#It’s actually a good response to all the “normal” Duke fanon

[5-7-9]

Duke’s full narration about how you have to be crazy if you’re Robin

[voiddaisy]

Rank the Batfam members based on how well you think you'd get along irl

This is so fun! Okay, so my idea of canon versus fanon is kind of messed up, but I'm going to do my best to go solely off of what I know is canon. I also went a little overboard and did some character study shit because when I tell you I love the bat family, I love the bat family.

(1) Duke Thomas. From what I know about canon, we are really alike. He has a strong moral compass, wants to help people, and can be super goofy and silly. He doesn't really take things super seriously, cares a lot about his family, and is not afraid to lie to Bruce, which I am a supporter of. I think overall we would get along the best just because we are so alike. He also just seems so chill and fun to be around, and I've made a post about this before, but he is so nonjudgmental when it comes to his friends and family, so nonchalant, and literally just the cutie patootie ever, so for sure him.

(2) Stephanie Brown. I love Steph and no one can take that away from me. She reminds me a lot of one of my sisters; She is very witty and humorous, and she is determined, stubborn, and compassionate. She tries to have a positive outlook on everything, despite everything she has been through. I think we would get along well because she is kind of my opposite in a lot of ways. She is outgoing, confrontational, and rebellious, but still vulnerable, caring, and selfless. We would kind of just be a slay duo in my opinion.

(3) Dick Grayson. If I didn't relate so much to Duke, I would definitely say I am the most like Dick. He is a perfectionist, very sarcastic, caring, and literally rocks "eldest daughter syndrome," which... same. He is also such an emotional person, and most of his emotions come out in anger because he doesn't know how to regulate them, which I can relate to. He has that personality that is so easy to banter with but also gets vulnerable, which we see a lot in the comics when it comes to his brothers. I just think our personalities would blend really easily together.

(4) Barbara Gordon. Barbara is literally that bitch. She is super intelligent, determined, hard-working, and responsible while also being empathetic, funny, independent, and wise. She takes so many of the bat kids under her wing as a mentor and tries to build them up to be better people (literally fixing what Bruce messes up). She is super funny and cool, is clearly intelligent without having to flex on it, and cares so deeply for people. If I had an older sister, I'd want her to be just like Babs, because this woman is literally gold. She isn't higher on this list just because I just connect with the other characters more, but she is still just such a good character and I love her so much.

(5) Cassandra Cain. I think I would get along well with Cass because she is a very complex person. She is silent, stoic, determined, responsible, deeply empathetic, and has self-esteem issues. I share a lot of these traits with her, but I'm more... outgoing than she is? So it would be like a bad bitch and her baddie friend situation where I am a yapper and advocate for us both when I normally wouldn't be. She'd encourage my more outgoing side to come out because of how stoic and quiet she can be. She is also like the better version of Bruce Wayne (sorry Bruce), where she still has that intense sense of justice and a strong moral compass, but because she cares so deeply about her friends and family, she puts them first, whereas Bruce kind of... struggles with that lmfao. That is just my interpretation of her, though!

(6) Jason Todd. I actually didn't plan on putting him this high on the list, but after I started typing it out, I was like... oh. I would get along with him better than I thought. Okay, so what annoys me about him is mainly his sense of justice, rebellious nature, complex moral code, and anger. However, these are all issues that stem from his insane trauma and aren't like natural-born traits of his. When he was Robin, he was very playful, witty, kind, and sweet, as a lot of people mention. Despite how he changed after the Lazurus Pit, we still see these personality traits slip through sometimes. He cares a lot about the street kids and does his best to mentor them. In the Gotham Knights cames (which apparently aren't canon but I don't care), he can be very vulnerable and kind to his brothers instead of... beating Tim half to death. Jason is a very emotional character with loyal and protective instincts, and he desires redemption so deeply that he doesn't care how it is acquired. His complexity is what makes me drawn to him, I think. To recognize him as a person who is deeply traumatized and needs positive reinforcement in his life is easy; To give that positive reinforcement is harder. But I think I could offer that to him (and I have the "I can fix him" mentality. Would I be able to fix him? No. Could I be a good friend to him? Maybe). My major qualms with him would be his skewed sense of justice and his moral code; Everything else is like typical emo behavior haha.

(7) Tim Drake. I did not expect Tim to be so low on this list, but I guess it's more of a little brother-type situation. Tim is very intelligent, analytical, determined, empathetic, and compassionate. He shares a lot of traits with Dick, where he is a natural kind of leader and has a deep resourcefulness to him. He can be very self-critical and lacks a need to take care of himself, but he is a team player and can be very responsible. He is also just kind of like... the funniest bat brother to me. It's his sarcasm and the way he picks on people, I think. While he is a good character, I just think I would get frustrated with his stubbornness very quickly. He also just has that little brother attitude that gets on my nerves. But I do think that I would be like a big sister figure to him if that makes sense? Like "you love to hate them" type of shit.

(8) Damian Wayne. Okay, to preface; Damian is just a deeply traumatized kid, so my reservations are literally just about that. I have what you would call a chronic need to fix people, and Damian would just be so easy for me to try to fix, even if I knew I couldn't. He has a skewed sense of justice, like Jason does, but is easier to convince not to kill people. He is stoic, cold, can be emotionless at times, and does not want people to take care of him. I saw some panel yesterday about Dick trying to comfort him after Bruce dies, and Damian is so choked up and doesn't want to speak about it, despite Dick being his older brother. Damian has literally been trained since birth to focus on his mission, his feelings be damned, and I would have such a hard time with that. I would just get so emotional over him and want to take care of him, and he would hate that. I just think that he wouldn't like me very much. I love Damian as a character and I love how complex he is, but he would not love me lmfao.

(9) Bruce Wayne. I knew Bruce was going to be last because there is a special place in my heart reserved for my beef with parents who fuck up their kids. Even though Bruce tries to be a good father to his kids, he is just so shit at it sometimes, and it makes me so mad. In my real life, any time my parents fuck with one of my sisters, I get so irrationally angry and want to fist-fight them. If I was around Bruce and his traumatized children, I would want to throw hands with him every time I saw him. I know that deep down, Bruce is a really good man who just wants to help people, but the way he treats his children literally just boils my blood. I would get along with him if he either didn't have children or had some deep-rooted therapy to fix his emotional constipation. I mean... we would get along fine I'm sure, I would just always have that rage, you know?

This was way longer than I intended it to be, but I have been doing so much character study lately about these people and wanted to share my opinion on each of them in a broader way. If I messed up their character in relation to DC canon... oh well. Also, I know Jason Todd is a little bitch, but he is my little bitch, so it's fine.

Thank you for the ask <3 this was so fun!!

[ectonurites]

Batcest shippers read comics, actually. And they write them, and draw for them. Please continue to make a fool of yourself pretending otherwise.

i got ranty here so the tldr: yeah no shit, you’re taking something i tweeted entirely out of context, i’m well aware of those facts and im not ‘pretending’ anything lmao

onto my full response:

i see you must have come from my twitter! and yeah, i’m unfortunately aware there are people who ship batcest working for dc, its super upsetting! the person who designed the current red hood outfit just posted j*ydick on their twitter today, which is horrifying to see.

like listen im not... im not gonna go out and harass people for shipping batcest. I literally do not have the energy, and I know I’m not gonna be convincing anyone of anything bc the people who chose to ship batcest have made their choice there.

but I’m always gonna advocate for like, those people TAGGING THEIR SHIT so that especially minors but also anyone else who doesn’t want to see fuckin’ incest doesn’t need to. And like, the creation of lists of what creators are making that stuff so people can block and move on? I also think that’s good. Like I don’t think people should go harass anyone over this because its just... theres no point. But letting people who don’t want to see it know who to block so they can move on? that’s a good thing.

The comments of mine I think you’re specifically talking about were about a specific but common type of fanon batcest shipper, because like... immabe real! its very clear a lot of the batfam community on here in general don’t read the comics, (like, as in many people will OPENLY ADMIT that they don’t) and thats not even an inherently bad thing, like people are allowed to interact with media how they want to! But when people get so divorced from canon by only reading fanworks or versions of characters that have been altered and their relationships altered, its easy for misconceptions about all of it to spread, and people to be shipping pairings that literally bear no resemblance to the canon versions/relations of the characters. This isn’t even exclusive to the people shipping batcest. However with the people shipping batcest like... its when those relationships in canon get blurred by just a fanon game of telephone that it becomes easier for them to justify shipping it, you know? That was the point I was trying to make on twitter (i think it was last night? this morning? i dont remember. its 1am rn time is fake)

but like, i’m sorry but in current canon Jason, Dick, Tim, and Damian all consider each other siblings (and Jason had even made a comment at one point in rhato about having four brothers, meaning he probably includes Duke too!). That is... canon. You can see multiple instances of this if you’re reading current comics. And while they have complicated relationships with Bruce, they do all consider him a father (even when Jason says he doesn’t- he literally flip flops on it depending on how he feels in a given day because of his trauma and stuff, but like there will be times only a few issues apart where he will or won’t admit Bruce is his dad). All of these characters have been adopted (or in Damian’s case obv adoption wasn’t necessary) by Bruce in canon at different times (and Cass also, but that’s only in pre new 52 as of right now)

If you are chosing to ship any of the siblings together (or any of them with bruce) you are chosing to ship incest. That is an active choice you are making, and you have to accept the consequences of that. Any judgement/backlash you face for shipping incest is something you are accepting by chosing to ship it.

And if you go “oh but they’re only adopted siblings not REAL siblings-“ you’re an asshole, because adopted siblings are real siblings. I don’t care if they didn’t grow up together, do you realize how invalidating that is towards like, real life people? The amount of people I’ve seen who are adopted themselves get insanely triggered and upset by that kind of content (not just in this fandom btw!) because it just shows people don’t see those familal bonds as being real? It’s not insignificant.

I know ‘media affects reality’ is a controvercial topic, and like obviously ‘i see this thing in media thus i will do it’ is NOT how it works, but the things you normalize/glorify in media you consume says a lot about your thoughts on the topics. Framing matters. Like obviously ‘haha i watch hannibal, gonna go eat people now-‘ is not the case. especially because that media doesn’t frame it as a good thing. That’s the thing I think people miss in these discussions a lot of the time. If you are like ‘i am going to explore how traumatizing incestual relationships could be through these characters’ with batcest? like go off! that could be interesting honestly, and that’s not glorifying it. But acting like ‘omg i just think its so romantic ❤️’ with stuff between characters who canonically are siblings... again you are accepting the judgement that may come your way by publicly doing that.

anyways, i’m well aware of how prevalent batcest is both in the comics industry and around here, i’m aware plenty of them do read comics, and you definitely missed the context in my tweets of me saying things like “a lot” “it feels like many” etc when saying batcest shippers don’t read comics. Context matters my dude ✌️ (also wanna point out, a lot of really gross people work in comics. Racist people, antisemetic people [even today there was some controversy abt that in some hulk comic i believe?] these people being in those industries is... not a good thing even if its normalized???)

But really I think its kinda funny to uh call me a ‘fool’ for something you think I’m doing because you took my words out of context. And maybe you weren’t trying to come off as smug but you absolutely do here and it just strikes me as very funny that you like... are acting like you’re smarter than me or better than me for being okay with incest being normalized in a fandom for superhero comics, a type of media that MANY KIDS READ AND PARTICIPATE IN DISCUSSION ABOUT, while I’m bothered by it.

I don’t talk about this stuff much on here because again, I don’t want to fight about it, I’m not gonna go out of my way to try to change people’s minds on any of it because I know that won’t accomplish anything, I much prefer to just... ignore the content I don’t want to see, maybe warn other people especially minors who also don’t want to see it, and move on with my life. You really didn’t need to bring this to my inbox here, but like go off I guess 🤷

editing this quick just to add in the tweets i made i think this anon is referencing that i very clearly started with ‘so many of them’, not me saying it applies to all of them