were successful. / He's boring, shy and doesn't know how to promote himself. I know Jungkook is so popular no one wants to give him proper credit, but he only makes generic music, really? I agree that some of his music is generic, but in the end that is what people like (tons of legends made generic music but it's not considered generic anymore because it's old) and stans seem to conveniently forget all the other songs he's done: Euphoria? A bit generic, yet very successful and pretty timeless, but Begin and My Time? Not generic, that's 2 to 1. Still With You? Not generic, very popular all things considered. Magic Shop? A bit generic, but one of the most popular bsides that BTS themselves love to perform, with nice lyrics and concept. Stay? A bit like Magic Shop but it's the only unit song they still perform and imo one of the songs in BE that aged the best. My You? Aanother fan song. Fan songs tend to be a bit generic and sentimental but he only wrote the lyrics; My You wasn't supposed to become a real song and he was only given 3 instrumentals to choose from. Left & Right? As generic as Bad Decisions and Vibe, and not a solo or self-composed track, but no one calls Jimin generic for those songs. Film Out and Your Eyes Tell? Fans literally rave about those songs, but often seem to forget that it was Jungkook who wrote them for his mixtape. Love is Not Over? Beautiful, not generic, written by Jungkook, and he also wrote parts in Run BTS, Telepathy, Autumn Leaves, Run, No More Dream. Stay Alive? One of the least generic OSTs ever, but I guess it doesn't count because he didn't write it? Dreamers? Sounds like a FIFA song but grows on you like crazy. People love Waka Waka and no one calls it generic. Dreamers is like the new Waka Waka so why is it generic instead of a bop? Because Jungkook has great pop vocals, admires Westen pop artists and has some generic songs and song covers (mostly collabs or unofficial releases), he's being pigeonholed. It's not that I disagree that his current style, or image, is mostly pop and very GP-friendly, but the same could be said of BTS in general, yet we know they have range and aren't just basic or whatever. Saying Jungkook will only become successful because he writes generic music as if he doesn't have the ability to write different styles or as if BTS aren't popular because they also appeal to the GP is just condescending. Also, JK isn't the only shy artist out there and he's had to represent BTS by himself many times; he can do it. Left&Right wouldn't have broken any kind of records if not for JK and Dreamers and Still Alive did pretty well under the circumstances (one being the soundtrack of a boycotted WC with almost no promo and the other being a webtoon OST). Lastly, JK not promoting himself is also a weak argument since that's mostly Hybe's responsibility and he hasn't even debuted yet. Anyway, I just think there are too many double standards when it comes to Jungkook.

[yesterdayiwrote]

Yo Emma thank you for writing down exactly my thoughts on Ferrari, Carlos and Charles! I know everyone speaks highly of Charles and takes him into high consideration (see Vettel too etc) and he IS a great clean driver that is also a great pole maker… but… I don’t know. There is something that feels is missing too for him to be WDC material tbh. While this is bit silly discourse, because given a car like say, the 2020 Mercedes, many mid drivers would probably manage to win a WDC or at least compete to get it, I still feel there is something about Charles that makes me believe he’s still no ready to get one. For now, at least. Not even mentioning Carlos because, sorry, but Carlos is like Checo to me, and that means nr2 driver. We’re probably gonna get cooked for this take by Charles and Carlos fans but unless time and the car itself prove us wrong… yeah, that is how I feel. And Ferrari has still a long way to go even after dropping Mattia and Rueda and getting Fred, tbh.

I think Charles still makes a lot of silly mistakes. Not always of his own making entirely but still a fair amount. And sure most drivers make silly mistakes from time to time even the best still do, but he’s had quite a few hefty practice crashes and that’s never great for a team.

Carlos has made some good career moves. He seems pretty reliable as a driver but… idk I feel like as he gets older more and more people are writing off his chance of being a WDC.

Statistically most of these drivers will never be WDC’s, especially these days where teams dominate for so long and stick with the same driver pairings too. There’s only been 5 different WDCs in the last 15 Drivers Championships… Think how many different drivers there’s been in that time! Even drivers I love who I want to see get WDC’s or the ones who feel like they should be future Champions, I’m more and more feeling like it just might never happen due to circumstances

[thebibliosphere]

Not to dredge the Audible discourse up again, but I said I'd come back when I had more numbers, and this post is specifically aimed at the people still trying to claim in my inbox that 'Scribd pays authors better than Audible' and giving me shit for using Audible as an author.

So here we go. This is what I earn per 1 book via Audible purchase vs. Audible subscription:

Image ID: a screenshot from ACX, the Audible portal for authors. The text is broken up into boxes. Running from left to right, it reads Hunger Pangs: True Love Bites (Unabridged) by Joy Demorra. The sales region shown is the UK, and my royalty rate is Audible's standard of 25%. The number of units sold is 1. The amount the person paid is $25.59. My earnings from this sale is $6.40.

The following image is the same data but taken from Audible credits. The quality "sold" is 1, at a rate of $12.84, giving me a payment of $3.21. The next few numbers denote zero, showing no returns, making my earnings from Audible credit for this region $3.21. /End ID.

And this is what I earned from Scribd (sorry it's so small, I don't know if anyone will be able to read it):

Image ID: Another screenshot from the FindAwayVoices portal shows my royalty earnings from Scribd across three regions.

From top to bottom, it shows the number of sales for Hunger Pangs: True Love Bites, followed by a series of ID numbers. It also shows three individual sales from Sweden, Bulgaria, and the UK. The individuals have paid the equivalent of $19.99 in subscription fees. Out of that $19.99, Scribd pays me $1.21, and then FindawayVoices subtracts a further 0.24cents as a distribution fee leaving me with a total income of 0.97cents per book read. /End ID.

Now, I am aware that the Scribd subscription fee allows customers to listen to multiple things for the cost of their monthly fee without forcing them to return it the way Audible does. This means the author isn't subjected to negative income which is a good thing. And if that works for you, great. I'm happy for you. I am glad you have found a way to enjoy media that still pays authors something.

But can people who don't have a clue how the industry works please stop making unfounded claims that Scribd is 'better' and 'more ethical than Amazon' and 'actually pays authors' because, as you can see from the above, that's a crock of shit.

I'm not saying this to shame anyone. I'm not trying to guilt anyone for using Scribd services. Again, if it is something that works for you and you can afford it, great. Please keep using it. I would rather earn 97cents than nothing. But I am sick and tired of people who don't work the industry telling authors we have 'better options than Audible' then listing places like Scribd, seemingly operating on the belief that just because it isn't Amazon, it's inherently better.

My inbox is a nightmare of people telling me I deserve to have my work stolen for using Amazon at all, and I don't know how people can say things like that without realizing they're also the villain.

And just for the people saying it's illegal for Amazon to take refunds from the authors and leave us with negative income and we're all lying:

ID: another screenshot from ACX, the Audible portal for authors. The text is broken up into boxes. Running from left to right, it reads Hunger Pangs: True Love Bites (Unabridged) by Joy Demorra. The sales region shown is the UK, and my royalty rate is Audible's standard of 25%. There are no individual outright sales, but there is a negative credit indicating a return, with the subscription fee shown as -$13.31 (note: this is MORE than what Amazon charges for a sale ($12.84)) with a negative royalty rate of -$3.33 for the author, which is also 12 cents MORE than what we earn for a non-returned sale.

There is some debate over why this is, but the most prevalent idea at the moment is that this is Amazon factoring in the exchange rate, and making authors pay it. So not only are we paying for the return and making a negative income, but we're also paying the cost of the exchange rate. 🙃🙃🙃

And people are wondering why authors are screaming about booktok "hacks" that promote returning books even if you enjoyed them and begging people to use libraries instead. And just in case you want to see those figures:

Image ID: Another screenshot from the FindAwayVoices shows Library transaction details. The library paid $29.99 for the lending license, earning me a royalty fee of $13.50. FindAwayVoices took a further fee of $2.70 for distribution, making my total income from a single library transaction $10.80. /End ID.

With that single library transaction, I have earned more than what I made from 5 separate sales from both Amazon and Scribd combined. And I will continue to earn royalties from the library lending service. Not much. It will probably be about a dollar max depending on the country and exchange rate. BUT--that's a dollar I am making that YOU don't have to pay for. This is why library lending services are so essential and why authors are begging readers/listeners to use services like OverDrive and Libby instead of abusing Amazon return policies.

Libraries pay us. And the more people request our books and check them out, the more likely they will be to keep buying our stuff and keep us in their catalog.

So please, please, please, support your local libraries and also stop harassing creators for using multiple platforms to sell our work. Most of us are making a pittance from our work. We don't need people who don't understand how rigged the system is against us lecturing us about how it's our fault because of where we are forced to sell just to try and make a living. 😔

Anyway, support authors direct where you can. Support your local libraries. Stop being a dick to creators, etc.

I'm going to go scream into a pillow for a bit then get back to work.

Edit: sorry for the weird formatting. I have no idea how that happened. I couldn't see the excess text until it posted.

[stormblessed95]

"Insecure Jikookers"

When we say that like 60% insecure jikookers aren't actually jikookers at all. And another 25% of insecure jikookers are just brand new to the fandom and doesn't understand how content work or the full extent of just how close all 7 of the members are. Very few of them are ACTUALLY just chronically insecure shippers. Which is a problem on its own, but a totally seperate one. Bloggers can tell. When we get asks or DMs and they all start with "I fully believe in jikook, but..." or "I'm a jikooker, but sometimes when JK..." or "I'm not an insecure jikooker, but sometimes taekook...." or "I never once believed in taekook, but when they...."

It gives you away. Lol it's not always, and most bloggers like to give you the benefit of the doubt when answering asks. But trust us, when we say we tend to get ALOT of asks, when my anons are off, the amount of DMs I get increases and sometimes it's from burner accounts to stay anon without being anon. Lol and I promise I don't mind, I love talking with yall. But keep in mind when we get snippy or rude sometimes, it's because a "jikooker" has been in our inboxes consistently being... annoying for lack of a better word. FOR EXAMPLE. Lol this person who DMd me, starting the conversation off with....

We had a decent conversation. Lol but they also were talking to a friend too. With the same sort of stuff after this. Where their conversations went like this....

And when my friend eventually ended the conversation because they were just talking in circles and she didn't want to keep saying the same thing over and over... they messaged me again. With the same stuff they were sending her. Lol

And at this point, I wasn't as kind. It had been WEEKS of conversation between us, as well as between them and my friend. All over the same stuff. We both clocked in a while ago that they were probably a tkkr, but just figured we would keep answering questions honestly in hopes of having an open conversation about it. But with this message, I too, was done. Lol I had already seen that they had been having this conversation and didn't have any actual interest or intent to hear anyone else's actual opinion.

To which, they responded with the classic "whoops, I've been caught" move and deactivated their account. Lmao which just proved our point that they were never an insecure jikooker. They were just a tkkr pretending and trying to create doubt and discourse in jikooker spaces. And "convert" people into shipping taekook. Because that's what they do. They want to "win" so they set out to try and convince people that what they see is what everyone should see. And to get more people to join their cult. It's honestly EXACTLY how actual cults work in getting more people to join as well. Which is bonkers.

And no, I don't mind exposing their account and these messages because the account doesn't exist anymore. And I'm using it for a be patient with your favorite bloggers because sometimes we are dealing with a lot of back and forth. And rhe stuff we get in our inboxes from people under anon are generally even more insane and wild. Or trying to be manipulative under the guise of being "jikookers." "Im just like you, but I've seen the light. You should too."

For another example, I've gotten actual messages from taekookers before too. Who don't pretend to be anything other than taekookers. We've had decent conversations as well. The ones who don't try to manipulate and gaslight their way into your inbox usually aren't as crazy, so tracks. I've had some where we shared opinions and walked away nicely agreeing to disagree. I've had some really great conversations that ended even better too. Lol for example, one person who was a tkkr messaged me and their conversations started like this

And our conversation ended like this:

And we still talk too. Pretty sure she is a fully fledged jikooker at this point 😂🤣 maybe she will see this and let me know for sure if she is or not. 👀😂

Lmao but the difference in how the conversations started was telling. And I promise, bloggers can usually tell the genuinely insecure but sincere jikookers from just rhe confused baby armys from the tkkrs (or other shippers) in disguise anons. Lol if any of these secret shippers are hiding around on blogs, please just dont waste your time or mine (or anyone elses.) If you are just trying to convert people into shipping your ship, don't bother. Only do this if you want to legitimately have a genuine conversation and are willing to be open minded about people disagreeing with you.

Yall excuse the grammar and typo/spelling mistakes in these messages. I'm CLEARLY much more relaxed and usually typing in more of a rush in DMs then I do for posts. 🤣🤣 I'm also usually nicer in DMs too unless you drive me insane to this point like above. Lol

Basically just a post to highlight that we aren't dumb. We know what you are doing when you send us messages or anons like these. Lol and to remind everyone else to be patient with us bloggers at times. We really do have all types of conversations all the time 😂