#about him would be this negative. But what we see through the story absolutely contradict Nanami's words in that airport | Explore Tumblr posts and blogs

sokkastyles · 1 year ago

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First of all, I responded to what themattress said already and when I told them I wasn't going to entertain their gross arguments further, not only did they continue to try and argue with me through other people's reblogs after I blocked them, but now they're sending other people to argue with me. Unbelievable.

What is it that you hope to accomplish here? Because you are utterly failing to convince me that you aren't an abuse apologist, since you continue to use abuse apologist arguments. And now you come here to harass me and others, a real person, long after the original person I was speaking to was blocked and reported, to...what? Defend a fictional character? Can you see how this does not help convince me that you understand or have empathy for real people, let alone abused kids. Unless of course they're your pet fictional blorbo who you can idealize..

Also, it's hilarious that you would talk about ad hominim attacks and strawman, since that seems to be all your friend is capable of. I reacted to what they said, and what they said was blatant abuse apologism. I don't care what you think about my "case" because I am not on trial and you are not my judge. I disengaged from this argument and you and your friend are trying to continue it. I suggest you go home and shut up and stop harassing people over fictional characters.

The problem with your arguments here is that you are trying to argue that something that didn't happen or wasn't shown to happen is evidence of a negative relationship between the characters. Since Iroh and Azula are fictional characters, you cannot make the argument that Iroh didn't care about Azula just because we aren't told a lot about their relationship. And the few things we do have about how Iroh felt about Azula before she tried to kill him are actually positive, like the fact that he got her a doll. You can't just dismiss what we are shown and then claim that something we aren't shown is evidence of something else. That's not how stories work. And yes, because it is a story, it also means that what we aren't shown can be assumed to be consistent with the established characterization. Characters do not do anything offscreen that contradicts their established characterization, because fictional characters only do what they are written to do. So yeah, how Iroh and Azula act around other people are absolutely indicators of how they would treat each other, given the evidence we do have. And even after Azula repeatedly tried to kill Iroh and Zuko, we actually do have evidence that he cared about her from other source materials, like when he says in "The Search" that she thinks Azula going with Zuko to find their mother might be good for her. That shows he does care about her. There is nothing in post canon materials to prove a lack of caring, since we hardly get anything at all. And again, fictional characters do not do anything they are not written to do, especially if it contradicts their established characterization. If a writer wanted to show that a character who is established to be kind or virtuous had some blind spots, it would have to be established in some way.

It is not shown or established that Iroh thinks of Azula as mini Ozai. Where does this happen? I need quotes or transcripts or specific actions, because it didn't happen. I also need textual evidence that his gift was "tone-deaf." Deaf to what, that Azula was a cruel child who was mimicking her abuser and loved to burn things, and also hated Iroh for being "kooky"? Because that is what the point of that scene is and why it is there in the narrative, not to show that Iroh does not understand Azula.

We know that Azula abused Zuko even though a lot of it is subtle because of the pattern of her behavior towards him, the way he reacts, the general pattern of Azula's behavior, the fact that we know her abuser groomed her to participate in Zuko's abuse, and the fact that Azula treats others in similar ways and generally considers herself superior to others and is cruel towards those she considers inferior. These are all things we are shown in the text that elevate her behavior towards him from just dysfunctional sibling banter to abuse. Context is important here just as it is when assessing Iroh's character and his relationship to Azula.

Context is important, and you cannot "acknowledge" anything that didn't actually happen, and neither does the rest of the fandom, since most of us interpret things based on what is actually presented in the story, not bizarre headcanons from people who insist on harassing others and don't know when they aren't wanted.

Also, on power dynamics, the problem with using Azula's age as a reason why other people have to be responsible for her is that in-story, Azula actually has a lot more power than Iroh, and a willingness to use that power to hurt others, whereas Iroh obviously does not want to hurt Azula. But he's frequently put into a position where he has to protect Zuko from her, and so was Ursa. In that context, it is not just about Azula, it is about the other child Azula is putting in danger, and everyone else she's putting in danger. Normal adults do not enable children to hurt other children. And Azula even as a young child shows a desire to hurt others, is a powerful firebender, and is encouraged and enabled to hurt others by her powerful father.

Also? Abuse often happens even in the midst of the best well-meaning adults, and it's shitty to assume that the reason it happened is because the adults didn't care enough. Sometimes that is the case, but it just isn't here, and you do not have a right to insist on this as a universal truth, and doing so actually does a lot more harm than good in recognizing how to prevent abuse in the real world, and mostly just enables shifting blame away from the actual abusers and onto victims. And yes, often when abuse is happening in a household, other well-meaning adults are also victims, also being groomed and manipulated (Ursa is a good example of this) or have smear campaigns done against them to isolate them from the victim or render them powerless to stop it (Iroh is a good example of this, his entire narrative is built around survivor's guilt). This is something you need to understand if you want to talk about abuse. If you don't, but you are only interested in continuing a conversation long expired for the purpose of harassing real people, then we know just how much you really care about preventing abuse, then, don't we?

Once again, go home. You and your friend are not wanted here. Donate to a shelter, do some research. Harassing people online and spreading misinformation ain't it.

Edit: I forgot to mention this because there is just so much awful in this response to my post, but the use of the claim that Iroh showed favoritism to Zuko (a claim also lobbed at Ursa) is the dead give away that this is less about protecting victims and really about protecting abusers. Iroh and Ursa both tried to prevent Azula from abusing Zuko and that is an unforgivable sin in the world of an abuser. Get out of here with that shit.

So about that post we're both included in...the good thing about being at work when I saw that come through was that I wasn't able to respond. lol

I've decided not to respond but something they said that really irked me and wanted to get your thoughts on was this: In all that time between his return and Zuko's exile, there's no evidence that he (Iroh) ever tried to reach out to Azula

This comment and other's like it always irritate me because they always seem to leave out the idea that Azula has to be receptive to Iroh's help. They act like that all Iroh had to do was extend a hand to Azula and she wouldn't turned out the way she did. As if we haven't been shown that Azula has been dismissive of Iroh from a very young age. The idea that Iroh was ignoring her that whole time between when he moved back into the palace and leaving with Zuko, is just another way of blaming Iroh for not loving her enough. I highly doubt Azula was eager to spend time with Iroh around then and tried to avoid it as much as possible. Zuko was trapped on a boat. 😆 You cannot tell me that whatever short time they had together, that Iroh never left the door open for her. At some point, doesn't Azula need to reach out as well?

I'm not sure what I'm asking, I think I just wanted to vent instead of responding to that person. But if you have any thoughts on this, I would love to hear them.

P.S. Sorry for spamming your inbox while going through your old posts. 😁

No problem! Sorry that person reblogged your post to try and continue the argument with me.

You are right that Azula has to be receptive to any attempts Iroh would make to try and reach her, and what we know from canon is that she wasn't. That's why these people always say the doll doesn't matter, because it's evidence of Iroh doing something kind for his niece and her violently rejecting it because she thinks her uncle is a weak fool and her father taught her that people like that deserve to be treated cruelly.

But secondly, lack of being shown him reaching out to her doesn't mean that it never happened. Especially considering Iroh's character and the way he is consistently portrayed, it would be bizarre to interpret him as uncaring towards his niece just because we are not shown it onscreen. The writers expect you to fill in the gaps based on what we are shown onscreen, and what we are shown onscreen is that Iroh, even before his redemption, cares about his family and gets his niece and nephew a gift. We are also shown onscreen that Azula, even as a young child, is cruel towards everyone who is not Ozai, including Iroh, and burns the gift he gives her. Since these characterizations are consistent - Iroh being kind to others, Azula being cruel to others - we can interpret that the reason Iroh and Azula do not have a good relationship is because of what we already know, and that Azula is the reason they do not have a good relationship, and that she would reject whatever attempts Iroh might make to reach out. If the writers wanted to establish that Iroh was uncaring to Azula, it would need to be shown onscreen, since it contradicts everything else we know about his character, and everything we know about Azula and Azula's relationship with Iroh.

It'd be like me trying to argue that Ursa hated Lu Ten, since we never see them interact or get an indication that Ursa feels anything about him one way or the other, except for seeming sad about his death. But that's enough, because we know through everything else we know about Ursa that she is a kind person who cares about her family. Just because we don't see Ursa talking about or interacting with Lu Ten is not evidence of a negative relationship.

I agree that from what we know of Azula as a child, she did not want to spend time with Iroh and probably avoided it. Given how she talks about his reaction to Lu Ten's death, I also think even if Iroh did reach out, he would find it both difficult and extremely painful to be around someone who gleefully made fun of his trauma over his son's death.

Not only does Azula have to be receptive of Iroh, but there is a certain point where Iroh does not need to submit himself to cruelty just because Azula is a child. Azula is also a child with fire powers who is the princess of her nation, and her cruelty towards Iroh is approved by Ozai, who is now the firelord. Can you imagine what it was like for Iroh coming back to that after his son's death, in a world where he was widely seen as a disgrace? How much power does he really have in that situation?

Also imagine that Iroh also has to protect Zuko, who has newly lost his mother, from both his father and his sister.

Imagine, if you will, him inviting both of the children to play pai sho with him one day shortly after his arrival home, aware that he needs to get his niece and nephew away from their father, who now is their only sole parental figure, but also the most powerful man in the country, while he, Iroh, has been reduced overnight to the kooky, disgraced uncle. Even if Azula had accepted that invitation, I imagine that she does not respond well if she were to lose a game to the uncle she thinks is not a real general or the brother she thinks is weak and deserves to be abused. Imagine Iroh trying to problem solve between Zuko and Azula while Azula is shouting at him that he's just a loser who cries all the time because his son died. Meanwhile, Azula is also trying to burn Zuko for taking her piece in the game, and eventually Iroh just has to seperate them both.

And that's sad. It's so sad. I imagine it breaks Iroh's heart to see what is happening to his niece, what his brother is turning her into, just as every cruel jab she aims at him tears open his wounds over the loss of his son, his regret that he might have done something to help her, just as he might have done something to help his brother as he saw Ozai grow into the kind of person he became. We know these are things that are built into Iroh's character, but we also know that he's also not going to allow an abusive person to continue to be enabled, and there's a certain point where what Azula stans seem to want from Iroh is exactly that. They hate him because Azula hates him, and need an excuse for it other than the truth, that Azula was learning to be hateful from her father. They also hate him because he committed the sin of trying to protect Zuko from her and not allowing her to continue the behavior Ozai enabled.

We're also shown this dynamic between Iroh and Azula in the show, from the moment Azula shows up to try and trap Zuko and Iroh immediately susses out her intent and she resents him for it, tries to prevent him from helping Zuko think about what she is saying, and identifies that she needs to seperare Iroh from Zuko. Abusive people are really good at picking out vulnerable people, and also are good at recognizing the people who are less vulnerable and alienating their chosen victims from anyone who is going to be an obstacle, like a protector or guardian. That also increases her hatred of Iroh, that he sees right through her and knows what she's trying to do, and won't allow it. She's not going to respond to an attempt from him to help her because she wouldn't see any benefit to it, because he isn't someone she can manipulate or exploit like Zuko. And she hates that. She hates that she can't control Iroh the way she is used to controlling people, the way she thought she had even her mother under control. Until she learns to let go of that need to control, she is not going to respond to Iroh. Further, he is an obstacle in her continuing to have access to and control Zuko, which increases her hatred of him.

#abuse cw #abuse apologism #azula #ozai #iroh #the discourse

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your-brilliant-lady-m · 3 years ago

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Part 2 - Basic Concepts of Miraculous Ladybug: Kwami

Kwamis are a fun concept and one of the main draws of the series. They make sense story-wise because, firstly, our characters need some support system. And since a lot of conflicts are centred around secret identities, characters should be able to discuss their double life with someone. As magical beings they could also be used to expand the lore, introduce new concepts and drive forward both the plot and character development. It doesn't always happen but Kwamis are a good idea. Some people who write AU's think that Kwamis are redundant, but I have to disagree.

Origins and nature

Where do Kwamis come from? What are they? It's never explained. Oh wait, it was explained in a comic people can accidentally find. You decide to explain the origins and nature of magical beings who are one of the key elements in your magic system and worldbuilding IN A SIDE COMIC, which has zero effect on your main story. Sounds legit.

Here it is.

So, Kwamis are abstract creatures. They can become tangible and interact with the world because of the miraculous jewels. Essentially, each Miraculous acts as an anchor to the material world for Kwami. They existed since the beginning of time and were invisible observers of the universe. Until they settled on Earth and observed how humanity came to be. This is where things get interesting.

Kwamis are the embodiment of abstract concepts. But, some abstract concepts were created by people (like everything mentioned in the comic: beauty, math, love, etc).

Kwamis wanted to help humans. And then, a human, who couldn't see, hear or touch a Kwami creates miraculous jewels. And now these beings can interact with the world, use their powers and grant them to humans. Yet, they are completely under control of their holder. I'll discuss it later, but why did Kwamis accept this deal? They are practically enslaved. At the same time they care about people and generally love humanity.

According to the wiki Kwamis grant powers because of "the privilege of having the ability to be perceived by mortals". What? Did I read that right? Kwamis agreed to be enslaved and used as a power source, because they wanted to interact with material world. That's it, guys, end of the story.

We also know these things about nature and abilities of Kwamis from the show:

1) need food, but only to provide the power for the holder;

2) can't phase through precious metals (Chloe's bracelet in "Rogercop"), their own miraculous and humans;

3) they can control if they phase through things or not – meaning that if they want to, they can (this way Tikki can stay in Marinette’s purse without much trouble and Plagg sleeps on Adrien’s pillow);

4) they can perform magic without a holder but they don’t control it very well, there are certain types of things that they can’t do without a holder;

5) they are immortal but can get sick for some reason, a non-magical reason mind you;

6) technology can't detect them in any way, you can't film, photograph or record their voices (writers establish this many times, but promptly forget all about their own rules in "Optigami", where Marinette talks with Kwamis over the phone without any problems).

If I missed something important, then let me know.

Look, the questions related to origins and motivations of Kwamis might not be very prominent in your story right now, but you must answer them in case you might need to involve these facts in the plot down the line. It's important to avoid contradictions in the serialised story with liquid plot, that can't be set in stone. It's a made up world for the sake of everything sacred! You can make up explanations and rules, of course as long as they don't contradict common sense.

Plausible ideas for origins and nature of Kwamis:

1) Kwamis are immortal spirits, whom humans accidentally summoned and bound with spells to Miraculous stones. They remember their existence before this. This version doesn't really explain their desire to serve people and love for humanity, however. It would be more logical for Kwamis to resent people for enslaving them. It doesn't explain how humans could create those spells and Miraculous stones either.

2) Kwamis are physical manifestations of abstract concepts who existed simply as fragments of matter for a very long time without sentience, until they were accidentally summoned through the Miraculous stones and bound by humans to serve them. Kwamis do not remember their existence before Miraculous. In this version Kwamis serve humans and love them because they have never known a different kind of existence. Unfortunately, it doesn't provide any explanation on the creation of Miraculous and spells.

3) Kwamis are gods, who created the universe with all its elements and concepts including humanity (similar to Valar and Maiar in Tolkien's Legendarium). They wanted to help their creations but discovered that their power was too wild and unpredictable for that. So, Kwamis decided to give up their free will and magical independence to help humanity. Together they created Miraculous stones for humans to use and sealed themselves inside. Kwamis as gods were abstract concepts, who didn't have a body. The act of sealing their power in the Miraculous gave them an opportunity to interact with outside world (an anchor) and each Kwami chose an small animal form (because humans easily formed bonds with animals, had animal companions (pets), small animals look non-threatening and familiar). Kwamis intentionally choose certain animal forms to suit the human symbolism. Humans later used magic that Kwamis discovered for them to place spells upon small gods (spells related to identity protection and so on). This version answers most questions, but if Kwamis are gods then powers they grant to people seem to be rather small.

Feel free to add more. I would be interested to hear your ideas.

Identity Protection

In "Origins" we learn that Wayzz can sense the aura of Butterfly Miraculous, a negative aura of activated Butterfly Miraculous, to be more precise. And yet, Tikki and Plagg are genuinely surprised to discover the identities of their holders in "Dark Owl". There are several things wrong with that.

Can Kwamis sense each other's presence? They shouldn't be able to do this to protect the identities of their holders. On the other hand, they are ancient spirits. So, their inability to sense each other seems weird. Unless it's the same situation as with the spell that does not allow them to speak the name of their holder aloud.

But if they can sense each other like Wayzz did, then it means that Plagg and Nooroo were living in the same house for over a year and nothing happened. I mean, Plagg could have just come upstairs, take off the brooch from Gabriel, while he is asleep and return it back to Fu.

This question lies right here, on the surface. And that's only one massive and very obvious plothole. How to fix it? Establish that Kwami can't sense each other for identity protection. In "Origins" Fu meditates on his balcony and Wayzz sees a charged Akuma flying by. That's how they discover that Butterfly is in Paris and the Miraculous is in the wrong hands. Perhaps, Gabriel akumatizes someone for the first time to survey the surroundings and general public is not aware of this. This works better in the narrative, giving Fu time to select holders for Ladybug and Black Cat. It also establishes whether Hawkmoth can remove the Akuma from someone without Ladybug and discharge it. Maybe it depends on the circumstances (sometimes he can, but if this person was akumatized many times or their emotions are too strong and their mind doesn't want to let Akuma go then Hawkmoth can't pull the butterfly out with his magic). This scenario allows for Volpina to happen on "Heroes' Day". Silly recurring Akumas like Gigantitan and Mr. Pigeon could still happen. In this case Gabriel didn't want to akumatize the guy more than 70 times on purpose. It just keeps happening against his better judgement because evil butterflies are automatically attracted to Mr. Ramier. This way repeated attacks of Mr. Pigeon annoy Hawkmoth just as much as they do the heroic duo of Paris (I did not sign up for this Nathalie!).

Let's come back to the spell mentioned earlier for a moment. Kwamis can't say the name of their current holder out loud, but apparently, they can exploit a loophole in the spell by confirming the identity of their holder in another way. The spell doesn't work with other holders. Kwami can say the names of other holders if they know their identity. That being said, can the holder order the Kwami to tell them the identities of other heroes if they know them?

Kwamis know how each Miraculous looks with or without camouflage. Can the holder order the Kwami to tell them how each Miraculous looks in disguise (I liked that Grimoire doesn't have pictures of camouflage for identity protection)? Guardians can recognise Miraculous in any mode (Su Han). Did Fu teach Marinette this? Does she know how each Miraculous looks like unactivated?

Oh! Since we are discussing camouflage, let's take a moment to appreciate the Mother Of All Plotholes. Plagg didn't recognise Peacock because of the plot.

Relationship with Holder

I absolutely loved the idea that Kwamis must obey their holder introduced in "Sandboy". This concept opens tons of plot opportunities. It's such a great idea that makes sense, has potential, can create conflict. Why, oh, why didn't writers develop it more?

Like, it was so good. It can be a great push for character development. This concept resolves so many existing inconsistencies within the plot. It's mind-blowing.

Why can't Nooroo simply leave Gabriel, so that he wouldn't be able to transform? Because Gabriel bound him with Miraculous to always stay near.

In "Sandboy" Tikki asks Marinette's permission before going to the meeting. Plagg lies to Adrien instead. This implies that usually Plagg's holders weren't kind to him or feared his power (Su Han's remark in "Furious Fu"). Perhaps, his holders were taught to keep the Kwami of destruction under constant control. So, Plagg in turn has learned not to ask, because if he doesn't ask permission then his holder can't deny him freedom with magic.

Can Kwami lie to their holder? Maybe they can't lie to their holder about their nature, origins and powers and other Miraculous (but Kwamis can't reveal the location of Miracle Box, Guardian's identity and can't confirm identities of other holders known to them in any way). Kwami would be forced to speak even if they don't want to. That's why Nooroo told Gabriel everything about the abilities of the Butterfly Miraculous and the wish secret of Ladybug and Black Cat.

But Kwamis can lie to their holder according to Plagg in "Sandboy". If Kwamis can lie about everything (including powers) then Nooroo didn't have any reason to be honest with Gabriel way back in "Origins".

Speaking of Gabriel and Nooroo. Can Kwamis harm their holder? Maybe doing so would harm the Kwami as well. Can they do it only when the holder is not wearing the Miraculous? Can Kwami take their Miraculous from their holder? Will they disappear if they try to do so? It seems like Kwami disappears only when the holder takes off the Miraculous with the intention of renouncing power, the words "I renounce you" are not necessary.

Other Kwamis can take the Miraculous from people if it's not their own (Wayzz in "Feast"). But what if it wasn't possible. Imagine what could happen if it's not possible to take the Miraculous by force from the transformed or untransformed hero. Just like Lady WiFi couldn't remove Ladybug's mask. A person has to willingly give up the Miraculous. Only in this case, it's possible to take it. For example, somewhere around the middle of season 3 Hawkmoth could have trapped Ladybug and Chat Noir and cut off any escape routes. His Akuma tries to take both Miraculous, but they don't budge. Then afterwards, every Akuma tries to manipulate the heroes using hostages, illusions or mind control. It's hard to say whether this version will be better than canon, but it's a fascinating theory.

You can use the idea of obedience to create more situations contrasting the relationship of Plagg and Adrien, Gabriel and Nooroo. I liked how canon created a storyline about Plagg learning to control his powers without a holder and Adrien helping him. However, why would you stop here? Give us some flashbacks about Plagg's previous holders, tell us what kind of people they were. Expand the lore and add some character development for Plagg and Adrien. The same thing goes for Marinette. What kind of battles did they have in the past? What kind of people past holders were? Did Ladybug and Black Cat heroes always get along well? Were they allies or enemies? Were they always lovers?

Give us more information about Butterfly and Peacock holders. Perhaps Nooroo has dreams about his past holders who were good people. Show us what kind of things a Butterfly holder with good intentions can do. Tell us more about Duusu and her past holders, sprinkle in a few bits of info about Emilie and Duusu's relationship, just a few vague hints to preserve the mystery. You have a lot of screentime each season and instead of doing filler episodes dedicated to love drama, you can use them for developing minor characters, relationships between them and lore.

#miraculous ladybug #ml #miraculous analysis #miraculous meta #ml meta #ml analysis #miraculous transformations #miraculous critical #miraculous ladybug critical #miraculoustalesofladybugandcatnoir #kwami #miraculous kwamis #miraculous holders

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lovecolibri · 3 years ago

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I was prepared for S2 to be off limits for Malex this season but I was not prepared for just how unsatisfying that would be. What was hands down the strangest part of the Malex stuff for me in 3x08 was Alex's sudden certainty that apparently a future with Michael was an option again now. He didn't just tell Michael he joined Deep Sky for him which was already jarring after 7 episodes of nothing. He referenced an us and then proceeded to flirt with his eyebrows. I don't think we've ever seen Alex this confident he would have an effect on Michael, not even early S1. Where the hell was that coming from? It certainly wasn't coming from anything we've seen in S2. And if it's sheer hope he couldn't quite squash, where was that hope in 3x01 when he was considering commiting to F*rrest without ever checking where Michael's headspace was about the two of them? Like you said, we shouldn't have to be this deep in the fandom to make sense of things.

I had some really big thoughts about this but it was the middle of the workday I think and now it's been.....several weeks and I've forgotten all the thoughts. Love this brain for me. BUT you're absolutely right, that shutting down all discussion of season 2 for Malex has made for some really unsatisfying moments this season, from all the Malex hope/ready to be together stuff coming out of the ether with no build up, to every single time one of them shares the screen with or mentions m*ria and how weird those moments feel, especially when m*ria is acing catty and mean like SHE was the one hurt in all of this. Now, Malex already being domestic boyfriends deeply in love doesn't surprise me or feel unearned in any way because it's been 84 years and they were nonsensically kept apart for far to long already, but not having the build up to 3x08 is what really bothers me, and them not being able to hash out their issues in the lead up to them getting together. And that's entirely because the writers for some reason will not allow anyone to even acknowledge that m*luca happened. Which I think some people were hoping for, just leaving season 2 in the flaming dumpster where it belongs, but it doesn't work because their relationship with each other was deeply affected by season 2. Alex was only with Forrest because of season 2. And trying to spin 3x01 like Michael was super hurt and sad about that while Alex has STILL never been allowed to have a negative thing to say about the hell he went through last season did not hit well. Showing Echo as dealing with the fallout from last season and centering the season around taking personal responsibility for your actions while putting m*ria on a pedestal and not allowing anyone to call her out for doing shitty things just this season like talking down to Michael or actively being willing to kill Max (still waiting to see Liz and Isobel's reaction that one 🙄😒), and not allowing Malex to deal with the fallout from season doe does not hit well. It's unsatisfying because it's unfinished. Michael hurt Alex in season 2. Deeply. Alex hurt Michael in season 1. Deeply. But we got to see Alex's thought processes and trauma responses and we saw his growth in season 2 and him being Michael's emotional support. But we had to skip Michael addressing picking someone else over Alex at every turn and telling someone else he loved them because that would necessitate addressing that m*luca was never anything to him but a distraction and part of his self-sabotaging spiral OR risk painting it as something "good" that helped him "grow" which is...blatantly in contradiction to what we saw on screen (thank you @ladymajavader for this post about Michael's spiral in season 2), and would also undercut the Malex love story. Son instead they just...pretended it didn't happen, but when someone does the things m*ria did to her supposed BFF with full knowledge of how Alex felt about Michael and later knowing how Michael felt about Alex, you can't just sweep it under the rug and not allow at the very least Michael and Alex to address it, or allow either of them time and space away from her character even without going super in depth or totally throwing her character under the bus. There were ways to handle season 2 well, without totally vilifying m*ria but by not addressing it at all and trying to have everyone, especially m*ria act like none of that ever happened and having her character continue talking down to and about Michael and poking at things with Alex knowing full well Alex is with Forrest is just suuuuuch a bad look and only makes things worse for her character. If they wanted to fix the issues from season 2 with her character, literally NONE of the things they did were the way to go about doing that. And unfortunately the whole entire season suffered for it.

#my sweet nonnie friends #roswell nm #season 3 spoilers #anti maria deluca #anti miluca #malex #there were ways to handle this but what we got? ain't it

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bethanyeliseart · 3 years ago

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Time for more after midnight Merlin ramblings!! I'm really just writing this because I need to get these thoughts down. I just got to The Disir episode in my Merlin rewatch and boy oh boy does this one cause a strong urge to cry in absolute frustration more so than the finale(not that the finale doesn't make me want to sob into a lake). It's not that it's a bad episode, it's probably one of my favorites in terms of writing (so this might also be me pointing out things I really liked) like how Revenge of the Sith is my favorite star wars movie but it also makes me want scream into my pillow.

Basically it's Merlin and Arthur's decisions, mainly Merlin. I know Arthur has always been arrogant but c'mon man, disrespecting the Disir's sacred place !! While he jokes about Merlin's worries, he usually comes around and sees how serious he is about something this important. That one might actually be because of iffy writing. They tend to wash away any character development Arthur gets, in regard to magic, a few episodes after he gets that development. But anyways, his insolence is what leads to Mordred being hurt, thus leading to Merlin's big dilemma.

Now onto Merlin which is the number one reason I was frustrated. Obviously he screwed up in telling Arthur not to bow to the Old Religion, since the Disir let Mordred live anyway. I do understand why he did it, but as a watcher you obviously shout at the TV all the things they could've done or taken into consideration. All he's been hearing about the moment he stepped into Camelot was how there is this big destiny he's apart of to protect Arthur, so that magic and peace can be brought back to the kingdoms. And Mordred has been made to look like the biggest threat to Arthur. For him it really doesn't get any clearer than a straightforward vision from a seer. But in opposition, Gaius said the future is always changing and there's no clear path. Which yes! And Kilgharrah was the president of the get rid of Mordred club since he was a child. Poor Merlin is pulled in so many directions because he knows Arthur is so fond of Mordred and you can even see that Merlin was beginning to like him at the start of the ep! The little moment of them paying their respects to the sorcerer and talking about their magic! It makes me so emo. Obviously Merlin is devastated about telling Arthur that there can be no magic in Camelot, but the way I think we're meant to see it is that he's hoping that sentiment will be temporary for Arthur. Because no Mordred, Arthur doesn't die, Arthur gets to bring back the magic. (God, Merlin and his relation with his magic and other magic users is entirely something else I could get into, but I won't for now) But aghh that also can just lead to Arthur's further disdain for magic. Like after Uther kicks the bucket due to magic, Arthur states that all magic is evil. So Merlin, you should've taken that into consideration, Mordred's death would be Uther's 2.0 !! The end of the ep makes it clear that had Merlin told Arthur to bow down, Mordred living would be for the better this time. Arthur would welcome magic into the kingdom and maybe Mordred would've told Kara of the good his King had done, she wouldn't die, and Mordred wouldn't seek revenge on Arthur.

Anyways that's just me being like any other person getting frustrated over what if scenarios. While I like to think oh how wonderful it could've been if Merlin had thought this through and given Mordred the benefit of the doubt, I don't think it makes sense in this storyline if he did. To me this story has always been a tragedy so it was never going to have the happiest of endings. Like he told Gaius, he'd grown up, well more accurately he's been traumatized by what happened with Morgana. So after more than 5? years of seeing the constant threats to Arthur, Merlin's not going to take any chances. I'm not an expert in literature, but I think Merlin has a negative character arc and I love that the later seasons highlight it. Props to Colin Morgan for the scene when he's literally tearing up over having to tell Arthur there can be no magic. I freaking love the parallel to s1 the beginning of the end ep, Merlin being emotionally distraught over the decision to help Arthur save Mordred or not both times, but this time it ends with him choosing no.

Honestly I like season 5 because there's so much at stake and I love when things like fate start to come together. But what makes me mad is that we didn't get another season when the plot really requires it. The first way another season could've gone is Arthur doesn't die in s5 and he and Merlin bring peace to the kingdom, fulfilling their destiny (personally I think Arthur would still have to die at the end of s6 at Mordred's hand but the end credits could be him rising idk!). Second is the last season could be Arthur rising again, but not as far as the 21st century. Personally I would love to see Gwen ruling Camelot with Merlin as her advisor, and then halfway through the season there would be an intense challenge and Arthur would rise again. Basically it was rushed which we all know.

It's late so these thoughts are very messy and contradicting. But one of the reasons I love this show is because it makes me think so much about the characters and their decisions! (also I'm a sucker for tragic heroes) Feel free to add your thoughts and opinions below on the Disir episode or just Merlin in general!

#the disir #bbc merlin #but ya i went into this show knowing arthur's fate so i always saw it as a tragedy #I think Merlin loved and needed to protect Arthur so much that he forgot to consider the consequences got camelot as a whole #arthur pendragon #merlin #mordred #so many thoughts they could change when i wake up

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ruby-whistler · 4 years ago

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hi, here's a short (long) analysis of this song which you should at least give a watch in my opinion! you might not like it, but you also might, so i say give it a shot.

anyways, here's my personal interpretation of the lyrics i (co)wrote. ani might have a completely different one, but you know.

beforehand, i need to point out that the first half of this was written before c!wilbur's revival and the second one was written after.

so, starting with the title

my motivation for it was c!wilbur's general role in shaping the narrative of the server, as well as cc!wilbur often joking around about scripts and other plot elements.

another thing was a clip of him talking with philza about how he thought the server's storyline was becoming very scattered, and i got the idea that maybe when c!wilbur comes back, he might try to rewrite the plot to his benefit as he has done time and time again.

hence, the idea for the song was born in my mind as i was falling asleep one night, because that is the only time i get good ideas.

the first half

"history, history, s'told by the winners, made by the sinners"

this was a reference to wilbur quoting the famous line "history is told by the victors". the reason i chose to use this set of words is because although the winners (wilbur) are the ones telling the story, the people who actually make the impact are often flawed, and genuinely invested in the cause (rest of l'manberg).

while c!wilbur knew the cause of l'manberg was false, he let the "sinners", or people he considered lower than him, since he was the one "telling" the story, win the war for him and make history as he altered the finished "story" in his own favor.

"so lie that you'll free them, s'long as you lead 'em"

this one is pretty self-explanatory. wilbur promised the revolution freedom in return for total loyalty to him, his power, and his country.

i'd also like to point out the use of "you" in this song - this was written, once again, before the revival; it was however expected that dream was going to bring wilbur back at some point. and i'm pretty sure ani doesn't know this, but writing this, i intentionally made the "you" wilbur is singing to be dream.

in essence, wil's telling his newfound ally about how powerful he is due to his abilities to "rewrite the script" - picture this being your usual villain monologue song after a dramatic return, since wil's always had a knack for the theatrics. keep this in mind for the rest of the explanation of these lyrics.

"the ink doesn't dry 'till time blows by spin a silver web and they're comply"

i absolutely loved this lyric, i couldn't stop gushing about it. ani came up with this one completely, so i don't know whether or not it has any deeper meaning, but i wanted to point it out because it sounds hella cool. the second part is about c!wilbur spinning lies until people would listen to him and do what he wants.

"smiles in the mirrors, reality's a game"

this line was meant to give an idea of just how screwed wilbur's perception of the world and people around him is, in that he treats everyone's lives as a narrative, as a symphony, as something that belongs to him and is free for him to play with.

smiles in the mirrors can be taken in a lot of ways, but one interpretation i like is that wilbur and dream as characters are parallels in their actions, but no one realizes it because the narrative paints them in different lights and the tragic hero and puppeteer respectively, when it's moreso the other way around.

"with help from the spinners we can shift all the blame"

spinners are the people wilbur uses to "spin" the tales for him. and, well, he's always been very good at shifting the blame and making himself out to be a victim.

seeing as he's talking to dream, in this line he is also reassuring him that he has people on the outside that can help them "rewrite" the current narrative and shift the blame away from dream and wilbur, in order to change the public's perception of them, which is at the time overwhelmingly negative.

"and if the world hunts you down out your mind and around we'll set their precious world adrift, adrift"

this is the most obvious pointer that wilbur is singing to dream. he is directly telling him that since the people of the smp have "hunted" him (or would, if he were to escape), and have hurt him mentally and physically in the prison, wilbur would work with him to destroy their lives and their world as they know it for their mutual gain.

it also brings forth his views of possession and power; in essence, he sees himself as in charge of the lives of everyone in his story, hence finding their realities fragile and fully his own to mess with. he finds it amusing that he has full control over something so "precious" to them, and mocks this sentiment in the last line.

"and if you don't like what's shown and you feel like no one's grown just, rewrite the script!"

this was the first lyrics for the song, which ani wrote, after i proposed the idea. this begins a trend in the song where wilbur will alternate between talking to dream and the viewers themselves.

here he is directly addressing those who don't like the way the smp has been since wilbur has stopped writing, and who call out the lack of character development in certain people's stories. he is reassuring them that now that he's back, he will rewrite it to be more entertaining - for him, that is.

the second half

alright, now we're going over what i myself wrote the day wilbur was revived after getting a surge of inspiration.

"screams, broken voices poor writing choices"

this starts off with revived wilbur's opinions on the new storyline he has come into. the first line refers to the torture dream is going through in prison, and the second is him simply commenting on how he finds the plotline inadequate after his return.

"dreams of redemption caught my attention"

the interesting thing about this is that wilbur, as has been shown before with eret, doesn't believe in people's redemption.

this line insinuates that even if there was any chance of the circumstances changing and dream getting better, now that wilbur was back, he wan't planning to let that happen, as he finds it one of the aforementioned "poor writing choices".

it caught his attention as something he finds interesting - since he's always had a twisted fascination with people's hopes and goals, finding ways to use them to his advantage - but in the end, naive, since his outlook on the world has always been quite cynical.

"train wheels screech on the rails in the end, my world prevails"

this was an attempt to shove a reference to the stream i had just watched into the song. the train stopped in limbo, and it came to get him back out to the world of the living.

the second line is him boasting that he knew all along that his efforts to gain people's loyalty would would pay off in the end, and hence his "word" prevailed even over death.

"i've got tales in store, of loss and of war it's a shattered world for me to restore"

see, this entire sequence is quite the oxymoron, and it's meant to be confusing, showcasing once again just how twisted wilbur's outlook on the world is.

he finds the story "shattered", which is a reference to cc!wilbur saying he prefers more centred stories than what the dsmp is right now. he is promising to fix this, finding it another game for him to play, another puzzle for him to solve, however, his definition of "restore" is proven by the previous line to be a contradiction at its core.

he has plans from his time in limbo, and just like all of his stories so far, they're tragic and traumatizing to the people playing in them. he plans to perpetuate war and conflict in order to make the story more lively and dynamic, while using loss as a tragic element to push the "characters" in their lives further towards development.

in the end, the way he's planning to "restore" the world is by rewriting the narrative in such a way that it wouldn't stagnate, or work itself out naturally, but continue endlessly for him to write and control.

"villains and heroes, traitors and moles when push comes to shove they'll burn the world for their goals"

the second part of the first line was meant to be "interchangeable roles" instead, but we switched it out so it would be easier to sing.

it's talking about how after all, it doesn't really matter to wilbur who the villain or hero is, as long as they are part of the narrative that he has power over.

"and if i harness the flame their hope will blaze all the same no time for interests to conflict"

this is confirmation of the previous point that he can use people's feelings against them and in order to perpetuate his own "interests". as long as he can make people think he's helping them, even if their goals are different, there won't be room for them to truly conflict.

the people on the dream smp all burn with hope and passion and human emotions he can exploit and use in favour of himself and his story, and even then they won't get any weaker. he sees them as an endless fuel source he can take from, essentially.

"so when you're blue and betrayed by all the choices you've made just, rewrite the script."

the last lines of the song, and here he is speaking specifically to the characters in the story. all of them have made mistakes and been "betrayed" by their choices to trust others, which left them or others grieving or hurt.

wilbur is in essence mocking this, by pointing out, once again, how simple it is for him to "just rewrite the script", and take all of their "blue" away - while also making it clear that he only plans to use this power to take further control by driving those he sees fit further down their path of revenge and villainy.

epilogue

thank you all for reading, whoever did! this song was truly a passion project for me to work on, and i loved coming up with deeper meanings to the lyrics, by using my own personal interpretation of the character. i get that this is not everyone's interpretation, but i like it. i also really can't wait for what wilbur's up to now that he's back. either way, have a nice day!

#dream smp #rewrite the script #fansong #fansong analysis #c!wilbur #long post

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shihalyfie · 4 years ago

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A meta and analysis on Hurricane Touchdown

Hurricane Touchdown sure is one of the Digimon entries that’s really difficult to describe. Often said to be “confusing” and “like an acid trip” (for pretty good reason, honestly), it somehow also manages to have a lot of hold in public memory, partially due to being one of the three movies that got widespread international distribution via Digimon: The Movie. Moreover, its relevance has started to re-emerge thanks to Kizuna, the director of which has stated Hurricane Touchdown to be his favorite movie (multiple times). Rather recently, there was even an editorial written by a journalist who had been covering Kizuna, professing that he had watched Hurricane Touchdown as a kid and hated it, only to rewatch it as an adult and appreciate it much better.

With all that, plus the fact that the movie recently got a new translation, it’s probably a good time to go back over the movie and analyze it! Despite what popular sentiment may have you believe, the plot of the movie isn’t that fundamentally incomprehensible, just buried under some rather unusual production and execution decisions. But there’s a lot to be said about the themes and story of the movie, so let’s dig in!

(All screenshots and quotations from the movie are based off the Hudie translation.)

Hurricane Touchdown in meta franchise terms

The full title of the movie isn’t technically Hurricane Touchdown by itself, but rather “Digimon Hurricane Touchdown!!/Transcendent Evolution!! The Golden Digimentals”. (The Japanese fanbase tends to shorten it to “Digimon Hurricane”, or, for even more shortening, “dejihari”.) The double-titling there is because of how it was originally screened; it was the 02 “summer movie”, screening in July (between the airings of 02 episodes 14 and 15). Functionally, the franchise has thereafter treated it like a single movie, but at the time, the fact it was technically “two” movies gave it the longest running time of any Digimon theatrical movie, clocking in at a little over an hour. (The tri. movies are officially considered OVAs and not theatrical movies due to their limited-screening nature, so as of this writing Kizuna, at 95 minutes, is the only theatrical movie to break this record.)

The movie itself has a pretty fascinating development history – for one, Akiyama Ryou was originally planned to be the starring character instead of Wallace. It’s also the first Digimon movie to be in “questionable canonicity” territory – this is very normal for Toei tie-in movies, since development for these kinds of movies usually starts at the same time or even before the TV series itself, making it hard to reconcile canon, but unusual at the time for Adventure, which had both its first and second movies be plot-relevant to Adventure and 02 respectively. It is generally understood that the movie takes place in “summer” – possibly between episodes 14 and 15, at the same position it screened in real-life – but, interestingly, the Western and Japanese fanbases’ opinions on why it’s questionably canon tend to differ: in the West it’s usually based on the appearance of Tailmon and Patamon’s higher-level evolutionary forms (which shouldn’t be possible as per 02 episode 27), but in the Japanese fanbase it’s based on Wallace’s existence posing a timeline contradiction (according to Adventure episode 45, there shouldn’t be any Chosen Children before 1995, but the movie states that Wallace had been one before then). Add to that The Door to Summer, which seemingly contradicts the ending of the movie (in which Wallace and Gumimon find what’s implied to be Chocomon’s egg, whereas The Door to Summer has the line “Chocomon isn’t here anymore”), and everything is just a tangled mess.

Despite that, it’s pretty remarkable how lasting the movie has been in public memory. Even with all of the factors working against it – the fact it’s often accused of being confusing (or, by many a Japanese kid, boring and slow) or an acid trip – Wallace is a very popular character, more so than you’d expect for a “guest” character in a one-off movie, especially one so controversial. 02 fans often even consider him an honorary seventh member of the 02 group. His article on the Pixiv dictionary wiki is pretty surprisingly thorough, at that. Questionable canonicity aside, the fact The Door to Summer even exists is pretty significant – how many one-off questionably canon movies have you seen getting an actual sequel?

As an aside, Hurricane Touchdown has a bit of an interesting relationship with Ojamajo Doremi, which is in some sense classic Digimon’s sister series (it aired at around the same time as Adventure through Frontier, and was also headed by their producer, Seki Hiromi). Wallace was voiced by Miyahara Nami, a voice actress who grew up in an international school in Austria and thus speaks fluent German and English, thus often putting her in roles that require speaking one of those. (If you listen to Wallace’s Japanese speech through the movie, it has a very heavy accent, which is deliberately affected on Miyahara’s part.) A year later, Miyahara would be cast as major character Momoko in Motto! Ojamajo Doremi, and The Door to Summer would prominently feature Nat-chan, a girl voiced by Shishido Rumi, who voiced Ojamajo’s Onpu (who is generally agreed to be Doremi’s most popular character, and Shishido’s most famous role). Coincidence? Opportunistic casting? Who knows.

The movie itself

But that’s enough beating around the bush. Let’s get to the movie itself!

I’m not going to dwell on this too much because I’m going to be going more in detail about it below, but our story starts off in Wallace’s hometown of Summer Memory, a fictional rural village in Colorado, in 1995. (As mentioned earlier, this is a bit of a timeline contradiction; Adventure episode 45 establishes that “the one who wishes for stability” and the Agents didn’t get the idea of human Chosen Children until 1995, whereas the events of Hurricane Touchdown imply he’d been one before then.) Chocomon suddenly vanishes, and a gust of wind is left behind, implying that he must have been kidnapped. It’s not exactly said by what he was taken by (Digimon: The Movie ties it into Our War Game! by having both be traced to a “virus”, but no mention of such is made in the original Japanese version).

The mystery of what it is that took Chocomon away is never fully elaborated in the course of the movie, but as it goes on, it becomes increasingly apparent that it doesn’t actually matter. Why? Well, stay tuned.

So, timeskip to 2002!

As Takeru and Hikari are visiting Mimi in New York, Hikari, who is known to have a bit of an empathic connection to Digimon, senses that there’s a “crying Digimon” (this will be important later), and Mimi suddenly vanishes – as do the other Chosen Children.

I think part of the reason this movie is often pinned as feeling like an acid trip is that the demeanor and attitude the 02 kids express in this movie feels a little too laid-back for the very urgent situation of their seniors having suddenly up and vanished (which is also not helped by the movie’s overall soundtrack being a lot more laid-back than the events on screen should suggest). This is especially odd because it’s absolutely not like the kids aren’t worried about their seniors at all! Rather to the contrary; “getting Taichi and the others back” is the major motive driving the whole group for the rest of it, and it’s constantly brought up as their goal in dialogue, shaping their actions throughout the rest of the movie. The execution of the dialogue and the overall direction create a bit of a tonal mismatch, but on its face, the actual storytelling checks.

Shortly after, Chocomon – now evolved and corrupted into something – appears, and Wallace and Gumimon confront him.

The fact that Wallace refers to his partners by their Baby-level names (Chocomon and Gumimon) even after they’ve clearly evolved brings up a lot of interesting implications. One is that, not having been privy to any great adventure in the Digital World before, Wallace doesn’t have a lot of awareness of names changing after evolution the same way his Japanese peers do. But another important thing that comes out here is that, through the course of this movie, Wallace primarily sees his partners the same way he did as a young child. A lot of this movie’s story centers around Wallace’s difficulty in moving on from the past and accepting that things aren’t the same way that they are anymore – and so, just like how he has a hard time swallowing that the circumstances have changed, he has difficulty seeing his own partners as having changed, and calls them by the same names despite everything.

Takeru and Hikari catch on, and Hikari’s psychic sense catches on that something’s happened to her brother, too.

Oh, and incidentally, said seniors aren’t in a pleasant place to be in at all.

The fact that the older kids are clearly Not Having a Good Time in the realm they’ve been kidnapped to – it’s depicted as cold, lonely, full of negative emotions, and eating away at their ability to even bodily function – is very heavily connected to what we later learn about what’s been going on with Chocomon through the last seven years. Moreover, the one truly coherent thing Taichi and Yamato can spit out at this stage is concern for their siblings – i.e., love. Keep that in mind for later!

Wallace drops a line to his family (”Amy” presumably being his sister) saying that he’s going to head to Summer Memory, and skips town. Repeat: Summer Memory is in Colorado – he’s doing something as drastic as going out of state to follow Chocomon, which naturally does not amuse his mom very much (as we find out later in the movie). Patamon eavesdrops on the conversation and relays the information to Takeru and Hikari, who contact Daisuke in turn.

So the remaining three kids nyoom all the way to the US using frequent flyer miles (which makes you really wonder whose those are, or what on earth they told their parents to allow three elementary school kids go around unassisted in another country) to go save their seniors, which apparently doesn’t fund their trip all the way to Colorado, forcing them to hitchhike from New York.

(We also get a quick scene implying that Daisuke has better proficiency in English than Iori and Miyako, as he translates some of the statements for the guy they take a ride from. This is pretty surprising, given that Daisuke hasn’t really been portrayed as particularly book smart…but then again, language skills sometimes just happen to come naturally to some people regardless of skill in books, and hey, it might just come in useful for his future ramen chef career in New York…)

We get our first major scene of dialogue between Gumimon and Wallace, and we learn quite a bit about their characters in the process. Gumimon has a similar laid-back attitude to the more prominent Terriermon in Tamers, but beyond that (and a shared voice actress), it’s important to note that they have very different personalities otherwise. In this scene, Wallace and Gumimon get in an argument over how to handle Chocomon, with Wallace insisting that they shouldn’t have attacked him and that they should have just “talked” about it – even though, as Gumimon correctly points out, he was pretty obviously trying to physically attack Wallace.

In fact, at this part of the story, Wallace is being extremely irrational and in denial. You don’t even have to watch the rest of the movie to see that Gumimon’s very practical stance on the matter is reasonable – Chocomon was very much trying to attack Wallace, and getting caught in the fight was pretty much all he could do for Wallace’s safety. But Wallace, still stuck in the past, can’t accept that at this point in the movie, and, honestly, is being a bit of a brat about it too – he’s engaging in progressively more self-destructive behavior over the course of the movie (ditching his family to set off by himself in order to hitchhike to Colorado, for one). We later find out that Wallace is specifically obsessed with going back to the flower field where he lost Chocomon, having independently come up with the idea that this would somehow let everything go back to what it was before – even though there was really no sign this would actually fix anything.

The Adventure universe generally runs on a concept that a Digimon partner is representative of part of the self, and so, tying that into Wallace and his two partners, it can be taken that Gumimon and Chocomon reflect the duality of Wallace as a character – Chocomon representing his desire to latch onto the past and hope that everything can be the same that it was before, and Gumimon as Wallace’s sense of reason, advising him about the reality of the situation and how to practically get through it (and, thus, to move on). In fact, Gumimon is the one constantly advising him about said self-destructive behavior (reminding him that his mom is probably worried about him, but also berating him for just ditching the train as a result instead of thinking about how that’d leave them without reliable transportation for the rest of it).

The symbolism is driven in even further when the only thing Gumimon has to say, in response to Wallace clinging further onto the idea that going to the flower field will fix things…is a cryptic statement that Chocomon didn’t like the heat, then suddenly offering to be a hat to provide Wallace shade. Because right now, Wallace and Chocomon are the same: clinging hopelessly to shards of the past.

The other 02 kids make their way to meet up in Colorado, but run into some snags when Daisuke, Miyako, and Iori end up missing the exit to Denver (Takeru is not amused), and Hikari and Takeru’s train ends up stranded thanks to Chocomon’s interference…

…and, making things worse, Daisuke, Miyako, and Iori try to take a plane back to Denver, only to overshoot it again. (Sorry, Taichi…your juniors are idiots.)

Fortunately, they get lucky by running into the very same boy they’re indirectly looking for on their way to hitchhiking. We learn that Wallace has never had exposure to other Chosen Children before to the extent of knowing there were any Digimon in Japan, nor has he ever been to the Digital World, so for all intents and purposes, his experiences with Chocomon and Gumimon are all he knows (i.e. he has no awareness of large-scale Digital World affairs). He also apparently speaks Japanese, which is convenient for this movie so that they don’t have to have a language barrier, but, amusingly, Wallace claims that it’s because he “had a Japanese girlfriend once”. (Gumimon, who is much more reliable of a source, says that he’d apparently put an honest effort into studying, so an interpretation that Wallace really likes anime or something is not out of the question.)

It’s also interesting to see how the others react to him, especially considering that it’s becoming increasingly apparent that he’s involved with the disappearance of their seniors. Miyako is as openly friendly as she generally always is, Iori presses him very calmly about questions relevant to the disappearances and Chocomon without even batting an eyelid (future lawyer in training here), and Daisuke is suspicious from the get-go…which is exacerbated when Wallace starts flirting with Miyako. The running gag of Daisuke getting angry about Wallace flirting with Miyako has a lot to unpack here – the most obvious standby is the shipping interpretation (or, at least, that Daisuke may be as protective of Miyako as he is Hikari), but there are other points to observe as well. Firstly, Daisuke is a rather abruptly straightforward and overly honest person, and it makes sense that he’d play badly with people who seem dishonest – after all, his suspicions of Wallace started even before he started flirting, and he also shows similar hostility around Takeru (also not a very straightforward person) when he suspects he’s being made fun of. But also, the Pixiv dictionary entry takes the interpretation that Wallace’s personality had gotten a bit “warped” by his experiences – or, in other words, he’d developed this penchant for acting like a flirt, wandering off on his own, and altogether being incredibly wishy-washy because of the trauma of losing Chocomon and his inability to get over it.

And as much as Daisuke’s being a prick about it (to the point that mocking Wallace for it gets him left there stranded with him), he’s absolutely right about the contradiction Wallace’s posing – he’s acting all high and mighty about trying to become an “adult” (meaning that going off on his own and flirting with girls presumably are part of his perception of what Mature Guys do), yet he’s being a total mama’s boy by constantly dropping everything to call her repeatedly through his trip. (It’s even worse than the subs here suggest; he calls her “mama”, the kind of super-affectionate language used by Mimi and Ken.) As Gumimon says, Wallace thinks he’s actually right, but he doesn’t actually have it together at all.

Another interesting thing to note here is that at this point of the movie, Wallace calls Daisuke “Daisuke-kun” (with honorific attached, slight distance). Remember this for later.

Chocomon appears to confront them again, but he seems to not properly recognize Wallace – because, as we later find out, he doesn’t see the current Wallace as “Wallace”, and will accept nothing less than a younger Wallace from exactly the way he was when they were separated. (It is later stated in the movie that this is why he kidnapped the seniors and turned them younger; since he can’t recognize “Wallace” the way he is now, he’s taking anyone he can find with a Digivice and de-aging them in the hopes that he’ll find “Wallace” among them.) Gumimon recognizes that Chocomon is beyond recognition, and tells Wallace to not see him as Chocomon, but Wallace refuses to accept this and continues to intervene in the fight, telling Chocomon that they’ll meet again in the flower field. Again, Wallace’s mentality isn’t that different from Chocomon’s at this point – he may not be delusional to the point he wants to literally turn back time, but he still thinks that reproducing the conditions of seven years prior will fix everything and make it all better again.

During this whole time, the older(?) kids are getting progressively younger, and it’s turning out to impact not only their physical bodies but also their mentalities. At this point, they’re starting to lose awareness of what’s happening to them, as they become more and more connected to Chocomon’s emotions.

Daisuke is smart enough to catch on that Wallace definitely knows what’s going on, and starts to interrogate him. Recall that Daisuke is completely within his rights to do so at this point – Wallace is not only acting incredibly shady, he’s also being dismissive and refusing to give Daisuke any concrete answers about something that most certainly involves him at this point. As the 02 kids keep reiterating, their seniors have been kidnapped, and it’s pretty clear to anyone that Wallace knows something about this, but he continues to blow them off.

Wallace also doesn’t seem to be very happy about the fact Gumimon had evolved during the battle – remember, Wallace is very resistant to changes in his status quo, and especially when it involves Gumimon evolving in a similar way to Chocomon.

Daisuke continues to pry into what’s going on with Wallace and Chocomon, and Gumimon, who understands that there’s no use in denying that this is a problem, tries to be straightforward about it – but Wallace, still stubbornly refusing to open up about it, won’t even let Gumimon tell Daisuke about the truth.

Daisuke realizes that they’re not going to make any territory as it is, so he decides to have Lighdramon take them to Summer Memory for the time being, bonding a bit more with Wallace in the process.

Once they reach Summer Memory, the kids learn about Takeru and Hikari getting stalled by Chocomon on the train, and the fact everyone else on it had disappeared – meaning that the responsibility that Wallace is carrying for not taking care of this problem begins to weigh further on him. Daisuke, Miyako, and Iori continue to interrogate him about what he knows.

But Wallace, still stubbornly, refuses to talk, and being in Summer Memory only drowns him in further memories of his past with Chocomon and Gumimon. We learn a bit more about Gumimon’s past, too – apparently, he was quite the crybaby…

And when Gumimon finally begins to spill the details of what’s going on – that Chocomon wants to see the younger Wallace and is kidnapping kids with his Digivice and turning them younger as a result – Wallace still continues to double down on his denial. Notice his wording – his specific insistence that things will go back to “how they used to be,” because it’s not just about getting Chocomon back, but also a fixation on recreating that happy childhood he had with him.

(There’s also a bit of a cute moment around here where Daisuke asks Wallace if he needs to call his mom – after having teased him for being a mama’s boy earlier, Daisuke really is starting to care about his welfare. It’s also amusingly mentioned that Daisuke, Miyako, and Iori are broke out of money until they meet up with Takeru and Hikari again…)

That night, Wallace tries to go off by himself to the flower field, not even bringing Gumimon with him – as he implies later, he doesn’t even want to get Gumimon involved with this because he was the closest to Chocomon – but Daisuke, having finally caught on to his suspicion that Chocomon is not only relevant to Wallace but also Wallace’s partner, confronts him about it. Wallace thus finally spills the details – that Gumimon and Chocomon were born from the same egg, that Wallace kept them from his mother and stuck with them during childhood, and that, seven years prior, Chocomon suddenly vanished while they were playing at the flower field.

Wallace: I’ve never been able to forget about Chocomon since then. Not even after moving to New York, not even once. We were such good friends…So why did Chocomon have to end up like that? Does he hate me for not being able to save him? Daisuke: So the enemy we’re fighting is actually your Digimon? Your most important friend?! Daisuke: Of course you’d never be okay with that…

Daisuke is in shock, even though he’d already started to suspect this.

I said, earlier, that Wallace is being extremely irrational and in denial. I did not say that his feelings aren’t valid. Wallace’s situation sucks, and Daisuke recognizes why this hurts for him so much, especially after putting himself in Wallace’s shoes (and in fact it’s even worse for Wallace; Daisuke’s only known V-mon for less than half a year, whereas Wallace is talking about his formative childhood friend).

Daisuke: I’d never be able to do it. If V-mon were to turn into something completely different…Even if he went on a horrible rampage…There’s no way I’d ever be able to bring V-mon down. Wallace: Daisuke… Daisuke: So then, what are we supposed to do? Wallace: It’s not something you need to be crying over. Daisuke: But…

This entire scene is an interesting one for many reasons, especially because of the position in which it aired – this was in the middle of the arc in 02 when everyone was getting their second Digimentals. Daisuke had, only a few episodes prior, expressed trepidation over “friendly fire” – fighting any friend who had become controlled by the Digimon Kaiser. This is consistent with that (and the 02 kids’ general bleeding hearts and difficulty with fighting friends), and it’s even worse – unlike before, when we were talking about evil mind control, Chocomon is pretty obviously a victim of his own madness. And although Wallace continues to insist that this isn’t Daisuke’s problem, Daisuke, for all he’s rough around the edges, is a genuinely kind person who thinks of others to the point he breaks down in genuine tears over the problem, and it’s consistent with not only his prior characterization of thinking about others’ feelings in 02 episode 8, but also how this eventually ties into his indignation over seeing others being hurt (episode 20) or their feelings being trampled on (episode 49).

Another interesting thing here is that at no point in the movie is “killing” ever brought up, but rather the word used is taosu, which literally means “defeat”. In 02 proper, its use is somewhat euphemistic – most famously, it was used in episode 44, when Miyako and Hawkmon have a crisis over killing LadyDevimon (so in short, there’s no illusions about the fact killing is in play here). But in this context, it’s not even really about killing. Wallace doesn’t even want to fight in the first place. The sheer action of physically beating up a beloved friend is painful, with killing as the ultimate unwanted outcome. Everything about this sucks. But Daisuke correctly points out that Taichi and the others’ welfare is on the line here, and everything feels like the wrong thing to do. “What are we supposed to do?”, indeed.

So that’s why Daisuke momentarily indulges in Wallace’s denial-induced pattern of thought, because it really does seem like the only out here. (Especially because, from Daisuke’s perspective, Wallace seems to understands this situation better than he does – even if he doesn’t actually.) If they go to the flower field, they won’t have to fight and everyone will be saved and it’ll be fine! Wallace is irrational and in denial, but you can’t blame him and Daisuke for really, really wanting to believe this.

And Daisuke drops this zinger of a line, too:

Daisuke: So don’t say you’re gonna go alone.

Daisuke’s characterization really is important here, because, again, this movie came out during the first arc of the series, before episode 21 and the second half that centered around Ichijouji Ken’s redemption. At this point in the series, Daisuke was still being extremely deferential to others, especially his seniors, in almost all cases, and although episode 8 was a momentary glimpse into the kind of resolve Daisuke could have when it involved something he really cared about, this movie is really the first major sneak peek into how supportive of a person Daisuke is going to develop into, especially when it comes to Ken.

And Gumimon reaffirms that he’s going to stick by Wallace no matter what – filling the traditional role of a partner that Chocomon won’t anymore.

So they go to the flower field, and everything…fails spectacularly.

Well, before that, we get a glimpse of how the older kids are doing (they’re barely even conscious now), and we finally get to see Chocomon “in his element” and not as a rampaging monster. Things really, really aren’t going great for Chocomon either. He desperately and sadly jumps among the kids, trying to find Wallace among them, and what he really, really wants is just to be with his partner again. But they’re all “wrong”…

At first it seems like Wallace is making headway – for a second, Chocomon even recognizes him as Wallace! – but he continues to insist that he wants Wallace to come “with him”, to where it’s “cold and lonely and no one is there”. The way he starts chanting that he wants to go back is represented by the young Chocomon’s voice getting progressively lost in the monster’s voice, and Wallace, starting to grasp how futile Chocomon’s clinging to the past is, makes his first statement of the movie’s core theme: you can’t go back to the past, the only thing you can do is look forward and think about what you can do from there.

So after witnessing very clearly, in front of his eyes, how Chocomon is not going to listen to reason and will accept nothing less than something he can’t have, to the point of evolving and distorting everything around him, Wallace’s denial finally hits its limits, and he accepts that fighting him will be the only option out. (Again, note the use of “defeat” here – it’s not really about beelining straight to euthanizing him as much as Wallace has finally gotten over his refusal to fight Chocomon at all.) And considering that the situation is clearly rapidly escalating, and that Chocomon himself is clearly not in sound mind and having a terrible time himself, it doesn’t take much to see why the bleeding-heart Daisuke would also end up conceding so quickly. There’s a limit to how much you can hold out with pacifism when that just happened right in front of you!

(Also, Wallace no longer uses the honorific on Daisuke. Friendship level up!)

Chocomon evolves further and further, and his personality starts to actually take a turn for the cruel as he starts toying with the Digimon. In fact, it’s made pretty apparent that they’re no match for him from the get-go – he keeps toying with reality and forcing the Digimon back and forth between forms. He ends up “altering the world” into something reflective of his own heart, and it’s repeatedly pointed out that it’s “cold and lonely” – in short, Chocomon is subjecting the world to feel the same pain and loneliness that he felt, the pain that was enough to drive him mad.

And Wallace finally has this to say:

Wallace: Like Daisuke said, I’m a big baby. But you’re not Chocomon anymore. No, you’re the one who did this to Chocomon…Chocomon was all by himself and lonely, and in that loneliness, he tried so hard…But you took his heart and locked it away somewhere! I’m going to fight. If I defeat you…If that means I can free Chocomon from you…Then I want to fight, too! I need strength…

Firstly, Wallace acknowledges that he’s been a brat – that he’s been philandering around and acting spoiled and stringing everyone around (character development!!). And secondly, Wallace finally acknowledges the truth of Chocomon no longer being recognizable anymore. The ending quarter of this movie focuses heavily on the idea that Chocomon has now become so distorted that he can no longer even be considered the same thing anymore – it’s ambiguous as to whether that “you” that Wallace refers to having taken Chocomon away is actually a separate supernatural entity, or whether Chocomon was drowning in his own loneliness to the point those negative feelings became their own entity and consumed him.

In actuality, though – it doesn’t really matter! 02 as a series would also go on to blur the boundaries between external interference and internal forces – Ken having the Dark Seed as an influence but also being personally responsible for his own emotions driving him over the edge, and having to take responsibility regardless, and Oikawa technically being possessed by Vamdemon but still being goaded on by his own fixation with the past (in fact, notice how all three of these cases have to do with a fixation on things that can’t be brought back). Right now, the only thing that matters is that Chocomon is no longer recognizable, the thing in front of Wallace is no longer the same friend he knew, and even being able to bring back Chocomon’s sense of self is something Wallace wants.

(Daisuke also throws in a more charitable interpretation of Wallace’s actions even when he’s being hard on himself, pointing out that he can’t really be called a “baby” when he also did have genuine determination to come all the way there to find Chocomon despite his age.)

Hikari and Takeru arrive on the scene, and after Daisuke loses his marbles a bit over his happiness at seeing Hikari-chan there, Hikari points out the same thing: “You’re not the Digimon that was crying.”

Chocomon starts turning the 02 kids younger too – and remember, it was established earlier that he was using the Digivice as a guide. That meant it made sense for him to target the older kids, since they had the same model of Digivice Wallace did. But Daisuke and the others have D-3s, and there’s no way to really mistake them for Wallace – so in other words, Chocomon has devolved to inflicting cruelty for no good reason, with the original motive having completely vanished.

In increasing desperation, Angewomon and Angemon decide to evolve, and…look, I don’t have an explanation either, but I have to admit I’m somewhat amused by the fact that even they don’t really seem to have an explanation beyond “well, we’re desperate and hopefully it’ll do something!”

So they evolve, and Chocomon oneshots them. But that’s okay, because they released some golden Digimentals for Daisuke and Wallace to use! So V-mon and Gumimon get shiny new golden forms –

– and Chocomon pretty much oneshots them, too. More specifically, he eats them…and within his body, Magnamon and Gumimon’s consciousness gets eaten apart to the point they start forgetting their partners. Wow, this situation just got worse.

Yeah, so, despite the movie being named after the golden Digimentals, the actual point being here is that power means absolutely nothing in this situation. Remember, I pointed out that even from the beginning Chocomon was straight-out warping reality – they really didn’t have a chance.

So basically, everything devolves into complete chaos. Everyone’s being turned into little kids, with the mentality to match. All the Digimon are being oneshotted and being tossed around like tissues. But the one constant through all of this is that the kids are constantly running after their partners.

Remember how, back when the older kids were first getting sucked into Chocomon’s world, the one thing that seemed to remain intact at first was “love”? That “love” is what reaches out to Magnamon and Gumimon inside Chocomon, and makes them remember their partners again.

And, more importantly, that “love” is what awakens Chocomon – the real Chocomon – inside his consciousness, and he wordlessly makes a gesture begging Magnamon and Gumimon to kill him. And so they do – with understanding and consent from all three involved.

So in the end, the most extreme conclusion was reached. Chocomon died, at the hands of Daisuke and Wallace’s partners. But in that moment before he died, Chocomon’s pain was relieved, and he was himself again – Gumimon says that “Chocomon was smiling”, even in spite of his usual personality being that of a crybaby. They may have failed in their struggle to prevent the inevitable conclusion of having to kill Chocomon, but they did, to some degree, “save” him – so all of it did mean something in the end. And Daisuke promises that this still doesn’t mean the end of everything – they may have not been able to bring back Chocomon, and especially not in the exact way that would make things “the way they were before”, but the future is still there for him to return someday.

So, we clean up loose ends. Taichi and the others are returned safely, and in the end, Wallace decides to still be a vagrant for a bit longer – and to flirt with Hikari and Miyako a bit before he leaves. In the end, Wallace still has a long way to go if he wants to really grow as a person. But as Miyako points out, he’s gotten a bit bolder than he was before – and he’s greeted with an egg in the end, as if opening up new possibilities.

The Door to Summer contradicts the finding of this egg, or at least opens up the possibility that this wasn’t actually Chocomon’s, so it’s ambiguous as to whether the frame of Terriermon and Lopmon at the end of the credits is meant to be taken literally, or if it’s just symbolic. But even in the case of the latter, Chocomon is seen as Lopmon, a form he never got to have in Wallace’s childhood – so, in the end, it’s about different possibilities opening up in the future, rather than replicating that of the past.

All right, let’s recap this movie for those doing a tl;dr! Or, more specifically, let’s recap the events in chronological order:

Sometime before 1995, an egg emerges from Wallace’s mother’s computer, and hatches into twin Digimon, Chocomon and Gumimon.

In 1995, while playing in a flower field in Summer Memory with Wallace and Gumimon, Chocomon disappears for unknown reasons.

For the next seven years, Chocomon is trapped in delirium, full of loneliness and pain from being unable to see Wallace, and starts to become obsessed with the idea of reuniting with him, but, in his madness, accepts only a version of that reunion that involves him being the same young child he was when they parted, as if nothing had changed since.

Wallace, likewise, develops a fixation with getting Chocomon back so that things can be like “the way they were before”, even after moving to New York.

In 2002, Chocomon begins to kidnap kids with the same model of Digivice that Wallace has, and starts to forcibly turn them younger and send them into delirium like his own, hoping that this will bring the “Wallace” he wants back. Wallace starts to chase after him and decides that returning to the flower field in Summer Memory will allow him to communicate with Chocomon and make him go back to the way he was before.

Takeru and Hikari, hoping to find a lead on their seniors’ disappearance, drop a line to Daisuke, Miyako, and Iori, who head to the United States, also hoping to find a lead in Summer Memory. On the way, they run into Wallace, who is evasive about his connection to Chocomon and the kidnapping incidents.

At Summer Memory, Daisuke confronts Wallace and learns about his story, emphasizing deeply with the difficulty in killing an important friend, and agreeing that they should reach out to Chocomon at the flower field.

Chocomon continues to fall deeper into madness at the flower field, and Wallace and the others realize that they have no choice but to fight him. As Chocomon becomes so distorted he’s no longer recognizable, Wallace declares an intent to at least save his consciousness.

As the fight carries on, the kids are de-aged by Chocomon in his madness, and Magnamon (V-mon) and Gumimon are swallowed by Chocomon. However, the kids’ love for their partners awakens Chocomon’s consciousness again, and he asks Magnamon and Gumimon to end his pain.

With everything settled, Wallace and Gumimon are able to face forward into the future in the hopes of meeting Chocomon again and starting anew from scratch.

The Door to Summer

Actually, there’s not much to really be said about Hurricane Touchdown’s spiritual sequel The Door to Summer, except that it revisits similar territory to the movie, observing it more in Daisuke’s context than it does Wallace’s. (The story is very much more Daisuke’s than it is Wallace or Mimi’s.) The short synopsis is that Daisuke, having had a pretty bad time recently, finds himself in contact with a mysterious “winter” (in the middle of summer!) that seems to reflect his own heart…and a mysterious amnesiac girl whom Mimi names Onpu “Nat-chan”, who immediately latches onto Daisuke. In the end, “Nat-chan” turns out to be “a Digimon who’s taken in a lot of evil data,” who goes on a rampage and forces the others to fight and eventually kill her.

Although the reason for Nat-chan going on a rampage is more concrete than what was given in Hurricane Touchdown (it’s portrayed as “data chips” that seem like fireflies), The Door to Summer also makes it very clear that it wasn’t just supernatural influence, but also Nat-chan’s loneliness, desire for a human partner, and jealousy of Daisuke and V-mon’s relationship. Daisuke, while showing immense hesitation about fighting her when she had befriended them, still manages to “save” her in some way, to the point she actually verbally thanks him as she dies. And in the end, Daisuke and the others decide to take her egg and find a partner for her – even if she can’t be Daisuke’s partner like she wanted, she can still start anew with someone else.

Wallace in Kizuna

Warning: The rest of this post contains spoilers for Kizuna.

As said before, Hurricane Touchdown has been said to be the favorite Digimon movie of the director of Kizuna – and certainly, while Kizuna references all four Adventure-series theatrical movies, Hurricane Touchdown’s references are the least subtle, with the plot point of de-aging kids lifted directly from it. (Except, in this case, it’s in the context of trapping oneself in blissful memories rather than being portrayed as the upfront listless torture it is in Hurricane Touchdown.) Moreover, the theme of warning against being fixated on the past is just as present in Kizuna as it was in Hurricane Touchdown, especially when Kizuna’s main antagonist (Menoa) also falls victim to something that’s part supernatural influence and part getting swallowed by her own negative feelings…so it’s only fitting that Wallace himself makes a cameo in the movie. Two cameos, in fact.

The fact that Wallace is established as canonically existing within the Adventure main timeline has thrown a lot of people for a loop, especially since recent franchise events have made it questionable as to how it’s possible for canon to even make sense anymore because consistency has just gone out the window, but the Pixiv dictionary’s chosen rationalization for this is that, at the very least, “(some version of) Wallace exists in the timeline of the main story”. I’m inclined to agree with this evaluation; the fact that people around the globe can agree that the movie is questionably canonical but can’t even agree on how, and the fact that certain franchise entries considered canon (Tag Tamers) have their own contradictions, plus the fact that it’s not like Hurricane Touchdown takes a complete knife to timeline and lore common sense and more that it has some contradictory minutiae that are really easy to sidestep, it’s not actually that hard to say that some timeline of events that reasonably resembled Hurricane Touchdown (with maybe only some minor timeline or evolution differences) happened during the summer of 2002, and thus that Wallace exists.

Assuming that the story of our canonical Wallace is mostly the same or similar to that of the story presented in Hurricane Touchdown, Kizuna provides us with quite a bit of interesting information. We’re treated to two shots relevant to him: one in the form of his name at the top of Koushirou’s list of kidnapping victims, and one where he appears in person at the very end. It’s hard to miss him; he’s wearing similar colors to the clothes he wore in Hurricane Touchdown so you can identify him even at a distance, and he’s also the only loser around here with two partners. That’s right, two! Two!! Chocomon is back – and as Lopmon, exactly like the end credits card of Hurricane Touchdown depicted him!

So it looks like that, one way or another (after Hurricane Touchdown, after The Door to Summer, whatever, make up your own story), Wallace did manage to reunite with Chocomon and start a new life with him. It looks like not all of his habits have died – he’s depicted in a place with palm trees, meaning he’s definitely not in New York or Colorado, so either he’s moved again, is still maintaining the vagrant lifestyle, or just happens to be on vacation.

The other interesting thing here is that Wallace is depicted as one of the Eosmon kidnapping victims. According to Menoa, kidnapping victims were ones who were entertaining thoughts of wanting to go back to the past and remain a child forever – something that should intuitively be against everything Wallace learned in Hurricane Touchdown. But it’s important to point out that Eosmon’s lure is depicted as working on a subconscious level – certainly, if the kidnapping victims in Kizuna were to be outright asked if they wanted to be kidnapped and de-aged and trapped in their childhoods forever, most of them would probably say “no!”, and Wallace is likely no exception! But even if he’s starting his life anew with Chocomon now, it’s not hard to believe that there would still be lingering subconscious regrets about everything he’d lost with Chocomon and the childhood they could never spend together, ones that Eosmon’s allure would end up connecting with, even if the events of Hurricane Touchdown had consciously taught him better. Alas, being a human is hard.

#digimon #digimon adventure 02 #hurricane touchdown #shihameta #digimon adventure last evolution kizuna #kizuna spoilers

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sir-phineas-lost · 4 years ago

Text

Follow-up post

So I got a reply to my comment about the ableism in Ironwood’s character arc by @swapauanon and then they immediately blocked me. Since I am sometimes a petty bastard I decided to make a separate response anyway.

The first thing I would like to point out is that this person does not actually address my points in any way throughout this lengthy rant. My comment was all about the behind-the-scenes comments from the creators and they only responded with in-text examples and their interpretations of them. Those are important sure, and I will talk about those, but they don’t exactly come off as arguing in good-faith right from the get-go.

Okay, so I don’t TYPICALLY acknowledge RWDE’s beyond blocking them, but I think it’s important to separate how Ironwood views himself versus how the writers view him.

Because Ironwood’s entire downfall is his misunderstanding of how humanity works. He denies his own humanity, and sees maiming his vulnerable flesh and replacing it with unfeeling machinery as ridding himself of his own human weaknesses.

Except at the end of the day, he can’t cast off his VERY human soul, and his refusal to acknowledge that he can’t and SHOULDN’T do that are ultimately what leads to his downfall.

I have seen this “Actually it is just Ironwood himself that is ableist” argument before, and I don’t think it holds any water. While it is true that he begins to see compassion as a weakness, he never expresses the views you say he does about his own machine parts. And if you want to talk about how Ironwood sees himself vs how the writers see him you really can’t do so without talking about framing and subtext. When we get scenes that emphazize Ironwood’s machine parts to make him look intimidating or use his passive superpower (described as “hyper-focus” by the creators themselves) to shut off his empathy, that is the writers telling us that these physical aspects of Ironwood makes him less human.

Meanwhile, what V8C12 was TRYING to convey (even if it was horrible in its execution), was that it’s one’s SOUL that defines them, not the body that houses it.

Literally NO OTHER CHARACTER with mechanical parts added to their body views themselves as less human.

[...]

Penny doesn’t angst over not being human, she angsts over being treated like a soulless tool. (Which is why I don’t like that they turned her human. Had they set up that she’d wanted to be human back in Volume 2, it would’ve been one thing, but they don’t establish that Penny wanted to be human until AFTER her mechanical body has been discarded.)

So here they outright contradict themselves. They start off saying that no other character views themselves this way, and then go on to say that Penny does (but only after she has been turned human). And like, points for admitting that scene was bad, but they seem unwilling to consider that maybe the fact that the writers did include that scene tells us something about the way the show at large views disability. They seem to think they can just write it off and move on like this instance of Penny absolutely seeing herself as inhuman can just be ignored. it also disregards that this isn’t just Penny expressing how she feels about herself. When Penny gets her human body she expresses surprise that hugging someone makes her feel “warm inside” even though she has hugged people countless times before. This is not a villain saying that having machine parts makes you less human and being proven wrong, this is a hero saying outright that “wow, my mechaniocal body made me unable to appreciate this simple human interaction, but now that I have a flesh-body I can”. Things like this is why I do not buy the argument that it is only Ironwood who thinks being part machine makes you less human.

Mercury doesn’t angst over the loss of his legs, he angsts over the piece of his soul his father tore out.

[...]

While Yang DOES lose her arm and angst over it, she doesn’t view herself as less human because of her prosthetic.

The closest we get to a LITERAL “cybernetics eats your soul” story is with Cinder, and she doesn’t have ANY cybernetics, just a parasitic leash that’s slowly consuming her flesh and threatens to eventually consume her mind if she doesn’t get rid of it. And if/when she does, I imagine she’ll replace that with a mechanical arm.

(I moved a few parts of their post around here because it made more sense to me to talk about these quotes together)

I feel like this highlights how much this person completely ignores the core argument of what makes the themes in RWBY ableist. They focus way too much on the literal and whether the characters “angst” over their humanity. But like I have said before, thie main issue here is theme and subtext.

Mercury doesn’t “angst” over his legs, but that doesn’t erase the subtext inherent in the fact that he still lost his legs (and presumanbly the piece of his soul) at the same time as he joins team evil.

Yang is probably the best take on a disabled person with a prosthetic in the show. I will give it that. I don’t think there is anything particularly wrong with how it has handled this storyline, but I do think it sets a certain expectation for how it thinks a “good” person should handle their disability. Because Yang basically deals with her lost arm by seeing her prosthetic as an “extra”. She creates a distance between herself and it instead of seeing her mechanical arm as actually part of herself. Again, nothing inherently wrong with that but combined with the Penny-nonsense it creates a pattern of seeing machine parts as inherently inhuman and “lesser”.

The point about Cinder is where the argument relies too much on technicality. Sure, Cinder’s new arm isn’t cybernetic, bhut it is still a prosthetic and it is unambiguously presented as evil and corrupting.

So, no, it’s not the fact that Ironwood has prosthetics that makes him less human, they’re simply a symptom of his view of “soft” traits (kindness, empathy, forgiveness, and flesh), as weaknesses to be sacrificed for the “greater good”. Basically, while I know this term gets misused a lot, Ironwood embodies toxic masculinity. The idea that showing any emotion other than rage and pride is “shameful” and “unmanly”. The idea that brute strength matters more than strategy. That taking unnecessary risks to achieve your goal is “brave” and “daring” and not “stupid beyond belief”. Plus, I want to point out that WINTER HERSELF said that Penny (as a robot) was more “human” than her.

Again, this completely ignores how Ironwood and his prosthetics are framed by the narrative. The idea that all of his flaws are based in toxic masculinity and have nothing to do with his disability is just not very supported by the text or by word of God (again, it was the creators themselves who said that losing his arm was “symbolic of losing his humanity).

And Winter’s words to Penny aren’t very positive either. The point being made there is that Penny was always human “underneeth” her robotics, which sounds good until you realize that this still frames her mechanical differences as negative. They are treated as a prison for the “real” Penny and the narrative explicitly tells us that they have made her unable to feel certain emotions.

It’s just that searing off that flesh after breaking his own Aura serves as a good visual metaphor for Ironwood giving up his “softer” traits to accomplish his goals, even if there was a better solution staring him right in the face (i.e. the rings were EXPOSED and he could’ve just nudged them out of alignment to get to Watts).

This feels like a really big reach on their parts to justify their idea of Ironwood as stupid on top of everything else. It relies on assuming things about fictional technology that was never explained in the show itself. I mean, if the rings are so easy to nudge then what is even holding them in place?

Either way it doesn’t really matter because the message of the scene is the same. If the point is to signal that ironwood is willing to give up his softer traits because he is also willing to give up his soft bady, then that also tells the viewer that being able-bodied and being capable of compassion/kindness/etc are synonymous.

It has nothing to do with the metal, and everything to do with the “Mettle”.

I have no idea why they would bring up the fantasy neurodivergence the writers added in through word-of-God as if it somehow makes the show less ableist. “Mettle” as it is described by the writers, is not a character flaw. It is a chronic condition.

Edit: Seriously, I hope you realize that the hatedom makes it VERY hard for any criticism of the show to be taken seriously when the very VALID cricisms are downed out by “Adam should’ve been an anti-hero!” and “Fascism is good, actually!” leading to those of us with ACTUAL constructive criticism getting lumped in with you lot!

I am curious what they think “constructive criticism” looks like since apparently “Hey, constantly equating robot parts with inhuman behavior is shitty and ableist, please stop” doesn’t cut it.

Anyways, fuck this guy. If they want to be taken seriously maybe they should think about why they had to make such a long-ass rant to dismiss criticism of very basic ableist tropes.

#rwby #rwby meta #meta #rwby critical #rwde

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fanfic-inator795 · 4 years ago

Text

Allow me to ramble for a moment:

So, it’s pretty much a fandom consensus that Splinter/Yoshi/Lou Jitsu has the best story and character arc out of all the RotTMNT characters. ...In fact, given that a lot of the other character arcs were rushed through or cut off, you could argue that Splints is the ONLY one with a fully developed arc with the exception of maaaybe Raph and April but that has to do with Nick, not the actual writing so I digress

We see him start off as a blunt and lazy father who occasionally shows a soft side, to learning that he was once a movie star and seeing how much he truly cares about his sons, to learning that the choices he made ended up being a possibly world-ended mistake and seeing him do all he can to fix it like going after the Foot himself and making more of an effort to train his sons, to finally learning the motivation behind his major choices and completely understanding why he is the way he is. It’s a really great story, and it’s a major reason why he’s one of my favorite characters as well as my favorite Splinter interpretation.

...But if there’s one thing that I really wish we could have gotten more clarity on: His time in the Battle Nexus.

Out of all the things in his backstory, this is the most vague. We don’t know how long he was in the Nexus, nor do we see very many of his battles - and the clips we do see are often glorified by Draxum or Splinter. We also see him have two reactions to the Nexus:

A) He saw it as, essentially, an extension of his stardom days. He saw the Nexus as a means of gaining glory and praise despite being trapped, trying to turn a negative into a positive, and being perfectly fine with having yokai fans who love him for his fighting skills. Examples of this are ‘Turtle-Dega Nights’, the latter half of his match with Leo in ‘Many Unhappy Returns’ (”Heh, still got it~!” + him doing a pose as the audience cheers) and ‘Hidden City’s Most Wanted’, with him being clearly touched by the mural a fan made of him.

and B) He saw it as cruel and pointless fighting, and was absolutely MISERABLE there, to the point where what was once his talent and something he was clearly proud of and enjoyed was something he wanted to turn his back against for good. Examples of this are ‘Goyles, Goyles, Goyles’, his explanation in ‘Many Unhappy Returns’, and Draxum’s claim in ‘Hidden City’s Most Wanted’ that he had become a “shell of a man” after a while despite still being a strong and talented fighter, which we saw ourselves in GGG.

Now, let me make this clear that I do NOT think this is bad writing or the show contradicting itself. Humans are complicated, and we’re allowed to have mixed feelings on things - especially when they involve trauma that has to be compartmentalized in order to survive/not have a complete breakdown.

Much like with Big Mama - who Splinter verbally acknowledges is a terrible person and knows it’s foolish to trust her, yet because of their history, how much he once loved her and how great their ‘pre-kidnapping days’ were, he can’t help but miss her/show a bit of affection towards her, being willing to save her and being unable to completely hate her - Splinter’s mixed feelings towards the Nexus makes sense. It was both a source of pride when he literally had nothing else, as well as a source of shame as the fighting continued for years and years.

However, at the end of the day... a lot of what I just said was simply implied by the show.

While it makes sense that it WOULD happen, we don’t really get to see Lou transition from enjoying the glory and challenge of the Nexus to seeing it as cruel and pointless. Was his spirit simply broken down after several years of nonstop fighting or was it one particularly bloody fight that triggered a change of heart? And without actually seeing that transition and only having it be implied, if you’re not thinking about it analytically/in context or simply don’t want to, it very well COULD be written off as bad or contradictory writing.

A major example of this is how many people point to GGG as being a bad or contradictory episode. I don’t agree with this take at all and, honestly, I think a lot of the backlash came from people wanting a longer history between Lou and Draxum (no judgement, I had that headcanon too) because, as far as I’m concerned, Lou agreeing to be taken makes perfect sense to me in context.

Imagine you’re in Lou’s shoes: You’ve been fighting battle after battle for at LEAST ten years if not more. You’re tired and are refusing to fight anymore, meaning you’ve pretty much resigned yourself to two fates. You either change your mind and force yourself to fight on and eventually die at the claws of a yokai, or you keep your vow of non-violence and die alone in a cell. Essentially, no matter which one you pick, your life is over and your ending isn’t exactly going to be a happy one, but at least with the latter you can die with SOME honor (hence the vow of non-violence).

But then these cute lil’ goyles come in and say, “Hey, you wanna come with us to be part of our boss’ weird, unsafe experiments?”. It’s crazy, and will most likely result in a painful death (which you’ve already accepted p much) but honestly, this is the best option - because if you’re dead or stuffed in a jar or whatever, at least you won’t have to fight anymore. It’s only after Lou meets his future sons and finds something (or four someones) that isn’t just his survival and that is worth fighting for does he get his survival instinct back. So yeah, while his nonchalance and flippant reaction to it might have seemed jarring at first, the more you think about it, the more it makes sense.

(Also, remember, while he may have played a hero in his movies, Yoshi was NEVER really a ‘hero’ in a traditional sense until he found his sons, with nearly all of his choices being made due to very human reactions and motivations/needs, none of them being selfless until it was time to save the Turtles)

HOWEVER, again because we didn’t get to see that transition from “Glory-Happy Movie Star Turned Gladiator” to “Jaded and Hollow Warrior with Nothing Left to Live For”, I can understand why some people would miss the reasoning behind the character and story changes just because they were so subtle and didn’t have a ton of time in the forefront, instead just being implied.

BUUUUT because that shift in Lou’s character is such an important catalysis in both his backstory and the show’s story as a whole, being the thing that leads him to Draxum’s lab in the first place as well as just being another important chunk of Splinter’s character (as well as another element that kinda parallels him with Leo), it really is a shame that this transition was just kinda brushed over as “Oh yeah, being stuck in a death arena decade for a decade would probably mess a person up pretty badly, even if they did like fighting”.

Soooo yeah, tl;dr: I still LOVE Splinter’s story and how we saw his transition throughout the show from “Homer Simpson as a Rat” to “Jackie Chan with a Tragic Backstory” to a truly realized and fleshed out (but still chill, awesome and unique) Hamato Yoshi... but I really REALLY wish that the part of his backstory involving him in the Nexus got a bit more focus and was a bit more fleshed out.

(and yeahhhh, that would lead to this lighthearted show being a bit more angsty, but at the very least it would be interesting angst that has a purpose)

#rottmnt #splinter tmnt #lou jitsu #hamato yoshi #rise of the tmnt #PLEASE read if you can and give me your thoughts #especially given that I talk about what I guess is a 'controversial episode' in this #and also I just really like having in-depth analytical discussions about cartoons w/ people lol

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ahalal-uralma · 3 years ago

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Also, if you really had some self-worth, or self-esteem, or whatever, you would appreciate yourself the way you are, instead of trying to desperately imitate or even look like all those women you disdain so much. So shut the fuck up! Stop trying to project your own problems on others, because deep down you seem to be way more insecure than me, or any other girl i know. The difference between you and them is that you're borderline sociopath.

@vestige-of-thorns

First of all, you can not diagnose someone with a mental illness without being fully certified and following through legal procedures. You do not even know myself, my medical history or life experiences enough to diagnose me. I am not a psychiatrist, but pretty certain someone must be a complete sociopath or they must not. What you are suggesting I am is an oxymoron.

I do not deny I can have emotional and mental tendencies to contradict myself, but it’s kind of difficult to possess a personality disorder that is classified with “having a few or complete lack of emotions” simultaneously with a disorder that “can’t control their emotions.” You can’t have too much of what you don’t have.

If someone has sociopathy, they are classified under ASPD. You can not borderline being that. Being borderline is something else entirely. A professional can diagnose someone as BPD, with symptoms associated to sociopathy, but that isn’t the same thing as experiencing full ASPD; or vice verse. You can not partially have these mental illnesses.

ASPD and BPD can share similarities, but they can contradict one another, too. Ultimately, you are attempting to accuse me of a disorder that cancels itself out. I’m either mentally ill to you or I am not? Make up your mind. Besides, these things are not to be stigmatized and degraded to an insult. Your mindset is proving to be the real insult here. You have an absolute lack of empathy and maturity, but that doesn’t shock me given the ideologies typically shared by your group and the individuals in it.

For context, some of the examples you would find within a look of your friend Tessa’s blog:

I think if you gave a dime for every single time something negative, stereotyping, sexist, agist or blatantly ableist came out of this girl’s head, we could solve world hunger.

Also, this next post was reblogged by the same woman who in recent times people have come forward telling me she’s sending lies about me into their inboxes regarding my past.

She is using private messaging to send them cropped screenshots of exchanges in which she had with me from two years ago; the only time I’ve ever spoken to her, and she attempted to lie to me and traumatize me over the idea my ex wanted to cheat on me with her. And she’s trying to convince people with it that is her proof that I’m crazy. No, it just proves you are a pathological liar and narcissistic jerk.

When I see her share this, it further validates my belief that her aim was to scar me. If you want to talk about manipulation, then this girl is a genuine example.

Keep messing around and trusting her and find out the hard way like I did. If I were you, I would not even dare bring up having a bf to her ever. She will go after your bf and paint herself the victim. She will always have her own agenda to fill. She’s not an angel and doesn’t care about protecting women, especially if they make her feel competitive towards men. She gets a high off of rivalry and you’re just feeding it.

And don’t think I’m not aware of the “she’s a crazy girl who wanted some vampire wedding with her ex even though they barely knew each other” story. I know all about that lie.

I’m sure she will not show anyone the proof of her being the one who came at me demanding her to be invited to the vampire wedding. I told her that I was only with him for about two or three months at the time and wasn’t ready for thoughts of marriage. I just wanted to start the relationship slowly in a healthy manner. She harassed me to promise to invite her anyway and hours later, when she thought I went to sleep, she proceeded to swamp my inbox with messages about my ex love wanting her. “I’m so sorry to do this to you.” Are you? Are you honestly? No. She wasn’t sorry and no apology by this point will ever be accepted. Ever.

She’s retaliating against me after all this time, because you threw her a bone. It’s just her way of getting back at me for not reciprocating her false savior complex, like I didn’t have evidence she was trying to hit on said ex-bf herself. She’s just mad she got rejected by both parties she tried to toy with. She needed the ego boost and neither of us gave it to her.

I think you and I both know, your biggest pet peeve with me is my strong sense of self worth. You repeatedly try to destroy it to no avail. You try to control other people’s perceptions in the hopes that somehow that will break me down. You keep ignoring the fact I don’t care. Only thing I care about is if you are using me to hurt and manipulate kind and harmless people. You have used me to attack writers, photographers, and other creatives.

I need you to realize that nothing you do will ever work, because I do not depend on others for approval or validation. It pisses you off that whether my content reaches 10,000 likes or none at all, it makes no huge difference to me. I’m content with who I am and what I do. It’s taken me years of hard work to build up that kind of esteem. I had to unlearn a lot from very young of an age. I am grateful I unlearned most of it, before social media was existent.

I see how damaging social media is for mental health and those who depend their happiness on acceptance through it. Did you know using an electric device (ie. phone, computer) actually affects your serotonin and melatonin levels? It actually affects the chemicals of your brain. It has to do with the false daylight affect and constant exposure is harmful.

There is a reason many site’s like this one have adapted to darker dashboard settings. It looks all very innocent, or they will hope you think so, but it’s a marketing tactic. They want to give you false security and relief.

Do not get me wrong, however, I will personally encourage people to use the darker settings, because it has it’s small benefits, but you have to realize how small they truly are. You can research it as there are plenty of studies on this.

These sites need your traffic to continue to gain funds through ad revenue and clicks. So they need to offer features that make you forget for a little longer that the danger is still present. It can create things like depression and insomnia in those who never had them. Or it can worsen existing symptoms without detection. Darkness palettes simply slow down the process, but they don’t erase the effects of technology.

This is why people experience the highs and lows that they do to extremes. Being reliant on superficial attention via a virtual world is so toxic and self-depreciating. Your mind is already being manipulated the moment you turn the screen on. You need to practice and discipline yourself to awareness to defeat this kind of force. You are living in an insecure society that wants to condition you into a robot and to fear anyone who rejects this kind of reality.

People talk a lot about the negative effects of other addictions like alcohol and drugs, but no one ever talks about the addiction to social media or usage of electronic devices. It causes serious symptoms like panic attacks in those who feel they are being deprived access. It ruins your cognitive and social skills. You begin to speak like you do not have a filter, because your mind isn’t capable of forming one. After years of healing, I still struggle with my filter.

I was around 15-17 years old when I suffered spirals from denied internet access. It’s scary when you are that young, or anything close, because your body is struggling to adapt to important hormonal changes and this addiction is disrupting your human growth. It makes you feel easily excitable and chaotic.

Yourself and Tessa show huge symptoms of this addiction across many of your media posts and in general with how you convey yourselves to people online. You express yourself in a state of mania and that’s not an accident. It’s a serious symptom of this illness. Being aggressive, not knowing how to exercise discernment and being constantly hyperbolic in speech are all part of this pattern.

A balanced individual with only casual internet exposure, doesn’t go on tangents everyday to the public with every thought on display like a garden blown up with debris. Your discussions should look like the modest lawn with the smiling gnome and a few flower pots. Maybe, one of the pots has a small crack, because you’re not perfect and make a mistake once in a while. But, that is not how it is with either of you. I feel like I’m walking on glass where grass should be. I would rather not look at your lawn.

Also, I think your friends are pretty, but they’re not that pretty. You need to clean your energy of massive negativity. It will never make you more beautiful to be hateful of others. I am very happy in my own skin, too. I am content and not changing how I look just because you can not stop fantasizing yourselves wearing and controlling my body.

Projecting? I am not the one coming into your inbox, despite being blocked. You are actively breaking site terms to bypass being blocked. I have you, Marilia blocked for more than five months. I have Tessa blocked for two years and counting. Yet, at least one of you sends me hate messages. Both of you stalk me as you can not resist talking about my personal content and contacts. Here’s screenshots of both of your URL’s on my blocked list.

If I was stalking you, I wouldn’t be trying to block you; it creates several inconveniences, which you know all too well as I’ve blocked you from continuing to steal my posts to spit pointless vitriol. I could have chosen to do the same or worse to any of you, but obviously I have not. Unlike you, I have better things to do with my life than dedicate it to people I do not like or trust. You will never be worthy of my time and energy, no matter how much you insist.

I’m not interested in you or your friends. I have my own garden to cultivate and a collective of lovely fairies and dashing dragons to share it with. You’re just angry I will never invite you to the garden party.

#ask #asks #answered #drama

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dreamersleeps · 4 years ago

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So, as someone whose father is very similar to Endeavor, I've never understood the notion that Horikoshi is trying to whitewash or excuse his abuse by giving him a character arc. Abusers are awful people, but it's not often that they're one-dimensional villains. Nobody ever talks about how confusing it is when your abuser wakes up and sees the damage they've caused, much less when they clumsily try to make ammends. It seems fans would rather it all be simple, when it's anything but in reality

/2 Are there ways it can be handled better? Of course. But a writer making an effort to explore the complexities of abuse through all its angels is far from abuse apology. It’s much more respectful (imo) to treat the situation like the confusing, complicated mess it is in reality, rather than reduce it to some simple cartoonishly evil bullshit that either limits the survivors of his abuse to being lifelong victims, or enables the continued abuse perpetuated by a former victim (i.e., Dabi)

Hello, I’d like to thank you for sharing your thoughts and opinions. I was actually surprised to open up Tumblr to see your messages in my inbox. I spent the past couple of days sitting on and thinking about it. I’m not sure if you were asking for my thoughts and opinions, but I’ve finally sat down and written my response. It’s late at night so I apologize if there are any statements below that are poorly worded or expressed.

As you express, it’s a very complicated topic as a whole, because Endeavor, or Todoroki Enji is a complicated character.

I can not and will not claim that I understand abuse like those who have experienced it. Additionally, It’s not in my place to tell people how to feel or think. However in response to what you shared, I will give some of my thoughts as a reader and fan of BNHA on the topics surrounding Endeavor. (Btw to the anon: some of what I have to say below will be my general opinions about the topic as a whole.)

When I try to write meta and other analysis pieces, I try my best to go back to the manga and base my analysis and arguments on the (official) translations instead of my opinions and thoughts from the beginning. I sometimes have to go back and re-read chapters to remind myself what is “canon” and then try to understand and express my interpretations on the matter. This is not to talk down on those who do not do this: this is just something I do for myself. I am most definitely influenced greatly by what others have to say but I also want to figure out my own interpretation of the story and characters.

So, as someone whose father is very similar to Endeavor, I’ve never understood the notion that Horikoshi is trying to whitewash or excuse his abuse by giving him a character arc.

I personally never really saw it as Horikoshi trying to excuse Endeavor’s abuse by giving him a character arc as well. As many others have stated, I don’t see it as a “redemption arc,” because it isn’t.

I think that we all have to remember the diversity of the fans and readers of this and other fandoms. There are those who can personally relate to or understand what the Todoroki family has gone through, and others who are unable to. Those who are unable to fully understand certain experiences but can sympathize with the characters however even then, this lack of knowledge or exposure to the topic has led to people accidently expressing opinions that hurt or offended others. Additionally, based on what I’ve seen and read on Tumblr, there is quite a wide range of differing viewpoints from those those who can relate to the experiences of the Todoroki family.

Abusers are awful people, but it’s not often that they’re one-dimensional villains. Nobody ever talks about how confusing it is when your abuser wakes up and sees the damage they’ve caused, much less when they clumsily try to make amends. It seems fans would rather it all be simple, when it’s anything but in reality.

Abuse is complex. There is a very wide range of complicated feelings, emotions, thoughts and opinions that surround it. Everyone has a reason as to why they feel or think the way they do. Because we all have had different experiences and reactions to the events of our lives, we can not expect everyone to think similarly.

Given that BNHA or shounen manga in general is catered towards a younger audience (compared to, lets say seinen manga) and Horikoshi is working with topics that are difficult to read or understand even for adults, I’d argue that part of the discourse may result from that.

It seems like when we say that we like a certain character, people tend to automatically assume then that we approve of what they stand for and what they’ve done. I first watched the first two seasons of BNHA before I began reading it. I absolutely hated Endeavor in the beginning, however after I caught up in the manga and began to follow the chapter releases each week, ultimately the characters that really pulled me in to the story was Endeavor, Hawks, and Bakugou, arguably some of the most controversial characters of the series.

Are there ways it could be handled better? Of course. But a writer making an effort to explore the complexities of abuse through all its angles is far from abuse apology. It’s much more respectful (imo) to treat the situation like the confusing, complicated mess it is in reality, rather than reduce it to some simple cartoonishly evil bullshit that either limits the survivors of his abuse to being lifelong victims, or enables the continued abuse perpetuated by a former victim (i.e Dabi)

What truly drew me in was the complexities that came with their characters. I haven’t personally experienced abuse however I have lived through other experiences to recognize in my own understanding that life is both so negatively and positively complicated, confusing and messy. Some people want to see Endeavor fall, and others hope to see him actually change. These wishes are shaped by what we’ve seen or experienced throughout life.

We like simple, clear cut, perhaps one dimensional characters because it’s easier to form an opinion about them. It seems like we struggle with characters like Endeavor and others because we are sometimes faced with the contradicting collision of our own thoughts, morals and beliefs with the actions and story of these characters.

For some reason a lot of my analysis posts have revolved around Endeavor, Hawks, and Dabi and if anyone is interested, I personally believe that as much as we may love a character, whoever it may be, actions should and will be met with consequences. Tragedy does not excuse one’s actions. They may explain one’s actions but we are responsible for and should be held accountable for the consequences that result from it.

If anyone was thinking it, this all does not mean that I think Horikoshi should be exempt from critique. And as you ask and answer, “Are there ways it could be handled better? Of course.” Additionally as I have written on the top of my blog,

There will be posts found here that you may not agree with, however different perspectives are what keeps the meta conversation going.

I think that many of us would prefer it if people would refrain from accusing, insulting or bullying Horikoshi and other fans because of their thoughts and opinions. Although it is understandable that it is difficult when we respond to the story and others emotionally, taking part in these types of activities is not the same as critiquing something.

Boku no Hero Academia is still an ongoing manga. We get one chapter every one or two weeks at a time and so we only get little snippets of the full story. Based on new info and what we’ve read in past chapters, we make predictions, assumptions and have expectations about the future. However, I think that we all have to remember that the story of Enji, Rei, Touya, Fuyumi, Natsuo and Shouto is not complete yet. We are still in the midst of an unfolding narrative that Horikoshi is working closely with to present his readers.

#endeavor #todoroki enji #thoughts #cw abuse #luna answers

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starrysnowdrop · 4 years ago

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Hey there! I don't know how to write this so I hope you won't mind my awkward phrasing XD

I've see a lot of negative posts about the Sorrow of Werlyt Quest Line, some even pretty aggressive. Now I feel so bad for liking it, I love the Siblings and how Gaius turns out to be an actually somewhat good Dad. I like the fights a lot, especially the second one. Had massive fun with posing and fooling around. I also love how the Villain is just that, a mean bastard who deserves some stab wounds.

But now I'm desperately searching for other people who like this quest line. Long story short... I've just wanted to ask how you see the story arc 😔 sorry again for writing so much nonsense 💜

Hi sweetie, thank you so much for reaching out to me @xxcrowfeatherxx! Before I begin my essay long answer, thank you so much for the amazing ask!

First, please don’t feel bad for what you enjoy, or begin to think that your opinion is invalidated because some are really vocal about what they dislike. You are allowed to enjoy the Werlyt storyline despite the fact that there are some who dislike it. Also, please don’t take my opinions as gospel either. Regardless if my opinions are similar or contradict your own opinions, please go on enjoying the Werlyt content! With that being said, let’s get into it, shall we?

My Thoughts on The Sorrow of Werlyt Up to Patch 5.4

I think I will get the less controversial aspects of Werlyt out of the way and say I’m in LOVE with the fact that we are fighting the weapons from FFVII. VII is one of my favorite games in the FF series, so I have been hyped since Ruby Weapon was announced. I absolutely loved all of the weapons and their respective battles, with Ruby giving me utter chills with Nael van Darnus popping out of the weapon all gooey, then the absolutely EPIC Sapphire duty that is taken right out of my childhood fantasies of wanting to pilot a gundam! Emerald Weapon’s trial even on normal mode was so much fun, and it tested my ability to stay alive and dodge all the mechanics really well. And just seeing the VII weapon designs in full HD quality just makes me squeal with joy every time.

Now, for what you are probably waiting for me to comment on: the Werlyt story. Obviously since we haven’t seen it through to completion, I can only comment on how it’s going so far through 5.4, so my opinions may change down the road. That being said, I don’t hate the storyline, but it’s more in the execution of certain plot points that annoy me.

For example, I adore that we are exploring Gaius’ past and the reveal that he had more “adopted” children, as it shows the kind of person Gaius really is behind the armor so to speak. I don’t hate that the Raen kids are there, or that Gaius seems to be on his way to having a full redemption arc, unlike some more vocal people have said on Twitter recently. I’m actually all for a redeemed Gaius, I just hope they do it well, and not just brush over certain things... unfortunately it seems so far that they have.

Not sure if you’ve seen the meme going around, but after Severa explained her past to Gaius, he had full shocked Pikachu face, right? That bothers me, because how can he NOT know that a majority of pure blooded Garleans look down on other races as inferior? I mean, Cid knows, how can Gaius be all shocked about this? I understand that Gaius may not be aware of all the dealings going on in other legions, sure, but the overall ideals of the Garlean Empire even talk about “subjugating primitive peoples” (that’s an Emet quote by the way for the reference), so that sounds like half-assed writing to me. It seems to me that they are painting Gaius as if his biggest sin is being ignorant of the problem instead of him coming to terms with himself being part of said problem.

There’s also the huge issue of what sounds like victim blaming Livia sas Junius for how she turned out to be. Millisandia’s friend explains to you that Gaius always tried to keep Livia at arm’s length because she was getting obsessive over him and trying to keep the others from getting near him. Well, Livia was another of the “adopted” children as well, so if anyone is to blame here it’s Gaius, not Livia. Yeah, “keeping her at arm’s length” by making her his right hand! Talk about mixed signals here. If he knew something was up about Livia’s behavior, he should have done something about it to help the situation, instead of rewarding her for her devotion instead.

Also, others have brought up the point that the Werlyt storyline with Gaius and the Raen “adopted” children is sort of redundant when this has already been explored in Cid’s backstory, and I agree to a point, but not fully. The fact that Gaius takes in children and raises them like they were his own is not new to Gaius’ story certainly, as Cid tells the WoL that “He was there for me father, when you were not”, but it’s not explored that much more than that. And as we know, Cid defects and leaves Garlemald to fight for Eorzea instead of following Gaius. Therefore, it’s interesting that the Raen children look to Gaius as an example instead of what Cid did, so I actually like that we have been given more exploration into the backstories of these characters in this storyline.

There’s also the fact that people have been critical about Cid seemingly forgiving Gaius for everything he’s done and just brushing it all aside like it’s no big deal in this storyline. I guess people get that impression when Cid tells the WoL that when he saw Gaius again in Praetorium, he doesn’t know why he wasn’t that mad at him like he thought he would be. Now, I need to go back and screenshot this conversation just to be certain of the details, but the impression I got was that Cid had mixed emotions about Gaius, but he was willing to put it aside for the greater good (ie: defeating the Weapons that will kill all of Eorzea). Also, Gaius practically raised Cid himself, and in a lot of ways, Gaius was more of a father figure to Cid than Midas ever was. So does this make Cid’s feelings towards Gaius complicated? Absolutely! Gaius still feels like a father to him, so I believe Cid gets a pass for having mixed emotions about the whole situation. Not to mention that Gaius wasn’t the one that almost killed him... but anyway.

I haven’t talked too much about Valens yet, but he’s so creepy and freaks me out, and that’s a great thing! He’s definitely a change from our more sympathetic villains we’ve had lately with Emet and Elidibus, so I’m actually happy about that as well. I honestly can’t wait till that piece of shit dies!

I know I made this way longer than anyone probably cares to read, but I’m honored that you asked me for my thoughts on Werlyt and I’ll be happy to talk about it anytime with you! Once again, thank you so much for the ask!

#asks and replies #xxcrowfeatherxx #ffxiv spoilers #shadowbringers spoilers #sorrow of werlyt spoilers #sorrows of werlyt spoilers #patch 5.4 spoilers #5.4 spoilers #sorrow of werlyt #gaius van baelsar #gaius baelsar #cid nan garlond #cid garlond #once again thank you so much for the ask!!

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iacon-stargazer · 3 years ago

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THE POSITIVE & NEGATIVE: MUN & MUSE

fill out & repost ♥ this meme definitely favors canons more, but i hope oc’s still can make it somehow work with their own lore, and lil’ fandom of friends & mutuals. multimuses pick the muse you are the most invested in atm.

tagged by: stolen from @oneshallfall like.... months ago. im a slow gremlin hjksd. it's been in my drafts and i finally decided to finish the last few sections while working on clearing them out

tagging: steal it

MY MUSE IS. canon / oc / au / canon-divergent / fandomless

is your character popular in the fandom? YES / NO.

is your character considered hot™ in the fandom? Well.../ NO / IDK. (i know optimus is but i don’t really... know about orion? i have seen a handful of fanartists who turn him into a very sexualized moe baby but i’m not sure about the fandom at large)

is your character considered strong in the fandom? YES / NO / IDK.

are they underrated? YES / NO. (lmao there’s like no fan content with him unless it’s with megatronus)

were they relevant to the main story? YES / NO.

were they relevant to the main character? YES / NO / THEY’RE THE PROTAG.

are they widely known in their world? YES / NO. (not yet.... lol)

how’s their reputation? GOOD / BAD / NEUTRAL.

HOW STRICTLY DO YOU FOLLOW CANON?

This... this is a trick question in this goddamn mess of a continuity. That said, I try my absolute best to make my portrayal coherent with the TFP show... even if said show contradicts itself at times. I take inspiration from the earlier parts (the thirteen primes section) of the Covenant of Primus for his origin backstory, but ignore the rest of the Covenant since it makes absolutely no sense with his characterization in... literally anything else. I’ve peeked at Exodus and it utterly sucks, but I’ve picked up bits and pieces of concepts that originated there just from spending time in the fandom. Aside from that... I spend a ton of time thinking about how to weave everything together in a way that both makes sense and makes for a character development arc.

SELL YOUR MUSE! (aka try to list everything, which makes your muse interesting in your opinion to make them spicy for your mutuals.)

Orion is genuinely kind, thoughtful, and introspective, very loving of the world around him.

He’s also a more complex character than is initially obvious - despite mostly being good sweet pure baby nerd he’s still flawed, with many of those flaws being his strengths put into the wrong situation. His strong morals can lead to dogmatism, and he’s only slightly less likely to deliver lectures than Optimus. His determination to be kind and help everyone can come off as unintentionally patronizing at times; he has a very “well-intentioned semi-privileged middle class” perspective that he’s not always self-aware of. However, he’s also willing to look at himself critically and learn/adapt.

Essentially, he has many of the same traits as Optimus... just more or less apparent and/or developed. He's less confident than he eventually becomes through his future experience with leadership, wanting to change the world for the better but sometimes struggling to ground his plans in reality—something that continues to apply, but with reduced intensity and frequency over time. Idealistic cinnamon roll will eventually develop some realism, though never really quite enough. His selflessness remains a strength for now, but we know that eventually it will dip into martyristic tendencies.

NOW THE OPPOSITE! (list everything why your muse could not be so interesting (even if you may not agree, what does the fandom perhaps think?)

He could be potentially ‘boring’ in some senses. he’s the polite, considerate ‘next door’ type, who has for most of his life has just lived as a very average middle caste nobody. He’s more laid-back than he eventually becomes as optimus, but where others might get into trouble and shenanigans he’s most likely to just express concern. And since I try to keep him at least mostly ic, even with non-serious posts, this can derail ‘fun’ stuff and I fear dissuade some interaction.

While I try my best to give him realistic flaws that work with his character, he could still be seen as a little too good. very kind, understanding, forgiving, patient, considerate... almost endlessly so. A lot of my “he’s so good and pure” interpretation comes from using his having been the thirteenth prime as backstory, where he was pretty much the epitome of that, but some might not like the “he was a literal deity in a past life” idea for its “super special chosen one protagonist” elements.

His responsiveness to his environment can also be a downside. He’s not the type to start things; he just reacts and responds, standing his ground and finding himself when things get crazy around him. without megatronus, he may have eventually attempted political campaigning, but it wouldn’t have gotten very far. He needs to have more intense characters or events around him for major plots to really go places. Without those nothing would ever happen besides slice of life fluff, because he’s content with that kind of life.

WHAT INSPIRED YOU TO RP YOUR MUSE?

Honestly I just wanted to write op/ratch fhsjkdjsdh. But I also wanted to be able to interact with a variety of muses and so I chose Orion over Optimus because he’s not so emotionally closed off, which I figured would give more flexibility beyond the handful of characters op would reasonably have close personal and/or plot-important relationships with. Also, I can relate to him on a thought-process level which lets me get into his head easily, which additionally made him an appealing choice for my first real rp muse.

WHAT KEEPS YOUR INSPIRATION GOING?

I just love him so much, especially with the layers of his character I've built up around him. I don't always have inspiration to write or rp, but I think about him a lot. When I do find motivation to write, it's generally out of wanting to continue to work on developing him and just having a chance to express his characterization.

SOME MORE PERSONAL QUESTIONS FOR THE MUN.

do you think you give your character justice? YES / NO.

do you frequently write headcanons? YES / NO.

do you sometimes write drabbles? YES / NO. (i should do it more...)

do you think a lot about your muse during the day? YES / NO.

are you confident in your portrayal? YES / NO. (at least most days fhsdhfskj)

are you confident in your writing? YES / NO. (it waxes and wanes. I know I'm a good writer but I could still be better...)

are you a sensitive person? YES / NO.

DO YOU ACCEPT CRITICISM WELL ABOUT YOUR PORTRAYAL?

I’ll be honest; I’ve never gotten criticism. I haven’t been here very long in comparison to some and I’ve never been that popular, so I figure I’m pretty easy to just ignore. I guess how I would feel about it would depend on what it was and how it was delivered, though I like to think I would be reasonable regardless

DO YOU LIKE QUESTIONS, WHICH HELP YOU EXPLORE YOUR CHARACTER?

yes? yes absolutely?

IF SOMEONE DISAGREES TO A HEADCANON OF YOURS, DO YOU WANT TO KNOW WHY?

I would be curious to hear their reasoning, but I think enough about how everything fits together that chances are I would agree to disagree

IF SOMEONE DISAGREES WITH YOUR PORTRAYAL, HOW WOULD YOU TAKE IT?

Depends on if their disagreement makes sense. Maybe I’ll give back my own reasoning for why I characterize the way I do. Maybe I’ll just agree to disagree, if their view is just totally different from mine. If they have valid points I’ll probably overthink it and spiral into self doubt. In all cases I’ll spill my thoughts to friends on discord.

IF SOMEONE REALLY HATES YOUR CHARACTER, HOW DO YOU TAKE IT?

......Orion in general or? ... fhsjkdhf...... Well if it was mine specifically that might hurt lol. But at the same time.... I doubt i’d agree with their takes either so... fair enough.

ARE YOU OKAY WITH PEOPLE POINTING OUT YOUR GRAMMATICAL ERRORS?

Sure. I’m good at grammar so if something glaring is there it’s probably a typo I missed and I’ll be grateful for the chance to edit it out before more people see it lol

DO YOU THINK YOU ARE EASY GOING AS A MUN?

Yeah. I’m pretty quiet most of the time because I just don’t have energy to talk to a lot of people, and I never want to get caught in drama. I honestly wouldn’t know what to do in a situation like that. I tend to avoid conflict, I’m quick to apologize, and polite with anyone I don’t know very well.

#;the art student behind the muse {ooc}#;as for myself... {tag game}

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aspoonofsugar · 5 years ago

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Hi! How are you doing? Not sure if it's already been asked, but what are your top 10 favourite canon couples?

Hello!

I am doing fine, thank you! How are you doing?

It is alright, nobody has asked this before, so I can answer! That said, I am not really a hardcore shipper, so I am not sure I will come up with 10 pairs :’‘‘). I’ll do my best though! Also I have interpreted the term “canon” very freely.

As usual, here they are in no particular order:

1) Claire Stanfield and Chane Laforet (Baccano!):

I love their dynamic because they are fundamentally two almost opposite individuals who end up together in a surprising way. On one hand Claire thinks that he is the protagonist not only of his own story, but of the whole world. As a matter of fact he believes that the world is nothing more than a dream of his. Ironically, it is because of this selfish delusion that Claire is able to embrace the whole world:

“So what if I'd spare him? In my mind it's the certainty in myself that I possess which allows me to have that kind of mercy or compassion. There's no wavering on that point. It's fixed like the stars. The fact is I'm never gonna be killed! So remember this: mercy and compassion are virtues that only the strong are privileged to possess. And I am strong.”

On the other hand Chane has chosen to be nothing more than her father’s puppet. She is a satellite character in her own life and can’t absolutely think to live as a protagonist. If Claire’s world is too big, Chane’s too little because it has only her and her father in it. What is more, Chane has gone out of her way to make sure that it stays that way. For example, she asked her father to take her voice away and has not learnt alternative ways to communicate (like sign language).

Given this premise, it is interesting that a person so self-centered like Claire puts a person with such a frail sense of self like Chane at the centre of his world. Claire makes Chane, who is not even the lead of her own story, the heroine of his huge world. Claire instead plays a support role in Chane’s story. It is precisely because of this contradiction that their dynamic works. All in all Chane gets to get in contact with the world through Claire. Because of this, she is challenged to grow. This is another interesting difference between them. On one hand Claire is basically like Peter Pan and can’t really grow psychologically. On the other hand Chane is a character who has changed, but who is scared of this change. This is why she tries to actively regress, but she can’t really go back to who she was.

2) Komugi and Meruem (HxH):

I have explained here what I love about them. Their relationship conveys the themes of the chimera ants arc beautifully. I especially like it because it would have been easy to have Meruem grow fond of Komugi because of her kindness and goodness. However, this is not really what happens. The reason why Meruem is so attracted by Komugi is her prowess as a Gungi player. Komugi is not a character who coddles Meruem, but one who challenges him. As a result Meruem’s attraction for her is rooted in respect. Meruem brings out from Komugi her talent and stubborness, while Komugi brings out from him his caring and kind side. Meruem becomes interested in her because of the traits they share and grows to love what makes her different from him.

3) Ash Lynx and Eiji Okumura (Banana Fish):

I like their relationship, but I would have loved for it to be explored even more throughout the story. All in all, they are attracted to each other because they want something the other has. Eiji wants Ash’s initiative and daring personality, while Ash wants Eiji’s freedom and soothing personality. Eiji wants Ash’s ability to fight for himself, while Ash wants Eiji’s talent to heal others instead of hurting them.

Despite this, they are not fully able to grow as they could have because of the violence of the conflict they are in. Eiji makes some steps in the right direction, but the moment a wound incapacitates him he goes back to his more passive behaviour. When it comes to Ash, he is not able to take fligth like he would like because of self-hate. Their ending is tragic, but I wonder if it could have been different. For example, after a meaningful conflict the two of them decide to avoid fighting and to simply enjoy the time they spend together. This is a relatable choice, but a series of things are left unexpressed and because of this they are not really able to overcome their flaws. Maybe, if they had fought a little more and had called each other out more, things could have been different in the end.

4) Claire Nunez and Jim Lake Jr (Tales of Arcadia):

I have talked about them here. They are two very similar people to the point that they have basically the same flaw. They both feel responsible for bad things happening to them and to their friends. This is why they end up trying to fix everything by their own and fail spectacularly. It is nice to see them find help and support by their loved ones. And it is heart-warming that they keep being there for each other.

5) Chidi Anagonye and Eleanor Shellstrop (The Good Place):

Eleanor and Chidi are completely different people and this is why they are perfect to challenge each other. Chidi inspires Eleanor to be more selfless and to open up to others, while Eleanor inspires Chidi to be daring. This is obvious since season 1 and it is a constant throughout the series. Their relationship is a good example of a relationship which is conflictual, but enriching. In order to stay together they (other than escaping hell) must overcome their respective flaws. Eleanor must be vulnerable and let Chidi in her life, while Chidi must be decisive and actively choose Eleanor.

I also like that this is true even in those timelines where they do not develop a romantic relationship. The fact that their relationship is the same, but also slightly differs in each reboot makes it gain a very nice thematic meaning and enriches it. All in all, what Chidi and Eleanor represent for each other is always the same and what changes is the platonic/romantic aspect of the bond.

Finally I like the motif of them leaving messages to their future selves about the other. At the end of season 1, Eleanor writes to herself: “Find Chidi”, while at the end of season 3 Chidi writes to himself: “Eleanor is the answer”. This is a very cool motif which conveys their respective growth thanks to the other. Eleanor who only trusts herself chooses to trust Chidi’s ability to help her. Chidi who has spent his whole life searching for answers and failing to write them down decides that Eleanor is all he needs to find meaning in his life.

6) Roy Mustang and Riza Hawkeye:

Their relationship is my favourite of the whole series. Their characters are beautifully intertwined to the point that they can barely function without the other. This aspect of their bond is not excessively romanticized, but it is presented as a dreadful consequence of the traumatic past they share. At the end of the day Roy and Riza are too highly idealistic people whose ideals were shattered before they could evolve in something more than childish dreams. Despite this, they were able to put the fragments of those great dreams back together and have chosen to sacrifice their personal happiness to realize them.

All in all, Riza and Roy want redemption for their crimes and they find comfort in each other while they try to obtain it. In order to make things better they are ready to sacrifice their own existences and they have given up on the chance of living normal lives as civilians. However, they still have each other.

Roy gives Riza someone to protect, so that she does not fall apart and remains functional, while Riza restrains Roy’s most negative instincts. They make each other better even if they can’t completely overcome the pain of their past. They can just share it with the other.

Finally I especially like the scene where Roy chooses not to transmute humans even if it means Riza will most likely die. As a matter of fact, despite it all, that act is not framed as a betrayal of Riza, but rather as the only thing he can do not to betray her. I love both relationships where a character fixated on an ideal lets go of it because of people and relationships which make a person realize the importance of an ideal. They are both beautiful when well written. Here we are in front of a bond where both aspects are present. On one hand Roy must let go of his desire of vengeance not to lose Riza. On the other hand Roy must let go of Riza not to betray the ideals they share.

In the end theirs is a very tragic and strict relationship, but also a very warm and human one.

7) Kokomi Teruhashi and Saiki Kusuo (Saiki Q):

They are not properly canon since they are not together by the end. However, I think there is enough in the series to support the ship. Anyway, it is still a ship I enjoy a lot (and it is one of the few I feel strongly for, so I am adding it to the list no matter what).

I love their dynamic because it is hilarious, but it could also be surprisingly deep if the narrative wanted to explore it more. Teruhashi is my favourite character of the series because she is a nice subversion of both the yamato nadeshiko trope and of the alpha bitch one. She presents herself as an incredibly beautiful and yet innocent girl, but she is actually very aware of her looks and of others’ reactions. Despite this, she comes along as likeable mostly because she often genuinelly means well despite her being self-centered. Saiki instead projects the image of an average person, but he is actually the most powerful being of the world. In short, Teruhashi and Saiki are both opposite and the same.

They are the same because they both wear a carefully crafted mask. They are opposite because the masks they were are opposite. On one hand Teruhashi’s mask of the perfect girl attracts attention. On the other hand Saiki’s mask of the average guy is meant to make him invisible.

The difference between their two personas is the reason why Saiki wants to avoid Teruhashi at all costs. He wants to be average, so he can’t stay close to a person who attracts so much attention. At the same time, it is clear that Saiki grows to admire Teruhashi specifically because of her ability to always keep her mask up. He knows how difficult it is to realize such a feat and he recognizes Teruhashi’s dedication. Basically Saiki is the only person who knows the real Teruhashi and appreciates her for who she is and not for who she pretends to be.

In short, the series could have done a lot with them if it had wanted to go deeper in their dynamic. Saiki ends up coming to the spotlight multiple times to help Teruhashi, while Teruhashi breaks up her image of perfect girl when close to Saiki.

Unluckily this is the end of the list :’‘‘) I tried to think of other canon couples I enjoy, but even if there are some, I would not call them proper faves. At the same time, there are some ships I enjoy, but they are not properly canon/confirmed to be romantic, so I am not adding them.

Thank you for the ask!

#baccano!#baccano #clairexchane #hxh #komugixmeruem #bf #asheji #trollhunters #clairexjim #royai #fma #chidi x eleanor #the good place #saiki x teruhashi #saiki q #asksfullofsugar #eurekapendragon

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