#Sonic without an ego doesn't really feel like Sonic to me

[generic-sonic-fan]

Not trying to be edgy here but I love it when Sonic struggles with his own protagonist-centered morality. Make that blue hedgehog think that everything he does is objectively correct just because he acts with good intentions, please.

[livewireprojects]

Sonadowtober 2024 Day 17

Day 17 was alter ego

I really enjoy using Nicky in ideas & have some ideas I eventually want to work on. I actually had an idea I wanted to show for last Sonadowtober but I had trouble getting around to it cause digital stuff takes a while for me.

The idea for this pic is Nicky is aware of Sonic & turns into Sonic to save the day & hang out with friends because he feels way more confident when he becomes Sonic & he feels like Sonic is more important than Nicky. Despite this Sonic/Nicky still likes some privacy & it sometimes takes energy to be Sonic so Nicky still shows up if he needs a break from being Sonic. This comes with sacrificing being around his friends because he's self-conscious about telling them(Tails knows & helps because Sonic/Nicky trust him & he's their adopted brother, Vanilla & Cream know because Vanilla kind of adopted him) since he's been Sonic around them this entire time & he feels awkward if he just showed up one day to confess.

The context of this pic is that Sonic helped save the day from something or someone that damaged the city. He used too much energy so is stuck as Nicky & he's injured so can't just run out of there. Shadow & his team were asked to help other GUN agents find anyone still left in the city which led to Shadow meeting Nicky for the first time. Something about Nicky has Shadow worried especially since he can clearly tell Nicky is timid while trying to talk to Shadow & is trying his best to leave. Shadow has no idea this is Sonic & Nicky is nervous about being near Shadow while trying to get out of there without Shadow learning who he is.(Especially since Shadow would ask questions when he realizes Nicky lives with Sonic & Tails)

Shadow ended up dragging Nicky(not literally but you know though he might literally drag Sonic) to the GUN's medbay & staying with him once it was confirmed everyone is safe. This incident leads to Shadow becoming close with Nicky as they get to know each other while Nicky is recovering from his injuries. Shadow & Nicky keep in touch leading to a friend for Nicky when he's not Sonic, Sonic occasionally hangs out with Shadow(especially since they sometimes fight together) which kind of helps them bond a little.

Shadow is unsure how he feels as he was fully prepared to think about a relationship with Nicky but he's starting to feel something for Sonic who he's finally feeling close to. Meanwhile Nicky is wondering if he should confess to Shadow, he's worried what Shadow will think about him not only being Sonic but never telling him. At the same time Nicky wants to finally open up to Shadow because both sides have feelings for Shadow(they've accepted if he only wants one of the egos even if it'd hurt a little) & the ebony hedgehog has made Nicky feel like he matters since for the longest time Nicky has believed it'd be better if he was just Sonic all the time. Shadow made him realize Nicky deserves to exist as much as Sonic & should make time for himself instead of always being the blue hero.(Even if Shadow doesn't know they're the same person)

I want to stress that Nicky some how is able to change his appearance when he turns into Sonic & the energy used/change to Sonic some how allows him to be more confident & behave how Sonic does.(I dunno how to explain this) Nicky has Sonic's memories & powers he just doesn't use them when not Sonic(unless needed) because he wants to save energy(since being Sonic uses energy both power wise & emotional energy wise) for when he really needs it. I dunno how he gained the ability to change appearance & personality.(Personality is likely from confidence boost & lots of energy at once plus needs to keep up appearances)

Link to Sonadowtober theme list

[egg-emperor]

Is it just me or is eggman kinda chill woth amy? I was playing frontiers as amy, when i noticed that all the dialogue between her and eggman is kinda chill, especially when compared to the other characters.

Plus, then there's his egglog about her, where he's kinda, sort of proud of her? I dont think pride is the right term for it, but its the best i can use to describe it.

I mean sure, he did hold a gun to her head at one point, but it feels less out of malice, and more useing her as a bargening chip. Which ultimetly, he would do to any character regardless if it benefited him. Even sage if pushed to it.

Im not too framilar with sonic games though, so i could be wrong about this, but thats the general vibe ive got from them. Deffinetly not freinds, but not as at eachothers throats as i thought they'd be.

Im curiouse to hear your take on this though, since you seem very knowledgable on eggman lol.

Eggman does have an interesting attitude towards Amy in Frontiers. There's definitely been development in the way he feels about her over time, the most significant aspect being he's literally even thinking about her as her own person at all- with his own admission that he used to just see her merely as a pawn to ensnare Sonic in the memo

However now he's seeing her as her own person and calling her clever and tenacious, so clearly something changed. It seems she's proven herself to be more than that in his eyes, likely as he's seen/heard more of her doing things on her own and showing her strengths, independence and determination to work towards her goals

But also not without him saying that he feles she had trouble finding herself, so it seems he thought nothing more of her than just being a pawn to use as bait for Sonic to come along and thought of her as an obsessed fan who's life completely revolved around Sonic. So now she seems more than that to him, he feels it's something to commend her for

He's glad her life doesn't seem to completely revolve around his loathsome arch nemesis lol. It's funny how he says Sonic has an ego too, he's the exact type of guy to groan about someone having an ego or accusing them of such even when they don't because nobody should have an ego or even anywhere near as much as regular confidence like him XD

He's never really seemed that antagonistic towards Amy herself beyond the times he's kidnapped her and that was only with luring Sonic in in mind. He hasn't insulted her in the same ways/as often as with most of the other characters beyond calling her "that kid" condescendingly in Adventure and I think that says a lot about how he used to feel too

He probably saw her as just a little fan girl that wasn't any serious threat for a while and was just a pawn to lure in the ones he was actually interested in fighting so he didn't put that energy into it. However like all the rest, if she causes him trouble and gets in the way he will absolutely become immediately hostile and violent towards them, of course

But it's like he never really considered her an adversary and really just another common enemy just for being on Sonic's side. He couldn't see an identity in her besides chasing after Sonic, just like how he looks down on Tails living in Sonic's shadow. In his eyes nobody should center their lives around Sonic regardless of how true that is lol

Because be probably thought lowly of her in that sense but otherwise just didn't really think of her at all besides that, it probably made it easier to respect any accomplishment she made. When she proves herself to be a worthy opponent he will praise that, we know he's even willing to give credit where it's due with Sonic and Tails too

He seems to like to recognize and commend his enemies on their skills and I feel it's because praising them for their skill and strengths proves his own for being able to hold up against them in battle. Because if they have respectable skills and strengths, what does that say about him for being their absolute biggest recurring threat?

He praises both Sonic and Amy for their tenacity, which is something he of course has a limitless amount of himself, which supports that. Also for the cleverness he praises in Amy. It's like he can see himself in them in a sense and with that it makes even more sense, praising them praises himself, it makes him even more tenacious to be so in the face of their own tenacity

With that it makes sense he projects having an ego onto Sonic too lol. He has confidence but not in the immense egotistical way Eggman does- but because he doesn't believe Sonic's confidence is anywhere near as deserved as his own with the most inflated ego in the world, he thinks anyone else being confident in themselves is egotistical :P He's glad Amy isn't fuelling it

But yeah he's come a long way from thinking a bunch of Sonic's friends were just insignificant common enemies. He'll always become directly hostile the second they directly cause him problems/significantly aid Sonic in doing so but besides that he didn't think much of them, either lowly or not much at all. In Amy's case especially he seemed to hardly see her as enemy but now she's proven herself to be a worthy opponent now that he can see that she's her own person

He's not one to downplay their skills- well except for when he's trying to knock down their confidence in battle lol- when he recognizes them for how they can prove his own. They give him a challenge and he can prove himself and his own strengths even in his failures for still being able to hold up against them and the way that he still manages to keep coming back to try again, also proving his tenacity

In the Egg Memos, it seems he's thought deeper about all of Team Sonic as individuals, who they are, and what they can do rather than just being Sonic's insignificant friends over time. He shares little thoughts on Amy, Knuckles, and Tails in the memos like Sonic in the actual cutscenes. But it's interesting how it seems he has the least bad to say about Amy while he's at it

Their convos in Final Horizon with Amy do seem to be some of the most chill. Eggman acts passively annoyed at being approaching like "what do you want, if you're looking for Sonic he's not here" still acting like her life does revolve around Sonic to her face despite the contrary of what he says about her finding herself in the memos lol, and Amy saying things he doesn't like and sassing him and him getting defensive and correcting her which is funny

But there's not the same immediate hostility between them than say, Sonic and Knuckles. And he seems willing to discuss his knowledge with her, I mean he loves showing it off to all of them but something feels a bit different in his way of going about it, seems a little less condescending than with some of the other characters. They're more casual despite still bickering a bit but they can tolerate each other to get the job done

Eggman isn't the type to hold back on anyone if they get in his way though, so he immediately becomes extremely hostile and violent if she gets in his way, like when she interferes in SA2 and he tries to deal with her and Tails jumps in to save her. He was also willing to kill her the times he kidnapped her, with the way he says if she values her life she'll do as he says when he held her hostage with the gun to her head and threatened that "she WILL die" in Crazy Gadget in SA2

So there's definitely malice towards her in certain situations but yeah when he kidnaps her it's mostly just him seeing her as a pawn to get what he's really after with Sonic, rather than specifically as an enemy to take down, aside from when she specifically gets in his way. But he also seems to think more highly of her as a worthy opponent now, which could potentially lead to that actually changing and he sees her as more of a formidable adversary to fight! I'm interested to see where it goes

[an-obligatory-blog]

late night infinite thoughts/hc/analysis

despite being clowned on for his Ls and "i'm not weak" scene, i don't think infinite particularly childish? or more specifically not in the specific brand of "pathetic sore loser" that's been memed on. like he doesn't feel like the type of character who would throw a tantrum/be visibly upset if he can help it (particularly in front of shadow since that's the guy he's pitted against).

it's not that i don't understand why he left that impression-- the way shadow dlc told his background would ofc lead ppl to feel that it was an overreaction for being kicked a couple of times, but the thing is, we saw how he reacted when he met shadow again and what he said after being told that the hedgehog didn't remember him.

(using screencaps of the jp script, but i'm p sure en is the same jist)

sure, infinite is gassing himself up in this scene because of his shiny new rock, but when i saw this scene, my immediate thought was "so you think you aren't someone worth remembering"? (which can also be extended to his squad mates who were also defeated and thus "weak", regardless if you think they are dead or not) he's not particularly angry in this scene-- if anything, he admits that shadow's words of him being a loser (and thus weak) is /fact/.

hence why i think that infinite hates himself more than he could ever hate shadow. he can hide it by saying "well that's just the old me, i've changed. look at my virtual reality of green hill" but that mask isn't just for show. past or present, he is still himself even if he pretends otherwise. he is insecure, that's true. it's also true that his ego is fragile and that it hangs on his ability to suppress others.

however, his ego isn't unshakable at the face of failure or incapable of self-reflection, even if he wishes it was. the denial phase doesn't last forever.

to put it in another way, he's not the type of sore loser who will go "the other guy must've cheated" or "it's not fair" and deny the other person of their achievement. he's the type of sore loser who becomes frustrated with himself, trains himself to exhaustion, maybe cheat himself if tempted (you'll have to convince him that it would be a meaningful victory if he does though, (re. his logic on relying on magic rock ok, but relying on friends is bad and fake, apparently)), and fall into despair if his efforts don't pay off. that's really what his "i'm not weak" breakdown really is to me-- falling into despair and eventually accepting that he is powerless.

with high ego, he may dismiss losses as a fluke, but that requires plausible deniability to be present to fall back on. my point is that his arrogance doesn't come across as stable, it's just that conquering 99% of the world would convince anyone that they are hot shit.

also, he's not bad at /hiding/ his insecurity. insecurity isn't an aspect that was just added to him in the dlc and thus "ruining" him-- he just hides it well when he started wearing the mask. he only showed a mote of desperation by the end of his final boss fight. before that, we had sonic and the avatar breaking out from null space in record time and while eggman was in shock, infinite just stared silently-- he retained a "mysterious" aura for most of the game despite multiple setbacks. his ability to hide his emotions without his mask is up to you, but at the very least, he would at least /try/ to cover up anything he deems "unsightly".

what i'm trying to say is, i think he'd be upset being called weak, but i don't think that specific "overreaction" he had in shadow dlc is just something that happens every time he's insulted, esp when his ego is in a more stable state.

why he's so fixated about strength and weakness is pure hc territory bc forces writing sure as hell didn't explain it, but i think it's safe to say that he wasn't stable before his encounter with shadow and no matter how many ppl think that his motives are "stupid", this was something that meant a great deal to infinite. why it took until shadow for the camel's back to be snapped, idk maybe something happened to him earlier or maybe not, but regardless, infinite appears to be someone who is very desperate to be proud of himself and he measures how much he is worthy of pride through "strength". those who are strong don't think of those weaker than them, to him. (re. him saying that it's fine that shadow didn't remember his past self, and following up with "you're nothing to me now" bc he believes that he is now stronger than him. also note his quirk in jp where he calls ppl "gomi" (in katakana)/trash, idk jp well i just think it's neat)

this "fraud" quality of infinite's is something i find appealing as his fan, and not in the "i think it's brilliant to have a joke character that parodies edgelords" kind of way (infinite isn't purposefully meant to be joke and i don't think he has to be in order to be "good" with his current backstory). to segway into a different conversation, i don't care of the take that "infinite should've been an artificial lifeform like shadow created by eggman" bc to be frank (and i apologize if this is too spicy of a take), i don't see the benefit to that other than to give infinite more "aura points" by erasing his backstory as a "fraud". (bc a villain that doesn't meet the "aura" threshold is bad, i guess.)

bc here's the thing, right-- there are a lot of things you can compare and contrast between shadow and infinite and create a meaningful analysis out of it, but remember that infinite is the main villain of sonic forces and that sonic forces... is not about shadow.

sonic forces, if anything, is the avatar's story. the avatar is infinite's primary foil.

shadow defeating infinite parallels infinite defeating the avatar (at the start of the game). infinite gains help from eggman and the phantom ruby while the avatar finds the Power of Friendship, Love, and Courage (tm) through sonic. infinite finding solace in "fake" power while the avatar finds "true" strength. infinite believing that he is the one who sees the reality as it is (re. his theme song lyrics), when it was the avatar who sees through his illusions.

and i really like that. idk if these are the right words, but i feel like they stand out because of how "human-like" and "relatable" compared to everyone else (esp the avatar bc they are literally an OC). with the exception of tails (who is instead offset by being a kid genius), the sonic cast is filled with characters that have stronger than average willpower, leaving the "outsiders", infinite and avatar, to play catch up in their quest to find strength. they are not unshakably confident like sonic or endlessly persistent like eggman-- they are, at their core, embody the insecurity and lack of confidence that the ordinary person is more likely to succumb to. infinite is like a bandit boss in a jrpg: has a reputation of being feared, has followers/lackeys, villain vibes, but at the end of the day, they are just the first boss the protagonist wipes at the tutorial. the avatar would be a background character in literally any story except forces. they both "extras" trying to take the spotlight that was meant for the leads.

that is why i genuinely think that his current backstory has more value narrative-wise than that hypothetical one and it's not just preference. i don't care if forces has bad writing-- infinite and the avatar starting off as "ordinary people" as a parallel is neat and i will die on that hill. (and imo this attribute makes infinite a unique villain in the sonic verse. like he's not explicitly sympathetic like merlina was or even overtly tragic like gerald, but he manages to have that pitiable, human-like quality, you know?)

but yeah this is really about him not showing up in sonadow gens. like don't get me wrong, i would've been very happy if had shown up and i did lowkey expect it when i saw sunset heights in the trailer, but i'm not mad that he didn't ngl. for the reasons listed above, i don't see infinite as a "shadow villain" like mephiles and black doom are.

[skaruresonic]

Feel like you're taking 06's unfinished mocappedness over actual characterizing, though fans do the exact same in overly making him seem noble just cuz of taking the last scene OOC, and ignoring everything else

-He curtly tells Rouge he simply was rescuing her, which, kinda rude/blunt

-Mephiles he immediately calls BS

-Sonic he pushes back at the "don't be late" comment

-While he could've joined the others in simply going back to the present after Iblis, he remained out of his own volition of finding out WTF Mephiles is

-Silver he kicks and calls him misguided, rather than be proactive

Shadow isn't really misled or acting out of confusion/vengeance unlike earlier games in 06. It's a culmination of past char dev, along with different circumstance. So he doesn't have much to rib off of

Even then, in game there are a lot of quotes showing his ego. My fav is "Hah! There's no strength in numbers!" When he encounters hordes of enemies in later stages/Hard mode. The scrapped audio of him and Sonic having an Extra mode highlights more his attitude, though not to exaggerated levels like what the fandom does

And then Rivals 1/2, games literally written by Iizuka, was released a couple days later, and he very much is combatitive there to other chars interferring. He's not "softened" or "edged up", he's a very tempermental char depending on context/char interaction. Shadow's ego is very much "tell and show", so if nothing needs to be shown, he won't say as he's generally a reserved person

Later games are similar in that he doesn't have much to go off of in char chemistry for being "bratty", contrary to what fandom says. I'd argue the only bad use of him is Free Riders, cuz he legitimately has no reason or drive to participate in that contest

TLDR: I find fandom stupid, but I find your dismissal of 06 Shadow to fall in the same trap, for different reasons

My bad, I forgot '06 implied Shadow has an IQ of 200. xP

While I get what you're saying, my objections are more that fans call '06!Shadow peak Shadow without considering the fact that '06!Shadow looks like he's dissociating in half his scenes... Even more than the game where he's actively suffering PTSD flashbacks.

In addition, '06's canon status begs questions of just how much weight we ought to be giving it, when other games have largely tackled the same subject matter. We knew that Shadow will fight the world if necessary, since you have the choice to fight the entire world in ShTH.

I honestly don't know what '06 could say about his character that hasn't already been said. Because it seems to me the game offers more insight into Rouge and Omega's views on Shadow than Shadow's views on them, you know what I mean?

Rouge confirms her loyalty towards him and Shadow just stands there. It's not like in Battle where he begrudgingly calls her ally, or SA2 where Rouge's goading compels him to justify himself with "I came back for the Chaos Emeralds."

To say nothing of how the "I'd choose you over the world" sentiment loses a little of its luster when you realize it's not limited to just Rouge in her attempt to make Shadow feel better; Amy and Elise say it to or regarding Sonic as well. So it's not even particularly unique to Rouge and Shadow's relationship in this game anyhow. Compare these scenes. There's no real back-and-forth.

You also read the post where I said I feel the only thing Maekawa seems to think to do with Shadow is stuff him in a capsule, right? I don't really give its inclusion in '06 quarter for being an old game because A.) if folks are calling this portrayal peak, then I'm going to hold it to a fairly high standard, and B.) it's a recycling of the same plot we've seen over and over again, and suffers the same pitfalls of reducing Shadow to a plot device. We already had an evil "mastermind" try to manipulate him in the previous game.

'06 saying "Shadow won't fall for the chessmaster's tricks" is kind of a redundant point to make twice. Mephiles attempts to mess with his head a la Black Doom, but even that conflict falls flat if Shadow doesn't at least buy into it a little.

I've read analyses of '06 Shadow before. Half the scenes people analyze consist of him staring blankly into space. And I get the point they're trying to make, but it's hard for me to overlook the fact that, compared to other iterations, '06!Shadow has no real discernible personality. It's not like in SA2 where he's simply quiet; he's inscrutable in a way that makes him seem dead inside.

He has the exact same look on his face as when he kicks Silver in the head as when Mephiles drops the bombshell on him that the world will turn against him as when he's staring at Rouge's boobs. And I'm not sure if calling this Shadow peak over all over iterations is any better than the accusations that Pontaff-era!Shadow is an edgelord. Because it's like okay I guess, you can overlook Shadow appearing to have no affectation at all, but don't like it when he displays personality in other games?

And then Rivals 1/2, games literally written by Iizuka, was released a couple days later, and he very much is combatitive there to other chars interferring. He's not "softened" or "edged up", he's a very tempermental char depending on context/char interaction. Shadow's ego is very much "tell and show", so if nothing needs to be shown, he won't say as he's generally a reserved person

I wasn't contesting that, lol. xP When I say Shadow's an asshole, bear in mind I'm not saying that's the only thing he can be, of course. I know he is also reserved and isn't always "fight me" depending on the context. But at the same time, I feel like folks don't like to acknowledge that he does have rough edges and a sometimes unlikable temperament.

[operation-619]

What if the reader is an alien that has the same power as superman and stronger than Homelander? The reader works at the Vought and doesn't know the corruption in it until Butcher told the truth. Homelander acts soft on her when they see each other, and Homelander was still confused about his feelings and put his ego shit first. I kinda wanna see Homelander battling the reader when she was trying to protect Ryan and Butcher while Maeve hasn’t arrived yet. She will make him bleed.

Even the strongest man Bleeds.

Edited 17-01-21

Homelander x Alien! Reader

Warning: mentions of blood, language, mentions of death and murder. Violence read at your own risk. 

Bold italics- inner dialogue, Bold- the past. 

WC - 3.1k

Masterlist

“The compound V is what makes them, supes. It’s not real and the golden boy, your Homelander, is the most corrupt motherfucker I have ever met. We need your help (Y/N). Please?” his voice was hoarse, the stress in his words were leaking onto his face. She could see the worry on his face, but she couldn’t bring herself to believe the men in front of her.

“You’re lying to me. Billy Butcher, you have a lot of nerve coming here, you and your gang are mortal enemies to Homelander right now. It’s not safe.” The muscular black man scoffed at her statement and leaned back against the seat. He seemed relaxed but his eyes constantly sweeping the place told (Y/N) otherwise.

“I swear, come back with me and I will show you everything. Please?” his eyes crinkled at the sides as he pulled his face into what looked like a poor attempt at a pleading face. (Y/N)’s mouth was just forming the word ‘NO’ when the man called Mother’s Milk chuckled and leaned forward.

He whispered, “he doesn’t ever say please,” and stood up from the booth and walked out of the café. Her mind was racing, weighing the pros and cons of her current situation. She considered whether or not they were just baiting her into a trap, but she was confident that she could make her way out of it. But it isn’t everyday that two men come waltzing into her favourite café, sit themselves down like they own the place and cough up a semi-convincing story about the corruption at Vought.

“Fuck it,” she whispered under her breathe, “fine I’ll come, it’s good to go out your comfort zone once in a while.” The smile on her face made Billy look at her with confusion painted on his rugged features. She stood, and gestured Butcher to show her the way, “just so you know, I don’t believe you at all.”

(Y/N) replayed her past movement in her head carefully over and over again, and yet she still could not believe how naïve she truly was. But here she is sat in a car that smells like Old Spice, waiting for Frenchie to get the speakers ready. She threw her head back against the headrest and released a shaky breath; everything she believed and knew had been a lie to her. Including John. ‘Oh dear god John, what have you done?’ Her thoughts were getting too loud, they were screaming at her asking how she could’ve been so stupid to not know.

‘How could you not know?’

‘It was right in front of your face you idiot’

‘Your really are a cunt!’

(Y/N) squeezed her eyes shut and rubbed her temples, the stress of all the sudden information was taking a toll on the woman. Whimpering under her breath, she opened the car door and inhaled the cold air. Closing the car door, she leaned against it and watched as the group of friends conversed amongst themselves. The plan was to set off the sonic device and John to go over and destroy the source, and when he does Billy and Becca will drive and get Ryan. She still didn’t know why she was needed, (Y/N) was still processing the information she was given 48 hours ago.

“Okay, 15 minutes and everything will be all set,” the French accent let her know who was talking, but she wasn’t paying that much attention when she felt the hairs on the back of her neck arise.

“Get in the cars!” she whispered harshly, her arms waving about ushering the people back into the cars. (Y/N)’s breath shallowed once everyone was in their respected cars, she creeped forward and looked upwards, watching as the uncovered Nazi zoomed by. She vividly remembered the moment she had met that woman. (Y/N) never trusted that woman, something about the way her heart leaped when an opportunity to hurt someone arose. (Y/N) also didn’t like the way John was towards her, all bark, and no bite- vulnerable.

(Y/N) had never seen John so vulnerable around anyone except her.

The metallic taste in the air is what told (Y/N) that Stormfront had just flown by, the hair on the back of her neck relaxed and so did her posture. Walking over to Butcher, she waited until he rolled down his window before she spoke; “She’s seen the leaked news, my guess is she is going back to Vaught to see what caused that, fiasco.” She heard another window come down, not doubt Frenchie and the others.

“Was she alone?” without turning around she nodded. (Y/N)’s tongue ran across the bottom of her teeth before she turned around and faced the two cars, the cars holding the people that brought the truth to her naïve and simplistic eyes. “What exactly am I doing here? Because, you have the weapons, metaphorical and physical to defeat them. So please, tell me why I am here?” her eye followed the movements of the human bodies getting out of the cars. She could see the look on Becca’s face, and she didn’t like it.

“We’re gonna use ya.” Her (E/C) eyes shot towards MM, he stood there tall and domineering, with his hands on his hips. “Starlight, or Annie told us how soft Homelander is on you. And if things go south, you are our pawn.” (Y/N)’s hearts faltered.

“You humans are so pathetic. I mean, I am old. Older than all of you put together, so I have seen shit that no one can imagine. But the one thing that never changes is the utter stupidity of you homo-sapiens, the selfishness and carnage that I have experienced puts my species to shame.” (Y/N) paced back and forth, her anger evident as black veins started to appear under her (E/C) eyes.

“(Y/N). Please, MM didn’t mean it like that,”

“I did. I did mean it exactly how I said it Becca,” (Y/N) stalked the movement of the vigilante group. Her hearing was being drowned by the loudness of her beating hearts. She watched as Becca stepped forwards and stopped right in front of her.

“My son, who was conceived in the most- my son is in there. I don’t know if you have had children before. But I am not going anywhere until I have my boy in my arms. So please, help me.” (Y/N) flinched when she felt warm hands placed onto her cold shoulders, echoes of her past resonating inside her head. She now understood the look on Becca’s face, the look of a mother- a childless mother that no longer understands their purpose in life. Because she was one.

“Okay, but I want this on my terms.”

The little boy was screaming when (Y/N) landed behind John, crying for his mommy to wake up. She looked around, seeing the two women laying lifeless. She was too late to save them. The metallic taste in the air was getting stronger the closer she walked towards the pandemonium. The woman that confided in her mere moments ago, now lay with blood flowing out the cut in her neck. She watched as Butcher tried to stop the bleeding his white hands now crimson. His whole body covered in blood, soaking him to his soul.

Turning her head, (Y/N) saw John knelt next to Stormfront or what is left of her. The burnt woman mumbling in what sounded like German. “Ryan- ‘her attention went from the barbequed supe to John, ‘did you do this?”

“He didn’t mean to John,” she watched his whole-body flinch at the sound of her voice, she was happy to see his face finally, to get some sort of justification. But the feeling that shot through her body was the complete opposite, the look in his eyes reminded her of herself, and she didn’t like it.

“What are you doing here, I thought you left?” he surged forward and cupped her face, (Y/N) placed her hand on his chest and the other on his hand. She closed her eyes and inhaled her John deeply. “(Y/N), you have no idea, I. I don’t understand.” The beating of his heart grounded her for a moment, everything around them disappeared for a moment as the two of them were caught in their own bubble. But (Y/N) knew the bubble had to be popped. And she had the sharpest needle to do it with.

“John, what happened on the plane.” She was met with silence, the hands gripped her face harder, but her eyes still remained closed. “You left them all to die, didn’t you?”

“I did not leave them to die, I tried to save them. You know this (Y/N), why are you asking me this.” His mouth was talking but his heart told her the truth. Releasing a soft sigh, (Y/N) stepped back from John and finally opened her eyes. The bubble burst when his blue eyes met pitch black, her pupils had flooded the white out leaving a demonic presence behind, the black veins appeared all over her body pulsing violently.

“I know everything John, you have been lying to me. I trusted you, and you know that.” He started to mutter words that didn’t make sense to her, his hands anchored in his hair. (Y/N) watched as the great Homelander fell apart right in front of her, Earths favourite and mightiest hero crumbled under the pressure of words.

“Now let them go John. Please?” when his blue eyes met hers, the look rivalled hell itself. His jaw twitched, tongue pocking out to lick his bottom lip. He never broke eye contact with her, his eyes tracked her like predator to prey.  (Y/N) moved cautiously, never turning her back to John. Once she was stationed in front of Butcher and the kid, she placed her right arm out and behind her. (Y/N)’s ears were ringing, the power surging through her was immense and yet she felt weak. Weak, it wasn’t a word her species spoke, and she never heard of such a word until she came to earth. Vulnerable, weak, powerless, helpless, defenceless, and fragile; all these words are now part of her vocabulary, and she was feeling every single one of them as she looked at the man she had come to love.

(Y/N) had given him not just one but both of her hearts. He was the first person that offered her his hand when the rest of this new world beat her down with their harsh words, he taught her how the ways of her new life, he was her new life. (Y/N) may have been a celestial being, but she knew when something wasn’t right. At first, she thought John was just trapping her, the distance – although not physical – was fluctuating between then constantly; first John welcomed her with open arms, then he kept her at arms-length when they got too close and then the cycle repeated.

But through all the shit he had put her through, she was still there for him. until now.

“We are going to leave, and you will never trouble them again.” Her vision was sharp as she watched the wrecked man in front of her chose the option she hoped he wouldn’t.

“You know I can’t do that, he’s my son.” And with that he charged towards them, eyes red with hunger and rage. His path changed when he felt a fist connect with his cheek, sending him flying into a tree. His world spun, staggering up onto his feet he made eye contact with the shell of the woman he loves. Her black eyes reminded him of a starless night, an abyss that was forbidden to travel.

Something cold dripped onto his lip, and out of instinct his tongue licked it away, he thought nothing of it until the unfamiliar taste of blood slithered its way down his throat. His naked hand came up and delicately touched his nose, he hissed in pain when his calloused hand touch it, retracting his hand he look in bewilderment at the blood sat there taunting him on his hand.

“You broke my nose,” his voice was meagre but loud enough for her to hear the vulnerability in it.

She turned to Butcher and the child hurriedly telling them , “get away from here, quickly,” and before she could turn back around, she was pinned to the muddy floor. Her face caked in the mixture of blood and dirt; she could feel John’s breath on her neck. Without a second thought she flung her head back and used the distraction to spin around and wrap her hand around the heroes throat. (Y/N) paid no mind to the thoughts pounding in her head, she wasn’t about to let them stop her from – whatever she thought she was doing.

“(Y/N) … (Y/N). please.” the air around them froze, she wanted answers but standing here with her hand around the nations saviour’s throat was not the way she needed to get them. “You lied to me John, the one person who promised to never lie to me. You betrayed my trust.” She threw him to the ground.

“You had me working for monsters. They never helped people!” the wind started to pick up around them, her (Y/H/C) hair danced ferociously around her face, a face that was covered in black veins pulsating in rage. (Y/N)’s head snapped to the right when she heard a twig snap, her vision was met with Butcher and the kid watching her in astonishment and fear. The kid was hiding behind Butcher, just his head poking out watching (Y/N) beat up his father. And god did he look like John. 

(Y/N)’s body moved before she could even realise what was happening, her left hand came up to stop the blow coming her way and then she knelt down, using John’s momentum against him, she throw him over her shoulder. But the outcome wasn’t in her favour as he managed to land on his feet. And then he was charging at her. Punches were thrown and bodied flung everywhere, (Y/N) couldn’t bring herself to kill John, but it felt good to hurt him.

 “He’s my son (Y/N). He needs me!” his words were met with a foot to his chest.

 “No one need you John, not after what you did,” her elbow jabbed into his stomach, causing his arms to release her waist, she looked at his body lying pathetically on the forest floor. Americas strongest man, the embodiment of patriotism and pride had fallen to his knees.

 “(Y/N), you have and always will need me’, his blue eye sparkled with malicious intent, ‘no one wanted a freak roaming our home, but because I stood by your side, they welcomed you. But the moment I’m gone. You will be nothing. But a monster to the people you love so much.” Blood came flying out of his mouth as he spat his words at her. His armour had crumbled and all he had left was his words.

 “Stop” the alien smiled at the hero on his knees, her eyes only moved off his body when she felt a presence next to her. John started to get up, but (Y/N) swiftly moved forward, wrapping her arm around his neck, and gripping his hair with her free hand. She forced him to stay down, on his knees.

 Maeve came into sight, moving cautiously like she was afraid he would brake from his bond. She stopped when she was right in front of the disgraced hero. 

“What the fuck are you doing here?” (Y/N) could feel John shaking in her grip. The two looked at each other in silence for a while, their eye contact unbreakable. (Y/N) spared a glance at Butcher, who was still stood in the same place.

 “You’re going to let them go,” the man in question scoffed but immediately fell silent when (Y/N) tightened her grip on his hair. He cleared his throat, moving subtlety before answering the Queen. 

“And if I don’t?” his ego spoke louder than the words coming out of his mouth, he was confident that everything was going his way. Both Maeve and (Y/N) knew that. But the moment Maeve held up the recording of the plane (Y/N) could physically feel The Homelander admitting defeat. The cries of the passengers echoed through her head, along with the bullshit lie the man in her arms fed her. ‘there was nothing we could do, the terrorist had too much control I tried to save them (Y/N). I tried.’

“You’re going to stop hunting Starlight, you’re going to leave me and Elena alone. Or I release this.” there was no room for argument, and he knew that. But he had to open his mouth. “If you do that, I’ll destroy everything and everyone.” (Y/N)’s grip tightened, she dragged his head backward and brought her lips to his bloody ear. Her voice was cold, no hint of vulnerability, no hint of emotion. 

She could feel his bones quaking under her arm as she tightened her hold on the man she had come to love. The man that made everything feel less painful, the man that she called a true friend. But standing here in the middle of a forest with two dead women, a sobbing child and a emotionless man; she realised that what her people said about the human race was true. And John had proven that to her. It took everything in (Y/N) not to simply break his neck but she wanted him to hurt. 

She wanted him to bleed.

 So, she looked up at Maeve and signalled her to get the two boys out of here, she wanted to be alone with him. she willed herself to calm down, she knew she wasn’t in the right headframe to talk to John because if she did so now, his head would be lying two feet way from his body. So, she whispered to the man calmly, hearts no longer racing with hatred or fear. She let the venom in her voice speak for itself as she whispered to Homelander. But she let man she loved hear the pain in her voice, because the man she was holding was not her John, her John had died the moment Butcher and Mother’s Milk sat down across from her in the café. However, (Y/N) had comfort as she let the ten simple words leave her mouth, because she knows that no matter how much Compound V is pumping through his body. Even the Strongest man bleeds.

 “If you do that Homelander, I will make you bleed.”

|=|=|

Hello beautiful people, I hope you enjoyed my little piece, feel free to leave comments about what you liked and didn’t like, I’m okay with a bit of constructive criticism I believe it will help me get better, and if you want anything else.

[bloodontheredrose]

My Brutally Honest Opinion on the new BTS album...

*Please note this is just a personal opinion.

I decided to post it because I wanna see if there are armys out there with the same opinions or it might be just me, having this kind of feelings about the 7 album.

* It took me a while to process it so here it is.

I honestly believe "Persona" had more potential to get a Grammy than this one. That's why is depressing Persona never got a nomination. I'm gonna explain it.

My biggest problem with this album is the boring, empty, blunt production when the boys wrote some of the best lyrics and songs of their careers.

SHADOW: is one of my favorite tracks. Nothing much to say about it. It's Yoongi. Dark, real and raw. It also sampled a past song, so the production it's automatically a success.

BLACK SWAN: I loved the concept. It took some time for the song to grow on me. Powerful lyrics but something was wrong with the melody. The first times I listened to it, I couldn't remember it. I couldn't recall the chorus. I personally think that when a song doesn't leave a trace in your mind the first time you hear it, it's not a powerful song. Because it's forgettable.

FILTER: It perfectly describes Jimin. A Libra King. Jimin the people pleaser. The song is fun, it makes you move but I heard it before. Nothing deep. Nothing original about it. It's a mix of Ed Sheeran, Camila Cabello... drunk latino vibe. Another song that grew on me with time.

MY TIME: I was convinced this song was dedicated to JK's secret hookup with all that " I can't call ya", " I can't touch ya" in English. It's a sex song until you read the lyrics. Weirdly, it bored the hell out of me the first time I heard it to the point I wanted to skip it. It gave me The Weeknd vibes and despite the meaningful, sad message it failed to make me feel emotional. Up until, like I said, I read the translation.

LOUDER THAN BOMBS: The moment at least 10 people tweeted, including Troye Sivan, that they worked on it...my expectations went crazy high. It delivered. It caught me from the first second but it was not as good as I expected it to be. Way too short and it would've been easy to make it longer by giving V and Jin a proper number of lines. Just saying.

ON: is the biggest disappointment on this album for me. Specifically because it's the lead single. I loved the lyrics, I loved the concept but once again, just like JK's solo, I couldn't connect with it. It was as forgettable as Black Swan and it took 2 days for me to remember the chorus. A failure if I were to compare it with their past singles like " Fake Love" " Idol" etc. A thing that makes you forget the vibe of the song the first time you hear it, it's actually Jk's beautiful bridge. Somehow it breaks the vibe of the song and I think they could've easily avoid it to make the song more catchy.

UGH!: The rap line always gets it right. And they did. It's the best song on the album because the song delivered both lyrically and sonically...

Zero O'clock: I expected a Truth Untold when I heard it's the vocal line doing it. It didn't happen. It bored me the first time I heard it and it grew on me the second time I listened to it and looked up the lyrics.

INNER CHILD: It made me cry the first time I heard it and I cried harder the moment I read the lyrics. It's the only solo on the album that actually delivers. It's personal, it's emotional, it's Tae...

FRIENDS: A private, fun song. It perfectly describes them. I felt like an intruder while reading the lyrics in English but I disliked the sound the first time I heard it. Not my type and I think it's harder for people who don't know V or Jimin to connect with it.

MOON: I honestly think Jin is underrated so I expected more from his solo. It's a beautiful song he dedicated to the armys but I really wanted him to take off the insecure, " I'm world wide handsome" mask. I know he's more than that and I wish that will come out also in his songs. Wished he would've went as deep and personal as Kookie and Tae did honestly.

RESPECT: It gave me nice vibes. Like driving in a car with the sun in front of you. It brought back old memories. It's a chill song. Though... Despite belonging to two of the best writers and producers in the group it doesn't say much lyrically. All you hear for half of the song is Yoongi's sexy Daegu dialect " What is respect, dude?"

WE ARE BULLETPROOF: THE ETERNAL: It disappointed me at first because after all the previous slower, ballade songs I wanted this one to go higher like the first bulletproof did and maybe be the next Dionysus. It didn't happen. It's more the Mykrokosmos of the new album and I accept it since it shows how BTS changed, closing an emotional circle. It's the song that gave me goosebumps reading the translation because it reminded me they're about to go to military service and in the future retire. So it hit hard. It felt like this song was screaming "this is the last album you get as 7" right in my face. I can't quite listen to it without this thought coming up. Even tho it might not be true. It's excruciating.

EGO: When it came out as a trailer after Shadow I didn't quite enjoy it. I wanted Hobi to go in a different, darker direction. But it completes the album and is the perfect song with its vibe to close it.

ON feat. SIA:

*insert "what was the reason" gif*

I don't wanna say they robbed Sia because maybe the guys told her what she was supposed to sing and she sang it the way she sang it. It was horrible af. It sounded awful. The more I hear it, the more it annoys me. She tried too hard to sound like them or get into their vibe. Which makes me think she has no idea who they are. She sounds like a twelve year old who recorded herself singing the chorus over the original song. I didn't even recognize her voice at first. I remember the team at the conference before the release how they were rambling about Sia bringing different colors to the song and the song being different from the original. Uhhhh... Where? It sounds exactly the same and at times you don't even notice her. This colab was wasted, Sia's voice was wasted and it wouldn't have been that hard to give her a proper verse. Whatever...

In all honesty I think the album, despite its emotional baggage, is too weak to go to the Grammys. It's an album dedicated to the armys. It's already hard to understand the guys in Korean. If you are not a fan and the songs don't catch you at the first listen, if they don't tell you much despite the language is 100 times harder to reach these other people. I thought Persona was that kind of album. I remember how I felt when I heard " Singularity", " Pied Piper" " The Truth Untold" for the first time. No songs on the new album delivered that kind of feeling for me. It might be just me so...

I just wanna say I am thankful for BTS and their music but it's ok to have conversations about things we don't like I guess.

IF YOU DISAGREE PLEASE BE RESPECTFUL.

I 💜 YOU!

[egg-emperor]

'Show me one time where he's genuinely a good person with good intentions, where selfishness, ego, and desire to survive and save the world so he can rule it isn't involved. There isn't any.' ehh, i don't know, id argue eggman saving tails in lost world counts. dude doesn't need tails to get past the yeti, only sonic. he yells 'tails!' to try and alert him and sounds generally concerned when doing so. He also makes the decision to save him in less than a second, meaning he didn't have time to weigh the pros and cons of saving one of his worst enemies, he just instinctively went to help him. mind you, this doesn't even contradict him threatening to turn tails into mincemeat in sa1, because as he explains, he's a complicated guy *shrug*. not trying to start any drama or anything, but i def believe there are a few stand out moments in game canon when eggmans 'human side' is shown that cant really be explained away without heavily reaching imo

I knew this could possibly be one of the moments someone could raise. But I have a response locked and loaded, I always account for everything and am ready to go lol. And I don't think it requires what I'd consider heavy reaching to explain away because I go by what can be seen/heard of game then carefully think about what it means while considering his character and what tracks with everything we know.

I see Eggman's save of Tails as calculated decision. There are a lot of benefits: Making the team up seem more genuine and convincing, winning Sonic over some more and possibly finally Tails after how hostile they were towards each other, the way the more is up against the D6, the better, and the way Sonic could possibly be less focused on the mission if he lost Tails. Also the bonus of how he'd prefer to kill both Sonic and Tails more personally than some random unplanned battle robot, just like Sonic falling into lava would've been underwhelming.

Eggman could see that he was starting to gain Sonic's reliability when he said that they need him to shut down his machine, while Tails wasn't happy about it and felt like Sonic trusted Eggman more. So if he jumps in and acts like a hero and saves Tails, it's going to help him seem more genuine and possibly win Tails over more too after their beef with each other. It makes sense for him to be prepared to act to seem convincing whatever it may be, even though he of course couldn't have predicted the modified robot to attack him.

I don't purely say this off vibes because when Sonic says "you could've gotten yourself killed" Eggman quickly smiles behind Sonic which makes him seem very suspicious I love it lol

It looks sly and mischievous for a guy who just saved someone's life, it's not giving "he did it out of the goodness of his heart", more like "yes it's working, Sonic said he 'can't figure me out', I'm convincing >:)"

If you think it's not possible that he could've thought that fast to weigh pros and cons, he had the plan to betray Sonic and Tails the moment they got him past the Deadly Six and back to his machine and new Eggrobo all along. So I contextualize everything within this. That gives plenty of time to plan on trying to make his facade of a willingness to work with them without any tricks all the more convincing. This is why I feel that him jumping in to save Tails was more calculated than it appears at first watch.

Plus, we know he can think and act that fast anyway. Because in the Lava Mountain scene where he fakes his death, he was planning to do that the whole time and was prepared but he couldn't have expected for it to be kicked off by the Deadly Six breaking the bridge. Yet he was able to quickly act to save Sonic, so he could still keep the Zeti back while he went to reprogram the machine and he could destroy him himself with his new mech as planned.

Him suddenly thinking fast to save Sonic was for selfish and sinister self motivated reasons, and I think it makes a lot of sense for the same to apply to Tails.

Shrugging it off and saying he's just a complicated guy was also the perfect thing to say that wouldn't make it obvious that he was trying to convince them to keep him around. Because otherwise they would've likely realized it doesn't add up with how he was acting just a couple scenes ago when he said he thinks he "liked it better when [he] was trying to destroy [Tails]" If he dismisses it in such a casual way that can't be disproven, he's not trying too hard to convince them.

But if you think parts of that are a little too speculative, though it does have a little something on screen and the context of why he's teaming up with them to support it, we can also go by how he visibly acts much more blatantly in the later cutscene at Silent Forest, when Tails falls into the trap.

Eggman has no reaction, he just stands and silently watches. Doesn't even have the slightest look of suprise or shock like the Frozen Factory Tails save cutscene, which makes the latter feel more performative of a response while he was right in front of Sonic.

He then gives Sonic a little speech while he's devastated to motivate him, so that he'll "make sure his sacrifice isn't for nothing", his sly way of saying "alright but you've still gotta help me, I'm not letting you get hung up on this" lol

He needs to make sure Sonic won't lose focus of their mission and still work hard and not lose hope, so he can get him past the Zeti and betray him later.

And he just gives a little "eh whatever" shrug while Sonic isn't looking again. Much like how he grinned when Sonic wasn't looking in the other scene. Like when Sonic isn't looking, you see the real same old Eggman and how he really feels about both situations.

It's really funny how much he just doesn't even react or give a fuck in this scene lol. I think it really testifies against him really caring about Tails in his previous save considering this is the next cutscene he's even in.

It makes sense for the reasons behind the save is a combination of performing heroics to seem more reliable in this truce because he was planning to betray them the whole time, along with how he expected Sonic to lose focus of their mission and not perform as well if he was devastated by the loss of Tails. So when he couldn't save him this time, he brings out the little motivating speech since it's all he can do now.

Especially since the modified battle robot would've certainly resulted in Tails' death which of course would've had a heavy impact on Sonic and could've affected his performance, while they weren't sure what the Deadly Six were going to do with Tails though Eggman did think of it as like a "sacrifice". So I see that as explaining his earlier actions of the save.

Like this, I can't think of any others that I wouldn't also have an explanation for that tracks with the way he's selfish and self motivated. Lost World, to me, really seems like another prime example of that instead. I love Lost World Eggman and just how much there is to explore and consider about his actions, knowing that he was using them and was going to betray them the whole time.

Eggman does a have a human side and genuinely human moments in the series because being human isn't being a good person. There are many ways to be. Selfishness is very human too. He has a bunch of human traits and moments that remind us that he's human and none involve him being a genuinely good selfless or caring person because it's not required for him to be.

I haven't seen anything that people use as examples of him being a good person that I can't find reasons to argue against and they don't require any huge reaches or speculation as there are always scenes and dialogue to support my points, like the stuff I used here. The more I go back and reanalyze, I only find more to support them despite my open mind and neutrality looking into it.

I only see a pure evil villain with a funny side who is exclusively self motivated only acts for purely selfish reasons that personally benefit him. Which tracks with the kind of egotist and narcissist he is, it's the strong defining core of his character that influences his mindset, goals, and actions throughout the series consistently. There isn't any scene where I can see any exceptions to this.

I encourage you to have your own take and disagree so we can have a discussion like this though. I understand you're not trying to start drama and respect your perspective, I'm interested to see and discuss and share my thoughts. I understand what it's like for people think it's your intention though, it sucks. This is always a chill space to agree or disagree as long as you're chill about it too. 🤝

[egg-emperor]

I'm really happy I got to play Sonic Dream Team in the end. playing Sonic games really is a whole other vibe than just watching them, getting to immerse myself and experience it makes me feel so much more connected. I feel like I got to go to Ego City instead of just seeing it on a YouTube video and with poor quality low bit rate. XD and it's best to experience the story like that too because it was happening in real time and I had to earn it and have time to think about it in between cutscenes.

just makes me think about how I always highly recommend playing any Sonic games you can before properly analyzing and forming an opinion on any aspect honestly, even story. hell, I didn't even understand and like Frontiers for gameplay and story until I played it all the way through, not the first time but the second time. I understand that in the circumstances of Dream Team specifically, it makes sense that a lot of people unfortunately can't play it because it's limited to just Apple devices.

but for most of the other games, there are a number of ways to play, mostly easy and affordable, especially any game older than like five years old are so easy to get a hold of and pre-owned consoles can be cheap if you can't afford a brand new one or crazy gaming PC. I just really highly recommend more people playing and beating the games, any and all of the main Sonic titles you can. it's really a whole different experience than just watching any of them on YouTube, you may end up feeling much different about a lot of aspects.

I've played and beaten every single Sonic game that's possible for me to obtain in my 18 years of being a fan. that includes all main series titles and most spin offs. only ones I haven't ever played at all are rarer or straight up impossible ones without spending 100s-1000s. I've had every kind of console across those years BUT you can get a lot of the most important Sonic game titles on the Wii (not Wii U, get Wii for the GameCube compatibility for more games) and Xbox 360 especially, with all the different available titles, game collections, etc and the pre-owned console and games for both can be so cheap

playing the games is always a wildly different and way better experience for me than anything else to do with the series and watching videos really doesn't ever feel the same to me. I always highly recommend playing as many as you can

[egg-emperor]

Heya I just finished Sonic Frontiers and while I was trying to avoid spoilers, I did think of you when it came to the Eggman stuff in the game. I can definitely understand why you would be disappointed in the direction they went with with his character in the game. I don't mean to come off as trying to argue against your take away or say your feelings are wrong at all, how you feel is totally valid, but I just wanted to say when it came to how my interpretation of it was:

to me it felt like Eggman having a view of himself as Sage's father felt like it came from a place of his typical narcissism and psychopathy. There's the Egg Memo where he looks down on the idea of creating life as "just a bunch of proteins bumping together" and that the life HE created is so great and awesome because HE made it. It felt like almost like self deification or something. HIS creations, and his method of creating them, are superior to the genetic accidents of nature. He even kind of comes across as thinking the idea of procreation via sexual reproduction is sickening to him.

When he says he's proud of Sage it's like saying "I'm so proud of the new song I just put out" it's not like you're saying you think the song is doing a good job. It's an expression of self pride. He's literally saying he's proud of the thing he created, he's proud of HIMSELF. Anything she accomplishes is a reflection of his own genius. And in the end he's still willing to let her sacrifice herself without hesitation. There's no emotional second guessing or doubt, he just says "yup, go do it, I know you'll succeed (cuz I made you and I'm awesome)." That's just how it came across to me anyway.

I mean Eggman's usual ego tripping is still present all over the game. In the Egg Memo where he mentions Maria, he literally says "why was everyone so head over heels with Maria when I'M THE REAL STAR OF THE SHOW HERE!" And when he teams up with Sonic on the last island he does so under the rationalization of inducting Sonic into a part of the Eggman Empire and then ORDERING him to go collect the chaos emeralds. It felt on brand to me anyway.

Like I said I definitely get why you would come away from it feeling sour. Hopefully the idea that Eggman is canonically a DILF now is comforting? (I was making a lot of "I call Eggman daddy too" jokes during the final stretch of the game >.> )

I appreciate the understanding of my feelings about it. It's nice and refreshing to have someone finally present a different perspective without insulting my intelligence and denying the knowledge I have about Eggman and raising some actual points.

Your interpretation is definitely one of the few accurate ways I feel it would go if they wanted the dynamic to exist at all and I'd really like to believe it was the case and intention with it. And it actually almost would've came off that way to me as it mostly felt one sided from Sage only on an actual genuine sincere level, if it weren't for the weird parts of the memos where Eggman called her "the best" and acted like he sees her as an actual being and family, and how the final scenes tried to make it sad and dramatic and imply sincerity on a deeper level than pride in a creation.

He should've just said something typical like she's his greatest creation yet, so he's especially clear that he's praising himself as creator because he'd never say any other being was "the best", as they imply he sees her as a person rather than AI. They almost got that reflection of ego in it right in the memo about being able to create life and the superiority of him being the creator and I liked that (and how it can be interpreted as aversion to actual sexual reproduction lol) but again, the implication of seeing her as more than an AI and like family doesn't feel right to me.

His selfish thoughts on Maria (aside from the weird questioning of if Sage was like her because why would he care) and how he acted towards Sonic with his childish stubbornness in needing to feel he was still getting his way by ordering Sonic for the Empire are my favorite parts and this interpretation would've fit in perfectly with them. I can see him saying he's proud and she's his greatest creation yet for her loyalty like he has with other creations and yeah, everything he praises and is proud of is actually just reflecting pride in himself as her creator no matter what.

But calling her the best and seeing her as anything more than artificial and even as family made it seem too personal and sincere. There were memos that seemed to be going in the right direction but took weird turns, and especially in the final scenes as if they wanted us to believe that he suddenly saw a creation as important beyond serving their purpose, saw her as a person and family, and cared about someone in any way since he seemed upset to let her go and lose her, rather than just disappointed like simple line changes would've done.

And that's what bothers me most about it really, how it feels like they got so close to getting it right at multiple points and it kind of seemed that this interpretation was the real intention and I love it- but then the implications of thoughts of being like family and caring for "the feels" had to be abruptly forced into the memos and final scenes and ruin it and made him seem like Mr. Tinker with Belle to me, instead of anything the real Eggman would think and feel and act. But just small adjustments to the English dialogue would've changed everything.

It makes me feel better to try to think of the scenes with this interpretation in mind but I feel like that's not what they were really trying to go for with those weird parts that stick out and feel ooc in particular and I'm sad about it because it would've been so much more accurate this way instead. But it's been done in a way that has people thinking he might suddenly stop being evil, actually has a soft caring side, is genuinely a family man, etc and it really irks me. It was already bad and overexaggerated enough in fanon when it wasn't part of game canon and it's about to get worse.

In a way yeah being able to call game Eggman a dilf now too is one good thing that I could take away from it but also he's my daddy, back off Sage >:( lol

[egg-emperor]

Eggman might be a rather realistic sociopathic and/or psychopathic villain. He can blend in well when he wants to and strikes coldly and indiscriminately simply due to not giving a damn. He can easily act like he'll help you then stab you in the back. His charisma got him buddy buddy with the president in Sonic X. Hell, his hypocritical characterization in Sonic X (Despite so fans reaching in order to criticize it.) is pretty on-point.

TL;DR: The guy is a monster. Also, if he wanted to, he could blend in with society and that makes him more dangerous.

If anything, he's not the typical cartoony villain because he's more realistic than that. Hell, in Sonic Adventure 1 Sonic interprets everything he says as cheeky jokes. Tails on the other hand is scared of Eggman and interprets everything as menacing threats (The truth is probably in-between. But, Sonic treats everything as a game, so.... He doesn't seem to take Eggman seriously as the threat that he actually is. Maybe it's his ego, age, and/or the fact that he's being manipulated by Eggman.).

Shadow seems to be the only one who sees Eggman as the actual threat that he is and understandably wants to end the man when he finally gets the chance. Shadow has lost loved-ones before. Shadow has the scars and PTSD. It's not just a game to Shadow because he sees the actual grim reality of letting Eggman live while Sonic wants to play like a child.

I really think he is, along with being the perfect example of a narcissist. It's interesting to read into his actions and analyze him deeper while acknowledging and understanding this and his personality, behavior, and actions for what they're really shown to be. I feel that those who try to put a whole other spin on it are missing how cleverly well put together and accurate he is. He's genuinely self-centered and it reflects in all his actions. Everything he does is for the purpose of furthering his own goals and he'll do great evil to accomplish it and that's a part of what makes him so interesting. I don't need every bad guy's actions to have a nicer deeper meaning, a more sinister one is way more interesting to me after seeing so much of the former.

And it's true too, Eggman's narcissistic behaviors and apathy aren't fake and that's how he can do what he does. He isn't hiding a secret nicer and more caring side because he's so bold, confident, and unashamed to be evil and cruel and that's why he's never felt a single ounce of remorse for his actions. The only thing that ever really gets hidden is his evilness when he's lying and manipulating people or forming a truce, which always ends in backstabbing and going back to evil without hesitation after he gets what he wants. He can have the charisma and great acting skills to make people believe a huge untrustworthy liar like him regardless of his reputation and that makes him even more dangerous.

It shouldn't downplay his actions in the way people try by saying "but he's not so bad, look at this time he wasn't evil/he did a nice thing." Instead, it actually emphasizes his evil because he's capable of doing good and could choose to be for genuine reasons if he wanted to- but he does it only when it's necessary for the sake of his own selfish gain, goals, and the safety of himself and the world he wants to rule. It's always about himself and what he can get out of it. He is a selfish sly, manipulative, cunning, and backstabbing monster at heart, and how he can be cold, cruel, and merciless one time and can blend in and do seemingly good things while faking goodness the next to get what he wants is great. It shows he'll do whatever it takes.

Eh, I like most of X Eggman but that hypocritical moment in particular in season 3 wasn't really in character in the way it was handled and it's a part that bothers me most about his otherwise almost perfect and deeply beloved portrayal of him to me. It looked like it was implied to be a genuine belief of his, instead of him playing up a sly act as usual, as if he just suddenly had a huge change of character with no development leading up to it whatsoever and it blatantly contradicted his prior actions in the show. He can indeed be a hypocrite but the show didn't handle it the right way when it gave people the completely wrong idea of his character.

But when it's done right it's another of the many most interesting and entertaining traits that can have a lot of impact when it's handled well and proves how sly, calculated, and heartless he can be. Especially when he takes advantage of kind-hearted, soft, vulnerable people and then laughs in their face and mocks them for it when he gets what he wants, or doesn't care and is completely apathetic towards the pain that he's caused and shrugs it off.

I don't think you can really put the blame on Sonic for Eggman still being alive, though. Even if he does tend to mock him more than he blatantly vocally acknowledges how serious of a threat he is, though there are moments of the latter where Sonic realizes there's no time for jokes and gets serious. He clearly doesn't go easy on him in consideration of his safety, there are many times where he's been careless towards what happens to Eggman in a defeat despite the dangers, even if it could possibly result in his death.

So there are multiple factors, Sonic does love the thrill of adventure and the challenges Eggman brings, sometimes treating it like a game, just like Eggman can too. But depending on the situation, he can certainly get serious. And it's not really a matter of him letting Eggman go, it's that he always manages to get away/escape unscathed and is amazingly durable too, it seems nothing can kill this man lol (except for a karate chop apparently and the one time he couldn't evacuate/survive an explosion but those weren't canon :P)

I don't think Shadow is the only one that recognizes Eggman as a threat, he just has a different style of dealing with threats and just isn't the type to make jokes or make a game out of it in the way Sonic does. Shadow is also more often willing to kill when he feels it's most necessary than Sonic with his antihero status, but Sonic still isn't really carelessly letting Eggman get away, it's not like he doesn't leave him in danger at the end of many of his defeats despite all the great destruction, explosions, and falls that he caught in as a result.

Both still want to take him down when he's causing trouble and will do whatever it takes but neither can bring the man down for good because he's that good at surviving and getting away.

[egg-emperor]

I really like that scene with Starline you mentioned because although IDW often gets Eggman wrong, that moment hit the nail on the head. This. This is why he always fails in the end. Because he can’t just get rid of Sonic, he has to make it a huge victory and that’s where he slips up every time. His need for the special moment where he has Sonic in his clutches is his downfall, because it leaves Sonic room to escape. And I think he knows it, too. But he just can’t let it go for the sake of his own ego! It’s a very good way to frame things because it allows for the glorified game of cat and mouse to keep going without it becoming unrealistic that Sonic always wins, by making it a key point of Eggman’s character. It’s the one thing he just can’t let go, it’s his main character flaw. And I love that, because it’s not that he’s stupid or doesn’t think things through, it’s that his focus on his plan always slips in favour of going for Sonic personally. It’s just not as fun if he nukes the whole area, he needs to have the hedgehog in his clutches personally. I know I’m sort of rambling, but I just love those moments where you can really get into Eggman’s mind and see exactly what he needs for his win to be worth it in his eyes.

I loved that scene for the writing too, my liking isn't just a case of me only liking the art and the way that it's very thrilling and sexy to see Eggman physically attack someone. It certainly plays a part heheh, but this page was also in the earlier days of the Metal Virus arc, when I actually liked what his portrayal seemed to be shaping up to be. At that point, I'd loved it from the moment Starline helped him get back to his real glorious ingenious self. It feels so weird remembering how much hope I had.

And the scene provided a reasonable explanation for why he doesn't typically aim to kill Sonic in the fastest most simple way possible, if he has the choice. One that isn't 'ooh he secretly cares and can't really bring himself to kill him!' because that would massively contradict canon. Which is why I'm baffled by the way I've seen this scene interpreted as him having a soft spot for him and not wanting him killed. He's literally saying that he should be the one to do it instead of Starline, hello???

There have been other examples of him having a similar reason to keep Sonic alive in various media, with game canon examples being: Eggman saving Sonic in Lost World- he didn't want him to die simply by falling into lava by something the Deadly Six caused, he wants it to be his doing. He needed Sonic to hold off them off while he took back control of the energy extractor and destroy Sonic by himself with the Eggrobo that was powered by the energy from the extractor that he regained control of after betraying him.

Also the way that he kept Sonic locked up for six months in Forces- he wasn't sparing his life because he cares about him. He was keeping him alive so he could show him his completed empire before banishing him and dealing with him as necessary for good. He'd find victory most satisfying when he can make him know what it feels like to be defeated, proving his power, brilliance, and superiority, and finally accomplishing his goal so he can rule the world and make all the dreams of the glorious Eggman Empire come true at last.

Also note that, after Infinite is defeated, he says he didn't believe he could lose but that victory will be so much sweeter when he defeats Sonic because it's not anyone else's job. Having him successfully weakened and locked up and gaining 99.9% of the world is something to be immensely proud of, yes, but true victory to him is when he gets to complete that final step by destroying him. And it'll be much sweeter if he's the one to do it instead of Infinite, so he's truly beaten by him and he can prove his superiority.

It's a similar deal with this scene in particular in IDW. Eggman is pissed off with Starline because he's trying to go behind his back, act without permission, and destroy Sonic by himself without even asking if it'd a sudden move he should make. These are things that Starline should've taken his word for because he'd keep on making similar mistakes by going behing his back again to bring in the D6 and then trying to defeat Sonic and hand over the throne, despite Eggman very clearly wanting to defeat him himself and it's his victory to earn, not Starline's.

There are times where it's no longer a choice/he becomes desperate to kill him there and then, especially in the heat of the battle where he's clearly trying to kill him by any means necessary. Then it doesn't seem to matter how he does it. But Sonic manages to win and in the end he always goes back to wanting to draw it out and make it more impactful and more personal, so he can truly feel that he's gotten the most satisfying victory he desires after all the times he's gotten in the way of getting what he wants. He wants to finally get the last laugh and all the power he's always wanted!

While it's not always the case as sometimes we see that he settles for other robots, deities, or lackeys to destroy him, I also enjoy the concept of him having a type of fucked up possessiveness where he ultimately feels that Sonic is his to destroy, if he has the choice and feels it's the right time and place. And nobody else is allowed to try to do it for for him if he didn't say that they could, like Starline. I like his aggressive assertion of this desire, proving how damn serious he is about it. He isn't just messing around like some people think he is and it's certainly not out of a care for Sonic.

I think it's a good reason to put behind why he doesn't just quickly kill Sonic and have it over and done with just like that. Also a way to prove that he doesn't fail all the time because he's incompetent and lazy with the execution of his plans and doesn't take his chances (which IDW still decided to imply later on despite this scene, for some fucking lame and bizarre reason ugh), it's because he has a set goal and a specific way of doing things and he does get a thrill out if it and belief that he'll get it some day. After being a thorn in his side for so long, he wants his victory and Sonic's loss to be greater than ever, so he can feel truly accomplished and superior!

[egg-emperor]

I feel that in a lot of fan portrayals the common theme (other than the whole deal in my previous post) is that Eggman seems to have his villainy downplayed to purely soft and friendly with a secretly good side where he desires to do things that benefit other people

For example, things like this right here:

- are things that would really only happen with an Eggman like Mr. Tinker, unless Eggman in his regular conscious state was playing an act.

I mean before I even continue taking about Eggman in general, in IDW this is made clear with Starline's words in the first pic and Cubot's in the last one. That isn't usual for his personality.

That was the whole concept of Eggman doing all these nice things as Mr. Tinker, because it was so unbelievable to Sonic and the others that he had genuinely changed. Because it's not in common character for him. 

The thing about Eggman as his true self is that he would only do any of that to play up an act. Again, IDW is actually saying that for me there with the speculation of him playing a trick too, something I'm glad they recognize.

Sonic and his friends suspect it because they're aware of his cunning ways and constant trickery, but when he's putting on a show to anyone else he can convince them easily with his charm.

That is when I personally find Eggman doing such things interesting, not so much if it's being presented as something that he would regularly do as his genuine self. This works because it isn't expected.

Also when Sonic tries to give Shadow reasons on why Eggman really could be a changed man, he brings up events where Eggman only get involved because the world that he is a part of was at stake. Not because others would benefit from it. Because it needs to be there for him to conquer after all!

And I dunno, maybe it's just me but when I see how official Eggman: 

Contains living breathing woodland creatures within the shells of his robots as sort of like his cruel way of improving nature itself with his technology 

Manipulates people into doing his bidding, tells them all sorts of lies and shoots down any suspicion they have with more lies for as long as he can. (Examples being Knuckles multiple times and Shadow throughout ShtH 2005)

The way he'll drop people he's using without a single care the moment he's done using them or they fail him, instantly and easily. (Metal Sonic, the E series, Infinite and multiple others in various media) 

His treatment towards the E Series robots and how his previous doubts to Gamma being as good as Beta went out the window - saying that he KNEW that Gamma would do better despite previously placing his bets on Beta. And of course the way that he completely tossed the rest of them out for failing to complete their task. 

The way he blasts the moon in attempt to get everyone in the world to submit to him, his plan to hold Amy hostage to trick Tails for the emerald and attempting to kill Sonic - all in the same game.

How he doesn't care about the very damaging effects on places and people that the plans he carries out has as long as everything isn't destroyed completely so that it's still there for him to conquer 

How he enslaved the Wisps and the Zeti too - need I say more?

Taking all of that into account, (and those are just some game canon examples at that) I'm really not sure if we're looking at the same guy or not.

He isn’t secretly a good guy or anything in official material, yet it's common that people will say that Sonic villains that they think appear more evil - such as Mephiles, Infinite etc - are 'better' than him because Eggman is apparently a harmless joke that isn't capable of any evil impact at all, despite everything I just mentioned above.

Please keep in mind that I'm not saying that no fan content can ever contain or explore him doing anything that doesn't match canon- because I'm sure people can make that interesting. I'm just saying that this seems to be commonly presented as if Eggman is really like this in official material.

But also what I really want to see more of is things that canon Eggman does best:

Parading around with his big ego, taking pride in hatching his plans, his large confidence and snark when he carries them out, the way he taunts Sonic, tricks and messes with others, strikes fear into the hearts of those affected by his plans and the lack of empathy he seems to have for anyone that happens to get caught up in the effects.

And again, I'm not saying people aren't allowed to explore different outcomes with fan work, that's part of what makes creating your own content fun in the first place, to decide what happens for yourself. But to me, evil is fun to write and villains being evil and exploring their motives behind the things they do is interesting. It's personally my own favorite thing to create content of and I wish it was a more of a common thing.