#Stonehell

[vintagerpg]

Stonehell is my pick for the best of the 21st century megadungeons (and is, I think, one of the first in the OSR mode). It’s in two parts, the initial Stonehell Dungeon: Down Night-Haunted Halls arriving as a self-published print on demand product in 2009, and the second part, Stonehell Dungeon: Into the Heart of Hell wrapping things up in 2015.

The dungeon began as a tyrant’s prison, where the prisoners were forced to excavate their own living space. The tyrant fell, but when the prison was liberated, not everyone left — lots of folks considered the horrible place their home. The top layers still retain their prison-like feel, and numerous former prison gangs have carved up the complex into small warring kingdoms. Deeper levels get stranger. At the very bottom is the lair of a creature of pure chaos that feeds on the negative emotional energy generated by the inhabitants. The more it eats, the more it destabilizes nearby reality. This goes a long way toward explaining why the place is so weird (there’s a casino down there somewhere, and at least one crashed space ship).

Dungeons are inherently irrational, and even though it is unlikely that a group will ever “solve” Stonehell, I feel that as a whole, it justifies its irrationality in a way few other dungeons of any size do, and this makes it feel unique and special. Its also extremely usable — despite being something like 1300 rooms, each level is made of quadrants that are detailed in a derivative of the One-Page Dungeon system, so everything is clear, brief and even modular — you can rearrange, drop or use any section on its own, should you wish. It’s really quite the accomplishment, especially considering it’s Michael Curtis’ first big outing into design. No wonder he became such a big wheel at Goodman Games!

[renaarcana]

[thydungeongal]

Do you (or any of your followers) have a solid recommend on a First Timer's Megadungeon? I'm looking at Barrowmaze and Stonehell right now but I am very open to other suggestions too. (I do have experience running old school D&D and dungeon crawls, just not a megadungeon)

I think Dyson Logos's Dyson's Delve is a fun one: it's a mini-megadungeon, the idea being that it's a megadungeon where each level fits on a two-page spread, one having the map and the other having the key. It mostly hits all the right design notes of a megadungeon albeit in a condensed format.

I am personally quite fond of Highfell. It's a megadungeon situated on a flying island, meaning that one of the first issues the player characters need to face is actually getting up on that thang.

Rappan Athuk is a megadungeon available for multiple different editions and while I wouldn't say it's the best it is an extremely approachable and well-presented one imo.

And finally, I keep hearing good things about The Halls of Arden-Vul but like. The complete version of that dungeon is like a hundred dollars. I'm waiting for it to come back on Bundle of Holding so I can check it out.

[stonegearstudios]

Creating a MegaDungeon part 6

Oh shit I'm starting to map things

So while loose ideas have obviously been bouncing around in my head for ages, I hadn't actually started mapping out areas, rooms, and encounters.

But now I have

I certainly hope you didn't expect any picture I made to actually look good.

So yes, this is a basic blob map, but that's actually an improvement for me. I have so many dead projects behind me because I immediately tried to jump to 'the cool part'.

I'd try to make fully detailed dungeon maps in art programs, or start dreaming about comming art, and those were terrible ideas. I'd quickly run into walls, loose inspiration, and give up. So, this time I'm forcing myself to take it slow, actually lay the groundwork for this project.

And that means we start with blob maps.

So, what is this thing? Well, as it says right at the bottom this is Layer 1 (or floor one if you want to put it that way) of the dungeon. The entry, the starting ground.

Expedition Point

Now, looking at this, you might thing it's more than a bit basic for what's supposed to be a megadungeon, those are usually sprawling maze-like maps.

For example here is a (small) section of one of the maps from Stonehell, a very good MegaDungeon, I recommend it.

This is what a archetypal dungeon looks like. Narrow corridors with rooms branching off all over, each one detailed in the text for what treasure and monsters inhabit it.

But, unless you are a specific kind of person, jumping straight to drawing out rooms and corridors is a bad idea. Sure, I could grab some graph paper and do it, but I'd have no idea what I was making.

That's where the blob map comes in.

These aren't rooms, not yet, they're 'regions' inside this floor of the dungeon.

My current progression is: Scan other rpgs, mythology, the internet for monsters I either want to us or rework -> subdivide those down into ones I think should be on an individual floor -> Think about the kinds of environment those monsters/enemies/NPCs would be in -> Use those ideas to make a few 'keystone' encounters for each areas.

After that then it would be time to actually map out the area in detail... but I'm probably gonna put that off for a while. I may blob map the entire dungeon before I go into detail, we'll see.

[rppr-podcast]

Mega Dungeon Meandering - Episode 1 - Stonehell - Surface Level

Mega Dungeon Meandering is a deep dive into one of the best reviewed mega dungeons of all time, Stonehell: Stonehell Dungeon is a classic-style mega dungeon, filled with enough  monsters, traps, weirdness, and treasure to keep you gaming for a long,  long time. Explore over 700 rooms, encounter more than 40 new monsters,  and discover 18 mysterious magical items — and that’s just in the first…

[imsobadatnicknames2]

That is, in fact, still assuming that players will inevitably have the same linear set of predetermined encounters, just that they will overcome them in different ways (and with choosing how to overcome the inevitable encounters the GM puts in their path being the entire extent of their agency as players).

Most old-school adventures (particularly those based around megadungeons such as Barrowmaze or Stonehell) have dungeon exploration that's a lot more open-ended because most dungeons aren't meant to be fully explored in one go (or even fully explored by a single party at all), so the GM a has a lot less control over what encounters players do end up having and in what order. It's not uncommon for these type of adventures to conclude without the players having visited entire sections of the dungeon.

You could still argue that by designing the encounters the GM is setting the MAXIMUM amount of XP that players could *potentially* end up getting, but the amount of that XP they end up *actually* getting during play depends a lot more on the players than on the GM, so it's not equivalent to milestone leveling where it's, in some way or another, entirely up to GM fiat.

If there’s one mechanic the addition of which would significantly improve any edition of D&D that does not already have it, it would be the dungeon turn. Just that little bit of structure and procedure would communicate so much about how the game is played.

And if there’s one mechanic the removal of which would improve any edition that does have it, it would be milestone leveling. Get that arbitrary nonsense out of here!

[whereismywizardhat]

Consolidating all the new character art for my Stonehell adventuring party onto one post.

From the top, we have Quarie, Mary, Nyree, Varis, Minotsuchi, Ki Lin, Sidian, and Mara.  Together, they’ll have to keep on their toes to survive the darkness that lurks in the depths of the massive Stonehell complex.

[nerdtrekdotcom]

Stonehell Dungeon #2: Into the Heart of Hell (OSR)

Stonehell Dungeon #2: Into the Heart of Hell (OSR)

Stonehell Dungeon #2: Into the Heart of Hell (OSR)

The second part of the massive Stonehell mega-dungeon clocks in at 162 pages, not counting covers, editorial and index.

  The Stonehell dungeon books were donated by one of my patreon supporters for my edification, with the note that I can review them, if I’d like to. It’s time to also get the second part done, and once more dive deeply into…

[chronivore]

The Man With A Hammer: Knave Ancestries for Maienstein / Stonehell

[rpgcovers]

Labyrinth Lord: Stonehell Dungeon - Down Night-Haunted Halls ~ Three-Headed Monster Games (2009)

[vintagerpg]

Anomalous Subsurface Environment takes a novel approach to contending with the inherent irrationality of the dungeon by embracing it. There’s no secret at the center that makes it all suddenly make sense (in part because after two volumes — ASE1, 2011, and ASE2-3, 2012, both print-on-demand ��� the dungeon remains unfinished, but still, the introduction is pretty clear that there are no revelations to be had).

The dungeon came into existence spontaneously and persists thanks to a maintenance staff of self-created elemental spirits and defies any further explanation. The ASE was discovered in our own cyberpunk future by a megacorp that built large facilities around the ASE to research and extract profit. At some point, an unknown disaster forced the megacorp to seal the complex, trapping staff and resources inside. Fast forward 4,000 years into a retro-future resembling Thundarr the Barbarian, where the detritus of high technology mixes with magic and the ASE is, mysteriously, open for exploration once again. Thus, ASE is both as bizarre as its freeform funhouse ancestors but benefits from the narrative framework of modern megadungeons like Stonehell.

The central implication is that the system of the universe wanted dungeons to exists so badly that it just summoned one into existence, complete with all the silly game logic that had developed over the last 40 years, to see what would happen. The book present the ASE as the product of indomitable will that lacks driving intelligence. This is both brilliant and deeply, deeply weird. Watch out for the cornstalk warriors.

[renaarcana]

A weird machine

[imsobadatnicknames2]

Ooooh I've never checked out Hall of Arden-Vull but judging by the praise in these blog's notes I think I'll have to check it out.

Seconding Temple of Elemental evil, althought for a proper megadungeon it's definitely on the smaller side. Some great examples of megadungeons for old-school D&D are Barrowmaze and Stonehell (stonehell was technically created for Labyrinth Lord, but LL is pretty much a slightly modernized clone of B/X D&D)

Stonehell is particularly known for being enormous, I've once heard someone say you could perfectly add the entirety of Barrowmaze as a sublevel for Stonehell.

And that's saying something considering that this is what Barrowmaze looks like.

There is also Anomalous Subsurface environment, which is known for its far-future gonzo setting and its zany science-fantasy vibe. Although it's worth remarking that ASE was left unfinished. It was released as a series of volumes, and the last volumes never came out.

And of course... It wouldn't be a post of mine if I didn't mention something for Mausritter.

Tomb of a Thousand Doors is a Mausritter Megadungeon created as the result of a community game jam where everyone created a bit of a dungeon and at the end they were put stitched together as a single megadungeon. Again, on the smaller side, but it has tons of variety and personality.

If you're interested in creating your own, but don't know how to start, Atelier Clandestin on DTRPG has a pretty good megadungeon generator which only costs a couple books, and it also comes included in their Sandbox Generator book.

All of these cost money but I'm willing to send anyone a PDF of any of them if asked for it.

You've inspired me to make my own megadungeon (or at least run one), are there any good examples you know of? Since you did once mention current megadungeons doing things wrong.

I also want to say your blog and those like yours have been a major inspiration and make me want to create stuff! And have a great evening :)

Oh, I think the person who you want is @maximumzombiecreator, she's the one who's talked about modern megadungeons doing things wrong! (I think the one she was talking about was some megadungeon for Pathfinder 2e?) Oh, there was a time when @tenleaguesbeneath and @imsobadatnicknames2 vagued about one particularly catastrophic attempt by one blogger to make a D&D 5e megadungeon that never amounted to much. But yeah, I've reblogged those posts in question, and now I've summoned them so they may articulate their thoughts on the matter better.

I don't want to speak over anyone, but if I recall correctly: MZC's criticism of that PF2e megadungeon hinged on it lacking procedures for random encounters and restocking, two important things for making the megadungeon feel alive and reinforce the idea that it can't actually be meaningfully cleared, whereas the criticism of that 5e megadungeon was based on the idea that it was like. A dungeon shaped succession of linear D&D 5e adventure days. I think it was characterized as a "megadungeon-themed theme park ride," which feels very apt.

Personally, I'm a fan of the megadungeon on a conceptual level but have not had a chance to run one, but of the ones I have looked at I have a few that have stuck out to me:

Highfell is a megadungeon plus mini sandbox setting centered around a dungeon on a flying island. So, besides the dungeon itself, it immediately presents the party with the question of HOW THE HELL DO WE GET UP ON THAT FLYING ISLAND?

Rappan Athuk, originally released for 3e but having since been converted to almost every retroclone as well as Pathfinder and 5e, is pretty dang huge. I haven't delved deep into it (ha!) but it also features a whole sandbox surrounding the central dungeon, so there's potentially years worth of content in there.

Finally, not one I have actually read but that I am looking at hungrily, Halls of Arden-Vul. Everyone says it's basically a masterclass of megadungeon design, and I believe them, but also the complete version of that dungeon costs like a hundred bucks. Which is understandable since it was originally released in five volumes. But yeah, it has appeared in Bundles of Holding in the past for as little as twenty smackaroos, so I'm waiting for it to come back.

Anyway, of course a lot of classic TSR modules pretty much fit the megadungeon description these days: Temple of Elemental Evil and Undermountain I feel definitely count, and those two seem to appear on every "greatest D&D adventures ever" list. I've only skimmed through the former, but if you happen to find it floating around somewhere, maybe check it out for ideas!

[stonegearstudios]

Creating a MegaDungeon

So, for a few weeks now, thanks to RPPR, I've been thinking about MegaDungeons as interesting conceptual spaces. It started with Stonehell, but I've been looking at other ones like Highfell, Tomb of 1000 Doors, I backed a Kickstarter called Ave Nox... And unsurprisingly (for me) I started thinking about how I would make one. The guiding thought was "What if you made a MegaDungeon, a constrained and connected space, both above ground and without walls?" From that idea has come 'The Eye of the Storm'

The basic concept is this

Off the coast of a certain area is a storm, a massive, violent hurricane that reaches up through the atmosphere, out of sight.

The storm has been there for as long as anyone can remember, as long as history records, never moving, never shrinking.

The Storm is eternal.

Likewise, it is unknown who exactly first breached the Stormwalls by using powerful magic to briefly calm the winds, but what they found within has become common local knowledge.

Floating islands, suspended on thin air, cocooned in the eye of the storm, rising up. On those islands were ruins of an unknown make, but also strange plants and dangerous creatures. The most dangerous of all being the Elementals that seemed to infest the place.

Over the years many groups have been drawn to the storm. Adventures have breached it in search of treasure and strange mystical reagents, Harpies and other flying creatures considered monstrous have flocked here to roost, and wielders of powerful magic came to study the forces that maintain the vortex.

But none have ever reached Summit, eternally out of reach.

Will you?

So yeah, that's the basic premise of the dungeon. Floating islands inside a eternal storm, progression through the dungeon is like the ascent of a dangerous mountain in some aspects.

The main thought was, most dungeons and MegaDungeons are underground, so could you do the opposite, one where you are under the light of day, exposed to all manner of weather, and where you could physically see in the distance the other levels you were yet to get to?

That also raised the question of how to map out the placement of the floating islands? Eventually I came up with a potential model in Blender

Yes, it looks nonsensical at first, but it's really just a reference for me. The Outline Boxes represent a potential space where a island could be on the 9 layers of the dungeon, while a Green Sphere represents the presence of an island in that space. That way I can remember the positioning of them all in relation to each other and figure out the connections between them.

So far I've got a loose idea of the one at the top and am working on the one at the very bottom, likely the first island any PCs would land on (and the only one that's not floating).

Lot of work to go and I've still got to figure out things like how i'm going to map the islands (I can't draw) and what system I should build the encounters around.

[whoever-i-am]

Starting work on a new campaign! Using Stonehell as the base and finding inspiration in movies such as Mad Max and Pitch Black. Also going to take a page from my Sunday group and plan out campaigns around seasons of 8-12 episodes. This way we can rotate a couple of shows. If we like a particular show we can green light new seasons, if one does not resonate with the group it gets cancelled and replaced with a new show. #starfinder #stonehelldungeon #paizo #themildmanneredgamer #rpg #gamerforlife #tabletopgames (at Ridge, New York) https://www.instagram.com/p/CJj9oXTFicl/?igshid=nz0fwye1sbim

[whereismywizardhat]

Current RPG games

5e Game 1: Stonehell (Wednesdays, alt)

I’m dming this one, it’s pretty classic. Just my group of adventurers, consisting of a half-drow Barbarian who is obsessed with her family legacy of mapping dungeons, a Drow rogue who fled the underground yet cannot escape it’s lure, a kenku rogue who wants to eat shiny things, a bugbear fighter raised among humans who is sending money home, a tiefling sorcerer mystery novelist, a water genasi cleric who is not the brightest, and a Minotaur fighter who seeks honor and redemption through boneheaded decisions; all of whom are trying to delve deep into the ancient dungeon complex of Stonehell.

5e Game 2: Waterdeep Dragon Heist (Wednesdays, alt)

Alternating weekly with Stonehell is Waterdeep, which I play Sir Fionn MacMorne, a Ranger from the Moonshae Isles who came to Waterdeep hunting wererats. The rest of the party consists of a self conscious Wild Mage / Bard who only feels confident when performing as her alter ego, her gnomish adopted brother who is a necromancer with no necromancy spells, a kobold monk seeking revenge on the arena owner who enslaved him, a barber /cultist of a Fey Moth deity hunting his evil brothers, an amnesiac elven druid who may have been an Asmodeus cultist, and a romantic Tabaxi swashbuckler who just got engaged. It’s a lot more of a slice of life game then the first.

5e Game 3: Legacy of the First Growth (Mondays, alt)

A recent addition to my schedule, this game is a world hopping Spelljammer game. I play Decuron Krazag, a hobgoblin warlord from Mystara. The group has thirteen party members, including a cyborg artificer, a winged kobold philosopher, a death knight rune blade, a aaracocra rogue, et cetera. This one has a lot to keep track of and the DM doesn’t really want us knowing each other’s classes out of character. Thus far, we’ve blown up a Drow pirate fleet and crash landed on a planet dealing with an infection that either kills you or turns you into a weredragon.

Godbound, (Tuesday’s, intermittent)

Godbound is a free DND clone where you are playing as nascent deities, it’s hysterical in how overpowered PCs are. I play as Captain Zenda, a sky pirate with a grudge against the Empire and powers over luck. Our pantheon also includes a goddess of invention and dancing, a nerdy god of heroics and adventurers, a grim reaper, and recent addition creepy owl god. We’ve battled against corrupt priests, founded a city with the help of a construct formed from the memories of a pre-collapse hero, fought an anti-matter being in the bowels of a pyramid, and stole a seed from a corrupted artificial god. It’s a lot of fun.

Masks of the Week: Average Academy (Thursdays, alt)

The third season of our Monster of the Week game has shifted to the RPG Masks, as we’re playing college age heroes in training at the newly formed Average Academy. I play Benedeck Montauk, a delinquent oddball who never used a door in his life he could help it. We have some characters who are children of previous PCs, such as Theo, the son of werewolf asskicker Axel from our first season, and his best friend Takeo, a half oni half wizard. Others include Vic, a sapient blob from the Void dimension; Leslie Lawton, Benedeck’s rival on delinquency who has fought with him in 2 of 3 sessions; Tamao/Tamako, a genderqueer fox yokai who likes pulling pranks. There are more characters, but once again there are a lot of them.

Night’s Black Agents: The Dracula Dossier (Thursdays, alt)

This conspiracy thriller follows a group of burned spies battling vampires through Europe. I play Vasili Melnik, a Ukrainian hacker and mobster. We have a Siberian Ex-Spetznaz mercenary, an Egyptian analyst, an American confidence man, and a French cat burglar. This is our darkest game, tone wise, as we are unraveling a conspiracy involving vampires, pharmaceutical companies, British intelligence, and more. No one can be trusted, and the team is not united on what the plan should be.