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saellefanwork · 8 months ago

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𝐄𝐜𝐡𝐨𝐞𝐬 𝐨𝐟 𝐋𝐨𝐬𝐬

Kamado Tanjiro x DemonSlayer!F!Reader x (Past) Rengoku Kyojuro

Reminder: This Demon Slayer fic is rated Explicit (adults only) for canon-typical violence and, disturbing and explicit sexual content

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Chapter 2: The Shadow of the Mentor

Tanjiro and you don't cross paths again for several weeks, until Tengen plans an infiltration mission in the Red Light District.

Author Note: The timeline here is different from the canon story (characters are older, it's implied that Tanjiro has been Kyojuro's tsuguko for a while before his death). That's why Yoshiwara's team composition is also different. Since this is not a fic focusing on the Demon Slayer story, but rather on the relationship between the characters, I skipped the fight scenes. So there won't be any epic battles here, unlike in my other fic "The Tears of Time".

TAGS applying to this chapter: Red Light District Arc, Grief, Sad, Angst, Depression, some Healing though?, Near Death Experience, Ghost, No sex here, only Feels, hints of Tanjiro/Kyojuro's Platonic Love

Several weeks passed without Tanjiro visiting you. Missions kept pouring in relentlessly, and it seemed that the hierarchy, perhaps aware of the changes in your relationship, no longer assigned the two of you on expeditions together. The solitude the young man experienced, punctuated by moments spent with his friends, provided him a degree of perspective on the situation. Despite regularly inquiring about your well-being from the girls at the Butterfly Estate (although they didn't always give him answers), he remained convinced that he had made the right choice.

However, this conviction did little to quell the emptiness he felt without you by his side. While he hoped to reconnect with you in the future, he couldn't envision how to do so without falling into the same patterns as before. After what had happened, perhaps you no longer desired his presence, not even as a friend.

One day, Tengen summoned Tanjiro and Inosuke at the Butterfly Manor. The three of them were tasked with investigating the mysterious disappearances of prostitutes within Tokyo's infamous red-light district. The Sound Pillar had previously dispatched his wives on an infiltration mission in brothels there some time ago, but they had returned with no significant findings. But it seemed the demon living there was active again, as there was an unprecedented resurgence of crimes, prompting the Corps to take action once more.

"We need an additional member, preferably a girl," Tengen declared, his strong arms crossed. "Let's get Aoi," he commanded, pointing toward the main wing of the building, where the butterfly girls were working.

Tanjiro furrowed his brows. He had been raised with manners and harbored deep respect for his superiors, especially his new mentor, who had taken over his training following the Flame Pillar's tragic demise. However, it contradicted his very nature to ignore the call to protect those who couldn't fight.

"Let's leave Aoi alone; she is already making significant contributions to the Kisatsutai," Tanjiro argued. "Can't we request another female Slayer for this mission?"

"They're a scarce commodity. My wives are on another operation, and Zenitsu's late puberty facial hair would make for a terrible courtesan. Your and Inosuke's looks, on the other hand, can still deceive some with some makeup and disguise. Unless you have a better alternative, be prepared to enlist your sister for the task," he concluded.

Tanjiro was about to protest when a voice interrupted him.

"I'm coming with you."

The young man's heart skipped a beat as he turned around, spotting your silhouette in the shadow of the building. You stood there in your Slayer outfit, your katana secured at your waist. His chest tightened, and without thinking, he whispered your name. Despite the circumstances of your separation, he had missed you dearly.

You stepped toward them, fully revealing yourself in the daylight. You had lost weight since your last encounter, and dark circles had formed under your eyes. Your usually well-groomed hair was unkempt, and your uniform appeared somewhat shabby. Tanjiro looked at you with concern, but he summoned the strength to smile gently and offer a greeting, which you acknowledged with a nod.

You couldn't help but notice that he had once again cut his hair short, just like when he had first joined the Corps; you guiltily wondered it was a result of what had transpired during the last night you shared.

"Hmm..." Tengen eyed your tenses expressions alternately with a skeptical expression. "Weren't you supposed to be prohibited from heading on missions together, following Kocho's request?"

"If I volunteer, then it's fine," you replied curtly.

"Well, that settles one issue," Tengen shrugged, displaying little concern for your love drama. "We'll keep Nezuko as a backup. We’ve wasted enough time already; let's go!"

"Wait, Uzui-san!" Tanjiro turned to you. "Are you sure about this? It could be the work of an Upper Moon. I'd rather... have you stay safe here," he admitted.

You were hurt that he considered Nezuko an option for this mission and not you. Despite being in a fragile mental state, you were still a competent Slayer.

"It's precisely because it might involve an Upper Moon that I want to come with you," you declared firmly.

I want to be there to protect you if possible, especially now that I'm stronger than I've been since... the incident on the train. And if you were to die, I want to die alongside you, you mentally added, but you kept your thoughts to yourself, aware that he wouldn't agree with your mindset.

Tanjiro was not a telepath, but your scent and determined expression spoke volumes. He knew he couldn't convince you to stay behind, yet he still felt uneasy about the idea of you joining them. It was evident that you hadn't had a good meal or rest in weeks. His master grabbed him by the collar of his haori and turned him toward their departure.

"Listen to your woman if you want to succeed in life. Her opinion matters the most, second only to the God of Festivities. Stop wasting our time and let's move!"

"Your woman is a pain in the ass," Tengen complained just two days later. "She's exhausted but refuses to sleep. She's like a zombie and is inefficient in her research."

"This mission is tough, and she's doing her best. Plus, I told you it wasn't a good idea in her state, Uzui-san," Tanjiro sighed, not wanting to argue further about the topic. "And please, stop referring to her as 'my woman.' She's... just a dear friend. You know very well that she is Rengoku-san's fiancée."

"Hmm, whatever you say, your heart's melody doesn't sing the same tune when you see her. Besides, Rengoku is dead," Tengen remarked casually.

Listening to his words, one might mistakenly assume that Uzui didn't hold much regard for the departed Pillar, but Tanjiro knew better. The two men had been close friends; the shinobi had simply grown accustomed to burying his loved ones and moving forward.

"That still doesn't change the fact that she's not my woman," Tanjiro responded sourly. He carefully smoothed the folds of his kimono and checked his reflection in a mirror, ensuring that the makeup you had applied earlier remained intact. With night descending upon them, everyone had to return to their investigations separately. "I'll head back to my brothel. I think I've found a lead... I'll reach out to you when I get more intel."

The echoes of roaring flames and crumbling buildings gradually faded into nothingness, as Tanjiro teetered on the brink of life and death, poisoned by Upper Moon Six. His vision plunged into an abyss of darkness. Within this eerie realm, an icy stillness prevailed. Tanjiro wandered aimlessly, guided by an indistinct longing for something he couldn't define – perhaps a way out of this frightening place. He could discern your scent. Maybe you were close to his body.

He longed to return to you so badly...

"Kamado!" a voice called out from behind him.

Surprised, Tanjiro's gaze shifted to the silhouette of his former mentor standing only a few steps away. Kyojuro's arms were folded, a gentle smile graced his face, and his fiery eyes were locked onto his tsuguko.

His white and red haori was draped elegantly over his shoulders, waving slowly behind him, and the golden buttons of his Slayer gakuran gleaming softly. At his side, he carried his trusty katana with the flame-shaped tsuba that Tanjiro had inherited. The Hashira looked exactly as he did in life, radiating strength and vitality. His very presence dispelled the surrounding darkness, providing a reassuring warmth, much like before.

"Rengoku-san, Aniki!" Tanjiro exclaimed, tears immediately welling up in his eyes.

He stepped toward his mentor, overwhelmed with the desire to embrace him before stopping himself, remembering the gravity of his current situation.

"Aniki... I'm sorry. I failed. I slew an Upper Moon with Uzui-san and the others, but I couldn't protect the people of the entertainment district... a lot of people have died. And as for your fiancée, she's alive... However, I couldn't fulfill my promise to take care of her. I did all that I could, but... I just can't fill the void you left..." Tears now flowed freely down Tanjiro's cheeks, and he futilely wiped them away with the sleeve of his uniform.

The Flame Pillar placed a reassuring hand on his tsuguko's shoulder.

"Kamado, my boy, you were magnificent. You fought valiantly, and I commend you. You pushed your limits to the absolute extreme and emerged victorious. Thanks to you and your friends, these demons won't harm anyone else and will face retribution in hell. As for my former fiancée... I know the current situation is difficult for both of you, but she truly loves you, believe me. Hold on to hope. The two of you will find your way through this."

"You're mistaken, Aniki. She has eyes only for you; she doesn't like me that way. I fear I've only made things worse for her by trying to grow closer to her. I... I'm so sorry... I feel ashamed. To think that you had discerned my feelings for her when you were still with us, and instead of resenting me, you entrusted her to me... and yet, I failed..." Tanjiro's voice trembled as he sobbed, his tears mingling with hiccups.

He held Kyojuro in such high regard, idolizing him as much as he envied and begrudged him for occupying such a significant place in their lives, especially in yours, only to leave behind an equally immense void... The idea of letting him down was unbearable.

Kyojuro's spectral form embraced him gently. Though insubstantial, his warmth immediately enveloped and consoled his protege.

"Kamado... have more faith in yourself. She loves you. She chose me because circumstances made her realize her feelings for me before the ones she harbored for you, and I was deeply honored that such an extraordinary woman wanted me. But I'm certain she already loved you when I first met her. Don't try to take my place. You're an exceptional young man. Hold your head high and set your heart ablaze, especially in the face of adversity. She will return to you."

Tanjiro managed to suppress his tears and stared at his mentor, who was so kind and encouraging. His smile and reassuring gaze had the power to reignite even the most dimmed flames within one's soul. Despite the passage of time, this man would eternally remain a role model for the younger Slayer, someone he would forever admire and regret. He vowed to himself that he would heed his master's words and attempt to regain his self-confidence, honoring him in the afterlife.

"I'll do my best, Aniki," Tanjiro promised with a feeble smile. "At least, if I survive... I think I'm dying..."

"You're alive. Nezuko neutralized the poison, and you'll wake up shortly. Take care of yourself and our beloved, Tanjiro. The three of us will meet again in our next life."

The Hashira pressed his forehead against his subordinate's then straightened up, affectionately ruffling his burgundy hair with a broad smile. His silhouette vanished as mysteriously as it had appeared, but the warmth he emanated lingered long after his departure.

Tanjiro gradually regained consciousness. He was alive, albeit severely wounded, amidst the debris of Yoshiwara. The rest of his team was surrounding him, bent over him with worried expressions. He was so grateful that nobody had died... But perhaps his greatest reward was your presence close to him.

You wept profusely, cradling him in your arms.

"Tanjiro! I thought you were gone... I was so terrified." You hiccupped loudly, unable to stifle your sobs.

"Thanks Gods, Nezuko managed to burn the poison with her Blood Art. But you're still seriously injured... focus on your wounds to stop the bleeding, okay? The Kakushi will arrive soon. Hang in there and stay with me, Tanjiro. Promise me?"

He stared at you for a few moments, taken aback by your pleas and your tears. They weren’t for your fiancé, but for him. He turned his face slightly, nestling his cheek into your warm hand.

"Always," he whispered, closing his eyelids with a faint smile.

You were expecting (dark) smut, you got bittersweet relationship development instead. Maybe in next chapter ;)?

Tell me if you want to be tagged for next and last update of this story!

@gyusimp @kimiwotabenakatta-blog

Next chapter: "Closure" (will be released in two days maximum)

#tanjiro x reader #rengoku x reader #demon slayer fanfic #rengoku kyojuro x reader #kny x reader #demon slayer x reader #rengoku kyojuro #kamado tanjiro #character development #toxic relationship

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lotus-tower · 10 months ago

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okay so. i've always thought it was obvious that yoshiwara in flames arc's main relevance to gintama's overall narrative is as the prelude to rakuyou. like it's not thematically very interesting on its own, right? but it exists mainly for kagura and kamui's sake, establishing the sort of parallelism that gintama lives off of. it isn't really that connected to the red spider arc even though at first it might seem to be.

but i had no idea about the meaning of the name "rakuyou" until i saw @suchira 's post about it earlier today. and before that i also hadn't thought about utsuro's connection to the sun, which they've also talked about.

given everything that happens in rakuyou, this has expanded my thoughts quite a bit! i'm going be thinking through this as i go, so this is going to be me rambling.

housen is one of the few big arc villains who don't feel related to gintoki. jirocho, jiraia, oboro, takasugi--these kinds are obviously meant to be foils to gintoki. isaburo functions differently as a character, but even he gets directly compared to gintoki by nobume. but housen isn't really there for gintoki--he's there for kamui. he isn't a particularly interesting character, nor is his death very satisfying because of the wishywashy writing about hinowa showing kindness to him at the end. previously i'd thought that his thing with the sun was just a weaker example of craving something that would destroy you, and/or running away from one's weaknesses and vulnerabilities to the point that you become a sort of husk.

that's probably still a thing, but the introduction of the sun motif on the much more meaning-dense end of gintama adds so much more. because now the pre-existing thematic framework of gintama can do the heavy lifting for housen (who is, again, a pretty uninteresting character), hinowa (who is cool, but suffers from both Woman and Mom in shounen), and tsukuyo (who is very cool, but suffers egregiously from Woman in shounen).

so what is housen, really? he's the guy kamui chose to go with when making his very bad life decisions, the end result of the path he decided to pursue. for simplicity let's call him kamui bad end, though they aren't very comparable in canon itself because housen doesn't come across as nearly self-destructive enough. but the basic logic is that housen is one of those characters who gave up everything in single-minded pursuit of power--he's a flat character because he already "emptied himself out", as kamui says, before the series started. (but then he got scared and lonely, and all that.)

what's funny is that if housen is a bad end, then the guy who he considers his rival automatically comes to mind as an opposed route. i think it would be a serious stretch to call umibouzu the "good end" for kamui, and that's definitely part of the point in how the yato are written. but in any case, kamui clearly looked both ways (insert roads leading to two castles meme) and saw housen stereotypical villain bad end on one side, and his dad on the other. so obviously he chose housen.

rakuyou is a planet where it's always overcast. you could say that kamui chose to leave that "safety" in order to pursue something that shone much brighter to him, even if it would disintegrate him in the end. or, since rakuyou's name invokes the sun, you could say that he chose to flee the place of his weakness and pain, where his family was, like housen deciding to flee the sun and build an underground paradise.

when i go over my gintama cast tarot assignments, i always hesitate over hinowa. is she the Sun? or the Empress? how can i choose? and i think this is essentially the same conundrum. and i think the fact that she's both (thankfully, actual gintama storytelling isn't restricted to 1 character = 1 arcana) also provides us with the best answer here. hinowa is the object of yearning of both housen (as the sun) and of seita (as a mother). obviously, as i said before, the whole seita-hinowa thing is meant to lay the groundwork for kamui's motivations, and is also why he's introduced in this arc in the particular way that he is. but kamui is both seita and housen. he's the child yearning for his mother, but also the warlord who fears the sun so much he'll lock not only himself but countless others into the dark forever. but housen also desperately longed for the sun. kamui looks down on seita for being weak, and he looks down on housen for choosing to drown himself in vices at the end of his life. in the end, he doesn't kill either one of them.

if the sun is what kamui yearns for, he wants to leave rainy "rakuyou" behind--and/or he misses his home, his childhood, his family, even if these things feel like they will destroy him. or, if the sun is what kamui seeks to avoid, he wants to turn away from "rakuyou", all the things that hold him down so that he can throw himself into single-minded pursuit of self-destruction--and/or he's afraid of the weakness and pain that the sun inflicts on him, and desires to be strong enough that he won't feel them. see, a whole lot of words to say the same thing over and over.

i've always assigned housen the Emperor arcana. and i've often wondered, should it be umibouzu instead? should it be utsuro? and that, i think, is another illumination. thank you tarot for being an icon. it's so effective here because gintama is predictably built on parallels, and overlapping arcana assignments are bound to make you think: why?

in the end, housen builds a city underground in order to avoid the sun, but he also severs hinowa's ankles so that he can hold her, the sun proxy, captive in his grasp. he can't bear to feel sunlight, but he can't bear to let it go either. kamui is much the same, but he's young--he thinks he can let it go, his fears and regrets haven't caught up to him yet, because he still has so much to reach for. housen attained the peak of his strength and notoriety, and then there was little left for him.

what else happens in rakuyou? well, oboro and takasugi fight. oboro is sort of a seita figure in his own right, if seita had burned down yoshiwara in hopes that it would drive hinowa running to him. of course, seita didn't know that hinowa couldn't run; and oboro didn't know that shouyou couldn't, either.

but aside from seita and housen, there's another character in yoshiwara who yearns for the sun--not to possess it, but to protect it, to serve it. tsukuyo is an interesting character heavily let down by the realities of living in shounen jump. from my own understanding of sorachi's character, i don't think the following was intentional on his part. but i do think there are real reasons why these parallels are textually present (mainly through gintoki).

tsukuyo is the closest oboro has in this series to someone similar to him. not in the sense of a reflection in the mirror or hole-sided adjacency, but as in someone who sort of has a similar job and background to him. or had, anyway. as i implied earlier, the few, specific, clearly intentional similarities she has with gintoki (hello red spider) bleed over into her similarities with oboro, of course, because gintoki and oboro are... you know. just look at them.

tsukuyo swore herself to hinowa, but technically she was working under housen. she led housen's paramilitary force--fortunately, the hyakka loved her a lot more than the naraku were probably ever able to have an opinion about oboro. i don't think tsukuyo and oboro would ever get along--but they did have the same job. oboro did it in the heavens, tsukuyo did it underground. anyway, hinowa "saved" tsukuyo by teaching her about fighting from inside one's cage, and so tsukuyo gladly walked into the cage, just like oboro returning to the naraku without shouyou. because they thought it would be worth it. and also because tsukuyo had been groomed from a young age for the Hole (apologies to those who haven't read my ouroboros essay), to give up on her selfhood, and also to kill her sensei (hello gintoki). but hinowa remained around, unlike shouyou. tsukuyo never thought she could really free her--but protecting her, being able to see her, was enough.

oboro's life problem is a bit like if hinowa and housen were the same person. but kamui would see in that pairing only a reflection of his parents. and also, kouka is a bit like if hinowa and utsuro were the same person. but utsuro is already like if shouyou and utsuro were the same person--because oboro's actual life problem is that shouyou and utsuro are the same person.

i've spoken a lot about tarot, but the moon in gintama has little to do with the Moon arcana. in gintama it's the backdrop, the symbol of promises--promises made, promises fulfilled, promises held on to dearly whether they can be fulfilled or not. i don't truly think that the sun as represented by hinowa interacts directly with this. but tsukuyo and oboro share moon-related names, and their promises (or rather, their vows of devotion) towards hinowa/shouyou are one-sided. one-sided promises aren't a problem in gintama--our silver-haired protagonist wouldn't be alive if it weren't for them.

if the naraku, if utsuro, if oboro under utsuro is associated with the sun through the yatagarasu, perhaps it's because of the evaporation of the promise through the eclipsing of the moon. shouka sonjuku, after all, burned down, and utsuro emerged from a pyre. and though i think that the sun is overall a motif much more strongly associated with the yato--that which they avoid, are weak to, and secretly long for--i don't think that's incompatible with the crow-meaning.

rabbits can die of loneliness, you know--or they can die from overheating in the sun. i think the question here is, is this a trick question? are those two the same thing?

#i love starting a post with no idea of what my conclusions will be. thoughts can only be sharpened through writing #gintama #kamui #tsukuyo #oboro

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joelletwo · 6 months ago

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wrestling with the 4devas bitchslap again to convince myself its fine if graveyard wins the best ep tourney: it's not the other bloggers who are wrong, it's me

not a complete response to but definitely in conversation with and asking some of the same questions again as @reductionisms's 4devas essay, which tries to square gintoki's "life doesn't need to be fun, i just need you to live" being a series-sanctioned message he's given to villains as an arc-concluding moral continuously up until 4devas with it here being an incorrect worldview that needs to be (physically) corrected by shinpachi, the straightman tonal signpost of gintama

a conflict i have been perplexed by ever since i got to this line on my first watch a year or two ago, since i've seen this line before! all over fandom! as part of the general "dont [bottom text] kill yourself" motivational messaging of gintama that i love!

and, briefly, when i hit 4devas i was also in the middle of being really frustrated by the new arc pattern i was seeing crop up: i loved the villains-turned sympathetic-turned someone worth saving by gintoki tune of the first half of gintama, but it fell massively flat for me in Yoshiwara in Flames, where i was never convinced to be on housen's side but had to watch him get a heartwarming redemptive death at the side of the woman he abused anyways.

then shortly after i had the same exact experience in Red Spider with jiraia, and i thought, if this is what gintama is gonna do with its shitty dudes from now on im gonna quit the fucking show. and then shortly after that i met jirochou and saw him cut down otose the woman he loved (under a raining sky!!! the fucking sky motifs!!! the signpost im about to watch a dude be shittily violent to women and be expected to feel sorry for him about it) and saw too much red to really take in the rest of the arc level-headedly or care about anything in it lol.

so it was written off in my mind as the 'otose almost gets fridged' arc until i rewatched it this week. then i had to remember, oh yeah, there's a ton of political maneuvering fakeouts in this arc that i never actually squared back with how the plot presented itself prior to the reveals, so i'd still been thinking about the "fakeout" plot. then i read the manga version with all the "truths" in mind from the start, and finally i felt like i could understand what this arc is doing a little better.

(way) tldr (4.4k words. sorry): do i love this arc? eh. do i still hate it? eh. but it's doing stuff!

first, i was able to see an echo in all the "actually i was planning to betray you the whole time" "actually i was working to help you the whole time" plot beats of what sorachi does with the larger edo/universe story further into the back half of the manga. if i ever sound like i didnt enjoy or wasnt convinced by the execution of these "reveals," it's because i didnt and wasnt, lol. but it's fun that he had fun with them i guess.

the arc starts with pirako ingratiating herself into yorozuya, then having a classic "bump into you and pretend to be injured to extort you" encounter w her dad's gang. to resolve this without escalating into violence, gintoki... does it back to them, which is really funny. but thus the tone is set for the arc of: DISHONEST APPROACHES TO CONFLICT.

pirako isnt honest about her overall intentions the, like, seven different times that she "admits her real ones." kada plays at peacekeeper in the devas while being the ultimate person scheming to get the upper hand over everyone else in the end. (she's also secretly harusame, evil amanto outsider who acts as a unifying force for the kabukicho fighting itself to band together against and expel: sorachi's favorite move! the problem was never internal, it's the shadowy REAL antagonists who infiltrated us)

jirochou and otose are ultimately doing a pantomime of conflict to try to keep temperatures down and escalations from breaking out, so no one they care about has to get hurt. gintoki doesn't know this until the end, but he follows in their footsteps after his encounter with them in the graveyard: he plays at having given up to the rest of yorozuya so they'll leave and escape the coming kabukicho war, the same thing otose was trying with him. it fails both times. i'm really not sure why gintoki and otose thought it would work, honestly. they should know their kids are stubborn as hell.

but gintoki is in a bind because of the things he needs to protect, and all of his actions are primarily in service of that, to the detriment of how he'd prefer to act if he were less restricted. he is unsurprised and unoffended to hear saigou is only willing to warn them, not help them, because her son is in danger if she acts directly. all four devas are, seemingly, being mutually restrained this way, holding back even when blatantly manipulated to do so. the other constant of this arc: everyone is dishonest, and no one wants to risk losing what they have.

gintoki understands that! of course! he's had to make that calculus before, after all :)

and this arc is just one big cliff scene echo: the entire graveyard scene pushing gintoki to emotional regression because he thinks he's losing another parent figure, one he's just seen the Gintoki Figure of the arc cut down, no less (takasugi stolen valor when he goes berserk against him and only ends up uselessly bleeding out on the ground about it, honestly). otose goes into this willingly so gintoki can live. he accepts this decision because he values protecting her values (her kids living on) and is briefly broken by it (the story says, before giving him shinpachi to "put him back on track"). prior to the bitchslap, after saying he just wants them to live, even if it has to be without him, he says:

i dont have a good understanding of when we start getting reveals of gintoki's backstory versus foreshadowing because i went into gintama already knowing most of it, but definitely by the recent red spider where we get our first real look at (or really, first listen to) shouyou. but here we actually get some of what gintoki felt about it, which he keeps closely guarded even when the whole truth comes out: he's done his best to survive having lost, but it was so unbearable he can't face losing again.

(also, honorable mention backstory echo, the person calling him a brother sets his home on fire to drive him and his parent figure out of town. as i liveblogged: this one would really hurt gintoki if gintoki cared about anything oboro ever did!)

but with the shinpachi story-rerouting, they get the good end, keep everyone (otose, yorozuya, all of kabukicho, even pirako and her dad - everyone but kada) safe without having to sacrifice a single thing, even keep gintoki hopeful for this outcome. so, as goose points out, we are left to understand that there could have been a good end on the cliff, that something is different here than there, and, skipping a lot of math, that that is the people around gintoki.

which i do find really funny to imagine as a slam on takasugi and katsura. sorry you kids suck too much, your teacher dies bc u were cringefail. but lets look at it.

everyone is dishonest, no one wants to risk what they have: gintoki rallies himself to keep fighting but is determined to do it alone. kagura and shinpachi fight him on this; they can't leave because they don't want to lose their home, they can't let him fight alone because they don't want to lose him. they're just as restricted by what they have to keep safe, but their only option is to act where everyone else's is inaction. shinpachi says:

if i may skip over the bitchslap itself for now, gintoki does consent to let his allies fight with him after it. yorozuya stands alone against saigou, who's heavily demoralized but resigned, strongarmed into fighting them by the threat to her son. but on seeing their resolve to keep protecting their own precious home and family she says:

and, to skip straight to my thought, i think this is what turns the tides back in their favor. there are more twists and turns to the fight. pirako equates what binds saigou, which she herself equates to what binds the yorozuya, to what binds her:

(with an intentional distinction that she's willing to actively destroy the others', as opposed to their purely self defensive fighting, which is echoed at some point in her distinguishing gintoki from jirochou in the same way, that jirochou not only lives to protect like gintoki but is willing to destroy in the process. i don't find that part as interesting, but it's more fuel to the power of having something to protect as a driving force as an arc theme.)

so now all three stand on the same ground, absolutely unwilling to give up what they hold dear, but all their cards are on the table. they aren't dealing in 12 dimensions of tricksy defensive pre-emptive moves anymore. they know it wouldnt work, anyways, since they all know their drives to protect are the same and no one will be talked into backing down. now they can directly duke it out and let the winner be determined that way, on strength of will. even before the actual circumstances change, the fight somehow feels freer seeing how inevitable it is. and with everything out in the open, yorozuya can now protect each other and saigou's son, taking out one side of the conflict.

(and with everything out in the open, the ultimate 4devas villain can become the single person who continues to betray the others, kada, whose further machinations - with everything out in the open! - saigou (and later yorozuya) can choose to protect pirako from. everyone wins! because everything was out in the open! do you see where i'm going)

and so we come back to the question: gintoki is corrected, the arc is rerailed to the better outcome. so is the correction justified?

what does the correction accomplish outside of its moment? most convincingly to me of goose's presented options, i also think it's done as a thematic shift, a, okay, just live was a strategy that worked before but now doesn't suffice, so we need something more.

as to why this is needed now and not earlier or later...tldr bad planning <3 but like.

we have, prior to this, a consistent thrust of arcs where gintoki teaches people to lose. as well, while we meet the harusame and we visit space and we get the barest glimpses of takasugi's weird shadowy background moves there, largely we're dealing with kabukicho characters and kabukicho stories. we see or only hear about the shogun for short comedic moments only. we've largely dropped the series intro focus on things like the shinsengumi or hasegawa acting as foreign diplomats. it's a local series, a hometown series, a kabukicho and not even an edo at large series, a personal story about gintoki making personal connections with his personal experience as a flawed person with a flawed approach to life that has let him, chronic slacker, get by on the bare minimum.

at this moment, chapter 300, we have a slow trickle of gintoki backstory starting to come out to us. we've recently expanded the story focus to include yoshiwara, which gets a callout in this arc by kada to keep it relevant. we have an arc of sorachi testing out plot beats that he'll use again for the endgame, in all the political maneuvering and alliancing and betraying and shadowy outsider space governmenting, where he's also doing a lot of echoing of that backstory that only becomes clear later. so it's possible he's thinking about shifting gears and setting up for the eventual endgame, which means getting out of the episodic cycle so things can stick.

and after this arc, to my opinion and memory, we stop getting the classic gintama flavor sympathizable'd antagonists. a lot of the bigger arcs don't even have clear Big Shot antagonists anymore, being more about the shouyoucore theme of characters fighting against themselves, or if there is one they're always explicitly part of the Shadow Government now, a unified and more daunting force than someone they can win over with an inspiring gintoki interaction.

so 4devas does act as a turning point at least in some way. and it's not possible to say this definitively, since all gintama arcs are ultimately never going to be about gintoki or his friends Actually losing something instead of beating the odds, but it does feel like theres a different flavor to, say, dekobokko with its direct look at how chars lives could be different and better and they will still choose to keep struggling as themselves. and Kintama arc definitely doesn't feel like an early days arc, like it can only resolve the way it does with a gintoki who is now able to face his past and the possibility of losing again and again and again (now with, natch, his faith that yorozuya will by his side when he does).

why now, after 300 chapters of letting it sit ignored in the back of his brain working out perfectly fine except when it doesn't (the very reminder of shouyou in a fight making him go Demon Mode, which is like regular gintoki but worse at fighting, bc he is so unprepared to think about shouyou)? well i personally am in big favor of the "take a decade off" strategy for facing problems. it worked for me too. realistically watsonianly its nice to let things percolate in the brain and do some of the processing behind the scenes until its less immediately painful. and he's made many bonds over these 300 chapters, shown in this arc when the whole town rallies behind him, that are there to support him when he needs it now and weren't there before.

realistically doylistly eh. bad planning.

and so we come back to the question: gintoki is corrected, the series as a result is rerailed to a writing space where things can start changing (leave the episodic, as you guys say, sazae-san format). it's useful in the future. so is the correction justified in terms of what comes before it? was the correction needed?

thinking about the bitchslap leads to thinking about the cliff scene leads to (sorry kagura and katsura, you guys arent really relevant here) pitting shinpachi and takasugi against each other in how they act with something on the line they can't bear to give up.

i don’t need the lesson of 4devas to apply logistically to the cliff scene. once they were set up on that chessboard, frozen in their assigned places as a backstory, it’s not like takasugi could’ve power of friendship’d his way out of being physically retrained if he decided he wanted to. it’s set up as a forced choice, it has to play out as a forced choice.

but we see that even before it’s asked of him, takasugi is willing, prepared, unbothered to give up his own life for shouyou’s. this is, goose lays out in the sequel, the cardinal sin in gintama - a teacher shouldn’t outlive their student. it would have been especially egregious to shouyou, whose whole desired life’s purpose is to raise students who can outlive him and outgrow him, take his lessons and go out into the world and do their own thing with them. takasugi doesn’t expect to do this and doesn’t seem to see a point in the possibility if shouyou isn’t back with them.

though we can also think of shouyou as a little too quickly willing to give up on the cliff - sorry, gintoki, the suicidal guy has thought about it for .02 seconds and decided the best outcome is for you to kill him even though he could get out of this no problem. maybe its no wonder gintoki gave up too. can we ask katsura what he would’ve done?

and is takasugi different from shinpachi there? he rejects the mentor’s attempt to exchange his own life for his. he’s not willing to consider a life without him.

but shinpachi is convinced no one is going to die. because they’ll be there together. incredibly naive - shinpachi and kagura, restricted to one option by what they need to protect like everyone is in 4devas, have acting as that one option because they are still free in a way gintoki and the other adults aren't. they’ve never actually experienced the impossible choice that forces you to give up, so they can act as if there isn’t one - what else would they do? why would they think to give up?

but gintoki is defined by having lived the impossible choice. its built into the foundation of him as a character and leaks out everywhere. he couldn’t have relied on his friends on the cliff because they were quite forcibly removed from the picture as an option, not by his or their choice. its written as an inevitability, logistics we find out later be damned.

if we refocus to 4devas, we can look at the Gintoki Figure for a different angle. jirochou, after he and gintoki resolve the arc conflict by being able to team up because they - say it with me - put everything out in the open, tells gintoki about his impetus for abandoning his family and coming back to his wayward life in kabukicho, the death of otose's husband.

it's, um, another now really obvious parallel to gintoki, lol. characters talk about how jirochou does everything he does in this arc to try to atone for his failure to both otose and tatsugorou, and i guess thats true bc he was written that way but he has an odd way of showing it, but anyways he resolves that, despite his guilt over this, all he can do now is keep living and keep protecting what they loved together. he's come to the usual gintama message all on his own, reinforcing that this is the correct way to live in this series. he had his own unavoidably shitty situation, and he came to terms with it.

so then where did jirochou go wrong, in the narrative's eyes (other than abandoning one woman and their child to deal drugs in the town of his other woman while ignoring her)? was there a point he could've changed how their trio's story played out? but he loved and trusted tatsugorou, and he was happy to step aside and let him be the one by their otose's side. i doubt he would have been happy stealing her away even if it were possible.

but if we look at the resolution tool of 4devas... he never put everything out in the open!!! everyone knows he loved otose, but in more of an open secret way. in classic romance plot, he never confessed for second male lead rejection closure. indeed, in the closest we ever get to a main character having a romantic plot in gintama, the very ending of the arc flirts with him doing just that now that he's made a little progress with the arc message, with the entire cast of the arc expecting him to (and interrupting before he can).

but if he had when they were young. if he had been honest with his friends. could it have opened up other options that weren't available on his own, that they didnt know to offer? i have a preferred one lol. but u can get creative with all sorts of life paths that avoid tatsugorou dying that way or, at the least, jirochou feeling chained to a shameful life (living in a town he doesn't go out in to protect a woman he doesnt talk to and feeling like he doesnt deserve the family he abandoned for this) because of it.

and then if we take this and rewind back to the cliff... we get to grind my favorite ax, "shouyou shouldve told literally anyone literally anything about his deal." if gintoki knew more about shouyou, they could've faced his horrors together, the whole time. he couldve known that shouyou was being literal calling himself a demon and not internalized his own identity as one for life just because shouyou bonded with him over it. i truly genuinely think the logical conclusion of all of gintama's big messages are that shouyou and gintoki should have been more open with each other.

but i don't think sorachi thinks that. and, you know, by 4devas rules, the unriskable precious things he was protecting by staying silent were his students' humanity, and secondarily his own fragilely newly hopeful heart that literally couldnt stand another 10 millionth round of rejection (killed himself and then went on a 12 year rampage over it. girl i would too).

and takasugi really isn't dishonest about what's going on in his head when he tells us he expects to die for shouyou. that's as cards on the table as i could ask. gintoki is, a little bit, by omission. he does what i'd want him to here - tells takasugi try just not dying - but doesn't give him a reason to, and doesn't tell him he has no plans of letting anyone die for shouyou.

so what goes wrong on the cliff - shouyou is happy, gintoki is happy, oboro's even kind of happy, katsura is irrelevant - is that takasugi is blindsided (whoops) by their silent agreement that betrays the one he thought he and gintoki had. and then ruins everyone's party about it and spends the next ten years doing so for good measure.

which is also, basically, what shinpachi is going through that prompts the bitchslap, too. he thought they were a team, that they had each others backs, not that gintoki is a one-way protector of them. he is blindsided by gintoki lying to and tricking them and hiding things from them. he is hurt by gintoki feeling hopeless all by himself when he could share that with them and be encouraged by their endless child optimism.

and would it need to have changed anything on the cliff? in the moment after the bitchslap, what contributes to gintoki changing his mindset is tama telling him, we trust that you're capable bc youve always shown us that, can you trust us this time? when, later in the arc, gintoki seems to regress by sending kagura and shinpachi away, he asks them to trust that he's still trusting them, relying on them to help shoulder his burden, and in return they know he's staying alive, not self sacrificing. maybe it would've helped just to feel on the same team and not shut out, to be able to trust gintoki like gintoki was trusting shouyou?

so. two paralleled instances of gintoki making a bad situation worse by keeping to himself and being too self sufficient. that feels clear cut that feels fine im okay with that as a takeaway. do i think its exactly what sorachi had in mind while writing this, as opposed to just a good series 'hey lean on your friends' moment to read cool and tug at the heartstrings? eh lol. i think theres definitely room to read takasugi into this arc (i still need to refind the takagin 4devas post...) but its not so baked in that i think he was a PRIORITY in the plotting.

but is the shinpachi SCOLDING necessary is the scolding justified... and yes its in response to life doesnt need to be fun i just want you to live. still a confusing framing i can't immediately square. but/and more immediately its directly responding. to gintoki opening up to them about his insecurities!!

which, as said, he doesnt do!! he doesnt talk about his failures! its basically like, here and to hijikata that one time and otherwise even when we know all the facts about what happened we still never hear gintoki himself talk about it. (so he really DOESNT learn the lesson here either. he stays dissociated and triggered every time utsuro comes up. he tries to solve the altana baby problem on his own. he doesnt talk to his new friends OR his old friends. bwah. gintoki. silver soul.)

so this is like. its just in the wrong order!! its just in a baffling order lol. if you want gintoki to share his burden do you need to punch him when he shares it. does it also need to sound like you're blaming him for not being capable of upholding his promise to protect anyone when thats the insecurity thats got him all discombobulated this arc in the first place (a whole set of notes i took on this that i didnt find a place for in this post)?? its so weeeeiiiiiirddd lol i dont liiikeee itttttt. theres plenty of things shinpachi can validly punch gintoki for but this is such a weird one.

so i guess. having a clearer understanding of this arc do i hate it less? YES honestly. i hate fakeout plots generally they irritate me but everything... more or less makes sense by gintama standards now that i have the whole plot in mind.

do i hate jirochou less SORT OF? i enjoy him. in his individual relationships. i like his shitty dad deal i love shitty dads. i like him pining for otose who genuinely likes him but also brings up her husband every sentence she says to him just to keep him down. i like his parallels with gintoki that they both explicitly acknowledge and find macho comfort in. hes still not theeeeeeeee most well-developed gintama antagonist but you know? i at least think otose and pirako would want to be around him after this.

do i feel like i have a clearer understanding of the bitchslap moment. NOT CONVINCED I DO. i feel like its going to be one of those things that slips in and out of my understanding like sand in cupped hands. i have a tentative understanding of it that i dont think sorachi actually had in mind. so i dont think ive solved it lol.

will i be cursed to think about 4devas forever? god i hope not. am i okay with it beating farewell shins in the polls. god i fucking hope it does. in the horrible timeline where i have to see 305 make it all the way and then lose i guess id rather it be to this one than to hijigin. consider this poll propaganda?

#sopping wet gintoki posting

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rosencrantzsguildenstern · 1 year ago

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core serious arc = advances plot in a major way or opens up the way for plot to be advanced, excluding short arcs (harusame arc, festival arc, inugami arc) as well as arcs not generally viewed as part of that group (umibouzo arc) and character development/introduction arcs (yagyuu, red spider, mitsuba, etc)

#made out of curiosity and to clown on benizakura (which im not that into)#might make a reddit poll too #i like baragaki as much as anyone but it def isnt my favorite... where is my yoshiwara in flames movie #gintama #chitra.txt #please let me know if i missed anything obvious sjlkdf #ALMOST FORGOT COURTESAN OF A NATION

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gintama-polls · 7 months ago

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Gintama Episode Tourney

Episode 231, "When You Go to a Funeral for the First Time, You're Surprised by How Happy the People Are" At the funeral of the kind restaurant owner, Gintoki and Hijikata are the only ones who can see the old man's ghost.

Episode 142, "Life Is A Series Of Choices" Kagura loses herself during the fight against Abuto. The fourth episode of the Yoshiwara in Flames Arc.

#gintama #poll #gintama episode tourney #episode 231: when you go to a funeral for the first time you're surprised by how happy the people are #episode 142: life is a series of choices

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gabriella0807 · 6 months ago

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youtube

My First Gintama edit. It's mainly about Gin and Tsukuyo in the Yoshiwara in Flames Arc and in the Red Spider Arc. Enjoy! ✨

Song: TALI - Fighter

#gintama #gintsu #sakata gintoki #tsukuyo

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craftydragonperson · 10 months ago

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Happiest Birthday to Yoshiwara’s leading courtesan, Hinowa. ⛅️

I will never understand what prompted such an absence after Yoshiwara in Flames. The arc was done but we definitely could have gotten more from her character.

Continue to light the way, our beautiful sun. ☀️

#gintama #sorachi hideaki #hinowa #happy birthday Hinowa #happy birthday #anime #yoshiwara in flames #Hinowa the sun #sakata gintoki #hideaki sorachi #gintoki #gintoki sakata #shimura shinpachi #kagura #shimura tae #sadaharu #class 3z ginpachi sensei

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choosefromtoo · 2 months ago

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Ghost Ryokan Arc Or Yoshiwara in flames Arc

#gintama #gintama kagura #sakata gintoki #shimura shinpachi #yorozuya #kamui #rei #Tsukuyo #hinowa

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drax-is-inthefandom · 1 month ago

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An attempt of a timeline for Demon Slayer

Hi, hello, I am on a brainrot and for the sake of OC creation I decided to put a year and age to as much as I can in Demon Slayer.

What we know?

Demon Slayer takes place in the Taishō Era which goes from 1912 to 1926

But there are two things in the world building that can allow us to determine when the anime takes place in and from there develop a timeline of what happens when.

Beware, this will have spoilers for the late part of the timeline!

The presence of Moga

What are Moga? "The Modern girl" was a movement that occured in Japan during the Taisho Era where young women embraced the western style as a form of liberation from the traditional, men driven ideologies in Japan in search for financial and emotional independence.

We can see a couple examples of what might be Moga when Tanjiro arrives to Tokyo!

Muzan's own wife seems to follow Moga fashion even!

But we can't be sure if that's due to her own choice or Muzan trying to push his wish for Modernity on her, you know that demon denies staying in the past so probably would ask his wife to Mordernize herself as well -Even though between women her age and social status back then, wearing traditional japanese kimonos was the "Normal". Men were the ones who normally to show wealth wore western fashion-

The term of "Moga" was actually not adopted until 1923, but the movement could be tracked to the publishing of magazines as The Housewife's Friend, which was founded in 1917.

So if we follow these mere hints, we could say that Demon Slayer takes place between 1917 - 1923.

But there is something else that could give us THE EXACT YEAR of when the story takes place!

The Yoshiwara District and its destruction

The flashiest arc of the story takes places in The Enterteinment District of Yoshiwara, one of the 3 three licensed and well-known red-light districts in Japan alongside Shimabara and Shinmachi.

Knowing that this is Yoshiwara gives us an excellent reference of what year the story could take place in, and while personally I am not sure if Gotōge did it intentionally or not -Probably it was- The destruction of Yoshiwara in the battle against Gyutaro and Daki could have been easily been hidden by the Demon Slayer Corps by one catastrophe that happened in Japan during that time: The 1923 Great Kanto earthquake

The district of Yoshiwara was destroyed to point of near-obliteration after this catastrophe in Japan. And while a great tragedy, it could give the best smoke curtain to such big battle as the one against the Sixth Upper Moon was, as we know- The Enterteinment District got pretty roughed up during that battle, thanks Gyutaro.

SO! With this, I can say that the year in which the main story of Demon Slayer might take place in is 1923!

So with that settled! We can go into the timeline!

Meiji Era (1896 - 1912)

1898: Jigoro Kuwajima (35) retires from being the Rumble Hashira due to an injury

1904: Suicide of Kagaya Ubuyashiki's father, Kagaya (4) raises as the new Oyakata-Sama

1909: Death of Kagaya (9) 's younger brothers: Senri (8) and Akito (6), and of their mother, by a house fire provoked by Senri.

1911: Ruka Rengoku dies. Leaving Kyojuro (8) and Senjuro (2) without their mother, Shinjuro Rengoku, the current Flame Hashira, starts spiralling into a heavy depression.

Taishō Era (1912-1926)

1914: Kaigaku (11-12) lets a demon into the orphanage run by Gyomei Himejima (18), all the orphans die with the exception of one who frames Gyomei as the killer. Kagaya (14) saves Himejima from execution.

1915: Giyu Tomioka (13) succeeds in his Final Selection.

1916: Gyomei Himejima (20) becomes the Stone Hashira.

Tengen Uzui (16) joins the Demon Slayer Corps.

1918: Giyu Tomioka (16) becomes the Water Hashira. Tengen Uzui is already the Sound Hashira and Kanae Kocho is already the Flower Hashira.

Sanemi Shinazugawa (16) becomes the Wind Hashira

1919: Kanae Kocho (17), dies fighting the Upper Moon 2: Douma.

1921: Shinobu Kocho (16) becomes the Insect Hashira.

The Kamado family is slaughtered by Muzan, Nezuko (12) is the only survivor and turned into a demon. Tanjiro (13) tries to get his sister to a doctor, and on the way are attacked, and spared, by the Water Hashira, Giyu Tomioka (19)

Kyōjurō Rengoku (18) becomes the Flame Hashira.

1922: Obanai Iguro (20) becomes the Serpent Hashira

Muichirō Tokito (13) becomes the Mist Hashira.

Mitsuri Kanrōji (18) becomes the Love Hashira

1923: Giyū Tomioka (21), Shinobu Kōchō (18), Kyōjurō Rengoku (20), Mitsuri Kanrōji (19), Obanai Iguro (21), Sanemi Shinazugawa (21), Gyōmei Himejima (27), Tengen Uzui (23) and Muichirō Tokito (14) are the current generation of Hashiras under the leadership of Kagaya Ubuyashiki (23)

Tanjiro Kamado (15), Inosuke Hashibira (15), Kanao Tsuyuri (16), Genya Shinazugawa (16) and Zenitsu Agatsuma (16) succeed on their Final Selection. The main story of Demon Slayer starts.

1924: Muzan Kibutsuji is defeated and the demons are destroyed once and for all.

And I might have skipped some stuff, or I might even have some stuff wrong but I think this is rather solid? Anyway, you are welcome to take this as guide or just think I'm delulu! After all I'm just a fan with brainrot doing this for the sake of roleplay and OC making lmao

#kimetsu no yaiba #demon slayer #kny timeline #kny theory #demon slayer timeline #demon slayer theory #drax talks

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