#It doesn't mean you actually ship or like dark things

[skumhuu]

Proshipper = you're against censorship and harassment over fiction & curate your experience on the internet to have a healthy distance from things that make you uncomfortable

Antishipper = you're okay and even encourage harassment towards "freaks" and "weirdos" society deems acceptable to hurt

[minakoaiinos]

Animating this season like you can't have the slightest bit of jest and god forbid jesting about yaoi

[celtrist]

This was the piece that I had started before my extensive vacation (of coughing). Once again, Alastor is consistently the bane of my existence with his... well everything.

No matter! Anyway, this is something I like to call the Obsession AU. To sum it up real fast: Everyone is yandere for Alastor. I think it would just be apart of his punishment in Hell, being consistently forced into or desired in romantic/sex which he's never had much interest in. I would describe it as a dark comedy thing, but it can be as comedic or as dark as you want here. With that said, please be on guard with any mentions of darker content that treds towards a certain dead bird territory when I get a bit into how I imagine some of the characters. Again, it doesn't have to go that far if you're interested in this premise of an au and wanna focus on the more light hearted stuff, feel free.

This au is just poking a bit of fun at how everyone in the fandom wants to put Alastor in romantic situations constantly (whether it be with themselves or the other characters) despite Alastor probably being the least interested in the subject in the whole show. This is by no means a hate train or making fun of people who do enjoy shipping Alastor, it just more of a funny thing I think comes off as pretty ironic for his character and hopefully, others can enjoy that too. In this au he leans pretty much on the clear-cut side of aromantic and asexual with no interest in romantic affections at all. With that said, if you want to explore Alastor genuinely being interested in one of the other characters romantically or something similar, feel free to explore that! I can see some interesting dichotomies there. It's just within the actual "canon" of this au, he's not at all interested with that sort of thing. And just with a last final reminder to get into some character things I have in mind, some of the content mentioned does get pretty dark, particularly with Valentino but I don't think anyone's surprised there. But there might be some triggering content of the following mentioned here with characters but no crazy details really: Manipulation/Gaslighting, forced feminization, Non-con, Munchausen syndrome, Poisoning, Possessive, Drugging, Love bombing And I will be sure to give a quick warning to each character it might apply to, please feel free to let me know if I missed anything!

Rosie (Munchausen syndrome, Poisoning): Rosie has 100% poisoned Alastor before to make sure he relies on her. They started off as good friends but at some point Alastor began getting ill and Rosie offered to take care of him. This leads to Alastor staying in bed for full days, only really seeing Rosie who took care of his every need from food, clothing, washing, and so on. At some point, Alastor caught on that Rosie was putting something in his food to make him sick and he managed to escape with their friendship tarnished much to his dismay. He's often uneasy around Rosie but is upfront about his knowledge of Rosie's deeds. Rosie, in turn, acts like it is a lighthearted situation and often offers Alastor over for lunch, which he often denies. Any food he gets at his doorstep from a secret admirer or a lunchbox he finds at his seat in an overlord meeting goes straight into the trash. Alastor will still use Rosie's assets to his benefit of course, but is always careful as to what she might try to get in exchange. He has had more awkward lunches with her with his homemade meal versus the buffet she catered for the occasion, with the two gossiping like old times. Alastor is still uneasy during these times, but he also revels in the false pleasantries due to not having many others he's able to associate himself with due to the curse.

Lucifer (Controlling, Possessive, Manipulation): So I'm not 100% clear how I wanted to approach Lucifer. He and Charlie are probably the most similar I suppose? He wants Alastor as his queen (either alongside him and Lilith or only with him, he doesn't mind either way). He doesn't force him into dresses or anything, but Lucifer does consistently make doting moves and talks about how Alastor would make a good father to their children. Marriage is one of the mind and Lucifer probably gets a bit possessive with him. He also tries to guilt trip Alastor a lot, or manipulate situations in one of their arguments to get Alastor to say something he doesn't mean.

Charlie (Controlling, Possessive): Probably the most tame of everyone quite honestly. Charlie can be a bit controlling but does step off when Alastor expresses his dislike of her doing so, even if it takes a couple times. She likes doing things for him, is super affectionate, and daydreams about her, Vaggie, and Alastor all getting married. She can get pretty possessive with him, not being pleased when anybody does anything against Alastor's will or hurt him. The only exception to this rule is Vaggie, to which Charlie sees it like two cats getting along and finds it very endearing.

Vaggie (Forced Feminization, Controlling, Murder): Depending on how you look at it, Vaggie's one of the more fucked up obsessions or one of the more funnier ones. Because she's automatically inclined to like Alastor quite a bit with the curse thing but her personality doesn't jive with his for her own taste (in terms of their first meeting), she both hates and loves the guy. She's obsessed with trying to murder Alastor with traps around the hotel or outright standing over him with her spear. The hatred comes primarily from not wanting to feel the way she does about him, I guess like a fucked up tsundere if you wanna go that route. At the same token, however, she does want Alastor to be involved with both her and Charlie romantically. There's just one little problem: Vaggie has about the same amount of interest in men as she does in canon. So to sort of "fix" Alastor, she consistently tries to force him to be more feminine in clothing, offering different feminine names, and even trying to force him to get a sex change. Alastor is pretty slippery though, so it never quite works out in Vaggie's favor aside from the occasional dress or skirt being worn, which solidifies her attraction to him. Then he takes it off and looks more like a man again, and it solidifies her frustration/hatred for him.

Angel Dust (Drugging): To start, while I think Angel would love to have sex with Alastor, he 100% would not force it. Wouldn't even do touches or anything. Potentially he could just like as a coping (to be in a situation where HE'S the one in control), but that is a darker route that I don't think will be exactly true for this AU. However, he very much enjoys drugging Alastor similar to Rosie. Not only just as a bonding thing since Angel would also do the drugs WITH him, but just to get the not-quite-lucid compliments from Alastor and maybe a snuggle then and there. He wants to dote on Alastor with him drugged out in his bed saying nice things to Angel. Admittedly this one's a bit of a workshop as I just knew I didn't want Angel to be focused on sex like somebody, but wasn't sure what to do here.

Valentino(Non-con, LoveBombing): I mean... it is Valentino, what did you THINK he'd be trying to do with Alastor? There's really not much to say here, Valentino essentially tries pulling all the stops trying to get Alastor in bed while also love-bombing the hell out of him. Which really doesn't work. Valentino is pretty open with sharing Alastor, but again, does this surprise anyone? As long as he's participating in some way, he really doesn't mind.

Vox (ALL warnings): Pretty much the worst version of himself that people make him be sometimes for those darker stories in the fandom. While more interested in having an enthusiastic partner, I don't think Vox would be opposed to forcing himself onto Alastor. He consistently tries to manipulate and gaslight, while enjoying both the suffering and pleasure of Alastor. Much like Vaggie, Vox is obsessed both being in love with Alastor while also downright hating him to the core. He's possessive and likes the idea of being both sweet and heinous with Alastor. He pretty much is every other character wrapped up in one fucked up TV man. Vox acts the most well-adjusted of the characters here, but he's probably got the obsession the worst.

And of course, pretty much every other conceivable ship is up for grabs here. I did think about maybe unfallen angels are able to resist the obsession curse, which would possibly make a funny team-up of Alastor, Adam, Lute, and Emily. Alternatively, I thought maybe the other canonically asexual characters in the show wouldn't be affected instead, meaning another oddball team-up of Alastor, Octavia, and Mammon. Then there is of course the "nope, there's no escape for deer man". Not sure yet, maybe I'll workshop it. I have more normal things in the works rather than this messed up little au, but darker content is a guilty pleasure of mine.

[sorrelchestnut]

I've seen a fair number of posts both here and on reddit that question why Tav (or the Dark Urge) would end up as a group leader for any other reason that "game mechanics say so." There's the requisite "okay, well if you play a high charisma character I guess it makes sense," or on the other end of the spectrum, "if you're playing Durge and murder someone right off the bat everyone would be too scared to tell you no." And I get where people are going with this! I really do. But it also fundamentally misunderstands a facet of human nature, which is that the vast majority of people do not actually want to be in charge, because that means being held responsible for the outcome. Accordingly, most people will dither when a group consensus is needed: have none of you ever tried to get a group of friends to agree where to go for dinner? Yeah, it's like that, but waaaay worse.

A lot of times "leadership" is just the willingness to say, "fuck it, y'all do what you want, but I'm doing this." I see it all the time in a corporate environment, where people will go back and forth on group meetings without anyone making a decision until finally one brave soul goes "in my opinion the clear answer is x" and then everyone gratefully goes along with it. Because now it's not their responsibility when something goes wrong! They're just following along with someone else's suggestion, and maybe it works or maybe it doesn't, but at the end of the day they don't have to worry about the consequences unless they're personally affected. In which case they might step up and argue back, and then they're stuck being a leader, too. Welcome to adulthood!

Lae'zel is the only one who ever even tries to exert some kind of control, when she tells you to follow her lead on the ship, or calls you her subordinate in the Grove. But, crucially, she doesn't ever make any serious attempt to take control: you can just tell her, "lol, no," and she sort of confusedly gives way, because she doesn't know how to handle this scenario. In her world there are commanders and subordinates, and everyone knows where they stand and falls in line. She's never actually had to take control of a situation and so at the first sign of resistance she falls back on the dynamic that's familiar to her, which is executing the commands of someone older and more experienced. She goes through a lot of growth over the game, to the point that she can take over as a resistance leader in her own right by the end, but at the beginning she's a wet-behind-her-ears private with some decent combat chops and it shows.

Otherwise, your party consists of:

Shadowheart, who's trained in infiltration and assassination and does NOT want a lot of attention brought to her or her mission for a variety of reasons;

Astarion, who has literally been a slave for two centuries and canonically takes a while to realize that he can exert an opinion beyond complaining about it;

Gale, whose only friend is his cat and couldn't project-manage his way out of a wet paper bag;

Wyll, who was probably trained for command at one point but has been doing the lone-hero thing for a decade and has a very large secret that he's trying to conceal; and,

Karlach, who's only ever been a bodyguard and a soldier and is genuinely just happy to be here.

Honestly, it would be more a surprise if Tav/Durge didn't end up as their unofficial leader, given the general power dynamics at play. The first time Tav/Durge says something like, "fuck it, we need to do something instead of stand around arguing about it, let's go check out those ruins over there," it's a done deal. They're The Captain Now! As long as they don't make decisions that fundamentally oppose something dear and important to the other group members, they're not even going to get any argument. Because at the end of the day, not one of these walking disasters has enough trust in themselves and their decision-making skills to feel any kind of certainty that they can choose the right path forward. If someone else is going to take that decision out of their hands? They're going to follow, no questions asked, right up until the moment they can't.

[defnotsoju]

HER FIRST TIME

ILLIT'S MINJU × Y/N ( M READER )

Minju was one of those girls who always made you have mixed emotions about them. She was innocent, beautiful and very kind. Something that sometimes annoyed you about her, but at the same time sometimes made you happy.

In this situation, specifically, it annoyed you more. She was so sexy, lately her company had been making her wear too short skirts, which was pleasing to your eyes. You always had wet dreams with her for as long as you could remember, at least it happened to you often, even if not every time. You both went to the same high school, but after graduation you lost contact for a while. She began to pursue her dream of becoming an idol and now barely even communicates with her own parents, who by the way have always liked and shipped you both. A thought you actually liked.

Every night you went to bed thinking about her and even though you fucked other whores, you never stopped throbbing your cock while watching her first fancams of her debut song 'Magnetic' by ILLIT, which only fed your arouse and your desire to fulfill your dream of fucking her tight pussy. Oh yeah! You were sure she was tight just by the way the stripe on her pussy were clearly defined while wearing white safety shorts.

You heard from a mutual friend of both of you that she will be staying in Busan this week. This thought had excited you so much that you had spent the whole day trying to look good for your upcoming meeting, for which she doesn't even know about.

When you met, the situation didn't seem awkward. You talked about a lot of different things from the kind of school memories you two had. You talked about her idol career and that's actually how happy she is that her dream came true. Overall, hanging out with friends was nice because the old company was back together. Only now they had left you two alone outside, and you were thinking about so many things.

"I missed hanging out with you like this." She said causing you to raise your eyebrows and look at her in surprise. Did she miss you? Time with you? You looked at her confused. You wasn't actually confused, but you pretended not to understand. This made her pout.

"Say it again because I didn't hear you."

Minju folded her arms in front of her body as we walked towards her empty apartment in an affluent district of Busan.

"I told you I miss spending time with you. Are you happy now? Ya! Y/N! Why are you like that?"

You started laughing and she slapped you on the shoulder. You looked at her and instead of getting mad at her you slapped her as well, but on her butt, which made her put her hand on it and jump in surprise.

"I missed you too, Minju."

"Don't do it again! What if someone sees us and I'm in trouble? You'll live your life, but I'll have angry fans after me!"

When did this happen? Both of you were walking, and now you were in her bedroom home. The room was dark red in color, it had a very beautiful interior, and on both sides of the bedroom there were lamps whose light was warm.

You can't figure out when you sent her home and how it all happened, but you're so pleased you can't even complain. Her body lay under yours while you were on top of her. You looked with a confused look at her semi-naked body, whose curves were clearly defined. Minju had a really sexy body that you craved to fuck already. Her soft breasts bounced slightly when you entered her pussy with your erection. You watched her beautiful moaning face howling in pain but also pleasure for the reason that you had just taken her virginity. Damn it! Why was she so beautiful?

At one point she had quite started moaning loudly but also pushing you lightly with her hand which seemed to automatically make you press your pelvis against hers. This made her moan loudly and you covered her mouth with your hand.

"And you mean to tell me you haven't been fucked before? You're too hot Minju.. it's a shame your CEO hasn't fucked you or the guys in the company. Better that way. You're mine now."

Your movements were difficult because of how tight she was down there. This narrowness made you curse but in a raspy voice, and finally you leaned over her and kissed her soft lips. Her lips were so juicy and she was gagging herself in her own saliva because of the way she was constantly moaning and shaking under your body. She was so tiny. Her body was petite and when she is by your side she always boosts your man ego. Over time you roughed up your movements inside her, her warm walls hugs your cock that was throbbing inside her desperate to cum.

"Y..Y..Y/N..!! Don't stop fucking me. Damn it! I'll cum!"

"What if I don't let you?" You asked with a sly smile, stopping your movements for a moment. This startled her and she started moving her pelvis up and down on her own. She was exactly the needy slut you wanted to see. This was the light in which YOU wanted to see Minju. How she desperately rubs into you to cum and begs you, followed by a whimpering.

"Then stop moaning so loudly and be a good girl to me. Open your mouth" You ordered her, and she obeyed you. You spat in her mouth and slapped one of her medium sized tits which made her purse her lips. You didn't like this action of hers, so you allowed yourself to slap her again, but this time on her pussy. This caused Minju to arch her neck back and begin writhing her body on the soft thousand dollar mattress. You noticed that there was blood on your hand. It was her virgin blood. The sheets were in blood, her thighs, you were in her blood yourself, but that motivated you enough to keep going until you felt yourself starting to cum inside her. You filled her tight hole with your cum, but that orgasm didn't even stop you because your goal was for her to cum too.

You gripped one of her legs below the knee and spread the other wide, using your fingers on her clit, which you rubbed hard and fast as your pelvis crashed against hers. Your balls started hitting her small but shapely ass as you watched her boobs bounce with your predatory eyes.

The moment she came you stayed deep inside her, causing her to shake her body intensely, especially her legs and moan even louder, finally pulling away from her. You began slapping your cock against her reddened pussy, finally beginning to rub it between her pussy lips.

You watched with interest as your white liquid flowed from her hole, unable to hold back and lick her pussy. This made her cover her lips with her hand, but you pushed her hand away and continued to lick her greedily.

"Did you think that was the end?"

•

•

•

AO3 VERSION HERE

[fight-nights-at-freddys]

i've been seeing a lot of posts recently about the proship community, and their "obsession" with complaining/talking about them, saying stuff like "i miss when fandom was more than just "i ship taboo things and that's my entire personality"", and i think i disagree with a lot of those posts.

the thing with fandom is that it used to be that way, UNTIL antis started policing what you could and couldn't do. it was inevitable that some of us were gonna double down and talk very openly about all the dark stuff we ship. is it totally reactionary? yes. was it without cause? no. this stuff doesn't happen in a vacuum.

but also, like. i feel like y'all (not you reading this post but. the ppl that make those kinds of posts) are missing out on a few very key details, being:

the proship community was started as a reaction to antis in the first place. they are intrinsically linked together, whether we like it or not. being proship is reactive, fork found in kitchen,

all these different terms exists because of antis, not because of proshippers. complain all you want about "x/y is a comship!" or "a/b is a darkship!", because i agree, it doesn't matter! it's all shipping in the end! antis are the ones that actually gaf because to them it matters A LOT if you ship The Bad Thing™,

fandom is what you make of it. if you don't wanna ship taboo things, have at it! do what you want forever, but the need to shame people that like darkships and talk abt it openly on their blogs is odd,

you don't have to tag generic fandom stuff with "proship", you are allowed to exist in the main tags!! you don't have to go searching for positive fandom stuff in the proship tags!!

i think y'all forget this is a blogging site, not just a social media site. i'm here for my *own* enjoyment, entertainment, and sometimes catharsis. if i see an annoying take from an anti, i'm gonna post about it, bc it's *my* blog. yes, we can (and often do) block antis, but that doesn't mean we can't bitch about them. the blocking feature exists for everyone, and if you don't like what those kinds of proshippers talk about, block the individual, not just the tags.

like, i'm sorry to break it to you, but things don't have to be all unicorns-and-rainbows positive all the time. sometimes we wanna bitch and complain, and that's OKAY!

there's nothing wrong with having your "entire personality" being liking darkships! (i have issues w that phrasing btw, bc most of the ppl that talk Like That™ are bait accounts, or it's a side account where they only want to talk about their darkships. point is, them liking taboo ships is def just one facet of their personalities, not their whole personality)

the problem isn't people in this community "killing the vibe", the problem is you letting your vibes be killed by stuff you don't like!

[spxllcxstxr]

Fair Winds and Following Seas • R.R

(Gif not mine)

Request: That Roman soulmate fic was sooo good 😭😭😭 argfhh biting my pillow rn. May I request a scene rewrite of your choice of them already in an established relationship? They’d have cute bickering and lots of casual physical contact all the time. Maybe theyre on a yacht together like that one episode and theyre just so intertwined all the time that its hard to tell where roman ends and reader starts 😣-- anon

Summary: Roman seems to like casual intimacy, even in front of his family

Warnings: fem!reader (she/her pronouns used), based on 2x10 “this is not for tears,” established relationship, alcohol, ken suicide joke (one line, nbd), roman jokingly calls something 'domestic abuse' it certainly is NOT that, normal Roman shenanigans

Word Count: 1.1k

A.N: guys, I usually write fantasy so this dialogue may just suck ass im SORRY LMAO, lemme know what you think!!! Hope you guys enjoy! Roman is so bbg

•

The Mediterranean sun warms your exposed skin while the sea breeze keeps you from getting uncomfortably hot. The Roy's certainly knew how to take a vacation.

Roman lazily drapes his arm over your shoulders, the small act of casual intimacy in front of his siblings something you still can't really get used to just yet. The family, you learned pretty quickly, was not a clingy one, so Roman's constant need to be touching you in some way in front of them was unexpected.

You sigh happily at his side, ignoring the boring work talk the siblings had already immersed themselves in.

The weather was just too divine for you to focus on anything other than the free vacation and your boyfriend.

Shiv's piercing blue eyes peer curiously over her dark sunglasses. Her gaze causes you to straighten your back and shift ever so slightly away from Roman. You've noticed that her and Tom were never exactly touchy, but then again her and Tom were barely a loving couple.

The harsh scrutiny of her stare doesn't go unnoticed by Roman, who immediately pulls you back closer to him. Your cheeks flush at his blatant display of affection.

"Something the matter, Siobhan?" Roman asks, his voice slightly higher than usual with a British twang to it. His fingers absentmindedly trace odd shapes across your back. He sips at his cocktail, eyebrows raised waiting for her retort.

Shiv’s intense gaze slowly slides over to Kendall. Their older brother offers your group a half-assed shrug.

"Nothing at all, Roman." She offers you both a tight-lipped smile, swirling her white wine in front of her.

Awkwardly you lean back into him as he sarcastically grumbles something under his breath, unconvinced. Roman’s body in tense beside you, but stays firmly pressed next to your own.

Sounds of waves crashing against the yacht and distant conversations almost lure you to sleep though the three sibling’s chatter keeps you just conscious enough that you don’t completely drift off.

You hear Kendall get up from his seat, his joints popping.

"I'm gunna go check on dad," He says, voice low though he knows you're not actually asleep. "I'll catch you guys later."

"Just don't jump off the boat, Ken. We're not turning the ship around just for your old-ass." Roman jokes before yelping at Shiv's slap to the shoulder.

You hide your tiny grin with a fake yawn.

"Very funny, Rome," Ken mutters before leaving the three of you.

It's awkward, just the three of you alone; the tension is so thick it could be cut with a knife. Shiv clears her throat and you can only imagine the patronizing look she has on her face. Roman shifts, and most likely flips her off, but otherwise he's silent.

Moments later you hear the thud of expensive yet tacky yachting shoes against the floorboards, which could only mean Tom.

"Shiv, uh," The man stutters, obviously distracted by something. Slowly you open an eye, peering over at the man. "Why don't we go and uh, discuss that thing from before, huh?"

Tom's eyes can barely settle on one thing, he looks between you and Roman before only briefly settling on his wife. His cheeks are a little red, but with a man that pasty, it's sure to be a light sunburn.

"Oh yeah?" She asks, almost seductively, blue eyes twinkling with some hidden secret.

Tom's lips tilt down into a frown, now no longer even looking in your direction. He's jealous, you figure, you've never seen him and Shiv cuddled up like this, at least not comfortably so. Someone is always tense and irritated.

After sparing her husband a glance, you see her eyes narrow and her lips drawing into a tight line.

You offer them a smile while Roman once again gives a rude gesture.

Swiftly, Shiv rises from her seat, empty wine glass in hand. She barely gestures a simple goodbye before walking away with Tom. You watch as she says something to him, which makes him recoil from her.

You could only imagine what that was about, but you figure it was you and Roman.

You press your cheek even harder against Roman's chest, almost like you're trying to burrow your way under his skin. The fresh white linen shirt he's wearing is soft underneath you. His uncalloused fingertips continue to dance across your exposed arm.

He's no longer tense, you notice; his muscles are more relaxed now that his siblings are nowhere to be seen. Logan wasn't around either, which eased the thick and looming tension that usually hung around the family.

Roman chuckles, tangling his feet around yours.

"What's got you all giggly today?" You ask, closing your eyes as you soak in more of the warmth.

"I'm not giggly, thank you very much. Giggling is for school girls and wine drunk single moms."

"Yeah, ok," You snort, smiling.

"You're just all over me like a fucking uh--"

"Koala?"

"Nah, more like one of those bigass fucking boa constrictors, y'know the ones I'm talking about?"

"A boa constrictor?" You gasp, jokingly offended at his words. Shifting from your position you eye your boyfriend. "You asshole!" Grabbing a small pillow from beside you, you hit him square in the chest repeatedly.

You're hovering over him, knees on either side of his hips, pinning him to the couch below him.

"Hey, hey!" He laughs, attempting to grab your wrists. "This is domestic abuse! ABUSE! ABUSE! Greg call the cops, she's beating me!"

Somewhere in the distance you can only faintly hear Greg stutter something, but your laughter is too loud to actually make it out.

Roman finally grabs the decorative pillow out of your hands and flings it somewhere.

His brown hair is messy, strands dangle in front of his eyes, no longer slicked back and proper. The laughter dies down but his bright smile remains, melting your heart.

"You're an absolute prick, Roman Roy, y'know that?" You whisper, lips lingering right over his.

"Oh I know," He smirks, irritatingly handsome like usual, eyes flicking between your own and your lips. "And you fucking love it."

Surging up, his lips connect with yours, traces of coconut and pineapple left on his tongue. The sweetness of rum mingles with the fruity aftertaste.

Humming in satisfaction, you close your eyes and place your hands on either side of his face, leaning into the kiss. Roman's light scruff rubs against your palms.

Eventually you pull back in order to breathe in the salty Mediterranean air. Roman's lips chase after your own, hoping to continue and subsequently never stop again.

"Yeah, I do." You sigh, gazing at his eyes as they turn into a molten shimmering gold hue in the afternoon sun.

•

[ravenstargames]

✦ Lost in Limbo Devlog #13 | 11.11.24

Feels good to be back! This is our first post-Kickstarter devlog and I'm so excited to be writing it.

First of all— Lost in Limbo was successfully funded on September 20th, 2024! 🎉🎇

Yep, it has been almost two months, but it's still something to celebrate! Thanks to every single one of you for making this possible! We didn't meet all our stretch goals (there were a lot and taxes are a pain) but that doesn't mean we are giving up on those. More on that another time.

There's a lot of things we want to show y'all, so let's jump into it!

A sneak peak of Envy's postcard!

Raquel has been working hard on getting the "special postcards from your favorite LI" ready to send them to print ASAP! Initially we were going to use art we already had of the LIs, but we thought it was more exciting to offer y'all exclusive art pieces. After this, Raquel will focus exclusively on the rework of the sprites!

We hosted a few polls and got a lot of feedback. If you missed it, you can check it here!

Astro says hello :^)

As you know, the Extended Demo will feature more locations, including a glimpse of the MC's city, Faybourne! Astro is getting the main street ready for you and your bestie as you go on about your day. I've calculated around three / four different and new locations to properly pace the demo as we imagined it in the first place!

The writing deparment (me. i'm the department) has been focusing on the Extended Demo script. I have a lot of things to play with, like the flavor choices, the personality choices, and more. I want to create a proper balance because one of the things y'all asked for was more choices, and the pacing needed a bit of fixing, as we already knew!

The Extended Demo will actually introduce characters you've heard about, like your mom, your ominous grandmother, and your bestie. So no more talking about them, you'll actually get to meet them like we wanted to!

There will also be more time with the LIs, and hopefully the amount of time you spend with each one of them will feel more balanced, too.

Programming has been an adventure! Huge shoutout to Feniks for helping me figure out how to properly make a toggle for the timed choices as well as helping me polish the personality system. What a lifesaver!

So the timed choices toggle now works perfectly. That means you'll be able to turn them off if you'd like to play the game without being jumpscared by a timer—that doesn't mean you won't be able to mess up, though, on purpose or not :^) This is a dark game, after all!

The personality choice system lets you decide how the MC reacts to things including the nature of your romance with the LI. That means dialogue will automatically change in certain parts of the game to reflect the personality of your MC, some options will be locked, some unlocked, etc. There's three different personalities available.

For colorblind folks, the choices will have a different icon when you hover over them for you to know they're different!

Also, I've started coding some extra mini cgs Kayden's been working on! There'll be more in the Extended Demo to enhance the experience, so we hope you enjoy them! :^)

All the packaging stuff has arrived to our provisional headquarters (Raquel's home), and our business cards have been secured! Every backer with physical goodies will receive one for free :^) This month has been all about managing Backerkit, orders and merch, as well as preparing the Extended Demo. We hope we can receive everything very very soon and start shipping packages starting December!

For now, that's it! There's a lot of stuff going behind the scenes, a lot of things that need attention, and a lot of planning happening. Also the catastrophe the DANA has been on our cities is keeping me a bit on edge, but I'm trying to focus on work. This Saturday I'm going on a trip to Greece with my family, so I'll disconnect then! It's our first time traveling to a different country since I was like...seven years old? And we have been saving up and preparing a lot for the trip, so we are excited :^)

I hope everyone has been taking care and doing alright! Have a huge hug from the Ravenstar Team, and see you around!

[burningcheese-merchant]

Psst, hear me out: The Beast being fucking yanderes with the ancients.

You Get It™️ I mean... Did you guys see episode 6? Burning Simp Cookie is already a yandere lol. He's been there and he refuses to leave. And Shadow Milk is honestly not that far behind, he feels some type of way towards Pure Vanilla and it would be cute if it wasn't so sad and creepy lol

Really though, I just love hero/villain ships in general (always have, since long before Cookie Run ever existed) and I get a kick out of villains acting stupid over crushes (read: obsessions), and acting stupid in general. There's just something about a villain being in love with the hero to a psychotic, comical degree, and the hero rebuffing them at every turn that's just really amusing to me lol. Like what Joker sort of has with Batman, you know?

Here are my Yandere Beasts in bare-bones terms:

Burning Spice: come on, if you've read my stuff, you know EXACTLY what Yandere Spice is like lol. If not, I'll refer you to this and this, as well as my fics on AO3. If those don't tell you what Yandere Spice is like then idk how else to help you lol

Shadow Milk: if the final boss of theater/drama kids had a crush but was also a malignant narcissist of some sort lol. Absolutely DESPERATE for Vanilla's attention at all times. If he's not actively trying to worm into Vanilla's brain and harass him in his thoughts and dreams, he's in the real world brainstorming better ways to do that lol. He does not grasp why the creepy puppet shows and gaslighting attempts aren't convincing Vanilla to fall in love with him. Will attack and torment and insult Vani in one breath and then praise and love and worship him in another, because he's a histrionic clown freak with whirlwind emotions. But above all else, he literally thinks he owns Vani and is meticulously plotting the horrible and hilarious demise of any and all he perceives as a threat to their union

Eternal Sugar: World's Laziest Stalker™️. Almost exclusively haunts Holly in her dreams (I have to assume that that's what her power will entail, as the Beast of Sloth); however, she's more "effective" in her wooing attempts due to her past experience as the Herald of Happiness. She actually goes out of her way to construct dreams and the like that have things in them that make Holly happy (or what she thinks makes Holly happy; she, as well as the others, has big tunnel vision and is very selfish and self-absorbed, and thus pays more lip service to her own wants than those of who she loves/obsesses over). Thankfully doesn't run into Holly in person often because that's work... but sometimes she DOES work up the nerve to go after her for real, and... well

Mystic Flour: Denial, denial, denial. Not just a river in Egypt the Golden Cheese Kingdom, but she'll say and act like otherwise. No, she does not like Dark Cacao. He robbed her of her volition and the chance to enact her will. He prevented her from freeing the world from pain and suffering. He is a stubborn fool who refuses to understand the truth. He... is very handsome. She does not like how handsome he is. It is distracting. She doesn't like dwelling on her memories of him and their encounters. She doesn't like how she came to harbor a single kernel of respect in her heart after he stood his ground against her; a kernel that she inadvertently nurtured and cultivated slowly but surely, until... no. No, she doesn't like Dark Cacao. She doesn't think about him all day. She doesn't want to try to lure him back to her land so she can trap him in the flour fog with her again. She doesn't miss feeling his dark eyes on her. She doesn't deeply resent his attachment to his people, and seek to transfer that attachment to her instead. No, she... damn it, he's ruined her. He's made her feel things again. He's made her succumb to selfishness and greed, to earthly desire and attachment - desire for HIM, attachment to HIM. All of her hard work and enlightenment gone to waste... She doesn't want to like Dark Cacao, she recognizes the folly in such a thing, but she's stuck - and so stuck is she that not only does she not really see a way out, she doesn't WANT one. She's become too content with her attachment to him too quickly. Now she has to agonize over her own foolishness, and try to keep denying that she doesn't care while also longing for his attention and wanting to do away with all that steals his attention away from her

Silent Salt: probably the least awful of the five, but he's still creepy and that's not a high bar to clear anyway lol. Has a better grasp on "normal" behavior than the others (like... he pays attention to what White Lily likes/wants and tries to adjust accordingly), but he's following her around everywhere and acting extremely violent and territorial over her towards anyone who he catches approaching her. He's legitimately, surprisingly sweet and gentle towards her; he brings her flowers, he listens to her when she asks/tells him something, he's more or less respectful of her personal space (he will try to be as physically close to her as possible, but actually backs off a little if she asks him to, only to try again, and so on and so forth)... but he's still a villain, he's still violent and creepy, he still gets angry when she pays attention to other people for too long and he has brought actual harm to others out of jealousy. He's the best of the worst but that really doesn't mean much of anything, he's still a psycho creep like the others

In short, they form a tight-knit coalition of absolutely fucking deranged freakazoids and they should all probably die :)

[felicity-worthington]

Why is “Doctor Odyssey” a television show that very cleverly shows the depth of the human condition?

So, I have seen some people say that Doctor Odyssey is fun (especially because of Ody3) but also just a superficial show with no plot and I have to politely disagree. I think this show is the opposite, it's just supposed to look silly and superficial at first glance, as you can see when they repeat the phrase "we constructed a paradise" in the weekly recaps.

It is supposed to look like that, it is the idea of a cruise itself, for a week you escape the real world, you enter a new constructed one, which is supposed to be paradise without problems. But here's the thing, here is why there's a doctor and two nurses on this ship: it's just an idea, it's not real.

We especially see this in the episodes "I Always Cry at Weddings" and "Quackers" and of course in the main storyline of Max, Tristan and Avery navigating their relationship and their constant struggle with what they really want in life.

Let's start with "I always cry at weddings" to deconstruct the idea of superficiality with the weekly funny themes and the show only being silly because it's quite obvious here I think. I mean, a man commits suicide in this episode because he's deeply conflicted about what he really wants out of life and how he thinks there is an incurable darkness within him. And we see him, his bride and his best man as an example of how this construction, this idea of heteronormative happiness is just that for a lot of people: just an idea that doesn't guarantee you happiness, but actually destroys lives (not everyone's, of course). And we start this episode superficially, with a couple about to get married on a cruise, the perfect wedding in perfect paradise. But as the episode progresses, we see the cracks and then it gets very real. The scenes with the groom breaking down in the infirmary, the bride talking to Avery and Max after the suicide and her mother's confession are all absolute tearjerkers in the best way. I mean, watch that scene and then tell me again that this show is just a silly Riverdale for adults:

This is actually one of my favorite scenes of the show because the delivery of the line "we need to help this boy" is just perfect, the actress did an amazing job. Also, the character herself says "she pretended her fears away", which underlines the show's idea that this is a paradise where people should just forget their worries, but actually real life catches up with you no matter where you are, you cannot hide from it.

The other example I was thinking of is the latest episode with the Quackers community, which is super silly in a lot of ways and I love that, don't get me wrong.

And then you have this older couple, the leaders (?) of this community, who seem extremely superficial and silly, I mean, going on cruises to go on a quack treasure hunt? So silly. BUT then the cracks start to show again as one of them, the husband (I don't know what his name was, so I'll just call him the husband and her the wife), shows a serious condition, the compulsive urge to swallow objects. When confronted, the wife literally denies it, unable to face the ugly truth. In her world everything is perfect, she and her husband are on a never-ending treasure hunt on paradise cruises, and when something real, something problematic threatens that, she can't accept it at first. And we see that again later in the episode when she refuses to leave the ship:

She wants to stay in paradise, in denial, on the surface. But that's not possible, you can't ignore real life:

But this is her and her husband's dream, an endless paradise in search of ducks, and it's hard to let go and take a deeper look at life and accept that floating through life is a nice idea and might work for a while, but it can't go on forever:

regarding her husbands condition:

Once again the theme of what we want (superficial) and what is really going on (what is behind the construction of paradise) is mentioned.

All of this, and all of the recurring themes I mentioned, are also at play with the three main characters and their constant struggle with what they really want out of life. In a way, their calling to help people is fulfilled by their professions, but then they keep asking themselves, "Is this enough? Is this what I really want out of life, taking one cruise after another?

The theme of constructed ideas versus what is actually going on is also seen in their throuple situation. Max and Tristan have probably always seen themselves as straight, and now they are getting a deeper look at who they are and what they really want out of life. And that is scary, and it often takes years to deconstruct habits and self-image.

But there is no unnecessary weird teenage drama in this show, it is very real. It is supposed to look superficial, you only have to look a little closer to see that it is not.

So once you deconstruct the idea that this is all superficial, you will see that yes, it is silly, so is life and we need those silly and funny moments in life and in this show, but it is also very, very deeply human in many tragic but also good ways.

[pro-sipper]

I understand that we should just block content we don't wanna see, but I still think things like proships or ships that are wrong and illegal in irl should be kept private. Because that is exposing kids to the romantization of abuse, incest, and pedophilia. This content may expose them to predators, which could cause them harmful trauma, the type that people claim to use proshipping for. They may think that a person older than them liking a kid is ok, even though the adult has bad intentions. We know that they are fictional characters, but they represent real people and can still affect kids. And if this isn't supposed to affect them irl, why do so many groomers show proship media and illegal art to grow kids?

Don't want to start anything just curious

I think the short version of the argument is basically "the internet shouldn't have to be a 100% sanitized and safe space for children". But getting further into it...

"but I still think things like proships or ships that are wrong and illegal in irl should be kept private."

It's not worth mentioning now but "proships" aren't a thing. Proship doesn't stand for problematic ship, it's not an adjective.

My question is why this line of thinking only applies to ships? Murder and cannibalism are also illegal, but no one's going around saying you should keep your love of horror to yourself, or only watch R rated movies in the privacy of your own home.

"Because that is exposing kids to the romantization of abuse, incest, and pedophilia."

The majority of people interacting with media like this, or making posts about this, DO NOT want kids interacting with their content! They slap every rating, warning label, and trigger tag under the sun onto their work to say that it is not for kids. At the end of the day, that's all you can do. It is not one random proshipper's job to shelter every single child in the world.

Furthermore, kids are exposed to that crap from plenty of other places besides randos on tumblr. Walking into a library or turning on a television can easily expose kids to these topics just as much as going onto ao3 or opening tumblr could. That doesn't mean every professional author or tv writer on earth needs to create art that's palatable for children. Because that's not their responsibility.

"This content may expose them to predators"

It's grim to say, but literally anything on earth could potentially expose a child to a predator. Getting on the bus, going to the park, going to school, going to church, going to a friend's house, going home. Honestly I think it's a bit of a privileged mindset to think that a child would be 100% safe in this world if it weren't for faceless boogeymen online committing the sin of writing dark fic of their Blorbos.

"which could cause them harmful trauma,"

Again, that trauma could come from anywhere. And you're putting the weight of preventing that onto random strangers online, not anyone who's concretely in the hypothetical child's life, or actually responsible for them

"the type that people claim to use proshipping for"

Appreciate the subtleties of invalidating other people's trauma. Just because you don't have the same coping mechanisms doesn't mean theirs are invalid. Especially when countless licensed therapists agree that writing is one of the better ways you can help process trauma.

And to state the obvious, you don't need to have trauma to be a proshipper. Not everyone uses dark content for self reflection, some people just think it's neat.

"They may think that a person older than them liking a kid is ok, even though the adult has bad intentions."

A kid should not be getting 100%, or even most of their life lessons from fictional media. Parents, guardians, teachers, and other trusted adults in a child's life are the ones who need to teach them right from wrong, and how to protect themselves. I remember being a kid and being told by my mom "now if a stranger pulls up to you and says they lost their puppy and they'll give you candy if you help them look for it, do NOT go with them". That was her job as a parent.

Now I know that sadly, not every child has that kind of trusted adult in their life. But it's not the responsibility of a bunch of fanfic authors on tumblr to fill in the gaps.

"We know that they are fictional characters, but they represent real people and can still affect kids."

It doesn't matter how closely or loosely fiction depicts our reality, it's still just fiction at the end of the day. Movies have been using the whole "Any resemblance to real persons, living or dead, is purely coincidental" disclaimer for almost as long as there have been movies.

"And if this isn't supposed to affect them irl, why do so many groomers show proship media and illegal art to grow kids?"

One, art is not illegal. Unless you get caught graffiti-ing, then you might get fined. And no one is saying this kind of thing can't affect a child. But why, in this scenario, are you putting the blame on fanfic authors and fanartists before putting the blame on the actual groomer??

And again I ask, what exactly is "proship media" anyway? I'm guessing the kind of stuff that constantly appears on people's DNI lists, which could be anything from Steven Universe to Cannibal Holocaust, so who really knows??

Like I said in the short version, the internet should not have to be sanitized for the sake of the children. The entire internet does not need to be one giant safe space for kids. Adults have a right to talk about adult things with other adults. To explore dark topics in fiction, or to have fun with taboos in a harmless way.

I want the world to be safe for kids too. But the way to do that isn't to forbid adults from posting shit online. Instead of trying to shield children from every controversial, difficult, or uncomfortable topic under the sun, give them the tools they need to learn how to process these things.

Be a safe person to talk to if a kid has a question. Help them understand why something might be okay in a fantasy setting, but it's not something that should carry over into real life (like, a fairy tale prince kissing an sleeping princess to break a curse is fine, but in real life where there's no magic you should always make sure someone is okay with it before kissing them. Something like that)

Teach them internet safety, above all else. When I was a kid, you didn't give out any personal info. Nowadays kids have no qualms about giving out their full name, age, list of phobias and disorders, showing their school, their house - the list goes on.

Honestly, I think we need to go back to scaring kids with Stranger Danger, at least a little. But that's starting to veer into a different topic and I think I've said all I need to say about this one today.

[sarucane]

How did Stede know that Ed wanted to "watch the world burn"?

This one is fun because it's such a smooth and well-written character development that it's actually really easy to miss what a big shift happens for Stede in the first three episodes of S2. But in E1, Stede is saying this about Ed

and in less than an hour of screentime, he's mostly caught up with what's actually been happening to Ed.

So how'd Stede figure that out? Get to know Ed better, despite being separate from him?

By letting go of ego.

Stede's decision to bail on Ed in S1E10 is driven by selfish low self-esteem. He thinks he doesn't matter to Ed, that he's brought Ed to ruin and Ed will be better off without him. And that's actually held back his emotional investment in the relationship: Stede clearly misses Ed, but he's not devastated over the breakup to the same degree that Ed is.

But by the end of S1E10, Stede's gotten to understand himself better, and his relationship to other people. But he's also gone from not understanding that he's in love to idealizing the relationship between him and Ed, telling people they're "on a break." At the beginning of S2, he's projecting his own insecurities onto Ed, while at the same time trying to believe in a torrid love story starring himself (idealized) and an idealized version of Ed. An Ed who's still got Blackbeard's black beard.

These ideas are rooted in the same conviction that made Stede leave in the first place: he doesn't understand that he's important to Ed, so he can't absorb the fact that what he did was immensely hurtful.

In the second episode, Lucius forces him to really deal with the things he's been denying. He tells Stede "you broke him." And he does the thing that Stede just wasn't managing to do: he gets Stede to think about what's been happening from Ed's perspective, without Stede's insecurities blocking his imagination. To think about just how badly Stede hurt Ed. And to think about what pain and loss like that might mean for someone as damaged as Ed: hopelessness.

Far from Ed's life being "better without me," Stede has to face the idea that Ed might think his life will never get better again. That while Stede has been holding out hope for a reunion, Ed may have given up on both Stede and himself.

That means it's all on Stede, to hope and to act. And he rises to the challenege.

Stede doesn't hesitate when he thinks Ed is in trouble. And he doesn't doubt that Ed needs him, shouting "I'm here!" as soon as he sees the Revenge. He faces what he finds on the ship, and sets about fixing what can be fixed, pulling the knives out of the walls.

He doesn't quite know how bad it's gotten. That Ed couldn't hold onto the ideal-pirate dramatic "watch the world burn" drive. That Ed hit a point of actual cruelty and suicidal despair.

But Stede knows Ed enough to be able to absorb that information when he gets it. To face and accept the reality of the darkness inside the man he loves.

And then to embrace his own role in keeping that darkness from consuming Ed. In the first episode, Stede was putting off looking for Blackbeard because he thought he'd make Ed's life worse. In the third, Stede tells Ed he can come back to life because he's safe now that Stede's here.

And then Stede, again, embraces some selfishness. Asks Ed to come back to him. But this time, it's not the kind of unhealthy selfishness that makes someone obsess over what they mean to others. It's the kind of selfishness that makes people hope life might get better again. Lets people choose relationships they want, and exist in them consciously. Makes someone a strong enough person that they can give, and receive.

[cosmerelists]

Cosmere Protagonists as Villains

As requested by @idontknowanametouse :)

Let's talk about what Cosmere protagonists would be like if they decided to play for Team Evil!

[Spoilers for book series mentioned in titles--but no Wind and Truth spoilers included]

1. Kaladin [Stormlight Archive]

What turns him evil: I think Kaladin could honestly go down a Moash road, where he decides to take justice into his own hands and punish people who have hurt him, his friends, or What's Right.

What he'd be like: Abso-storming-lutely terrifying. Imagine a Pursuer-esque figure, but it's Kaladin coming to kill you. I mean, you'd die. He once ripped a guy's head off by lashing it to the floor. He never loses a fight. He wouldn't sneak up on you assassin-style, either. He's blowing the front door off its hinges and entering like a glowing Angel of Vengeance to MURDER you.

2. Vin [Mistborn Era 1]

What turns her evil: I can see a few possibilities: like she does take up the power in the Well of Ascension and becomes the new Lord Ruler, or Zane is just a lot more persuasive than he is in the original. But I'm gonna go with "Ruin gets to her so completely that she becomes his agent."

What she'd be like: Vin already has some...villain-esque actions in the original, like when she pretty much slaughters an entire Keep with Zane. But always in the original she was doing it to protect, and she had friends to give her moral and emotional support. But if she was Ruin's, then she really would be a Natural Disaster Made Flesh, bringing Utter Destruction and Ruin to the whole world. Like, she's taking down whole cities single-handedly.

3. Shallan [Stormlight Archive]

What turns her evil: Listen, Shallan already kills a lot of people. We know this, and we still love her. But perhaps she gets a little too into killing people and just goes straight serial killer.

What she'd be like: You ever seen Hannibal? I'm seeing the most beautifully artistic but horribly deranged Murder Sculptures. You know, where she's killed someone and but then turned their corpse into Art.

4. Tress [Tress of the Emerald Sea]

What turns her evil: It's hard to imagine Tress being evil, tbh...but, I mean, she does sell Crow into slavery to avoid the same fate, so there's something there. I'm gonna say that either the Sorceress does kill Charlie or Tress believes that he's dead, and she turns totally to the dark side.

What she'd be like: She already plays with hugely destructive powers and captains a Pirate Ship--plus her crew is actually loyal to her. She'd be what Crow wanted to be.

5. Yumi [Yumi and the Nightmare Painter]

What turns her evil: I mean...Yumi faced religious abuse for like thousands and thousands of years. She took it pretty well, all things considered, when she found out. Imagine if she didn't...

What she'd be like: Yumi is, like, the most invested being in the Cosmere. She's nigh unkillable. And she likes to stack things.... In this case, mountains upon mountains... of skulls.

6. Adolin [Stormlight Archive]

What turns him evil: I think Adolin could break from the combination of (a) finding out his father burned his mother alive and (b) killing Sadeas with virtually no consequences. Maybe he figures that if his dad can do all that and still be a beloved political figure, then he might as well do whatever he wants too.

What he'd be like: Adolin is great with people. As a protagonist, this makes him the sort of guy who makes friends easily, remembers everyone's name, and wins over even people determined to dislike him. Evil Adolin takes those skills but goes straight manipulator. He's winning people's trust only to poison them with lies, turn them against each other, make them think he's the only one they can trust. And if manipulation doesn't work, well, he can always challenge you to a duel...in a dark hallway with nobody around...

7. Sarene [Elantris]

What turns her evil: She just gets tired of not being in charge, considering that she's smarter and more strategic and just better than the men actually in charge...

What she'd be like: Honestly, Sarene would be a fantastic Evil Vizier, the real power behind the throne who is actually controlling everything for her own evil whims. I can see her doing it to Iadon, but that's almost too easy. I know in canon they love each other and are actually good 'n' all, but imagine her controlling Raoden from the shadows and tell me it's not kinda cool...

8. Marasi [Mistborn Era 2]

What turns her evil: She gets the Bands of Mourning...and decides she's never gonna give them up.

What she'd be like: Ultimate Power Marasi would decide that SHE knows what will keep a society happy and healthy, and that's her control. I see her creating a terrible police state where everyone's actions are very tightly controlled and every infraction is punished...but only because she wants what's best for you, you know?

9. Jasnah [Stormlight Archive]

What turns her evil: I mean, remember Jasnah's Philosophy Lesson to Shallan where she baited out some robbers and then murdered them in Cold Blood since they were hurting people and no one else would do anything about it? Now imagine that Jasnah takes it upon herself to fix all societal problems through whatever means are necessary...

What she'd be like: Jasnah could be a sort of Vigilante, who makes sure that "bad people" and "political problems" are dealt with swiftly and murderously. Like imagine the Urithiru coalition of monarchs, only Jasnah's is gonna assassinate you and replace you with a puppet if you're not persuaded by her arguments.

10. Spook [Mistborn Era 1 / Secret History]

What turns him evil: I mean, Spook had a lot of voices talking to him--first Ruin, pretending to be Kelsier, and then Actually Kelsier. And the voices were always pretty darn pro hemalurgy. I'm not 100% sure Spook wasn't evil by the time he was in charge...

What he'd be like: Spook suggests in his book that old people should let themselves be killed via hemalurgy to make sure their powers get passed on. Think that, only it's not a suggestion and it's not just old people and oh my god Scadrial is Hemalurgy Power Planet now.

11. Navani [Stormlight Archive]

What turns her evil: She just gets lost in the sauce, the "sauce" in this case being Scientific Advancement and Discovery.

What she's like: I see her as an Evil Scientist who is simply making terrible weapons of mass destruction more or less because she can...and no longer worrying about the consequences.

12. Ulaam [Tress of the Emerald Sea]

What turns him evil: Listen, he TRIED asking people politely for their organs and limbs after they died, and NOBODY ever said yes!

What he's like: Let's just say he got tired of waiting. And asking.

[enemywasp]

Alright so someone on tiktok sent me a link to a compiled list of arguments against proshippers and so I wanted to put a sort of brief response of my own thoughts of each point.

Long post warning!

"Proshippers are non-offending minor attracted people in a fresh paint of coat"

What a start, am I right? Okay so first off this is a huge generalisation, not every proshipper engages with or is even comfortable with anything that sexualises fictional children, or ships them with adults. And of those that do ship adult/minor ships, it doesn't always mean they're attracted to the character themselves or gains any sexual pleasure from that.

They then went on to say that although they might be non-offending, they still fantasise about and romanticise children- in the case of proshippers by creating art and stories. And I am not personally educated enough on how people's minds works to go in depth here, but I do know a lot of pedophilic thoughts can be intrusive and unwanted. And I would much rather people engage in this and deal with their thoughts through fiction where no actual children are harmed, than actually go touch a real child or engage is any form of CSEM.

“People can draw and ship whatever they want!”

Here they went on to say that surely to ship and create content you must justify these things in some capacity regardless of them being fictional. And immediately I'd argue, the justification it that they're fictional. And that sometimes you want to read about things you'd never approve of in real life, it's a natural curiosity. And again, regardless of what the dark content is I would take someone engaging in fiction over harming a real person any day.

They compared this to alt-right groups and dark humour justifying racism and transphobia, etc. And whilst I think something we should always be aware of in fiction is stereotypes and how we may be representing people. Youtube videos like this are usually a type of propaganda that AIM to change people's mindsets and turn them against groups. Whereas fiction tells a story, some may have meanings and connections to real life, be a political piece, etc. Not everything is that serious and has a clear distinction from reality.

Think for example, reading/watching about murder and gore. More on that in a second.

"Fiction doesn't affect reality!"

I'm going to be honest I rolled my eyes at this as their main example was slenderman. If you don't know about that, those girls were schizophrenic. Anything could of set off and caused delusions, it just so happened to be fiction. Those girls needed help- not to just read purer content. They also basically brought up propaganda again, which is again deliberate and designed to warp peoples perceptions. Its based of lying and spreading misinformation and passing it as facts. The only thing I strongly believe can be directly harmful is stereotypes if not handled with care. But I think that's something for anyone who writes and consumes content should be aware of regardless of their stances.

Again here they implied that all proshippers are peodophiles. And that they normalise abuse of children. I'd also like to point out that most proshippers I've interacted with online have age boundaries to avoid interacting with minors depending on how graphic or sexual their content is.

"What do you think all stories about murder should stop existing?"

Here they basically argued that killing in media isn't the same as its not romanticised or condoned. YA Novels disagree- mafia stories being the most immediate example to spring to mind. Furthermore, morally grey villains. One of my favourite films is Mr Right. It's about a hitman killing people. Anna kendrick falls in love with him and its framed as a romantic comedy. Funny how its only fanfiction that's criticised like this? I actually have more thoughts on this if anyones interested.

Again they bring up kids not knowing adults pursuing children is wrong, and I'm questioning why children this young are unsupervised on the Internet. How young were you when you were allowed to watch anything with graphic blood or violence? This content isn't made for kids! Especially not anyone so young they can't seperate fiction from reality as most sites have a specific age you have to be to join. And I'm sorry to say it, but on websites and social media where adults can interact with kids, anything can be used to groom kids. (The real thing you should be mad about here is how there's no websites aimed just for children and safe spaces on the Internet anymore cause it can't be monetised as easily)

"Artists are allowed to draw and write about dark people"

They basically said, yes but it's not the same as promoting. Writing something under a romantic light and not saying "Don't do at home!" Isn't promoting. No ones encouraging these things in real life. Or rather, if they are its not because they're a proshipper but rather who they are as a person and their intentions.

The trans example they used is very extreme and honestly something I agree with a little more, fiction can definitely be used as an excuse to say and act out hateful and discriminatory things. Whilst I do think it's something we should discuss and unpack more, I'm not certain of my view on how I would fix this without risking silencing people talking about their experiences.

"Its not my responsibility to look after other people, just block me and the tags"

Here they threw all kinds of accusations. And says that we're making traumatised people jump through hoops to avoid getting retraumatised. I hate this argument, you know people have actual triggers they may not be able to avoid in real life? The world can't bend around you. And I am very sorry if any content online is traumatising to you, but someone could also be traumatised by a certain breed of dog and not want to see it. Should no one post dogs online ever again? A bald man reminds you of an abusive ex? Bald men get off the Internet! You see how this thing can just keep escalating? The tags and warnings are important because they're the best you can get. You can't control the world to protect everyone from everything ever. No ones forcing you to interact, and if you're on any algorithm based content that will encourage that content on your for your page more.

The only thing I think we should take from this is the reminder that warnings and tags are always important.

"You only care about censoring creativity"

Here they defend themselves that oh wouldn't you want freaks out the community! Which again immediately makes me lose respect for you, if you're just going to brand us all as freaks as an argument and generalize us.

No comment on that first line when you can easily argue antishipper do the same.

"Proshippers are not remotely innocent of targeted harrasement" Neither are antis. There's people who take things too far both sides and I'm not going to defend either for that.

"Real kids get assaulted and all you care about is censoring people online!"

Here they shout "oh I can care about both!" But what I don't think they realise is censorship can make it difficult for kids and to learn about how to speak up and to look for signs, or to speak up about their experiences. How do you plan on removing the topic from the Internet whilst also letting victims speak up? And people may want to write fiction based off their experiences. Who are you to go through it and proclaim what is too far, what romanticises it too much? More on this later.

"Antis are reducing my trauma"

They compared this to saying "date rape victims are reducing my trauma because they weren't taken advantage of in the same way as me" which is a disgusting parallel?? Date rape is still rape. Someone writing about something isn't the same as it happening. Although it can be used as harrasment, grooming, etc if directly addressed to you or being constantly sent to you, written about you. But the content existing in general? No.

"I'm coping"

Compared it to self harm, and such. Poetry and diaries are also used to write about your experiences and unpack trauma. Some of which may write it in an unrealistically positive light cause that's how they want to unpack it or explain those thoughts. And yes these things get posted online.

I can't imagine a single therapist or professional psychiatrist of any kind disapproving of creative writing because, again, it's much better than any alternatives of doing real harm to yourself or people around you. Although I do agree that if something is traumatising for you to read about and just upsets you further, be aware of your own boundaries but not everyone is the same so how are you going to police people's own thoughts and emotions.

Also I can't remember who or where as it was years ago now, but I have heard of people who actually realised they were being groomed or abused and just how bad it was through reading about it in a fanfic and seeing it in an outside perspective.

They also say to do it in private, but doesn't everyone on the Internet now have an understanding of finding a community and looking out for eachother and sharing experiences?

"There's more nuance here than just calling proshippers peodophiles"

Here they say no matter what it still comes down to whether it's ever okay to sexualise minors in certain contexts. And again, not every proshipper does this or is even comfortable with engaging in this kind of content. And further, no one is sexualising real minors in this context.

"I'm a proshipper and a minor tho!"

I'd agree minors should be wary of the spaces they're in but proship spaces aren't always necessarily sexual, graphic or 18+. Saying they're being groomed feels like you're watering down that term. I was a proshipper at age 13, I didn't interact with anyone online about it though, I didn't even know that was the term. I just came to the conclusion that it's just fiction all on my own. Minors aren't idiots.

At then end they talk about their own experience being groomed and I'm obviously not going to nitpick or criticise their experiences. I will point out that one person being bad and taking advantage of you and using content to do so doesn't mean everyone is like that. I am sorry to anyone who has been taken advantage of by someone who claims they're a proshipper though. There are people who have turned out to be horrible on both sides.

I am ill and it's late but I want to get this up sooner rather than later so please ask for clarification on anything. I'm always up for a discussion on this topic as I do believe some of these points do have merits at times and that this whole topic is not black and white

[antianakin]

@theneutralmime

Any time Anakin's "obsession" with Obi-Wan shows up in the story, it's very clearly a bad thing, because Anakin's "obsession" is a bad thing, full stop, regardless of who he's aiming it at. To use Star Wars parlance, this is the attachment, this is why the Jedi forbid it and why attachments are considered bad on their own and why they're not considered the same as "love" or "relationships." So Anakin being attached to Obi-Wan INSTEAD of Padme (which doesn't have to mean they're in a romantic relationship, obviously) doesn't make that attachment suddenly a good thing simply because it isn't romantic. It would still be dangerous and it would still likely push Anakin to do bad things in the name of the attachment.

That being said, Anakin shows the MOST restraint in his relationship with Obi-Wan, despite the clear attachment he does have to him. I'm willing to believe that Palpatine likely did ENCOURAGE an attachment to Obi-Wan while at the same time also planting the seeds for doubt in the relationship, balancing those things very carefully so that he could use Obi-Wan to pull Anakin into darkness. But the very VERY few times we see Anakin successfully manage to actually hold off from making rash and reckless choices is with his relationship to Obi-Wan.

I've mentioned most of these examples before, but I'll go over them quickly again.

Chronologically, we start with Attack of the Clones where Anakin is initially inclined NOT to go to Geonosis to save Obi-Wan until Padme convinces him into it (while you could argue that this shows a lack of CARE for Obi-Wan, this isn't really supported by the dialogue and it's contrasted pretty explicitly with Anakin planning to abandon Padme earlier in order to chase after his mother).

The next one we see is in Landing at Point Rain during TCW when Obi-Wan's ship crashes and it's unclear what Obi-Wan's status is and Anakin has to make the choice to stay with his men and leave Obi-Wan to his chances rather than run ahead and abandon his men just for the CHANCE to help Obi-Wan (especially when Obi-Wan could easily be already dead, or could die/receive help from someone else before Anakin can get there, while his men will almost certainly die without him before they can reach the landing zone and that would be pretty disastrous for the mission).

The third one is, ironically enough, in the Deception arc. When Anakin and Ahsoka are first sent after "Rako Hardeen" to arrest him and they find him drunk, Anakin explicitly tells "Hardeen" that he'd kill him if it wouldn't disrespect Obi-Wan's memory to do so. You can make the argument that he's able to hold back in part because Ahsoka's standing there watching him, so he couldn't really get away with killing a drunk man who won't fight back, but he doesn't seem to be paying much attention to her and his claim out loud is that he's doing it because it's what Obi-Wan would want him to do. He does start to struggle more and more as the arc goes on and loses some of that fight with his anger, but this initial moment does show us that Anakin CAN hold back when he wants to and that Obi-Wan's influence on him is, generally, a positive one.

The reason I point these out is because we don't often see this kind of restraint with any of his other relationships. Shmi, Padme, and Ahsoka in particular have a tendency to bring out the WORST in him (note that Obi-Wan's influence will stop being as strong when it's pitted against, say, Padme or Ahsoka's lives at stake).

So I DO think that Palpatine likely was originally intending for Obi-Wan to BE the primary "obsession" for Anakin until the opportunity to throw Padme back into his life came into play. We see elements of it in the way Anakin talks about Obi-Wan through AOTC, telling Padme that Obi-Wan is as wise as Yoda and as powerful as Mace, and telling Obi-Wan himself that he's the closest thing he's ever had to a father. But even with that, Obi-Wan's influence is very GROUNDING for Anakin, it reminds Anakin of who he should be and who he CAN be in a way no other relationship he has ever truly does. Obi-Wan's influence in Anakin's life actually INSPIRES Anakin to be better because Obi-Wan has managed to connect with Anakin in a way that goes deeper than some of his other relationships (I think that his relationships with Padme and Ahsoka are both INCREDIBLY skin deep and that Anakin mostly sees them as extensions of himself or primarily for what they can do for him rather than caring about them for who they are).

Which means that, while Anakin's attachment to Obi-Wan is always going to be a bad thing that could feasibly push Anakin to do terrible things, there's arguably evidence in canon to support the idea that if Palpatine had CONTINUED with this particular plan, that it wouldn't have worked quite as well as it did with Padme. I think that Anakin's attachment to Obi-Wan, such as it is, has to come up against Anakin's desire for Obi-Wan's APPROVAL which is only gained when Anakin acts MORE LIKE A JEDI. He WANTS to live up to Obi-Wan's faith in him, he wants to Obi-Wan to be proud of him and feel like the time and effort he spent training him was worth it. It's also worth noting that their dynamic as Master and Padawan makes the whole overprotective thing less likely to come up than it would with people like Padme and Ahsoka. Obi-Wan was MORE powerful than Anakin for a while, MORE capable of protecting himself than Anakin was, and was actually ANAKIN'S protector. So while he does CARE whether Obi-Wan lives or dies, he's also much more inclined to believe Obi-Wan can generally take care of himself, too.

So I can honestly see it sort-of going either way. Obi-Wan's relationship with Anakin is one of the few (if not the ONLY) real grounding influences in Anakin's life and could have possibly broken through the attachment enough to keep Anakin from going full tilt Sith, but it's equally as likely that Palpatine would've found a way around that anyway. Obviously, Palpatine could've just... killed Obi-Wan to get that influence out of the way and pushed Anakin over the edge out of a desire for vengeance as opposed to a desire to keep Obi-Wan from dying in the first place. The attachment is still dangerous, and as long as Palpatine's alive, he'll find a way to use it to get Anakin where he wants him, but if Obi-Wan is ALSO alive, he has the ability to balance out Palpatine's influence to some degree.

[cherrielatte]

genuine question do you even understand what a proshipper is ? like youre okay with people romanticizing pedophilia and shipping minors and adults ? you think thats okay?? GENUINE question.

Hello! Judging from the way you worded this - I'm gonna be honest: I don't think you know what proshipping is. I was very close to not answering this because it was sounding a bit in bad faith ( and this isn't the first time I've gotten belligerent asks on the same topic) But well, I decided to give it a shot and give benefit of the doubt.

 I know it's common ground to jump onto proshipping with the idea that it means you romanticize pedophilia, abuse, toxicity, etc. It's the typical high ground taken when people hear that dark fiction enjoyers exist. But that's not actually what it means. It just means that YOU, as an individual, understand that a drawing is not the same thing as human being. Written characters are not the same as human beings. Harassing REAL people over a non existent character because they put them into situations that make you uncomfortable says more about the harasser than the writer/artist. Proshipping is about taking personal responsibility for your experience online. Not long ago, the idea of a proshipper was just considered having fandom etiquette (ie: Don't like; Don't read type of tag lines. ) I'm a proshipper and there are plenty of things I don't like & make me uncomfortable. But I also understand that I can easily not engage. I can filter tags so I don't see it. I can block people that make that kind of content. I can refuse to click on something clearly labeled as the content I don't like. I can control what I see. And I can also understand that that if someone draws something I don't like it doesn't mean anything about them in real life nor what they enjoy in real life. Besides, a lot of people that consider themselves proshippers are victims of abuse or have had to endure traumatic events in their lives. Engaging in what you might consider dark fiction allows people to cope and navigate through complex emotion/trauma and express themselves in ways they are not allowed to or haven't allowed themselves to. I've seen some people say "I've been through trauma and I don't engage in proshipping." And okay, I'm happy for you. But not everyone copes the same way you do. And no one should be held to the same standard. If we were all carbon copies of each other, maybe I would understand that argument. But that's not the case. I should also mention, that it's become a bit standard for people to only excuse those that have been through trauma to make dark fiction. But only if they publicly acknowledge what kind of trauma they have endured. I am 100% against this way of thinking. I do not think it is anyone's right to demand an account of my or anyone's personal traumas just to validate the existence of certain piece of art. No one is entitled to anyone's abuse story. If a person is willing to share, because they want to, that's the personal decision of the individual. But look, much of the horror genre (movies, books, tv, etc) wouldn't exist if we put these high censorship rules onto art as a whole and unfortunately, I see this happening more and more these days like discussed in this post about someone's experience in publishing gothic horror.

Going back to an earlier point, you have to really understand that the characters are fake. 100% fake. If I ship Sora ( KH) and Ash (Pokemon) neither of them are going to be upset about it because they don't exist. If I draw them kissing, it is a drawing of anime looking characters kissing. That's all. They don't look anything like real human people. Wasting energy fighting over fictional characters is just that. Wasting time and energy. Who are you saving? Ash? Sora? They don't need help, because they aren't real. Fight for real people that actually exist. I have seen people outside of the Soriku fandom genuinely upset about people shipping Riku x Sora because they are underage! Mostly because they are both male but without fail, they always slap on the argument: "they are kids, you sicko!" But you know why they go to that? Because assuming the moral high ground wins over arguments quickly. People are eager to be superficially perceived as morally good. I have seen people ship Riku x Ansem SOD, which could fall into that age gap - problematic shipping you referred to in your ask. But you know what? I get it. I see people interpret their relationship as one of abuse, metaphorical SA, manipulation, etc. I completely understand and see that interpretation and where it stems from. And unfortunately, there are many people in fandom that have had this exact experience. Honestly, without me needing to ask anyone specifically, I KNOW there are people in fandom projecting their experiences onto Riku and Ansem as a means to replay it with a bit of actual control. And even if there are people who don't. I'm not going to ask, because it's none of my business. So again, as a proshipper I am completely in control of my online experience. I can block, mute, filter, and not engage with the things I don't like or things that trigger me. But as long as it is fiction, it remains as just that : Something I don't like between characters that dont exist. I don't have to harass, bully, nor threaten people over fiction. Of course, there are bad apples in every circle. But to me, whether someone is a bad person or not is expressed through action toward real people and the intentional harm done onto them, whether it be through inappropriate interactions, abuse of any kind, exposing personal information, harassing family/at work, or encouraging harm. Those are real actions on real people and engaging in these actions is what counts to me as markers of a bad person. Not someone drawing two fictional characters that haven't aged in the last 20 years kissing or having sex.