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masterjedilenawrites · 1 year ago

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Lena! First off, I hope you're doing splendidly. Your posts always make my day better. Second, I had a mad idea that I'd love your take on but if it's not to your liking, feel free to ignore it. I was listening to the Pride and Prejudice soundtrack today and the thought struck me of which of our beloved clones is like which Jane Austen hero? Wolffe totally gives me Mr. Darcy vibes and I can see Fives as Mr. Tilney (young, handsome, likes to dance, likes to tease, probably understands muslin). Would you be willing to share your thoughts on any of the clones? If you throw in Waxer and Howzer, I'll love you even more than I already do. You're marvelous. Thank you thank you!

LOVE this concept. Mansfield Park is the only Austen story I'm not at all familiar with, so I'll exclude any gentlemen from that one. But here's what I think about the others and their similarities with the clones...

Wolffe is like Mr. Darcy... He's proud, yes, but further, he's a man of duty and principle. He knows what he wants and has no time for things that fall short of those standards. He is a steadfast friend for life, even taking a hit to his own reputation (or life) to save them. In a romantic partner, he'd need someone unafraid to call out his BS, but also patient enough to let him learn his lesson and try again... and he'll always try to do better for the ones he loves.

...Some similarities: Crosshair

Wrecker is like Mr. Bingley... He may not be the brightest star in the sky, but he sure is the most sincere and kindhearted. What you see is what you get with him. He gets along with everybody, making friends wherever he goes, and tends not to get too upset over things. He does, however, get easily flustered, especially when his heart is involved. He'd match with someone who is just as sweet and easygoing as he is, and together they won't have a complaint in the galaxy.

...Some similarities: Tup

Fives is like Mr. Tilney... He's charming and he's playful, he's smart and he's soft. Though he may be private about some matters, overall he's fair and honest and has a very calm but confident demeanor. And yes, he does have a unique appreciation for fashion unfound in other clones. Such a range of traits means he will first and foremost be a friend before a lover, though once shifted to the latter, will have plenty of teasing fun. He'll love someone who can surprise him in return.

...Some similarities: Howzer

Rex is like Captain Wentworth... On the outside he's a strong, dashing trooper, calm and collected in any room he finds himself in. But underneath the politeness and agreeableness is a bleeding heart, a sense of duty that often causes him to strain past his limits. He wants to do the right thing, even if it's at the expense of his own feelings. While he can maintain all sorts of friendships, the only romantic interest he'll have is in someone who knows their mind and sticks to it.

...Some similarities: Hunter

Cody is like Colonel Brandon... Really puts the sense in sensibility, am I right? Faithful, admirable, and smart... he's not old, just "seasoned." He knows which fights are worth having and which are just petty drama to stay out of. He's very generous with his time and resources, but in more of a subtle, working in the background kind of way. His loved ones will have a comfortable life if it's the last thing he does. He may not be traditionally romantic, but his patience and devotion more than make up for it.

...Some similarities: Fox

Echo is like Edward Ferrars... He's another duty-bound gentleman who sometimes gets in the way of his own happiness by choosing to follow what's expected of him over his own heart. He's a fan of good company and good conversation, and can generally get along with anyone. Though his personality may not be as charming, or his looks as flashy, he'd still be able to easily endear himself to a partner of equally good character and heart, once he had no other conflicting interests.

...Some similarities: Dogma

Kix is like Mr. Knightley... He is a sharp, perceptive man who looks out for both his friends and community as if they were family. His maturity serves as a good balance to his more, let's say, chaotic acquaintances, though he's not above having a bit of fun when it makes sense. Despite having such a good head on his shoulders, he can't help but be attracted to someone on the wilder side. Some would say they actually enjoy arguing, probably because they secretly know it helps them both grow.

...Some similarities: Tech

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Tender Loving Clones Masterlist | Master List of Master Lists

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an-extraordinary-fate · 2 years ago

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So let’s have a little love ❤️ meter test for the Austen men. Not all of them have recorded declarations of love or even a reference to them, so I had to fudge a little. I think sometimes the bits that aren’t there are just as romantic because what gets one person’s motor revving another finds sappy or laughable (mostly points to self)

Ratings scale:

kind of fond of ❤️

warm & fuzzy ❤️❤️

crazy about ❤️❤️❤️

with all my heart ❤️❤️❤️❤️

Feel free to reblog with your own passages and ratings.

Darcy: ❤️❤️❤️❤️

If you will thank me,' he replied, 'let it be for yourself alone. That the wish of giving happiness to you might add force to the other inducements which led me on, I shall not attempt to deny. But your family owe me nothing. Much as I respect them, I believe I thought only of you.'

Elizabeth was too much embarrassed to say a word. After a short pause, her companion added, 'You are too generous to trifle with me. If your feelings are still what they were last April, tell me so at once. My affections and wishes are unchanged; but one word from you will silence me on this subject for ever.'

Captain Wentworth: ❤️❤️ (I know I know I’m a cold fish, but I heard an actor read this just today and it might be changing my mind)

'I can listen no longer in silence. I must speak to you by such means as are within my reach. You pierce my soul. I am half agony, half hope. Tell me not that I am too late, that such precious feelings are gone for ever. I offer myself to you again with a heart even more your own than when you almost broke it, eight years and a half ago. Dare not say that man forgets sooner than woman, that his love has an earlier death. I have loved none but you. Unjust I may have been, weak and resentful I have been, but never inconstant. You alone have brought me to Bath. For you alone, I think and plan. Have you not seen this? Can you fail to have understood my wishes? I had not waited even these ten days, could I have read your feelings, as I think you must have penetrated mine. I can hardly write. I am every instant hearing something which overpowers me. You sink your voice, but I can distinguish the tones of that voice when they would be lost on others. Too good, too excellent creature! You do us justice, indeed. You do believe that there is true attachment and constancy among men. Believe it to be most fervent, most undeviating, in

F.W.

'I must go, uncertain of my fate; but I shall return hither, or follow your party, as soon as possible. A word, a look, will be enough to decide whether I enter your father's house this evening or never.'

Mr Knightley: ❤️❤️❤️❤️

As a friend!'--repeated Mr. Knightley.--'Emma, that I fear is a word--No, I have no wish--Stay, yes, why should I hesitate?--I have gone too far already for concealment.--Emma, I accept your offer--Extraordinary as it may seem, I accept it, and refer myself to you as a friend.--Tell me, then, have I no chance of ever succeeding?'

He stopped in his earnestness to look the question, and the expression of his eyes overpowered her. 'My dearest Emma,' said he, 'for dearest you will always be, whatever the event of this hour's conversation, my dearest, most beloved Emma--tell me at once. Say "No," if it is to be said.'--She could really say nothing.--'You are silent,' he cried, with great animation; 'absolutely silent! at present I ask no more.'

Emma was almost ready to sink under the agitation of this moment. The dread of being awakened from the happiest dream, was perhaps the most prominent feeling.

'I cannot make speeches, Emma:' he soon resumed; and in a tone of such sincere, decided, intelligible tenderness as was tolerably convincing.--'If I loved you less, I might be able to talk about it more. But you know what I am.--You hear nothing but truth from me.--I have blamed you, and lectured you, and you have borne it as no other woman in England would have borne it.--Bear with the truths I would tell you now, dearest Emma, as well as you have borne with them. The manner, perhaps, may have as little to recommend them. God knows, I have been a very indifferent lover.--But you understand me.--Yes, you see, you understand my feelings--and will return them if you can. At present, I ask only to hear, once to hear your voice.'

Mr Tilney: ❤️❤️❤️ (I’m probably biased because there aren’t any actual words given but he’s such an eloquent speaker you know what he said was good)

They began their walk, and Mrs. Morland was not entirely mistaken in his object in wishing it. Some explanation on his father's account he had to give; but his first purpose was to explain himself, and before they reached Mr. Allen's grounds he had done it so well that Catherine did not think it could ever be repeated too often. She was assured of his affection; and that heart in return was solicited, which, perhaps, they pretty equally knew was already entirely his own; for, though Henry was now sincerely attached to her, though he felt and delighted in all the excellencies of her character and truly loved her society, I must confess that his affection originated in nothing better than gratitude, or, in other words, that a persuasion of her partiality for him had been the only cause of giving her a serious thought. It is a new circumstance in romance, I acknowledge, and dreadfully derogatory of an heroine's dignity; but if it be as new in common life, the credit of a wild imagination will at least be all my own."

"Henry, in having such things to relate of his father, was almost as pitiable as in their first avowal to himself. He blushed for the narrow-minded counsel which he was obliged to expose. The conversation between them at Northanger had been of the most unfriendly kind. Henry's indignation on hearing how Catherine had been treated, on comprehending his father's views, and being ordered to acquiesce in them, had been open and bold. The general, accustomed on every ordinary occasion to give the law in his family, prepared for no reluctance but of feeling, no opposing desire that should dare to clothe itself in words, could ill brook the opposition of his son, steady as the sanction of reason and the dictate of conscience could make it. But, in such a cause, his anger, though it must shock, could not intimidate Henry, who was sustained in his purpose by a conviction of its justice. He felt himself bound as much in honour as in affection to Miss Morland, and believing that heart to be his own which he had been directed to gain, no unworthy retraction of a tacit consent, no reversing decree of unjustifiable anger, could shake his fidelity, or influence the resolutions it prompted."

Colonel Brandon: ❤️❤️ (it’s not a declaration of love, but it’s such a good example of who he is as a friend and person)

It was no time for hesitation. Her fears and her difficulties were immediately before him. Her fears, he had, no courage, no confidence, to attempt the removal of: he listened to them in silent despondence; but her difficulties were instantly obviated; for, with a readiness that seemed to speak the occasion, and the service pre-arranged in his mind, he offered himself as the messenger who should fetch Mrs. Dashwood. Elinor made no resistance that was not easily overcome. She thanked him with brief, though fervent gratitude; and while he went to hurry off his servant with a message to [the apothecary], and an order for post-horses directly, she wrote a few lines to her mother.

The comfort of such a friend at that moment as Colonel Brandon,--or such a companion for her mother,--how gratefully was it felt! a companion whose judgment would guide, whose must relieve, and whose friendship might soothe her! As far as the shock of such a summons could be lessened to her, his presence, his manners, his assistance, would lessen it.

He, meanwhile, whatever he might feel, acted with all the firmness of a collected mind, made every necessary arrangement with the utmost despatch, and calculated with exactness the time in which she might look for his return. Not a moment was lost in delay of any kind. The horses arrived, even before they were expected; and Colonel Brandon only pressing her hand with a look of solemnity, and a few words spoken too low to reach her ear, hurried into the carriage.

Mr Ferrars: (❤️❤️ Edward is so changed and happy afterwards and so are the Dashwoods that I can’t be anything other than warm and fuzzy from what we can only imagine)

How soon he had walked himself into the proper resolution however, how soon an opportunity of exercising it occurred, in what manner he expressed himself, and how he was received, need not be particularly told. This only need be said: -- that when they all sat down to table at four o'clock, about three hours after his arrival, he had secured his lady, engaged her mothers consent, and was not only in the rapturous profession of the lover, but in the reality of reason and truth, one of the happiest of men.

Edmund Bertram: (❤️❤️ kind of a comeuppance almost in how he shifts his affections while also coming out of his blindness to how wonderful Fanny is, but again we get no quoted conversation).

Edmund had greatly the advantage of her in this respect. He had not to wait and wish with vacant affections for an object worthy to succeed her in them. Scarcely had he done regretting Mary Crawford, and observing to Fanny how impossible it was that he should ever meet with such another woman, before it began to strike him whether a very different kind of woman might not do just as well, or a great deal better: whether Fanny herself were not growing as dear, as important to him in all her smiles and all her ways, as Mary Crawford had ever been; and whether it might not be a possible, a hopeful undertaking to persuade her that her warm and sisterly regard for him would be foundation enough for wedded love.

I purposely abstain from dates on this occasion, that every one may be at liberty to fix their own, aware that the cure of unconquerable passions, and the transfer of unchanging attachments, must vary much as to time in different people. I only entreat everybody to believe that exactly at the time when it was quite natural that it should be so, and not a week earlier, Edmund did cease to care about Miss Crawford, and became as anxious to marry Fanny as Fanny herself could desire.

With such a regard for her, indeed, as his had long been, a regard founded on the most endearing claims of innocence and helplessness, and completed by every recommendation of growing worth, what could be more natural than the change? Loving, guiding, protecting her, as he had been doing ever since her being ten years old, her mind in so great a degree formed by his care, and her comfort depending on his kindness, an object to him of such close and peculiar interest, dearer by all his own importance with her than any one else at Mansfield, what was there now to add, but that he should learn to prefer soft light eyes to sparkling dark ones. And being always with her, and always talking confidentially, and his feelings exactly in that favourable state which a recent disappointment gives, those soft light eyes could not be very long in obtaining the pre-eminence.

Having once set out, and felt that he had done so on this road to happiness, there was nothing on the side of prudence to stop him or make his progress slow; no doubts of her deserving, no fears of opposition of taste, no need of drawing new hopes of happiness from dissimilarity of temper. Her mind, disposition, opinions, and habits wanted no half-concealment, no self-deception on the present, no reliance on future improvement. Even in the midst of his late infatuation, he had acknowledged Fanny’s mental superiority. What must be his sense of it now, therefore? She was of course only too good for him; but as nobody minds having what is too good for them, he was very steadily earnest in the pursuit of the blessing, and it was not possible that encouragement from her should be long wanting. Timid, anxious, doubting as she was, it was still impossible that such tenderness as hers should not, at times, hold out the strongest hope of success, though it remained for a later period to tell him the whole delightful and astonishing truth. His happiness in knowing himself to have been so long the beloved of such a heart, must have been great enough to warrant any strength of language in which he could clothe it to her or to himself; it must have been a delightful happiness. But there was happiness elsewhere which no description can reach. Let no one presume to give the feelings of a young woman on receiving the assurance of that affection of which she has scarcely allowed herself to entertain a hope.

❤️❤️❤️❤️My very favorite romantic encounter is Mr Tilney and Catherine’s first dance. It’s gets all the hearts.

“he suddenly addressed her with—“I have hitherto been very remiss, madam, in the proper attentions of a partner here; I have not yet asked you how long you have been in Bath; whether you were ever here before; whether you have been at the Upper Rooms, the theatre, and the concert; and how you like the place altogether. I have been very negligent—but are you now at leisure to satisfy me in these particulars? If you are I will begin directly.”

“You need not give yourself that trouble, sir.”

“No trouble, I assure you, madam.” Then forming his features into a set smile, and affectedly softening his voice, he added, with a simpering air, “Have you been long in Bath, madam?”

“About a week, sir,” replied Catherine, trying not to laugh.

“Really!” with affected astonishment.

“Why should you be surprised, sir?”

“Why, indeed!” said he, in his natural tone. “But some emotion must appear to be raised by your reply, and surprise is more easily assumed, and not less reasonable than any other. Now let us go on. Were you never here before, madam?”

“Never, sir.”

“Indeed! Have you yet honoured the Upper Rooms?”

“Yes, sir, I was there last Monday.”

“Have you been to the theatre?”

“Yes, sir, I was at the play on Tuesday.”

“To the concert?”

“Yes, sir, on Wednesday.”

“And are you altogether pleased with Bath?”

“Yes—I like it very well.”

“Now I must give one smirk, and then we may be rational again.” Catherine turned away her head, not knowing whether she might venture to laugh. “I see what you think of me,” said he gravely—“I shall make but a poor figure in your journal tomorrow.”

“My journal!”

“Yes, I know exactly what you will say: Friday, went to the Lower Rooms; wore my sprigged muslin robe with blue trimmings—plain black shoes—appeared to much advantage; but was strangely harassed by a queer, half-witted man, who would make me dance with him, and distressed me by his nonsense.”

“Indeed I shall say no such thing.”

“Shall I tell you what you ought to say?”

“If you please.”

“I danced with a very agreeable young man, introduced by Mr. King; had a great deal of conversation with him—seems a most extraordinary genius—hope I may know more of him. That, madam, is what I wish you to say.”

“But, perhaps, I keep no journal.”

“Perhaps you are not sitting in this room, and I am not sitting by you. These are points in which a doubt is equally possible. Not keep a journal!

…. What are you thinking of so earnestly?” said he, as they walked back to the ballroom; “not of your partner, I hope, for, by that shake of the head, your meditations are not satisfactory.”

Catherine coloured, and said, “I was not thinking of anything.”

“That is artful and deep, to be sure; but I had rather be told at once that you will not tell me.”

“Well then, I will not.”

“Thank you; for now we shall soon be acquainted, as I am authorized to tease you on this subject whenever we meet, and nothing in the world advances intimacy so much.”

#Jane Austen #passionate speeches are sometimes private in Austen #Austen men

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delehosies · 2 years ago

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i think we need to launch an investigation into slutty men and their slutty white shirts

#THEY CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS #like…#why does it make them 100x more attractive please answer me that #i know that i basically only like fictional men but Still #there’s just something about that shirt…#anthony bridgerton #king george #queen charlotte #pride and prejudice 2005 #pride and prejudice 1995 #mr darcy #benedict bridgerton #lost in austen #♡grace speaks!

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sparknoteslitmemes · 1 year ago

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#rohitakadambi #@rohitakadambi #spark notes twitter #spark notes #spark notes meme #spark notes killing the queue #literature meme #jane austen #jane austens leading men #pride and prejudice meme #pride and prejudice #emma #persuasion #sense and sensibility #mansfield park

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anghraine · 2 months ago

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It's always been intriguing to me that, even when Elizabeth hates Darcy and thinks he's genuinely a monstrous, predatory human being, she does not ever perceive him as sexually predatory. In fact, literally no one in the novel suggests or believes he is sexually dangerous at any point. There's not the slightest hint of that as a factor in the rumors surrounding him, even though eighteenth-century fiction writers very often linked masculine villainy to a possibility of sexual predation in the subtext or just text*. Austen herself does this over and over when it comes to the true villains of her novels.

Even as a supposed villain, though, Darcy is broadly understood to be predatory and callous towards men who are weaker than him in status, power, and personality—with no real hint of sexual threat about it at all (certainly none towards women). Darcy's "villainy" is overwhelmingly about abusing his socioeconomic power over other men, like Wickham and Bingley. This can have secondhand effects on women's lives, but as collateral damage. Nobody thinks he's targeting women.

In addition, Elizabeth's interpretations of Darcy in the first half of the book tend to involve associating him with relatively prestigious women by contrast to the men in his life (he's seen as extremely dissimilar from his male friends and, as a villain, from his father). So Elizabeth understands Darcy-as-villain not in terms of the popular, often very sexualized images of masculine villainy at the time, but in terms of rich women she personally despises like Caroline Bingley and Lady Catherine de Bourgh (and even Georgiana Darcy; Elizabeth assumes a lot about Georgiana in service of her hatred of Darcy before ever meeting her).

The only people in Elizabeth's own community who side with Darcy at this time are, interestingly, both women, and likely the highest-status unmarried women in her community: Charlotte Lucas and Jane Bennet. Both have some temperamental affinities with Darcy, and while it's not clear if he recognizes this, he quietly approves of them without even knowing they've been sticking up for him behind the scenes.

This concept of Darcy-as-villain is not just Elizabeth's, either. Darcy is never seen by anyone as a sexual threat no matter how "bad" he's supposed to be. No one is concerned about any danger he might pose to their daughters or sisters. Kitty is afraid of him, but because she's easily intimidated rather than any sense of actual peril. Even another man, Mr Bennet, seems genuinely surprised to discover late in the novel that Darcy experiences attraction to anything other than his own ego.

I was thinking about this because of how often the concept of Darcy as an anti-hero before Elizabeth "fixes him" seems caught up in a hypermasculine, sexually dangerous, bad boy image of him that even people who actively hate him in the novel never subscribe to or remotely imply. Wickham doesn't suggest anything of the kind, Elizabeth doesn't, the various gossips of Meryton don't, Mr Bennet and the Gardiners don't, nobody does. If anything, he's perceived as cold and sexless.

Wickham in particular defines Darcy's villainy in opposition to the patriarchal ideal his father represented. Wickham's version of their history works to link Darcy to Lady Anne, Lady Catherine (primarily), and Georgiana rather than any kind of masculine sexuality. This version of Darcy is a villain who colludes with unsympathetic high-status women to harm men of less power than themselves, but villain!Darcy poses no direct threat to women of any kind.

It's always seemed to me that there's a very strong tendency among fans and academics to frame Darcy as this ultra-gendered figure with some kind of sexual menace going on, textually or subtextually. He's so often understood entirely in terms of masculinity and sexual desire, with his flaws closely tied to both (whether those flaws are his real ones, exaggerated, or entirely manufactured). Yet that doesn't seem to be his vibe to other characters in the story. There's a level at which he does not register to other characters as highly masculine in his affiliations, highly sexual, or in general as at all unsafe** to be around, even when they think he's a monster. And I kind of feel like this makes the revelations of his actual decency all along and his full-on heroism later easier to accept in the end.

------------

*The incompetently awful villain(?) in Sanditon, for instance, imagines himself another Lovelace (a reference to the famous rapist-villain of Samuel Richardson's Clarissa). Evelina's sheltered education and lack of protectors makes her vulnerable to sexual exploitation in Frances Burney's Evelina, though she ultimately manages to avoid it. There's frequently an element of sexual predation in Gothic novels even of very different kinds (e.g. Ann Radcliffe's The Mysteries of Udolpho and Matthew Lewis's The Monk both lean into this, in their wildly dissimilar styles). William Godwin's novel Caleb Williams, a book mostly about the destructive evils of class hierarchies and landowning classes specifically, depicts the mutual obsession of the genteel villain Falkland and working class hero Caleb in notoriously homoerotic terms (Godwin himself added a preface in 1832 saying, "Falkland was my Bluebeard, who had perpetrated atrocious crimes ... Caleb Williams was the wife"). This list could go on for a very long time.

**Darcy is also not usually perceived by other characters as a particularly sexual, highly masculine person in a safe way, either, even once his true character is known. Elizabeth emphasizes the resilience of Darcy's love for her more than the passionate intensity they both evidently feel; in the later book, she does sometimes makes assumptions about his true feelings or intentions based on his gender, but these assumptions are pretty much invariably shown to be wrong. In general the cast is completely oblivious to the attraction he does feel; even Charlotte, who wonders about something in that quarter, ends up doubting her own suspicions and wonders if he's just very absent-minded.

The novel emphasizes that he is physically attractive, but it goes to pains to distinguish this from Wickham's sex appeal or the charisma of a Bingley or Fitzwilliam. Mr Bennet (as mentioned above) seems to have assumed Darcy is functionally asexual, insofar as he has a concept of that. Most of the fandom-beloved moments in which Darcy is framed as highly sexual, or where he himself is sexualized for the audience, are very significantly changed in adaptation or just invented altogether for the adaptations they appear in. Darcy watching Elizabeth after his bath in the 1995 is invented for that version, him snapping at Elizabeth in their debates out of UST is a persistent change from his smiling banter with her in the book, the fencing to purge his feelings is invented, the pond swim/wet shirt is invented. In the 2005 P&P, the instant reaction to Elizabeth is invented, the hand flex of repressed passion is invented, the Netherfield Ball dance as anything but an exercise in mutual frustration is invented, the near-kiss after the proposal in invented, etc. And in those as well, he's never presented as sexually predatory, not even as a "villain."

#self-indulgently long tangents even for me but i had Thoughts!#i almost appended a third footnote to the second footnote. rip #anghraine babbles #long post #fitzwilliam darcy #lady anne blogging #austen blogging #austen fanwank #ivory tower blogging #anghraine's meta #eighteenth century blogging #gender blogging #i do think it's interesting that associating his flaws with lady catherine's is honestly fair - she comes to wonder about this later #but lbr that is totally understandable! lady catherine is the awful parody version of him!#but the times when elizabeth's assumptions are highly inflected by Yes All Men Actually generalizations she's utterly wrong #it's not some horrible misdeed but it's not really fair #not because she's oppressing him (lmao) but because people don't work that way #not saying that p&p is some huge blow against gender essentialism but i do think it's FAR less friendly to it than its fans are

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