#Ming is all kinds of toxic

[dramaruni]

Joe is my blorbo and Ming is my problematic fave.

[heretherebedork]

How aware of Ming’s feelings do you think Tong is? Unless he’s an actual brick, he must know Ming likes him. Does he indulge him for the attention?

I think a lot of people give too much weight to people knowing that someone who is hiding it likes them.

I don't think Tong knows. And even if he has the suspicion, I don't think he's sure of it. And he might not want to be sure of it. He might just want to believe Ming is his friend and that they can just be friends.

Just because we know we're watching a queer show and know that Ming has a crush on Tong doesn't mean Tong knows and the assumption that he knows and it using that for attention goes against a lot of what we saw of them in this episode which included Tong try to indulge and treat Ming in his excitement about his return.

I see no reason to assume that Tong knows and is using Ming when he's famous enough to have fans and already has a girlfriend. I think he's just friends with Ming and missed him and was happy to see him come back from abroad.

I dunno, I might be wrong, @respectthepetty might be better for this question.

But I tend to fall on the side of 'most people don't know that their friends have crushes on them randomly because it's just not on most people's radar.

[respectthepetty]

This is gonna sound very weird but I hope as we go on with the show you won't stop making posts about how much you love Ming's toxic ass cause they make me laugh and I'll need them when in the future I'll feel the urge to somehow strangle Ming through the screen. No pressure but please help a girl in need if you can!

You're writing to the person who is openly praying that Ming gets worse (amen), so I am not one to call others weird.

Something about those who live in a glass house shouldn't throw stones, you know?

Because, once again, I want Ming to be awful to Joe, and only Joe, which I know is kind of weird of me, but I'm just too happy to care.

A few people have commented that Ming will get worse, and I'm giddy from the mere thought of it, so I'll be here all season being unhealthy about Ming's behavior.

Because in the first episode, he was awful, which I LOVED, and I don't think some people really see just how bad he was simply because he is being played by Up, which was a brilliant move by casting, so I love that the show directly told us he is a nightmare, and we could judge all his actions accordingly.

Regardless of Tong's fake personality, Ming just showed up at the set without any warning and ambushed Tong at his job

Ming only wants to eat alone with Tong, and it's of course because he likes Tong, but he even hung up on his sister mid-conversation after she threw him a little welcome back surprise (sidenote: I think he and his sister might be similar personality-wise because her call while Tong was eating with Ming was convenient)

Ming doesn't tell Joe his name or how he got Joe's number

He called Joe drunk and obviously pissed off, then snapped at the staff for being shocked by his behavior

He doesn't tell Joe he thinks of him, but instead reversed Joe's statement to point out that Joe thinks of him

He doesn't compromise

And none of these have to do with sex and Ming wanting to fuck Joe because he looks like Tong because Ming's toxicity isn't just about sex.

This is about how meek Ming is around Tong

Compared to how aggressive he is with Joe.

Pushing Joe down and standing over him, which in the heat of the moment doesn't seem like much.

But Joe took Ming to his house because Ming told him to. Joe doesn't eat instead opting to watch Ming eat. Joe lets Ming spend the night because Ming asked. Joe gets on the bed because Ming tells him to. Joe goes to Ming when called. Joe bottoms because Ming wants him to. Joe does everything Ming wants.

With Tong, Ming can't control anything, but with Joe . . .

Ming's gonna control everything.

Or at least that's what I'm hoping!

So I'll be here all season, cheering every single time Ming does something truly fucked up because he is going about his issues in the worst way by trying to exert dominance on a stand-in of Tong since he is weak for the real Tong until he ends up regretting it once he loses Joe and tries to replace old Joe with new Jo which restarts the vicious cycle that began this entire shit show in the first place! *deep breath*

God, I'm so happy!

[zykamiliah]

what about bingqiu?

this is my response to this post. i didn't want to reply in the same post because it's going to get really long, and i disagree with almost everything, so this way i may avoid the discourse. haha. anyway, i'm gonna try to answer each of op's points.

-why bingqiu are a couple:

♦ because despite everything, they've chosen each other. not because they're soulmates (though mxtx did pull the string of fate thing), but because they genuinely want to spend time together

it's very subtle but they do share some values and similarities: they both repay kindness with kindness and believe that one should pay back those who hurt you twofold/tenfold. furthermore, they are both petty bitches. as @fireandgrimstone pointed out here, they're both busybodies: they get restless if they aren't doing something.

on that note: self-preservation is not a core value they share. sqq is terrible at self-preservation. from the first moment, instead of minding his own business, he risked losing points (which would terminate his account and kill him) just to protect binghe when he was being bullied by ming fan and co. sqq couldn't stand by watching someone being bullied. then during the demon invasion, he was ready to risk his own life to protect all the cqm disciples. he was willing to self-destruct to take out sha hualing.

the thing is that sqq likes to lie about himself and say everything he does is out of self-preservation, but it isn't true.

so, if it wasn't out of self preservation, why did sqq pushed binghe into the endless abyss? yes, it needed to happen, but he didn't do it to save himself. he can't hurt binghe just to protect himself. he did it because he brainwashed himself into believing this was the best for binghe, that binghe needed to in order to become strong and achieve his fate.

(chapter 4: conference)

♦ because they give each other what they need. consistent love, support and understanding was something lbh really needed, and those 2-3 years before the immortal alliance conference did wonders for binghe to allow himself to feel vulnerable and be more in touch with his own feelings. this will get screwed up post-endless abyss but sqq does encourage him in the extras to express his feelings and talk about what he thinks and feels.

now, what lbh gives to sqq may not seem obvious (thank you for the help, luuny!♥), since sqq's layered narration is tricky to deconstruct, but by the end of the novel lbh can get past sqq's tsundere/savin face bullshit. sqq has all his toxic masculinity ideas and internalized homophobia that he keeps dragging everywhere he goes, and his relationship with lbh, who was supposed to be the epitome of masculinity, has allowed him to shed off some of it. but not all. thus, lbh knows when sqq needs to be pushed or coaxed into doing something he already wants to do but thinks he shouldn't want and doesn't know how to justify (sex for example). lbh also gives sqq the whole domestic package: someone to dote on, someone that does the chores and takes care of him, because frankly sqq is good at many things but he fails at self-care.

♦ domesticity and companionship. for bingqiu it wasn't like other couples who were first attracted to each other from one reason or another and from then on the relationship developed. the first period of their relationship is mostly platonic (poor binghe is suffering the teenage hormones), and was based on the easy domesticity and companionship they shared. and honestly that's such a simple yet beautiful kind of love. they genuinely like spending time together, living together, talking to each other. they never get bored of being together or of each other, which brings me to

♦ the obsession. like, it's honestly hilarious how obsessed they are with each other. sy was already obsessed with pidw protagonist bingge, but in svsss he got to love and get obsessed all over again with his own binghe aka bingmei. and from lbh's pov it's more or less the same: he had a complicated relationship with original sqq, which was the start of it all, but the person he loves is not the cold shizun from the past who he needs to prove himself to, but the one that's always trying to protect him, even if it's from himself. in both cases, their relationship started with distance, with the shadow of the other version of each other they'd known before. but what made them fall in love weren't those ghosts from the past, but the person they could see underneath it all: the hardworking boy that just wanted to be loved, and the closeted man who wants to give love and help others and have a purpose and belong to something (binghe understands that sqq would be unhappy if he couldn't visit cqm, qjp and his sect siblings). this relates to the fact that

♦ they understand each other better than anyone else. it takes them time, but that's the point of their journey and by the time we read about their relationship in the extras, we can see that despite everything, they not only understand each other very well but actively try to understand each other better. they already made the mistake of making too many assumptions, and they're not doing that again.

________________

another point that op got wrong:

off the top of my head an example would be how bingge (he-with-no-shen-yuan) took a harem of beauties so he could control xin mo but bingmei (he-with-shen-yuan) decided to just... cripple people's cultivation (...) what i'm getting at is that binghe was willing to pay other people's lives just so he didn't have to be intimate with anyone except shen yuan.

bingge too was cripping other cultivators to get ride of the excess of demonic qi, it's just that after he captured the three nuns from tianyi overlook they taught him how to achieve the same result using dual cultivation. (thanking @stardust-falling for their notes on this topic!)

(chapter 9: borderlands)

[aerscribbles]

^owo^ < My dumb ass starting yet another WIP because I'm not in the mood to work on the complex two chapter long fight scene or the genuine emotional intimacy/psychological warfare.

Anyhoo, I think we can all agree that Hua Cheng writes/has written fanfiction, right? (if you don't agree... why?)

The main premise is that HC gets really mad at a trashy romance novel (he read all of the good ones and is scraping the bottom of the barrel) and Yin Yu offhandedly suggests he write his own.

Fafa being Fafa, the idea is taken completely seriously.

The resulting end product is pretty much just Wu Ming/Calamity!Xie Lian, cultivatorXdemon, hurt-comfort, angst-with-a-happy-ending fanfiction with the serial numbers scraped off.

Yin Yu is made to proofread, and does fix the grammar where it goes wrong, but is also... not experienced with all this scholar stuff, and has no idea how to fix the phrasing issues (over-describing certain things like clothes, referring to characters by their hair color or relative age, the Orbs, etc, etc).

He Xuan gets dragged in as the second beta reader & editor. Suffers.

Heh. Betta Reader.

After the book is published, it gets really popular among gods and ghosts alike, because the author just kind of... gets it, the fixations and complexities of a conceptual being. Also, the art is really fucking good.

Eventually, Xie Lian finds a copy.

(It doesn't count as breaking your vows if you read it for the plot and characters, right?!)

And it's... comforting? getting a different perspective on that part of his life.

But also kind of makes some things slightly worse, digging up traumas and stuff.

Seeing this kind of situation from the other perspective is very disorienting, with the MC taking any sign of attention from the ML as a reward- even when it is just straight-up abuse. The narrator/author criticizes this behavior, specifically in the way that it enables the ML's self-harm and descent into insanity.

(Basically, a scathing critique of his own actions)

Xie Lian, having finished the first volume: where can I get more of this?

Thankfully, the author Inkstained Fox sticks with the story for all seven volumes. And an additional volume of extras.

The story ends with the main characters settling down and rebuilding ML's sect, adopting a bunch of children disciples in the process.

Inkstained Fox doesn't stop with one successful series, though.

(Validation is one hell of a drug.)

No, he keeps writing for centuries.

...

Some ideas for Fafa's barely disguised fanfiction:

priestess/rain deity, toxic yuri

artist/the demon that haunts his dreams

loyal servant/young lord, political intrigue

field healer/general, surprisingly accurate to real army conditions

human sacrifice/god of death

...

What a surprise it is for Hua Cheng to walk in to Puqi Shrine and find multiple bookshelves filled with literally every book he had ever published.

(They are so obsessed with each other)

[vegaseatsass]

Reading/thinking about Sol some more, and I do think there's a need from some viewers for him to be either the pure selfless "healthy romance" choice OR purely selfish and unworthy of Joe, and imo he's neither, and that's what makes him interesting and human.

He hurt Joe by assuming the worst of him (in like, a very specifically, viscerally hurtful-to-queers way) and running away; he expects to be able to pick up where they left off as soon as he comes back, and really struggles to calibrate to the fact that Joe neither held a grudge against him nor pined for him this whole time. He just... moved on.

A lot of the ways Sol tries to support Joe or intervene in his toxic relationship with Ming are blatantly compromised by how much Sol wants Joe to choose him instead, but he's also right about Ming. I find him compelling because he goes harder than anyone before Ing in consistently, materially trying to be there for Joe, but there's always that level of selfish motivation to Sol's actions where he doesn't just want to protect Joe from violence or danger, he wants to redirect Joe's feelings from Ming back to himself. (And sometimes he fails to protect Joe not because Joe won't let him intervene but because he's too busy fighting Ming to pay attention to the guy they both just knocked to the ground!!)

If Sol really let go of the idea that Joe could ever want him again, would he still be as ride-or-die for Joe? Is the sincerity Joe showed him something he's repaying in kind, or is there always something he still wants from Joe lingering in the background? Is it possible to sincerely support someone you haven't stopped hoping will one day choose you? And when Joe refuses to let Sol help him, is it because he can't let himself burden a junior, or because he is intuiting and avoiding those strings that come attached to Sol's help, or both?

To me all of those questions are a lot more interesting than like "does Sol deserve Joe" or anything along those lines.

[pr0cyon-lotor]

I would like to hear about your BingFan "slay the princess" au please <3

I'm going to rant so hard rn thank you for asking :D

(It's been a hot minute since I played Slay the Princess but I will replay it to write the fic. But honestly the plot will be different anyway so meh ¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯)

Okay so the plot is based on a PIWD-like timeline, so it is quite dark because I am very weak to toxic yaoi. A lot of the things are similar but the most important difference is that Bingge became obsessed with Ming Fan for some reason.

I'm planning on making it that this Ming Fan had a bit of a stronger moral compass and did step in a few times whenever Shen Qingqiu was getting way too cruel to him. But Ming Fan was never a saint, he still did envy Luo Binghe and bully him. He just wasn't that bad.

That was enough for Bingge to become obsessed with the smallest hint of kindness shown to him by an authority figure. It doesn't change him for the better, it probably even changes him for the worse.

When later on he becomes the emperor, he does pick up a harem, but he doesn't even bed them and dangles the prosperity of being his "favorite" to manipulate a lot of them.

When Cang Qiong starts to crumble, he does take Shen Qingqiu hostage. Except he uses him to lure both Yue Qingyuan and Ming Fan. Yue Qingyuan falls the same fate, but Ming Fan doesn't he gets imprisoned instead.

Bingge tells him that if he agrees to marry him, he'll release Shen Qingqiu and cease his rampage on Cang Qiong. Ming Fan agrees and becomes Luo Binghe's empress and the only one he has actually bedded (the harem is NOT happy).

The thing Bingge didn't tell Ming Fan is that Shen Qingqiu is in a jar and dying and that Cang Qiong had crumbled while he was imprisoned. When he finds out, he tries to kill Bingge and then himself when he was unsuccessful with that.

Luo Binghe locks him in one of the towers in the palace and forbids anyone from entering. He delivers food to Ming Fan and forces him to eat when he refuses to.

During the usual routine, he finds Ming Fan dead. A pristine blade in his chest. He spends days trying to figure out who was responsible and ends up slaughtering a lot of the palace staff, his court, and practically destroying his palace.

He can't find any leads and because Luo Binghe's mental state was so dependent on Ming Fan, and decides that killing himself is the only option. Because while Ming Fan spat and cursed at him, he was still alive.

And this is all backstory. This is where the actual Slay the Princess stuff starts :) You're supposed to get snippets of the backstory in each route.

Luo Binghe wakes up in a throne room alone. There is no one around and everything is clean. He doesn't remember anything. Then two voices speak up. A narrator (Shang Qinghua) and a Heroic Voice (Shen Yuan)

The narrator chitters a nervous (obviously rehearsed) speech about how he's here to slay an empress. An empress that will end the world if let out. The heroic voice starts berating the narrator and then moves on with another (obviously rehearsed) speech.

Luo Binghe is prompted to go through the palace. He does and eventually reaches the door to a tower where the empress is supposed to be.

Depending on what Luo Binghe does, the empress will greet him differently and will determine what route he has.

All the voices are characters in svsss. (Tianlang Jun is the Voice of the Smitten because I think it's funny) Some of them will be resentful towards Luo Binghe and be snide and backhanded or some will be nervous and avoidant.

I haven't finished placing all the points yet, but I know I want

The Damsel route to mention Ming Fan's minor kindness towards Luo Binghe that caused the obsession to take root

The Prisoner route to mention Luo Binghe forcing the marriage onto Ming Fan with a false promise

I'm still working on the rest, but I want the ending to be the crows telling Luo Binghe that this entire loop was his fault. And the reveal would probably be something bittersweet.

I just think they're neat (I'm obsessed with their toxic asses) :D

[daouoffroads]

I just don't understand how you like S*l? He is actually right up there with T**g for being the worst. There is nothing good about him, sorry.

i don't understand the wild and weird hate against sol (or even remotely comparing him to tong) but here we are, anon. like if joe out right saying sol is a good person can't convince ya'll... idk why you're asking me?

anyway... you asked for my thoughts and opinions, so you shall receive.

sol is just a really interesting dude to me. he's just some guy that i think is really neat. he's a thai kpop idol and FAMOUS famous but he isn't like tong about it. he's kind and just a really good-hearted person. he's the sunny type, cheerful, caring, and loyal to his friends. like joe, sol is a sunflower in the toxic showbiz world msi is set in.

(tbh i see him and ming, who is also a fascinating character, as kind of two sides of the same "rich and famous" coin. ming is cold, aloof, calculating with walls as high as elon crust's ego is inflated. and then there is sol, open and kind-hearted. which is exactly why he and joe hit it off. funny though, ming and sol are petty but like on completely opposite ends of the petty spectrum.)

after lovingly bugging @zhouxiangs for novel spoilers i really wished the series had touched more on sol and joe's history instead of just a few throwaway lines here and there because sol's story ;3; my smol bean of a son. (and this is where media literacy and nuance comes in :D but y'all barely have any of that.)

joe and sol were very close . they ate, trained, and slept (sleeping type of slept lol) together. they did everything together. and then sol found out joe was gay (in the novel sol was also struggling with his sexuality) and then joe confessed to sol. joe liked sol first (not this weird warped reality y'all are living in where sol has been obsessing over joe). but anyway, sol was young and scared and dumb. he was afraid of being taken advantage of and also of his own feelings for joe and he ran away. joe got over it and never held it against him.

while in korea, it seemed that sol struggled to connect with people and went through some tough times as a trainee (i'm quoting from porsche's interview) and he realized his true feelings for joe so when he had the chance to return to thailand he took it and he sought out joe to reconnect. as a friend, as more.

was he supposed to have some sort of psychic link with joe that he was already seeing someone? obviously not. but when joe made it clear he liked ming, sol backed off romantically. he didn't back off as a friend though. (idk about y'all friendless gremlins but if one of my close friends was in the situationship from hell that joe was in... i'd also try and make them see reason, open their eyes. like sol once having feelings for joe does not diminish his friendship with joe. at all. (yes the scene of joe and sol in the van in ep 6 means everything to me. joe and sol were friends, brothers even. and that scene showed it.)

fyi, novel sol recognized joe too :D

ANYWAY, it was interesting to see the change in sol after joe's death. he isn't his usual cheerful self, but he's still kind and polite if a bit more reserved. and i for one love the cattiness with ming he has going on? LEAVE MING ALONE i see y'all shouting but me I WANT HIM TO PUNCH MING IN THE NUTS ONCE (if y'all can project, so can i) like ming deserves to catch a bit of shit from sol (his 'khun chai ming' sent meeee), since his and tong's bullshit directly contributed to the death of his best friend.

is sol perfect? no. (the fight with ming where joe got hurt. or the phone call scene that resulted in joe effectively being cut out of sol's life. again.) but are any of these characters perfect? absolutely not.

sol though is strangely villainized and for what? because he's trying to help and protect his friend (and is maybe being snotty with ming but... deserved tbh lol)? because he might be feeling a little righteous and fafo with the guy who took his friend away from him? because he once had feelings for joe but then redirected them into being a decent human and a good friend?

sponsored by: @zhouxiangs and porsche/lotte interview with iqiyi.

[bunnakit]

my stand in ep 2 thoughts, feelings, etc.

alright i wanted to write this up nicely but it took me... two hours to get through the episode bc i kept stopping to write notes, so i'll do my best i guess.

weird thing about me is when i watch shows and write notes for these posts i always write the notes on napkins? i have like 5 different notebooks in arms reach at all times but i really like scribbling on a napkin for the true unhinged effect.

anyway blah blah reminder i'm just a silly dude on the internet, idk shit about dick, i just like to say shit, don't take me too seriously.

also please DO NOT leave novel spoilers in my reblogs, tags, or replies without some kind of warning label. please? it seems to happen with every show i write meta for and i LOVE that people get hyped but there's no way for me to avoid it when it's in my notifications like that.

some before the actual episode stuff; after learning last week that some of the kinnporsche people worked on this it really becomes apparent, especially in the style of the intro.

the music choices also seem a bit reminiscent of kinnporsche (and a little bit of not me) which i really enjoy. it feels kind of familiar and comforting.

immediately i loved how soft this episode started, the slight stubble on each of them, the way joe speaks so softly as if afraid to shatter their little bubble of peace, etc. i also love that the show doesn't skirt around the topic of sex and the fact that sometimes sex is awkward and clumsy, especially with a new partner and doubly so when it's your first queer partner.

and then the peace was shattered with ming kissing his back yet again. ouchies.

"will tong be at the set?" he's just not even trying to hide it. he basically said 'yeah ur great and all but tong????' but DAMN if poom isn't the absolute king of microexpressions.

at this point i can't really tell if tong is being a spoiled prince (derogatory) or if he's tired of acting in general? judgement withheld until a later date.

and then we jump into this actress being a parallel to ming and OOF OUCHIES MY ORGANS. she's a fan of tong but has to "settle" for joe - just like ming. and yet joe takes the time to be kind, to soothe her worries and put her at ease, because he has a heart of absolute gold. "it's her first movie but she was left to drown by the male lead." it's ming's first love and he has been left to drown in it.

mek's acting is really endearing. this is my first exposure to him (ive seen some of his social media and really like what he stands for as a person) and i'm instantly drawn to his performance. he also pulls off a great balance of adorable/sexy.

OOH THE SHOW SAID BISEXUAL OUT LOUD. A WIN FOR THE BI'S WE LOVE TO SEE IT.

i personally find ming's jealously hilarious. what a little caricature of toxicity.

anyway, it seems to me that if ming could get over his feelings and enjoy what he has in front of him he could be part of and enjoy a very sweet family, as it does seem tong IS giving him love, just not the exact flavor he craves.

the cut to joe's training made me laugh. little oat lore dump but my bio dad was actually a stunt man for movies (which is another part of why i was so excited for this show) and i can promise you nothing like this was part of it. what do i know, though, maybe things have changed since the early 2000s lol.

(no, they're probably not any movies you know, aside from maybe wild wild west [1999]. he mostly did westerns, historical docudramas, and historical fiction.)

ANYWAY AGAIN. with this little glimpse into ming's home life we get to see that he's very accustomed to doing what he wants and getting what he wants, which makes a lot of sense when applied to his almost obsessive behavior regarding tong - and now joe. i did absolutely LOVE linin and her sassy independence (minus the 'i can buy anything i need'.)

but... girl... did you just spray perfume in your mouth?

your actions are strange and unsettling. i like that in a woman.

ugh getting into ming venting his frustrations on joe's body. listen. liiiisten. while toxic without prior discussion... i'm into it. it may or may not be one of my favorite tropes in fanfic. toxic and unhealthy as fuck and i'm here for it.

AND THEN DAMN POOM THOSE NOISES. ACTING FOR YOUR LIFE BBY -- and the SNEEZE AT ORGASM LMAAAO oh i hope that's a running bit for some comedic relief.

because we then make a SHARP pivot into "then stop me" and there's so much potential for pain and self loathing there, for joe to think "i can't blame ming, i didn't stop any of it." i'm sat.

a little side bar, but i'm enjoying the fact that while there is discussion of topping and bottoming as a narrative device there really aren't any stereotypes here. i think on a surface level people would think "oh joe is the top" (pit babe style) and the show said no actually he isn't. love that for us.

"you can even move in haha jk" but the thing is, not jk, because joe would do that for ming - for anyone - bc that's the type of person he is.

[i had to stop and have a lil snack here]

hold up is this wut out drinking with them? OH SHIT IT IS. OKAY. it didn't give us much but at least it's a little connection to him finally. we knew joe knew him from his first life, just didn't really know how.

"i missed you" and when was the last time someone missed joe? not who he's replacing or the space he's filling, but HIM?

love ming's goofy ass locking the door and going inside just so he can make a dramatic ass appearance like he's 'the other woman' or some shit LMAO.

"what's in you to make me jealous?" quite possibly the worst dialogue tree choice ming could've picked.

[joe's emotional well being -45]

[everyone hated that]

"don't be so full of yourself" something joe has never been a day in his life. "you're just a stand-in." he knows. it's not something he ever forgets.

but after all that toxicity we have ming back home, seeking out joe's food for comfort, and we finally get to see him interact with his sister. i LOVE that she knows the importance of being a little silly as a treat, one of my biggest life mottos. we also get to see more of how ming is surrounded by love that he misses out on bc of his own wallowing and self sabotage.

oh, the homoeroticism of sparring with your bestie.

[everyone liked that]

oop- joe is wearing the shirt ming borrowed while sol is wearing a shirt with the word 'fantasy.' i'm good, i'm fine, gwenchana, gwenchana.

ough. sol with too many eyes on him and none of them sincere and joe with nothing but sincerity to offer but remains invisible. oof ouch.

enter ming with more religious imagery to match last week's cross scene. something something the sin of greed? confessing your sins? coveting - idk man, i don't have any religious trauma, my family let me just do my own thing.

but with ming knowing joe's true feeling every toxic thing he does is going to be 1000x more painful and i'm here for it. bring it you fucked up little guy.

"we can't mess with each other's privacy" don't mess with MY privacy. "you can't mess around with anyone else" emphasis on YOU, not we.

and then it's driven home what a romantic joe is, both with his workout heartbreak poetry and this little lady and the tramp noodle moment. this man, again much like pit babe, wants to be domesticated so bad.

and i know we all have hated on ming, that's the point, he's been a caricature of a toxic relationship spelled out in neon letters --

but when was the last time ming laughed with someone like this?

ok im exhausted, i'm falling into bed to read fanfic, but i'm absolutely in love with everything this is doing so far. i haven't written anything as in depth as this since last twilight (pre-betrayal) so it's really nice to feel insane again.

[bengiyo]

My Stand In Ep 2 Stray Thoughts

Last week, we met Joe, our stuntman protagonist with a terminal case of Bottom Dementia. He is the primary stuntman and stand in for a popular actor named Tong. He met Ming, a younger friend of Tong that has been secretly pining after Tong for years. Ming mistakes Joe for Tong and begins to pursue him, and the toxic yaoi began. We know that in the future Joe dies in a stunt accident and wakes up in the body of another guy named Joe (not confusing at all) and goes back to work at the same company. We left at Ming possibly recognizing Joe by his back again.

Joe, baby boy, if he can't remember fucking you this is a huge warning.

Joe sneezes when he has an orgasm? I really hope Ming remembers this when he inevitably fucks Wahl!Joe.

Joe, asking to tag along with you so he can see another man is another warning.

Keeping it on the DL is also suspect! Joe, it's so painful watching you when I know you're only going to make bad choices!

This Tong guy seems very difficult to work with. Leaving his costar alone to drown is super unsubtle as a metaphor.

Joe, he is flirting with another man in front of you, who is the guy you are asked to resemble.

Joe, he was just flirting with Tong and now he's jealous of you possibly having feelings for other people! He's mad at you for picking up on the flirting. Get out of there.

There's a lot of use of reflections in this episode. If one of you writes about it, please tag me.

Now, Joe, do not take your frustrations out on the other stuntmen.

Does Ming's mom not know he's gay?

I like this girl. She seems pragmatic.

JOE, YOU ARE EMBARRASSING! Why would you flirt like that??

No lube in a bathroom? Oh, BL.

I don't like the "Then stop me" thing Ming keeps doing.

Porsche!!! Welcome back!

I like that Sol wants to reunite because he left on a major misunderstanding, but recognizes that his feelings for Joe are genuine. This conversation about people taking advantage in the industry being a barrier to real connection is fascinating. I hope we see more of Sol, but I doubt Joe sees it.

Okay, legit fuck Ming. Ming showed up hella drunk and Joe took care of him and put him in a bed. Ming beefed with Sol and then dumped Joe on the floor for stinking of alcohol. I do not support these gay wrongs!

Wait are Ming and Joe NOT using condoms??

"You're just a stand-in." Hey, Ming, come outside. We won't jump you.

It's kind of a hilarious casting choice to put Porsche in a show where a gay man has feelings for his sister's boyfriend after his excellent work on You're My Sky. He's not involved in that plotline, but I'm thinking about it.

Well, that was fun, but at least Sol is still breathing.

Joe, are you really saying MING taught you about love? We're giving up on Sol for Ming??

I see. Ming has been very alone for a long time. I see how he became a stuntman.

I respect and support Ming's Lady and the Tramp desires.

I really hope this isn't the last we see of Sol! I feel bad for Joe because it feels like he's not got folks around to push back on Ming's bullshit. They were smart to pick Up for this role because he can make Ming's attempt to treat Joe and play house feel genuine, even if we know it's going to fall apart. Likewise, Phoom does the wounded puppy thing so well. Really impressed with the casting of this show.

[alwaysthepessimist]

Ming is so fucking pathetic.

He's been in love with the same guy for years. A guy who's been dating his own sister for a while. A guy who, with every interactions, has been showing him that he'll never be his first choice, that his sister will always come first. Literally nothing in Tong's demeanor has implied so far that he would ever give him the time of day. Yet, instead of moving on like a normal person would, he's holding on to this love for dear life, even after spending four years overseas.

Insanity is doing the same thing again and again and expecting a different result every time. And in that sense, not only is Ming pathetic, but he's also insane and probably gets a kink out of his own suffering . There is no other explanation as to why this man is still spending time with Tong in the hopes that somehow, his brother in law will open his eyes and realise that he is the one for him. No reason whatsoever, when every time they do spend time together, he ends up feeling , hopeless, lonely, miserable and sexually frustrated once Tong leaves, and that man always leaves .

By using Joe, Tong's very own stuntman as a stand-in, Ming seriously reached a new low. Like the lack of self respect went up a notch here. Truly. Fantasizing about Tong making him dinner, while another man is making him dinner, thinking about Tong while having sex with another man. All that is showing us how much of a loser he truly is. The worse part is Joe is actually an amazing guy, way more than Tong will ever be. He is kind, caring, extremely handsome and willing to give him the love and attention he is desperately craving for. But instead of getting out of his own head to see what's right in front of him, he prefers to remain in this toxic cycle he creating for himself while using a poor guy in the process, almost ruining, by doing so, his only chance at true happiness.

It's pretty sad... and I love it!!!!

[befuddledcinnamonroll]

15 Day BL Challenge - Part 2

I had a lot of fun doing @negrowhat's BL Challenge earlier this year, so of course I have to do @slonekaru's as well! Challenge here.

Day 16 - What show has taken you by surprise this year?

This is a rather tricky one for me, because I have gotten very good at going in without expectations. I'm prepared for shows that grab my heart, and I'm prepared for shows that go off the rails. I never know which it will be before we get there, but I'm ready for anything. Which makes it a lot harder to be truly surprised by anything.

But I think the closest I came to being surprised was by My Stand In.

I tend to be someone who gets captured emotionally very easily, but it also can make angst in shows a really difficult experience. I had to binge Unknown so I could cope with the hard episodes by immediately rushing to the next one. I sobbed buckets over I Feel You Linger in the Air and The Day I Loved You, and that took time to shake off.

It's not an inherently bad thing, but I do have to be careful with my real life stress and mental health when consuming angsty media. It can make it hard for me to engage with some things.

And yet, somehow, the creators behind My Stand In managed to nail this incredibly tiny little target of having a lot of chaotic and angsty plot things happening, while staying really low stress and fun for me. It felt so delightfully indulgent to watch. Sure, there were moments I felt for Joe, but I never got pulled in so deep that I stopped having fun. Ming was the kind of toxic mess we'd all run from in real life, but Up made him mesmerizing to watch. It is the probably the happiest I've been watching such an angsty show, and it still makes me smile to think about it.

[heretherebedork]

The same Joe who proclaims that all his feelings for Ming died with his body still protects himself from those same feelings by denying everything that Ming is showing him and doing for him that's out of the ordinary.

I love Mike. He is gonna Do Some Things here and probably cause a lot of damage but I am okay with that because he sees what no one else does.

This promise that this is just for a year. That he won't keep coming back. That Ming will let him go... Joe really is so convinced of his own unimportance that he doesn't see how obsessive and possessive Ming really is about him.

Oh, Mike, you're gonna be interesting, aren't you?

He's protecting his big brother. Oh no. That... makes a lot of sense, actually. And is kind of sweet. Ming might be out of his mind and toxic as well but his baby brother isn't going to let him get taken advantage of by a stuntman... even though, frankly, Ming would be pissed if he heard this.

And he was. I do love how the show knows how toxic Ming is and embraces it, holds onto it, offers it out again and again and says 'yes, he's fucked up and he's going to keep hurting people and being hurt and he's broken and shattered and bloody and weary but he cannot rest because the only person who ever let him rest was Joe'.

[becauseimanicequeen]

After having a sleep on it, I feel like I can write something a bit more coherent about ep. 3 of My Stand-In than last night. So, here goes...

This episode felt a bit off-track when it comes to Ming. He's had a great trajectory on his toxic railway, but the domesticity with Joe just felt... off. Ming seems to have lost himself. It felt like the way he was with Joe in this episode was out of his character (imo).

Some moments still showed Ming's questionable actions and behavior (like the bathroom scene, which Ming seems to have a thing for, btw, but I digress), and there were some subtle ways in which he tried to hide his relationship with Joe (like when he grabbed his own pillow and walked away to "hide the evidence" even though he'd been using Joe's pillow).

I'm sure the domesticity here will stand in contrast to the events in the next episode and that's why this was shown here. And I'm sure Ming will be back on track again in the next episode because I'm hoping and wishing for peak toxic behavior before realizing how fucked up he was. And that he doesn't realize it until it's too late. Because that's the pain I'm hoping for.

And, fortunately, it seems like we're getting back to the accident (shown in the preview for the next episode) so we can get back to the aftermath of it all. That's the shit I want to see.

Then there's Mr. Asshole... (I'm sure I don't have to write his name, you already know whom I'm referring to.)

Honestly, I loved the way he was portrayed in this episode. I love that there are more problems in this series than just Ming. I love that there are characters that are different kinds and levels of problems. And I love that he's the asshole I expected him to be. It's setting up for a great showdown when Ming is finally done with Mr. Asshole's assholish ways. And I'm hoping May will follow her brother's lead (even though the parents might be a problem...).

Then there's Sol...

I know a lot of you like him and are rooting for him. But... I don't.

There's just something about Sol that makes me question him. I mean, he admitted to running away because of Joe. And then he basically came back to Joe because he realized other people were approaching him to get something out of him. He knows Joe likes him (or used to) and he feels like Joe is a safe place for him. How is that not using Joe to his own advantage? How is that not using Joe as a stand-in just like Ming does (even though not to the extent that Ming does)?

Maybe it's just me (which is fine), but he's practically standing there in a multitude of red hues and values. Just saying...

Anyway, this felt a bit like an episode to set up for the shit that's coming. So, even though it wasn't my favorite so far, I'm sure it is there for a reason.

(Also, I haven't read the novel, so, please, don't spoil it for me.)

[neutrallyobsessed]

What are your least favorite clone high ships? Any you don't like?

well, tophabe gotta be the one i hate the most for sure, THE lame as fuck, generic red x blue yaoi ship with a toxicity that the fandom refuses to adknowledge?? when thats the most interesting and fun part of the ship?? worst crime of all is the one that should be DOM-ming is subbing like (omg why does this keep happening??) there's only one person who gets the dynamic """correctly""" and even then they're still wrong about like. literally everything else. i can allow a certain level of OOC-ness but whatever the hell is going on here is WAY! TOO! MUCH!! all things related to this ship are terrible terrible terrible all of it SUCKS!!!!

you will find that ppl who hate tophabe are the better topher understanders with like 2% margin of error, and im topher understander no 1 you can trust me on this one ;3

overall i dont ship topher with men, beyond the uncomfortable implication that he couldn't be into me (girl), just----- look, you cant make topher a minority of any kind without compromising a huge and important chunk of his characterization, resulting in him being turned into a completely different character. i love topher exactly the way he is and as canon as reasonably possible, him being into men in any way is the exact opposite of that so dont put that near me thanks i have every tag filtered and its GREAT!

id say tophucius is the second worst on this regard, if the hopeless normie cant be corrupted into liking the edgiest memes 4chan can offer then its not a good ship

joanfucius killed my grandma so i dont like it much either :// and the more i think about it, the more i realize that they dont work well togheter at all.... i see the show, i see the fanart and im like "wow joan looks miserable here, she'd be better off with topher" sure maybe its my own bias but am i wrong?? adsadasdasasadsadas

i dont really think of my notps all that often unless they're popular thus annoying, cause why could i? lol, but mmmmmm cathivan always looked so lame and boring in my eyes :PP

[bitacrytic]

How are we feeling about my stand in? Still tingling all those senses? Haven't had the opportunity to watch episode 4 yet. Will do it soon. How are we feeling? About stuff.

9/10

I don't want to say this because I feel like I'm betraying myself a bit, but I might be liking this show just a little more than I liked Kinnporsche.

Whew, that was a sentence I never thought I'd write.

Someone said that they're packing 10 chapters of the book into each episode and it shows. Stuff is happening. No scene is dragging. Every scene moves the story forward and every episode has a beautiful arc.

Asides from my regular gripes with Thai editing choices, this show is SPARKLING!!!!!!!!

I have loved every episode and I dread every day of the week till Friday.

I have two issues with the story that kind of cancel each other out.

1. I wish Ming was more toxic.

2. I wish Joe doesn't end up with him.

But like I said, since Joe will eventually end up with him, I guess I should be grateful that they haven't raised Ming's shenanigans to the max.

I'm a sucker toxic love stories that end in revenge. Ah, I'll eat it up any day.

But, for the story that MSI is trying to tell about a good man who falls for wretched nuisance, they entire team is doing PHENOMENALLY WELL.

And yes, Anon. All my senses have been tingling since yesterday.