#both and in and out of a context of fiction

[maowives]

this isn't a coherent thought yet but I'm like fairly certain that the proliferation of the framework of fictionkin is rooted in the fact that for many people (in particular, children who have not been given the language to identify and articulate the underlying phenomena animating their experiences), these identifications with characters provide a mythological scaffolding upon which they can start to build a way to make sense of the difficult interpersonal and intrapersonal experiences they've undergone. this may seem trivial to some, especially to those who participate, as it's clear that part of the draw of "Fandom Culture" broadly is that it affords an (ostensibly) unified theory of analysis and engagement for intimate interpersonal and intrapersonal experience, by way of storytelling and the curation of particular fictional experiences which resonate with the reader. it feels evident to me that this is more often than not, designed both as a method of communication, seeking to provide (relatively) broadly legible shorthands and handholds for articulating painful or otherwise important personal experiences which would otherwise be complicated or simply emotionally difficult to express, as well as a form of identity-crafting, in which these characters form the building blocks of an internal symbolic language that, when rearranged and ordered in a particular manner, enable the user to understand their experiences and their internal responses to those experiences. frankly I think it's quite an elegant solution, and one which I understand the utility of. in particular, I think it's relevant and understandable that these kinds of frameworks arise in the particular political contexts in which they do. further, it seems clear to me that many of the more reactive and reactionary elements of these kinds of contexts frequently arise from a deeply felt defensiveness about the sanctity of these internal frameworks and spaces, not because of the sanctity of the thing itself, but rather the ways that these symbols act as placeholders for particular individual experiences of particular and deeply felt narrative relevance and importance. said in another way, the sanctity of the particular reading of a character or a story are not valuable in and of themselves but rather for how they act as stand-ins for The Self. an example might be in the ways that "Fandom Discourse" tends to produce heated conflicts between different people who interpret different characters as having different kinds of essential moral qualities, as these characters do not function as characters in a text but rather as placeholders for either the reader or other people relevant to the reader's life, whether they be loved ones or agents of harm, or both. it becomes easy to understand why contending understandings of a particular character's "moral quality" become very high stakes very quickly, as the coherence of the individual's particular meaning-making system, and therefore, the integrity of a particular narrative about one's own life, depends on a particular reading of that character.

and, while, as I mentioned above, I do think it makes sense for this framework to function the way it does, and while I do think it is, broadly, an elegant solution to a difficult problem, I think it is hobbled by a few factors.

Using other people's fictional characters as a mythmaking device requires necessarily having inconsistencies and misalignments as well as implementing an active practice of Character Curation.

Conversely, using one's "OC's" as a shorthand for personal experience and expression requires other readers to be heavily invested in, and acquainted in, this particular idiosyncratic mythology.

These frameworks, while undoubtedly valuable for their legibility to others within the shared fandom space, are both imperfect, in that they never are able to communicate exactly what an individual sets out to communicate, as well as incomplete, in that their explanatory power borders on nil.

Because of the previously discussed contending interpretations of given individually relevant characters, these frameworks tend to promote intense and heated conflict between contending camps who, all in all, are most likely fighting over some relatively inconsequential quibbles of personal idealist moralism at worst, or just simple miscommunication and misunderstanding at best.

Because of this fact, ingroup compliance is heavily, heavily policed, and the space becomes more and more encouraged to adopt increasingly draconian and reactionary methods of control.

these observations are not intended to be a moral condemnation of these practices, as savvy MaoWives readers will know that OP does not traffick in idealist moralisms or other such quibbles. however, I do think that identifying the particular gap of where a unifying theory with explanatory power may come in handy for encouraging people to make sense of their own lives in terms that they have more control over, and which have more robust analytical tools. again, savvy MaoWives readers will be able to see the predictable turn to articulating the value of using a dialectical materialist and Marxist-Leninist analytical frame for these kinds of things, but further, perhaps more particularly, I could see a place where family abolition as a framing device may be significantly more helpful in encouraging interpersonal abuse survivors to make sense of their experiences, rather than the readily accessible, but inevitably incomplete, frameworks of using particular characters as social signifiers of experience, and mythmaking devices for intrapersonal awareness.

[I apologize for the length of this post. I did not have the time to write a shorter one.]

[luvwich]

✒️ writer interview tag

tagged by @dustdeepsea — tysm, this was great fun! read their answers here and mine, if you like, beneath the cut ✨

When did you start writing?

early 2023 was my first foray into writing actual fiction. prior to that i'd done an embarrassing amount of roleplaying many years ago, which i shall speak on no further, but it did form the basis for a lot of my writing now!

once upon a time, i seriously entertained the idea of an MFA in screenwriting, but went on to pursue something even stupider for grad school 👍

Are there different themes or genres you enjoy reading than what you write?

honestly everything i enjoy reading gets smuggled into my writing in some form or another!

Is there a writer you want to emulate or get compared to often?

there are like 26 different writers where i wish to take bits and pieces of their style, send it all into a meat grinder, and press the gunk into sausage casings to be dipped in batter and deep fried. ideally i want my writing to hit like wagyu beef that's been corrupted into a county fair corn dog. but no i'm not sure i've ever been compared to another writer! that would fuck my shit up truly (in a good way)

Can you tell me a bit about your writing space?

typically curled up on my couch, because the ergonomic status of my home office setup is terrible — potentially lethal. sometimes i stay late at my not-home office, hidden away in a dark conference room, but that's usually only if i'm on a self-imposed deadline (i.e. i've started posting a WIP)

What's your most effective way to muster up a muse?

the spark that gets me to write is usually some kind of Dynamic that i want to explore so i do a lot of noodling upon situations and then figuring out how to get there. and by situations i mean smut

also, writing bits of dialogue, even if i don't know the context yet. it gets a character's voice and mannerisms in my head, and gives me a little grain to start building on

sadly, going on a hike and/or reading a really good book are both very effective and by far the most time consuming

Are there any recurring themes in your writing? Do they surprise you?

longing, isolation, identity, the difference between the person you'd like to be and the person you are, strained/dysfunctional family relationships, wrong person right time, hope, blowjobs, self-deception, california, fucking your way through it, guilt, social class, mommy issues, mono no aware, oral fingering, etc; they don't surprise me anymore but the first time i finished a long fic and took a step back i was like "ohh haha Damn"

What is your reason for writing?

i am horny, sad n silly

Is there any specific comment or type of comment you find particularly motivating?

all forms of feedback are so touching! i think much of what i write is pretty niche, so simply knowing someone has read my stuff gets me pumped. a big essay of a comment is like receiving a love letter, and comments that are just an emoji are like someone's tucked a little note in my lunchbox, and both are incredibly nourishing to me. as far as motivation, though, anything that implies someone is looking forward to reading more is the surest way to light a fire under my people-pleasing ass

How do you want to be thought about by your readers?

affable wretch, trickster, wine aunt

What do you feel is your greatest strength as a writer?

i'm not sure any one thing stands out: i believe i'm pretty good in a few areas (dialogue, sensory detail, characterization) and notably lacking in others (action, "plot," pacing, not getting high on my own supply)… okay i'll stop being an asshole though and say my strength is in "delivering on a mood," if that is a thing

How do you feel about your own writing?

generally good. for one, i'm proud of myself for ever finishing and posting anything, because following through on shit isn't something i'm renown for. i tend to hate everything i write after i've gotten some distance from it, but i think that's normal? right? i'm new at it and it's all for fun so i try to be gracious with myself, with mixed success, because beneath my goofy exterior i do take everything too seriously

When you write, are you influenced by what others might enjoy reading, or do you write purely for yourself, or a mix of both?

mostly for myself; i do abstractly ask "would someone who isn't me enjoy this?" and never quite know the answer. like most humans i crave external validation and connection, but like a cactus i can survive on just a lil rainfall 🌵

tagging w/no pressure (but with my best barbara walters impression) @corpocyborg @ghostoffuturespast @merge-conflict @streetkid-named-desire @writing-for-soup

[mister-tom-a-dildo-lover]

Confession Time!

So, over on Twitter, I'm a member of the Community Notes, and I can write Notes on any post as well as rate other Community Notes on those posts. This is done to fact check people. You have to provide a credible link as the source of your note before you're able to post it, right?

A bunch of M@rauders stans are attacking Tomarry writers, as usual, and because they can't handle that they like morally grey characters who did sus things, they make up all this shit to excuse those characters of their wrongdoings. Maybe that's why they're so jealous, cuz we can like a shitty character while NOT downplaying the bad he did.

Currently, there is an idea going around that Harry Potter was not abused in the canon story, and that everybody just swears he was abused when it was apparently, never addressed or shown and was just not treated the best. But when any M@rauder stans claim that Sirius was very clearly abused, it's unfair how no one agrees with them...

As such, they've been inundated with people pointing out all the abuse Harry has been through, from Vernon choking him out, Petunia trying to hit him with frying pans, them making him sleep in a closet instead of any of their extra bedrooms, lying about his parents, letting Dudley bully him constantly, punishing him when he doesn't understand that magic is at fault, starving him and his pet, putting bars on his window, etc... EXPLICIT ABUSE.

Now, one person gave a whole list of things that Sirius 'suffered' at the hands of his mother, and they're mad because it was pointed out that none of this actually happened in the story, not from anyone's mouth, and that that's just fanfiction tropes to make his parents worse and easier to hate. Harry's abuse is both told to us and shown as early as Ch. 2 of PS. We get to experience it through him in many ways throughout the books.

So usually, I don't get involved in these things, I just watch from the sidelines and laugh. But I thought it would be funny to put Community Notes on all of these people's posts because they're posting literal misinformation. And it's just funny to look at the post making all these claims and immediately see Rate Proposed Community Notes right at the bottom!

This person is ranting about how there are 'context clues' about Sirius was being physically abused by his family, while claiming that Harry's neglect was never explicit to try and make it seem as if Sirius choosing to leave home because of his parents' beliefs is proof of his suffering and is the same as Harry's blood relations treating him terribly for how he was born, his whole childhood.

When people have to sugarcoat and lessen Harry's experience because they want to uwu their favs so they can feel less bad about what their favs have done in canon... It's the weirdest thing. I'm not borrowing shame from a fictional character over their wrongdoings despite how all my favs are the villains. I'm here for the character, and to be so emotionally distraught over what your fav has done, that you need to gloss over it and invalidate canon over and over, is truly unhealthy behavior.

And then attacking people with different favs/ships than you, is peak madness. Get a life. Go figure shit out. You clearly cannot handle interacting with real people yet.

[starcloud-nova]

i actually think i’m a little obsessed with time loops

[wonder-worker]

Wild how we know that Elizabeth Woodville was officially appointed to royal councils in her own right during her husband’s reign and fortified the Tower of London in preparation of a siege while 8-months pregnant and had forces gathering at Westminster “in the queen’s name” in 1483 – only for NONE of these things to be even included, let alone explored, in the vast majority of scholarship and historical novels involving her.

[kyliafanfiction]

I sometimes feel like characters who do truly monstrous things while also having been victims of some pretty insane shit themselves are sort of an exercise in empathy. Or at least, should be seen as such.

Like, in real life, if a person who has been horribly broken by their experiences and failed by society than proceeds to rape someone - it's hard to feel the justifiable sympathy/empathy for that person (without excusing their rape, never do that) because well, you can look at this actual human person they hurt, or worse, and it feels gross and disrespectful to the rape victim.

And this is understandable. (And applies to more than just rapists/rape victims of course, that's just the most visceral one and thus picked for that reason)

But a fictional rape victim is... fictional. You can't 'disrespect' their trauma, and while obviously rape/whatever else is real, and people may related to the rape victim and thus see your comments about the rapist also being a victim as somehow being about their experience...

Well, it's not.

Because the rapist here, didn't actually hurt a real person. Fictional characters are objects. They're objects that often grab us by the throat and refuse to leave our fucking heads, yes, but they're objects. They are tools used by writers to tell a story, and readers to tell a story.

And one of the things fictional characters are good for is allowing us to consider experiences we never had, and imagine ourselves in other circumstances and lives. (Also just fun and fascinating and interesting to watch their stories).

It's very easy to feel for the rape victim in fiction, and rightly so. That's Level 1 Empathy there. Granted, some people IRL fail that, but that's not really what we're talking about here.

Advanced Empathy, hard Empathy is feeling for the rapist. Not for the rape, of course, even if they feel guilt about it, but if someone really was failed on multiple levels and was broken and damaged and went through the sort of psychological wringer that would leave most of us here on tumblr catatonic - they do deserve the same Empathy any human (any person) who went through all that.

Even after they also do the bad thing, critically they still deserve Empathy. And that is fucking hard. I very often have a hard time feeling bad for truly awful people who also deserve empathy and sympathy, real and even fictional (despite all this, yeah, I'm not perfect on this) for what they (separately) went through.

It also becomes even harder when what they went through is utterly bound up with what they did. How what they went through and experiences is in part responsible for what they did - because they still made a choice. The circumstances may have left them not in their right mind, may have left them feeling without choice, may have driven them to things they normally might not think of or do, but they still chose to do that bad thing. And that's not okay. They still hurt someone.

And yet - one cannot remove the action from the circumstances. So you can still feel empathy, and elucidate all the factors and circumstances as to what led up to their choices and why, and it doesn't change that they did the horrible thing. The rape, or the murders, or whatever.

But circling back - with a fictional character... they didn't hurt a real person. There's no one who is real that suffered. The things the character did IRL are bad because they hurt real people.

So you're not being disrespectful to the victim by feeling that empathy, or sympathy. By exploring the things that they were a victim for. Even by wanting to focus on those things - fictional characters should be compelling in all their aspects, if they're written well.

And yet, of course, if you do that empathy and do talk about what the bad person went through and all that context, people come at you. They call you evil, just as bad as the (again, fictional) character, or they say that you're treading dangerously close to the arguments people use to defend the real people who do these things in real life. Or you're disrespecting all the victims of these crimes IRL. Especially of course, if the person coming at you has a reason this comes close to home.

But again - fictional.

In an ideal world, we'd all feel sympathy and empathy when it's called for, regardless of what the person did. Even the worst most monstrous people deserve human treatment in prison. And if you don't have empathy, that's hard. Even if you do have empathy, that's hard.

So if you look at a fictional character (who doesn't hurt a real person by virtue of being fictional) that does horrible, vile things, but went through so much, and you still can't empathize or sympathize with them... I mean, it doesn't make you a bad person, not even close, this is still fiction, and there's people I should empathize with in fiction that I don't, but...

It's still a failure of your ability to be empathetic. And we're all humans. We're all failing at that, among other things, all the time. But... it's good to be aware of that. at least?

At the very least, bear that in mind when other people are talking about that context, and that victimization. And please, for the love of god, don't fucking pretend that the victimization didn't happen, that this person who did do terrible things (in fiction) suddenly didn't also (in fiction) experience awful shit, as if doing a bad thing erases all the bad things done to you.

Again - it doesn't necessarily make you a bad person, but like... the horrible state of prisons in our society is a real, actual problem. The way we as a society dehumanize people who do bad things is a real actual problem for a lot of reasons (not least because it creates an incentive for authority that wants to dehumanize a person or a group to expand the definition of 'did bad things' to make their dehumanization now acceptable, among other things).

So yeah. Fictional character who suffers but than also makes others suffer - that's a useful exercise in Empathy. And doing that doesn't make you or anyone else a bad person, or actually defending the sorts of crimes, IRL or Fictional, that this character did. Contextualizing is not whitewashing, empathy is not erasing, and humanizing is not disrespecting the victim(s).

So yeah, they fictional character did bad things. But there's more to them than that. And you can say but and talk about what comes after but without disrespecting the fictional victim. Because the fictional victim... is just as fictional. Just as not real.

Is it possible for this to end up being taken too far? Yes. But that's a reason to be mindful of yourself when it comes to real people, not to never do it. And when it comes to fictional people - again, fictional. Nobody was actually, really hurt.

(I really do want to make clear, before people read the tags, that this applies to all crimes these sorts of characters do, rape was just picked as the one to use as the example.)

[kasumingo]

"Science showed that there is not much difference with how we react to fictional stories and characters compared to real life and real people" is a take I've seen more than once now and it's something that sounds so objectively untrue

So does anyone has any sources on that?

[sevenangrybees]

Sometimes things bother me

[laesas]

Hey I hate daemi as much as the best of them but let's maybe be a bit mindful in our outrage when talking about characters with suicidal thoughts and not frame it as "Macau wouldn't be so selfish" "his brother's love should have been enough to keep him alive" "Why didn't Vegas do more to save him" etc.

Critique the plot point choice all you like, it's perfectly valid to say "it's upsetting" "it's messed up" "I'm sad and angry that they didn't give this character a chance to heal" even "I'm sad because this character had loads of cool potential and it feels wasted for shock value" but I think within that it's important to make sure we aren't framing suicide as "selfish" and the friends and family of victims as "not doing enough".

[wpffw]

[clueless1995]

i’m trying to treat chibnall’s era with the same grace i’d give to rtd’s era but some of the Moral Lessons are so beaten over your head it’s insane i feel like i’m watching Play School sometimes

[fastepp]

i need YA to be better written and I need full grown adults to stop recommending me YA. these two things are related.

[chisatowo]

I love nuzlocks you get forced to use pokemon you would never use otherwise (especially in randomizers) and then you can chose out fun naming themes and have a fun little lineup of guys that you may or may not get to use and then there's the horrors

[captainshyguy]

i’ve been watching the great british bake of 2019 with my mum and it cracked my brain open like an egg so i will be insane for like a week probably heads up lol

[the-reblogger-of-headcanons]

Me watching the discourse unfolding by the FE Engage leaks on my hill of absolutely zero fucks

[synonymsforstupidity]

'Kris being an outcast who likes freaking people out means they must be a Bad Person™️ and thus taking their free will and piloting them like a puppet is actually Good™️ morally speaking'

How about I eat your skin how bout that