#Mouthwashing discourse

[lackablazeical]

I wish all my fellow SA victims a very kill the baby 🙏 kill it its a parasite 💯💯 kill it kill it its eating your insides 🎉🎉 it'll destroy you🪄🪄 its killing you 🕊☀️rip it out rip it out rip it o

[c1trvswurld]

Sometimes, I'll see an amazing mw analysis, and then they use the most ill timing, unfunny, weird joke or phrasing ever and ruin it.

This is a personalized message for any serious mw analysis that has unironically used the word "j-diddy" instead of just manning up and saying the dudes actual name. It is jimmy, he is the main protagonist in the game I assumed you've at least watched a playthrough of, correct? The guy we play as for 90% of the game and see though the nuanced and fucked eyes of. Everyone here is aware of how dark the source material is, correct again? So why are we unironically pulling a streisand effect on him? (Assuming the whole purpose is to obscure jimmy to the point he is unrecognizable/ignored) why give him that power? Why censor his name like a slur and white out his name as if we didn't all come to the table knowing that the media we were about to cut into was gonna be some terrible fucking cake.

[toringo]

Ok I'm done What a shitty fucking take, jesus christ

[certified-moth]

its kinda interesting seeing a lot of the female mouthwashing self insert ocs where they make themselves besties with anya who stood up for her and hate jimmy and curly

dont get me wrong I understand fully that they are not that serious, but I think there's just such a frustrating disconnect between these ocs and canon.

the truth is that if the LARGE majority of women were put on the tulpar in that situation they would not speak up of even acknowledge the situation. women dont get the privilege in workplaces like pony express to rock the boat. assuming the sexism and gender issues are the same in mouthwashing as they are irl (assuming based off plot), i have no doubt that it would be just that much harder for a woman to succeed in these workplaces, they would be struggling to be respected in their own job and temporary home, would most really push issues like this?

its too bad because I think the idea of adding another female character makes a lot of interesting routes to explore. would she avoid anya as a whole out of guilt? or an attempt to keep HERSELF safe from jimmy?

would she really just be a stand in for any fandom member who hates jimmy and loves anya & daisuke?

its easy to say "I like this character, therefore I'm putting myself into this scenario where I am besties with them!" but theres so much MORE... mouthwashing is genuinely one of the most interesting games to think about that ive seen in a long time, I wish fans were more willing to engage with the narratives it lays out, and more often use self indulgent fanworks to PUSH what the story is trying to say instead of subverting it in a way that removes all meaning

[cherry-pop-elf]

Small Mouthwashing Break

Hey guys. I know so many of you are hyped and excited for another mouthwashing fic/update to my series but the whole RussianBot situation just. I can’t

I’ve seen things that have left me painfully traumatized. Its made me scared to even open this app. I’ve seen things no one deserves to see. Enough where I won’t even mention what they are

Until the situation is solved I just can’t be part of the fandom atm. I’m already painfully traumatized as is. I have enough going on in life. I don’t need more shit like this

It’s genuinely given me nightmares and taken a toll on my health, since fibromyalgia reacts to stress. What a way to start my thanksgiving break. Just peachy huh?

I’m super sorry to everyone that’s so eager to see more of my content, who want updates, to have asks left unanswered, but I deserve to take care of myself

Hopefully a few days away will make the situation resolve itself on its own. Maybe tumblr will actually do something. Who knows

Just know I’m super sorry, but I gotta take care of myself. I love the mouthwashing fandom/game but Jesus Christ those Russian Bots man

Keep me updated on if that stupid thing gets solved. If things go get fixed. That it’ll be safe to return

I wanna keep posting and doing what I love after all. Don’t we all?

Love yall

[marzipanxx]

are ppl actually shipping jimmy and anya....

[lemon69lol]

Gently grabs your shoulders

Curly is a victim of Jimmys abuse, and Curly failed to protect Anya from Jimmy are both true and are not mutually exclusive concepts

[outlandish-dreamer]

I can say this for most of the crew, but especially Anya and Curly. They should've, at the very least, been given the opportunity to napalm Jimmy.

The people have spoken. My apologies if you somehow disagree/j

[crosstrike]

Gonna brain dump a little bit but

I feel like no one talks about the idea of curly being a victim even before the crash? Or maybe it's just me but,,

We know he's a big people pleaser,almost a doormat but I think that those characteristics could've developed with his time with Jimmy.

This isn't to excuse Curly's actions but to give more depth why he reacted that way?

I mean cmon! We see Jimmy pit Curly as the bad guy when they get the message of their unemployment.

Then not only that but he BLAMES Curly for what HE(Jimmy) did to Anya. Curly doesn't even argue and practically deflates under Jimmy's glare.

TW: Jimbo jumpscare

Anyways ,take it away pooks

@monkiestitches

[c1trvswurld]

Some of you self proclaimed anya likers are so weird bro just saw someone say shipping a rape victim period with any other character is weird and like...you realize people with sexual trauma are not broken dolls that will crack if touched. We can still be sexual just as much as we can be repulsed. We can still love and be loved or we can chose to not. You guys unironically act like life ends when someone is assaulted, which is so weird. I don't even like shipping anya with anyone but I can see the way you guys treat not only fictional but irl rape victims through your interactions with her and it's weird how u guys pick inbetween infantilizing or demonizing her no inbetween.

[chobbemoe-art]

Okay so about what you said, is your proposed solution to fixing the fandom situation to contribute to it more with healthy content instead of boycotting the fandom?

Which would make it morally correct and needed to contribute to it as much as you want and can?

I didn't know the fandom was being boycotted but if it is, it shows rn lmao. I feel that we as a fandom need to do something about the problems plaguing it and the material running rampant rather than abandoning it, we need to do various measures, some range from easily doable to more complex, but for what I know there are a lot to tackle, which have been affecting fandom culture for decades.

These I think are the main ones

1. Problematic materials

2. Harassment

3. Low media literacy and young audiences

4. Inattentive or enabling creators

5. Algorithm-rotted behaviors

☆Mind you these problems have been around in all types of fandoms before, and while I think compared to how those problems looked in other big fandoms that came before it we have evolved a lot, mouthwashing has become the prime example as to how a fandom can ruin a piece of media and its message. I don't fully blame the creators, since it's clear it's their first time handling such a big following, but I do think they have become complicit in some of the detrimental activities that occur even in their own server.☆

I will try giving out some solutions, but my main outlook is the following, problematic creators and fans will always exist, whether we like it or not, the only way to avoid them poisoning the content they interact with is by being more resilient than them.

1. Problematic materials:

I think it's important to state that handling and talking about taboo subjects shouldn't be problematic in itself, Mouthwashing is special because the game addressed hard topics like rape, misogyny, toxic relationships, violence, cannibalism and more, with its owed respect. Letting fans try to tackle those themes in their fan creations with respect is important because it opens dialogue and an exchange of perspectives.

It's possible people accidently glorify or mishandle subjects like that, and that shouldn't be a reason to allow harassment to run rampant, understanding that people have different visions that may go against your preconceived notions is important, and the first thing should be an open respectful dialogue with the creator if they did mishandle the subject. However, and I want to make this really clear, once that discourse is had and the person is still maliciously depicting those subjects with disrespect, then actions should be taken and the benefit of doubt given prior should be revoked.

What actions? This is when we have to be smart, harassing them will only give problematic creators an alley to make themselves the victim, which allows them to usually garner sympathy and get away with what they have done. Simple, we I.B.R depending on the degree of their actions in the platforms that allow it:

Ignore: usually reserved to minor behaviour but that you personally may find distasteful, for example to me the ship Daisuke×Swansea makes me gag, that's why I ignore creators that show it, because even if I don't like it, I do more by ignoring it when it appears and creating my own content than by spending the same time harassing the people that do create that.

For content that isn't explicitly problematic but it isn't clean either.

Block: this is for creators you don't want to see at all, people think blocking is extreme but genuinely, the peace of mind it grants is impressive. I usually use it for people that uwufy Jimmy, because although it isn't explicitly harmful to like Jimmy as a character, his fans tend to erase and even glorify his actions, and I find that really distasteful, so avoiding interaction is best. If enough people block problematic creators, their engagement drop and less people see them, it's a silent but app compliant way to ensure you don't accidentally participate in the spread of that content.

For purposeful mishandling heavy subjects and characters, glorifying terrible actions.

Report: it should encompass everything before it, and it should be used when real criminal behavior is being shown. If enough people do it when necessary, I bet a lit of the noncon material that sadly is available in this fandom, would dwindle.

For explicit noncon, abusive shipping (Anya and Jimmy) (Jimmy and Curly) (Just Jimmy with any of his victims).

2. Harassment

*Shudders remembering Voltron fandom* We have evolved, there aren't as many cases of big doxxing and harassment as old fandoms sadly had, but it doesn't mean it hasn't happened (Looks at the Joestatic situations).

Some people that are conscious of the game having septic tank levels of horrible in the fanbase, seem to try to overcompensate with overcorrective measures to the slightest misdemeanor (like with ocshipping for example), having that well deserved panic misdirected towards things that are frankly not that important, and usually shifting the attention away from truly problematic behaviour. (I have seen more people having backlash about Curlya [which isn't great yeah I know] than when some freak does ship art of Jimmy and Anya)

Again, we need to remember that being in the fandom should also mean having fun, and people being stressed to post their ocs kissing idk Daisuke in case they get backlash is detrimental to the health of the fandom. We need more people to be cringe, to create and learn from their mistakes if need be, because if we overpolice every aspect of the fandom, that just creates a sterile wasteland were nothing creative comes out because people fear harassment.

I will once more refer to the I.B rules, since curating your own fandom is crucial to make the experience your own, the important factor is allowing people that may be weird but not problematic to create, to nerd out and coexist. Always using dialogue first if need be, and respect first and foremost.

3. Low media literacy and young audiences

Here is where we might be in a pickle, fanbases have and always will have people of all ages interacting with the material, even if unintentionally. From MLP acquiring a big adult fandom to FNAF getting a lot of young children in the fandom (me included), if people like it, they will interact with it, even more if it becomes famous.

What does take me aback is that Mouthwashing, being a mature and even explicit game with mature subjects, has such a low bar of age interaction in the server (13+) I know minors won't stop interacting with mw content, but that doesn't mean we should ease access to them either.

I always believed that fandoms should have some divisions, because sometimes having it all so mix takes away from the experience and quality of discourse. I think creating adult only spaces that aren't NSFW is important, so talking about the subjects tackled, showing fanart and more without overcensoring for minor audiences is possible. I find it tiring that in a server for a game talking about sexual assault and violence I have to tiptoe about the same subjects because the unintended audience is there.

If Wrong organ doesn't want to keep all the minors out (even if I think it would be best), at least making it 16+ would be nice, nobody younger than that has any business seeing gore and other graphic topics.

Some division ideas:

- Mixed chatroom (all ages, just like it is now I guess)

- 16 and up chatroom (it can handle harsher topics but nothing explicit)

-Adult only chatroom (SFW) (all the topics can be handled without the need to oversee if it's adequate for minor audiences)

And because freaks will always exist, I know it you know it, we know it. (I'm not better, I love me a shirtless Swansea from time to time)

-Adult only chatroom (NSFW) **highly regulated plss I beg**

Now with the media literacy, part of it being low is kids not knowing what that is and running around like headless chickens with the first misinterpreting action they see instead of analysing the content. I think book recommendations, video analysis and genuine dialogue is the cure (God knows that helped me understand Curly’s character grayness so much better than on my first viewing of the game). Not much else can be done in that department.

4. Inattentive or enabling creators

Wrong organ, ily so much but please, yall are letting so much worrying content pass in the showoff chat that sometimes I don't even want to bother enter it. I know the devs and mods cannot control every fan, but at least a verbal denounce of proship (as in problematic) content would be nice. Or trying to hold accountable problematic creators that run around your server, at least enough as to not spit on the games message that enabling is just as bad as letting things rot in the name of the bigger picture.

Also I hope I don't need to clarify this but please don't harass the devs, let's be normal guys, this is constructive criticism not a brawl.

So yeah, let's start holding people accountable to their responsibilities just like the cautionary tale of the Tulpar warned us about!

5. Algorithm-rotted behaviours

Last but not least, imma curse out short form content based algorithms for making fandom lifespan shorten severely. Material that in times prior to tiktok could feed a fanbase for years now rot in a few months, and that is genuinely infuriating.

Creators cannot take time to curate long projects anymore in fear that leaving the algorithm alone for some time to do so will leave them out of the hype train, and I can't blame them, but that creation model is truly exhausting. Expecting people to create polished masterpieces everyday isn't only detrimental to the big creators but the the lil guys starting out too, since if from day 1 you don't post 500 post a week the algorithm can leave you talking to the void, and that as an artist sucks balls.

Let's go back to having patience for projects to come out, let's be fans of fans and their fan projects, if it takes time we fanart and theorise and talk until that voice dub does come, until that writer does post and until that singer does sing. Because being fans of fans feeds us past the original works and makes the bonds of the fandom stronger.

Give that smaller artist a like, redraw a silly post, engage in the comments of that post, we need to make the most of the social media outlet and make it last longer than a couple months.

☆In conclusion, let's create more, talk more, learn more (and block more), to make the fandom grow healthy☆

[thatonedemonnamedlucifer]

sorry to be once again discourse-y, but i think people need to realize that the problem with fandom isn't shipping, fanfiction, porn or even fandom existing. the actual reasons why most fandoms become so toxic and unwelcoming is the encouragement of harassment. it's "proship vs anti" discourse (both the people and the terms themselves). it's the puritan mindsets. it's the superiority complexes that people get. it's the gatekeeping. it's the ableism, queerphobia, racism and misogyny. it's the lack of media literacy. it's sheltering people that have done harm (predators, pedophiles, bigots, fascists, etc) all of those are why fandom become toxic.

while i do agree that there ship pairings that are *yikes* and that romanticizing dark elements is *also yikes*, those aren't the main issues. i'd argue that those are a symptom of many of the above, particuarly poor media literacy, sometimes queerphobia (especially when it comes to ace characters), misogyny and a bunch of other things. (well. it's also because some people are just... shitty. but that goes without saying).

[micro-meltdown]

Daisuke!!! Yippee!!!

Nothing bad ever happened to that boy TRUST

I have. A lot of thoughts about him.

I really dig the father-son dynamic between Swansea and Dai. That's a given. I also like to think him and Anya act like "siblings," which is cute and endearing. The relationship with Curly seems positive to me too, a healthy authority... But that's not what I want to talk about.

My thoughts always circle back to Jimmy.

In the wiki, it says that they're relationship is very negative, and even tho I do agree in some way, I don't believe it's entirely true.

The obvious: Jimmy looks down and manipulates him. It's blatantly obvious in the way he talks Dai into going into the vent. The way Jimmy gaslights him about drugging Swansea. He makes it clear that he thinks Daisuke is a rich, spoiled kid who had no business being in the ship. Useless.

But I think there's something... else.

Daisuke tries to be friendly and upbeat with everyone, and that's just how his personality is. But I have the feeling, from the way the game presents, he trusted Jimmy.

He didn't sleep next to Swansea, nor Anya. He felt comfortable and safe enough to sleep right next to Jimmy.

When Anya locked herself in, he didn't run to Swansea. He came running to Jimmy.

As horrible as that man is, you can't convince me he didn't feel some type of positive way for Dai. I think he felt the slightest hint of fondness the longer they survived. He didn't give a single shit about Anyas death because Curly was still alive. But he Freaked Out over Daisukes death.

We can't see his expression, but the way I read it he was Mortified. The burden of Dais death made him snap, pushing him further down the spiral. The first thing Jimmy did is grab the gun to kill Swansea for what he did. Some may say that Jimmy did it out of a selfish need for survival, but a part of me feels he was fueled with revenge.

I think there's Some significance that he sat Daisukes corpse closest to him. Swansea and Anya furthest.

"Daisuke would have hated him if he knew"

I see the point, but I dont agree. Daisuke would have been disgusted, horrified. He would have never condoned Jimmy's action. He would have clowned on him, defended Anya and Curly.

But Daisuke is a good kid who sees the good in everyone. He's not innocent nor pure, but he has naive faith. You can't tell me if Jimmy actually did work to change, and had something to show for it, Daisuke wouldn't have believed in him.

Maybe he would have hated him, but more likely, Daisuke would have had forgiveness in his heart.

And I think that makes everything so much more tragic. I think it would destroy Jimmy more than being hated. He can deal with hatred. It makes it easier to cope and accept.

Anyway I'm working on an afterlife au where I explore all those things yippee

Those are all my opinions and personal headcanons, yall can disagree but I won't accept criticism <3

[tinywafflerat]

archive for my argument with @berrksha in case it gets deleted :3

tw: slurs and insults and some fatphobia stuff idk

original post is the last one sorry

[miaubonnie]

Does anyone also hate Curly more and more?

Like the first time I watched the game, I was a bit angry at him but now I think I fully hate him, and it's increíble how analyzing more and more the same dialogue can change your perspective on him so much.

[loyaldegenerate]

Mouthwashing discord servers are all like NO TRIGGERING TOPICS SFW 12+ AESTHETIC THEMED FOR DAISUKE LOVERS AND MOUTHWASHING FANS !!!!!!! ANYA OUR SWEET PERFECT BBY WHO CANT LIFT A TEA CUP ON HER OWN JIMBOBWAY EAT SHIT AND DIE AND IF YOU EVEN TALK ABT HIM WE WANT YOU DEAD!!!!!!!!! CURLY SO SMEXY AND COOL AND HE SAYS SORRY AND HIM AND ANYA ARE OK!!!!!! and youre always like "well surely,,, they arent that bad" And they're that fucking bad.