#If you disagree I'm okay with that just be an adult about it if you decide to voice your disagreement

[stillarobyn]

I understand the intention behind this post and I don't disagree with it. I don't.

If you're writing a period piece or something with a certain dark tone, then yes, you absolutely want to keep to that, give your gruff sailor a mumbled line about not being like most other men, or your scattered workaholic scientist can say she never felt like she was missing out on anything by not having a partner while they save the world.

But do not limit the reach of fanfiction by expecting it to be held to the same standards.

Because we need both. Because the target audience for a lot of works that employ this are young, they're disconnected from community, and they're lost. They think they're broken or they don't fit or they are made wrong.

I, a millennial, didn't know about bisexuality until I read about it in fanfic somewhere around 2003 (I was 13). I didn't know any out gay or queer people growing up. It was still scandalous on tv, and my parents didn't have any problem with it, they just didn't talk about it. I can't imagine how isolating it would have felt if my parents prevented me from watching anything with gay characters or spoke negatively about them.

My first discovery of nonbinary identity was in a bandom fic I read in 2010 (I was 20, for those playing the home game). It was maybe two years after that that I began to talk with nonbinary/genderqueer/genderfluid people online. I knew a couple of binary trans people in college, and one in high school, but this was my first time meeting people who weren't a binary gender. In 2012! It took another two years for me, at this point a full-ass adult, to start describing myself that way.

All of this oversharing to say...my understanding of queer identity was not hand-held by anyone in my life, but boy I learned to accept these foreign ideas I saw in myself because I had a safe fictional environment to explore these concepts and terms.

I think it was 2014-2016 when fanfic spaces had a boom of "everyone is trans" AUs and headcanons, and they were often rose-tinted and a bit twee, but that's the point of them. I saw identities I had to look up, and when I asked in follow-up "okay, but what does a person who feels like that look/act like?" it was all crickets, except in fiction, and specifically fanfic.

"But the world is different now, not knowing is no excuse" NOPE. not with anti-lgbtqia legislation passing in the US, or in other hostile countries around the world (I'm from the US, my argument is US-centric based on my experience and knowledge, but by no means exclusionary of people in other countries), or even family situations or rural upbringing or any other circumstance that isolated young queer folk from other queer folk.

A popular live-service video game introduced a nonbinary character and I saw twitch chats full of people who were just confused and uneducated. Ignoring those who were hostile was easy, but the uninformed, especially the non-English-speakers and people who didn't come from Western cultures, were largely open to learning something they never had framework for. Made all the more frustrating in a game environment where the characters didn't make a habit of having these discussions on screen, but that's a different rant.

I don't know if OP intended this in reference to original media, or toward fic, but I saw a lot of established characters in the reblogs so I just want to address that. I'm a characterization first fic reader, so I get it. "Everyone is trans" fics aren't for me, but there's a space needed for them if someone needs to see Captain Kirk and Spock debating the application of terminology of human gender and sexuality in interplanetary cultural settings...now actually I kind of want that fic so I played myself.

Dragon Age Veilguard came under attack for daring to openly and forwardly use the term "nonbinary" in its fantasy world, as though something about the word is inherently incompatible with the fantasy genre? But the game was pretty clear in its goal to create a safe gaming space for marginalized folks when so often their experiences are erased, ignored, tokenized, or stereotyped. The narrative, therefore, had to be hostile to the unaccepting, educational for the ignorant, and validating to the vulnerable. Getting to play in a world where people are referred to as nonbinary (just like me) and where people use they/them pronouns (just like me) and where no one ridicules or attacks them specifically for this? It felt comfortable and safe and the world was ending in the game, but I felt a personal empowerment in my immersion.

More complex and nuanced discussions by characters about their queer identity add to the picture. It shouldn't be in every work because every author has their own angle and their own philosophy about it, but they have just as much a right to a seat at the table. You can have your fics where Tony Stark's sexuality is a smirk and a wink, and you can have your fics where he explains that he used to call himself bisexual but the world is bigger and weirder so he considers himself omnisexual now. And if you don't like that, scroll past it. The author didn't write it for you, but someone else needs to hear that.

Maybe this is just a personal vent that escaped containment, but I feel the need to remind some folks that some people need the LGBT center brochure version because they didn't get one in the mail. It's a tough time for everyone in this community, no need to make it tougher.

he would not fucking say that but it’s he would not fucking talk about his queer identity like he was reading out of a college campus lgbt center brochure

[feral-radfem]

Oh my God I'm so surprised that super persistent but consistently flawed debater on Tumblr is actually a child. I never saw that coming.

Look, there's things that adults shouldn't say/ topics we shouldnt bring up around children and should be able to create spaces away from them. If I'm being completely honest, radical feminism almost entirely falls in this category of 18+ content. We are constantly talking about sexual violence and other extremely adult topics that aren't appropriate for developing minds to be constantly bombarded with. It's bad for your young minds and it's bad for the movements that you seem to think you care about.

If you want to be a child activist then volunteer for your local community, don't get in online spaces with adults. It's simply not safe for children and creates an unproductive environment for adults. Children will learn better skills and build more fulfilling relationships and achievement doing local community activism anyways.

If you're a minor you need to put that shit somewhere so that we can tell that we're talking to a literal baby. I really don't enjoy this increasing trend of purposely not telling people when y'all are minors because you think that it's going to make people dismiss you, when you having limited life experience is a legitimate limitation on your analysis. You're being deceptive because someone placed a social boundary that you don't want to respect. It's high key gross.

On the same note, different tune, I hope this serves that is a reminder that people can literally be lying, either outright or by omission, about everything they claim about themselves on here. We, people in general, have created the online culture where it's completely normal to lie about important identifying features about ourselves for social clout/elevation. While I know there are some of us that may not participate in this practice, I know plenty of radfems do. We've caught a few doing it red-handed and all they're doing is breeding distrust amongst us in these spaces.

Can y'all not just act like normal honest people?

[libraford]

It is possible to interact with people whom share opposing views and no this is not about pineapple on pizza. In fact, it is imperative that you learn how to be civil with some people who you may find difficult to agree with.

At work, Youngin would often tell me that the guy that trained him (Ginger) was a misogynist. I had never met Ginger, and I had very little to say on this matter. But I would ask Youngin some questions about him because I like to know the other seasonal workers a little. I ask about Ginger- first words from Youngin's mouth 'he's a misogynist.'

I asked him why he thought that. (There are many misogynists at this location, as someone that is woman-shaped I see it often, I am comparing notes.)

"We were on our way to a location and a driver was going really slowly. When he got around her he said 'fucking women drivers.' Like he was going out of his way to prove that the driver was a woman."

The last month or so, Youngin worked exclusively with me because I knew that it was a matter of time before he said something that pissed off one of the guys. He was not going to get along with people here, it just wasn't happening.

When he left, everyone wanted to know what he was like to work with. And I finally got to have a conversation with Ginger.

"I'd like to ask you something a little strange- he said that on his first day there was an issue with a driver going slowly. Can you tell me about that?"

"Oh yeah! She was going super slow and when I got around her I said 'yup- little old lady driving.' And he was like 'what's that supposed to mean?' And I just kind of dropped it, but I hear he was saying I was a misogynist over it?"

So I give Youngin some grace because he's young, he's got a social bubble that's very liberal, he has not met very many people that weren't part of that kind of scene. But he often talked about how every person here has said something that pissed him off and he seemed really surprised that I (woman-shaped queer liberal) would be okay working with all these sexist homophobes.

And I give grace to Ginger because he had no reason to think that his words would be interpreted like that. What he was saying was normal to him. This is... somewhat the culture of landscaping jobs. And its not even close to the worst thing I've heard out of these dudes mouths. (Literally had one of the dudes comment that he would like to 'motorboat' one of the pedestrians.)

It was weird for Youngin to carry that with him for the whole two months that he worked here, over a very... small comment.

Every single person I've worked with here has said something that has given me pause and I tuck it away to rant about later and then I let it go. If it gets out of hand, I talk to one of the bosses about it. I know how to contact HR. I came into this place knowing that I was going to disagree politically with most of the people that I work with because I'm coming in to a culture that is fundamentally different from my own.

If I am being frank, I find the overt bigotry somewhat better than the corporate bullshit of 'we value your contributions, but won't be granting your accommodations request out of fairness to other workers' or the glass cliff or literally being fired for my sexual orientation but phrased with 'oh you just weren't a good fit for the culture here.' I at least know what I'm getting into when I come to work. I know what not to talk about. Last time I thought I was safe to talk about something queer with my boss she blindsided me with some transphobic garbage.

Its admirable to stick up for the marginalized people in your life, but part of changing minds is knowing the time and the place to comment. I think I've changed more minds at this warehouse by being a visibly out lesbian at work than I have by making carefully crafted speeches.

That is fine. It is fine to disagree. Sometimes you have to work with racists, homophobes, and assholes. That is part of being an adult. You talk about things like... sports or TV or weather or some cool bug you saw. Finding common ground with people who are different from you in many ways is an important part of socialization and it sucks to think you have anything in common with a jackass but look- you're spending 7-ish hours with these people and at some point some of them are going to say stupid shit. You are going to say stupid shit also. I have said my fair share of stupid shit. Deal with the fact that you're all stupid shits.

And for fuck's sake, wear your hardhat.

[celibibratty]

i thought reddit were more down to earth, no!, this is not being down to earth, they are just rude...just rude!/jerks!, it-was-only-supposed-to-be a text saying that the pak mei form should have on Nintendo switch.........i have a fucking fuss/fighting magnet for some fuckin reason on this shit💢🔥 anything I say on this shit site appears a bunch of motherfuckers to disagree or complain about something, trying to be the known at alls, don't mess with me, that i don't mess with you, if you gonna bite/come to me with bad heart shitty comments, i will bite you too(and i will bite HARD), don't try me, i not in my best state of spirit🔥💢, you so coward and dumbass that you need a bunch dumbass homies like you to defend your shitty behaviour/comments so you feel right/in power, whata hell, i just do/write things on my own little way if don't like/don't have patient to read it, FUCK YOU!, so you not the person to read this, it makes me feel sad how such a cool game like sifu attract such motherfuckers(come on ana i already know/notice that since the moment that the game released (february 2022), don't get so surprised, gamers/fight game community is shitty), stop, stop, stop with this, i used to thought the same thing with lis2 on 2020/weird diazcest and extremist anti phase, i shouldn't take this things from heart, shitty people will always exist on things that you like(it's not the things fault, don't blame them, Ana)

[markanddebbie-protectionprogram]

Let's address the MVP in the atom eve special: Zak

He gave Eve an opening to show her interest. And when she got into detail, he listened to every word.

He didn't disregard her intelligence or bitterly called her a "know-it-all" or called her names like "nerd" or "weirdo", instead, he was fascinated with her. He openly showed interest in wanting to know what she knows.

Of course there's a little personal agenda that he needed to learn these things but you can tell that he was genuine with her.

What really made me feel so emotional is that Zak celebrates Eve, he proudly compliments her to her parents. And he's aware/probably aware that she's not a very verbal kid around her parents so he took it upon himself to prove her genius.

He showed every model Eve built and carefully picked them up to show them off. You can even see Eve smile when he showed the magnesium model. And even if he doesn't completely know what the final model is, he still praised it.

And can we applaud this dude? He literally understood what was happening to her, what she was seeing, before her own parents did. And if this was his first time babysitting her? That's just all the more impressive of him to be able to realize.

Even as Zak said all that about Eve being able to see and memorize molecules, you can feel that he was amazed by Eve the entire time.

You can see that Eve was visibly distressed in this moment cause her parents aren't the least bit happy.

But Zak handled it well. Teens would fold or agree when the adults seem to disagree or don't want to hear them out (especially if they're babysitting, wouldn't want to lose that pay). But that's not the case with him. He didn't raise his voice to be heard. But he made it known that he thinks what Eve knows and what she can do is cool.

And most importantly, Zak didn't forget his manners. He thanked Eve and made sure she knows that she helped him a lot by showing that he's confident he'll do well in his test.

He literally did every single thing right. This boy was raised right. We don't have much info on him but he was a great character in the entirety of his screen time.

I don't think I can stress this enough but his whole scene was amazing.

Eve looks super young here and she might not remember this moment but I'm sure she's glad that at that moment, someone made her feel okay with herself.

That what she's seeing is okay.

That what she knows is okay.

And that it's okay to show it to others too.

[miwiheroes]

Season 1 Mike Wheeler Queer-coding

Just some of my favourite pieces of queer-coded Mike evidence that I have found from season 1. Let me know if you have never seen these before because I'd love to add to the conversation <33

My overall conclusion from season 1 is: Mike gets taught that being queer/ not liking girls is dangerous. It means you die/ disappear. Being 'normal' or straight is therefore easier. Take this conclusion in mind as you read this.

Disclaimer: This is just my opinion. If you want to interact with this post because you disagree with me, please be respectful.

(Yes I will be doing all the other seasons at some point but it will take a while because this one took me a WEEK)

1. Ted's Comments

Take these with a grain of salt, because when I watched the show again I was a little unsure of whether these are actually implicitly homophobic or due to other things.

So here Ted says 'see Michael, you see what happens?' after Nancy storms off and goes to her room. This could be in relation to Mike shouting at Nancy earlier and that's why he's scolding him a little, but also Mike was talking about how it isn't Will's fault that he's gone missing. It's also kind of established that adults in the town think that Will is gay (more on that later) and was hatecrimed, so Ted could be referencing that.

It's also notable that Mike thinks his dad is talking about Will's disappearance because he then says 'what happens when what? i'm the only one acting normal here. i'm the only one who cares about will.'

So I think it's pretty clear what he's insinuating here. He didn't want to explicitly say 'see what happens when you're not like everyone else' but you can tell. And why would this be said to Mike in relation to Will's disappearance if not for queer-coding? Even early on in the show, Mike could associate being queer with going missing.

Ted, later on in the season, says 'our son? with a girl?' which tbh i thought could be because he's a nerd and only likes hanging out with his friends.

But now that I'm thinking about it, they also say that kind of stuff about Will in season 3. And people on twitter who were against Will's queer-coding before season 4 figured that a lot of the reason people called him slurs was because of him being shy/ stereotyped/ a nerd/ sensitive. But it was confirmed after season 4 that the slurs were queer-coding aka we were right. So the same could easily be said for Mike in this situation.

2. The 'Talk' tm

We've all seen a lot of people talk about this, but I have a teensy bit more to add onto what others have said already because it's sort of funny.

This scene is different to both Karen and the audience. To Karen, she's basically asking Mike if he's feeling particularly sad about Will being missing because of reasons. But to the audience, and Mike, this is a moment for him to be worried about the fact he's hiding El in his closet.

Karen says: 'with all this that's been going on, with Will, i can't imagine what it's been like for you. i just-- want you to feel like you can talk to me. i never want you to feel like you have to hide anything from me. i'm here for you. okay?'

This feels like something Joyce will say to Will in season 5 LMAO like-

If you aren't queer, you will never understand how obvious this is that it's a gay talk. The word 'hide' is so often used in these situations. What is she insinuating? I understand that the 'i want you to feel like you can talk to me' might just be about Mike's sadness, but the emphasis on 'hide anything' is crazy. Also this is about Will and nothing else because at the beginning she pointedly says, 'with Will'. She's basically insinuating there's something different about Mike's relationship/friendship with Will.

What she could also be insinuating is that she thinks that Will's disappearance had something to do with him being queer, (which is rumoured about). She then applies this same logic to Mike. She may be thinking 'oh if Will didn't feel safe about being queer, I'd better let Mike know he is safe.' -- This could be far-fetched though.

Okay so what is very interesting is that El's in Mike's closet at this time. There are multiple reasons for the directors to put her in there: One, to show a flashback from when she's in the lab, and Two, for her to be in the closet during the queer-coded conversation.

Here's why: RIGHT AFTER KAREN SAYS ALL THE HIDING STUFF, THERE'S A SOUND FROM MIKE'S CLOSET......

Walk with me here folks... To the audience, this is funny because Mike is hiding something. He's hiding El. But. Also the sound came from his closet. He's hiding the fact he's in the closet-- *gunshots*. Double meanings exist i swearr

3. Lucas's Teasing

This whole scene is so interesting to me. I used to ignore it because it's possible Mike and El proof but...

It reinforces the heteronormativity of Mike and could even feed into how he acts in his relationship with her. First of all, Lucas tells Mike that just because he is being nice to a girl he must want to marry her and love her right?

This could be a 'Mike could like El' scene, but no. Mike is literally like, 'Lucas what are you talking about?' HE IS CONFUSED. He's also fed-up, he's not embarrassed. He's not flustered. He's not like 'omg shut up hahaha' he literally bluntly says 'shut up Lucas' in this voice that sounds kind of tired.

What Mike learns here is that being with a girl is kind of expected. He's not allowed to be friends with a girl or care for a girl without people assuming they're a thing.

This leads perfectly onto the next point.....

4. Bullies' Homophobic Comments Exhibit A

Straight after learning that Lucas assumed he had heterosexual feelings for El, Mike learns that being gay is a 'bad thing'.

These comments could just be coding for Will, sure, but there are indications that it could be Mike queer-coding as well.

First of all, 'He's dead, that's what my dad says. Probably killed by some other queer', is a very weighted comment. The fact that Troy's dad said this to him implies that Will's sexuality is like a rumour amongst adults in the town. It's also the show portraying how hate like homophobia can be taught from parents.

Mike's then the one to be like 'just ignore them' and goes to walk away. SPECIFICALLY IT IS HIM THAT IS TRIPPED. I REPEAT!!! HE IS TRIPPED NO ONE ELSE.

This could imply that the bullies were targeting him as well as Will for homophobic bullying, maybe in the past as well, and the 'killed by some other queer' comment could be directed at him. I guess you could say that he was tripped because he was the nearest person, or that he was the one speaking, but the directors chose him to be the one walking there. And SPEAKING. Why??

So: Mike has just learnt from Lucas that being nice to a girl can be seen as attraction and means he has to love her. THEN Mike has just learnt from the bullies that maybe Will died because he was gay, and that being gay gets you hurt (tripped over).

Mike is given a choice between the lesser of two evils: choose to fit into a heteronormative society but get made fun of Lucas, or embrace being gay and get killed/ bullied like Will.

Later on in the season, he finds out Will has died. Let me repeat that. He. Believes. Will. Has. Died. Would this maybe reinforce what the bullies said? That being gay = disappearance. Oh poor MIKE OMGGG

Queer coding all up in this scene lads. (+ a reason for internalised homophobia uwu)

5. Bullies' Homophobic Comments Exhibit B

This scene and the previous scene are inherently linked.

Mike is the one to confront the bullies about Will, defending him, so the bullies instantly resort to homophobia. This means that they may be implying that Mike trying to defend someone who they view as gay is also gay.

In the last scene, I guess you could say that the comments weren't particularly targeted at Mike as well as Will because he wasn't at the forefront of the group (even though he was tripped over). But in this scene he definitely is. They chose to utilise homophobic language about Will because they know it touches a nerve with Mike: This homophobic language doesn't just affect the person they are talking about but also the person they are saying it to.

So here's what they say: 'Besides, what's there to be sad about anyway? Will's in fairyland now, right? Flying around with all the other little fairies, all happy and gay.'

The words that Troy is saying here are obviously more linked to how Will is queer-coded throughout season 1, but the way that the scene is shot, the music, the implications, they're all coding for Mike.

'Will's in fairyland now, right?' is posed as a question. They didn't have to make it a question, but they did. This is basically them saying 'oh we've told you this before, shouldn't you know?'/ implying that Mike would know because he's also gay.

Another line they didn't have to include unless it was queer-coding for Mike is: 'Flying around with all the other little fairies.' They could have just written Troy to say 'Will's in fairyland now. All happy and gay,' or something along those lines etc. The jab at Mike is that other gay people exist, and that Will is being gay 'with them'. The words 'all happy and gay' here doesn't actually imply Will's sexuality by itself, but the act of 'being gay together' or in a gay relationship so to speak.

So if you put the pieces together, they're making a point about Mike and Will's friendship in a sense. Also the fact that Troy at the beginning of this insult says 'What's there to be sad about anyway?', basically means that he's trying to get under Mike's skin by saying 'Why are you sad that Will's happy and being gay with other boys? Are you sad he's not with you?' I know that's like, on the nose, but whatever.

(Also Mike has tears in his eyes during this part showing how the words are also affecting him and not just Will)

Another thing I want to talk about is the music. Obviously this music is foreboding and is trying very hard to make the audience uncomfortable, trying to let you know that something bad is going to happen. When Troy walks away, the music swells and the camera zooms in on Mike's angry expression.

Then, Mike pushes troy over for the homophobic comment. This is interesting why? Because Troy tripped Mike over in the previous scene I talked about. Meaning: the scenes are linked. Troy was being homophobic to both Mike and Will. Mike's had enough, so he retaliates in the same way that Troy had treated him earlier.

I'd also like to add that before El saves Mike, he just stands there as Troy stands up and says 'You're dead Wheeler, you're dead.' He was ready to take whatever Troy was going to throw at him. Which is interesting because in the previous scene I talked about, Troy spoke about how being 'queer' means you'll get killed. ('He's dead. That's what my dad thinks, probably killed by some other queer.') So Troy is going to kill Mike, just like how Will is dead too.

A lot has happened between the previous scene and this one. Mike thought Will had died. Yes, during the assembly scene, he doesn't believe it anymore, but he watched Will's body being dragged out the water just recently. Just like in the scene where he jumps into the quarry, this is yet another instance of Mike not caring if he gets hurt in regards to bullying/ Will.

6. More Lucas Comments

"Screw you Mike! You're blind, blind because you like that a girl's not grossed out by you! But wake up, man. Wake the hell up!" (btw I'm not saying that Lucas is being homophobic here, they're little kids and they've been through a lot)

I mean, come on. This basically implies the classic compulsive heterosexuality concept of Mike choosing which girl to have a crush on because she's the easiest option, since she didn't know him growing up or didn't go to the same school together. Even if this isn't accurate, it is still coding because they wrote Lucas to say that jab at him, it hurts Mike inside, because he knows deep down it's at least a little true.

He looks saddened by this, not angry. Mike usually gets annoyed much quicker than this and whenever he's insulted he looks shocked or has a scowl on his face, but here he just looks... sad. Because he knows that Lucas is touching a nerve. (The top pic btw)

He's completely silent. Until, of course, Lucas starts talking about Will:

'She knows where Will is. And now, she's just letting him die in the Upside Down.'

'Shut up!' -- Mike suddenly shouts either because a) he doesn't like that Lucas is insulting El or something OR b) he hates that Lucas is implying that it is his fault that Will is dying in the upside down because he's being blinded by the fact El isn't grossed out by him.

I think it's B tbh <3 (this scene isn't toooo important for my overall conclusion but it's a little nugget of info i guess)

7. Mike Jumps Into the Quarry

Let's be honest here, before this scene, almost everything seems hopeless for Mike finding Will. Firstly, he physically saw Will's 'body' being dragged out of the same water that he's about to jump into. Then he found out he was still alive but somewhere extremely dangerous and he could be dying there for all he knew. Then his one hope at finding Will (Eleven) is gone and he can't find her ("She's a weapon!... We're no use to Will if we're dead!") and Lucas won't agree to help him find her.

This scene was foreshadowed earlier on, making it a very important scene anyways -- Hopper said that no one would survive the jump and the water 'turns into cement, hits you like a tonne of bricks'. Mike would have died if El didn't save him. And he seemed okay with it.

The camera focuses in on him, and if you listen closely, you can hear his heartbeat. You could say that he's only really doing this to save his friend, but like, why is he so willing and why did they so pointedly zoom in on him?

Here's where we get a little serious: Mike would have committed suicide if El wasn't there at the last second. He would have died in the same place where Will's body was discovered.

Quotes about how being gay gets you killed:

'See Michael? You see what happens?' --Meaning: What happens when you're gay? You disappear.

'He's dead, that's what my dad says. Probably killed by some other queer' -- Meaning: Being gay gets you killed/ means you should die.

'Besides, what's there to be sad about anyway? Will's in fairyland now, right? Flying around with all the other little fairies, all happy and gay.' -- Meaning: Will's dead along with all the other gay people, that's where they should be etc.

'You're dead Wheeler, you're dead.' -- Meaning: Mike you should die too, because you're just like Will, and you should join him in 'fairyland'.

(from this scene) 'Jump [into the Quarry].' -- Meaning: Mike you should die just like I told you earlier and in the same place that Will died. (Honestly I believe the whole town now think that Will is dead and his body was found in the quarry, so Troy would know too and use it against Mike.)

Then, after Mike survives this queer-coded death (which can be paralleled to Will's hypothetical death because it's in the same place), he says to the girl that he cares about and has been presumed to 'like' by his friends: 'You saved me. You saved me.'

(just wanna note that i think that is a very sweet scene and doesn't just have to be all about Mike's queer-coding. it's a bond between the party as friends because Dustin also hugs El. But still.)

You tell me what this scene means then.

8. Mike wasn't Lying (Theory)

Okay so this is more of just a theory than queer-coding, because there is something about this scene that I just find... weird.

I personally think that this scene with both Nancy and Mike talking about their so-called 'crushes' is meant to be so you can see the difference between someone who is lying and someone who is telling the truth. Their reactions to the questions are very different to each other (although it could just be a difference in their characters).

Mike: 'Do you like Jonathan now?'

Nancy: 'What?' *looks to the side, fighting a smile* 'No... no, it's not- It's not like that.' -- She's clearly lying because she's being vague, looking to the side, stuttering over her words etc. However, Mike nods like he believes her. This is key for later.

Nancy: 'Do you like Eleven?'

Mike: 'What? No. Ew. Gross.' *looks her up and down in disgust* -- Telling the truth because he stares at Nancy, doesn't stutter over his words and is very direct.

The fact that these reactions are so different (and we know that Nancy likes Jonathan lets be real) is purposeful in my opinion. It shows that at this point, Mike doesn't like insinuation that he likes her in that way.

Something else that happens later in the episode is also quite interesting to me, which further points to Mike 'telling the truth', which is that Mike thought his and Nancy's conversation was mutually truthful.

Why? Because he was completely confused when Lucas says that her and Jonathan are romantically involved later:

Mike: 'They're gone. Nancy and Jonathan. His car's gone.'

Lucas: 'They're probably just sucking face somewhere.'

Mike: 'What? No. No way.' -- Clearly showing that maybe he thought that Nancy was being truthful, meaning he thought their exchange was mutually truthful.

This seems a bit far-fetched but... something to think about.

Btw, I was going to talk about how the First Kiss between Mike and El is queer-coded, but tbh, it's more like... weird. Because they're 12/11 years old and El literally has no idea what a kiss is and they have this exchange about being brother and sister (ew). Then Mike kind of says 'oh i want to go to the snow ball with you, but not if you're my sister', just gives me vibe that he's just doing what he thinks is normal as a result of what others say. But that's it, not much else to say abt it really (also im tired of writing this post ive been doing it for so long <3)

In conclusion: Mike gets taught that being queer/ not liking girls is dangerous. It means you die/ disappear. Being 'normal' or straight is therefore easier. He internalises this for a while poor child <3

Thanks for reading!!! I love you <33 Let me know if you have anything you want to add or if you have contradictions idk byeeee

[trueebeauty]

IGNORING THEM - lookism men

how lookism men react to you giving them the silent treatment...

Confused and Concerned; He is gentle and nurturing to you. He might not even realize you're ignoring him because he wouldn't intentionally cause you to be upset. He genuinely cares about your feelings and wants to make sure you're okay. He might be worried he did something wrong and wants to fix it.

"Hey, is everything alright? You've been awfully quiet all night." Places a hand on your shoulder gently.

"Did I do something wrong? You seem upset." Looks worried with furrowed brows.

Cooks your favorite meal and sets the table. "How about we eat and talk about what's bothering you?"

 ➥𝐆𝐔𝐍 𝐏𝐀𝐑𝐊, 𝐕𝐈𝐍 𝐉𝐈𝐍, 𝐄𝐔𝐍𝐓𝐀𝐄 𝐋𝐄𝐄, 𝐉𝐀𝐘 𝐇𝐎𝐍𝐆, 𝐇𝐔𝐃𝐒𝐎𝐍 𝐀𝐇𝐍.

Slightly Upset and Needy; He might be a little insecure and craves your attention. He might feel rejected or unimportant when you ignore him. Using playful tactics is his way of trying to win back your attention and affection in a lighthearted way.

Sighs dramatically. "Come on, (Y/N). The silent treatment? Really?"

Pouts and gives you the puppy-dog eyes. "Is this about [something minor you might be disagreeing on]?"

Whines playfully and nudges you. "Alright, alright, I'll stop. But you gotta tell me what's wrong, babe."

 

➥𝐆𝐎𝐎 𝐊𝐈𝐌, 𝐗𝐈𝐀𝐎𝐋𝐎𝐍𝐆, 𝐑𝐘𝐔𝐇𝐄𝐈 𝐊𝐔𝐑𝐎𝐃𝐀, 𝐙𝐀𝐂𝐊 𝐋𝐄𝐄, 𝐃𝐀𝐍𝐈𝐄𝐋 𝐏𝐀𝐑𝐊, 𝐉𝐎𝐇𝐀𝐍 𝐒𝐄𝐎𝐍𝐆.

Giving You Space (But Still Worried); He is respectful and understands that sometimes you just need some time alone. He trusts you and your ability to communicate when you're ready. He offers support without being overbearing, hoping you'll feel comfortable opening up to him.

Kisses your forehead softly. "I'm here if you want to talk. Otherwise, I'm going to watch some TV in the living room."

Sits beside you silently, offering a supportive presence without pushing.

Makes you a cup of tea and leaves it on the table next to you. "This might help." Gives you a small smile.

 ➥𝐂𝐇𝐀𝐑𝐋𝐄𝐒 𝐂𝐇𝐎𝐈, 𝐆𝐀𝐏𝐑𝐘𝐎𝐍𝐆 𝐊𝐈𝐌, 𝐉𝐀𝐊𝐄 𝐊𝐈𝐌, 𝐒𝐈𝐍𝐔 𝐇𝐀𝐍, 𝐉𝐄𝐑𝐑𝐘 𝐊𝐖𝐎𝐍, 𝐄𝐋𝐈 𝐉𝐀𝐍𝐆, 𝐉𝐈𝐂𝐇𝐀𝐍𝐆 𝐊𝐖𝐀𝐊, 𝐒𝐄𝐎𝐍𝐆𝐉𝐈 𝐘𝐔𝐊, 𝐓𝐀𝐄𝐒𝐎𝐎 𝐌𝐀. 

Annoyed and Frustrated; He might have difficulty with indirect communication. He might find the silent treatment immature or manipulative. He could feel disrespected or dismissed by your lack of communication.

Crosses his arms and leans against the doorway. "Look, If you're mad at me, just say it. Ignoring me isn't helping anything."

Raises his voice slightly. "Seriously? This is childish. Talk to me like an adult." 

Storms out of the room, muttering to himself. "Fine. Be that way."

Feels the energy and leaves, not wanting to deal with you right now.

➥𝐉𝐀𝐌𝐄𝐒 𝐋𝐄𝐄, 𝐄𝐔𝐆𝐄𝐍𝐄, 𝐒𝐀𝐌𝐔𝐄𝐋 𝐒𝐄𝐎, 𝐓𝐀𝐄𝐉𝐈𝐍 𝐂𝐇𝐄𝐎𝐍, 𝐎𝐋𝐋𝐘 𝐖𝐀𝐍𝐆, 𝐖𝐀𝐑𝐑𝐄𝐍 𝐂𝐇𝐀𝐄, 𝐆𝐎𝐍𝐆𝐒𝐄𝐎𝐁 𝐉𝐈, 𝐉𝐀𝐄𝐆𝐘𝐄𝐎𝐍 𝐍𝐀, 𝐆𝐈𝐓𝐀𝐄 𝐊𝐈𝐌.

[damnfandomproblems]

Fandom Problem #5548:

Which one says more "groomer"?

"NSFW - Trigger warnings: age gap, noncon 18+ only, dead dove do not eat, minors keep out" "What you enjoy in fiction is mot necessarily what you think is acceptable or good in real life, and that's okay. Just be courteous and respect people's boundaries, tags, filters, and content warnings are useful tools. Fiction is a safe way of exploring unsafe concepts. Many people use fiction as a method to work through their traumas, but its okay even if that's not the reason they like it, some people are just drawn to taboo subjects, that's completely natural. Regardless we're not going to try to force people to open up about their past traumas, nor any other personal information. No story should be banned from being told just because it makes some people uncomfortable. Art is meant to provoke intense emotions, afterall. Even if I don't like something, it's not my business to tell someone else what they should or should not create. I'm an adult and its MY responsibility to manage my emotional responses, not anyone else's. If you find yourself unable to manage please remove yourself from this space and find somewhere more suitable.

or

"EVERY OTHER ADULT BUT ME is out to get you!! I'M the only one I can trust!! I only like WHOLESOME ships and WHOLESOME content!! Look at this GROSS NASTY PORN someone made!! They tried to hide it because they don't want anyone to know what a GROSS FUCK they are!! That's why I'm showing it to all of you!! I can't trust anyone unless you detail ALL of your privileges and your traumas! And if anyone steps one toe out of line by enjoying a problematic cartoon ship I'll publicly shame them and tell all my other 14 year old friends to bully harass cyberstalk and socially ostracize them as well and if they don't I'll make sure the same thing happens to them!! This is for the SAFETY of other minors and NOT because of any petty personal vendetta!! ALSO I think its a good idea to send specifically minors to mess with people who - I claim to truly believe are - ACTUAL REAL PEDOPHILES-- to totally frickin own them online!! Anyone who disagrees with me is a pdo and gromer!!! So ONLY LISTEN TO ME!!! NO opposing or outside perspectives allowed!! I'm a good, SAFE, HEALTHY, NORMAL ADULT!! PROSHITTERS KYS!!!!!!"

[ihopeiexplode]

What if we all normalize not writing smut for minors or saying inappropriate things about minors chat!!!!

The amount of Megumi, Yuji, inumaki and yuta etc etc smut fics I keep seeing is insane

Yes I'm aware all there all somewhere 16-17 meaning there almost adults but mind you, there still minors so writing smut for them is NOT okay

Regardless if you say 'oh but they 're aged up!' so? Even if it's aged up it would still have weird feeling knowing how there canonly MINORS

But wait theres more

Writing smut for Sukuna IN yujis/Megumi body is not okay, yes I'm aware Sukuna is grown but I'm specifically talking about people who write smut for Sukuna in yujis/megumis body

Mind you Sukuna is in yujis/Megumi body who are minors, Sukuna is in a body of a MINOR

↑ (take note I'm only referring to those who write smut taking place in the CANON jjk timeline where Sukuna is either in yujis or megumis body)

(if it's true form, or modern AU Sukuna then it's completely fine to write smut of him seeing how he's canonly an adult)

"why are you making such a big fuss out of it? Let people have fun and write what they want!!"

"just block/ignore them it's not that hard"

SHUT UPP!!!!!!! yes I do block them but mind you this is MY opinion and I have the free will to state it

If you disagree with my opinion feel free to block me nones stopping u and I really don't gaf

[enemywasp]

Alright so someone on tiktok sent me a link to a compiled list of arguments against proshippers and so I wanted to put a sort of brief response of my own thoughts of each point.

Long post warning!

"Proshippers are non-offending minor attracted people in a fresh paint of coat"

What a start, am I right? Okay so first off this is a huge generalisation, not every proshipper engages with or is even comfortable with anything that sexualises fictional children, or ships them with adults. And of those that do ship adult/minor ships, it doesn't always mean they're attracted to the character themselves or gains any sexual pleasure from that.

They then went on to say that although they might be non-offending, they still fantasise about and romanticise children- in the case of proshippers by creating art and stories. And I am not personally educated enough on how people's minds works to go in depth here, but I do know a lot of pedophilic thoughts can be intrusive and unwanted. And I would much rather people engage in this and deal with their thoughts through fiction where no actual children are harmed, than actually go touch a real child or engage is any form of CSEM.

“People can draw and ship whatever they want!”

Here they went on to say that surely to ship and create content you must justify these things in some capacity regardless of them being fictional. And immediately I'd argue, the justification it that they're fictional. And that sometimes you want to read about things you'd never approve of in real life, it's a natural curiosity. And again, regardless of what the dark content is I would take someone engaging in fiction over harming a real person any day.

They compared this to alt-right groups and dark humour justifying racism and transphobia, etc. And whilst I think something we should always be aware of in fiction is stereotypes and how we may be representing people. Youtube videos like this are usually a type of propaganda that AIM to change people's mindsets and turn them against groups. Whereas fiction tells a story, some may have meanings and connections to real life, be a political piece, etc. Not everything is that serious and has a clear distinction from reality.

Think for example, reading/watching about murder and gore. More on that in a second.

"Fiction doesn't affect reality!"

I'm going to be honest I rolled my eyes at this as their main example was slenderman. If you don't know about that, those girls were schizophrenic. Anything could of set off and caused delusions, it just so happened to be fiction. Those girls needed help- not to just read purer content. They also basically brought up propaganda again, which is again deliberate and designed to warp peoples perceptions. Its based of lying and spreading misinformation and passing it as facts. The only thing I strongly believe can be directly harmful is stereotypes if not handled with care. But I think that's something for anyone who writes and consumes content should be aware of regardless of their stances.

Again here they implied that all proshippers are peodophiles. And that they normalise abuse of children. I'd also like to point out that most proshippers I've interacted with online have age boundaries to avoid interacting with minors depending on how graphic or sexual their content is.

"What do you think all stories about murder should stop existing?"

Here they basically argued that killing in media isn't the same as its not romanticised or condoned. YA Novels disagree- mafia stories being the most immediate example to spring to mind. Furthermore, morally grey villains. One of my favourite films is Mr Right. It's about a hitman killing people. Anna kendrick falls in love with him and its framed as a romantic comedy. Funny how its only fanfiction that's criticised like this? I actually have more thoughts on this if anyones interested.

Again they bring up kids not knowing adults pursuing children is wrong, and I'm questioning why children this young are unsupervised on the Internet. How young were you when you were allowed to watch anything with graphic blood or violence? This content isn't made for kids! Especially not anyone so young they can't seperate fiction from reality as most sites have a specific age you have to be to join. And I'm sorry to say it, but on websites and social media where adults can interact with kids, anything can be used to groom kids. (The real thing you should be mad about here is how there's no websites aimed just for children and safe spaces on the Internet anymore cause it can't be monetised as easily)

"Artists are allowed to draw and write about dark people"

They basically said, yes but it's not the same as promoting. Writing something under a romantic light and not saying "Don't do at home!" Isn't promoting. No ones encouraging these things in real life. Or rather, if they are its not because they're a proshipper but rather who they are as a person and their intentions.

The trans example they used is very extreme and honestly something I agree with a little more, fiction can definitely be used as an excuse to say and act out hateful and discriminatory things. Whilst I do think it's something we should discuss and unpack more, I'm not certain of my view on how I would fix this without risking silencing people talking about their experiences.

"Its not my responsibility to look after other people, just block me and the tags"

Here they threw all kinds of accusations. And says that we're making traumatised people jump through hoops to avoid getting retraumatised. I hate this argument, you know people have actual triggers they may not be able to avoid in real life? The world can't bend around you. And I am very sorry if any content online is traumatising to you, but someone could also be traumatised by a certain breed of dog and not want to see it. Should no one post dogs online ever again? A bald man reminds you of an abusive ex? Bald men get off the Internet! You see how this thing can just keep escalating? The tags and warnings are important because they're the best you can get. You can't control the world to protect everyone from everything ever. No ones forcing you to interact, and if you're on any algorithm based content that will encourage that content on your for your page more.

The only thing I think we should take from this is the reminder that warnings and tags are always important.

"You only care about censoring creativity"

Here they defend themselves that oh wouldn't you want freaks out the community! Which again immediately makes me lose respect for you, if you're just going to brand us all as freaks as an argument and generalize us.

No comment on that first line when you can easily argue antishipper do the same.

"Proshippers are not remotely innocent of targeted harrasement" Neither are antis. There's people who take things too far both sides and I'm not going to defend either for that.

"Real kids get assaulted and all you care about is censoring people online!"

Here they shout "oh I can care about both!" But what I don't think they realise is censorship can make it difficult for kids and to learn about how to speak up and to look for signs, or to speak up about their experiences. How do you plan on removing the topic from the Internet whilst also letting victims speak up? And people may want to write fiction based off their experiences. Who are you to go through it and proclaim what is too far, what romanticises it too much? More on this later.

"Antis are reducing my trauma"

They compared this to saying "date rape victims are reducing my trauma because they weren't taken advantage of in the same way as me" which is a disgusting parallel?? Date rape is still rape. Someone writing about something isn't the same as it happening. Although it can be used as harrasment, grooming, etc if directly addressed to you or being constantly sent to you, written about you. But the content existing in general? No.

"I'm coping"

Compared it to self harm, and such. Poetry and diaries are also used to write about your experiences and unpack trauma. Some of which may write it in an unrealistically positive light cause that's how they want to unpack it or explain those thoughts. And yes these things get posted online.

I can't imagine a single therapist or professional psychiatrist of any kind disapproving of creative writing because, again, it's much better than any alternatives of doing real harm to yourself or people around you. Although I do agree that if something is traumatising for you to read about and just upsets you further, be aware of your own boundaries but not everyone is the same so how are you going to police people's own thoughts and emotions.

Also I can't remember who or where as it was years ago now, but I have heard of people who actually realised they were being groomed or abused and just how bad it was through reading about it in a fanfic and seeing it in an outside perspective.

They also say to do it in private, but doesn't everyone on the Internet now have an understanding of finding a community and looking out for eachother and sharing experiences?

"There's more nuance here than just calling proshippers peodophiles"

Here they say no matter what it still comes down to whether it's ever okay to sexualise minors in certain contexts. And again, not every proshipper does this or is even comfortable with engaging in this kind of content. And further, no one is sexualising real minors in this context.

"I'm a proshipper and a minor tho!"

I'd agree minors should be wary of the spaces they're in but proship spaces aren't always necessarily sexual, graphic or 18+. Saying they're being groomed feels like you're watering down that term. I was a proshipper at age 13, I didn't interact with anyone online about it though, I didn't even know that was the term. I just came to the conclusion that it's just fiction all on my own. Minors aren't idiots.

At then end they talk about their own experience being groomed and I'm obviously not going to nitpick or criticise their experiences. I will point out that one person being bad and taking advantage of you and using content to do so doesn't mean everyone is like that. I am sorry to anyone who has been taken advantage of by someone who claims they're a proshipper though. There are people who have turned out to be horrible on both sides.

I am ill and it's late but I want to get this up sooner rather than later so please ask for clarification on anything. I'm always up for a discussion on this topic as I do believe some of these points do have merits at times and that this whole topic is not black and white

[mmikmmik]

When Mirabelle chews Siffrin out in Act 5, she actually does correctly touch on a huge issue in their relationship that's prominent from at least Act 3 and arguably present before the loops.

From the ISAT script project (emphasis mine):

Mirabelle: Is something wrong, Siffrin? Did something happen? Did you have a nightmare or something? Siffrin: No, of course not. Mirabelle: Then what happened, Siffrin! Because clearly something did happen!!! Otherwise, i-if nothing happened, I'll have to accept the fact that I was wrong about you!!! Siffrin: (Huh…?) Wrong about me…? Mirabelle: . . . Mirabelle: You always tease me, Siffrin. And it's fine. Everybody does. I guess I have the kind of personality where it's easy to want to tease me. But I know people don't mean it. It's how-- It's how some people make friends. And I thought it was the same for you. I thought, "It's okay, they don't mean it, it's how they are. They tease me, but they're never mean. And Siffrin never really hurts me." "Would never really hurt me." Mirabelle: . . . Mirabelle: But now you have, Siffrin! Thinking I should be alone… Telling me I should be alone… Who do you think you are, to say this to me? Acting like-- Like you know better than me!!! Always soooo mysterious, Siffrin, always talking as if you're better than me! As if you know me!!! But you don't, Siffrin!!! You're just as lost and useless as I am!!! So stop!!! Talking!!! As if you know me!!!!!!

I think it's easy to miss because so much of what Mirabelle says is off base. Because Siffrin insists "no, I really did just decide to suddenly undermine your self-confidence and trust in me out of nowhere for no reason, on the day before we're supposed to fight the King together", Mirabelle goes off that premise and rants that they must never have really cared about her or their mission. Obviously untrue. I think even Mirabelle's dialogue here is hinting that she knows on some level that this is one of her deep insecurities coming to the surface and it makes more sense if something did actually happen that Siffrin is refusing to explain.

But it is true that Siffrin acts superior sometimes. At the start of Act 3, Mirabelle sees him freaking out after his first meeting with Euphrasie and tries to comfort him. She sees through multiple attempts to laugh it off or deflect her (i.e., lie to her); she coaxes them to talk to her, she begs them to talk to her, and finally gently but seriously tells them that the group needs to trust each other and share their worries. And Siffrin's take-away from that last tactic is... "[I] know why she's asking [me] this. Poor Mirabelle can't just say it, so [I]'ll have to do it for her..." and asks Mirabelle what she needs help with, to Mirabelle's visible and uncharacteristic frustration. What condescension! Siffrin was being way nicer about it when he was in a better mental space, but he was basically doing the same thing Mirabelle correctly accuses him of doing in Act 5.

To be fair to Siffrin, they seem genuinely confused in Act 3 when Mira is trying to convince them to share with her, so I think it's more about them being repressed and inexperienced with friendship than an ego thing. But I do think ego is part of it, if only in an "I like myself better when I'm making Mirabelle happy" kind of way. Whatever's going on internally, the bottom line is that Siffrin is not treating Mirabelle respectfully as his adult peer and friend.

Of course Act 5 Mira doesn't remember that Act 3 conversation, so given how she described the behavior, I'm guessing Siffrin has done this sort of thing occasionally before the events of the game. And I think you can see some similar behavior in earlier acts. Siffrin worries a lot about saying things that might have upset or embarrassed Mirabelle, and a lot of their non-plot-related dialogue variations I can think of are trying to be more encouraging towards her. That's more of a grey area, though - I'm not sure I disagree with him doing stuff like faking enthusiasm for the sleepover idea or calling her plant cute. It's kind of a red flag in the context of everything else, but I can't really blame him for it. Even if these issues were fully present before the loops, I think Siffrin and Mirabelle could have worked past them without having to have a really awful fight like that, if Siffrin wasn't falling apart so badly. I really, really like their resolution to be "feelings buddies" as a conclusion to this character arc - yeah! opening up! mutual trust and reassurance! willingness to be vulnerable with each other! Good for them!

[hg-aneh]

Hi! I absolutely love all of your art and I’ve been fallowing you for awhile! There’s been some rumors that you ship Muriel x crowley?? Which I guess is an odd paring but nothing terrible wrong with, I was just curious if you do ship them.

Thank you for all your wonderful art <3

okay, i want to preface this by saying that I've already been harassed over this to the point of being called a lowkey pedophile and having every little move of mine scrutinized and misconstrued to sickening extents (this harassment spilled over to my partner too, and it was horrible)

so all anyone would do by doing this again would be repeating history, among other things that have to do with fucking up my already frail mental state

now.

onto the meat

yes, I ship it

no, I do not see Muriel as a child, kid, teenager, or anything of the sort and I find it personally distasteful to think of doing so because infantilizing autistic traits rubs me the wrong way (p e r s o n a l l y)

you can do it if you want to, I have worse things to worry about than a random person on the internet thinking something of a fictional character, just don't try to push your headcanon onto me just because you perceive it that way or because it's a popular dynamic that you find fun

adding onto this, i want to add that i will never and i mean fucking NEVER post anything related to that ship outside of the very specific private Xitter account i created for it

(and my personal facebook, on a friends only setting)

any Muriel & Crowley content outside of that account is all platonic and bla bla you get the gist. I can separate things, what a talent.

Now, I'm being overly paranoid and explaining myself to exhaustion over this for a very good reason and it's because last time someone found out about it ((yes we're going full circle to the beginning of this little bible)) they treated it as some sort of GOTCHA moment about me being a pedo ((and if you didn't know this already: I fucking despise children with my whole being, I'd rather be forcefed alligator shit for my whole life than be with one of those creatures for a single day))

It got to the point of that person making extremely hurtful videos about me and their little friend group comprised of goober eating toddlers joining in on the "Hater" train or whatever the hell that new cultural trend is called, as well

It was hell, that whole experience fucked me up BAD and i feel silly for saying this but it was genuinely traumatic! So- I apologize if I'm sounding confrontational here, anon, but like, this is the type of thing you have to do to keep yourself safe now, it's gone to that point and I'm in hysterics now because what the fuck

Lastly, I'd like to say this one other thing

Muriel is played by an adult actress, they are canonically the same age as Aziraphale and Crowley and are also an eldritch creature just like them

The fact that they're nice and bubbly and happen to have autistic traits doesn't suddenly make them a fetus. I have friends with the same personality type as them and I feel like it'd be dumb to treat them like zygotes knowing they're adults with body hair and debt

Again, if you see them as one, I'm literally no one to judge, I'm 1.49, you're better off taking judgement from a stupid lone penguin in the saharan desert.

But don't fuck with others for thinking otherwise, it's not a moral issue to disagree with a headcanon, please. 🥲

[heavyhitterheaux]

Treat You Better Preview

“Urb, here me out. Why are you so against this? I like Y/N and I'm 98% sure that she likes me back and I'm good enough for her! I'm not like these other dudes out here that don't deserve her. I know and you do too that I'm going to treat her like she deserves.” Jack expressed as he pleaded his case. He knew that it would eventually come down to this.

"You are literally the biggest WHORE that I know of. Ain't no way in HELL. She's been off limits from the beginning and you know that."

"Look who's talking! We're adults now and she can decide for herself who she wants to date." Jack quickly shot back looking at his best friend in disbelief.

"Her track record says otherwise. She's my godsister and I'm going to do what I need to do in order to protect her."

"But from me? Protect her from me? Do you hear yourself right now? So you’re going to shelter her for the rest of her life?”

"Especially from you. I've seen your track record too with relationships and she's not someone that you hit it and quit it. And I’m not sheltering her. I’m protecting her from no good assholes.” Urban replied keeping his voice low in the hopes that you wouldn't hear him.

"I'm not going to do that with her and did you low key just call me an asshole? You know how important she is to me!” Jack was now fuming and shaking his head at him in disbelief.

"Like I said. She's my baby sister and I said no. I don't give a fuck about how you feel. End of discussion.”

“The fuck it is. We can agree to disagree.”

As Urban was getting ready to respond, you walked in the room beaming, holding Jack’s dog CoCo in your arms.

“Jack Jack, are we ready to go?” You asked as you scratched behind her ears.

“Where are you two going?” Urban asked while getting a slight attitude.

“Jack promised me an ice cream date with just the two of us. Since we couldn't do it yesterday.” You responded and Urban shot Jack the evil eye while all he did was come closer to you.

“Are you two okay? You both look tense.” You asked looking at both of their faces and Urban couldn't help but to blurt it out.

“I don't want you dating Jack.” Was all he said and you looked at him dumbfounded.

“Well Urby, that isn't for you to decide. I can date whoever I want. But I would at least think that you would approve of me dating your best friend.”

“I don't want you to get hurt.”

“Jack would never hurt me in a million years and you need to get that through your head and get over it. We mean a lot to each other and I would think that you would be happy. You don't want to see me happy?”

“Yes! Of course I do, but…”

“But what, Urban?”

“He thinks that I'm going to use you essentially and when I get what I want, leave you high and dry. Oh and also said that I'm the biggest whore he knows.” Jack finally spoke up and you looked at Urban who simply shrugged.

“I've seen him do it countless times before and he's not a relationship type of guy.”

“Urban, I love you with all of my heart, but until I ask you for your opinion, stay out of my love life. I am tired of you coddling me like I can't take care of myself. I'm not a baby anymore.”

“Fine, but when he cheats on you and breaks your heart remember that I warned you. Oh, and don't come crying to me because all I'm going to do is say I told you so.” Urban replied as he walked away bumping Jack’s shoulder on purpose but he decided to ignore him.

“Urby!”

“Nope, don't want to hear it.”

“URBAN HENRY WYATT!”

“Enjoy your date.”

As he walked off, you turned back to Jack Who could tell that you were clearly upset.

“Just give him some time. He'll come around.” Jack told you as he kissed your forehead, but he wasn't quite sure if he believed those words himself.

[myfairkatiecat]

okay so shannon giving us a keefe pov seems actually lowkey important and what i would do in the story rn but I'm not convinced she's going to use it to do the things I feel like we need her to do.

let me explain.

Shannon set Sophie up as a character who behaves certain ways. A lot of those ways are very good, and she's certainly a hero, but she also has character flaws that get worked through. For example, she can be a little reckless (personally I would have made all the same choices) (I know we think of Keefe as the reckless one but he's a different type of reckless) she can prioritize the wrong things, she can be disorganized, etc (all things that are super valid and understandable and make her relatable btw. I am a sophie foster defender)

and BECAUSE sophie is the protagonist, we see all of this develop. She has certain qualities that are a little stagnant sometimes, at least if you look from the outside, but there's actually a ton of development going on. She hears others' opinions on her actions, good and bad, and the reader sees how this impacts her and how she grows and changes, even if that change is nonlinear or in many ways she stays the same and just grows more mature.

Here's the thing about Keefe. he wandered out of side character territory and into second main character territory starting at the end of everblaze and peaking in legacy. And Shannon has been INTENTIONALLY writing him with consistent character flaws since the beginning, explainable by his past circumstances in fascinating ways. But we aren't there to see a lot of the falling out for that stuff.

A lot of people complain that keefe never faced consequences for stealing the caches or never had the black swan or adults yelling at him or mistrusting him or his friends avoiding him. And like... we do not know that. It could simply be that that was just not Sophie's problem at the time. Sophie also may have simply not been one of the people giving him a difficult time about it. In fact, we know she wasn't, but boy oh boy Fitz certainly didn't bounce back in less than five seconds. And we don't know what the Council and/or black swan did with him that sophie just wasn't involved in--and bc it didn't become relevant to the plot from sophie's perspective, sophie being the actual MC, it just seems unimportant.

Another thing is that Keefe has a lot of the same character flaws throughout the series, but they do shift somewhat with his experiences, and that's without us even seeing in his head, you know? So here's the thing.

Shannon went and started developing Keefe like a second protagonist (who is interestingly also an anti hero in some ways) and even if you aren't a person who thinks he's the most developed character on the paper (disagree but see where you're coming from) he's DEFINITELY most developed in shannon's brain, and that bleeds through. But then we ONLY see Sophie's perspective BECAUSE THIS IS SOPHIE'S STORY, and everything revolves around what is relevant to the plot from her perspective, and then keefe is just in the background being extremely important and relevant and having all these extra issues that we ONLY ever see from sophie's perspective.

Unlocked was... well, it was half a book, and only half of it was keefe. I actually do think his perspective was enlightening in some ways, but a full keefe book at this point kind of seems necessary to me. Because... he's taken on the role of another main character in this story, but we don't see any of that development happening, and for a lot of people i can see that getting taxing. Now I get that those same people also wish keefe would just. step back from the plot. and i get that! but I think with the way he's involved in the plot NOW, seeing his perspective is important, because sophie's POV (especially with her unreliable narration) doesn't give us enough of a window into the complexity that is keefe's worldview right now, especially with all the ways he keeps impacting things. it's just a really important perspective to have at this point.

Shannon, if unraveled is just keefe trying different human foods and giggling like a kotlc react on wattpad, I will probably enjoy it bc i love your work always, but i will also be shaking you by the shoulders because we need this book and you better spend it doing the things we need

[turbulentscrawl]

In the poly post you said that ithaqua is as close as it get to a yandere may I ask why you think that ? Or any headcanons related to that if that's okay with you (sorry if the English is bad )

As luck would have it, Ithaqua is one of the few Hunters I think I have a decent grasp on rn so I was also able to crank this out quickly! (To my other request-ees: I'm working on HC requests for several other characters rn! I should have them ready to spam-post sometime this weekend <3)

So here's some general and sfw relationship hcs for Ithaqua ;)

-A first small note, his exact age is not listed, but he’s described as a “young adult,” so I imagine him to be somewhere between 18-22.

-Ithaqua is a man who has entirely rejected society. He wants nothing more to do with it, with anyone, and any instance of breaching his territory is met with wind-swift punishment.

-It all fits when you consider the major events of his life. He was abandoned in a snowstorm, left for dead, because he was thought to be a devil. He was saved and raised by a “witch,” a kind woman who stood outside of society’s norms and was feared and hated for it. Their solitary home was trespassed on in the night, defiled, and his mother was kidnapped, tortured, and broken by a man with his exact face. Every small bit of comfort he ever had was destroyed by a mirror image of himself that was raised in “civilized” society. If that doesn’t cement the idea that people from that world can’t be given a chance, I don’t know what would.

-And I think on some level he questions the reality of it all. Did he do it? Did he destroy his own life? Was his so-called brother actually a copy of himself? Was Nathaniel supposed to be the better or the worse version? Was he himself evil before…or is he evil now? None of it matters in the long run, though. His only remaining goal in life is to defend his home and his mother’s resting place from interlopers. But he does get this distant, sour expression sometimes when he contemplates these things.

-I think he’s close to an as-is yandere because, if we assume he’s still capable of bonding with someone on a genuine level, that person would be a one true exception to his otherwise all-consuming distrust and hatred for society. He could not be “led to water”, so to speak, even by a partner who exemplified everything good left in the world. He’s just not capable of making that leap anymore.

-So again, he’s territorial, and that would 1000% extend to a partner. He’s not a master and you’re not his pet, but god would he try to keep you in his clutches. Use every sweet word and convincing anecdote in his arsenal to convince you to stay in the forest. The thing that keeps him from being all-out controlling is that his mother let him make his decisions for himself. She taught him how to survive in the wilderness, and she taught him about the rest of society, and she let him decide for himself if he ever wanted to get involved in it. He didn’t of course, because how could a place that shunned his mother be good for him? You deserve to make those choices too, even if he disagrees with what you pick.

-He will, however, watch you like a hawk. To not sugarcoat it, he’ll stalk you. Ithaqua wants to be prepared for the moment everything goes wrong. The moment he knows for certain will come, when you see he’s right about other people. When that happens, he’ll swoop in to save you. He refuses to be late again, like he was for his mother.

-He doesn’t leave the forest unattended often, but when you spend longer stints at your home in a village, you’ll notice the weather gradually becoming worse and worse. It seems to snow every day, and the wind is so harsh that walking outside is deafening and blinding. When you return to visit Ithaqua, the village mysteriously returns to its normal weather patterns.

-Ithaqua hates when other people interact with you. No one is no one is safe enough, trustworthy enough for him to not worry for your safety. They don’t deserve to even stand near you. But he won’t do anything until they do…or you say he can.

-Anyone he takes as a partner would have to remind him of his mother, at least a little. She’s the only example he has of a “good person” so he’s not likely to give people with divergent personality types much of a chance. He’s also more likely to trust a woman over a man, by a small margin.

-He won’t stand for being doted on or babied by anyone other than his mother or partner. he won't fall for other people's faux-gentleness! Don’t you know who he is? What he is? Call him cute or pitiful again and your blood will stain the snow red.

-His lips are always chapped to hell and back, sorry. Sharp kisses only for you.

[joonipertree]

How Mikey Loves and Proposes

Okay so some of my headcanons for him align with my beliefs however I am very particular about characterisation so I'm gonna keep it balanced.

Genuinely i think Mikey does not need the paperwork, the title or official testimonies to consider himself your husband. Once he has sort of outgrown 'boyfriend', like maybe he's in his mid to late 20s, he wants a new title because boyfriend was very highschool.

Imagine every single thing a couple could be, it has been done. Shared apartments, pets, joint bank accounts. I genuinely think because of how devoted Mikey is with his people, he would be just as devoted to his partner.

He is a people person, he finds his people and he keeps them close to his chest no matter what happens. He has forgiven his people for the unforgiveable. Very very ride or die type of person. So out of everyone, he is devoted and loyal.

I will say, in cases of fucked up timelines...chances are he would either keep you at an arm's length, push you away and disappear or just be cold. He does this because he considers himself a danger. I don't care if he has hurt his friends, I dont care about dark impulses, that man would never lay a hand on you. Dark impulses are strong, his love for you is stronger.

If he does run away, he will never look at another person ever again. Loyal as fuck.

But we are talking about final timeline so LETS GO.

At some point, he just wants matching wedding rings, he just wants people to look at you and then look at your left ring finger and be like 'oh fuck, they're taken'. You're already his, ya'll probably have matching bracelets or necklaces that he bought with his very first paycheck. But he really craves that moment where you call him 'husband'.

He probably felt connected to you in an everlasting sense from the moment ya'll started dating. This commitment was from the soul from the get go.

So why does it take like 6 to 7 years into the relationship to get married? Firstly I just have a general rule that marriage should come after 5 years minimum because it's paperwork and a big process. You can disagree and just add in your own minimum but again...adding that no matter what, ya'll live together, wake up every morning together, build a future together. At some point, you guys are too busy getting jobs, being adults and hanging out with friends to be like 'ooooo marriage'.

How does Mikey propose?

i think it was spur of the moment, maybe it hit him that OH ya'll arent married and suddenly he has the urge to say it.

And one night, it's 2am and you wanna go on a night ride and he never says no to you so he wraps you in one of his jackets and both of you head on a ride.

And it's peaceful and maybe Mikey is having a moment where he's like 'I have died, been reborn and saved multiple times for this moment. I am meant to be alive so I could be with my person. I'm very happy I am alive.'

And he's blinking back tears, stopping close to a convenience store..using snacks as an excuse to stop.

And while he's walking through the place, grabbing his usuals and your favourites...maybe it's the fluorescent lighting or the way you're picking out the drinks, maybe it's because how you look in his clothes or because it's late and you're here with him getting snacks, maybe he is sleepy and warm that he says:

"I wanna be your husband."

And the place is too quiet to not hear it, the cashier is like 'what the fuck dude, you're gonna get smacked for proposing like that' but you look at him and his teary eyes and lovesick smile and you're just speechless. But you move forward to hold him, he wraps his arms around you and presses you close to him. It's warm and engulfing.

And maybe you give an excited 'yes' or maybe you make a joke about where your ring is or maybe it's a soft whisper of an answer...in any case....the answer had been given way before he had even asked it.