#Specifically the “if you have sex with men then ur a traitor”

[cruella-devilla]

gonna take a small break from tumble bc I’m getting sick of the whole infighting going on, good grief.

“if a women had close relationships with men then we will never defeat the patriarchy” ok, makes sense, but then what’s the solution? Bc we talk about the B4 movement, the goal is for the e system to change but until then those women will refuse to have close relationships with men and have kids, ext.

fair, fair. But then we get “oh but men will never change, they will always oppress us, they oppress us on a biological level”

Then how do we solve this problem??? Jjst refuse to reproduce and die out??

this is obviously a generalized vent, please, for the love of all that is good, don’t assume that I’m attacking anyone specifically, I’m just noticing a pattern of arguments and it’s getting frustrating bc no actual solutions is being proposed and it always feels like the blame is being shifted on het/bi women.

[batmanisagatewaydrug]

hi! i watched ur stream last night (not live sadly) and... ngl when i heard the actual definition of "political lesbianism" i lost some brain cells. and i'm not wrong in saying that it uses... straight-up homophobic rhetoric... am i? "sexuality is a choice" "lesbianism is The Ideal" "straight women should just swear off men and bisexuals are just confused/can be "converted"" "ur not a True Feminist *cough* Good Christian *cough* if ur not a lesbian" like...? it all sounds horribly familiar.

I don’t know if homophobic is precisely the right word for an ideology that places relationships between women as the pinnacle of feminist praxis, but it is… complicated. let’s break it down!

right off the bat, political lesbianism is obviously biphobic as hell; if you’ve seen the stream you’ve already heard me elaborate on the ways political lesbians dismissed bisexual woman as, essentially, class traitors unwilling to give up hetero privilege to be Real Feminists. so that’s bad!

political lesbianism, especially the original 60s flavor, also had a complicated relationship with actual lesbians. it’s not an explicit part of the ideology, but many who embraced the idea that lesbian relationships were inherently free of the toxicity of heterosexual relationships were also opposed to butch and femme lesbians on the (tired) grounds that they were reinforcing patriarchy by conforming to heteronormative gender roles. so that’s obviously, you know, some unpleasant intracommunity policing right there.

many political lesbian arguments were also tinged by a vague mistrust of sex in general as a corrupt power system, and the types of relationships between women that were most glorified in these discussions were essentially chaste life partnerships without anything overtly sexual about them, which seems more than a little like erasure. we probably shouldn’t be surprised; there’s a pretty clear progression between “any woman could be a lesbian if she tried hard enough” to “actually lesbians don’t even like having sex that much, they’re too pure for that.”

so, that’s a lot. in conclusion? definitely biphobic. maybe not strictly homophobic, but definitely very interested in policing lesbian identities and punishing anything that deviates from a very specific definition of political acceptability. calling it out as conservatism with a gay hat is not, I think, inaccurate.