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padawanlost · 4 years ago

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Why is faking a surrender so terrible? Would it be better if Obi-wan just let the general execute him? To be honest if I don't commit genocide or do other atrocities like slavery(which I am not denying the republic but did) yet I still do small things like the fake surrender to win I don't see how I am some how a terrible person as long as I am saving lives and winning a war against terrible people I don't see what would be bad?

Continuation of the other anon. I am only ok with someone doing small things like that to win because why would it matter. I am sorry maybe I am too cold on this but if I am in a war against someone that is actually evil I don't see how doing the moral high ground all the time will benefit me besides potentially making me look better in my grave.

Dude, i’m not going to explain to you why a war crime is a *crime*. Just figure out what an war atrocity is and maybe you’ll understand why humanity collectively decided that shit is bad and it should be stopped and prevented from ever happening again.

Just to put things in perspective: What if Dooku had pretended to surrender, and we he was arrested blew himself up with half of the Jedi Temple (Obi-wan Kenobi included). Would that have been okay too? or it is only okay to hurt people we don’t like? Palpatine tricked the Jedi Order to get what he wanted. Is that okay too? Or is it wrong only because the audience knows he’s the bad guy? Better yet, Anakin walked into the Jedi Temple under false pretense and slaughtered everyone. At the time he believed he was doing the right thing and that he had no other choice. That he was acting for the greater good. Was that okay too? Because he was ‘good guy’ doings a ‘little’ wrong thing for the greater good.

It’s not about being cold. It’s not an emotional matter. it’s a moral one.

We don’t get to decide to deserves to die and who doesn’t. we don’t get to decide which crimes are okay for ONLY CERTAIN people to commit. That’s not how any society works. The idea that some beings are exempt from society rules is called corruption. If a certain action is a crime, those committing them are criminals regardless of how much you love them or what their original intent was. We may understand, we may sympathize, we may even agree but none of that erases the fact they committed a crime.

It’s not about looking good. We don’t say war atrocities are crimes because we want to look good. we say it because they are crimes committed against innocent people by people who thought were the good guys. That’s why the idea that the ‘good guys can do it’ is morally bankrupt because everyone think they are the good guys. The imperial officers thought they were saving the galaxy, same as the Jedi.

Of course, I’m not say they are same because they are not. But both sides made mistakes and recognizing these mistakes doesn’t mean they are both equality bad. Like I said, understanding the reasoning behind the actions helps understand the action itself and what drove someone to commit a crime. But it doesn’t mean a crime wasn’t committed.

As an Anakin fan, I absolutely love him, sympathize with him and understand why he acted in such way. At the same time, I also understand that killing and torturing people is wrong regardless of how much I love him and want him to be a great guy/character. it has nothing to do with how I feel about him.

#ask #anon #sw meta #gffa politics #jedi order #jedi politics #txt

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legacyofabsolutewalnuts · 4 years ago

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@swtorpadawan tagged me in this meme, and I am hella into it. This is my favourite musing bc swtor in the canon of star wars is fucking hilarious. On a side note, for anyone who does this and chose only one oc, but has thoughts about the others oh my god do and let me know. Im a snoopy bish give them all to me. In this case I’m going to try to keep it brief while covering my main four, Viticalia, Thomsyn, Belville and Montym. Partly bc I’ve been thinking about their dynamics for a joint Alliance Commander AU lately

This got really long, bc I couldn’t choose one, and Im a wordy bish, so I’ve put the actual answers under the cut, so as not to kill everyones dashes

What would your OC do if they were thrown through time and into Star Wars the Clone Wars:

1. Who would they fight for?

I think most of them would either end up going independent or siding with the Republic. Montym and Belville would actually be the most likely to commit to the Republic, they’re both two people who value loyalty and understand that sometimes things need to be changed from the inside out. Thomsyn I think would stay with the Republic, but may end up with the Grey Jedi. She isn’t inclined to this whole “just peacekeepers” deal and would want to take the fight to the Sith directly. Viticalia would be an independent, committing to neither except for who would pay her most, or just destroy the CIS and take her place at the top of it. She would not be willing to submit to being ordered around by Dooku, or lord forbid Grevious or Ventress, and she definitely wouldn’t appreciate Sidious being unwilling to step up on the frontline with his troops.

2. If not a force user, would they keep their job (Would a trooper still work for this new Republic and would an Agent be loyal to the Separatists?)?

Bel would probably make a play to join the SIS. And then immediately question how the SIS went from agents like Theron to seemingly having the capabilities of two people and paperclip. I’m just saying how did no one put any of the diddly dang dots together. He’d be the type to pull off an op and then basically drop it at the Jedi’s feet like “here, give me a job.” I’ll get into why he would go to the republic in a bit.

3. Who would they hate?

Vits would despise Dooku and Sidious. She would like Ventress but find her training considerably lacking. She understand some cunning, undercover work, and what it can do, that’s why she and Bel get along, but the lack of commitment to stand beside your men and fight with them is something she despises.

Thomsyn would have some problems with the way the Jedi, but she and Montym would both have a much bigger problem with Senate oversight. They’re both used to working with politicians, but the inability to work without that oversight would bother them. Neither of them think the Jedi are infallible, but they both have a big problem with the idea of needing politicians to greenlight things like humanitarian missions.

Bel would have a huge problem with the Jedi that he keeps under lock and key. Part of it would be due to Kothe. The other part is...well he’s seen what happens when Sith lead, he doesn’t really think the Jedi should be given military power for their ability with the Force either.

4. Who would they get along well with?

Bel would actually get along really well with GAR Specforces. I think he’d adjust pretty easily to them, and people like Skirata and Vau would be comfortingly familiar as Bel actually got along really well with Shae and Torian. And he would very much enjoy the troopers, he understands their mindset, and especially with the Commandos, they understand the importance of intel people like Bel are meant to provide. He’d also be all in to spar with the ARC’s, and hone his skills against theirs.

Montym would have had a romantic crush on Obi-Wan within five seconds of the man dramatically dropping his cape and that’s really all there is to it. He would also get along well with Senator Organa.

Like I said earlier, I think Vits would have liked Ventress, and probably tried to poach her as an apprentice in a damn second. Thomsyn I’m not really sure who she’d get along with best.

5. What would they think of the Jedi Order?

Viticalia has, and always will be fascinated by the Jedi in that sort of detached, research-esque way. Otherwise she doesn’t care about them much, although she does find it a bit amusing to watch some of them tout the ideals of the Republic as things go down hill. She at least never had any misconceptions about the Empire. Thomsyn and Montym sort of understand how the Jedi could have come under such heavy control of the Senate. They both would have hoped for better, but aren’t that surprised, not after Saresh.

Bel could not care less about the Jedi. Likes them well enough individually for the most part, but that’s his approach to any and all force users really.

6. What would they think of the “rule of 2” Sith?

Viticalia thinks its the stupidest thing ever. Probably starts taking on as many slightly sensitive people as she can and calls them her Apprentices just to piss off these new “Sith”. Really she’s just adopting herself a bunch of children, but it counts and that’s all she cares about.

7. What would they think of having a clone and droid army fighting instead of typical soldiers?

Bel understands what its like to be treated as less than a person. As an asset only. It’s still something he does to himself, thinking about himself as only an asset or a liability, which is a mindset Theron’s working on having him get rid of. So he would sympathize pretty heavily, which is part of why he’d go to the Republic. He’s turned the tide of a war and saved countless of his coworkers in the military before, he would try it again.

Viticalia and Thomsyn would have more practical issues with the idea a droid army. They aren’t creative, they can’t interpret, and they aren’t built for every situation. Thomsyn however would have a lot of problems on the legality of clones, whereas Vits is used to slavery and is prone to forgetting about how that works.

Montym thinks the whole idea on either side is terrible, for various reasons, but cannot stand that clones are not legal citizens but the Republic uses them anyhow.

8. If Republic - if they became a general in the army what would their relationship with their clones be like?

I think Montym would accept a position as a General, Thomsyn...maybe for a while. Montym is a little better with handling the cost of war, whereas Thomsyn counts on herself to keep everyone around her alive. I think they’d both be on good terms with their troopers, Montym would take a bit longer, he’s quiet and a bit...odd, but when he likes people he makes it clear. Thomsyn would get close to them quickly, and each death would hit her pretty hard.

9. If Imperial - what would they think of the complete lack of sith and excess of droids in the Separatist army?

Viticalia has soooo many problems about tradition with the way the Sith operate, but in particular thinks the CIS is...stupid. The idea of a civil war is fine, sure, but their execution is lacking. Bel thinks they’re stupid but also finds it very funny. Terrible tactics, questionable leadership, not a good spy in sight... but he also thinks the way the Republic has alienated so many of their own...well he’s seen it before with Imperial worlds, and after Saresh it isn’t surprising. He’s largely disillusioned and just wishes someone would learn from their mistakes already. Part of what would push him to join the Republic in this case would be that he values peoples lives a lot more than droids, and he hasn’t valued the Sith as leaders in a long time, so he has no reason to go to the CIS and as far as he’s concerned, Republics got the better chance.

10. Consider they were born in this era - where would they fit in Clone Wars canon?

This I’ve actually thought about this a bit. Thomsyn and Montym would be still pretty much the same, Jedi, although Thomsyn would not have joined the Grey Jedi in that AU as she would be more accustomed to what this Republic is like. Viticalia I would go with a Jedi who leaves the order eventually, simply because it would be really fun to explore a much more light-sided Vits. Bel’s a bit more difficult to place, in a society that doesn’t put as much importance on genetics and perfection, he would have the chance to do whatever he liked, which he didn’t in the Empire. In an au that follows his canon life a little better, he would probably join the SIS, but more likely as an anaylst or undercover agent, not as a sniper and agent.

Honestly time travel and born in that era, they’re def aus I’ve thought about writing

#tag meme #Viticalia Volcatius #Belville Abelard #Thomsyn #Montym #swtor #my ocs #swtor ocs #thank you for tagging me!#this was really fun #and I adore these au musings

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gch1995 · 2 years ago

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Yeah, their recruitment of Anakin doesn’t really involve properly informed consent either. Not to mention the fact that they’re already handing him a lightsaber to train him to commit murder a few months later at the tender age of ten with a bunch of other kids, which is just scary.

Qui Gonn takes a blood sample from Anakin to test for midichlorians under the guise that he’s trying to help him bandage a fresh injury. He gambles on the freedom of Anakin from Watto in a pod race that Anakin enters without telling either one of them, and he uses a mind trick on him to make sure that he will win Anakin in the bet after he wins.

After he “wins” Anakin in the bet, Anakin has been freed from Watto’s enslavement, but his mother has not. Qui-Gonn has paid Watto money in exchange for betting on Anakin’s freedom. It was said that Watto was a greedy slave master. Would he want to give Qui Gonn his money back in exchange to take Anakin back into slavery? Probably not. Not to mention the fact that Qui Gonn really pissed Watto off when he used that mind trick on him to get Anakin after winning the pod race bet.

Then, even if you believe that Anakin could have refused Qui Gonn and stayed with his mother under Watto, he’s still getting left in physically abusive slavery and poverty. What better option has he really been given to survive and thrive by Qui Gonn, aside from the Jedi Order? None.

He also only ever tells Anakin that being a Jedi is a “hard life” without going into detail about what that entails at all. Qui Gonn mentions that he could see his mother again someday, but never mentions that it’s highly unlikely either. This was more or a less an abduction of a child that a Jedi got away with. Not to mention the fact that Qui Gonn makes it sound even worse by saying “I didn’t come here to free slaves” because the Republic forbids them for getting involved, unless one is a powerful force sensitive kid they can use for their state-sanctioned military cult

Essentially, as an overall organization, most of the Jedi had become terrible people serving and running a powerful military cult that their Council got sanctioned by the corrupt state government in exchange for their protection. They didn’t deserve mass murder. They had pure intentions. You understand why they’re so fucked up. It’s easy to sympathize with them deeply when you see how many of them are just as much of perpetual victims trapped within these broken systems with limited options as much as they become horrifying perpetrators of them, just like Anakin. They certainly shouldn’t be getting viewed as role models, though. Just because they became victims of even worse bad guys and deserved better than what they got, it certainly doesn’t mean that most of them were blameless victims with no hand in their own downfall either. How many of them actually grew up to be good and functional members of society? Not many, and that’s not just including the ones who became Sith.

Obi-Wan Kenobi, Qui Gonn-Jinn, Yoda, Mace-Windu, Ki-Adi-Mundi, Luminara, and a number of other Jedi of the prequels display abusive, arrogant, cowardly, deceitful, hypocritical, exceedingly hostile, manipulative, merciless, oppressive, self-centered, and willfully in-denial traits, too. These aren’t just issues that Anakin and Dooku go on to develop. It’s a systematic issue of toxicity that many of the Jedi they trained under displayed and even encouraged for their own benefits at times.

Ahsoka, Luke, and Ezra ended up mostly normal (excluding the ooc bs) because they weren’t recruited as children and/or they got out of that systematically toxic environment before it was too late.

@praetor-canis

@an-angels-fury

regarding that abusive training post you reblogged, do you feel that the jedi's training methods were abusive? physically and/or mentally?

Wow, that is a tough question. I haven’t read any of the old Legends stuff about growing up Jedi, so I’m just going to comment on what we see in the films and Clone Wars cartoon.

It’s important to note that no one, with the possible exception of Anakin, actually consented to join the Jedi. They were all drafted as infants or toddlers. From a very young age they are groomed for combat. @howtofightwrite has some excellent posts about children raised for combat. The goal of the Jedi Order’s childrearing and training practices is to create effective fighters with an intense loyalty to the Order and the cause they serve. They accomplish this through isolation, indoctrination, and the rigorous suppression of dissent. Children are pushed to do and be their best, but I seriously doubt that the Order is going to do anything which endangers their health before the age of ten or so. They aren’t going to beat them. They aren’t going to train them to the point of injury. Force-sensitive kids are a rare and precious commodity and the Order isn’t going to risk losing them to injury or the Darth Side.

By the time the kids are ten or so, then they’re willing to endanger them. We see this during the Gathering arc. The kids are sent into a cave where they undergo a test of character involving hallucinations, extreme temperatures, and potentially life-threatening situations. Ezra and Luke undergo something similar during the course of their training. Everyone consents to participating, but none of the people involve fully understand what they’re about to endure. In the case of Ezra, we see real proof that people have died during the test. We don’t know if anyone has died during the Gathering, but it is presented to the children as a real possibility at the outset. Tests for children that conceivably involve dying if you fail is pretty fucked up.

Tests and object lessons remain a pretty consistent thing with the Jedi from this point on. Initiates have to pass the Padawan Trials. Padawans have to pass the Knight Trials. Knights are assigned padawans to test their ability to handle losing said padawan. Teenagers are repeatedly placed in deadly situations with minimal support to see if they survive. A group of children are kidnapped and left to fend for themselves as Council members declare they’ll be fine and find their own way back if they’re worthy students.

This is all deeply fucked up and symptomatic of the way the Order views it’s members. Jedi, regardless of age, are disposable resources meant to serve a greater purpose. This is fundamentally dehumanizing and results in the various emotionally stunted messes we see on screen.

@howtofightwrite writes in another post about abusive trainers that the key to understanding abusive training scenarios is all about control. Abusive trainers want their trainees to serve them, their needs, and their interests, regardless of what is good for the trainee. I’m just going to quote a few paragraphs from the original post rather than rephrase because it’s just too perfect:

A character with an abusive instructor may become a great fighter, but they will also be emotionally crippled. Like a bully, they will feel the need to exert control over their environment, create their own little kingdoms, and lash out at those who threaten their authority.

A character who cannot embrace their teacher’s outlook will be shattered, chased by self-doubt, and end up too mentally insecure to succeed at warfare. Their confidence is crushed, and whatever they learn from their teacher they don’t have the fortitude to use.

That’s the consequence of an abusive instructor.

You embrace them and become like them.

Or…

You reject them, and they break you.

This is not physical, they break their student emotionally through neglect, through failure, by critically hampering their ability to succeed, by undercutting them, or changing the goalposts on them.

This is literally what happens to Anakin. We see this happen to him over the course of the Clone Wars series and films. We also see them do this to Ahsoka, especially during her trials. We also see a bit of this with Caleb in the Kanan comics when he gets yelled at for asking questions.

And so, to sum up, yes, the Jedi Order was an abusive training environment. They didn’t beat the initiates, but they did recklessly endanger their lives and emotional wellbeing as part of various tests. Their end goal was not to create functional, successful adults, but rather soldiers blindly fighting for their cause and they psychologically broke anyone who didn’t immediately fall in line.

#Jedi order critical #tw abusive training #they didn’t deserve mass murder in retaliation but on the whole the Jedi had become a pretty awful group of people before their fall

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obaewankenope · 8 years ago

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The Gospel of the Anakin Apologist + The General Rudeness of Unrelated Comments on a Post

So @stonefreeak had an anon show up and whine about Padme. I and @sanerontheinside added our two cents in then *waves hands* SOME ASSHOLE shows up and wants to play ‘Anakin is a victim and Padme is a stupid ho and Obi-Wan is to blame for EVERYTHING EVER’ on the post even though, amusingly enough, it has no bearing on the discussion in the slightest.

Ergo I got vexed.

Actually all of us did bc wow stupid much.

The rest is under a read more because wow this got long and salty.

Also I’m tagging people so they can share the salt: @meabhair, @kyberpunk, @maawi, @markwatnae, @lilyrose225writes, @knight-kennedy, @punsbulletsandpointythings, @deadcatwithaflamethrower, @myurbandream, @jhaernyl :)

You see, we were discussing Padme as a female character and the double-standard around female characters being expected to be perfect and male characters essentially being able to do whatever the fuck they want so long as they’re pretty (pick a fandom, any fandom, you’re guaranteed to see the same dichotomy in treatment of male - female characters).

Apparently we can’t do that shit tho bc ‘oh no you’re blaming my bae!!!’ like wow, really fucking stupid much.

Anyway, to explain why I’m raging (why all of us are raging actually: it’s glorious to behold and I feel so blessed to experience the righteous fury of my spouses and friends) I personally feel like this particular person has literally pulled the embodiment of that “she doesn’t even go here” meme because whoa boy, their reblog does not belong here.

Now, in general I’m usually quite happy to let the morons roll on by like the sad little tumbleweeds of ignorance they are. But not when it’s on a post informing others of the behaviour and perception of gender/sex relations and treatment of characters in fandom. When you show up here and want to blame a single character who is flawed, especially just to venerate and excuse the behaviour of another flawed character... well, then I feel obligated to respond.

It’s not personal it is it’s just in my nature.

Okay so, first paragraph of their reblog (and subsequent stupid dialogue included) sums up the situation on Mustafar as ‘Padme should have been a good wife and sided with her genocidal husband who just helped wipe out thousands of lives (including children) bc she’s his wife’ and that ‘Obi-Wan is responsible bc he tried to do his duty as a Jedi’ and apparently that’s wrong as according to the Gospel of the Anakin Apologist.

Of course, they make a general, sweeping statement about Obi-Wan, describing him as a ‘fantastic space cop but an asshole friend and a person in general’ which, as I’m sure you’re all aware, shows a typical lack of understanding of what the Jedi are in universe, and also the background of Obi-Wan and Anakin’s interaction.

This isn’t unusual and I’m not gonna berate people for not knowing about the EU (Extended Universe) materials, or those damned benighted Junior Apprentice (JA) novels about Obi-Wan’s padawanship (and Anakin’s later on). The thing is though, there is plenty of information available about Obi-Wan, his background and so on on various websites -- Wookieepedia, to name but one -- so I don’t think it’s fair to be so quick to judge a character, any character, without understanding their background.

Even if this blogger is uninitiated into the ranks of SW lore and such, even if they only have the movies to go on, I still consider them to have a shockingly particular mindset and perspective of the relationship between the three protagonist characters.

So, here’s the thing, the below is a direct quote from their post. As you can see it’s... a particular perspective.

Padme should have sided with Anakin or Obi-Wan clearly when Anakin confronted her about Obi-Wan being on the ship, Obi-Wan killed Padme by appearing while they were talking, Padme might’ve been able to talk some sense into Anakin or join him, i guess Obi-Wan was afraid Padme would flip sides and decided to burst out with his “hello there” bullshit, if i was Padme i would have immediately said “that fucker snuck on my ship i had nothing to do with this, take care of him my love!” or “oh shit, well i didn’t plan this Obi-Wan tag in!” i know she was shocked and all that jazz but lady think on your feet, you went to meet your fugitive husband who just killed a academy full of space coplings on isolated planet and a space cop popped out of your trunk, use your words and use them quick! Anakin choking his wife in anger is understandable when you think of it from his perspective, “ok im on the hide from the law(Jedi), ill contact my wife and get her to safety” “hi love i came alone as you asked” “oh thank god for a moment i thought you might sympathize with the corrupt jedi” *Obi-Wan dumb ass pops out of the shadows* “hello there bitches!~~” “wtf Padme?! you brought a cop to our meet out?! you do know i am wanted dead right!? You little bitch! i did this all so i could keep you alive and this is how you repay me? i killed younglings to get this power Padme fucking younglings! you ungrateful little bitch ill kill you!” “hey bro let her go you said you wanted to save her right? kind of doing the opposite right now” “… god damn it i hate it when he is right, lets fight!”

First of all, they’re working on the assumption that Anakin was hiding from the Jedi. Second of all, that he was hiding from the Law(Jedi). Perhaps their memory has failed them, but I’ll provide a little breakdown of how the third movie actually went so they can understand that their initial narrative is... well, to put it plainly, ‘wrong and really wrong’.

1. Separatists vs Republic battle with Obi-Wan and Anakin going after Dooku. Dooku dies by Anakin’s hands after being disarmed (this is murder btw, rules of war mean that if your opponent loses or surrenders, then you don’t kill them -- this is generally considered a war crime).

2. Obi-Wan and Anakin talk about stuff and then Obi-Wan heads off to chase Grievous alone. This is after Anakin has been put on the Council by Palpatine even though he’s only been a Knight for a while. The Jedi do not approve, Obi-Wan is cautious and advises Anakin to be careful (Anakin ignores him by the way and continues to be friendly with Palpatine).

4. While Obi-Wan is off after Grievous, Anakin has Palpatine’s identity revealed to him. Gets played into saving him from Mace and co in order to keep Padme alive (even though she isn’t dead by the way). Anakin then goes to the Temple with a collection of Clones and helps murder every Jedi there. He purposefully murders the children in the Council chambers.

5. Obi-Wan is nearly killed after defeating Grievous because of Order 66. He escapes and hides. Meets up with Yoda and Bail. Goes to the Temple. Finds out that Anakin killed Jedi and is heartbroken by this fact. Then he goes to Padme after being tasked by his superior to go and defeat Anakin. He tells her the truth and she refuses to believe him.

6. Padme goes to meet with Anakin who is on Mustafar, drowning in his angst-ridden guilt of now having become an accomplice to genocide. Obi-Wan tags along, knowing that Anakin and Padme love each other so much that both would forsake their duties. He hides and Padme doesn’t know. Anakin doesn’t notice.

7. Padme rejects Anakin BEFORE Obi-Wan shows himself, because she realises he’s literally gone crazy. Then Anakin turns on Padme and chokes her into unconsciousness, even though she’s heavily pregnant and he ‘loves’ her. Obi-Wan gets Anakin to focus on him and they fight.

8. They fight to the point where Obi-Wan has the high-ground and Anakin does a stupid and gets his limbs cut off. Obi-Wan leaves him to burn to death (brutal) and goes to Padme. He takes her for treatment and instead watches one of his oldest friends die while her children are made into orphans.

9. Movie ends with Anakin becoming the giant suit version of Vader and Obi-Wan on Tattooine delivering Luke to his aunt and uncle.

Anakin isn’t evading the law, aka the Jedi, he’s killed them. Obi-Wan is the one evading the law because it wants him dead. Anakin is on Mustafar because Sidious told him to take out the Sep leadership. Padme meets him there after hearing the truth from Obi-Wan and only believes it when Anakin admits it himself. Then she rejects him. Obi-Wan does his duty as a Jedi -- sworn to destroy the Sith -- and the end is that Padme dies because Anakin loses his temper and lashes out at her.

I may be Anakin apologist but considering his situation he didn’t act out of character, id be pissed off too if i contacted my wife when i am in hiding and she brings a cop there (it seemed like that to Anakin since he didn’t know Obi-wan snuck on board) before i can explain myself to my wife

Firstly, you are an Anakin apologist and he did act out of character. His behaviour after discovering Sidious’ identity and stopping Mace from killing a Sith Lord is out of character. Anakin is a bright, kind and friendly child with a temper issue. Anakin is someone who hates injustice and despises the way some people are treated by others for no other reason than because of where they were born or who they were born to. He was a slave and then he became a Jedi; he went from victim to protector. His final character jump sent him from protector to oppressor. That’s not in character, that’s specifically cultivated and justified behaviour because he puts his own needs above absolutely everything else.

He also had the chance to explain to Padme. He didn’t deny what he did and Padme actively rejected him when she realised he wasn’t sorry for what he’d done ‘in the name of love’. You’re justifying abuse and don’t even realise it.

Think of it like this, in a galaxy where there are force powers etc shit you keep seeing horrible nightmares of your wife dying, your mother gets kidnapped by space isis and killed, you butcher the village in retaliation and tell your wife about it, after which the greatest political figure of your “country” tells you that there is a way to save your wifes life from the faith that seems foretold (like someone offering you a cure for cancer when you think your wife has cancer), the old dude tells you you have to do something to get the cure (equivalent would probably be extracting stem cells from kids spines or something lethal), well you love your wife and can’t let her die because love, well you go and do the dirty deed like a loving husband would can’t let your honey bun die, now you’re kind of in hiding waiting for your old dude friend to wipe out the cops (rought shit but it will all be worth it when i save my wife from certain death), you contact your wife and tell her to meet you in some backwater planet where you two can talk it out, you can tell her why you did it and you can finally save her from her faith, your wife finally arrives the joy we are finally together, listen wife the reason i killed the younglings is “Everybody down on the ground, the Jedi man has arrived!”, all your efforts to get the cure, all you did in the name of saving your wife and she brings a cop to execute you (that’s what he thought and can’t blame him, how the fuck did she not know Obi-Wan snuck on board?)

Firstly, Shmi Skywalker was kidnapped and tortured by Tusken Raiders on Tattooine, not ‘Space ISIS’. The settlers on Tattooine are the proverbial invaders of a planet where the Tuskens are the natural species. So your metaphor is inaccurate and shows but a lack of understanding and also a clear desire to produce extreme sympathy for Anakin. We don’t know why the Tusken’s took Shmi but it’s generally considered unusual behaviour. We do know that they have attacked farms on Tattooine before and that they have been united by an ex-Jedi at one point when Obi-Wan was in exile. This is all we know. So you’re making an assumption that they’re evil terrorists when you don’t even have the material to back you up.

Anakin killed an entire village of Tuskens, including women and children. There is no excuse for that. Unless you think it would be acceptable for a US soldier to execute the children in an Iraqi village because some of the inhabitants were part of Al Queda?

Obi-Wan had already informed Anakin in Attack of the Clones that ‘dreams pass in time’ referring to Anakin’s recurring problems with his dreams about his mother. Anakin didn’t inform Obi-Wan of anything after that and so Obi-Wan has no knowledge. He tried to help, in his own way. Anakin’s behaviour and fear of what he dreamt about Padme drove him to extremes of behaviour -- the love he held for her is what destroyed him because he was so selfish as to refuse to let her go.

The dangers of attachment isn’t of falling in love, it’s in that love turning into obsession which is what happened with Anakin. Palpatine used Anakin’s fears of losing Padme to sway him into his service and with Mace’s death, sealed his fate and that of Padme.

Do you honestly think Padme would have died had she not been choked into unconsciousness by her ‘loving’ husband on a boiling planet of death, after the revelation that her husband had willingly committed genocide because of his love for her?

If you do then there’s no hope for you.

The dialogue of the Mustafar scene is below, read it and perhaps recognise that Anakin admits to having become obsessed with power and paranoid. Perhaps also recognise how Padme only rejects him after he says he’s going to overthrow the Chancellor and together they can rule the galaxy.

Padme: Obi-Wan told me terrible things Anakin: What things? Padme: He said, you’d turned to the Dark Side. That you... killed younglings? Anakin: Obi-Wan is trying to turn you against me Padme: He cares about us Anakin: Us? Padme: He knows. He wants to help you... Anakin, all I want is your love Anakin: Love won’t save you Padme, only my new powers can do that Padme: At what cost? You’re a good person, don’t do this! Anakin: I won’t lose you the way I lost my mother. I am becoming more powerful than any Jedi has ever dreamed of. And I’m doing it for you. To protect you Padme: Come away with me. Help me raise our child. Leave everything else behind while we still can! Anakin: Don’t you see? We don’t have to run away anymore. I have brought peace to the Republic. I am more powerful than the Chancellor. I- I can overthrow him. And together you and I can rule the galaxy. Make things the way we want them to be Padme: [backs away, shaking head] I don’t believe what I’m hearing. Obi-Wan was right, you’ve changed Anakin: I don’t want to hear any more about Obi-Wan. The Jedi turned against me, don’t you turn against me Padme: I don’t know you any more. Anakin... you’re breaking my heart. You’re going down a path I can’t follow Anakin: Because of Obi-Wan? Padme: Because of what you’ve done! What you plan to do! Stop! Stop now! Come back! I love you! Anakin: LIAR! Padme: No! Anakin: You’re with him! You brought him here to kill me! [Starts choking HIS WIFE] Obi-Wan: Let her go Anakin!

The end of this interaction is that Padme rejects Anakin for going power-mad, Anakin admits he’s become a stranger to her and then attacks her over a perceived betrayal -- out of character for someone who at the beginning of the movie thought Padme might have been cheating on him and then APOLOGISED for thinking such things in the first place.

In conclusion to your post that I’m not going to ever reblog, but will link here so others can read it in full, I have to say that your ending paragraph is... well, a fantastic example of selective thinking and something I daresay several of my friends from my psych classes would have had a field day with the dispositional and situational bias you exhibit.

who nearly killed Anakin and Padme? Obi-wan freaking Kenobi, well done douchebag, be sure to lie to his son that Vader killed Anakin to pit a son against his own father, Obi-wan was a fantastic space cop but an asshole friend and a person in general, dude is the reason Luke’s father is a space cyborg and Padme is a corpse, but that’s not all let’s turn their son into a space cop and tell him to kill daddy cyborg, he’ll never know it was his father, if he did this could really backfire but who gives a shit ill probs be dead by then

#Star Wars #Meta #Meta Mic Drop #Anakin Skywalker #Obi-Wan Kenobi #Padme Amidala #MAKE WAY APOLOGISTS I AM SALTING AND BURNING MY WAY THROUGH YALL

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