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relaxxattack · 3 years

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hi im asking u this bc u seem to be bee duo enthusiast so

ive been calling c! beeduos relationship platonic because i thought that was what their cc’s said, and i thought they had said that they were uncomfortable with ppl shipping the characters. But ive seen a lot of posts that say their relationship is canonically romantic? and i absolutely do not want to come across as homophobic by watering down a mlm relationship to just friends because that happens so much in media so.

what is the canon state of their relationship / ur opinions on the platonic thibg

dont worry abt answering if u dont want to!! i see a lot of differing opinions and i trust yours :)

aw it’s totally fine, im flattered you asked me about this!

let me put it simply: it’s a whole mess, lol.

first im going to talk about what’s happened fandom-wide that caused differing opinions, and then i’ll explain my own opinion/interpretation. :]

(this got really fucking long im so sorry)

ranboo and tubbo initially proclaimed the relationship was romantic, specifically in argument with the wiki editors who had set it as platonic by default. (you can see this in the vod where they decide they’re canonically married— it’s very funny. chat tells them the marriage is already on the wiki, they check, tubbo is jokingly offended that it says platonic and asks if he needs to up the romance).

tubbo also makes jokes about adultry, which sort of implies the relationship is not necessarily a platonic one.

(theres definetly more in that stream alone but it’s been a long time since i watched it so i don’t remember a lot of it.)

the wiki, because of this, suffers from going back and forth on platonic and romantic, seemingly unsure where the joke ends and the canon begins, or if its canonically a joke! a mess, as you can already tell.

this gets more complicated as the marriage bit goes on: outsiders, such as phil and scott, both at one point say “platonic marriage”, which then ranboo and tubbo agree with. however, when chat asks them if they’re platonic, they say the opposite. so there is a lot of confusion there.

there’s also the difficulty of being able to tell streamers and characters apart. ranboo and tubbo both don’t like being shipped irl, and that’s their boundaries that shouldn’t be crossed. (they’re also minors, but tbh when they’re 18 in a year i will still be following their boundaries regardless of their legal age).

due to people not wanting to be accused of minor shipping, they started adding the platonic tone indicator to most of their drawings— basically a way of saying “no homo”. meanwhile, tubbo frequently on stream flirts with ranboo and makes quite a bit of nsfw comments towards him that are frankly hilarious.

this goes on for a while with nobody really sure what’s canon, but a lot of people assuming it’s probably platonic, until: the drama of the mods night. a few mods dmed all the wiki editors telling them ranboo wanted his canon character relationship officially set to platonic.

unfortunately for those mods; the very same day, a few hours later, ranboo on stream makes fun of puffy delivering him and tubbo “friendship flowers”. because, and i quote, “bruh. we’re literally married. this must be how the ancient greeks felt.”

in case you don’t know, the internet often jokes about how historians will call ancient greeks ‘very good friends’ when they are quite obviously gay. so in this context, ranboo is joking that people will call him and c!tubbo, who are married, “close friends”, when he doesn’t think they are.

basically, ranboo canonized romantic bee duo, the very same day the mods told everyone he’d wanted a platonic one.

chaos and drama immediately erupted everywhere. on tumblr, we were talking about how weird it was of his mods to do something like that without asking him first. we ALSO talked about how weird it was of them to assume that ranboo can’t make his own decisions, or assume teenagers cannot be in relationships without it being sexual. twitter did the same thing but in the opposite direction: called ranboo mods homophobic, or said they were mad ranboo felt pressured into making a romantic relationship canon ‘just so people could have mlm rep.’

i dont want to go into detail about the drama that happened that night because apparently official people follow me and i dont want to stir it up or have them come “clarify” things. im just saying what we talked about.

ranboo in typical ranboo fashion apologized quickly and seriously. he was deeply sorry for possibly offending anyone with how he’d portrayed his rp relationship with tubbo, and he also assured everyone the mod thing was just a miscommunication.

he said he would talk to tubbo and they’d decide once and for all whether it was platonic or romantic, and then announce so everyone would know.

it’s now been a few months and we've had no word from them on that development. we still have no clue.

now, here’s my opinion:

i want to take ranboos word for it that it was a miscommunication with his mods, but... we had it on good authority from people on the wiki team and people in the discord with the mods that (while it was happening) they were really going after the wiki admins, and also made some weird comments about it. that combined with the way ranboo seemingly had no clue (considering he canonized their romance that very same day).... it’s very. sus of the mods.

then there’s the canon we’ve got since then. although occasionally adults in the room have called it a “platonic marriage” and tubbo once (back when it first started) called it a “plankton tectonic” marriage, in roleplay it’s been... kind of not that. tubbo and ranboo make nsfw jokes about each other in character, and their characters also share a master bedroom and bed in the mansion. there's also the way c!tommy really thinks it’s a romance between them as well, and they agree with and play off that— for instance confirming that they “fell in love” when he asked, or ranboo confirming that they “make out on occasion”.

people will still put platonic on their art and posts, imo, because they’re worried about breaking ranboo and tubbo’s irl boundaries by looking like they ship them. or even just being accused of shipping real life minors. and that’s a valid fear to have.

the thing is though: c!bee duo are not cc!bee duo. they’re roleplay characters. cc!bee duo are not okay with being shipped, but they made their characters get canonically married, and call each other “husbands”. so it’s okay to write the word “husband” in your comic without adding “platonic” to it, i promise.

telling the ccs that their characters have to be platonic is... weird. it comes off as not only babying them, but also as saying teens can’t date without it being gross. which isn’t true.

(this is why seeing people overuse “platonic husband” so much bothers me. like, they ARE husbands. you can just say it. what are you trying to hide...?)

do i think they’re canonically romantic? ehh, its likely. it’s still okay to interpret them as platonic, because again, it’s hard to tell where jokes end and roleplay begins. like, maybe it’s jokes in the rp too, and c!bee duo are just friends. friends can and should be allowed to make jokes like that with each other! aro & ace marriages exist!

or, maybe it’s actually part of the rp, and they’re very much romantic. we don’t know!

some people say they could be a qpr (queerplatonic romance), which i could see. (a qpr is a relationship that fluctuates between, or can’t quite be sorted into, “romantic” and “platonic”. people in a qpr can do romantic things while having platonic feelings for each other). in my opinion this is a very valid interpretation as well!

CONCLUSION (sorry this got so long omfg):

are c!bee duo romantic?

its likely, but you can still interpret them however you like!

should i put /p on bee duo content?

ehhh? i find it annoying when it’s overused (as do others), but if you’re worried you can. its up to preference. putting it too much is weird though

should i put /p on things cc! bee duo do?

no. you’re not the one saying it so you can’t decide the tone tags for that. imagine you said something to your friend and a random stranger came up and was like “haha but that was /p right...?”

can i ship c!bee duo?

mmm. i’m not sure on this one. they are canonically married and very flirtatious, but the ccs don’t like being shipped and they’re close enough to being the ccs that actively shipping might be against boundaries.

can i treat c!bee duo as romantic?

yes. literally just don’t be weird about it. it’s not that hard! you can understand that two characters are husbands without making it weird

here’s the most important thing: boundaries. cc bee duo still haven’t told us what their preferences and canon is about this whole thing.

right now, i am assuming based on what they already show us they’re comfortable with, but! the second they give us any more info! all these opinions will change!

i am only going off what they do. i would never want to cross boundaries at all. i just wish they would make theirs a little more clear.

..... i hope that helped anon, i went way off the rails... i need to go to sleep.

#it’s late im so sorry for how much i rambled and wrote #i hope this helps you #bee duo #og post #there’s probably so many spelling errors i need to go to bed #i tried to fix some spelling so reblog this one ig #and not the old one

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btsandvmin · 3 years

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Ask: Reply - 2021.04.16

Time to answer some more of your questions. I have a lot this time, and still a lot left I’ll have to save to another post. You are all very good at being curious and asking interesting questions. There are also some asks that are replies to old asks, and then I’ll include the link to the referenced post.

This time the topics will be:

Ask 1 - About KTH1 and expectations Ask 2 - KTH1 spoiler with “Oh lady” Ask 3 - Vminies getting superiority complex Ask 4 - Not dismissing the bond between Vmin and the other boys Ask 5 - Other people’s words can influence your thoughts Ask 6 - Vmin not sharing rooms in Bon Voyage Malta Ask 7 - Has being a Vmin shipper always been so overwhelming with all the content? Ask 8 - “Just a friend” interview Ask 9 - The garnet necklace Ask 10 - Vmin in CMs Ask 11 - Taehyung uncomfortable about shipping/tae*kook? Ask 12 - What did Jimin write on his shirt in Run ep. 53? Ask 13 - Gina Maeng ask follow up Ask 14 - Vmin’s love is beautiful (and so much nice praise omg)

Today’s post is a long one... Enjoy!

Ask 1 - About KTH1 and expectations

Ok, so I did write a shit post about this... (I mean… This is literally all Vmin’s songs so far ), but I still think your questions are worth a proper answer.

Honestly I think speculating about KTH1 is kind of hard, and as seen in the shit post I am quite torn with my expectations... In general I am the type who doesn’t like to expect too much in fear of being disappointed. I rather be pleasantly surprised. That being said Vmin does have a track record of getting involved in each other’s songs. I mean a lot is just speculation of course, but we do have confirmed cases as well, enough to not be too surprised if they would keep it up and do something for Tae’s solo album as well. (Tae saying his mixtape would be named Jimin back in 2016 still haunts me.)

On the other hand, they have already given us a lot of collabs. Adding more would feel more like a statement, at least if it would be only Jimin out of the members on that album. The thing is that if Vmin would have something “real” or at least if they are a bit careful with how they come across... I am not sure they would do something too “obvious”. But where such a line would be drawn is impossible to know. I mean clearly they managed to write and sing Friends and it worked fine, even if they did get more attention as a ship.

We also know Tae has been quite loud about Jimin in ways that single him out, so maybe they would really dare push the boundaries as far as actually including Jimin in the album somehow. It’s also very possible there could be other members, and honestly we probably shouldn’t hyper focus too much on it and that it has to mean something no matter if anyone is on it or not.

I think one of the rappers being on it is probably more likely out of the members, but it seems Tae has shown an interest in collabs with people outside of BTS, so that’s kind of what I am expecting the most. No matter who in the group is on it I am sure fans will make a big deal out of it, and maybe Tae would rather have his own thing for his first album. I really don’t know how his thoughts would go.

But again, looking at how Tae and Jimin has talked about working together, and have had moments like Tae promising Jimin a song or Tae saying they will work together again... It’s definitely not impossible to get another Vmin song. I do feel it’s more likely for any connections to be vague and not instantly noticeable though (at least not anything romantic looking because we know what happened to the Christmas song). Especially considering how they have only recently revealed things like 4 clock’s inspiration more openly and had Friends followed by Sweet Night. My main stance for any possible real ship is still that they have reason to be careful, and yet another Vmin collab, on Taehyung’s first personal album would probably raise some eyebrows considering everything else we already have. But it could also be me over analyzing them, and maybe they just really like and want to work together. Tae for sure has after all been vocal about this preference and want to work with Jimin.

So yeah, on one hand they have a track record that is hard to ignore... But on the other I wonder if they might want to add another “point” for ARMY to look at them and their songs. I also don’t want to assume that if there are songs on there that sound romantic that they automatically will be about Jimin. There will have to be legit possible connections for me to acknowledge them.

It’s tricky. I guess we will have to wait and see. I am kind of scared both that there won’t be anything or that there will be SOMETHING. Thank you for the ask, and I hope I shed some light on my thoughts on this subject. Either way I am very excited and looking forward to an album full of Taehyung’s own songs and the stories he wants to tell.

Ask 2 - KTH1 spoiler with “Oh lady”

I am not sure it is “lady”, since it’s a bit unclear in general. He also has a part that just seems to go “do be do” and I don’t know if the lyrics are even finished or if he worked with someone else etc. We basically lack a lot of information. But even so using lady/her/she etc. in a song doesn’t have to mean it is about a specific person or that the person is a she or that it is Taehyung’s own feelings (I know he said he usually sings about things he have felt, but just saying it doesn’t always have to be).

Of course I don’t want to downplay it and say it doesn’t mean anything, but considering their fanbase is majority women, they live in a homophobic country and he has even been denied to sing a romantic song with a man before, it’s not impossible to add that to make it more “relatable” or less “gay”. God, that sounds terrible. I don’t want to start discussions where we don’t take their words for what they are, so I hope you might understand my point of view. That being said of course it could just as easily be to or about a specific woman in his life that we don’t know about. Or as you say, he isn’t actually in love but is simply writing love songs that could be inspired by non-romantic relationships or movies etc. as was the case for his inspiration for Winter Bear.

Tae also used “she” in Winter Bear, and that seems a bit forgotten. Or people try to say it has to be about his grandmother... Which we obviously don’t know, it’s just the woman people jump to since he used “she” and many people don’t like the idea of him dating a woman or writing about a woman we don’t know. Either way I think we need to remember that anything is possible and we don’t know them personally and how they think or why they choose to do what they do.

I think we need to remember that there is always going to be the possibility that ships aren’t real, that the romantic songs aren’t about Jimin and that either one of them could be in a relationship with someone else (all genders included).

Ask 3 - Vminies getting superiority complex

Hello! I want to address something that has been bothering me for a while now. I have been seeing some vminnies have a superiority complex just bcoz they ship vmin. Its very rampant among new vminnies and twt vminnies. I get that we all feel validated and happy when out OTP claim to be soulmates and bff. I feel that way too. But people have to remember that vmin are real people and their relationship is dynamic. Like they did grow from bff who used to tease e/o and fight alot to soulmates who are gentle and caring. Who is to say that one day they wont drift apart (i hope not and dont think thats gonna happen but for argument sake) so there is no reason to feel superior or look down on other shippers.

If people think vminnies are superior bcoz they are not toxic they probably know they are lying. Lbr i have seen my share of toxic vminnies though may be a lesser number but they are there and its not the ship but its that particular person who is at fault. While i agree that some ship theories cultivate hate and toxicity there may be people among those ships who are just as sane and good as we claim to be. I just wanted to address this bcoz seeing some vminnies on twt saying locals thinking vmin were tgt after coway add is a validation kind of triggered me. I m sure there would have been similar responses to any other ship bcoz they all have been tgt for a decade and are very comfortable with e/o. I just wanted to talk to someone about this and i know you have discussed similar topics in the past. So yeah this was very long.

First of all, on request I won’t show your name, but thank you for sending me this and letting me know who you are. It’s always nice to know who is behind the question. But that being said I don’t mind people asking on anon, I totally get it being a lot easier to ask or question things when you don’t have to reveal yourself. Either way I am just glad to get interesting and important topics and I do think the things you bring up are worth talking about.

As you say, there is this thing when people start to feel and act superior for various reasons, and I too have seen some Vminies do this. Getting a lot of moments is sure nice. But honestly, just imagine if another ship came and mocked Vmin or gloated every time they got more moments. It has surely happened too, and I am sure it doesn’t feel very nice when on the negative end. Just be a decent human, ship moments will always vary and it’s great to be happy about getting moments, but there is no need to compare or look down on other ships. I say it again, shipping is not a competition, just enjoy your own ship and let others enjoy theirs.

As for feelings superior based on group behavior I think we really need to stop looking at groups and start looking at individuals, both when it comes to groups we are part of and groups we consider “bad”. I have said it many times, but individuals of other groups we don’t agree with won’t all be bad, or all stupid or young etc. We might want to tell ourselves they are worse, but it really doesn’t change much.

Being “less bad” it not a merit and it shouldn’t be a competition. We all have our own selves to answer to and we should judge other people based on their actions and not based on what group they might belong to.

I think size and the toxicity of a narrative can lead to more people in certain groups behaving in toxic ways... But I think any person could happen to fall into these behaviors if not careful and aware. Often the change is gradual too, or you feel attacked by the other “rival group” and thus feel it’s justified to attack back, and so it escalates.

Vminies are at the moment as a group smaller, and thus have less “bad apples”. We likely also have a narrative for Vmin that doesn’t require as toxic mindsets, for example extreme jealousy or Vmin being forced to hide. But there for sure are still toxic Vminies, and there are also a lot of non-toxic shippers in all groups. Usually the louder ones are also the worst ones while the chill and nice will remain in their own lane and ship more peacefully. But being part of a smaller group doesn’t make you superior, your actions is what is important.

As for small moments getting noticed or other types of “validation” for your ship, of course it’s going to feel nice. However, what people see and think of any relationship in BTS is still just an outsider view and literally has no meaning for their actual relationship beyond it being a cute moment. That’s why size and popularity also doesn’t matter as any kind of “proof”. Interpretation will always just be interpretation, good or bad, if you like it or not.

Sadly I think we will get more and more toxic behavior from more ships as the fandom grows and as some things get more normalized within those ships’ communities. It’s about certain behaviors growing into a community culture... The more toxicity that is allowed the more others will follow. That’s why bringing up the problems is important, but trying to do so without shunning people so that they don’t go and create their own space where everyone else is the enemy. After all, being open and welcoming and understanding is much more likely to make someone listen and even change their mind than by attacking them.

I answer for my own actions. So does every person. I don’t want to be judged for everything every Vminie or ARMY or Multi K-pop fan etc. has done. Generalization is a huge problem in general, not just in fandoms or ship wars. I do try to be a positive influence, to not judge too harshly and to remember that being hostile won’t help any situation. But that’s about it. I am glad you brought up this topic, because talking about it is important, but sadly I don’t think there is a lot that can be done about it. Just try to be nice and open minded.

Thank you for the ask, I hope you all understood what I wanted to say.

Ask 4 - Not dismissing the bond between Vmin and the other boys

Thank you. I really see no need for it. It’s clear as day that they all love each other, and even if one pair would happen to be romantic instead of platonic that won’t change. We don’t have to compare and we definitely don’t have to downplay the moments they share with each other. All shippers should at the very least accept the the things they do and say as mostly genuine. I trust BTS and what they show us, it’s that easy.

I know some also get influenced by toxic fans, but we really need to remember that no narratives by fans matter when it comes to reality and what bonds BTS share with each other. They are all great people and seem to have such love and respect for each other I frankly don’t understand how you can be a fan if you think any of it is played up to the point some claim.

Likely no ship in BTS is real, but if any is, to me I am sure the ones involved would be happy and supported by the rest of the members. That’s why it doesn’t really matter what ship would be real or not real as long as they are happy. We shouldn’t let our own views and sometimes want or hopes affect the way be judge their reality. This applies for things outside shipping as well.

Thank you for your kind words. :)

Ask 5 - Other people’s words can influence your thoughts

Indeed. The brain is a powerful thing. This is very obvious if you are a multi-shipper or a general fan, but BTS truly has a lot of questionable moments between all kinds of pairs. Focus is a interesting thing. If you like something you will notice it more, and you will also remember it more while you forget other moments. Likewise if something is “negative” like a rival ship you are likely to notice them more as well. This happens even if you just watch the general content and get your own bias. Imagine then how it might influence you when others keep repeating either your happy interpretations or things you worry about? You’ll get it stuck in your head and remember it more than other things.

Like isn’t it funny how we might gush about Vmin sharing beds, or worry about ji/kook or tae/kook cuddling while hope/kook literally sleep wrapped around each other in both Bon Voyage 3 and 4? Sometimes it’s all about perspective.

By now we need to realize that fan perspective will influence us a lot. And in particular if a lot of people say it or if it is presented in a way that makes it sound logical and intelligent. Words have power.

I still think using “Vmin is dead” or spreading worry often in itself leads to people thinking it and it being somehow accepted as fact. In similar fashion getting to hear about certain ships or certain narratives will make us notice things in relation to that. My own words and posts too will have influence on some people that read them. That’s why I try to be so careful, and why I try to avoid using strong words or claims that might cement themselves in someone’s mind. (I’ll actually talk more about the power of language in my big analysis as well)

Thank you for your input, it’s definitely an interesting thing to consider and another aspect of why shipping mentality is so complicated.

Ask 6 - Vmin not sharing rooms in Bon Voyage Malta

Hi and yes, I have answered this before HERE, but it’s ok. I know it’s not easy finding old topics amongst my collection posts.

Collection of asks - BTSandVMIN Collection of asks 2 - BTSandVMIN Collection of asks 3 - BTSandVMIN

In short I think Vmin wanted to share rooms but that Taehyung got fooled when Jimin stopped him from checking the upper room. Because it seemed like Jimin stopped him from walking into that room by saying he couldn’t peak Tae probably assumed it wasn’t Jimin’s room and that when Jimin said it was his room he was joking (his face was definitely something). So yeah, I think he just got fooled by Jimin’s statement about not being allowed to look inside the room before picking. There are other interesting things about this whole moment, but the one thing we should take away from it is how it is one out of now many examples that seem to show that Vmin have a preference to share rooms/beds. Thank you for the ask. :)

Ask 7 - Has being a Vmin shipper always been so overwhelming with all the content?

I wouldn’t say it’s something recent. I say it often, but we really do get very intense periods from time to time with many of the ships. For example in February 2017 with ISAC, fan signs and everything else we got a lot of Vmin too. I remember being overwhelmed myself, and that was coming out of BST era Vmin. We got many moments every day and that’s just one specific period I can remember.

Over the years sometimes we do get these very intense days or weeks with a lot of moments at once. Usually I get asks like “do you think something is up with Vmin lately” or “wow I can’t believe how much Vmin we have gotten lately” but really, it’s hard to tell, because it really does happen from time to time. I also still say we always get Vmin moments regularly as long as we get BTS content, but sometimes a bit more and sometimes less. I am sure there will be more times when we also get “Vmin is dead“ and worried people because we get less moments than they expect. It just happens, up and down and around it goes.

As for what ships are big I will definitely say Ji/kook and Tae/kook are the biggest, but that all BTS ships are big by now. Meaning as soon as we do get moments it will be seen online. Especially if you follow people who talk about it of course. I also think what platform you are on can result in some ships being seen more than others. For example I know ji/kook is by far the biggest BTS ship here on Tumblr while Youtube seems to have more tae/kookers.

Thank you for the ask. Let’s hope Vmin keeps overwhelming us. (But let’s not start to worry if they don’t) ;)

Ask 8 - “Just a friend” interview

Ah yes, I have a bit of a soft spot for this interview myself. I am not sure, but I think it might be from 2017 (since Tae wrote a birthday letter to Jimin in 2016), or at least that’s when I found it and saved it down. I haven’t actually tracked the original source. You can find the translation in the link shared HERE, credits to @95z.

Seeing this close after the chaos of Let’s BTS and other letter confessions it really does seem very cringe for them to express sincere thoughts in these more formal ways. I can’t blame them.

I do think this interview is yet another example of how much Vmin has tried to adapt to each other, learn and be more open with expressing how they feel. They literally inspire and learn from each other in how to express themselves. Isn’t it completely endearing?

I also love how they get each other to feel strong emotions and how they are there for each other when in need. On a slightly more analytical note I also can’t help but note the “just a friend” vs “soulmate” descriptions and how they seem to have a hard time putting it into proper words. We already know this of course, but yeah... They really don’t have an easy time describing their relationship.

Thank you so much for sharing this moment. I was going to talk about it in my big analysis anyways, but honestly I can’t save everything for it, and you mentioned it so who am I to keep it to myself.

Ask 9 - The garnet necklace

Oh yeah, I know that JK wore it once and that the talk was that a fan gave it to all of maknae line. Not much was ever confirmed from what I know, but regardless it doesn’t change why I think it’s a Vmin/soulmate necklace and why I see it as special.

Here is the thing, when I use “Vmin thing” it really doesn’t have to be exclusive. To me it’s the context around it and how they have used it and even reacted to it that makes the garnet necklace something special for Vmin. In the case of the soulmate necklace Vmin wore it a lot. Almost constantly during a big part of 2017 and even a bit into 2018. They also wore it at the same time a lot. I find this very cute, and we all know “couple items” is something all fans enjoy even if it would just be a platonic relationship behind it. But if both of them wearing it was all there was, as a lot of Vmin sharing clothes (or BTS in general sharing clothes) I wouldn’t really think too much about it beyond it being cute. It could still be just a cute thing that Vmin did, but I personally see it as something beyond the normal clothes/jewelry sharing.

(At the very least you can remember Vmin did this while people thought their relationship was dead, which doesn’t make much sense to do if you hate or dislike someone.)

The things I find more noteworthy about this necklace is the fact that the fandom picked up on it and because they wore it so much and so often at the same time it was dubbed the “soulmate necklace”. Possibly knowing this Tae also brought specific attention to the necklace at two times, as if wanting to show it off. Interestingly enough, in one of these times Jimin seemed to ignore Taehyung who was bringing attention to it on purpose. For me it came across as another thing Taehyung wanted to show off and that Jimin was a bit more careful about.

Of course I could have read it wrong, maybe Jimin just misunderstood. But even so, Tae did bring attention to it in specific relation to Jimin. You can watch the clip HERE. (BTS Tell Us What They Love About Each Other & An Update On Tony & Nate From America Hustle Life)

The other time was in Run ep. 39, right after Vmin talked about being in school together and showing off their school uniforms. If Tae is the one to try and highlight something, I feel it likely has some meaning to him at least.

Either way the necklace is basically a symbol of Vmin’s relationship and the fact that they liked it so much and wore it together during a long period I think they liked wearing it not only because they both happened to like the design but because they both had it. If JK also had one and didn’t use it of course it could include him, but I will still say it remains significant for Vmin’s bond with each other.

As for buying a necklace together they haven’t talked about this one in particular, but Tae did mention he bought his tiger necklace with Jimin in NY, so maybe you are mixing the two things up?

Ask 10 - Vmin in CMs

Thank you for loving my blog and for the ask! :) I am not sure if you perhaps meant in a lot of BTS own photoshoots/units as well, but I’ll focus on CMs in this post since that was your direct example. I might go a bit beyond here, but I saw it as a good chance to revisit some Vmin ad moments.

I wouldn’t personally say we have gotten “way more” but I do think because of their Friends unit they got to do some more interviews together and some CM stuff too. I also think we have gotten more BTS commercials in general now, likely because it’s an income alternative to touring during the pandemic. So that obviously means more CMs, and more chances for them to be paired up. They also have gotten paired with others of course (like in the Bodyfriend CM or Baskin Robbins), but most commonly they aren’t divided in smaller groups at all.

We also have gotten Vmin paired up before, both in photoshoots and in CMs. Of course we saw some great ones in 2016 with Puma and NUGU, but I don’t think we got that much more in 2016 and before than in 2017-2019. I think what we can see is BTS having more endorsements after Covid.

Like honestly, the Puma adds are iconic. Of course the original one, but also the revisits from 2018. Puma definitely seemed to like to pair Vmin in particular. (There are so many good examples from Puma that I’m not including)

We also got a snippet in the Hyundai one, also from 2018.

Another snippet from the Coconut Chicken ad from 2017.

I mean, I don’t know if I should count the snippets at all, like from BTS x VT cosmetics in 2019, but I feel sometimes just being seen in the same frame seems to get attention as being paired up so. (I decided to not include being together when it’s at least a third member in the frame)

And guys... Have you ever watched BTS and the milk song?

What did we get so far more recently? In 2020 we had the Hyundai interview.

And the hyundai #PositiveEnergyChallenge

Fila provided a nice one, also from 2020.

Samsung gave us a snippet recently.

Coway was basically couple goals and like the best one in my own opinion (besides Puma because it is going to take a lot to beat Puma).

But other than that? I don’t think we have seen it that much, have we? I am not complaining or anything, like I am happy with what we got, but I don’t know if it’s that much. I might forget some obvious ones, but these were the ones I had top of mind. Feel free to add ads if you can think of more recent ones that I left out.

So I think we have gotten more BTS ads in general, also more where they are not all of them or single focus, and that we have seen maybe Vmin getting paired a little more after Friends. But to me there is such a small difference I can’t really say if it is anything particular to Vmin or just BTS doing more CMs.

I mean, I don’t have a sheet of who has been paired with who and how many times over the years. But either way I don’t think we should look too deeply into things like CMs or even photoshoots units. Thanks for the ask though, I hope you enjoyed this mini collection. :)

Ask 11 - Taehyung uncomfortable about shipping/tae*kook?

So this is a thought sent in after THIS ASK though it really brings up a new subject, which is that of Tae possibly being uncomfortable with shipping. As for Tae saying that to a tae/kooker in particular I think we have to remember it could very easily just have been in the moment and we can’t know why he decided to reply to that person in particular.

The Vmin post was not invasive and it wasn’t romantic. I mean, I do think Tae keeps showing again and again that if there is any person in BTS that is special to him it’s Jimin. But the difference in the posts also likely matters, but we can’t know how much. We don’t know if Tae would feel annoyed if a Vminie wrote the same thing as the tae/kooker did, and we don’t know if it was just in that moment that he got fed up with the shipping discourse in general, or if it was because it was tae/kook.

Honestly any shipper, regardless if a ship would eventually prove to be real or not, should not go and invade spaces where the boys get exposed to it. We don’t know if Taehyung would have reacted in a similar way if it happened to be another ship.

Personally I don’t think tae/kook drifted apart as a result of shipping, because honestly they still kept being pretty intimate physically and engaged in fanservice on stage etc. If they truly were uncomfortable with the idea I just don’t think they would “feed it” much at all. I think as they said in ITS they just, kind of changed and it became harder to talk. I’ve talked more about tae/kook and my views on their bond in THIS POST and a little in THIS POST as well as about BTS possible stance on shipping HERE.

I also think all of BTS has a pretty good distance from hate and fandom speculations in general. I think that because they know about shipping and partly also feed into it they probably expect crazy people to some degree as well, even if they probably don’t like it. Hetero shippers as well, or solo stans etc. have very toxic behaviors at times, but I think BTS can recognize that it is kind of “bound to happen” with their popularity, no matter what they do about it. Not saying they would like it, and they could definitely feel awkward or annoyed because of it, but it doesn’t seem to bother them too much as I think they can detach themselves from it pretty well.

I also think “fan opinions” in form of rival shipping wouldn’t really harm a hidden couple as it first would likely be a sort of “shield” and second because they have their relationships and are likely comfortable with them on their own terms. What fans think is probably secondary.

It is possible that they could get annoyed or frustrated at times, but again, if they truly felt bothered by it they probably wouldn’t do a lot of the things they do. Because I am sure they are aware to some degree that fans scrutinize their every move and ship moments. Both Tae and Jimin are some of the most physical out of the members, and also some of the members that seem to like to initiate fanservice moments... So I doubt they would have much problem and can feel secure enough in their relationship no matter what fans think.

Ask 12 - What did Jimin write on his shirt in Run ep. 53?

Hi, I guess you got curious after I talked about this episode recently in my post Ask: Reply - 2021.03.30 (Ask 8 - Going down the rabbit hole, micromoments and shipping vs believing).

I don’t know hangul, but I do know what “Jimin” looks like. On Jimin’s shirt from behind the scenes of Run ep. 53 you can see he’s written his own name “지민” Jimin followed by what looks to be “ 님 “ which is nim. So basically the text on the container in the picture says Sir Jimin.

Jimin seemed very keen on writing his name on both his own shirt and on Tae’s and even tried on JK’s. He failed of course, but he sure did try.

Thank you for the ask, and isn’t Tae cute?

Ask 13 - Gina Maeng ask follow up

Glad you liked my reply. :) (From Ask: Reply - 2021.03.30 Ask 4 - Idols dating members of the same group). Yeah I get what you mean, talking about it openly I suppose isn’t so normal. But since it seems to be more and more fans who assume it happens to some degree maybe it’s not so strange if it starts getting more talked about as well. I’ll take it as a good sign, even if the information is nothing new in itself, being more open is going to make it easier for fans to realize it’s possible for their idols to be LGBT+ or have hidden relationships.

As for K-Population it doesn’t seem to be too well known, but it’s one of few actual examples to be found. So yeah, interesting that we know it has happened, and also that it shows what risks it could mean to get involved with a group member. I think the risk of a falling out is something a lot of shippers tend to forget. Anyways, thank you for your reply. ^_^

Ask 14 - Vmin’s love is beautiful (and so much nice praise omg)

Oh my... I am not sure I have ever been called sweetheart by anyone ever before. Thank you! You are making me blush with all the praise. 💜💜💜

But really, we can all just watch Vmin in awe and be happy they have each other and feel such immense love for each other, no matter what that love is. It’s kind of amazing. Like even if they are platonic their relationship is so wholesome and they put so much love and effort into it that it’s truly inspirational. I love when we get bombed with moments like this with a very intense period of great Vmin interactions. As you, me too never fail to feel all soft watching them together.

95z is love and what a love they share. Truly wonderful. 💜

You take care too, and really, thank you so much for this lovely message. it means a lot and is very heartwarming.

And with that sweet ask I’ll end the post. There was a lot of very different questions and I feel I could have written more about many of them, but alas I need to remember I can’t write full essays on everything or I would never get anything posted. Thank you all for reading and I hope you found my thoughts and speculations interesting. ^-^

#vmin #vmin analysis #btsandvmin #ask: reply #vmin collection #vmin ad #vmin cm #vmin commercial #vmin gif #vmin photo #bts shipping #btsandvmin answer #my post #Ask: Reply - 2021.04.16 #vmin soulmate necklace

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florenceisfalling · 2 years

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okokok so its kinda like the consumption of skewed fiction is okay as long as you know the difference between what is and isnt okay in society? i think thats what im getting maybe? but what if someone reads that kind of fiction and like, also agrees that that kind of thing is okay irl? would they be a proshipper or would they be something else?

i think i can understand it, its just a deal of knowing that fiction is, fiction, and its not okay for fucked up fiction to happen irl? like i can read a story about i dunno, a town falling apart due to mysterious murders and enjoy the plot but if i were to say "man, im really wanting dozens and dozens of innocent people to be gruesomely murdered i think thatd be a really neat thing to happen" then thatd be a problem because at that point id think that kinda thing is okay amd id be wanting that kinda fucked up shit inflicted on real people?

OR OR IS IT LIKE TWILIGHT?? people like twilight for lotsa different reasons, some like the movie because its outrageously toxic and badly made, some like it because of the concept of "this is a toxic relationship and its extremely entertaining" and some like it because they idolize the relationship between bella and edward and i guess jacob. the difference between these three is that the first two recognize this relationship as fiction and bad, whereas the last one idolizes the toxic relationship and probably wishes that kind of relationship to be irl. the first two know the relationship is not okay but the last one thinks it is?

IM SORRY IM JUST TRYING TO HET MY HEAD WRAPPED AROUND THIS PLEASE TELL ME IF IVE GOT SOMETHING WRONG

~krabs :]

you grasp this really well dude dont apologize at all!!

what you said at the start - "the consumption of skewed fiction is okay as long as you know the difference between what is and isnt okay in society" - is such a perfect and succinct way of explaining it, or at least how i see it:

a person who is proship/profiction is someone who thinks that bad stuff (mysterious murders! toxic relationships! all the things u mentioned!) is okay in fiction but not in real life! ayyy

not everyone who agrees with that calls themself "proship" (lots of them r just ppl who think its common sense, not a label, lol) and not all proshippers have good views. but thats the basis of the proship community in fandom!!

the reason there are so many antis, or people who think proship is bad, is because people jump to conclusions when taboo stuff is involved. it kinda goes like this: person A ships something with an unhealthy age gap, or whatever -> person B assumes that because A spends time writing or drawing it, they think it is okay irl -> B thus makes a post falsely claiming A is a pedo/abuser/whatever -> person B's followers take this at face value, without checking further.

this spreads like wildfire online! you know how it is.

its also important to know that: 1.) when someone makes content with these dark themes like murder or abuse or so forth, they should be tagging it/otherwise making sure people don't have to see it if they don't want to. its just common courtesy, so that nobody gets triggered. 2.) fiction and reality are different, but fiction still affects reality. writing about a murderer is okay, mentioning someone being transphobic in a story is okay. but trying to incite violence with hate speech, or turning a character into a transphobic caricature, etc, is obviously Not okay. ik ur aware of that! im just sayin that anyone who responds to criticism for bigotry with "fiction =/= reality!!" is misusing that phrase.

#lemme know if u have any other thoughts :0!!! ty for talkin w me krab <3 #discourse

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popculturebuffet · 3 years

Text

Ducktales Treasure of the Golden Sun: Three Ducks of the Condor or Now with More Racism!

Hello all you happy people! And welcome back to my look at Ducktales: Treasure of the Golden Suns!, the pilot episodes that started it all. This look was one of my patreon stretch goals. To explain them in case some of you aren’t familiar with patreon it’s essentially like a kickstarter stretch goal: every milestone I reach in my monthly earnings means a crop of reviews for you guys, with this being 10 and my review of the movie, and the goofy movies in two weeks and September respectively, being the 15 dollar one. So if you want reviews of the OTHER Ducktales mini series Time Is Money and Super DuckTales, then hop on aboard and help me reach my 20 dollar goal so I can keep making these reviews for a living and give you all more. Said goal also includes a Darkwing Duck review eveyr month AND a review of teh Danny Phantom special The ULtimate Enemy so hop on board HERE AT MY PATREON. Patrons also get exclusive reviews, access to my discord server (Though if anyone would be more intrersted in me making that public let me know), and to pick a short each time I do a birthday special for a character from Looney Tunes, Disney and Beyond. And next month is my boy Donald’s so since you all already sat out goofy NOW is the time.

So now my very necessary plug is out of the way, i’m very poor, we can get to the review proper:

When last we left off Scrooge and the Boys went on their first proper adventure together, heading to Central America to follow the map from the first episode and running into Dr.Claw El Capitan and his new best buddy Glomgold. Mild racisim, moonsoons and much better pacing ensued.

So join me under the cut as my boy Donald returns, some iconic characters are introduced in Webby, Launchpad and Beakly, though this series only made one of them iconic to be fair, and we get some more mild racisim because fuck my life. Onward to the cut!

So yeah as I’ve mentioned a few times now this episode had a content warning.. which was fair as there is some pretty cringy stuff in here but it had the side effect of me holding my breath until the racisim came up and whapped me in the face. So i’m keeping that tension up for you guys so I don’t have to suffer alone.

We open at the Mansion. Scrooge is trying to find a governess for the boys, but they keep scaring off all the clients because they don’t like the idea. And for once.. i’m on Scrooge’s side here. Yes I know there’s a sterotype of rich people hiring a nanny to not have to parent. and it’s sadly often true and it’d SEEM like Scrooge is doing that.. but really he just wants the boys to be safe. He’s fully grown to care for them and just wants someone cheap and responsible to look after them while he’s busy and clearly still makes time for them. As someone who is a former nanny, albeit for someone working class, I get that as much as you WANT to spend every moment with your kid you often can’t. I say all this because SO MANY kids movies and shows villianize parents for not spending time with their kid when their clearly just working to support them. There are nuanced exceptions to this and refreshingly Craig of the Creek has outright avoided this: JP’s mom is gone almost all the time due to working as an airline pilot, but while he clearly misses her he never resents her or guilts her over it, he understands sh’es supporting him and goes out of his way to make sure his friends can meet her. It’s really swee.t And while again I get it, this guys a billionare, most examples aren’t, Scrooge still really CAN’T stop working: He has more money than god and like most bilionares REALLY should give most of it to charity or to help with programs instead of hoarding it in a massive bin.. but he’s also got tons of companies, factories, investments... people COUNTING on him to make sure these are working correctly and keep their jobs. So yeah i’ts nice that the show isn’t demonizing scrooge for this or dosen’t even consider it: he’s getting help beacuse he needs it, that’s what’s important.

So while the boys widdle down the nannies, Scrooge talks to a renowned coin collector. He does show off his collection to the guy, but his main goal is naturally to show him the coin from last time. Turns out that naturally for a five part episode the treasure they lost last time was just a fraction of the real thing and the real titular treasure is a mythical horde even Scrooge, who normally has proved something out of myth is very real 5 times before breakfast, didn’t think existed.

Something I do love about this five parter is how every treasure hunt has ended up being important each piece of the puzzle leading to the next like any good treasure hunt. As for where this one leads the collector HAS heard of only one other coin like it, up in the Andes Mountains in a mysterious fortress whose mountain habitat and being a fortress makes it hard to get to and the owner is apparently a real piece of work.. but Scrooge isn’t afraid of a little hard work and is ready to go after it.. he just has to find a Nanny first.

And he does as there’s only one left: Mrs. Beakley, who we FINALLY meet after two episodes. Yeah for some weird reasont his episode choose to cram the rest of the major main and supporting cast into one episode.. it still works, they all still get great introductions it’s just weird to me when you have five episodes to not say introduce Launchpad last time.

But regardless as I said it’s a good intro.. despite the boys wilding a lasso and a snake.

Beakly is unphased and even dosen’t remotely fall for them trying to say she got the wrong name. And while Scrooge is a little impressed, he’s even more when she states she’ll work for free... with one condition: Free room and board for her and her grandaughter, Webby, who has been there the whole time and looking cute as a button. Scrooge is unsure but one minute of Webby being adorable later and he’s agreed. She can’t eat much right? He also hopes she’ll help the boys not be douchebags, unaware that their inherent poorly written sexisim means that was never going to work. And why yes I will call it out eveyr time it happens because it happens every time they have an episode together and only gets worse.

He goes to Gyro for help and Classic Gyro.. is utterly delightful. While I clearly have issues with Classic Scrooge, whose a greedy poorly aged asshat and the boys, who are sterotypes of male children, Gyro? He’s nice, friendlya nd eccentric, using a delightfully wakcky pogo hat thing to think and takes only a mintue to figure out how to solve a seemingly unsolvable problem and only needs a few hours to build his cool looking bird ship, using bird legs to offset the hard to sort out landing conditions. But since it’s a fancy bitch, it needs a pilot and i’m sure we all know where this is going...but since Carol Danver sis busy he has to go with Launchpad.

Launchpad’s intro is great, cheerful as he does a job testing a plane and naturally crashes it, and when thought dead walks out seconds later unharmed and jolly as ever. Scrooge is naturally terrified of the prospect of flying with him but dosen’t really have another choice “I hope my insurance is paid up.” Scrooge it’s you.. of course it isn't.

So with that our hero bids a farewell to the boys and ends up unteitonally coming off MASSIVELY unlikeable. No really he leaves them behind for their saftey despite needing help... and then upon finding out Donald is going to be on leave soon in the andes, and just assumes that YOU KNOW, he’d LIKE to go on a dangerous exausting adventure instead of actually get some rest after working in the goddamn navy and STILL dosen’t take the kids along despite having a very tearjerking farewell IN FRONT OF HIM that happened at most a month ago. Granted i’m suprised Donald is getting leave this soon.. but since I genuinely like to look into this sort of thing and the last time I didn’t I was correctly reminded Gulliver’s Travels was a satire.. and found out someone HAD actually watched the Jack Black movie. I only vaugely remember a trailer.. I thinkn it was a trailer? Maybe it was the middle part of a juinor novelzation where htey have all the photos? I really don’t know. I know almost every pokemon on sight but not where I saw pictures of a forgetable jack black movie, what a shock.

So long story short I DID google it. Here’s what I got

So given clealry more time has passed than we’ve seen on screen, enough time COULD have passed for Donald’s three day pass to kick in. So credit to the crew for actually thinking that out. They still get all the blame though for not only not seeing how bad not taking the kids to see the uncle whose like a father to them a month after he left when he CLEARLY can is bad, but how worse it is that the first break donald gets ina month.. is spent helping scrooge against his will on a life or death treasure hunt.

And I get WHY they wanted to try out having Donald on an adventure: he was in most of the carl barks material.... but I also dont’ get it as Launchpad was deisgned entirely to fill in for Donald when needed, we’re only three episodes into the series and this gives the wrong impression Donald will guest star a lot more. In practice while he still did get a meaty 8 episodes on the show including this one, 2 of which were cameos and the pilot only dosne’t count because of the exnteded slapstick sequence, and dosen’t appear at all after season 1, likely because Fenton’s introduction made him reduntant as he was an even more blatant Donald stand-in. It just feels weird to shove him into the pilot movie when we should be focusing on our main cast, epsecially with so many getting intorduced this episode. It woudl’ve made more sense for Gyro to be the third man instead and it woud’ve elmaited Scrooge’s uttelry horrible actions here of depriving his nephews of their surrogate father.

So Uncle Dickstick leaves with Launchpad to go abduct donald.... and tha’ts not me being funny, that’s what actually happens. Donald is singing out on leave.. with his superior... weirdly doing paper work outside on the flight deck.

And is angry at Donald because of him taking pictures and stuff and threatens him if he’s not back exactly in time... because look he’s on a boat with a bunch of sweaty men but as the most superior officer he can’t enjoy that so he has to get off SOMEHOW and ruining donald’s life just happens ot be a thing for him.

So yeah Scrooge straight up naps Donald via claw and Donald is angry, wondering, as you’d expect “What’s the big idea”.. and once Scrooge clairfies he did it.. still asks that because what the fuck. And the episode treats this as comical, as it does Launchpad not understanding Donald.. and don’t get me wrong you CAN make a good “I can’t understand Donald Duck” joke, the 2017 series made PLENTY. But said series also spoiled me as they did it with far more effort, while also still showing just how much it would suck to have everyone around you struggle to hear what you say and never listen to you. They actually cared abotu Donald’s well being where as this one thinks “Gee you knwo what would go great iwth a hard month’s naval work? MORE WORK HELPING YOUR UNCLE GET RICHER FOR NO PERSONAL BENIFIT AFTER HE KIDNAPS YOU”.

So our heroes.. and scrooge, head to Andes and find the temple and it’s here “Sigh” we met our antagonist. A Conquestador Douche who DOES have a name and it is on the wiki.. but is so generic and unlikeble I’m just going to keep calling him conquestador douche, whose introduced waving his sun coin around while the natives all bow to him because of the coin.

Welcome to the racisim! Admitely it’s not as bad as Treasure of the Lost Lamp, that’s a high bar to clear, but ti’s still not great to have the racist cliche of “character conquers a civilization because of they belivie he’s a messenger for their “silly” god”. And the saddest part is not that I didn’t notice this trope and how bad it was as a kid watching shows like this... but that as an ADULT about 4 years ago when I watched this episode how racist it and this trope in general was didn’t register to me at all. That.. really bothers me that it took me this long to pick up on things like this and i’m sorry for it.

That’s honestly WHY we need these warnings and WHY i’m so hard on this racisim: it wasn’t necessary, it could’ve been removed and you clearly just didn’t care or didn’t realize it was racist. And even acceptable for the time dosen’t work for anymore: I learned recently that the creators of Fresh Prince of Bel-Air, both white, hired black writers..and actually LISTENED, looking to them for personal stories and to check them if one of the white staff wrote something that wasn’t true to the black experience. I know that sounds like the bare minimum but this was the early 90′s, that kind of thinking wasn’t hte norm like it is in most writer’s rooms now.. and sadly not ALL writer’s rooms. Not only that but just today I ran into a MST3K skit that lampooned this kind of bullshit from not long after this episode. People clearly knew better, the writers of this episode just didn’t’t care

So yeah, I get this was a kids show in the 80′s, I get the writing staff being almost all white.. but they still coudl’ve avoided cliche sterotypes and done something diffrent. It was was still wiithin white people like myselves power to actually think about something other htan themselves and we did not. So i’m never going to stop holding my own people accountable for just how BADLY we’ve fucked up in ways great and small because it still hasn’t stopped , likely never will so I won’t.

But yeah.... the tribe here are portrayed as ignorant, mindless dumbasses who blindly follow tradition and a clearly corrupt leader. It’s patronizingly stupid to assume just because a belief system is diffrent than yours a person will belieive anything. Religion CAN make people act stupid, the fact many people are homophobic simply because the bible, a centuries old document written and distrbuted by humans that could of been altered by people with a clear homophobic agenda, says they should be. But there’s the very clear very gross implication here that any god but the christian god is invalid and simplifies wonderful and well thought out myths and beliviefs from various cultures into “well they belivie in da sun god because of the shiny coin”. It’s gross, i’m glad it’s stopped and it’s VERY telling that the closest Ducktales 2017 came to this was the most dangerous game night which while a tad cringe inducing at least showed the tribe it used was clever, disposed the person they mistook for a god after it was clear he wasn’t one , and were wholly sympathetic.

Naturally Conquistadouche orders the tribe to attack Scrooge and it works briefly , though Scrogoe prepares to take on the ENTIRE villiage.. and given this is Scrooge and on this blog we’ve seen him take on an entire town before, and that was a more inexpericed less bastardly scrooge yeah their fucked, and only escape death because the coin falls out of scrooge’s coat when he tries to help donald who naturally injures himself trying to help.

And since as per white dumbass racist logic, the villiagers thought Conquistadipshit was a messenger of the gods because of his coin, they think the same of Scrooge, this causes them to stop and bow instead and protect scrooge when Conquistadumbass tries to attack our heroes. Their given a room for the night naturally.

Conquistadick demands they give him the coin and leave, but Scrooge has none of that: he has no reason to leave and has all the leverage so he instead demands to know wha’ts going on.

Turns out Conquisineart is the decdendant of one of the crew from the ship Scrooge found: their captain rain off with it, leaving two of his men behind, though both had the map to the rest of the treasure and split it: one left for the Arctic, the other stayed and did the whole racist god bit. And somehow despite all the time passing Conquistadoodoohead still has his half and Scrooge aranges a trade for the coin. And why yes their is the obvious problem of “what if Conquistascoobydoo say tells them he’s the true god and attacks scrooge like he ends up doing in the climax”. And Scrooge’s plan.. is to have the plane ready and to run to it, despite Launchpad not being a mechanic and saying as much. Instead of you know... stealing the guy’s coin while he’s asleep or something or just having launchpad, whose bigger and stronger and donald whose not bigger but is also stronger hold the guy while Scrooge steals his sun coin, then simply walks to the plane with the map, the coins and all the leverage. at worst the guy tries to do the same scheme without any coins and as the end of the episode shows, that wouldn’t have worked. He was stupid. Oh and the cherry on top of this shit sundae is scrooge objects to the guys tyranical rule.. but is okay with letting it keep going if he gets his coin and DOnlad, whose there for the deal, never call shim on it.

We then get a bit of Launchpad being forced off a cliff to ride a giant Condor...

Look this episode is filled with racisit sterotypes, a generic villian and Scrogoe being awful. I’ll take a fun sequence of Launchpad riding a condor, with Donald providing an assit with his camera by blinding the beast so Launchpad can ride him properly giving them more leverage now Launchpad is popular. And a deadline to fix things by tommorow.

The next day Launchapd and Donald have defied logic and their own tendency to screw up and fixed the bird, while Scrooge makes the deal.. and naturally it goes EXACTLY how you’d expect and Scrooge runs, though our real heroes get thigns running.

That’s when the people arrive on condors to persue, a fight insues yoru standard hero stuff.. not bad but given the racist context I can’t really enjoy it like Launchpad flying a condor.. which had some mild racisim in them making him do that as a ritual clearly deisgned to kill him but i’llt ake mild over pretty damn obvious. Eventually douchebag looses his coins, his ctizens abndon him. Happy end.

So with the map Scrooge decides to do the logical thing.... have launchpad drop him in the middle of the ocean in a raft and steer there

Launchpad takes Donald home in time and his superior is mad he dosen’t give him a proper salute.. even though he CLEARLY just got home and is diisorented from a crash. Launchpad makes a quip and this episode mercifully ends.

Final Thoughts:

This episode starts out okay.. but quickly goes downhill fast and steep. There are massive bits of racisim, massive leaps in logic, and massive amoutns of scrooge being a dick.. not his WORST in this series but it’s still bad. It’s just not very good. It’s the second worst episode of Ducktales i’ve seen, only held up by my boys Donald and Launchpad. This was miserable.

Next Time on Treasure of the Golden Suns: Our heroes head to the arctic for another offensive episode to rescue scrooge from his own stupidity. Next Time on this Blog: We return to Green Eggs and Ham and hop on a train as our raging bitchcanoe mother and daughter duo meat our ambigiouslyg ay duo at last.

See you at the next rainbow.

#ducktales #donald duck #scrooge mcduck #launchpad mcquack #huey duck #louie duck #dewey duck #bentina beakley #webby vanderquack #gyro gearloose #treasure of the golden suns

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ninakaina · 4 years

Note

sorry to bother you with this if you have already addressed it, but I couldn’t find such a thing and didn’t want to assume your intentions. You said you dont demand that people stop shipping BurDa, you just want the ship to be seen more critically, which I believe (unless that has changed ofc) But I’m struggling to understand how this statement works with believing that it is inherently racist? Surely if that’s the case people should stop completely? Regardless of answer, thank you for Ur posts!

don’t worry about it! i’m sorry actually, i’m having trouble connecting concepts and putting thoughts together tonight, so this will probably be a little disjointed.

it’s kind of a complex subject! my purpose in making those disclaimers is to make my posts as accessible as possible to my audience, whoever that might be. to be clear, i’m NOT saying my way of doing things is right or the only right way or that people have to “be nice” about their opinions, this is just how i choose to go about this conversation. but i do want to be nice when i can (eg. i don’t make problems on random people’s burakhovsky posts* or talk about specific users i disagree with unless they have spoken directly to or about me or they’re big well known racists like threi), and i want to make it as easy as possible for well-meaning people to start thinking and talking more critically about things they like. i think that there are some people who have been able to learn something useful from my posts who wouldn’t have if i had said “if you like burakhovsky/burda, stop it or block me��. i would personally rather encourage people to think and talk about it critically, and i know it sucks to see even valid condemnations of the things you like so i want to remind people i’m not attacking them. i obviously don’t like that it’s shipped at all, but... point number 2:

i don’t feel comfortable saying that it Should Not Be Liked as a rule / demand / universal statement. a lot of things are inherently racist. most things are inherently racist. again, please don’t take what i say in this post as my assertions of how anyone else should be acting because this is my very specific and uncertain personal choice. i wouldn’t argue with someone who said everyone should stop, and i don’t argue with my mutuals who enjoy it critically. i’m pretty good at making connections between concepts (normally) but making moral or authoritative judgements about them is something i’m a lot less confident about, believe it or not. like, the ask i just got about the stamatins: i can tell you some things i find interesting about them, i could do some analysis that might make someone think about them in a new way, i can tell you they’re racist, but when asked how i feel about them or if it’s ok to like them i’m at a loss. i thought for a long time about “why it’s ok” for me to like maria and i’m still not completely confident in my answers. “is this racist?” “is this a harmful trope?” are different questions than “are its elements so racist and harmful that it can never be liked or engaged with without being part of the harm?” that is a complicated question with a lot of variables, and i am very fallible, and i don’t feel educated or experienced enough to tell you not to like something, period.

one of the reasons for this is i don’t know what’s going on in the heads of people who like it. i don’t know every single shipper’s heritage, experiences, conclusions, or reasoning. i never saw anything between them so i clearly don’t see what a lot of people see, and i don’t know how it’s handled when it is handled critically-- i don’t consume burakhovsky content when i can avoid it (i have it blacklisted on tumblr and don’t read fics) because it very easily can become upsetting for me due to my personal experiences. like tweets about me, i only find out what’s going on with burakhovsky content when friends or followers show it to me. and again, i don’t know how you think about it in your mind. my conclusion is that it is racist and harmful enough that i personally should not like or engage with it. when i ask people to think critically about it, i want them to come to their own conclusion on that matter for themselves, personally.

* where i draw the line and start getting assertive is when you create and publish content that is harmful. when you are creating content, even fan content, even analysis, it’s no longer a matter of “enjoying things”, it’s a matter of actions and decisions which can affect others. which is why i say racist tropes/themes in fanfiction and fanart and discussion should be addressed and why i really appreciate creators who make space for good faith criticism and acknowledge their fallibility. this is also where my footnote for the “not making a stink on other people’s posts” comes in-- as i’ve said before, if you see offensive content being made, you’re welcome to ask me to address it directly on your behalf. i appreciate all the people who have held me accountable throughout my life, even when sometimes it took me a while to come around.

i hope this made a little bit of sense! in conclusion it’s a matter of my intention in the posts i make, which is to start a conversation and offer a new perspective, a matter of establishing my respect for well-meaning people with lives and thoughts i don’t know, and a matter of the complexity of ethical judgements and my own insecurities about whether my feelings are right or good or real.

#daniel davinky #thanks for this one it really got me thinking!#Anonymous #asks

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the-breloominati · 4 years

Text

pretty unimportant but it's whatever

i am now being exposed to shipping/art discourse in i think the first time in my life

and I just

so the thing thats getting to me is the whole anti and anti-anti thing right

cause people are getting upset about getting hate from people that dont like one of their ships or something??

and like I get it cause apparently some people are receiving really bad harassment and maybe death threats idk this isn't something I really actively seek out yknow

but when you write with kinda vague language ("fucked up tastes in fiction" for example) it kind-of leaves a lot of room for interpretation

and I know thats the point becayse theres a lot of things to cover right?

but like..

ok so there's this story "Borrasca" right

its really messed up (the plot basically revolves around this sexual abuse ring), but it isn't glorifying the abuse or anything?

its kinda hard for me to put into words but basically the abuse isn't included for the pleasure of the reader

like its messed up but thats kinda the point maybe?

it isn't written in a way that's supposed to provide pleasure to the reader, I guess is what I'm trying to get at

and so there's a difference between that and writing horrible abuse for the purpose of providing pleasure to the reader, if that akes any sense

and like you do you I guess, I don't..

art is weird in the sense of what you should and shouldnt express I guess

I just..

idk like I'm just so tired of it

like yeah I guess "purity culture" is kind-of a thing

but also please think about and be aware of how art affects people and how it will be seen by people

because a thing I've seen a lot from anti-antis (idk if this is them as a whole but from what I've seen it kinda seems to be the thing) is the whole "oh fiction doesnt affect reality" thing

and I cannot describe to you how frusting it is every time I see it

like yes for the most part fiction does not have a direct impact on reality

most people won't read something and be like "oh so this is ok now" or "oh I'm going to do this now"

but it is absolutely fucking ludicrous to believe that fiction has no impact on people whatsoever.

believe or not, people are, in fact, affected by the fictional media they consume

yknow Cupcakes? that mlp fanfic? and rainbow factory?

those helped shape me as a person and have probably affected my tastes somewhat

like yknow gore art? and body horror?

like I'm mostly fine with it

body horror's neat, and I love me some Junji Ito

but I think a lot of that is because I was exposed to it I guess

Because, when you consume a piece of media, regardles of how it affects you, it still becomes a part of you.

It does affect you.

Just not in the way I think a lot of people assume it would.

also with your vague language, are you upset because you made like.. idk a fanfic focusing on like idk an abusive relationship and exploring it (idk, I have no idea what people do)

or is it something that is genuinely concerning and may, in fact, have a negative effect on people

And for fucks sake stop calling people who get triggered by certain media "snowflakes."

I understand that they can just block you and move on, and stop looking at the piece of media that's triggering them, but it literally costs you $0 and only a few extra seconds, maybe a minute, to put a trigger/content warning on your piece.

Acting like that's too much work or acting like the people that get triggered are being entitled is the most snowflake fucking thing.

Grow the fuck up.

Sick of people being super vague like "oh x person got mad at y person for making some fucked up art" or whatever.

Stop being vague about it.

If you're being vague because you don't to write out what it is they did, maybe think about why that is, and reevaluate.

I understand freedom of expression, and how important it is to art.

I understand pushing boundaries.

But please for once in your life sit down and think about how what you make is going to be perceived by people.

Death of the author is real. And it's one of the most important things you need to remember as a creator.

Doesn't matter what you intended for something to be.

Probably the most important thing is how other people are going to perceive it.

And in case I didnt say it before: don't harass people, and never send anyone death threats.

First, those are things you generally just shouldnt do. Period.

Second, if you have a problem with someone, all harassing them does is give them the opportunity to be like "oh I got death threats over a piece of art," which gives them the opportunity to be the victim, amd makes your side of the argument look way worse. You want people to hear you out, dont fucking do that shit.

#im gonna fucking scream you people are insufferable #mostly the anti-antis tbh #like yes antis harassing people and sending them death threats is bad.#i am aware.#most people are aware that those things are bad.#but its so unbelievably frustrating to see people acting like fiction has ZERO impact whatsoever on people #literally.#like just.. throwing this out here #and yes i know its a more extreme example you dont need to point that out #but im willing to bet a lot of people have found out theyre into something *because* they consumed a piece of media #didnt akidearest (anime youtuber) literally say the reason shes into tentacles is cause she stumbled across that one episode of bible black?#or like how she found out she was into it??#so dont fucking act like fiction doesnt affect people because it absolutely does #like oh my fucking god #yknow stonetoss? that nazi who makes comics trying to get people to believe the same things they do?#pretty sure people have been radicalized to the right by those *fictional* comics #so kindly shut the fuck up.

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secretlyatargaryen · 5 years

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Ugh asoiaf fandom is so frustrating. I'm so sick of people talking shit abt tyrion when their faces do literally all the same shit but they only hold tyrion accountable. Like multiple people have said that they dont shop tyrion with anyone because of his issues with women but then ship Petyr and sansa or sandor and sansa and its like,,,,, just say his dwarf dick makes you uncomfortable and leave oh my goddddddd

And like I have no issues with people shipping whatever the fuck they want, but if you cant bear to ship tyrion with anyone because his canon flaws make you uncomfortable then you should also be uncomfortable with people like petyr and sandor. It’s not a moral “this is how you should be” its literally a logical “this is how you should be” and the fact that they’re not just shows how fucking transparent they are

I’m far from an anti make no mistake it’s just the hypocrisy that pisses me off. I’m sick of the ableism and I want positive tyrion content I cry

It’s just plain ableism. I don’t care what people ship, and people have different tastes and tolerances and experiences, so some people might be able to handle, say, Sansan, despite the fact that he assaults Sansa, but not like Tyrion because the forced marriage makes them uncomfortable. That’s perfectly fine. What’s not okay is faking moral superiority or acting like your fave is objectively less problematic, or acting like it’s objectively worse for Tyrion to be in a situation with Sansa that he was forced into and which is also abusive for him vs Sandor acting of his own free will.

People also need to realize how ableism comes into play in the way fandom views Tyrion as a whole, even among Tyrion fans. I think a lot of people do this unconsciously because ableism is a learned institution that permeates our society and our thinking unless we actively question it. So when I talk about ableism I’m not saying people are sitting there going “grrr I hate people with dwarfism” (although there is a lot of blatant ableism in this fandom wrt Tyrion because people with dwarfism are largely seen as an acceptable target even among people who consider themselves sensitive to social justice issues), what I mean is that ableism is often present in our thinking even if we don’t realize it, so people do have to question WHY they see Tyrion’s sexuality as so much more threatening and uncomfortable. Shit like that post in, ironically, a livejournal group called “Sane ASOIAF Fans” where the poster was like “It’s a good thing Sandor’s cock didn’t betray him on the night of the battle of the blackwater!” to make some kind of disgusting comparison between a scene of a grown man assaulting a child and a child being raped by his father, in order to make the former seem better and to demonize the latter, is not okay, and a symptom of the ableist idea that even when Tyrion is being abused, he is a figure of disgust or somehow to blame. People are enthusiastic to ascribe malicious or immoral intent to Tyrion even in places where they would forgive others, and that IS a symptom of how we as a society collectively think about people with disabilities, disabled men and in particular men with dwarfism, who throughout history have been used as a symbol for disgust and a threat to idealized feminine purity. That’s why people are more inclined to, say, forgive Sandor on the grounds that he was drunk, but ascribe malicious intent to Tyrion despite the heavy coercion that he is under. It’s also why people are more willing to forgive Jaime for having abusive sex with Cersei, because he fits a masculine ideal and has sex within the confines of a relationship, and it’s easy for us to say that Cersei “wanted it anyway,” vs Tyrion who is both disabled and has taboo sex with women he pays for. There’s a lot of assumptions about how OBVIOUSLY no woman could actually want to have sex with him, therefore it’s somehow worse for him to have sex or think about having sex. This also comes out when people sneer at Tyrion for thinking that he wants Sansa or Shae or anyone to love him. There’s a perception in fandom that NO ONE could love Tyrion so anytime he thinks about wanting love it’s somehow wrong and a sign that he really wants to commit rape or that he’s imposing on women (specifically able bodied, idealized women) by even thinking about them.

That’s why fanfic writers who want to imagine Tyrion being in a mutual relationship are sneered at, because there’s no way that could REALLY happen, right? Like, I can’t count the many times I’ve heard about how it’s somehow awful to imagine Sansa being in a mutual relationship with Tyrion because it’s “disregarding Sansa’s desires.” What bullshit. Sansa is a fictional character, and her story is far from over. If I write a story in which Sansa desires Tyrion, then it’s not Sansa’s desires that are being disregarded. It is the ableist reader’s perception of Tyrion that isn’t being catered to. Same with the insistence that Tyrion has to be portrayed as a sexual deviant or predator, and this goes for the show adaptation as well as fic. There is NO reason that Tyrion has to be portrayed the same way in the show, or in fanfiction, that he is in the books. No reason. Tyrion is a fictional character, and not a real person. So no adaptation is actually “whitewashing” him because there is no real Tyrion to whitewash. So when people are like, “but Tyrion did x thing!” Okay, great, but in my story he doesn’t. There’s no reason that should be a problem unless you’re really invested in seeing this character being portrayed a certain way, and being invested in seeing fictional disabled people be portrayed as villainous or immoral is not a good look.

Also, within fandom, even Tyrion’s moral behavior does not explain the lack of fic or fandom content. I have been told lots of times that it’s okay for me to write “dark fic” about Tyrion (which is bullshit anyway), but if that were the case, why are there not hundreds of dark fic about Tyrion? Why doesn’t he have a thriving fandom the way Thramsay does, if that’s the real reason people are uncomfortable?

I’ll tell you the reason why, it’s because Tyrion is a dwarf. That’s the reason people are more comfortable with like, all manner of sadistic torture porn but the idea of a person with dwarfism being portrayed as a sexual being, as a romantic being and an object of desire, makes people uncomfortable. That’s the reason Tyrion’s sexuality is exaggerated in fandom (which is so meta because this EXACT THING happens to Tyrion in the books and is used against him in his trial, to make him seem sexually deviant, when his sex life with Shae is, in reality, pretty vanilla.)

It’s also an interesting phenomenon to observe because the way Martin writes the story, Tyrion’s sexuality is on display for the reader. Sandor’s and even Petyr Baelish’s aren’t. Even though we hear about it, we don’t get the details and narrative closeness that we do with Tyrion. That’s why there’s a persistent fandom belief that Sandor doesn’t actually sleep with prostitutes or that his sleeping with prostitutes is somehow innocent, or why there are certain fans who make excuses for even Petyr. We’re told it happens in the books but we don’t see it, so it’s easy to idealize or imagine away. Meanwhile GRRM revels in the details with Tyrion and like, on one hand that’s part of what makes the character revolutionary, because the book deals openly with the sex life of a character who, because of his disability, would usually be portrayed as sexless in fiction, and does not apologize for it. But the flip side of that is that people with dwarfism have also, historically, been treated as an object of fetishism and sexual horror, and for all GRRM imbues Tyrion with humanity, there is something of a voyeuristic quality in the way he writes Tyrion. The reader is kind of like Oberyn going “oooh, tell me more!” and it also must be remembered that GRRM does not have dwarfism and is able bodied, so the way he writes Tyrion, especially with regard to sex, is not exempt from these stereotypes about people with dwarfism.

So like, when people cite x, y, and z thing as a reason Tyrion shouldn’t be shipped with *anyone*, maybe we should question why the story was written in such a way that the only POV character with dwarfism and a congenital disability in general can comfortably be excluded from shipping. Maybe we should question why we allow exceptions for other characters but automatically assume the worst about Tyrion, even when we aren’t in his head.

And if it’s about Tyrion’s relationships with women, why aren’t there tons of m/m ships with Tyrion? I can probably think of like, ten possibilities off the top of my head which make more sense and have more canon evidence than most widely accepted asoiaf ships. Why is Tyrion excluded from even AU scenarios, if it’s really about what Tyrion does in canon? Why is there so much policing in fandom of even fix-it fics or noncanon fics that want to imagine Tyrion a different way? Fandom is about creativity, and insisting that this character with dwarfism HAS to be portrayed a certain way and nobody else can imagine him any different is extremely uncreative, and as I said before, it is NOT a coincidence that fandom suddenly gets uncreative when it comes to a character whose disability marks him as other.

#fandom drama #ableism cw

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modern-oedipus · 5 years

Text

Conflict post that got too long and title doesn’t match the rest because I didn’t plan to write so much

Please be honest: Do you think Conflict is an angsty fanfiction?

Despite the amount of sadness, suicidal tendencies, ptsd, panic attacks and even implied incest; I can’t bring to think that Conflict is angst. It’s just the story of two flawed boys falling in love in their most vulnerable moments and learning how to know themselves as they get to know each other.

It might be because I know the whole story, though, unlike the readers who know the first arc only. I mean... it’s perfectly fine however you interprwt their story. It’s not like I’m mad. I’m just surprised when I see things like “this is so sad!” I mean, yes, Ray is not going through best time of his life, but I think it is honorable. It’s honorable that he is trying his best, despite the depression blowing his mind. It’s honorable that Norman is trying to be a little honest with himself despite the chaos he is living in. It’s honorable that Emma sticks with Ray through thick and thin. It’s just characters trying their best, I don’t think it should be needlessly tagged as “angst” because I don’t think I write them that way for the sole reason of sadness. Rather, there is something I want to tell— something I want all of my readers to see.

But I can’t blame anyone since I haven’t written 3/4 of the fanfic yet. I haven’t shown you even a bit of the path I’ve already decided and mentally written for Conflict. I actually wanted to write Conflict tonight, but due to personal reasons I’m not feeling my best and despite my efforts to write Shotgun, I couldn’t write shit, and it won’t be good for my mental health to be in fiction today. Today I need my science and my facts (I say today but it’s 2.40 am and maybe I should sleep).

So, basically, I want to just SHOW by writing instead of giving leaks and stuff, but...

But...

You have no idea how much braining it takes to write Conflict.

Sure, I’m not a professional writer and there may be many better, smarter stories out there, but to me, personally, I put my best into Conflict. I give it all I have. I give it all my experience and everything I’ve learned until age of 21. It is a very condensed, artistic way of me talking about my life and experiences and observations throughout a fictional universe where it is not directly my life, but a world I try to represent in balance. So— to me, ever since I started writing first chapter I treated Conflict like my first book, I mean, sure it is a fanfiction but I thought “I’d give it a try as a hobby and if it goes well— if i can stick to it determined and if I get nice feedback and if people like it, this will give me strength to write a real book!” and BOY I got SOOO MUCH MORE THAN I’D EVER EXPECT, I even got FANARTS and people messaging me or commenting how much they personally relate or how much the fic helped them to go through bad days or how much they’ve seen themselves in Ray or Norman’s situations, and when I read those messages I can’t help but think all of you deserve to see the way Conflict builds up. You deserve to see how many times Ray and Norman are challenged, by themselves, by each other, and by society, and you deserve to see how they respond to them, and you deserve to see how much and how little of a difference it can make to have two people really love each other. Anyway, I went off topic, I was saying that, to me Conflict is a story I’m giving all I have got as the person I am today.

Other fanfictions of mine are moreee easy to write because they don’t have sovmuch in depth characters or complex plots and they are just that, fanfictions, in which I write a ship. But Conflict, man, I treat it like my real novel— which is technically one to me, though a non-profit one dedicated to the manga that really challenged me, and I have no regrets writing it or making it a fanfic. Anyway! Thing is, given the fact that Conflict is heavy, content and chapter length wise, I can’t always get to write it. I could, if this was summer, but this is collehe time and even though I really want to get going, sometimes I need to save Conflict for another time when I’m more available. Me publishing easy to write things like Shotgun doesn’t mean I’m available for conflict. The mental energy they take is A LOT different.

But it’s not in a bad-different way! I love both my fics! I have no regret over time and dedication I have for Conflict! I just, don’t have the time for it all the time, which can’t be helped.

It’s 2.49 am now. I really want to write conflict. First draft of chapter 16 was written two months ago. The scene is completed as a draft. But that scene includes a terrible pstd & panic attack about Ray and I just... /sighs/ don’t really wanna get in mood for something so gloomy? I wanna write more cute stuff like their awkward date on Shotgun... but I really want to keep Conflict going. I guess I’m terrified that given how fragile my mental health is right now, the content of Conflict might make it worse. I’d still proud to have finished a chapter. But thinking about writing about Leslie’s loss and its effects on Ray makes me shiver, because that’s a topic I’m sensitive of and although I almost never get affected emotionally from the ficsbI write (for example, I dont cry writing sad smiles neither do I smile a lot at soft scenes, I’m usually neutral and I simply enjoy act of writing itself) but the 1% chance that Conflict’s content might fuck with my mental health.. as if one last trigger before a breakdown, makes me want to stay a few steps back from Conflict and just breathe.

But I also somehow feel like I’m really available to write Conflict. I don’t know. Why do I care so much about Conflict, you may ask, since it’s just a fanfiction.

I think that’s because Conflict is the first real thing I’ve done (along with many other achievements that exactly started on the same day, July 1) after I got out of depression. It proves me that I can create something— get it visualized— and having people respond to it makes me feel connected to world. Remember the scene I wrote about Ray’s detachment to Emma’s calls? I’ve never gotten physically unresponsive like that, but there were times depression made me detached and to me that’s the scariest part... feeling detached. I feel as if I don’t post a fic for too long (assuming I’m in mood to write), or if I don’t go out/go to school/go to gym for too long, if I don’t meet up my friends or reply back to my texts for too long, I may get detached. If I get detached, I’ll think of dark, terrible stuff. If I don’t return world easily, it may easily slide into a depressed day. Or two days. Before I get back. And those one or two days are scariest because I’ve lived a YEAR worth of them, continiously, and god forbid me or anyone experiencing that. It was terroble.

So when I don’t write even when I want to, I feel as if I might get depressed. Not emotionally. But rationally— be being unable to do things I want to do EVEN WHEN I HAVE TIME AND SOURCES AVAILABLE FOR THEM would build depression up. I sm not saying right sway. Anyway. That’s why I care about Conflict. That’s why I’m staying dedicated. Dedication prevents detachment. When I’m not detached, and thankfully having readers interacting to me, I feel— or prove— that my work is reaching someone. I exist. My ideas mean something. Even if it’s just fan base, ie friends— I consider y’all friends— I mean, we are still kids, right? Most of us are 16-25 and that ain’t even real adult to me, we are just friends befriending each ofher oe so I believe, so like, even if its just with friends it means a thing. It prevents detachment. When I’m not detached I’m motivated. When I’m motivated I want to live. When I want to live I go out and do things. When I go out and do things I get motivated again. When I’m motivated again I write again. When I write I’m not detached. The cycle continues, see? Of coursw, writing is just ONE way to prevent detachment. It itself can’t carry all burden. Same goes for me regularly going to classes, going to gym, meeting up or calling my friends, etc. I’ve learnt that the more places you put a bit of yourself in, less likely you are from detachment. And that’s good. Idk, that’s why comments are important to me. It’s too personal at this point but they really, really, really help me to stay in connect.

So I want to write, so I can be happy, and I can interact, and look at my published chapter, so I can be further motivated to do things tomorrow... but it’s now 3 am and, I, if I start now I won’t be done earlier than 4.30 am and it’ll be cold and I’ll be brain dead, so for my sake, it’s better if I sleep. Msybe studying a bit before sleep will prevent detachment as well. I usually don’t EVER get detached, I’m quite successful at holding myselfnon line, but that’s bc I am careful about triggers. So... not starting conflict will be the best decision.

I don’t know how much time I’ll have in sunday but I hope it will be enough for a chapter update.

If you’ve read so far, thank you, this post went out of hand— but I can comfortably talk about it now because I’m over it, and I’m trying to rationalize the fact that me consistently updating really makes me happy and excited and having fun instead of feeling detached and it’s important and I just love my story and I hope you all feel content and satisfied when you read Conflict’s final.

#nila stuff #conflict #writing #personal #shotgun

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jinsbts · 5 years

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not only do you stan jin but you're opposed to celebrity shipping; i see i made the right choice in following an intellectual.

lmao thank you :( also i got so many wild and defensive asks about shipping that im putting them under a read more so at least desktop users don’t have to read them lmao.

also wanted to add (even though without this you should also get the point about shipping) i literally got shipped in highschool with a guy i was friends with and he liked me. everyone around us would want us together and would be really fucking rude whenever we spent time. not only did it put pressure on me it also made me feel so fucking uncomfortable, i was being treated like an object/doll and it's so creepy. our friendship got ruined because of it too. bts deal with that times a thousand.

[[MORE]]

anonymous asked: lmao the responses to this is exactly what i meant about the homophobia in this discussion. Yall get so protective when someone mentions the possibility of them dating a man and then bring up how shippers are gonna explode when they get gfs in the same damn breath. Like i said i dont like it when shippers are extreme, but if i said ”wait till they get a bf” instead of ”wait till they get a gf” yall would be tearing me to shreds

idon’t care who bts date in the future at all? which is why i don't ship. i don’t see where you would’ve gotten the conclusion that i care about the gender identity of their future partner. shipping them with anyone is invasive and creepy end of story. bts literally never talk about their relationships so it’s obviously something they want to keep private. i see it as highly toxic that you’d want to pry into that and in such a public way too.

anonymous asked: As a pansexual girl my view on shipping is: Do it FOR FUN as long as you RESPECT WHO YOU'RE SHIPPING. Since when is shipping only romantic or sexual. Shipping can be between friends or as soulmates too. There is nothing wrong with being like "aw jikook would make such a cute couple" It's all for fun. People who say shipping is bad are generalizing everyone who ships. If BTS came out & said they were dating guys/girls/people we don't know, I WOULDN'T GIVE A FUCK. that's their decision.

i also wouldn’t care who they end up with alongside with the fact it’s obviously something they don’t want to share currently which is why i don’t ship? shipping real ppl is creepy and invasive end of story. how is playing with someone’s private life fun...... i just don’t see that but okay.

anonymous asked: I’m the last anon. So, if, I see two people hold hands on the street and I assume they’re dating I’m shipping them too? I really didn’t think it was that bad? It doesn’t hurt them, I have never posted anything about it or said it out loud even?

of course it isn’t the same. you’ve watched hours upon hours of content of bts vs. seeing someone on the street in a flash. and you just said it out loud here kdshfkdjfh but anyway if you aren’t posting about it then it obviously won’t hurt them so yeah. do what you gotta do i guess!

anonymous asked; Is it bad if i know irl they are brothers, but I still read fanfics? And I draw big red line between what is fictional and what is real? Or is that ok ;

i honestly don’t know? im not the moral police on shipping nor is my opinion any more valid than anyone else’s. i just think that if you’re someone who enjoys shippy content but are doing everything you can to not let it be seen by any public/big account i can’t really say anything about it?

#ask #anon #answered #long post #sorry mobile users :((#Anonymous

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the-velociruby · 6 years

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Earnest Discussions with Velo C. Raptor, #1

My Experiences with Bumbleby

I wanna try expressing my opinions & opening up a little bit here, if no one minds. This’ll be a first in a bunch of personal discourses, if anyone wants to see these kinds of posts from me. So as I am making my presence known on this site (probably a bad idea), I’ve been representing myself as a Bumbleby shipper. I wouldn’t say I’m the most devout shipper out there, nor do I really want to be viewed in that way, but when there’s a pairing that I really enjoy I’ll latch onto it tight. And Bumbleby happens to be one of them. Why do I enjoy it so much you may ask? Well, let’s dive right into that.

When I was first getting into anime, with Fullmetal Alchemist & Attack on Titan being my firsts, I was really getting into it. But my interests in most of the shows I watched died out as I finished them, and I felt a little empty without a show to be obsessed with. I was also an avid fan of Red Vs Blue at the time, so when they first announced RWBY as I was getting into anime, I was really interested. After watching the trailers, I was hooked. After watching the very first episode, I was in love with it. Granted, I didn’t like Volume 2 all that much (despite the bees’ dance), so my interests in it did die a little; that was quickly remedied by Volume 3, and then I was officially obsessed.

So while watching RWBY in its early years, I came to a few conclusions that others may have had at first: that Cinder Fall was the biggest bad, Adam Taurus was supposed to be some sort of mysterious badass (cue vomit in mouth), and everyone was gonna have a happy ending of some kind. Oh, and there was also something really important I concluded at the time: I thought everybody was straight. To me, it looked like almost everyone had a love interest of the opposite gender, such as Jaune & Pyrrha, Ren & Nora, Weiss & Neptune… and Sun & Blake. I didn’t really look hard enough into the show to think otherwise; I just assumed that Sun and Blake were gonna hook up while Yang was just gonna have her adventures happily by herself or with Ruby. It didn’t really bother me when I thought Rooster Teeth was gonna go for an all straight romance; I was pretty much fine with it because I would support the show I enjoy no matter what. Although admittedly, I did find that somewhat boring.

So if I thought RWBY was gonna go a heteronormative route, what got me into Bumbleby? Back to me first getting into anime: a thing I would do was go on the internet and search the shows I watched in the hopes of finding more content, which was how I came upon the world of fanfics and fanart. I remember how I’d look for & read FMA fanfics nonstop. RWBY was no exception; thus, I was introduced to Bumbleby through the fan-made works of its supporters (same for White Rose, which is also my favorite but a guilty pleasure because I think it’s much less likely to be canon). At first I was confused by such work, thinking ‘why would anybody ship Blake and Yang together if Blake had Sun?’ It didn’t make sense to me at first, but I found myself drawn to the numerous depictions of Blake & Yang together nonetheless.

And then it hit me: they look good together. GREAT, in fact. I was stunned, never having thought that such a relationship could have ever been conceived before. It was as if nothing could compare, nor the other RWBY ships could stand up to it. Not even Arkos, probably one of if not the most significant ship in RWBY, was designed so perfectly like Bumbleby was. Just everything about those two complimented & contrasted with each other so well – black against yellow, amber eyes complementary to lilac ones, and their fantasy inspirations intermingling with one another. The more I would find fanart and fanfics of it, the more I would fall in love with it. It was by far the most amazing thing I’ve ever seen, and it was the works of other fans that convinced me that they were the perfect ship.

But to me at first, it didn’t look like Rooster Teeth agreed with that train of thought. I still believed that they were gonna put everyone in a straight romance (and by that I mean I still thought Blake and Sun were gonna hook up). I didn’t really have any of the investigative skills I have now to look deeper into the show to think otherwise, though I did question moments in the show that wouldn’t have made sense for a friendship-Bumbleby or a romantic-Black Sun. Still, I was certain that Blake & Yang were straight at first, so I pretty much made Bumbleby a guilty pleasure. Honestly, I would’ve still supported Rooster Teeth and RWBY if they went with Black Sun, as I didn’t fall for the series simply for the romance.

Then Volume 4 came out, then Volume 5, and now Volume 6. Now, I have come to new conclusions: RWBY has a bigger n’ better bad in the form of Salem, Adam is the bull-horned bastard that he is who deserved damnation, and everything is a lot more greyer than previously thought (as in not morally black and white). Oh, and I concluded something else that’s really important: not everybody is straight. Black Sun turned out to be a friendship more so than a romance; Yang and Blake were painfully missing each other during their separation; then they were reunited and that’s all that matters (music reference haha); everything just started pointing towards a deeper relationship between the ex-partners. Bumbleby was more than likely to be canon, and it pretty much is at this point. Their stories were practically woven together, setting everything up for them to be together. Everything about Bumbleby just seemed right now. I couldn’t have been more elated.

So some individuals outside the Bumbleby fandom may think that I’m “delusional” for believing in its confirmation. Some of those people may think I’m approving of something “toxic” (which is a ridiculous sentiment might I add). Frankly, I don’t care for any negative things others might say about my preferences. This is the internet, only real life can hurt my feelings. It also never matters to me if the characters in a canon or non-canon ship are of the same gender & sexuality or not, what matters is that they’re depicted to be happy and in love. I ship two characters I adore because it makes me happy. Frankly, I’m always afraid of never finding a special someone. The thought of not having a partner and living alone severely depresses me, and I have these thoughts constantly. But when I see two amazing characters I appeal to in a happy, healthy, and fantastically developed relationship, especially one like Bumbleby, it will always give me a little hope for my own future. Or if a ship’s simply canon then I’ll just love it like a blind puppy dog.

So I guess that’s all I have to say. I enjoy the Bees, they’re on their way to canonization if not already, and I couldn’t be happier. I also couldn’t be more thankful for the contributions of others in the RWBY fandom to Bumbleby. If I didn’t find the passion behind Bumbleby that others have, a passion I learned to share & understand, I’d probably be a generally more miserable person than a joyful one. Thank you for taking your time to read this earnest discussion. If anyone wants to see more of these from me, please be sure to let me know. Also, send me any asks if you want me to elaborate on anything!

#rwby #bumbleby #yang xiao long #blake belladonna #long post #earnest discussion

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pwnyta · 6 years

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per the pedophilia ask : different person here but id like to say that the difference is that those dangerous situations are part of the show or the content and usually aren't there to make the audience happy, they're usually there to make the audience sympathize with the victim or give the victim a motivation. when you ship abusive/pedophilic relationships, you are doing it of your own volition for pleasure. (not saying you personally do this, but when you condone this kind of thing, well :///)

Except at least in BNHAs case its a battle shonen. Just as a genre you know the characters are gonna be young and theyre gonna be put in dangerous situations that will be glorified violence. There are also violent scenes played off comically. Scenes you wouldnt find exciting or funny in a real life situation. But you read/watch it anyways... because theyre fictional characters and the story is fun and exciting.

Yeah people do it of their own volition or pleasure because they like the characters or the relationships in a way you couldnt possibly apply to any real life situation without it being voyeuristic. These characters are toys for people to play with. Theyre not going to be hurt or more often then not people arent even thinking of real life.

As some one who enjoys brutal violent horror movies I wouldnt want people to assume im a violent person. If a character does something stupid in a horror movie and I cheer when they get killed... that doesnt mean I would want anyone to die IRL just because they made a stupid mistake.

Or take the Hannibal fandom... im sure most people who enjoy that show and were excited for Hannibal himself wouldnt root for a real life analog of him. Hannigram as a ship would be absolutely disgusting in a real situation for multiple reasons... but I love it in the story just because its so dramatic and twisted and theyre fictional characters so I dont care. I can read a story where the events of the series happen except they both live and become sappy murder husbands.

I enjoy terrible shit in fiction so I cant judge other people... theres probably shit you enjoy in fiction that would also be terrible in real life. So why the disconnect?

#Shots fired..

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sanguinarius-archive · 6 years

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uh so im about to discuss about salvis aka sal x travis (and no its not going to be me calling it problematic and im not gonna bash you if you like it, im going to be explaining the flaws that come with the ship regarding the canon character dynamic) so click read more if youre up for it!

warning for mentions of abuse, internalized homophobia, uhh i think thats it

alright so a lot of people tend to think that when someone tries to explain the little issues with a ship that its because theyre defending their own ship they like. and... for me? no, thats not the case. yeah i dont ship sal x travis but im not going to say i dont or argue why just because i prefer my own ship over it. thats a bullshit reason and we all know it.

as a victim of abuse and self-insecurity i completely understand what travis has gone/is going through. he cant accept that he likes boys. he’s been raised to think that its sin, that its disgusting and that the one person or being who he ever felt has truly heard his cries, aka god, hates him now. and i understand if you have been through that situation yourself and therefore you project onto him, and youre someone who has a tough time dealing with issues independently. i understand completely. as i said, ive been there before.

but i personally dont think it’d work to ship travis with, not just sal, but anyone in general. he’s a character who still has a lot of development. what he truly needs right now is a friend, and yes, i understand thats what a lot of you are trying to go for, but its hard to not see undertones of them (travis and sal) being shipped in your content. travis has been physically harmful towards sal and has harassed him and his friends. and while that is because he deals with being abused himself, causing him to not really know how to deal with his emotions, he still knows and is aware that what hes doing is wrong. hell, in the note (who im assuming is for sal) he says hes crazy about him. and then he goes to tell him he doesnt actually hate sal. so he knows what hes doing is wrong.

and can he control his anger? probably not. and thats okay, i understand that. but again as someone who has been abused and has taken out my own issues on others in different ways, ive come to learn that its inexcusable. no matter what form of abuse youve been through, no matter what mental illness you deal with, no matter what, you have to learn that taking out your problems on others in any sort of way is damaging and does not help you heal and grow from your issues.

and i think a lot of people tend to subconsciously make sal a big part of travis’ “redemption arc” in fanon content. i do acknowledge the fact that sal has said he forgives travis and is willing to befriend him, and understands that his home life is tough, but he should not be playing such a huge role in travis being redeemed. adding a relationship to travis does not erase his current issues, it only worsens them because now he has a relationship added on top of the abuse he endures from his father and his still-healing internalized homophobia. its just not healthy in that way. i dont see it working.

a lot of people tend to think especially in characters that a redemption arc is easy, that with characters you can just change them completely like the flick of a light-switch. but with how real and raw sally face is, its important we try and take travis being redeemed very slowly and steadily. he has to accept himself, first and foremost, with the occasional help from sal and his friends. he has to learn that he is not a disgusting person for loving who he loves and that with time he will get better, he just has to set initiative to that. then he has to find out how he can tackle the abuse he endures from his dad. worst comes to worst, he doesnt find a very complete way of healing from his abuse and simply runs away or turns his back on his father. and you know what? thats okay, because as long as he can escape it one way or another, and have time to heal afterwards, its okay.

it isnt easy to accept yourself while being abused at the same time. and like i said i think a lot of you tend to subconsciously make sal play a huge role in travis becoming a better person, when really, sal should only be there for small bits of advice or when travis is in desperate need of comfort. travis needs a friend, nothing more, nothing less. he doesnt need a relationship because that only adds to the problems he faces already. travis is a good character and id personally love to see him be redeemed in the last episode (aka the next episode), but i want him to be able to do that on his own.

as i mentioned before i am someone who has had a very hard time coming to terms with who i am in the past, and i have been a victim of abuse. i know how hard it is to heal and to grow, and trust me it takes a very long time. its never easy. and if you are a victim of abuse or you have dealt with/are dealing with internalized homophobia or whatever it may be, and you ship travis with sal or whoever, thats okay. i understand if its a comfort for you and a way for you to project. but you know what? in reality, unfortunately, a relationship like sal x travis, with the past dynamic theyve had, it most likely wouldnt work. it would only cause more trouble and probably for both sides.

im not hating on the ship, i just want to speak out about the flaws it has. im not discouraging anyone from shipping it, im only letting you know that it wouldnt be the Healthiest with how their dynamic is. im not willing to argue on this or start a bunch of discourse. i just thought this would be an interesting topic to make a post about.

if youve made it up to here, thank you for reading, i appreciate it and i hope you took something from it. again im not hating. i kinda think itd be cute too if they didnt have the dynamic they have in canon. but because they do have that kind of dynamic its just not good realistically.

#sally face #long post/#idk what to tag this?#let me know if you want it out of the main tag

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thelifetimechannel · 6 years

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This week’s bonus content brings us Jake and John discussing the likelihood of a robot apocalypse:

JAKE: Hey there pal! JAKE: So youre jades... brother? JOHN: that's right! JOHN: compared to how confusing everyone else's family trees are, we are very straight forward. JOHN: even if we did not know we were related at first... JOHN: i wasn't sure how YOU were related to her, back when you were pen pals. JOHN: do you remember sending me that letter? JAKE: By jove i almost forgot about that. It feels like ages ago. JOHN: i don't know how long it was for you, but i got it three years ago. JAKE: I mean from my point of view it was only a couple of months but a lots gone on. JOHN: it arrived on my birthday so it was right on time. JOHN: it came in handy in a tight spot. JOHN: you were right in your letter, i DO love movies. JOHN: even if i am not into wrestling that much. JAKE: Oh well ive had my fill of fisticuffs for awhile anyway. Movies on the other hand i havent had much time to dig into! JAKE: By the way did you like your present?? And little terry kiser? JOHN: um... JOHN: well, i named her liv tyler, actually. i didn't know you already named her, or him. JOHN: anyway, she saved my butt in a big way! JOHN: and then she flew off on a ship heroically, but ran off again i guess? JOHN: and then she somehow joined dave and rose on their even more heroic mission to blow up a sun. JOHN: which they failed to do mostly because they actually MADE the sun, but the important thing is that they tried. JOHN: they came back, but i think the bunny didn't make it. :( JAKE: I live by the philosophy that when a stuffed toy changes hands its appropriate to change its name. It gives things a history like that. JAKE: At least she died doing something i presume she enjoyed. JOHN: blowing up? JAKE: No!! Being a hero and dicing up bad guys! JOHN: was the robot sentient? JOHN: maybe we should have treated it with more respect, so it would not turn evil and destroy us like a watership down version of skynet. JAKE: I mean dirk helped me a little in making it and all of his projects seem to enjoy that kind of mayhem. JAKE: Not as much as his own version of the rabbit but i think in giving me advice at least a couple of his engine greased fingerprints are on it. JOHN: man, everyone is some sort of robotics genius around here. JOHN: if we hadn't already had an apocalypse ushered in by rogue technology i would be worried. JAKE: I briefly suspected hal but no worries. JAKE: I think if he were going to attempt a robopocalypse he wouldve done it a long time ago when he was bored and had less to do. JOHN: he and terezi would get along. they both seem to enjoy wreaking mayhem for fun, although she says she's sorry now. JAKE: They might try but dirk would go spare. JAKE: And I think hes tossed out all his spares for today already. JOHN: everyone has learned their lesson about devious deeds! JOHN: i'm confident that will not happen in the future. JOHN: instead we can relax and do things like watch that movie you were recommending. JAKE: Oh yeah!! JAKE: Which one did i recommend again? I think it was weekend at bernies. JOHN: the one about the corpse getting moved around to trick people? JAKE: Oh yes! Two gentlemen discover that their boss has died shortly before throwing a party and try to convince people hes still alive by puppeting his body around! Its really quite hilarious! JOHN: it sounds good. JOHN: although apparently i'm already locked in to watching a few others. JOHN: including dave's? JOHN: i can't believe he became a big deal movie star in your world, that's hilarious. JAKE: He did. Ive got one of his characters tattooed on my arm! JOHN: um JOHN: you do? JOHN: wow. JOHN: have you told him that? JAKE: Not yet. Should i? JOHN: you might actually make him speechless, which would be a first. JOHN: definitely try it. JOHN: wait, which one is it anyway? JOHN: also, how did you get a tattoo? JOHN: i thought you grew up alone or something, like jade did. JAKE: Ive got sweet bro. Dirk gave it to me after we met up! JAKE: Hes got hella jeff. We match! JAKE: Let me tell you it was a harrowing thing getting it! Id heard getting a tattoo really hurts but you know what i just closed my eyes and before i knew it it was over just like that. JOHN: ... JOHN: huh. JOHN: well, that sounds exciting. i'm sure he'll be thrilled. JOHN: none of us have ever shown that level of devotion. JOHN: mostly we just repeat his shitty memes. JAKE: Dirk takes memes to a whole new level pal. JOHN: i haven't really had a chance to meet him before this. JOHN: i've been missing out on so many reunions today, maybe because i keep bouncing around taking people places. JOHN: out of you guys i've mostly talked to jane and roxy. JOHN: and i only talked to jane once! JOHN: i'm already behind. JAKE: Oh im sure youll get along great! Hes a cool dude and super smart. A little odd but he genuinely means well. JOHN: i'm looking forward to meeting everyone! JOHN: wait, i did meet him once, that's right. JOHN: back in the bad timeline, i saw him floating in space and asked him what happened, because i'd just come back from fighting calliope's brother. JOHN: but all he said was 'i failed' and then he... turned into glitter? JOHN: there were lots of glitches floating around, it was a hazard. JOHN: hopefully we can overcome that first impression. JAKE: ...yeah that sounds like dirk. JAKE: He can be pretty dramatic. JOHN: rose and dave are super dramatic too, he'll fit right in. JOHN: with all of us together it's going to be all drama all the time. JOHN: it will be up to us normal people to keep things under control. JAKE: He grew up all alone so sometimes i think he only knows how to act from movies too but who knows. Maybe it runs in families. JAKE: Family. Weird. JAKE: Hey that means were family too arent we? JOHN: i guess so! JOHN: you're my... JOHN: hm. JOHN: relative. JAKE: Relative. I guess. JAKE: I cant exactly go calling you great uncle john even if i still call jade "grandma". JAKE: Has a ring to it though! Great uncle john! Its all folksy like poppop crocker. JOHN: that's right, i was jane's grandpa in your universe, i guess. JOHN: which is also weird to think about. JOHN: and i was sort of everyone's dad, by mixing our slimes. JOHN: so it keeps getting more outrageous. JOHN: as for knowing how to act from movies... JOHN: i didn't even grow up alone, and i think sometimes i have that problem. JOHN: you want your life to make sense that way! JOHN: but real life is a lot more complicated sometimes. JAKE: Yeah!! JAKE: God yes it is. ESPECIALLY when it comes to romance. Good grief. JOHN: i know! JOHN: the movies make it look like it's essential or something, when usually in real life it mostly seems to cause trouble. JOHN: but you can't get a good ending otherwise, unless you accomplish that and a bunch of other arbitrary criteria. JOHN: most of which we haven't accomplished ourselves, but i think we're going to get a good ending anyway. JOHN: still it can mess with your head. JOHN: real life is not like the movies, that's for sure. JAKE: Its hard to have a romance going when your life is constantly under threat by skeleton monsters. JAKE: Also your first time seeing another person in ten years and your first boyfriend happen on like the same day. JOHN: see, that's how it happens in the movies sometimes. JOHN: the main characters meet up and get together right away, and i guess you have to assume it all works out, because the movie ends. JOHN: but when you're actually doing things it is not that convenient, you have to keep going. JOHN: although i hope we're going to get a break soon. JOHN: i would be happy for the credits to close on the constant heroics and dying for a while. JAKE: Me too. JAKE: I want a nap. Without an evil spider troll waking me up. JAKE: Movies also dont tell you how tiring the whole rigmarole of adventure is. JOHN: the main characters always look great, if fashionably ruffled, and they can keep going no matter what. JOHN: but i'm kind of tired. JOHN: especially since i've lived through the same hours twice in places i think? JAKE: You and your weird time travel nonsense again huh? JOHN: i will probably be mostly retiring that, i wouldn't want to cause any more trouble. JOHN: for now it looks like everything is turning out fine on its own. JAKE: Yessir i think were on the right path now and as soon as were done here im gonna take a long nap and anyone who cares to wake me up can throw down about it even if they are a hitherto-perfectly nice troll lady. Or human lady. Or anyone else. JAKE: The suplex of slumber justice is unisex. JOHN: that's the spirit! JOHN: we will all pass out and righteously beat up any one who disturbs us. JOHN: except hopefully once we are settled somewhere a little less exposed. JOHN: if we were asleep here someone might roll off. JAKE: But we can fly? JAKE: Where would we even fall? Towards the frog since its like a planet? Or... down? Were being pulled down by gravity i guess but how can we fall down if theres just space? JAKE: Would we float in our sleep? Maybe just get sucked back to the victory platform? JOHN: that sounds like a question for jade, she's more interested in how this works. JOHN: i told her science was dumb and boring if it didn't work the way i wanted, which made her upset, but i guess i got what i wanted. JOHN: so hah. JAKE: So science works how you want now? JAKE: Are you ganking my power set young man?? JOHN: not all of science, just space and time i guess. JOHN: and all of the scientific laws i am violating with my wanton displacement of matter and energy. JOHN: what ever those laws might be. JOHN: i am not a scientist or lawyer. JOHN: or science lawyer. JAKE: You fiend. Ah well as long as you dont go abusing your power im sure nothing terrible will happen. Like you flap your windy hood and cause a hurricane down south like an errant butterfly of causality. JOHN: well, i sort of lured lord english here, but i had to to save calliope, and we had to fight him anyway, so hopefully you can let that slide. JOHN: like i said, i will be taking it easy from now on. JAKE: I hear you there. Im over here asking myself do i even want to go wandering around this wonderland of dreaminess or do i just want to curl up over in that edge of the lily pad and have a nice snooze? JAKE: You know i can nap almost anywhere. I consider it a talent. JAKE: I have fallen asleep on clear grassy hills except thats probably not a good thing because centaurs can track through at any moment and they arent too careful about where they step! JOHN: jade was like that too! JOHN: although it MIGHT have partly been a troll messing with her brain again? JOHN: trolls sure are meddlesome. JOHN: anyway, this is probably our last chance to explore the dream bubbles, so maybe hold off on the naps until later. JOHN: also, centaurs? JAKE: Centaurs! JAKE: Oh yeah did i never say my island was full of alien monsters? JAKE: Because my island was full of alien monsters. JOHN: wow, your life actually WAS like a movie. JOHN: no wonder it was tempting to see yourself as an action hero. JOHN: everyone else had such weird and dramatic childhoods. JOHN: i don't have many bragging rights but JOHN: i liked mine. JOHN: i guess i'm one of the people that actually... left something ok behind? JOHN: but that's fine! because there can be ok things in the future too. JOHN: or hopefully more than ok. JAKE: I hope so. JAKE: I mean most things would probably be better than having to keep an eye out for monsters while walking to the pantry for canned friggin beets. JAKE: Not that i couldnt handle myself but beets arent worth that much. JOHN: bluch, no. JOHN: jade kept trying to make us eat our vegetables. JOHN: it was terrible. JOHN: she doesn't even know about lunchables. JAKE: My grandma ONLY stocked veggies. JAKE: And this weird stuff called spam. JOHN: i think our jade would probably have a heart attack if she saw spam. JOHN: although she does like raw beef these days. JOHN: which is a little alarming if you see her eat it. JAKE: I think she mostly included it as a courtesy to me and also i dont think theres many other great ways to keep meat. JAKE: So i hunted! Hopefully most of those creatures were edible and i didnt give myself any weird diseases. JOHN: the rest of you were like man versus wild! JOHN: including dave and rose kind of, even though they lived in real houses. JOHN: i will have to catch up if we are in some sort of survivor situation in the new universe. JOHN: i'm not really sure how that will pan out. JAKE: Youll be fine. Well watch your back! JAKE: Dirk will probably like. Invent a house if you give him long enough. JAKE: Just stick with jane and youll be fine. Shes kind of like you in that she also had a pretty cushy upbringing if you count out the assassination attempts. JAKE: Not that i hold it against her anything. We all take our lumps as theyre given. I mean she also has a dead grand- JAKE: Wait a minute. JAKE: Did you say you were...? JAKE: *Suspicious squinting.* JOHN: what? JAKE: Janes... JAKE: Poppop? JOHN: i... guess so? JOHN: that would make sense, she was my nanna. JOHN: oh man, was i also crushed to death by a flying baby? JOHN: that would be so undignified. JAKE: But hold the damn phone!! JAKE: You were ALSO jades brother in my timeline! JAKE: So if you were siblings and youre also janes poppop... JAKE: Would that make her and i... related?? JOHN: um... JOHN: not genetically? JOHN: but i think you were adopted siblings in our world. JAKE: !! JOHN: she grew up with a brother under a wicked alien queen. JOHN: which was betty crocker! JOHN: and the troll empress. JOHN: it is all connected. JAKE: So we were always family! JAKE: Gosh shell be so surprised to find out i bet. Just over the moon. JOHN: who doesn't want more family? JAKE: Of course! Good gravy aint that just like a movie. So many of us grow up without any family to speak of and we find out we were all family all along! JAKE: Consarnit id even call that some kind of irony. JOHN: at least it's a pretty crazy coincidence. JOHN: except since skaia set it up that way it's not a coincidence at all. JAKE: The chilly wind of fate whips through our unshielded undercarriages. JAKE: Get out of there skaia that zone is closed for business! JAKE: Its not enough to be whipping round my legs its gotta go and nab my shorts too... JAKE: Well ive had the last laugh. Ive got PANTS now! AND family! HAH! JOHN: well, fate or coincidence or whatever, I'M happy about it. JOHN: and i think both pants and family are important.

#bonus content #jake english #john egbert

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maivalentine · 7 years

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Why do “problematic” ships and characters appeal to us?

I really wanted to write up a long post on this subject, seeing the ever growing hate and even IRL bullying that occurs because someone likes a character or ship that is deemed “bad”. A lot of these people say they are abuse survivors and invalidate the feelings of OTHER abuse survivors and it’s really starting to get on my last nerve. A lot of people in fandoms commonly say things like “That doesn’t make sense to me” or “I dont understand it” or “they hate each other (as if we didnt know that already in canon)” .

Another popular thing to do is to claim we crave unhealthy relationships and glorify them to the point where mock posts and comments have been made about those of us that hate/rival ship characters. Or, if we like an individual character that is a “bad person”.

Coming from the stance of a physically and emotionally abused person - and from what I have seen in my own fandoms and other people who support characters and ships for the same reasons I do, this is an explanation as to WHY we like these characters and their dynamics. I only speak from my own POV and am in no way trying to paint a picture of everyone who can speak for themselves.

1) Rival ships :

Why do people LIKE rivals together? Typically they are seen consistently competing and trying to show each other up. Sometimes it’s questioned if they even “like” each other, or if the rivalry ends the relationship ends. There’s several things people like about rivalry. There’s something really attracting about two people getting passionate about each other. At some point it becomes a routine - their routine. Often times the bickering starts out as legit teasing, that turns into friendly banter. There are a lot of people that love the idea of friendly bickering, teasing, and the dramatics of being someones rival.

Sometimes this doesnt happen in canon. Sometimes we decide on a ship based on their character personalities and how we *think* they would act in a fanon reality. Others can perceive this TOTALLY different which is where the “not understanding” comes from. It’s kinda wilde but different chemistry appeals to different people. Unlike hateships however, rival ships tend to be really friendly. Not always, but usually. Rivals that turn to friends BUT STILL keep their antics is one of the most appealing things about their relationship(s).

2) Hateshipping:

Unlike rivalry (which can exist in hateshipping as well) these characters have made it clear in canon they DO NOT like each other, or have blatantly stated that they hate each other or even that they want to kill each other. The terrible misconception about those of us that ship these (personally, one of my favorite dynamics) is that we support abuse and we “get off” to bruised and beat up characters and we’re twisted. Now while I don’t think there’s anything WRONG with being attracted to that dynamic, for myself and many others I’ve seen in different fandoms, Hateships are NOT about abuse - and they are hardly ever based on canon events unless grabbed to use in fanon + AUs. Hateships tend to branch off from canon and form into fanon AUs where we see this chemistry working if x thing happened, or if x thing developed this way instead, etc.

Hateships aren’t all the same - sometimes we get clue-ins that the two characters are able to respect one another to a certain degree, sometimes characters start out hating each other and that changes, or sometimes they save the other’s life unprompted. Little things like that create more initiative for us to think “huh... this could work if circumstances were different”

A lot of time with hate ships, we see how the two characters personalities mesh together SO WELL even though sometimes they appear as total opposites. Like rivalshipping (which it grabs some similarities from) they have grown into a routine of needing each other in some strange way. And we LOVE to explore that.

Another big thing about ships involving hate, is that they are often written and drawn by fans as a couple that HEALS not a couple that ABUSES one another. It’s usually about healing and forgiveness - confused feelings, and really digging into how these characters really dont actually hate each other at all. The fun part is exploring their complicated relationship.

3) Problematic Characters:

*Characters that experience abuse, but have done unforgiveable things:

People tend to assume that liking a character like this means we glorify them, support what they have done (ex: murder, emotionally damaged others, acted out, caused physical harm to others) and fully support them to the point where we want them to be forgiven for the bad things that they’ve done. It varies for every character, but in most instances that is NOT the case. In fact it’s only a handful that call these types of characters “precious characters that did no wrong” and MEAN it. ( a lot of us joke abt it but arent serious )

Like I said at the start of this, as someone who’s been abused in both ways I feel like these characters deserve BETTER. Sometimes abused characters are unfairly treated in canon - they arent given help, their help is taken away from them, their abuse turns them into the awful person they are. We want them to have redemption - we want them to have a fair development. We want abused characters to have some understanding, some respect. We are not saying it’s OK that they physically or emotionally hurt others. We are saying we understand them -- sometimes their actions can reflect an abused persons *impulses* that arent acted on. Abuse pain and the inner turmoil goes deep. Abused characters usually end up with a terrible hand, shitty development, and usually die or never get a chance to be understood.

*Characters that are mentally ill:

Similar to an abused character (sometimes characters fit BOTH) people think we are saying “theyre mentally ill so we should forgive them and support what theyve done” no . no . no. much like the abused character, we SEE how their illness has effected them and again -- how theyve received no help in canon. Thats why ships involving these characters often revolve around rehab, redemption, healing. Typically with both these types of characters we see glimpses of how they were a good person before their trauma effected them. And we want to see more of that person. We want that person to come to life. Because we almost NEVER see abused or mentally ill characters come out alive or with understanding.

*Villains:

I know a lot of people don’t grasp this still, but you can like an evil character just because they are just so GOOD at being bad. It doesn’t make YOU a bad person for liking them. It’s fictional and their actions effect no one in real life. Yes, bad content can cause a trigger or a bad feeling - it can hurt. But liking a bad character does NOT MEAN we support bad feelings // things that happen to REAL people.

Villains tap into dark fiction and it’s PERFECTLY okay to love horror and twisted things in fiction. Not all villains are 100 percent terrible either. Some start as a villain and become a hero. Sometimes, the other way around (a favorite of mine). Nothing about liking a bad character means that you are a bad person.

What’s relateable about a villain? They aren’t perfect. They have interesting character development and back stories. Usually very dark things have happened in their lives. Sometimes, villains can draw out sympathy whether you see it personally or not.

People need to respect the fact that not all minds think the same. Abused and mentally ill people, do not exist in some bubble where you personally get to decide what content is right and wrong for them to consume.

People joke about “coping” but it’s true - we DO use fiction to cope sometimes and there’s nothing wrong abt it. We DO enjoy the darker side of things sometimes and want to explore it in fiction. There’s nothing wrong with it, and it hurts NO ONE at all.

If anyone tells you that you are hurting them for liking a fictional character or ship, they’re full of shit, plain and simple. You CAN NOT hurt someone by liking fictional pairings and characters.

It is not your fault if content you like triggers someone. It is not your fault if someone doesnt agree with your personal taste. It’s not THEIR fault either. It’s no one’s fault for triggers (unless we intentionally are trying to hurt someone which is shitty dont do that) and uncomfortable feelings arising for simply enjoying something.

It’s an unfortunate thing - we all handle these things differently. But what we have to realize is that all content is consumed differently and we need to respect that. We need to kindly deal with what makes us hurt (and what makes us not hurt) in a respectful manner.

It does no good to claim people are “rapists” “pedophiles” or “support murderers” for simply liking a character or a ship. You can be disgusted. You can rant. You can vent. You can express yourself no one’s stopping you.

But lines are totally CROSSED when you personally attack a person (who probably experienced some abuse of their own - its ,more likely than you think) or even physically attack a REAL LIFE person over content that they like.

People have been bullied at cons for liking characters like Goro Akechi or Nathan Prescott . People have been called horrible things for liking characters that are deemed “bad” by others.

I’m not saying pedophilic or legit horrible content doesnt EXIST nor do I condone it (lines to be crossed here too tbh), but it takes a bit of common sense... a common sense a lot of attackers against “problematic” content do not have.

To end this I want to say the most mind-blowing thing to me is a person claiming to be an abuse survivor and then emotionally or physically attacking ANOTHER ABUSE SURVIVOR (or any other type of person really) over what characters they happen to like. That IS abuse. That IS harassment. And you ARE a part of the problem.

You are not protecting us by hurting us (ABUSE SURVIVORS AND THE MENTALLY ILL) & others .

#long post #abuse #fandom #idk what else to tag this as #hateships #rivalships #problematic characters #idk???? lol

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