#Roman paganism

[sebastophanes]

Why exalting history is good, actually

I was griping a bit about this list to a friend of mine the other day and mentioned that I didn’t see anything wrong with exalting the ancient past, to which he retorted that “hagiography is for gods and heroes, not eras or systems of government.” I disagreed with that so strongly that I decided to write a post briefly looking into the matter from the perspective of the Byzantine Pagan tradition and the Empire of Byzantium Novum. None of my thoughts should be taken as ‘officially’ the position of the Church or Empire, but as far as interpretations go I’m not just pulling this out of my ass either.

So let’s examine the Byzantine Pagan viewpoint a little.

Does Byzantine Paganism apply a hagiographic lens not just to Gods and heroes, but to our understanding of Roman/Byzantine history more broadly? I would say so. The crux of Byzantine revivalism which animates both Church and Empire is basically that the Eastern Roman Empire was so cool we’ve taken it upon ourselves to do it again. According to the Declaration of Byzantium Novum our mission is rooted in an explicitly-reverential sense of historical space and time. We declare that the “ancient lands which constituted the Byzantine Empire” are our “cultural and religious homeland”. We assert that “the express purpose of our nation is to renew Byzantine culture and spirituality, so that the Byzantine traditions of over a thousand years may be preserved in the world.” Our starting point, then, holds that the record of Byzantine history contains unalloyed good which is worthy of commemoration and emulation.

In Byzantium Novum we abide by a holy past, building a ‘cathedral in time’ from our perceptions of our ancestors. Within the Empire the Eastern Roman past is not an Other, not an object to be examined by scholars looking to excoriate medieval sins of imperialism, but rather exists as a living inheritance from the Romans who came before us. In the Classical Church our ritual Kalendar sanctifies not just our Gods and Heroes but also the many triumphs and disasters of Byzantine history which the Church commemorates — inscribing the whole patrimony of Byzantine history as sacralised. This can be seen in holidays which otherwise would seem to have little to do with paganism — marking the otherwise-secular victories of Byzantine armies over the barbaroi and the lives of notable Christians such as the Emperors Constantine XI, Theophilus, and Nicholas Kanabos.

There is little to be gained in our view from litigating history’s discontents, or indulging in condemnation of the ancients’ disregard for our modern pieties surrounding power, colonialism, et al. These might be useful concerns for contemporary mandarins of the humanities but serve no use in building out a new sphere of the Byzantine Kosmos — one which is proud of, and built upon, the sacred patrimony which we have inherited. Ours is a conscious choice to defer to and expound upon our ancestors’ greatness, to turn to the record of history and don rose-coloured glasses. This hardly serves as a stepping-stone to fascism or a precipice which bottoms out in the darksome lands of racialism — such accusations would be trifling nonsense at odds with any honest examination of our behaviour. Rather it is a sign of our commitment to the mos maiorum, and to the deathless Gods who so favoured our forefathers, that we respect, embrace, and exalt our past.

Anywho, I’m just spitballing here. If your feathers are ruffled, dear reader, do accept my apologies.

Hey I saw your post that you block helpols who dedicate their whole account to disparage Christianity or abrahamic religions. Do you have any other Helpol "red flags" /gen q

This is a really good question, and one that I've been asked before, so here is a (*cough* non-exhaustive *cough*) list of my Helpol red flags:

1.) Helpols who are racist, ableist, sexist, queerphobic, transphobic, or otherwise intolerant (i.e., evil).

2.) Helpols who exalt the ancient past and either ignore, downplay, or praise ancient imperialism, slavery, sexism, etc. to feel comfortable in their polytheism

3.) Helpols who either completely disregard the Greek mytho-poetic tradition as man-made fiction OR treat it as gospel handed down from the gods themselves

4.) Helpols who insist on getting all their information about the gods and ancient Greek religion from mythological sources

5.) Helpols who insist they know more about ancient Greek religion than legitimate scholars

[within-stars]

what are they called? reconstructuralists?

well ppl who think u have to follow the practices of the Roman and Greek pantheons to the T are just. missing the point of spirituality.

the point of gnosis is to know yourself. striving for this ideal that just doesn’t exist anymore is just spinning circles.

the parts that make up deity work: offerings, divination, calling upon them in spell work. these are all things you have to individually understand the meanings of.

because, without that, you are priming yourself for your doctrine being weaponized against you. which means, something that sounds woke but it’s actually just validating your fears.

these are all parts that make up a balanced practice. but do you understand that these parts are roles, like that of a musical or play?

these roles can be played by a litany of objects. it is with discernment that you, as a practiconer, must pick your poison.

[altarofanorseheathen]

the gods understand your disabilities, mental health, and neurodiversities.

they understand if your disabilities, mental or physical, prevent you from being able to go outside.

they understand you even when you cannot articulate what you mean during prayer or cannot find the words to express gratitude and love.

they understand if you can't spend much time or stand still at their altars.

they understand if executive dysfunction keeps you from making offerings or doing a lot of active practice.

they understand if you have to take breaks and hiatuses from practicing to focus on yourself and your mental or physical health.

they understand if you lose focus during meditation/trance work or cannot do it to begin with.

they understand you and are with you when you cannot get out of bed for mental or physical reasons.

they understand you and are with you during times when you cannot care for yourself or love yourself.

the gods will always understand, love, and accept us for who we are. we are all valid, and we are seen and heard by the gods, even when it feels as if we are alone. 💙

[myrtles-and-blood]

Discovering that stuff in your life aligns a lot with correspondences of the deities your worship is so weird and comforting at the same time.

Like, you've been there all my life and you didn't tell me you sneaky bitch, I love you.

[flaroh]

Io Saturnalia!🪔🌲🏺

From Dec 17-23, Romans celebrated the god Saturn by feasting, exchanging gifts, lighting lamps, and switching up the normal societal class structures 🪔🌲🥧

These illustrations are from my series of Saturnalia in Hadrians Wall country 🏛️🌲

[marblesandmuffins]

hot take but if you're going to be participating in any religion (INCLUDING PAGAN RELIGIONS) you have to research about the culture itself first.

[jezzzebel]

The person who re-blogged this wants you to know that they are open to questions regarding their spiritual path, witchcraft and faith, and in fact, would love to talk about their spiritual path with you and have a casual talk!!

(this applies to me pspspsps HMU , don't hesitate, i am always open to respectful discussion of our spiritual paths and just being friends!!)

[aureliaeiter]

As much as I like to consume modern media based on the gods, I hate how this Americanized lense strips them away from their cultural context reducing them to an archetype the audience can understand, but that would've seemed so foreign back then.

For example, Artemis and Diana are portrayed as girl bosses. A woman who is incapable of falling in love or that simply is repulsed by men.

But when I see them I think of the little girls of the Ancient Mediterranean and how, as soon as they turned teenagers, they were set to marry men much older than them. And how, as they offered their dolls to Artemis/Diana as a thank you for protecting them through their childhood, they probably fantasized about being able to join the hunt forever.

[thedansemacabres]

Remember to find the divine in human life. The streets are full of lares, the old woman at the counter blessed with long life and wrinkles touched by Hera’s embrace, the warm days of Helios and the magic he gives, the child understanding who they are under Apollon and Artemis, the enduring tales of Arthur of pagan providence that haunt the world.

You donate a bowl of soup, and Hestia is there to light the stove. You reach towards the lightning and feel Tinia’s smile as he delivers omens. If you take a walk down the street, surely you must see the works of the divine, whether as so small of a spirit or a grand god.

life is beautiful. be sure to connect to your fellow people, love divine.

[liberstenor]

🌿Reminder for myself and other pagans 💜📿

There is no reason for anyone to tell you the way you practice is wrong. Religion evolves over time and everyone experiences it differently. It’s normal and natural to worship the gods in different ways people would have hundreds of years ago. Or even just ten years ago! As long as you are not being harmful to yourself and/or others, practice however you please!

I’ve seen some people consider only the way they worship to be valid, and it’s so hypocritical and frankly unkind. I support anyone who does not practice in ways that are considered “traditional” (again, with the intention that it is safe and respectful!) My blog is a safe-space and I never intend to shame anyone for the way they connect with the gods. 💜💜💜

[bolszaja-miedwedica]

don't know who needs to hear this but just because someone sees and hears the gods doesn't mean they have spiritual psychosis

[theic-manic]

So, your deity doesn't match mythology energies huh?

And you've ruled out trickster gods, simple mistaken identity, misinterpretation of texts and you've received so many signs that makes you pretty certain that it's say, Ares but his vibes are more chill and besides you don't seem to match the typical Ares follower vibes?

You're sure it's Zeus but you're getting his more subdued personality?

Well, do I have news for you!

Actual realisation I had recently.

My Ares has been more like a mentor because he's Mars with me.

My Aphrodite has been less erotic because she's Venus with me.

My Zeus is mellow, calmer and less authoritarian because he's Jupiter with me.

Meanwhile Apollo is a combination of his Hellenic and Roman aspects

Then there's Hermes Mercurius aka mf pivots harder than my moonswings

I suspect this is because of my emotional, spiritual, career, and even financial growth (or their Roman aspects triggered this growth, it's a bit chicken vs. egg) but it appears I need to sit down and recalibrate my Polytheistic practice.

I will also start a "compare the pair" Hellenic vs. Roman counterparts deity series when I'm less spoon- deficient.

[sebastophanes]

another marvellous Platonist quote about the perfectly benevolent state of the Theoi

[apollophanes]

O Dionysos, O Bacchus!

My Lord, may I be free from all stress and worry

O Eleutheros, O Liber!

May I rise up like the mighty grapevine

And may I create a path for myself wherever I see a dead end

Hail, O Bull-Horned God!

Hail, O Thrice-Born Lord!

[mint-in-the-moonlight]

the fandomification of paganism

hello everyone! first of all, thank you for taking the time to read this post. I want to preface it by saying that it is based on my opinion and observations and it's coming from a genuine place of care for the community. I don't mean to attack anyone or deny anyone's experience, I simply want us to reflect on the path that online paganism has been taking in recent years. with that being said, I hope you can continue reading with an open mind and limit your critiques to those actually related to my points, framing or conclusions. thank you!

there is something that I've been noticing in online pagan spaces lately, a shift which has me worried and feeling disconnected from much of the community. it seems to affect the way we think and talk about our deities which then seeps into the rest of our practices and communities.

I think we have already witnessed many large ways in which it manifests. the most recent and widespread example that I can think of was the whole "the gods are mad" thing on the eve of the US presidential election. some people were adamant that the gods were emotionally affected by the affair as if they themselves had a personal stake in it. now, I don't mean to say that the gods don't care about human affairs but the general consensus after this whole debacle seems to be that the gods are generally quite distant from stuff like this as they have no stake in things like human politics beyond potentially how it affects their worshippers. I agree with this general idea and I think what is likely happening is people are projecting their own opinions and feelings onto the gods because it is important to them that the gods seemingly agree and can sympathise (i wrote a bit more about this situation here if you're interested in reading it).

so from this one example, but potentially many more that I or you reader have experienced, i think what we are seeing is a certain trend (and I don't mean this in a negative way) of the gods as much more human-like. this is not necessarily a bad thing, many pagans see the gods as much closer to humans than I do (I see them as much more non-human or superhuman and just completely out of our realm of understanding). but what i usually see this being accompanied by is a certain belief that the gods are always around and very invested in every tiny aspect of our lives. in some people's practices, they seem to serve a more companion role and their importance as gods is severely downplayed.

I think this want for spiritual companionship is completely understandable and normal, this is after all one of the reasons why people can decide to become pagan or religious in general. but I think at times I see this move into a territory that I find problematic. I call it the "fandomification" of paganism.

I've been struggling with how I want to describe it because as much as I want people to be able to worship and practice however they want, I genuinely think that some of these behaviours cause problems in our communities and I want to address that from a place of good faith. with the knowledge that this might ruffle some feathers I want to say the following: I think some people treat the gods too much as manifestations of their favourite blorbo from a tv show or book rather than the powerful spiritual beings that they are.

I think that the idea that anyone can immediately communicate with the gods through a candle flame or a pendulum has led people to believe that they always have the ear of the gods and that the gods care and have opinions about every little thing that we can think of. I think skits on tiktok have popularised the erroneous idea that the gods can have snippy little conversations among themselves and practitioners and that they have beef amongst themselves.

what I honestly think is that many people have lost the respect and awe of the gods and made them into their personal entertainment clowns and that really rubs me the wrong way. this is not the way I want to engage in my religion, and once again while I do not wish to compel people to adapt their religion to what I believe, I have definitely noticed a growing schism between pagans who think like me and pagans who do not. I think it may be time for us to reflect on this development and how we want to tackle it going forward in relation to the future of our pagan communities.

[homewardskies]

Deities For Beginners

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Okay... I've been seeing a lot of misinformation and misconceptions regarding deities, so I'd like to contribute a little bit to the conversation. Fyi, this is from the perspective of a polytheist, not a witch!

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"How do I talk to the Gods/how do I start working with them/how do I ask to work with them?"

Honestly, you don't know, and you don't need to. A lot of people start out obsessed with direct communication and instant gratification. All you need is intention: start praying. Paganism is about building connections and relationships. Those take time. You will learn your Gods. You don't need them to magically manifest in front of you, and I honestly don't recommend divination to "talk" to them, at least until you have enough experience to discern actual interactions from nothing at all.

"Is [insert God] mad at me?"

Have you caused terrible harm to someone intentionally? Have you shown unprecedented levels of hubris? No? Then they aren't. This question is usually a result of the questions from earlier. Just because you don't feel them during your first ritual, or life throws something at you, does not mean the ancient forces of the universe have it out for you. Take your time, recenter yourself, and remember that the Gods hear you and they are there.

"Oh you worship [insert God]? Aren't they...evil?"

No! Hope that helps! Jk jk. The myths are stories that allow us some degree of historical context for how the original practitioners viewed the Gods and what their practice was like. Through their cultural lens, we get a decent picture of what the Gods are like. However, that does not make the myths literal depictions of the Gods, and it's actually a major red flag to treat them as such.

"Are all the Gods just the same few Gods viewed differently by different people?"

So, this is the soft vs. hard polytheism question, and honestly, I personally find soft polytheism (all pantheons are the same God/few Gods in different forms) to be problematic. Are Wodin and Odin the same? Yeah, you could argue that they share a common origin. Are Zeus and Odin the same? No, and you really can't argue that.

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Anyways. These are some of the more common questions I'd like to answer. I would love to elaborate if needed! Also, if anyone has other questions, I'll answer to the best of my ability.