#but I loved the blackwater arc and the pain and the tragedy of it all

[bokutoasavillain]

I have to be honest. I don’t think beefleaf would be this popular if they didn’t have a tragic ending.

Like that’s their whole appeal to me.

[baeshijima]

OMG HI sorry for randomly appearing in your inbox but i had no idea you like tgcf?!?? omg. i perfectly understand the whiplash between hualian being.... hualian and the absolute tragedy beefleaf is going through 😭😭 still experiencing five stages of grief after the revenge scene and here we have hualian. living their best life HAJSHD

im very much unwell about beefleaf in general..... both about the ship but also about the characters + shi wudu and their entire story... like its so tragic?????? and also an amazing topic for many character analysis and essays but shh... id be very happy to see this all play out without the gut-wrenching angst but alas 💔💔 the angst is what we get........

KHSD UR FINE DW AND YES I LOVE TGCF 😭 its been so long since i read the novel so some things a re blurry but ourghghg... i should reread it... and i need to catch up on the donghua bc i havent watched s2 onwards ;w;;

no bc its literally just. hualian doing their thing and having their moment so the hualian lover in me cheered so hard and cried tears of joy only to find the beefleaf audio drama right after and wallow in despair and anguish 🧍‍♀️one couple is getting it on and the other is going through absolute hell i cannot why would they do this to us 🧍‍♀️

AND NO BC SAME 😭 like on one hand i understand hx and his revenge and the fact his existence as a ghost built on vengeance and such cant go against his cause, but on the other the absolute pain and anguish sqx went through in the blackwater arc and apologising and screaming and crying and begging hx and ourhgkh GIVE ME ALL HIS PAIN AND SUFFERING INSTEAD MXTX WHEN I CATCH UUUU

hx: what did you call me?

sqx: ming-xiong...

hx: you called for the wrong person.

THROWS UP I HATE THEM AND SWD TELLING SQX HE IS LEAVING FIRST AND HE WILL MEET HIM LATER WITH SQX CONSTANTLY APOLOGISING IM SOOO

LIKE

AND ON TOP OF THE ANIMATED VERSION OF THE ART??? LOSING MY MIND I HATE IT HERE

on another note, i just saw someone on twt put the beefleaf audio over the "I JUST WANNA BE PART OF YOUR SYMPHONY 🐬🐬🐬🌈🌈🌈 🎶 🎶" meme with the dolphins and sparkles and i think that killed me :D

[esther-dot]

One thing that has always baffled me about the fandom is how Sansa's mistakes are difficult to forgive than say the acts committed by other characters which are worse . It could be an unpopular opinion but I don't think it's rooted in misogyny even though a good chunk of it is . ASOIAF as a saga operates on POV structure and perception that we have as readers of a POV character is coloured by the said POV's interactions with other POV characters .

For example , in AGOT we have Sansa butting her head with her father and her younger sister both of whom are introduced positively . Then in ASOS we have her clash with Tyrion even though it isn't as active as the one she had with Ned and Ary@ . Obviously she clashes with Cersei who is another POV character but we don't get Cersei as POV till AFFC . Now there are 3 active POV characters with whom Sansa interacts and all of them are fan favourites and have underdog coding . So a zero sum analysis is framed while analysing Sansa wrt to them " Sansa the mean pretty girl to noble tomboy @rya" , " Sansa the vapid shallow daughter to noble Ned " or " Sansa the shallow ungrateful pretty maiden to kind ugly Tyrion " is how these dynamics are juxtaposed because Sansa as a character doesn't have underdog framing in comparison to those characters who have tropey underdog framing . It's interesting about how one day I was going through some old reddit forums about the topic of Sansa Tyrion marriage and I was surprised to see how the tone against those topics have shifted throughout the years . Earlier it was about sad Tyrion but now most of them are geared towards about how Sansa instead of being the shallow princess who has the upper hand is actually the one with the lack of agency . It's also interesting how in the recent years Ned's parenting failures are acknowledged in the fandom and that how Blackwater was an attempted assault rather than sexual tension culminating into wet dream . It's really a refreshing transition and thanks to the Jonsa fandom for that . That is why you have accusations about how Jonsas aren't true Sansa fans and that they are trying to make everything about Sansa and how we don't understand her character .

Regarding POV interactions , another interesting example is J@ime , a character that is easily forgived by readers once he gets his POV and I think that is one of GRRM's intentions . Yes, he clashes with the Starks but the thing is when he is introduced to us a POV, it is in ASOS at his lowest and halfway the book we get a flashback to his character about the things he had to commit while he was young and they are painted with tragedy . Later as I said about POV interactions , the ones he clashes with is his villain coded twin and that is how the POV trap is birthed in J@ime's arc and the so called redemption because this clash with a villain is to make the reader think that he was always a good person who was corrupted by his twin and is now taking strides to better himself . I have always wondered why Grrm didn't introduce him as a POV in the first book and the things that he does - throwing a kid and supporting the corrupt Lannister regime ( cuckolding the king ) would be pained in a negative light by the narrative and the funny thing is even after being assigned a POV , he is doing the same things in Feast Dance only this time it is under the garb of Goldenhand the Just instead of the damned Kingslayer .

Coming back to Sansa one of the accusations in her show version was that her S6-8 self was inconsistently written and that was because she clashed with characters . It's really interesting how the vitriol that was geared towards her in the later season is quite similar to that of the first season and the common factor in both of them is that she clashed with fan favourites . In S1 it was Ned and @rya and in later season it was Jon, @rya, D@ny . That's why I always lol when ppl say how they love book Sansa but hate Sandra Bolton when AGOT Sansa is perhaps one of the most hated characters in the entire fandom . If the later books have her in conflict with fan favs then the same worshippers will throw her under the bus .

I think whatever we perceive of a character is mostly not derived from canon characterisation but from POV placements ( when they are introduced as POVs and how they clash with other POVs ). I was reading an essay about a critic on GRRM's incoherent writing on Sansa and one of the accusations was that her transition from AGOT to ACOK was a bit incoherent as if there was some off page character development and growth . The thing was Sansa's act of kindness of saving Dontos in ACOK seemed a bit ooc to the essayist considering how she was penned by the author in AGOT . The problem is her first act of kindness in the books was not saving Dontos but consoling S@ndor in AGOT and as I said how POV placements color the view of the characters - in this respect it was the essayist's just because she clashes with underdog fanfav @ry@ , most people seem to think that her entire AGOT arc is being mean to her sister and betraying her family when it is not so . Thats why one of the judgements about Sansa's is that she garners sympathy for what she had to go through but that doesn't mean she is a kind person because her rude awakening made her think .

Regarding POV placements , it's interesting how D@ny hasn't had a conflicting POV character interact with her in 5 books ( Barristan doesn't count ) . We haven't had seen her clash heads with a POV character and maybe that will change as she journeys towards Westeros starting with Tyrion in TWOW .

Anon, I was gonna hit like and reblog and then remembered this was an ask so all I can do is hit post. You explained this all so well, nothing else needs to be said!

Actually, one thing I to add to the mix is that I think Martin is pulling from some classic lit that features naive/innocent heroines, and he may have not realized how modern fans who don't have the same literary background would respond to such a character, might despise those things that make her vulnerable. Naive is not stupid and it isn't a ruse to hide evil, it's innocence. I assume the fandom simply can't accept that because this kind of character doesn't feel familiar to them.

The combo of that and the POV issue makes me want to be sympathetic to them, but Sansa fans have been churning out content for years explaining her, so now those excuses don't quite cover the fandom's insistence on their negative interpretation. People lose all perspective when it comes to Sansa (in my experience), so I'm really surprised that you found Sansa positive content on Reddit which was the worst when I stopped going in 2018. I’m so happy that even there she has defenders!

[princeofvelvet]

Which do you think is more tragic, Yi City arc or BeefLeaf arc or the Fallout between Shen Jiu - Yue Qi?

the Shicest arc is especially painful because I just love SWD so much. And not just him but his relationship with his brother which is Central to the arc and (imo) acts as a perfect foil for the main couple's story. It's so intense!! The way SWD protected SQX!! He loved him so much that he couldnt sit around and watch him suffer, that he had to rewrite fate for him!! morals be damned!! His love for his brother is stronger than the possible consequences of committing atrocities against nature!! THIS is some MXTX love right here that parallels the main couple's whole deal of creating your own path, even if fate says youre cursed, even if you were cursed. SWD actually DID!! Even at the end, when Blackwater stops him from strangling SQX, telling him he doesnt get a "third path", that he has to choose between the two fates he's chosen for him, SWD STILL finds a third path, and gets Blackwater to kill him, sparing his brother of having to do it himself, and sparing himself of having to watch him live a painful life. It's selfish and selfless at the same time.

THAT BEING SAID, Yi City is just straight up TRAGEDY in the way that aristotle would eat Right Up. The way XXC's tragic flaw is exploited. His blind slaughter of helpless people!! You can see his impulsivity to Do Right, to Save people!! His impulsivity to make it up to SL led him to lose both eyes, then his impulse to save people got a lot of people killed, then the impulse to save his friend got his other friend killed! all by his hand! all while he was trying to do good!! The way he scolds XY about how his impulse to get revenge was wrong and XY shows him that his impulse to do right was Also wrong... god, the Despair of recognition, of Understanding what his actions have caused... man, MXTX is a Master at crafting tragedy

[bunny-wan-kenobi]

Bunny’s GOT Top 10

So I’ve been re-watching old GOT episodes this week as a bit of a cleanse (believe me it’s been good for the soul) because while things soured in Season 8, when GOT has been good, it’s been AMAZING. And it’s been encouraging for me to revisit the episodes that struck a chord in me and stayed with me because as I said before, NO ONE can take that away from me. So here’s my personal favorite episodes: 

10. Kissed By Fire (3x5)

This episode lingers with me because it’s a character-driven one with a bittersweet quality to it that pulls you in. It’s an episode about choices and their consequences, and the choices alluded to and made here leave a significant mark on the characters’ lives. It’s also an episode that adeptly balances action, intrigue, and rich dialogue-heavy scenes. 

Highlights: Jon and Ygritte consummate their love, introduction of Davo’s first and always #1 adopted child Shireen, Beric vs The Hound, Robb makes the fatal error of executing Karstark (I love the score for that scene)

Favorite Scene: Jaime revealing why he killed Aerys to Brienne at Harrenhall. Both actors were captivating in the way they carried this profound moment, and it’s one of the best GOT monologues. 

9. Fire and Blood (1x12)

After the shocking and climatic death of Ned Stark, this episode manages to draw together all the characters’ threads into an emotionally compelling season finale. This is where all that time investing in these characters pays off as we see them both mourn their losses but prepare for their next move, perfectly setting the stage for Season 2.

Highlights: Robb crowned King in the North, Tyrion is made Hand to the King, Arya meets her new crew of Gendry, Hot Pie, and Lommy

Favorite Scene: Dany rising from the ashes with 3 dragons. It doesn’t get more hopeful and iconic than that.

8. Hardhome (5x8)

It was tough not ranking this one higher because it’s really an exceptional episode that hammered in just how much of a threat the White Walkers are to the rest of humanity. Not only that, but we get rewarded with some long-awaited character interactions, some painful to watch and others simply engrossing. 

Highlights: Dany and Tyrion’s first meeting (so GOOD seeing the interplay with these two), Jon slays his first White Walker, Sansa and Theon reunite, Karsi the Free Folk chieftainess 

Favorite Scene: The Night King raising the dead as Jon and the remaining Free Folk flee in diminished numbers. It’s a game-changing and tragic moment with a haunting final image, even as it spawned a slew of new memes.

7. A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms (8x2)

This one ranks higher because of the way it emotionally resonated with me, and it’s one that doesn’t lose its introspective power the more I re-watch it. It has a play-like elegance honed in on these intimate scenes between characters simply working through their tensions as well as reflecting upon their pasts. It truly is a love letter to these characters, honoring their journeys and their relationships as they quietly await the dreaded Long Night. 

Highlights: Jaime’s trial, Jaime and Tyrion’s conversations about family and “self-betterment,” Sam gives Jorah Heartsbane, Jon reveals his parentage to Dany, the “Fireside Club” (honorable mention to everyone’s reactions to Tormund’s ridiculous tale), the gorgeous marriage of melancholic imagery with Daniel Portman’s rendering of “Jenny of Oldstones” 

Favorite Scene: Brienne’s knighting by Jaime. One of the rare moments of pure light and joy on the show, and a beautiful tribute to Brienne’s idealism and honor as well as her transformative and magnetic relationship with Jaime. 

6. Rains of Castamere (3x9)

I remember how devastated I was when I first saw this episode. The set-up to it was so well laid out that it was inevitable, but the almost-Shakespearean sense of tragedy still hurts to this day. The performances here are raw and powerful, and from the moment the ominous strains of the Lannisters’ song begin, you can’t look away. 

Highlights: Jon leaves Ygritte and just misses a reunion with Bran and Rickon, Jorah’s epic team-up with Daario and Barristan Selmy in Yunkai, Bran and Rickon say goodbye 

Favorite Scene: The massacre at the Twins. I mean...what else could it be? This entire sequence is heartbreaking, from Arya realizing her family is being slaughtered to Greywind’s death to Catelyn’s final wail. 

5. The Watchers on the Wall (4x9)

This episode stands out to me as one that testifies most to Jon’s journey. It illuminates his strengths as a leader, the fire-forged loyalty of his friendships, and the poignancy of his first love: Ygritte. There are some spectacular action pieces here, and even the deaths of minor characters heft an emotional punch. It’s also one of the few episodes to be grounded in one location, and that adds to its depth.  

Highlights: Grenn’s last stand against the giant, Sam defeats a Thenn, Ygritte dies in Jon’s arms 

Favorite Scene: Jon taking command on the ground level. There’s an elemental ferocity and resolve in the way he carves his way through the battle, turning the tide in a way everyone bears witness to. 

4. Baelor (1x9)

The episode that changed everything. I wept when I read the chapter where Ned dies in the book, and I still wept here seeing it onscreen. His execution is so abrupt and unjust and horrific that the impact of this moment reverberates throughout the story forever after. There’s actually a LOT that happens in this episode, and it’s all riveting.

Highlights: Robb defeats and captures Jaime, Dany tragically loses her child to save Khal Drogo’s life (it’s weird calling this a highlight but it’s a deeply sorrowful and important moment), Jeor Mormont gives Jon Longclaw 

Favorite Scene: Ned’s death. It’s still hard to watch because it’s so painful.

3. Battle of the Bastards (6x9)

Brilliantly shot, edited, and acted, this episode is one of the most memorable of the GOT battles. It works because it doesn’t lose sight of the characters, conveying the horrors of warfare to a visceral degree. The ending is also one of the most satisfying in the show, cathartic even as the wounds of battle linger. 

Highlights: Dany’s triumph in the battle at Mereen, Sansa’s “Riders of Rohan” rescue with the Knights of the Vale, Dany meets Yara and Theon, Sansa ends Ramsay with his own hounds 

Favorite Scene: Jon draws out Longclaw to make a final stand as the calvary races towards him. It’s just one of those shots that becomes emblematic of the show and the character, and Djawadi scores it beautifully. 

2. Blackwater (2x9)

This episode is teeming with amazing character moments and splendid visuals. But I love it most because it’s the peak of Tyrion’s leadership arc within the first two seasons. He commands the troops and the screen, and it’s hard not to root for him as he amasses the full force of his cleverness and resilience to fight against looming odds. 

Highlights: Bronn lights it up with wildfire, Cersei and Sansa’s conversations (some great Lena Headey moments here), Cersei’s lion story to Tommen on the throne, the Hound leaves the battle and Kingsguard after seeing flames

Favorite Scene: Tyrion’s speech. It embodies the character so well: irreverent, pragmatic with a good dose of “to hell with it!” 

1. The Winds of Winter (6x10)

I have re-watched this episode so many times I’ve lost count. It contains all the best of what GOT represents to me: rich characterization, well-cultivated storytelling, and rewarding plot payoff against a backdrop of exceptional score and cinematography. More than that, it’s the kind of episode that I leave feeling like I’ve experienced something truly special, something ineffable. 

Highlights: Jon revealed as the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna, Dany proclaims Tyrion Hand of the Queen, Arya gets revenge on Walder Frey, Davos confronts Melissandre about Shireen’s death, Jon made King in the North 

Favorite Scene: THE WHOLE EPISODE. Okay, I’ll just cheat and share just two scenes. The first is the entire Light of the Seven sequence because I just think it’s the perfect scene. It’s builds up its ominous tension so brilliantly and brings everything to such an explosive climax so incredibly supported by the music that it’s a work of art. The second is the ending, which I also think is perfect. It’s what so much of the story has been working towards: Dany sailing to Westeros, and every visual, from her standing proudly on the ship to the combined forces of several houses to her dragons soaring above her, culminates in this triumphant moment that is simply unmatched.