#a very annoying part of this is it means really good jiang cheng pov that gets into his issues is super thin on the ground

[whetstonefires]

The reason I keep banging the Jiang Fengmian drum so hard is not that he did nothing wrong--he's definitely in contention for best parenting in this book but that bar is in the ground--but because most of the takes I see about him are so extremely bad.

If you want to slag him off for trying to make choices that would hurt no one, and winding up properly protecting no one as a result, that's valid! That's an interesting and text-based critique, which opens into his parallels with Lan Xichen!

If you want to blame him for being weirdly over-invested in Wei Wuxian and Jiang Cheng being bffs, that's fair, that definitely contributed to the weirdness between them. If you want to say he was a poor communicator, that he fundamentally misunderstood his son, that he failed to be emotionally available in a way his kids could get much use out of, even that he should have figured out a way to stop Yu Ziyuan from creating such a hostile environment, all of that is fair game!

If you want to tackle how the worst thing he did to his kids was die I am so interested in how Wei Wuxian went on to abandon A-Yuan by going to his death, and how that might be tied to how his primary adult role model tied him to a boat and went off to a fight he knew he was going to lose.

After his parents had already left him like that once before, presumably less intentionally.

But no, instead I keep seeing that Jiang Fengmian didn't care. That he never expressed affection. That he actively participated in Yu Ziyuan's fucky game of forcing proxy conflict onto the boys instead of constantly trying (and failing) to shut it down, or that he ignored her bad behavior because it didn't affect him, or that he fought with her constantly, or that he was too much of an unmanly coward to stand up to her when she wanted something.

All of which are directly in contradiction to every scene he's in, and several of which manage to invert or erase the actual conflicts between him and his wife that were the source of all that tension.

And which are really interesting, because some of the most intractable elements are ideological--Yu Ziyuan is fundamentally a conservative and Jiang Fengmian seems to want to be an egalitarian, which ofc matched poorly with his hereditary authority as patriarch of a large sect.

The fact that the bit where we get to actually see him failing to parent Jiang Cheng consists of him gently and firmly trying to correct Jiang Cheng's ethics when what was actually needed in that moment was reassurance for the well-founded insecurities that were causing him to be a little bitch, only for Yu Ziyuan to charge in and make everything fifty times worse, is so much more interesting than literally any version of this family dynamic I have seen in fic. It's to the point I'm relieved when writers kill Jiang Fengmian off, because it means they probably won't feel the need to character-assassinate him too badly.

The number of people I've seen come right out and say some variation of 'men can't be abused' is killing me here. No, Yu Ziyuan wanting to hurt her husband does not constitute sufficient proof that he abused her first and deserved it! That's not how anything works!

[robininthelabyrinth]

How would you describe your version of the Jiangs?

See, this gets tricky, because I often write my fics in close-person perspective and that means I write them as how the POV character perceives them to be rather than how they really are. So a fic written in the POV of Jiang Cheng will have a very different Jiang sect than a fic written from Wei Wuxian or a third person’s POV - even though their actions wouldn’t be in any way different.

That being said, my version of Jiang Fengmian and Madame Yu (excluding Jiang Cheng and Jiang Yanli because that would take forever):

Jiang Fengmian is a calm, introverted, laid back person who tends to go with the flow. He hates confrontation and drama, and just wants to be happy, which is reflected in his preference to surround himself with happy people who similarly believe in not letting things bother them. He rarely pursues anything too aggressively because he thinks that’s just setting yourself up for disappointment, and tends to deal with difficult situations by looking for a solution where everyone will leave him alone/continue to play nice, without really thinking too much in the long term or too deeply about questions of right and wrong. If someone starts an argument with him or is annoying him, he will leave rather than engage; if someone does something that only harms him tangentially, he will ignore it in the hopes that it will go away by itself. He is a private person who does not generally share his emotions.

He does not have a happy marriage - he likes his wife a great deal, actually, but their communication styles are so utterly different that he honestly thinks she hates him, even when she’s trying to show affection, because he does not understand that anger/scolding can show care. His own methods of showing affection are often rejected by her (because she in turn doesn’t understand him), and he believes this means that she does not love him. He believes he was in love with either Cangse Sanren or Wei Changze or possibly both, he’s not entirely sure himself, and he regrets their deaths more than anything else in his life - except maybe the realization that his wife does love him, always has, and that he only figured it out right before their deaths.

He is, objectively, a bad father. He favors Wei Wuxian and neglects Jiang Cheng, and lets Jiang Yanli bear most of the emotional burden from that. He does not think of himself as a bad father - he doesn’t really think of himself as a father much at all. He doesn’t see anything wrong with what he is doing because he treats his children like adult friends, so he thinks it’s fine to spend time with the people whose personalities he likes (Wei Wuxian) and less time with those he doesn’t (Jiang Cheng). He is, unknowingly, rather misogynistic, and assumes that Jiang Yanli, who fits his image of a proper woman, is fulfilled by caring for her brothers and not burdened by it; ironically, the women he actually appreciates most are the ones who break his expectations. 

Madame Yu, Yu Ziyuan, is a lonely, highly introverted woman with an extremely strong sense of pride. Her personality is cold and standoffish, coming off as disdainful, and she doesn’t have any mode other than fully engaged and intense about everything. She does not suffer fools gladly, and has a truly nasty turn of phrase that does more damage than she realizes. She is extremely aware of etiquette and class divisions, and is especially angered by disrespect. She was an excellent cultivator in her youth and is an excellent trainer for the Jiang sect, remaining highly respected by her peers, although less so now that she no longer goes out on night hunts; she did not want to stop, but felt she had no choice once she became a mother. She is resentful of the fact that her husband does not involve her more in sect politics, and believes she would do a better job if given the chance, but she would never lower herself to ask because it would risk being rejected.  She misses her home very much, in part because she was last truly happy there, but she’s also extremely proud of being part of the significantly stronger Jiang sect.

She expresses affection through worry (often manifesting as scolding) and through acts of service, such as by trying her best to improve the sect’s reputation or make people stronger. As a result of her own experiences, she believes people need to be toughed up to deal with the cruel realities of the world. She is in love with her husband, who she believes does not love her - she interprets his gifts as trying to buy off her anger, which only makes it worse, his acts of service as condescension, and when he says sweet words to her she is convinced that he is only trying to use her as a ill-fitting substitute for the person he really loves, which also makes her angry. This is in large part because he persists in treating her like she is a soft woman who likes pretty things for the sake of being pretty, which she is not - she is highly practical and likes to look good because she knows it’s another weapon, not because being pretty is fun. Her best friend - who became Madame Jin - has an equally unhappy marriage, which she thinks should give her a cynical view of marriage, but in fact she’s still secretly a romantic at heart.

She is, in many ways, a bad mother. While she loves her children, she also sees them as key to her position as mistress of the Lotus Pier, and anything that challenges that position is disrespect to her - a sore spot. She does not understand how Jiang Yanli seems to be happy with what she is given, a domesticity almost to the extent of acting like a servant, but since it seems like Jiang Yanli likes it, she tries not to interfere. The fact that Jiang Fengmian won’t quash the rumors about Wei Wuxian makes her anxious that he is, in fact, planning on disowning Jiang Cheng in favor of Wei Wuxian, and she hates the fact that Jiang Fengmian prefers Wei Wuxian. She gets this anxiety and anger out by trying to make Jiang Cheng do better in the hope that if he is truly exceptional, the way Wei Wuxian is, Jiang Fengmian will finally like him - and maybe also her. She is aware to some extent that what she is doing is futile and hurting Jiang Cheng, but she cannot seem to stop herself. 

She does not hate Wei Wuxian himself, nor does she mean him any harm - if only her husband were not so partial to him, she would be very pleased with how he’s done as head disciple. She makes sure he has the best possible training and wants to cultivate him to be as strong and smart as possible, in large part because she thinks of him as her son’s future right hand. The main thing that bothers her is that he leads her son in trouble - the issue being lead. If Jiang Cheng were leading Wei Wuxian into trouble, she wouldn’t mind it, but she foresees that it will be a problem in the future; she doesn’t want her son to be a hollow sect leader who is a puppet for Wei Wuxian. 

[inknose]

mdzs read diary part IV, the end

It’s inspiring how much self care wwx is gonna finally get now that his husband will go along with whatever he does, so he’s gotta look out for lwj’s well being if not his own. that is emphatically the STUFF

dragging my hands down I face as I read this, after all these chapters of getting up close and personal with ghouls bleeding from every orifice, slaying ancient beasts, rebelling against the entire cultivation world, the two of them are absolutely paralyzed by middle school crush sleepover math

chicken

he actually drew kissy doodles .... he....

IDK I THINK I JUST DOCUMENTED THIS PART CUZ I WAS STILL SCREAMING you cant expect me to have very useful things to say at this point

this is torture you are both so mushy you are so GONE

This part really stood out to me, it’s an attitude I feel like wwx implies with his inner narration a few times but most clearly says here: he’s not one for allowing himself to exaggerate how bad his circumstances are/could be even a little bit - he’s already lived through some extreme low points and found a way to keep going, so he never makes sweeping statements about what he couldn’t live without (Inner JingYi: you’re supposed to say you’d be lost without him here!!!) Instead he seems to accept as a given that being alive doesn’t guarantee him any pleasantness or joy at all, and as a result his feelings toward being in TRUE LOVE are surprisingly pragmatic, but also colored with such gratitude. There are a lot of things in the novel that struck me, like this, as being just a little to the left of familiar tropes/sentiments, and were more touching for it. Whether it be the influence of culture difference as opposed to what I’m used to reading in most western romance stories, or MXTX’s unique outlook, or a combination of both, it was really refreshing and made me pause over it. Not “I can’t imagine living without you” but “I could be living without you, but instead I get to be with you and I think that’s the best thing that could happen.”

ADJFDKFJ THE UST BEING SO STRONG THAT EVEN THE VILLAIN COMMENTS ON IT IN THE MIDDLE OF EXECUTING HIS EVIL PLANS IS ONE OF THOSE THINGS THAT WILL NEVER FAIL TO MAKE ME LAUGH MY ASS OFF. hes like god damn! here I thought I had problems

it was at this moment that I realized we were doing this Now... I’m still recovering. What a scene. I am so glad I saw the most incredible fanart soon afterwards, bc the fact that someone has already drawn a perfect comic of this part means I don’t have to

I love you so much, you are so annoying, you are perfect... I like how he’s been experiencing openly requited love for all of ten minutes but he’s already figured out how to weaponize it to piss people off

doing!!! his!!! job!!!!!

ahh... it’s a really good story. JGY is a great character. One of the most interesting differences for me between drama watching vs. novel reading experience is that without an actor to bat his vulnerable doe eyes at you and smile faintly with his cute dimples, the book does not go much out of its way to try to lull the reader into a false sense of security around him or *endear* him to you the way the show does. But just by seeing events through wei wuxian’s POV, its still enough to evoke pity or understanding towards him. The overall impression is a bit more detached though, there’s less emphasis on the spectacle of how he could manipulate everyone closest to him and more of a general feeling of resigned tragedy that everyones the worst on this bitch of an earth.

I CANNOT DEAL WITH YOU FOR EVEN ONE MORE SECOND!!!!

I clearly paused to take note of less and less parts at the end & the extras due to: a) too excited to reach the end b) too spicy to photograph and c) too sleepy cuz I kept reading in the middle of the night. but I absolutely took the time for Bro We Are Teens appreciation corner:

I’d absolutely read 40 more extra chapters of their monster-of-the-week field trip antics.

god... poor Jin Ling now basically has to deal with divorced parents that talk shit about each other to him whenever he is saying with one of them. except they are both his uncles. just a disasterhood of all uncles from start to finish. AUUUGH wei wuxian and jiang cheng have fucked me up completely, I dream of them reconciling but I also REFUSE to believe it would ever be easy. let me know if theres a fanfic that absolutely tortures you for decades before they hug

HAHAHA oh no this man ain’t making it to immortality thats for damn sure. HE’S JUST GONNA TRY AS HARD AS HE CAN HIS WHOLE LIFE NOT TO LOOK AT HIM BUT THEYRE *MARRIED* SDLKFJSF ohhhh it’s too funny, like... the mundane domestic family drama IN the fantastical swords and sorcery setting is what really ratchets up these things from amusing to fucking hilarious I think

aaaa the end... final random thoughts? No not final, I would like to please keep discussing at length and exhaustively, all the time please - CQL has gotta be one of the best TV adaptations I’ve seen. ANY adaptation of anything would be lucky to be so good!! reading the novel has just made me appreciate it even more.

- I don’t think I can do justice to what I find most fascinating about comparing the two versions briefly, to do that I need to get drunk and ramble at my friends for hours but... the condensed version is something like this. Really all the significant differences between the two versions (besides the ones which can be attributed to censorship and therefore aren’t worth discussing) are a side effect of the structure of how the story is told - there’s barely anything changed arbitrarily. Aside from having a cold opening, the drama sticks to a very linear version of the story, and I think for a TV show or film, that’s probably the best way to do it. We see everything, we get shocked and tricked and betrayed and surprised along with the characters, we feel the biggest impact at the climactic scenes having experienced all the build-up. The novel on the other hand is not only much more non-linear in WHEN we learn bits and pieces of information, but that information is also obfuscated under wei wuxian’s multiple layers of Unreliable Narratoritis, which are as follows: 1) difficulty remembering things because of personality/avoiding painful memories/actual memory loss, 2) No Homo Goggles still on, and 3) a wry sense of humor that makes the reader unsure of how much they can trust his attitude toward things, especially near the beginning. The experience of reading is a puzzle the reader has to mentally piece together through all of the above listed camouflage, and the puzzle itself is a three-sided mystery: One - How Bad of a guy was Wei WuXian really, and how exactly did all the bad stuff in his life go down; Two - wangxian epic pride & prejudice gambits; Three - political murder mystery. (I love stories like this btw... though I fully admit I’m glad I watched first this time bc it might have taken me a long time to tackle otherwise.) Because of this, where the drama wants to pull you in and submerge you in all the most potent emotional parts, the novel in direct contrast deliberately side-steps around these things and asks that you hurt yourself by filling in the blanks. In fact the more intense emotions and painful memories involved, whether it be his relationship with jiang yanli, his DEATH, the darkest days of war times etc, the more the novel evasively withholds details. I actually really like both styles of storytelling but each one is obviously way better suited to its medium. ANYWAY.... THATS BASICALLY WHERE MY BRAINS AT WHILE IM READING GAY SWORD WIZARD BOOKS

- The extras are so saturated with domestic married bliss that it’s a good thing I stopped taking pictures because I’d just take a picture of every page. this is too much for me to take... I did jump the gun a few times and read a few fanfics while I was still mid-read of the book (I tried to hold out but alas I am mortal) and at one point after finishing I was like “wow what fic was it in where lwj says something cute and wwx kisses him in public but they’re in the corner of the restaurant so no one really sees... OH NO WAIT that was actually in there.” and ... and that’s the LEAST OF IT... *stares into the distance* theyre married wow

- I ofc couldn’t help but see a few vague blogs beforehand so honestly I was braced for something like, wildly ooc for the sake of porn to happen in the extras... I definitely appreciate how the incense burner porn interludes could be uhhh a lot for many people and not my personal cup of tea in terms of smut however [here follows the words of a poisonous frog who has dwelt her whole life in the rainforests of BL] the concept is also surprisingly SWEET SDFLKJF like wwx sees lan wangji’s darkest mixed-up violent teenage fantasies and he’s just like aww babe you had a crush on me!! just... good for them

- I swear I’m not gonna rehash every cute married thing they do but wei wuxian grading papers in the tub........................rEALLY GOT ME

- I want to Draw - ok thats enough if I keep going I’ll just write “wei wuxian grading papers in the tub” seven more times probably

[bloodgarnet]

MDZS Original Mystery Fic Idea

So I came up with this idea for a mystery plot since I was so impressed with all the fic until I read the novel and realised most of it was just minor alterations on canon :/// (still impressive though). I got pretty far in the outline before I realised it would need a lot of minor character interactions and cultural knowledge which I respectively can’t be bothered with and don’t know shit about lol. The premise was also meant to have a lot of happy trolling WWX but most of the scenes turned out pretty serious… There’s probably a 99% chance I’m never going to write this so posting it publicly as free real estate.

Tags: Case Fic, Memory Alteration, Mystery, Plot Heavy, Romance, True Love

Title: Fortune’s Memory OR One Thousand Worries (*from Chinese proverbs)

Summary: Wei Wuxian successfully manages to convince everyone that he is Mo Xuanyu… through absolutely no merit of his own.

Prologue: WWX reflects after his resurrection that even if MXY forgot to state his wishes, he still did a pretty good job—after all, with a totally untested ritual from the branch of cultivation that he invented, who knows how many things could have gone wrong. /foreboding

WWX’s wrist held by LWJ as JC and he argue. Unexpectedly, JC says this is giving him a headache and decides to leave (jin ling says you too, uncle? JC like you ARE my headache, child). LWJ says WWX is coming with him to gusu but WWX argues it and says he doesn’t want to go to such a place with LWJ, whose eyes go cloudy and he suddenly releases WWX, confused. They part ways, but WWX wonders what the heck just happened—unexpectedly lucky! He’s still interested in all the weird things happening though and decides to meet up with wen ning elsewhere.

Meanwhile, LWJ inexplicably feels a profound sense of loss.

JC goes back to Yunmeng with Jin Ling and has trouble remembering things. He tries to recall the culprit of the ghost general incident but can’t picture his face. He tries to scold jin ling but can’t remember what for; jin ling also has trouble remembering. He tells jin ling to go to his room and if he wants sympathy, go to his mother for that. Jin ling freezes and says what are you even talking about. Jiang Cheng blacks out as jin ling screams.

Lan Xichen talks to Jin Guangyao about how both Jiang Cheng and Nie Huaisang have come down with a mysterious illness which affects their memory—possibly a targeted curse at clan leaders, though perhaps a small smattering of rogue cultivators have also been affected. Sadly, it has even affected the Jin heir, Jin Ling, though his is a bit better. JGY reflects since it’s the opposite way, it can’t be the strength of his golden core but rather maybe his youth that makes him resistant as some spells operate that way. LXC thanks him for the advice and worries that LWJ was recently in contact with JC and JL. JGY comments that these unexpected events are the most dangerous.

WWX meets up with wen ning and they discuss what to do: he frees wen ning from chains and needles and says he could go live life if he wants, but WWX is interested in the ghost arm incident. They get wen ning a disguise and hear from locals that nie huaisang and JC have come down sick. WWX frowns and wonders about the current political climate, who knows how many people would want to take down the sect leaders. Then he hears that LWJ is possibly also ill and feels really bad about it for some reason—that’s what makes him decide to investigate himself, putting this over the ghost arm incident. Wen ning asks how to do that and WWX says they need information now more than anything—they must prepare for the upcoming conference which will discuss what is happening.

JGY attends the conference and notices a strange bird outside. He’s seconds away from touching it when LXC calls him and it flies off. They go inside and discuss the potential epidemic; LXC confesses LWJ seems to show preliminary signs but Clarity seems to be helping him remain stable for now. They discuss it’s potential as a contagious epidemic and agree to have healers share findings as well as a group of famed Lan healers (?) visit the other sects with a small entourage in order to compare patients directly. JGY notes that this subject has totally eclipsed the issue of the ghost hand, which tried to escape Gusu Lan but was caught at the barrier with no casualties but many injuries. Also JC has woken and has a clean slate memory and just seems to be much happier??? They decide to keep the whole thing quiet from the public for now to prevent panicking. Conference ends with JGY accidentally revealing that he’s forgotten something important, so he’s infected too, to LXC’s shock. The bird flies away.

Wwx discusses the situation with wen ning at a restaurant (where wen ning is like thank god my tastebuds are dead lol). Wwx says that the situation is bad but not killing anyone so far which is good. Explains to wen ning that the healers probably know this but it can’t be an epidemic because it hasn’t spread enough; it’s far more likely a targeted attack since it’s really only affecting important people. Lan Sizhui and Jingyi enter the restaurant and WWX hides his face by faceplanting in his noodles lol. WWX and wen ning eavesdrop on their plans to escort the healers back from Nie territory to Gusu Lan, noting that LWJ may have gotten worse in the time they were gone. WWX worries and decides he needs to steal a jade token, but for now they have a convenient target for a little spy.

Sizhui and Jingyi report to LXC with the healers who explain that it IS contagious, a qi transmitted virus, but only from the carrier—likely only one since it hasn’t spread far: so it must be someone who has come into contact with all of the people affected fairly recently. Also it seems like an imbalance of energies causing qi deviation. Sizhui reflects this will be hard since the victims don’t remember anything. LXC says that’s somewhere to start, though, and gets disciples/servants to fetch LWJ from seclusion since it’s not contagious. LWJ joins (sizhui happy!) and says that his illness has not progressed at all. LWJ says that the number of potential carriers is too many but to retrace his steps he might as well seek out the rest of the ghost hand’s body as the hand has conveniently pointed in that direction. Sizhui and Jingyi volunteer to go with him along with some other junior disciples; justification that it can be a low-stress learning exercise if nothing else(?) which is what LWJ was doing originally. Then takes out his sword and strikes down the hidden bird which was trying to steal his token – LXC marvels that LWJ broke a rule (no killing) but LWJ says the bird was already dead.

WWX says, “Shit.” WWX talks to wen ning and says that chasing the hand’s body now is dangerous since LWJ will be there—he wants to investigate the victims too in case there’s a demonic element but has an inexplicable bad feeling. Laughs off concerns about memory because his has always been bad. WWX says that his expertise in this area is lacking though and what they really need is a healer who knows about demonic cultivation and wouldn’t run on sight… oh. Wen Ning is like I mean. WWX like would she kill us?? Hmm. They head to Yiling Burial Mounds.

Dead bird makes everyone realise it’s related to demonic cultivation

Filler scene…? Maybe LWJ POV? Tiger seal? Body parts?

Sizhui and Jingyi realise that someone LWJ met right before this happened (along with JL and JC) is MXY, so they should find him!

Wwx and wen ning arrive at the burial mounds and talk while wwx makes chenqing 2 (joke that’s a JC name! But I can’t think of one now lol). He uses it to summon wen qing with inquiry and ask her about it. She says it’s hard to say but given that no one’s died, it may not even be intentional, maybe just a side effect or symptom of something else. WWX says since there’s no change in political power. It does weaken the sects affected temporarily but a widespread attack like this isn’t so good tactically so it could fit. Wen Qing says she’d need to examine a victim herself but would need a body for that and hers is long gone. WWX like wait you would be okay with me getting yours back? Also idk how to do that?? He explains the ritual he used to come back and she frowns. WWX like to accomplish what you suggest would need more power than I currently have in this body… perhaps by repurposing the tiger seal???

And this is where I stopped because I legit can’t remember what happened to the tiger seal at this point in canon. Probably something about Xue Yang but I skipped over his chapters because I wasn’t interested lol. Since there wasn’t really a point to bringing Wen Qing back, I imagine their plan fails but it brings them into the fold with the other characters, and she stays a ghost and has a tearful goodbye with WN at some point near the end or something. Also having to figure out exactly how the whole Nie Mingjue thing would fall apart with both Nie Huaisang and JGY incapacitated, as well as the whole Qin Su thing... blah. Wanted to change the dead bird thing since I was annoyed at myself for copying a fandom trope but couldn’t think of anything better.

Basically the points I wanted to reach were:

Sizhui and Jingyi note that the spell reveals your ‘true colours’ lol

WWX is eventually caught and interrogation reveals that he also has the virus even tho he has a very weak golden core and they realise he must be a demonic cultivator; some pity because he seems so happy without memories of abuse (his happy antics are even kind of familiar... hmm)

Full clarification that WWX is the virus carrier: it’s a golden core imbalance caused by the imperfect resurrection which infectiously causes qi deviation for people who come into contact with his demonic cultivation and triggered by emotional upheaval which is why JC gets the full thing IMMEDIATELY lol

WWX was trolling at first but then actually DOES forget everything (caused by something with LWJ? Maybe a gay panic lol), but still knows his shit and explains that if it’s an imbalance then the opposing yang/yin energy must be demonic in nature so they should just huff a demonic seal or something lol

^ political statement that demonic cultivation isn’t evil, just ~opposite~

Jin Ling has recovered a bit and says he will talk to MXY but is like wait that’s… not him?? like yes I know he forgot everything but it’s really, really Not Him???

Interrogation of JGY’s spotty memory leads to deduction of what scrolls of WWX’s MXY learnt—body sacrifice and summoning

The cure is demonic energy + confessing your sins and being happy you fucks

And then like the one scene I actually had in mind when I wrote this: WWX confused but yelling MXY is not my name!!! And LWJ, on the brink of forgetting everything, still says, “Wei Ying,” recognising him immediately despite everything. Much shock, so drama.

[meny-sempai]

MO DAO ZU SHI IS A MASTERPIECE – part 04

Hey guys!

First of all:

How is it possible that there are only 19 votes for this? Jeez…

This week’s newsflash!

Quote from the novel:

“Every day when Wei Wuxian was free, he played with the toddler Wen Yuan, son of Wen Qing’s cousin. He either let him hang on trees or buried him in the ground, fooling him that he’d grow faster if he was watered and bathed in sunlight… Turning around, though, he realized that Wen Yuan was gone. He almost turned pale, searching for the toddler all along the streets. Suddenly, he heard the wails of a child, and he immediately rushed over…

…

Wei WuXian, “Do you want one?”

Wen Yuan thought that he was going to buy one for him. He spoke embarrassedly, “Yeah.”

Yet, Wei WuXian walked in the opposite direction, “Haha, let’s go.”” (ch74)

Wei Wuxian, my son, you are so adorably horrible at parenting. Do keep it up. AND. If you think I’m not gonna use this in my favour, you’re wrong:

“Wei WuXian laughed madly, “Hahahahaha! Lan Zhan, congratulations! He’s taken a liking to you! He hugs the leg of whoever he likes, and he never lets go.”” (ch74)

“Jiang Cheng didn’t know when, but a child about one or two years old crept over and hugged his leg. Raising his chubby chin, he looked up at him with his dark, round eyes.” (ch73)

My boy JC = instant like. The children know.

Aaand that’s a wrap, see you guys next time!

… You wish. Let’s get started!

Before I begin I’ll just repeat this for the new readers:

I’m not a native English speaker so please bear with the mistakes I’m bound to make. I did read the novel, but only as far as the Exiled Rebels Scanlations translated it (thank you Rebels, you’re gods). I know a lot of spoilers, but I can’t say I know the whole story – If I start theorising be aware that I’m just theorising, I’m not actually telling the plot, but, just to be sure: SPOILERS ahead, I will use the facts I know for my analysis.

In this short series I’ll talk about the episodes, but I’ll also have long monologs about a certain topic.

EPISODE 07 – or, man I hate the Wens but I LOVE that theme music of theirs

… Has anyone ever told you the story about the boy who cried wolf?

And half of the fandom just died in the most satisfying death. I love how he just took a glance at the tables and was like: Nope, I’m not having any of this shit. And I’ll be theatrical and dramatic about it for all to see.

Remember what I said in one of my posts about the clans - how they don’t seem to be willing to play as a team and mostly watch their own? I think there’s a lot of truth in this and I suppose this is one of the reasons why the Wens grew so much in power. Nie sect obviously has a grudge against the Wens and wants to act on it. Now that Nie Mingjue is old enough he could do it. In theory. But without the assistance of other sects it would be suicidal. Was that why the Wens left Nie Mingjue and his brother alive after they killed their father? Did they know the other sects wouldn’t be willing to lift their fingers for the Nie? We can assume they didn’t react to the murder of Nie Mingjue’s father, so why would they help the Nie in revenge?

From my POV and understanding this advice of Lan Qiren should be pissing the hell out of Nie Mingjue. He is telling him to suck it up. Yes, for the sake of his clan, but also, because any kind of mess like this is endangering the other sects. Other sects chose to keep to themselves, so the advice is also: You do this, man - you’re alone.

On the other hand, this sentence can be also seen as how Lan Qiren himself feels. We saw him being enraged by the Wen clan because they let the Waterbound Abyss in their territory. But he can’t voice out his dissatisfaction, because he himself is sucking it up for his sect. If we see it that way, he’s basically saying: Even if we both riot it would be a suicide (Because, you see that yellow prick behind you? He’s not gonna help us and he’s the richest of us all. Jiangs are playing friends with them, they want to be family. We can’t count on any other help.)

And Lan Qiren is right. Nothing happened after Cloud Recesses was vandalized.

I don’t think the four big sects trust each other very much. The Wen sect actually brought them all together with all the shit they did. But teaming up happened mostly because the young ones took over.

I don’t even think they like each other. Which is kinda expected – they are all very different - their origin, mentality, temper, code, cultivation method. It’s actually funny how the Gusu Lan and the Nie are showing the first signs of teaming up since they are completely different in everything.

Instant confirmation to both Nie Mingjue and Lan Qiren. If you are understanding the scene like I described it, this guy laughing after what Lan Qiren said gets a whole new meaning. UGH. I don’t know why, but I really like the sound of his voice. Ugh…

And now we get the Jiang’s POV. The leader of the Jiang doesn’t care about the sitting arrangements (about the current situation of the sects). For him, the way things are, everything is already settled and can’t be changed in the present situation. What he cares about is THE FUTURE. Who will come after Wen Ruohan? Considering we know how deeply Jiangs value their family we can assume Jiang Fengmian is only thinking of how all of this will affect his children. Especially the future leader of Jiang.

What if? Jiang Fengmian always talks about the clan’s moto, he cherishes the “attempt the impossible”. But he himself is a very mild mannered man who doesn’t seem to have accomplished anything “amazing” in his years. And the way he acts could be seen as “weak” – he “accepts” the Wen sect, he “accepts” the wife’s anger, he “accepts” the marriage, he “accepts” the betrayal of his servant and friend. He is actually… very similar to Jiang Cheng.

What if the reason he’s being so strict and emotionless towards his son is because, in his way, he’s trying to make his son a better man than himself. Attempt the impossible/be like Wei Wuxian – don’t be like me. The future is bleak, and as a leader, you, my son, my heir, you can’t be like me.

Once again, MDZS makes a fabulous scene out of nothing.

Not at all.

My god, I love the dialog in this. Also, remember what I rambled about Wen Xu? Could this also be a hint? Did the sect leaders maybe hope to see him there? Instead, they got an untalented punk – worse than his father.

I’m sorry, for some reason I always laugh like an idiot during this exchange. I don’t know what it is that makes this scene so hilarious to me. Please, someone explain it to me.

He’s so precious!

Ah… JC, we meet again. I’ll talk about this moment down below. Just, remember it.

*squealing from love and insufferable pain*

JC: “Let’s split into two groups, then gather at the exit later.”

WWX: “Hey, where the hell are you leading me to?” (smiling)

JC: “Stop complaining! Just follow me.” BAM

WWX: “How about we go back the way we came? Rest assured. I definitely won’t tell anyone.” (teasing)

JC: “Just shut up, will you!” BAM

WWX: “Ahahahaha! Jiang Cheng.”

JC: “What now?”

WWX: “Look.”

I laughed my ass off the first two times I watched this. The third time… I noticed something.

Jiang Cheng takes the lead the moment the archery tournament starts, as an heir should. He gives out orders and goes into “follow me” mode. He has a path in mind, this strange and hard path looks right to him. He has a gut feeling he’s right in his decisions and he follows his gut. Wei Wuxian questions the plan like any of us would if someone started to drag us through “tight spots” for no reason. He questions him but he follows him nevertheless. I don’t think he even questions him for real, I think he’s just having fun watching his brother plays leader. And that’s one of the problems. Jiang Cheng is not playing. He’s trying to prove himself. This is his chance. So, when Wei Wuxian pokes fun at him he snaps like he usually does, but this time there is also an injury. Their conversation and Wei Wuxian’s comments hurt. Hence the head bumps. You can clearly see the change in Jiang Cheng’s expression after the first bump. He’s not so decisive anymore. He actually looks sad as if he’s starting to question his decisions too. But he can’t back down now so he just keeps going. And the smart-ass Wei Wuxian knows his brother too well. From his next comment we can see that he figured out what is bothering Jiang Cheng and as any decent sibling he pokes at it. Of course, Wei Wuxian doesn’t mean any harm, he’s just playing like the brothers always do. JC says some harsh things to Wei Wuxian too, it’s all part of being siblings. Sure, Wei Wuxian makes comments, but he still follows. He’s not even truly questioning anything, he’s annoying, but he completely trusts JC’s lead. He never thought of leaving his side, not even during “tight spots”.

Jiang Cheng doesn’t get hurt because of what Wei Wuxian says, he knows Wei Wuxian is probably the only one who doesn’t and won’t ever mean any of it. And that’s the biggest problem. Jiang Cheng believes in Wei Wuxian, he believes in WWX’s love for him, he trusts Wei Wuxian, but he doesn’t trust others. When someone says similar things that Wei Wuxian would jokingly say to him, Jiang Cheng can’t ignore it. Why? Because the same things have been said to him by the people who should love you the most. When your mother is always attacking your brother and saying you’re a fool to love him, when she is constantly dissatisfied with you and even says things like:

“You really are an idiot. I’ve told you long ago that you’ll never in your whole life be able to surpass the one sitting beside you. Not over cultivation, not over night-hunting, even over shooting kites, you can’t surpass him! … Your mom tells you countless times not to fool around with him, yet you’re still defending him. Just how did I give birth to a son like you?!” (ch51)

When your father never acknowledges you, when your parents are fighting because you’re not good enough, how do you feel? Wouldn’t any kind of comment affect you? Wouldn’t hearing that you’re worse at archery than some guy who missed the whole target hurt you? (But, they’re fighting because of Wei Wuxian and his mom, not because of JC.) Sure. But, would that be such a big problem if Jiang Cheng was as good as Wei Wuxian? If he was as good, wouldn’t that make his mother as good as the other woman? Wouldn’t that make his father love them equally? Besides, what child doesn’t think it’s his fault their parents “don’t love each other”?

“Jiang Cheng told him from inside, “Go sleep somewhere else! This is my room! You’re even gonna steal my room?!”

At that time, Wei WuXian didn’t know what Jiang Cheng was mad about at all. After a pause, he replied, “I didn’t steal anything. It’s Uncle Jiang who told me to sleep with you.”

Hearing that he was still bringing up his father, almost as if he was purposely showing off, Jiang Cheng’s eyes reddened as he yelled, “Go away! If I see you again, I’ll call a bunch of dogs to bite you!””(ch71)

This scene ripped my heart to shreds. Poor WWX, so confused and scared. Poor JC. Yes, this, THIS is jealousy. A full blown toxic jealousy attack, but there is also a lot to be read between the lines. Why is he exploding like this out of the blue? He was ready to forgive the fact that they’ve taken his only friends away from him. He was ready to share the room with the person for whom he had to give up his dogs. So why? He’s a child and he’s jealous, but is that really it? You know, seeing your father hugging someone should not be a trigger. It’s not normal to compare yourself just because of that. There has to be more, more unspoken reasons why someone would instantly compare oneself with someone. JC is someone who puts up with a lot of shit without saying anything – such people tend to explode for “no reason”. Realizing he’s been hugged only five times is the last straw.

When a very young child is unsure of whether his father loves him – you, as a parent, are doing something wrong. When a child is so afraid that his mistakes will make his father not like him even more – you have a very insecure child. An insecure child/person has a very low opinion of himself.

“Looking at Wei WuXian’s legs, Jiang Cheng’s face was full of nervousness. If any other disciple or servant learned about this and told Jiang FengMian, after Jiang FengMian knew how he threw Wei WuXian’s sheets out and made him hurt his leg, Jiang FengMian would definitely dislike him even more. This was also why he only dared chase after them alone and didn’t get anyone else.

Seeing how worried he seemed, Wei WuXian took the initiative, “Relax. I won’t tell Uncle Jiang. I only hurt myself because I suddenly wanted to climb a tree last night.”

Hearing this, Jiang Cheng sighed in relief. He swore, “You can relax as well. Anytime I see a dog, I’ll chase it away for you!”” (ch71)

I do believe this was the beginning of the ultimate trust. Also, after his jealousy attack, JC immediately realized what he did and felt bad. Yes, he was afraid of his father, but I do not believe for a second that that has any significance in his love for Wei Wuxian.

“Jiang YanLi put Wei Wuxian onto her back and began to walk back, wobbling in her steps as she spoke, “A-Ying, no matter what A-Cheng said to you, don’t bother about him. He doesn’t have a good temper, so he’s always home playing with himself. Those puppies were his favorites. Dad sent them away, and so he’s feeling upset. He’s actually really happy that somebody’s here to be with him. You ran out here and didn’t go back for a long time. I came to find you only because he’s worried that something happened to you and went to wake me up.””(ch71)

I love A Li, I’ll talk about her more later. She’s a great sister, but she does sometimes unintentionally do things that are unfair to Jiang Cheng (don’t attack me, wait for the next post for the elaboration). In this particular scene she was amazing. She didn’t get mad at JC (out of all the people he trusted her to bring back Wei Wuxian and don’t tell father about his mistake – that’s love). She carried them both (which is a nice contrast to Jiang Fengmian who carried only Wei Wuxian in the scene before). She tended to JC’s wounds from falling into the pit and encouraged him to say sorry. She. Was. Great.

But, let’s address one more thing. What does she mean by JC not having a good temper? What kind of a bad temper can a child have to not be able to have friends? Older JC is stiff and grumpy, but he does have friends in his sect and other people want to be his friends (Nie Huaisang for example).When you doubt your own worth, you can’t trust people to like you. Being around people can be hard. Being around dogs that have unconditional love for you can be very easy. It’s pleasant. I think Princess, Jasmine, and Love were healing his soul (like dogs often do) and taking them away was way more tragic from JC’s POV than it seems. No wonder he was wailing.

It’s funny how Wei Wuxian is afraid of dogs, but has so much unconditional love in him for his family.

I’ll talk about Wei Wuxian and Jiang Cheng more – the juicy episodes are coming. I’ll just say this: I really admire both of them. It would have been so damn easy for those two to hate each other’s guts, but they just don’t. And, yes, I don’t know the whole story, but right now, I believe JC never truly hated WWX, not even after everything.

Anyway.

Back to the scene from the donghua.

So, JC bumps his head and we laugh because it’s funny. If you are overthinking, like I am whenever JC appears on the screen, then you might see the head bumps as a metaphor for the comments JC has to live with. There’s one more way we can take this scene. Let’s say this is some form of foreshadowing. JC becomes the leader. Through thick and thin he leads and WWX follows him. JC’s decisions are not always the best, but the one who gets hurt by those decisions is him. Let’s go further and say the first bump is Shijie’s death.

Wei Wuxian: “How about we go back the way we came?”

I don’t know how it happens, but JC most certainly refuses to go back to how things were, he can’t go back. Even if you see honest hurt on his face, he continues and his leadership and decisions hurt him again. The death of Wei Wuxian. Even after this, JC continues on and in the end he reaches his destination. He was right all along, the path did lead to their goal (feral ghosts in this particular scene), but when he’s finally reached his goal he doesn’t see it. Not until Wei Wuxian points it out. When JC lost all of his family (Wei Wuxian in particular) he lost his focus. The goal became invisible because it had no worth anymore.

The two heroes of Yunmeng Jiang – Jiang Cheng needs Wei Wuxian in order to be himself and show his best.

I can’t wait for more chapters of the novel to analyse all of this and have a full picture of their relationship.

I know, ladies… Aahh… I know.

Well, you are extremely striking, Wei Wuxian, I’ll give you that. You’re so damn pretty here, my son.

One starts, the other one finishes. Both in their own ways. I just remembered this quote from the novel while re-watching:

“The two knew how to continue each other’s words ever since they were young. Now, one sentence after another, the argument flowed seamlessly…” (ch62)

I TOLD YOU NOT TO CRY WOLF! LOOK WHAT YOU DID! Calm down, Lan Zhan, breathe, my child brea-

HOLY FUCK! Down, Lan Zhan, stay down, remember the code! Remember, you’re a good boy, the best bo-

OK. OK, yeah, let it out. That’s healthy. Just… yeah. O.O (You better not piss off this dude. Fear the quiet ones, FEAR THEM.)

How can you be so smart, yet so stupid? XD Seriously, did you or did you not copy the damn rules for a month??? But, yeah, poor Lan Zhan, and poor Wei Wuxian – he is honestly confused. He wasn’t given a moment to properly apologize and he clearly wanted to. These two… they’ll be the death of me. Btw, the whole ribbon thing is so interesting, such a nice detail to the world building. But! I do admit that you most likely wouldn’t know about it if you follow only the animation. They should have made it more obvious. Unless. They did it like this on purpose, only to reveal it in the next season, which is also cool.

He feels so bad. TT_TT Don’t make that face at him, Lan Zhan, he’s a gentle soul. He doesn’t look like it, but he is.

Exactly. We won. Love is strong in JC. And look at those dorks. Precious. These moments are truly the blessing that we got from the animation. For me at least, it made me care about those guys even though I can’t remember their names. Those two nameless purple boys were the ones who made me drop my first tear in ep 11. These small things are so important. This is how you write a scene. 

Envious much? I get you, though.

EPISODE 08 – or, where have all these bitches come from???

Diminutive - used to express the fact that something is small, often either to show affection or to suggest that something or someone is not important: Adding diminutive suffixes is often a disparaging tactic. MDZS has this fascinating ability to tell and show without actually spending too much time to tell and show.

Once again, such an imaginative way to progress the scenes.

“The cultivation clans kept silent in indignation (after the fall of many clans), only to share their resentments secretly. In the same year Wen Ruohan commanded his eldest son, Wen Xu, to aggressively intrude and burn down the Cloud Recesses.”

Ah, Wen Xu, I had so much faith in you. But, at least you didn’t burn everything and killed everyone like Wen Chao did. And defying your father/leader is a no-no. Eh, dunno, I wish we had more on him.

Don’t touch my baby! *animalistic growling*

That was really… cruel. But, I already talked about it. I want to say another thing here. I think the main reason why Wei Wuxian immediately jumped to the chance to go with Jiang Cheng is because Jiang Cheng will be safer with him than alone (I think Jiang Fengmian knows this too). Wei Wuxian is very protective of his shidi, he always saves him from (physical) danger. Man, I really love the Jiang siblings.

This is a nice parallel to that one moment when Wei Wuxain absorbed resentful energy in the earlier episode. The core melting must hurt as hell. Since I know almost all of the Jiang family lost their cores in similar fashion I get so pissed whenever I see The core melting hand (I don’t care for his name, he doesn’t deserve to have a name, I actually hate him more than any other Wen. He knows what he’s doing is wrong, he knows his lords are evil and he does nothing and his excuse is some favor. I totally get why Wei Wuxain was so furious with him.)

SCREENSHOT!

Don’t do something that will kill you.

Also, I like how the moment Wen Chao said “Who else dares to defy my orders?” Wei Wuxian immediately showed up in the frame. It’s such a nice touch to his personality and it’s a nice “invisible way” of foreshadowing.

He’s such a good child… *ugly sobbing*

The world doesn’t deserve Wei Wuxian. The world punishes people like Wei Wuxian and everyone knows this fact. The world is just not ready for someone as good and righteous. It probably never will be and that’s sad. But being “good and righteous” is complicated and debatable. The world will never agree on “good and righteous”, the agreement can never be pure and open-minded – someone like Wei Wuxian will never be accepted in the real society. We can all say we admire him and we truly do, but we also call him a fool.

He is so creepy. I love the VA for this guy. The way he laughs and yells Yahoo adds to the craziness.

All of them are so cute here. Lan Zhan too, with his childish jealousy. They just look like kids playing around. Also, Nie Huaisang, I can’t wait to see more of your shady ass in the future.

… I just think this shot is beautiful.

Jin Zixuan: Did you just touch my shoulder with your filthy finger?

Me: Fret not, babe, I’ll have Wei Wuxian make him eat that finger.

Lan Zhan and Jin Zixuan started it, Wei Wuxian brings a whole new level to “Fuck you”. I mentioned this before, I’ll say it again: I really like how our MC fights first with his smarts and even when he’s physical you can see that he’s using wits and tricks to win. That’s not usually the case with MCs. In this particular case, because he used his wit to disgrace Wen Chao and the Wen sect, he got remembered and became the main target to Wens’ revenge. JC must be eating himself up over this. He tried so hard, yet at the end he let his brother do something that will kill him. Honestly, though, I would have done the same as Wei Wuxian… and then I’d be feeling guilty for the rest of my life… just like him.

… Um… Wei Wuxian sweety, your Yiling Patriarch is showing.

“Attempt the impossible” sequence is a go. Also, this is such a cool shot.

Can’t you see a giant killer turtle behind you??? Good to know what your priorities are. You dumb bitch. Also, that scream… That was a really good scream of Wei Wuxian. Well… not good. You know what I mean.

And that’s all for today. I always say to myself I’ll make it shorter next time and I always fail to do so. Well, hope you enjoy my rambling. See you!

[nadiasna7]

#hoc est meum#a lot of this is people projecting cliches and daddy issues and gender shit onto cql#where jfm's characterization mostly didn't make the jump#but still it's like#wtf man#why are we taking yu ziyuan's word about fault at face value#when the fact that she talks a lot of bullshit is so firmly established?#you don't have to Let Him Off his own mistakes for the challenge factor of being married to an abuser if you don't want#but can we stop victim-blaming the guy for ten minutes???#mdzs#meta#jiang fengmian#spousal abuse#characterization#sometimes fanon is Worse#a very annoying part of this is it means really good jiang cheng pov that gets into his issues is super thin on the ground#because no one wants to wrestle with the complex layers of how he felt like his dad didn't love him#or at least not the way he needed to be loved#how he's sort of aware he's bringing his mother's interpretation to things#and that she wasn't entirely right BUT#how he has this deep dreadful certainty that in the most fundamental way she was entirely correct: that jiang cheng was just like her#selfish and violent and unable to manage his own emotions at all#and therefore didn't deserve to be loved#which yu ziyuan so clearly and tragically believed about herself and thus made true

OP's tags from the first post

while i don't agree with some interpretations of jfm and yzy here, i do find it tiring how a lot of people misunderstand the jiang family (including wwx in this too) dynamic and try to write them off as irredeemably awful parents whereas all interpretations of canon are so much more complex. it then leads to ppl misunderstanding the complexity of wwx and jc's dynamic in this essay i will...

OP's tags from the second post

#brought to you by#i was reading a jiang cheng centric fic#wherein everyone kept calling the late couple 'our parents'#(including wwx)#and referring to their parenting behaviors jointly#which was dubious enough already#but then jiang cheng's internal monologue was complaining that *both* his parents#had liked wei wuxian better than him#and i was like#uhhhhh who is this man then#this man is not jiang cheng#jiang cheng's fucked-up would not have reached the level it did#without his mother's fantastically toxic approach to favoritism#and without his father's niceness compounding his self-doubt

The reason I keep banging the Jiang Fengmian drum so hard is not that he did nothing wrong--he's definitely in contention for best parenting in this book but that bar is in the ground--but because most of the takes I see about him are so extremely bad.

If you want to slag him off for trying to make choices that would hurt no one, and winding up properly protecting no one as a result, that's valid! That's an interesting and text-based critique, which opens into his parallels with Lan Xichen!

If you want to blame him for being weirdly over-invested in Wei Wuxian and Jiang Cheng being bffs, that's fair, that definitely contributed to the weirdness between them. If you want to say he was a poor communicator, that he fundamentally misunderstood his son, that he failed to be emotionally available in a way his kids could get much use out of, even that he should have figured out a way to stop Yu Ziyuan from creating such a hostile environment, all of that is fair game!

If you want to tackle how the worst thing he did to his kids was die I am so interested in how Wei Wuxian went on to abandon A-Yuan by going to his death, and how that might be tied to how his primary adult role model tied him to a boat and went off to a fight he knew he was going to lose.

After his parents had already left him like that once before, presumably less intentionally.

But no, instead I keep seeing that Jiang Fengmian didn't care. That he never expressed affection. That he actively participated in Yu Ziyuan's fucky game of forcing proxy conflict onto the boys instead of constantly trying (and failing) to shut it down, or that he ignored her bad behavior because it didn't affect him, or that he fought with her constantly, or that he was too much of an unmanly coward to stand up to her when she wanted something.

All of which are directly in contradiction to every scene he's in, and several of which manage to invert or erase the actual conflicts between him and his wife that were the source of all that tension.

And which are really interesting, because some of the most intractable elements are ideological--Yu Ziyuan is fundamentally a conservative and Jiang Fengmian seems to want to be an egalitarian, which ofc matched poorly with his hereditary authority as patriarch of a large sect.

The fact that the bit where we get to actually see him failing to parent Jiang Cheng consists of him gently and firmly trying to correct Jiang Cheng's ethics when what was actually needed in that moment was reassurance for the well-founded insecurities that were causing him to be a little bitch, only for Yu Ziyuan to charge in and make everything fifty times worse, is so much more interesting than literally any version of this family dynamic I have seen in fic. It's to the point I'm relieved when writers kill Jiang Fengmian off, because it means they probably won't feel the need to character-assassinate him too badly.

The number of people I've seen come right out and say some variation of 'men can't be abused' is killing me here. No, Yu Ziyuan wanting to hurt her husband does not constitute sufficient proof that he abused her first and deserved it! That's not how anything works!