#Jonathan of Conte

[copperhawks]

You're not the first person to make this comparison on this post, but when I wrote this, I hadn't done a re-read of SOTL yet (and the last time I'd read In the Hand of the Goddess was... a LONG time ago, so I couldn't really make a good comparison between these two scenes), but I have now and I've been sort-of thinking this over and have some thoughts on it.

For me, this isn't so much an indication of them being similar so much as it is just an unusually similar narrative beat. A character chooses to disobey an order about not crossing a border during a war in order to go save someone who has been captured and, in so doing, takes out a major antagonist that leads to the end of the war.

But the MOTIVES behind the two actions seem very different to me. Jon goes to save Alanna because he's in love with her and can't bear to lose her. Kel goes to save the refugees because she's responsible for them and takes that extremely seriously. She does CARE about the people, obviously, it's still being done out of love, but she's not doing it because she can't stand to live without them so much as that she's INSANELY duty-driven. She goes up to save Lalasa for similar reasons after being told that a noble's duty to their servants is basically sacrosanct. Kel goes across the border because she believes it's the honorable thing to do. Jon's motives aren't about honor and are, arguably, somewhat more selfish in origin.

So while this is obviously a very similar storyline, I don't find that it's an example of these two characters being similar to each other.

Kel is willing to give up EVERYTHING out of a sense of duty to the people she's responsible for. While Jon is someone who does a LOT of things for his people and spends a lot of his time and energy making life better for them, I can't recall a moment where Jon is ready to give up everything he wants and everything he's worked for just to save his people. Jon actually tells Kel in Squire that he and Thayet work pretty hard to keep themselves OUT of that kind of danger whenever possible, that's the point behind all of the compromises. All of the arranged marriages for his kids are to try to ensure peace through political connections and stop fighting in wars.

This is where they DO differ because Kel feels like someone who, at least at this point in her life, is willing to die to protect her people. But Jon is someone who will do whatever it takes to LIVE for his people for as long as possible. Jon understands that, in his position, it's more beneficial for everybody for him to make compromises in order to stay alive so he can keep making changes that will make people's lives better in the long run. This is a lesson that, while we do see Kel LEARNING it a little during Lady Knight, isn't one that really plays into the final conflict of the book. It's possible that Kel will end up being even more like Jon in this way as she gets older, more willing to stay back herself and trust others to do what needs to be done in her place, but by the end of Lady Knight, that just isn't who she is yet.

And maybe that's what's interesting about the comparison. Kel isn't all that much like Jon YET, and she's certainly not all that much like Jon when HE was 19, but Kel shows signs of being a lot more like Jon as he is during HER series as she gets older and gains more experience. Kel is very righteous, very inclined to just act and get things done, but over the 9 years we get to know her, she has to learn more and more about when to act and when to WAIT. She has to learn when to push and when to bend a little.

As a woman, she's going to be held to different standards than her male counterparts like Raoul or Wyldon, she'll be dealing with different limitations and setbacks than they ever did. And so her approach to leadership will, by necessity, have to be different than theirs was. She does look to them for inspiration, but in execution, I think she'll likely end up far more like Jon. Jon is obviously not a woman himself, but as King he's ALSO held to different higher standards than his compatriots and he was very young when he took the throne and has been very progressive throughout his reign which means he's dealing with certain limitations and setbacks that more conservative people might not.

Kel has strong opinions and firm ideas of what the world SHOULD be like, and that's going to lead her down a similar path of trying to CHANGE things, but she'll be dealing with all of the same limitations that Jon is, which will force her to approach things the way he does. She's going to have to compromise, she's going to have to bend, she's going to have to learn when a fight is worth having, she's going to have to learn to give a little in order to get a little later.

Kel would probably not have crossed the border for just one person. If it had been Neal, for example, and Neal alone, she may not have decided to take that risk. Neal is a trained knight like herself and probably won't thank her for giving up everything to come save him. Kel could probably have been convinced not to cross the border for him, as much as it would've pained her. And Jon I think would not necessarily give up everything to save a few hundred people the way Kel did, even though it would pain him to have to make that choice.

Kel IS like Jon and will likely become even more so as she ages, but crossing the border just isn't one of those places where their similarities are showcased to me.

The funniest thing to me about Kel, and maybe one of the most interesting because of how understated it is, is that Kel becomes a good commander in the end, not by emulating Wyldon who was cold and implacable and insensitive, or by emulating Raoul who mostly only disobeys orders out of principle or because he has an issue with what the order says about his personal relationship with Jon, but by emulating JON.

Kel doesn't even LIKE Jon, she BARELY respects him as a person. He's a good enough ruler that she's willing to fight for him and swear loyalty to him and to at least mostly believe that he wouldn't work with Blayce to make his own killing monsters, but that's as far as it goes for Kel. If he's kind to her, she finds it uncomfortable and almost untrustworthy because she assumes he doesn't care about her and so his kindness and respect towards her must be fake.

But from the outside, as readers, we know just how much Jon fought for Kel. We know how much he does respect her right to be a knight. Jon is the sole reason that Kel DID get the opportunity to prove herself, if he'd capitulated to Wyldon completely, she just wouldn't have ever been allowed to join. Kel doesn't KNOW THAT, obviously, but we do. We know that Jon did everything he could to find a way to convince Wyldon to let Kel become a page. While Wyldon claims later that the reason he chose to let her stay at the end of the probation year was because his better judgment convinced him she'd earned it, I'd be willing to bet that part of that better judgment also included knowing if he couldn't prove to JON that she needed to go, then he'd be in trouble. Kel was training and working in front of plenty of other trainers and teachers who could easily contradict Wyldon's lies if he'd tried it, many of whom are closer to Jon than they are to Wyldon.

Kel's experiences and feelings about that experience are entirely valid, and she doesn't have the knowledge we do about how hard Jon fought for her, so it's not shocking that she's upset with him for a good portion of her series. She never even discovers this truth by the end of her series, even though she does get a lesson from Jon and Thayet (and Raoul to some degree) about how politics and compromises work in order to make changes happen. So her opinion of him by the end is boiled down to the quote from Squire: "good kings weren't always good men." It makes sense for her to think this, but because Kel's knowledge base is so limited (and her worldview so black and white for much of her series), it makes her an EXTREMELY unreliable narrator about this particular issue.

Kel believes that while Jon generally does his duty and keeps the peace, he doesn't actually care all that much about his people as individuals. But in their only meaningful conversation in Squire, Jon is able to point out that he (and Thayet, who is actually equal to Jon in power, something Kel either doesn't know which would be a failure in her education or just tends to ignore so she can focus her ire on Jon) has to make a LOT of compromises in order to get ANYTHING useful done at all. Sometimes, often, it means making deals with people he doesn't like or people he just fundamentally disagrees with, because it's the first step in a multi-step plan to help more people in the long run. He also points out that just throwing his weight and authority around in order to be able to change everything he wants to change immediately regardless of what anyone else thinks about it is a great way to get himself and his family killed. Because even if he had good intentions, that would be tyranny. It does make Kel think a little, but she doesn't tend to like him much still afterwards, her resentment from her page years will always color her opinion of him a little.

However, then she gets to Haven and she's suddenly tossed into a position of leadership over a lot of other people, many of whom disagree with each other or disagree with her or both. And all of the sudden, Kel has to make compromises. She doesn't LIKE the way the sergeants often treat their men, especially the sergeants whose men are convicts, but there's very very little she can do about it without really pissing off those same sergeants and that's not something she can afford to do. There's a moment when Neal starts getting frustrated about the treatment of the convicts and she takes him out to vent to her so he doesn't vent to the sergeants, something that the sergeants would then take out on their men. Kel's reasoning as she does this is that she "preferred to avoid battles with them now so she would have authority with them later if she needed to use it." Later, Kel is talking to Daine and she says "That's all this job is... Trying to please everyone and pleasing no one. And it will only get worse, not better."

Both of these moments showcase Kel choosing to make compromises. She may not like the way the sergeants treat the convicts, but she needs to stay on the sergeants' good sides because she doesn't have enough resources to butt heads with them nor enough authority to just force the issue, and even if she DID, it could cause the sergeants to become troublesome or take out their frustration with her on the men in ways she can't see as well. But staying on the sergeants' good sides might mean letting some of their maltreatment slide if it's not physically harming the convicts. And even setting that aside, she's dealing with nearly 500 refugees eventually, all of which are from different towns in the area and have different needs, not all of which she can accommodate. This requires compromise. Sometimes she can please some of them and not others, but mostly she probably just ends up not pleasing anybody because that's often how compromises WORK.

She never makes the active connection to Jon and his lesson on leadership from Squire while she's in Haven, but that quote up there about how this job (aka being a commander) is all about trying to please everyone and pleasing no one? It sounds a HECK of a lot like "good kings weren't always good men." You can try your best to help others, but often doing the right thing can involve making everyone unhappy. You can't be everybody's friend if you're going to get anything done.

Some of this she might've learned from Raoul's style of command, but Raoul commands a fairly small amount of people (at least in comparison to a King), and so we see him able to be pretty friendly to the people he commands in a way that Jon is perhaps unable to do. And she might believe that she learned some of this from Wyldon, but Wyldon had a tendency to be very unfair and biased due to his raging bigotry and conservative values, as well as the fact that he doesn't actually even LIKE being a training master and that likely impacted the way he treated the pages (he's almost never that kind to the pages, whereas we see him capable of being quite kind with the refugees later, which is where Kel comes to the conclusion that he hadn't enjoyed being a training master).

But Jon makes an entire speech about how he (and Thayet) have been working THEIR ENTIRE REIGN to change laws that help people. He explains how they have to consider the needs of merchants, nobles, farmers, street people, priests/priestesses, and mages. They have to consider not only what these people might need or want, but also what they could do when they feel sufficiently offended and how that could impact not just the royal family or the nobility but the realm as a whole. Jon points out that they HAVE made changes, for the better, and that just because they don't always succeed at everything or because they have to compromise sometimes, doesn't mean they aren't working at making changes or that they don't care about helping people. Not everyone you have power over is going to be your friend, they might not even be someone you like. But if you're going to take on the job of leadership, that's something you have to be willing to accept and work with, which often means making compromises with people whose needs and values are contradictory to your own.

Jon probably knows when he makes the compromise with Wyldon that it will likely impact a lot of people's good opinion of him. Alanna is right there and clearly angry, and we know Thayet doesn't like the decision, either. And it's entirely possible that Jon knows in the moment that Kel herself will put the blame on him because he's the King. But he also knows that if he insists on Kel being allowed to be a page without trying to compromise with Wyldon, Wyldon will quit over it and he'll end up with ten DIFFERENT problems that could cause a lot bigger issues to far more people than just one girl. So he makes the compromise. He sacrifices Alanna and Thayet and even Kel's good opinion of him in order to ensure that Kel gets the opportunity to become a Knight without turning all of his nobles against him which could ultimately lead to a civil war. Is it fair? No, and he knows it. But it's the best option he has in order to get the outcome they all actually want which is just for Kel to have the chance to prove herself.

Kel has to make similar choices once she's finally in a position of leadership of her own. And whether she realizes it or not, without ever even spending more than a few minutes with Jon, she ends up emulating his leadership style more than anybody else's because it WORKS and it works WELL. She'll probably never admit it, she might never even realize it herself, but she's so much more like Jon than any of the other men she sees as role models. And I love that. I love the dramatic irony of that, that the one person Kel only barely respects because of a compromise he made on her behalf that she'll never even know about, is the person Kel ends up most resembling. Jon is the reason she has the opportunity to become the Protector of the Small in the first place, Jon is the person who created that environment that allowed her to nurture those values, and she'll probably never even really be able to acknowledge that, because sometimes that's what being a good leader means.

[morphmaker]

Protector of the Small x Redwall

[aladygrieve]

One of the thing that always stands out to me about Jonathan of Conté is how different he and Roald are as pages. Jonathan leaned on his royal status constantly to exert authority over the other boys. You can even say he abused it. He also had one tight group of friends and basically ignored everyone else.

Roald, on the other hand, is super hesitant to do anything that might even be perceived as using royal power, to the point that the other pages remark on it. He also makes a point of sitting with all the different friend groups so nobody feels left out. Both of these set him apart from his fellow pages, not because he's royal, but because he has to be so careful not to offend anyone all the time that he doesn't really ever get to show his true personality.

You can just bet that Jonathan told him to do all those things. As a ruler he has his problems (notably his treatment of Kel), but overall he's a much better king than he was a prince. I think he's quite ashamed of some of the things he did when he was younger, as well he should be.

[checkoutmybookshelf]

The Quartet That Started It All

As followers of this blog will note, this is not actually the quartet that started it all for me, but it DID launch author Tamora Pierce's career in the 1980s, and Alanna remains absolutely beloved among Pierce's heroines. Let's talk the Song of the Lioness Quartet.

In a classic case of "if I can't do this as a girl, then I'll do this as a boy and I have a handy twin brother to go full Twelfth Night with," Alanna of Trebond begins The First Adventure by dressing as a boy to train as a page in Tortall's royal court. This book introduces all our main characters and establishes Alan the page amongst his peers and Alanna as she finds herself and her place in chivalry.

One of the other amazing things about Alanna's story overall is that she begins it absolutely terrified of her own magical gift. Her arc includes learning to work with her magic rather than to fear it, and that's a twist on magic users that I really appreciated. We often get overly confident magic users--indeed, we'll get TWO of them later in the series--but it's rare that we get magic users who are fully aware of their powers and are still absolutely terrified of them. So of course, the story and the world and Pierce herself keep throwing Alanna into situations where she has no choice but to develop and use her gift. It's so, so good. This first book covers Alanna's page years, and we move into her squire years in book two.

In the Hand of the Goddess really expands on Alanna's key relationship with Prince Jon on Conte, Duke Roger of Conte, and Geroge Cooper. Alanna moves into a wider world of adult politics and stakes in this book. From being able to defeat an older, stronger, and more experienced opponent in a duel to developing her healing skills when a wound puts her out of commission during a war, Alanna cements her skills, connections, and position in society. This culminates with unmasking Roger as an attempting regicide and the accidental reveal of her gender.

This book is really, really good, and extends Alanna's childhood fear of magic to her fear of Roger specifically in a really natural, logical way. I could say more about the details, but these two books have an episodic vibe to them, so I won't spend too much time exploring every single key plot event.

The Woman Who Rides Like a Man sees Alanna spending her first year as a knight in the desert, with a Bazhir tribe. She becomes their shaman by way of self-defense; she murders their first shaman when he tries to murder her for "being unnatural." Then it falls to Alanna to train three magic users for the tribe, and this is where we see more nuance into how different magic users relate to their powers, from sheer hubris to fear to "this is just part of me, let's do this." It's a phenomenal experience for Alanna, and she learns as much from her students as they do

Book three also sees Jonathan bitching to hell and back about having to be king, which is not a great look, and it's one Alanna calls him on. He spends most of the book alternating between pitching a hissy fit, begging Alanna to marry him, and training to take over as Voice of the Tribes. The interesting thing here is that Alanna refuses to marry Jon. He is trying to fit Alanna into his own fairy tale, and she very much goes "That isn't our relationship, I can't do that. We aren't meant to be like that, and that's ok." If I could inject that lesson into humanity's collective head, I would. It's well done and it's great.

Lioness Rampant picks up on Alanna's travels after she leaves the Bazhir, and eventually sees her return to Corus with a magical artifact to help secure Jonathan's position as king.

There's also the teeny tiny complication that Alanna's twin brother, Thom, has resurrected Duke Roger. Absolute chaos ensues, and Roger almost manages to take out the entire court during Jonathan's coronation. Nobody should have to kill an evil sorceror twice, but Alanna did.

If you want to dive into Tamora Pierce's Tortall Universe, starting with Alanna is absolutely a good choice. These books hold a very soft spot in my heart, and they're never not engaging.

[rikashmoonsword]

what makes me like Jonathan and Alanna's relationship/friendship so much is just the fact that they're peers.

There's a lot to be said about our beloved Tammy and her penchant for deeply questionable age gaps, but I won't say them because despite everything my ideal of love remains daine/numair and thus I can't criticise them to save my life. but to Alanna, all of her loves are older than her. George is 17 to Alanna'a 10, Liam is 34 to Alanna's 19/20, Jon is 18 when Alanna is 14.

George is a teacher as much as a friend, he teaches her to pick locks, wrestle, use a knife, pick pockets, how to walk among thieves and keep her purse on her and how to know who to trust and who not to. He shows her unselfish love, he shows her how gentlemen treat their ladies, he treats her like a friend and like the most beautiful woman alive. George is a Teacher.

Liam teaches her how to hold her own without a weapon in her hands, shows her how nice it is to flirt and flit without sneaking about. He also teaches her to never sever a part of herself to suit a man, and that love is important but if the love isn't for all of you it isn't love at all.

and then she's home with Jon. Jon who she couldn't look into the eyes of as a page but who she would chase him to the realm of the black god if she had to, Jon who fought Gary to get her as a squire, Jon who held her when she was afraid and who was the first one to show her love.

Jon who acts like a child when things don't go his way, who would flirt with a crazy girl to get on her bad side, who has a temper that can rival her own.

When Alanna is with Jon, she isn't with a teacher, he isn't older and smarter, he's as young and foolish as her. he rages and throws fits and apologises sloppily and he loves her just as much as she loves him.

Jon is never truly something bigger than himself with Alanna, because she was the one who saved his life from his cousin, because he is the one who dragged her into a death trap of old gods and survived, because she is the one he disregarded direct orders to save from tusaine, because they're best friends more than anything else in this world and not even screaming matches and world ending spats can break them.

That's why i love them so much, because they're peers, and that friendship makes them stronger than any other champion and king in history.

[queershippingpolls]

Do you ship them?

[naurielrochnur]

Tortallan sleepover

Jon, Thayet, and Numair stay up late drinking tea and swapping stories.

(ask me about the parallels between these characters, I dare you!)

Thank you @malkaleh for introducing me to one of my fav ot3s.

[whimsicallywiddershins]

I'm just imagining one day that George, Alanna, Jon, Thayet, Numair, Daine, the knights, ect are just hanging out after a council meeting or something, and they all start talking about famous ancestors, cause they are all noble and I'm sure they all have great records. And George is sitting there, listening but quiet, cause he really can't contribute to all these ancient bloodlines and kings and such. Jon feels bad and is like

"George, do you have any interesting family members? I've bet you've got lots of famous thieves." You know, the include him. And George is like.

"Well, there is this one lady, Rebekah Cooper. She was a guradswoman that caught some big kidnappers and such."

And everyone's like, cool cool, how ironic, ect.

Then Jon starts thinking. That name is familiar, but he just can't place it. So later everyone is drunk and having a good time and Jon goes and unearths a book about his family. And there, in the section of his famous ancestor King Gareth III, there is a sungle page about his kidnapping. And one sentence mentioning his rescue by Provost Guardswoman Rebekah Cooper.

Jon goes insane. He goes running back to the little party and is like

"George!!! You won't believe this shit!"

And everyone gathers around and is amazed. That George's many great-grandma saved Jon's many great-grandfather. And there are lots of jokes about how Tortall would be lost without a Cooper there to save it.

But then, as the weeks go by, Jon keeps looking. He finds old Provost reports about a stubborn Puppy named Cooper that nabbed a notorious child kidnapper. About a rookie dog that ended a counterfeit ring practically singlehandedly. Reports left by Lord Gershom of Haryse, praising Rebekah Cooper for her work. Small accounts talking about an odd cat. A scent hound. The amount of people Rebekah Cooper saved. The difference she made.

And he compiles these findings, and spreads them around. Everyone is reading about this young Guardswoman that saved Tortall's people, over and over. Girls are inspired to become guards and knights and Riders. The Lower City is proud of its savior. The commoners are excited about a hero that came from nothing, like them. People start telling stories, making songs. Talling the story of Rebekah Cooper, so she will never be forgotten.

[axolotlcipher]

See the joke is that I love Tammy, but GURL these romances. All lighthearted fun from ur local lesbian.

[mariedemedicis]

Jon, Numair and Ozorne for the ask game?

Jon:

• My NOTP for them: I'm...not sure I have one? I wouldn't want Alanna/Jon or Delia/Jon to be long lasting but there are enough interesting elements to both those relationships that I would be open to reading fic/meta that explores those. There's no like instant recoil. Okay, no, wait, Jon/Roger is definitely my notp.

• My BROTP for them: Jon/Gary

• My OTP for them: Jon/Thayet, I just love them together so much!

• My second choice pairing for them: Jon/George - I love that line about them sharing an understanding from both being monarchs.

• My fluffy pairing for them: Uhh, does Jon really have a fluffy pairing? Jon/Thayet isn't only fluffy but it might be the closest.

• My angsty pairing for them: I feel like also Jon/Thayet with all the family drama around Kalasin.

• My favorite poly ship for them: I don't have one ready to go but maybe Jon/Thayet/Buri/Raoul? Although to be fair, I feel like the Jon/Thayet, Buri/Thayet, Buri/Raoul, and Jon/Raoul pairs are all solid. It's Jon/Buri where I feel a bit shaky about things working out but I guess if they both love Thayet and Raoul, they can probably come to a level of understanding.

• My weirdest pairing for them: I've always been a little intrigued by the idea of Alanna/Delia so, I think it would really interesting to see how things go in a Jon/Delia/Alanna throuple.

My intrigued-by pairing for them: I could see Jon/Numair being interesting.

Numair:

• My NOTP for them: I'm so sorry to everyone that loves them together but it's got to be Numair/D.a*ne.

• My BROTP for them: Maybe Alanna or Lindhall?

• My OTP for them: I just love the potential of him and Thom as massively powerful, extremely talented, and chaotic sorcerer husbands.

• My second choice pairing for them: Numair/Ozorne/Varice, pre-Ozorne's ascension.

• My fluffy pairing for them: Same as above!

• My angsty pairing for them: Well, same as above but post-ascension.

• My favorite poly ship for them: Sorry for answering the same thing for most of these but Numair/Ozorne/Varice again.

• My weirdest pairing for them: Maybe Numair/Varice/Thayet in an au where Numair and Varice both escape Carthak and Thayet never encounters Alanna.

My intrigued-by pairing for them: Same as above, Numair/Jon.

Ozorne:

• My NOTP for them: Kind of Ozorne/anyone post-ascension.

• My BROTP for them: Ozorne/Fazia because I refuse to believe they weren't very close at one point in time.

• My OTP for them: Numair/Ozorne/Varice, pre-Ozorne's ascension.

• My second choice pairing for them: I guess Ozorne/Numair.

• My fluffy pairing for them: Again the OT3, pre-ascension.

• My angsty pairing for them: The OT3 post-ascension.

• My favorite poly ship for them: Again the OT3.

• My weirdest pairing for them: Hmmm, I could kind of see a Ozorne/Josiane thing working out in the 'they make each other worse' kind of way. They certainly share a worldview by the time of Emperor Mage, anyway.

My intrigued-by pairing for them: See above.

[fytortall]

Do you think that any of John and David's kids were sneaking off to hang out with the King of the thieves?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Translation: Do you think that any of Jon and Thayet's kids were sneaking off to hang out with the King of the Thieves?

[copperhawks]

Hot take: George's behavior throughout In the Hand of the Goddess and Woman Who Rides Like a Man (at least up until he and Alanna officially get together) is worse and more sexist than Jon's behavior in Woman Who Rides Like a Man.

Jon gets a "maybe" from Alanna when he asks her to marry him and makes the assumption that that "maybe" is just nerves that will ultimately change to the yes that he thinks Alanna ACTUALLY means. Is it wrong? Yes. But Jon at least has the backing of having been in a romantic relationship with Alanna for a long time by this point and she's verbally confirmed that she's in love with him more than once. He also has confirmation that their destinies are intertwined and that their partnership is blessed by the gods, which he's interpreted to mean that he and Alanna HAVE to be together, that "all along this had to happen." He's obviously interpreted things incorrectly, but he's not actually wrong about their fates being connected to each other on a divine level.

Tamora Pierce mentions in her afterward from 2014 that Jon also starts to get a lot of attention from girls and it goes to his head, making him assume that Alanna will want to marry him simply because he's the prince. And while that is clearly true, I think that his dialogue from when they get together shows that there's even more going on that makes him believe their relationship to be inevitable. Jon is assuming the two of them are going to get married and be together forever from day one and Alanna just doesn't pick up on it and thinks he's just being kind-of flowery when he's actually being dead serious.

We also get a lot of discussion of Jon feeling restless and frustrated with the way his life seems to be going during Woman Who Rides Like a Man. He mentions wanting to rebel against the expectations placed upon him, but that he also feels trapped. Given by his words to Alanna when they get together, the relationship with her is, in its own way, also a trap he thinks he can't escape. It HAS to happen, and it WILL happen, regardless of what he and Alanna do or don't do, and so it's just perhaps really convenient that the two of them love each other, or perhaps their feelings were inevitable because of their shared destiny. He loves her, and he seems to see her as an escape from his life as a prince, but she's also intrinsically entwined with his life as a prince and his future as a king, and so the frustrations he is having with his life are tainting his feelings for her, too.

So yes, he's being arrogant and making assumptions about Alanna's answer to his proposal and his behavior towards her isn't okay, but there's an entire book and a half helping explain why Jon makes the assumptions he does, why he FEELS the way he does. It's entirely understandable, even if it's still wrong.

And then there's George. George who gets a really negative reaction from Alanna when he kisses her the first time and proceeds to keep pushing his feelings on her a few times after that, including kissing her AGAIN. Alanna once describes his behavior towards her as "stalking" and "terrifying." When he tries to propose to her after that (again, all he's gotten so far are NEGATIVE reactions to his advances), Alanna thinks that she wishes he wouldn't and tries to divert the conversation away from that, but George refuses to be deterred, going so far as to say that he'll keep waiting for her answer to change when she gets older even though her answer was a pretty unequivocal no.

He also promises in this scene to never speak about this again. He kisses her a second time after this, despite the fact that she's reacted negatively to his advanced and just turned him down really clearly (Alanna's reaction to this is more positive, but we're not discussing Alanna, we're discussing George). George really quickly breaks that promise to her, too, sending her a letter when she's out in the desert that Alanna describes as letting her know he still has feelings for her, and then when Alanna shows up in Port Caynn to see him and finally opens up about her break-up with Jon, he takes the opportunity to shoot his shot again.

All of this behavior could be considered sexual harassment. Alanna gives him no indication that she wants in and in fact gives several indicators that she DOESN'T. The narrative tells us that some part of her MIGHT want it, that some part of her enjoys his attention, but her actual words and actions to George are telling him she's not interested and he's choosing not to respect that boundary. Even if George thought that Alanna was lying, or if he felt like she couldn't admit it to herself, the respectful thing to do is to listen to what she's SAYING and accept it and leave her alone. But he doesn't. With zero actual encouragement on Alanna's end, George continues to pursue her.

George also has a tendency to push boundaries with Alanna in other places, too, through his feelings of protectiveness about her. Alanna seems to take this in stride and kind-of seems to enjoy that protective streak to some degree (it seems to satisfy a part of her that wants to be treated like a delicate little flower sometimes), but some of his behavior when being more protective or even jealous veers into questionable territory for me. When Alanna is with the Bazhir, he sends two men out to spy on her. They're specifically told not to be caught by Alanna at all, so it's not even like he just sends a messenger out to try to hear from her and make sure she's okay, they're just spying on her for him. After she comes to Port Caynn, she shows an interest in getting to know the Shang warrior he has staying with him and George immediately sends him away because he thinks that Alanna might get accidentally killed as a result, which feels pretty insulting to both Alanna AND the Shang warrior's skills as fighters. Alanna takes both incidents in stride and brushes them off as slightly annoying but not worth expending lots of effort being mad about it, but I personally feel like it's odd for her not to care given that similar behavior from anyone else would've netted them a lecture.

Jon's behavior is arrogant, yes, and he's wrong, but I feel like it makes so much more sense for him to hear "maybe" and assume that it's just nerves and that he and Alanna are on the same page about their relationship, than it makes sense for George to keep pushing for something Alanna has made very clear that she's not at all interested in.

George's narrative is STEEPED in "no means yes" trope. And while the "no means yes" is also present for Jon's storyline in Woman Who Rides Like a Man, it's directly criticized by Alanna and, simultaneously, by the narrative itself. But George's behavior is SUPPORTED by the narrative. His behavior is okay because the narrative supports that he DOES know Alanna better than she knows herself despite a distinct lack of any proof of that, while Jon is wrong for making the exact same assumption due to a LOT of proof of his conclusion. George's behavior isn't really criticized because, even when Alanna describes him as stalking her, it's represented as a sort-of romantic thing for him to do instead of creepy.

None of which means I think George is worse for Alanna than Jon ultimately. I think that Jon's entire approach to their relationship was doomed to failure and flawed from the beginning. Jon's interpretation of their relationship as inevitable was always going to butt heads with Alanna's need to always go against what the world tells her is inevitable for her. It's actually really brilliantly written as a relationship, it's entirely understandable why Alanna as a teenager would be swept away by someone she's been so divinely connected to for YEARS and who has been a close friend and confidante from the moment they met. He's also closer to her age and she spends more time with him when she's younger.

But it's also so clear from the jump that this relationship is never going to work because Jon and Alanna clearly aren't on the same page about things and they don't communicate enough about their feelings for that to change. Eventually, inevitably, it was always going to explode in their faces, and then it does. Jon takes his duty seriously and he knows that it's vitally important for him to take a wife and have an heir (and several spares, ideally), so he wants to move forward with that now that they're both adults and Alanna's secret is out. But Alanna had never really considered that the relationship would really go that far and balks when faced with that reality. Alanna's desire for independence butts heads with Jon's dedication to his duty as a prince. It doesn't take away from what they mean to each other or what they'll accomplish together, but I love how well that relationship is built over the first two books so that their end doesn't really come as a surprise.

Conversely, George has no real responsibilities that he couldn't set aside if he really wanted or needed to. He has no grand destiny with Alanna causing him to pursue her. He just likes her. This makes it a lot easier to start the relationship on equal standing once they DO make it there. George has been pretty forward with her, but this also means that Alanna is under no illusions about his expectations of her and what he wants from the relationship. She already knows he wants to marry her, she knows he's protective of her, she knows that he's in love with her. There will be fairly few surprises in store down the line with George in a way that wasn't true with Jon.

But unfortunately, I only really like George and Alanna's romance after it begins. I don't like the build up for it the way I like the build up that Jon and Alanna had. I think that George and Alanna's romantic scenes prior to them getting together are questionable at best, so while I can tell where the narrative is trying to lead me, I don't really find that it works. I think it's very dated and it shows. There's a lot that's so good about these two and that I love about them, but I do wish that George was given the same sort of scrutiny that Jon gets for his behavior, regardless of what the narrative is trying to say about it.

[morphmaker]

The Immortals No. 10: The Battle of Port Legann

[mkaugust]

Hi hi!! Kisses ask game #13 for the knights or (fictional) hockey players of your choice, if you’re interested

I'll be toasting at midnight to a year of new forms of brainrot and all the continued brainrot to come <3

Knights, as you requested. Continued below the cut cause I got wordy. Warnings for lack of editing or I fear it would have been even longer. (Everyone who doesn't know these guys should go read The Song of the Lioness series. Make it your new years resolution lol)

A Toast

“George!” Jon startled as George walked out the door to Alan's empty room. Well, perhaps not Alan’s room anymore. The squire’s room? Jon shook his head, distracted and thoughts swirling with the sounds of the party he had left behind still echoing in his ears. Quieter this time, though no less surprised, he said, “George, you're here.”

“Still haven't fixed your security flaws I see.” 

Jon huffed and straightened his shoulders. “There are no flaws and I can protect myself if there were.”

“Hmm,” George smirked. “I suppose that's why I stayed here rather than keeping an eye on Alanna.”

“She's strong on her own.” 

“Yes. We'll keep reminding ourselves of that, shall we?” George whispered, voice suddenly less sure than before. They both worried for the missing third piece to their set, even if they constantly pretended otherwise.

Jon smiled in reassurance and nodded. “So, how do I happen to find you in my rooms on the eve of the New Year? Shouldn't you be…at a party of your own?”

“I was. I left. As did you.” George spoke as he walked slowly around the room, aimless and yet clearly full of purpose. Jon sat on the edge of his bed and reached to remove his shoes, loosen his tight clothing. 

Their eyes never left each other for long. This dance was becoming familiar.

“I watched you dance.” George whispered, nearly more hum than words. “I watched…I…”

“You…enjoyed it? My…dancing?”

George nodded, once. “Dance with me.”

“What?” Jon frowned, confused. This part of the routine was…new. “We…have no music. No partners.”

George stared down at Jon, motionless, intently serious. “Two men can dance together. Surely they taught you that.” 

“They?”

“Alanna.”

“Ah. I…yes I suppose.” Jon stood at George's beckoning. He hesitated, looking around. “My boots…”

George knelt to remove his own boots quickly, placing them out of the way. “There. Now we're on equal footing. Your excuses are gone. Dance with me.” 

It was a command, but the gentlest one Jon had received in recent memory. How could he resist obeying?

George bent at the waist briefly, a motion like a bow but somehow different, placing himself in the maiden’s position for the dance. Oh, Jon realized, he's done this before. Jon stepped forward and they began to dance as one.

“George…”

“Yes, Jon?” 

The moment was too tender for loud speech, nearly too much for steady thought. Jon stumbled, less elegant dancing on his bedroom floor than in the ballroom. Dancing with a man. Dancing with George.

George steadied him and suddenly they were closer, so much closer, than any dance should have rightfully brought them, hands strong and tight to each other even as words faltered and the music of joint silence prevailed. They danced on.

“I thought of you, you and Alan, at the party. Sometimes I feel as though I've been waiting all night for you.”

“I have waited…my whole life for the both of you.”

Distantly, the cheers of a party reaching its peak echoed through the halls. As the cheers reached them, their dancing halted, though their embrace did not. Foreheads pressed together, Jon blinked his eyes open, unsure when they had closed.

“We should toast. I don't think I have anything for it though.”

“Toast to what?”

“To…the new year, of course. To…to Alanna's adventures and safety. To dancing.” The last was said with a smirk and confidence Jon did not quite feel until George returned it readily.

“To dancing.” George echoed. “Or…to us?”

“Us?”

“A toast, to us three. Dancing here and awaiting the steps of our missing partner, their return to our arms as certain as their place in our hearts. And to us two, keeping space safe and warm in the meantime.”

“A toast indeed.” Jon echoed, awed by George’s words. “And still…nothing to toast with…” Jon looked around his room sadly.

“Here,” George called Jon’s attention back. “Here.” 

George placed a hand, gentle but firm, to Jon cheek and closed the little space between them, pressing their lips together briefly. “A toast,” he said again, pulling back only just enough to speak.

“A toast to us two,” Jon echoed, speaking the words asked George's lips before sealing them together once more. “A toast to us three.”

Further words were unnecessary. Their toasting continued to blur out the distant sounds of revelry and a different sort of New Year's toasting occurring elsewhere in the castle.

[spiritintheinkwell]

It's me, hi, it's your Swiftie girlfriend who just finished a nostalgia read of the Song of the Lioness series and I submit to you that All Too Well (10 minute version) is very much an Alanna/Jonathan song - Do with this information what you will <3

I love and cherish my swiftie girlfriend and her galaxy brain. ⚔👑

[ladylingua]

Jon, George, Liam

Fake Date: Jon

I think dating a prince sounds awful but fake dating one sounds fun! We’d be going out and having fun on his dime, and Jon is charming and enjoyable in small doses.

Slow Burn: George

I don’t know that I would want to go that slow with George, but I could never be his enemy, and I only want to real date him, not fake date 😂

Enemies to Lovers: Liam

I hate his personality so enemies on sight, but Alanna did say he was a fun hook up, so I guess I could see myself tempted to attempt being with him...at least for a very short time lmao