#I think Moths are the perfect trans symbol

[just-a-little-moth]

I am not a boy, but I do like to reblog

one thing to know about me is that i am a boy who likes to reblog

[chatnoirismycinnamonroll]

Alternate Ending to Mayura/ Song fic

I get a lot of inspiration from songs, so I'm probably going to have a lot of fics based on songs, such as this one and my previous one, Only Human, which many of you have already read. Thank you for reading. Enjoy the fic :)

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Disclaimer: I don't own, and never will own, Miraculous Ladybug or any other songs my fics are based on. Inspired by I'm Still Here from Jem and the Holograms.

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It seemed like the battle was over. Chat Noir and Ladybug were groaning on the floor, having been beaten physically by Hawkmoth. He was still red, since Ladybug wasn't able to take away his cane successfully and shatter it. The other akumas had them surrounded, but Hawkmoth kept them at bay. He wanted an audience that would laugh and point along with him when he succeeded in taking the heroes' Miraculouses. Hawkmoth smirked as he stepped towards the heroes, watching them try and fail to crawl away from him.

"You both are no match for me. You are still so young, so inexperienced. You still dont know how to keep your transformations. You're sad excuses for heroes. Not only did you fail to protect Paris..." Hawkmoth stood over Chat Noir, and Ladybug's eyes widened as he reached down towards her partner. "...you even failed to protect each other from me."

Hawkmoth grabbed his hand, ready to pull his ring off, when a small red body collided into him, shouting "Don't you dare touch him!"

"M'Lady, no, wait!"

"Get off me, you stupid girl!"

"Chat!"

"Cataclysm!"

"NO!" Hawkmoth cried out in anger as Chat turned his cane into nothing but dust. He watched as his red akuma fluttered out. He reached out to grasp it, only for a red yoyo to soar over his head and conceal it within its healing light.

He felt the red bubbles envelop him as he watched the purified butterfly fly out of the yoyo and his anger grew with every flutter of its wings. He reached behind him towards the spotted heroine and finally grasped her and pulled her off his back, holding her by her neck as she kicked in pain and defiance while he threw that blasted yoyo away from her grasp. He leaned in close to her ear, and whispered menacingly:

"You may have won the battle, but you have not won the war. I wonder if this wingless Ladybug can fly."

His voice held nothing but cold anger, and Ladybug's eyes widened as she felt the flex of his arm as he quickly drew her back and threw her over the side of the railing.

"LADYBUG!"

The sound of her body hitting the landing 50 feet below them echoed in Chat Noir's ears, and he rushed to the edge as fast as he could. His emerald eyes glimmered with tears and dulled with pain and grief as he saw her motionless body lay on the metal landing, not a sign of life coming from her closed blue eyes. He couldnt feel anything. His eyes went blank as he desperately tried to shove down the pain of losing someone he loved (again!), but the anguish practically glowed form his cat-like eyes.

Hawkmoth could see the pain, and like any moth, he was drawn to it. But he still had uses for the boy, so akumatization wouldn't be so ideal. But a boy filled with hate for his loved one, and everything she cared about, would be perfect in destroying the city she loved to protect. He would be the perfect minion.

Chat's eyes widened as he heard the sound of a string being pulled, and he turned around to see Kim, akumatized regularly back into Dark Cupid, and a black rose hitting his chest. His vision enveloped into black, and he knew no more.

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"Dupain-Cheng! Wake up! Ugh, you better not be dead or I swear on my Miraculous I WILL sting you."

"Chloe-"

"Its Queen Bee, Cesaire. Get it right, fox."

"Everyone knows who you are, Chloe, since you were the one who gave up your identity on your first day, so it doesnt really matter what I call you, now, does it?"

"Its for the principle here that matters!"

"Girls, now is not the time! We need to do something! Marinette, dude, please wake up."

"Shes not going to wake up, Nino! She's, she's-!"

"Still alive." Marinette groaned out, her head pounding as she finally got her eyes to open.

"Marinette!" Marinette cried out softly as she got crushed between two bodies, but it didnt last because a third person pulled them off and slapped her arm none too gently.

"Ow! Chloe!"

"That, Dupain-Cheng, is for daring to have been my hero all this time without telling me or your friends and for almost dying today. I'd consider giving you the gift of hugging me for your comfort, but I dont want your bloody lip getting anything on my designer jacket." Chloe sat back down with a huff, looking away with bright red cheeks as the trio of heroes looked at her in shock.

Marinette finally chuckled and smiled when it drew Chloe's attention. "Thanks, Chloe. I'll try not to die anytime soon, and I might, might, take you up on that offer for a hug. If you're nice."

Chloe made a disgusted face that made everyone laugh. Marinette's chuckles, however, died down at her sudden realization that something, or someone, was missing.

"Um, guys? Where exactly are we? And where's Chat Noir?"

Their chuckles died down at Marinette's questions. The trio looked at each other, trying to decide who would be best to tell her. Chloe rolled her eyes, but kept her eyes averted nervously as she spoke.

"Well, Dupain-Cheng...Marinette, Foxlya and Ninopace decided it would be such a brilliant idea to shove us all into a storage closet in my daddy's hotel while your mangy alley cat and Big, Bad and Unfashionable destroyed Paris."

Marinette stared at Chloe, silent with shock. Alya waved a hand in front of her face, but she still didnt react.

"Um...Mari?"

"He...they...what? Chat would never-!"

Nino spoke up, his voice tinged with a grim determination. "Oh, we know. Dark Cupid got to him first. I guess seeing you fall 50 feet and then lay motionless must have left him emotionally vulnerable, dude."

Alya looked sadly at her best friend as she looked down at the covers, her fists clenching and unclenching with her troubled thoughts. Marinette might not have known who Chat Noir was, but it was obvious that she loved him almost, if not just as much as she loved Adrien.

"So, you guys know. Then where's...?"

"Shes eating and resting in the other room. She was panicking about you, so we sent her with our kwamis to calm her down. You want to call her in?"

"That sounds just like Tikki. Always worrying about me." Marinette smiled fondly to herself before looking up at Alya. "Bring her in, Alya. I want to make sure she's also fine with the fall."

Marinette watched Alya stride towards the door, her hand reach towards the handle, but flinching back as a little red goddess phased through the door and rushed at Marinette.

"Marinette! Oh, I'm so glad you're alright! I was so worried it was all so sudden, I wasnt sure my magic would cushion your fall in time!"

Mari's blue eyes twinkled with joy and exasperated fondness as Tikki snuggled up to her cheek, worrying all the way. "I'm fine, just a little sore, I think. It still surprises me that I can survive a fall that high in the suit."

"Yeah, but please dont make it a habit."

Marinette smiled, but she turned serious as she once more pondered their situation. The look on her face finally destroyed any doubt her friends might have had that Marinette wasnt Ladybug.

"Marinette?"

"We need to capture Hawkmoth once and for all, but we cant do it alone. We need Chat Noir back. No offence guys, but you're still fairly new to working with me. And I need someone who really gets my way of thinking. Chat is that person, and i wouldn't trade him for anyone, or ever leave him at the hands of evil. Once we get Chat, Hawkmoth is going to have a hard time without all his other akumas."

Alya, Nini, and Chloe smiled eagerly, and leaned forward. "We're in."

"Great. We'll start immediately. But first, I need to get up and trans-augh!" Marinette fell forward as a sharp pain flashed through her abdomen, but Alya caught her before she hit the ground.

(Start playing I'm Still Here from Jem and the Holograms)

"Marinette, you need to move carefully! You literally just survived a life-threatening fall." Alya scolded Marinette as she helped her stand fully. Marinette smiled thankfully up at her, and looked down at Tikki. Her heart started beating faster.

"Ready? You think we can do this?"

"Of course, Ladybugs have always won. You can do this. It's written in the stars."

Marinette called on her transformation as she walked towards the door, her steps gaining confidence as she thought, "It's not over. I've still got fight."

Part of her worried over Chat Noir, wondering if she would be able to draw him from the darkness like last time. And she promised herself that Hawkmoth would pay for taking her kitty.

She looked at her team, so brave to rise after being broken. They didnt know what was coming, but they'd face it head-on.

She opened the door, and saw nothing but flames. Paris was up in flames, and it felt like her heart was burning with it. She looked at her team, and together they took the leap, falling before catching themselves, and she felt the familiar rush that told her "I'm still here." They ran across the non burning buildings, the flames licking them when they leapt over the burning ones.

They headed towards the Eiffel Tower, and she could see the height differences between the landings, and felt the ghost pain of falling, and a fire to defeat Hawkmoth once and for all. He was standing there, with Chat Noir at his left, a small collar around his neck, like a symbol that Chat belonged to Hawkmoth.

Ladybug's eyes narrowed. She ducked under a burning arch as they snuck up onto the landing. Oh, hell no. That's her kitty. He just crossed a line, and she's taking her kitty back.

"CHAAAAAT!!!!" She cried as she launched herself at him. His lips were black again, but Ladybug was not going to spend almost an hour chasing him again. Her lips crashed against his, and she rolled with him as Carapace shielded her while Rena and Queen Bee attacked Hawkmoth and Dark Cupid.

Her kitty's eyes were like fiery waterfalls. His tears burned her as she saw his pain at thinking she was dead.

"I'm here, you stupid Chat."

"My Lady?"

"Who else? Now, let's get that Miraculous."

They rushed into the fight, Hawkmoth's face whitening at seeing her still alive.

'I'm still here.'

"This isnt possible! You're supposed to be dead! You should be gone."

"And yet, I'm not. I'm still here. And I'll always be here, as long as you continue to terrorize people, Chat Noir, Rena Rogue, Queen Bee, Carapace and I will still be here to take you down! You cant win against us, Hawkmoth, and you can never get rid of us. You tried, and you failed.

I'm still here."

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I'm just going to leave this here. If anyone actually wants to write the ending in which they defeat Hawkmoth, that's cool. I just kept hearing that song come up in my playlist and thought, this is a great comeback song. Like, you cant defeat us, no matter how hard you try.

I'm still here.

@mindfulmagics @drarrylover007 @zoe-oneesama @marionettedupaincheng @lunian @un1cornf1ghter @dreamteaze

[bibliophilicwitch]

Morpheus // Μορφευς

A revival polytheist’s introduction to working with Morpheus including mythological background, Hellenic (Greek revival/recon polytheism) basics, and a starting point of offerings, prayers, and spells for the Shaper of Dreams.

M Y T H O S

The Oneiroi are dark-winged daimones of the underworld and are the personification of dreams. They are able to take the form of animals at will and are said to leave Erobos each night like a flock of bats. The Oneiroi leave Erobos from one of two gates, either the gates of horn which emit prophetic, god-sent dreams, or the gates of ivory, which emit false dreams without meaning.

Parentage and siblings depend on which of the Greek or Roman epics, essays, or plays one refers to. In Hesiod’s Theogony, the Oneiroi are the children of Nyx by parthenogenesis while in Cicero’s De natura deorum, they are the children of Nyx and Erebos. In Hesiod’s Theogony, they are the siblings of Hypnos while in Ovid’s Metamorphoses, they are the children of Hypnos and Pasithea.

In the Metamorphoses Ovid gives the names of three of the Oneiroi including that of Phantasos, who takes the form of inanimate objects in prophetic dreams, Phobetor, the god of nightmares, who can take the form of beasts and monsters, and Morpheus, the god of dreams, who can take the form of men and is seen to be tasked as a messenger to the gods.

Ovid, Metamorphoses 11. 585 ff (trans. Melville) (Roman epic C1st B.C. to C1st A.D.) :  "[Hera commands the messenger Iris summon Dream :] ‘Iris (Rainbow), my voice’s trustiest messenger, hie quickly to the drowsy hall of Somnus (Sleep) [Hypnos], and bid him send a Dream of Ceyx drowned to break the tidings to [his wife] Alcyone.’  Then Iris, in her thousand hues enrobed traced through the sky her arching bow and reached the cloud-hid palace of the drowsy king [the God of Sleep] … Around him everywhere in various guise lie empty Somnia (Dreams) [Oneiroi], countless as ears of corn at harvest time or sands cast on the shore or leaves that fall upon the forest floor.  There Iris entered, brushing the Somnia (Dreams) aside, and the bright sudden radiance of her robe lit up the hallowed place; slowly the god his heavy eyelids raised, and sinking back time after time, his languid drooping head nodding upon his chest, at last he shook himself out of himself, and leaning up he recognized her and asked why she came, and she replied : ‘Somnus (Sleep) [Hypnos], quietest of the gods, Somnus, peace of all the world, balm of the soul, who drives care away, who gives ease to weary limbs after the hard day’s toil and strength renewed to meet the morrow’s tasks, bid now thy Dreams, whose perfect mimicry matches the truth, in Ceyx’s likeness formed appear in Trachis to Alcyone and feign the shipwreck and her dear love drowned. So Juno [Hera] orders.’  Then, her task performed, Iris departed, for she could no more endure the power of Somnus, as drowsiness stole seeping through her frame, and fled away back o'er the arching rainbow as she came. The father Somnus (Sleep)  chose from among his sons, his thronging thousand sons, one who in skill excelled to imitate the human form; Morpheus his name, than whom none can present more cunningly the features, gait and speech of men, their wonted clothes and turn of phrase. He mirrors only men; another forms the beasts and birds and the long sliding snakes. The gods have named him Icelos; here below the tribe of mortals call him Phobetor. A third, excelling in an art diverse, is Phantasos; he wears the cheating shapes of earth, rocks, water, trees–inanimate things. To kings and chieftains these at night display their phantom features; other dreams will roam among the people, haunting common folk.  All these dream-brothers the old god passed by and chose Morpheus alone to undertake Thaumantias’ [Iris’] commands; then in sweet drowsiness on his high couch he sank his head to sleep.  Soon through the dewy dark on noiseless wings flew Morpheus and with brief delay arrived at Trachis town and, laying his wings aside, took Ceyx’s [ghostly] form and face and, deathly pale and naked, stood beside the poor wife’s bed. His beard was wet and from his sodden hair the sea-drips flowed; then leaning over her, weeping, he said : ‘Poor, poor Alcyone! Do you know me, your Ceyx? Am I changed in death? Look! Now you see, you recognize–ah! Not your husband but your husband’s ghost. Your prayers availed me nothing. I am dead. Feed not your heart with hope, hope false and vain. A wild sou'wester in the Aegaeum sea, striking my ship, in its huge hurricane destroyed her. Over my lips, calling your name–calling in vain–the waters washed. These tidings no dubious courier brings, no vague report: myself, here, shipwrecked, my own fate reveal. Come, rise and weep! Put on your mourning! Weep! Nor unlamented suffer me to join the shadowy spirits of Tartara (the Underworld).’  So Morpheus spoke, spoke too in such a voice as she must think her husband’s (and his tears she took for true), and used her Ceyx’ gestures. Asleep, she moaned and wept and stretched her arms to hold him, but embraced the empty air. ‘Oh wait for me!’ she cried, ‘Why haste away? I will come too.’  Roused by her voice’s sound and by her husband’s ghost, now wide awake, she looked … but found him nowhere … She cried, ‘… He is dead, shipwrecked and drowned. I saw him, knew him, tried to hold him–as he vanished–in my arms. He was a ghost, but yet distinct and clear, truly my husband’s ghost, though to be sure his face was changed, his shining grace was gone. Naked and deathly pale, with dripping hair, I saw him–woe is me!’"  [N.B. Ovid uses the original Greek names for the three gods of dreams.] – Theoi.com

Sources (further reading): Oneiroi (Theoi.com), Morpheus (Theoi.com), Oneiroi (Wikipedia.com), Morpheus (Wikipedia.com), Phobetor (Wikipedia.com), Phantasos (Wikipedia.com)

U P G

UPG is an acronym for unverified personal gnosis and refers to interactions with entities that are not supported by the original mythos. Here I explain what I have found deities tend to expect and how I recommend starting a relationship with Morpheus.

There is a general consensus by revivalist or reconstruction polytheists that deities prefer to be honored in a modernized equivalent of how they were honored in their ancient culture – though this certainly isn’t the rule. Some deities are more specific and demanding than others while some really do not care. Morpheus has been found to be rather easy-going though he really prefers at least an attempt and, the more effort given to that attempt, the happier he is. The term used for the reconstruction/revival of the ancient Greek religion is called Hellenismos and more information can be found below.

Building a relationship with a deity is where one often starts to part with traditional lore and become influenced by others’ and one’s own UPG. So while you use the framework of Hellenismos for your worship, you use the UPG of others, and later your own, to form connections to build upon with the deity. Starting a relationship with a deity is a complicated business and often varies from person to person, but when I am asked how to start, people are often asking me about ways to approach Morpheus. I recommend starting with a small offering to Him. This post includes a list of associations for Morpheus, suggested offerings, and spells that can be used to offer and/or honor Him. I also recommend musing over what Morpheus means to you in your spiritual and personal development (Is he a messenger? Is he a teacher for astral travel, lucid dreaming, etc? Is he a symbol of hope for you to encourage you to reach for the stars and dream big? Is he a symbol of escapism? Is he just a god of dreams?).

Quick while still on the topic of UPG. When I first started working with Morpheus there was very little available to me. I ended up considering that as the god of dreams it would follow that daydreams would also fall to him. Daydreams are our fantasies and dreams. Those fantasies and dreams can spark some amazing art and writing or drive us to achieve the futures we dream up, so I often associate Morpheus with the arts and see Him as one of our biggest supporters in finding the strength and courage to achieve our dreams.

H E L L E N I S M O S

Hellenism 101 Pt 1 & Pt 2

Miasma, Katharmos and Preparing for the Gods

On pollution and purification

Purification in Hellenismos

Basic Hellenic Offering Ritual

On Khthonic Worship

Greek Phrases for Worship

A S S O C I A T I O N S

Epithets: Μορφευς, Morpheus, Shaper of Dreams, Sandman, Mildest of the Gods, Balm of the Soul (Ovid p. 165), Oneiros, Kai’Ckul, Lord L’Zoril, Shaper of Forms, Lord Shaper, Prince of Stories (The Sandman, Neil Gaiman), Dream Giver, Sleep’s Guest, Lord Shaper,  Father of Dreams, Lord of the Night, He Who Tells Mortals Stories, Formshaper, Shadowmaker Animal: Cats, Fireflies, Moths, Butterfly*, Racoons*, Wolves*, Crows Colors: Black, Blue, Gold, Purple, Silver, Red Crystal: Amethyst, Herkimer Diamond, Scolecite*, Hematite*, Lapis Lazuli* Celestial Body: Moon Day: Night Direction: West Element: Water Incense: Opium, Lavender Moon: New Number: 6*,7* Plant: Chamomile, Dandelion (in seed), Lavender, Poppy Season: Winter Sun In: Pisces Rules: dreams, daydreams, lucid dreaming, meditation, astral travel **, imagination, creativity, inspiration, wishes, encouragement, communication, divination Other: feathers, wings, skeleton keys, stars, night, horn, ivory, tea, baths, sweet coffee

NOTE: A lot of this could actually work as associations for Hypnos, the Onoirei, Ikelos/Phobetor, Phantasos, and some could work for Nyx. Additionally this was originally posted to my old blog now an archive.

* Notes items not listed in lore or shared with other followers of/workers with; feel free to reblog to add personal commentary ** Depending upon one’s understanding on the astral; some may have an understanding that wouldn’t work with associating the astral with dreaming.

D E V O T I O N S / O F F E R I N G S

track your dreams on a calendar

keep a dream journal

get enough sleep

turn off your electronics one hour before bed (gets you in a deeper sleep faster)

perform an evening ritual

learn/practice lucid dreaming and/or meditation

write a letter to Morpheus before you go to sleep

herbs/teas associated with calmness, sleep, or dreaming

crystals/gemstones/minerals associated with dreams

stardust / dream sand

sleep-inducing herbs/flowers/etc

prophetic herbs/flowers/etc

horn and/or ivory (as in the horn/ivory gates thing)

wing/feather related things

sleep-related things (pillows, etc)

prayers

spells

playlists

M I S C

Personal Experiences

Morpheus and Dream Catchers

F O L L O W E R / D E V O T E E S

bibliophilicwitch

dreamingthedoe

Hermaiondiaktoros

kaesdeliveryservice

keysandtorches

nebulouswitch

nihilistic-void

nowitssovivid

occolteyes

oneiropoloi

orriculum

samuel-brien

stormsandsage

E - S H R I N E S

dreamingofmorpheus

midnightandpoppies

the-dream-king

[heilewelt]

“Is it good to be satisfied?” - An Interview With Kellermensch

There are not many bands I’ve missed as much as Kellermensch in the last couple of years. They released their s/t debut in 2011, disappeared for a few years and now returned with their amazing second album “Goliath”. It was about time. Seeing them on stage the day after our interview was one of my most favourite moments of 2017, the same intensity I loved back in days. One that I’ve never found in any other band. 

Six years ago singer, guitarist Sebastian Wolff, guitarist Jan V. Laursen and I sat down in a cold, grey conference room of Universal Music, this time I spoke to Sebastian, John V. Laursen (upright bass, guitar) and I enjoyed a very interesting conversation (as always) over some coffee and cake at my favourite coffee place in Berlin, the Ramones Museum. The rest of the band, Jan, Claudio W. Suez (bass), Anders Trans (drums), Christian Sindermann (vocals, organ) and more, waited around until Sebastian played a very special “acoustic” gig. The difference between the interview places is also a little symbol for the many changes the band went through in the last couple of years. Only one thing remained: a certain amount of hopelessness at the beginning. But read yourself.

Dörte: Are you David?

Sebastian Wolff: In a way, I guess. The title “Goliath” was something I suggested early on.

John V. Laurens: It gave more sense later on.

S: The further we got in the process of making this album, which was very difficult, the title became  more and more fitting. I think in the end it felt like the album is the rock we throw against Goliath. In a way the band is David and the making this album felt like facing a giant. It was an uphill battle.

It's also what it sounds like. When I looked at the lyrics the title could have been found at the end of the process as well. It's always a bit like a small person fighting for love, for being accepted the way he is and so on.

S: I think that's true. It might be surprising it was suggested early on and it became so filling. A lot of the lyrics involve a struggle somehow to get love or recognition or just to get by. That's what the album is about: the feeling of being underappreciated.

J: This struggle has always been a theme in our inspirational sources. We looked at different bands, even in Rock and in Metal it's a theme. We love bands like Rage Against The Machine, even the band name displays the same struggle, defying the giants. It felt good and right.

S: I think also it was the literature that we read. When we started the band we wanted...

The album still fits your band name.

S: We wanted to be able to write about every day stuff and still do it a way that is dramatic and intense. I think we succeded on this album with writing about every day stuff. We're not writing about revolution or war or any political stuff. Some of our heros, including Dostojewstij who wrote the book “Notes From The Unterground”, do this excellantly. They write about how they see the world and their lives.

(...and there are still two members missing on the photo...)

I felt this album is unlike the first album closer to me in a way that it's simpler written.

S: I'm glad that you say that because when we started working on this album we had very few hopes or goals that we wanted to archive. One of them was to write songs with a clear character who appears in the songs. If we can do it that way we can have a character like in the movies or in a book. That was one of the things we wanted on this album: To have a clearer character that the audience can relate to. We speand a lot of time on the lyrics and on the athmosphere of the songs.

When we looked at our debut album it happened sometimes by chance. When we started writing the lyrics for this album I had to remind myself and Christian and Anders and whoever helped writing the lyrics that we needed to play with open hands. Sometimes when you write movie lyrics with metaphores you can loose the audience but they can still feel the athmosphere but they don't really know what they're singing about. We wanted to avoid that and make sure that we play with open cards and people know what we're singing about. So, I'm happy that it translates to the audience.

I remember when you wrote the first album you said that the band was like a hopeless project in the beginning and everything was really hopeless because you're so different and then there were years of nothing where I checked you Facebook and stuff and I thought you gave up without telling anyone. And now your back and being rather big in Denmark.

J: Yes, it's also a good thing to be a bit different from all the others. Now we're maybe the dark horse that the festivals can take in. That fits our role pretty good and it feels comfortable.

S: I think the process of writing this album was so difficult that I remember thinking that we need to reach the point where everything is hopeless because maybe that's where we feel most productive. And then start to rebuild it. We definitely hit that level of hopelessness writing this album. But then releasing it in Denmark was surprising because there was a lot of positive feedback. People were really happy to hear the album. And then again now is the first time – we never really fit in – but now in Denmark Rock is so out of fashion that we look around and wonder where all the other rockbands are. We've been away for 5 years and now they're all gone. It's really strange. Here in Germany there are a lot of Rock bands around. We did an interview in Copenhagen and he asked 'What is it like returning after all these years?' And I told the story when we went to England to do a showcase in 2010 and a journalist who saw us compared us to the band playing on the Titanic. Coming back after 5 years with a new album feels like being that band. All the other rockbands are leaving the boat trying to get off.

You've never been in a certain genre. I never really considered you a rock band, I always thought of you as a band.

J: Many of the reviews from Germany are from Metal sites. They include us there but it's out of our hands really. Some think it's Indie. There's growling, there's rock music, there's comtemporary, there are classical instruments.

S: I think we never tried to think about genres. I think part of the success it due to the fact that there is no competition with bands that are playing distortion guitars and real drums anymore. A lot of Danish bands are electrionic which is cool and it also leaves more room for us.

What I found funny listening to this album is that the further you listen the more growling is happening until “Moth” where it's almost nothing else. It's like a theater play.

J: It's quite systematical for many of the songs. There is a huge force in having Christian growling, especially in the end parts it's a climax. It makes it more dramatic.

S: I think it's true that on the debut album each song had it's curve but on the new album it's the whole album.

Was it something you planned when you wrote the album?

S: No. I remember I spoke to Christian about it and we suggested that we take that approach. We had the songs ready and thought about how can we fit them together. What if it becomes more and more dramatic? Maybe have an exit where we drive off the cliff and then there is only the closer which sounds like everything has been falling apart now.

J: I remember talking to Michael who had another take on it. He asked some guys how to do it when you put it on vinyl. It's a bit of a different story what is first, what is second and when you flip it to the b-side it supposed to be something powerful as well. He had some technical thoughts about how to do it.

S: It made sense. There was on thing that was deliberate from the beginning: We wanted the songwriting to be in the focus when we worked. On the debut album we were all in the room so we all play on every song. We wanted to challenge that and let the song dictate who plays. We did that intensely that when our guitarist Jan wrote the chords for the first song “Bad Sign” we arranged it so uncompromisingly that we removed his guitar. There is no guitar on it although it was his song. We wanted the song to have the perfect arrangement regardless of the band.

Especially because it is so inviting when you're such a big band to use everything you have every time.

S: That was an approach we had from the beginning which let to a lot of the songs like “The Pain of Salvation”, “Bad Sign” and “Atheist in a Foxhole” not having growls on them but it wasn't a deliberate intend to have less growl. I remember we spend months trying to work out songs that were heavier and “Moth” was actually a song that took quite a bit of work. We really wanted this album to have this edge and I think I would have liked to have more with the time we had and the inspiration we had....

You mean the six years?

J[joking]: Great. We needed more time...[we all laugh]

S: The way that the songs don't have every bandmember on it that was deliberate from the beginning but the have this curve something that was just like playing Tetris when we did the track list.

J: We're still refining songs. We have a new sound engineer who is really talented and who has an a approach of the live feel. Sometimes he asks if we would like to change small parts like less gain on the guitar or something like that, so the track would fit better live.

Also, it often looks odd when someone leaves he stage because he has nothing to do. I know bands who do that quite well like Archive. They can be just four on stage or six, seven people. It always changes.

S: I remember the first time I saw Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds in Copenhagen. There were like 14/15 people on stage. It blew my mind. I think there were two or three piano players and when they had nothing to do they just sat around smoking cigarettes. That was very cool.

J: It's a funny thing - this activity to be on stage. Kellermensch played three or four shows before I joined the band but I know that you [looking at Sebastian] switched instruments a few times. Sebastian would play organ or something. He switched places. Some bands can do it. I know Arcade Fire does it all the time. It didn't work out for us. That's why we made a new constellation.

S: I have no time on stage to do anything. Last night we played in Hamburg and we had a band called Paul opening. Somebody turned my setlist upside down while the first band was playing. Then we went onstage and I never had time to flip the page around because I'm so busy trying to tune guitars, change guitars...so if I had to change instrument it would be too much.

I'm really looking forard to see you again because you're one of the most intense live bands I've ever seen. I remember the last gig I've seen from you quite vividly. I don't know many bands that are like you, perform like you.

S: I'm actually very happy that you say that. I remember when we started playing I think we often played when nothing really worked. The sound was shitty, there was always this feeling...

The sound can be shitty but the thing what it depends on is you and your presents on stage and that's amazing.

S: We didn't have a way of doing it that was controlled. It's still not controlled but now we feel we get to where we want to go. I think it always felt like we do something differently. I remember in the beginning when we got off stage there was never any 'oh, I didn't play that fill the way I wanted to', it was always like 'it wasn't interesting'. The question we always had was: Is this interesting? That's what we always chased. Later we had a bit more time to think. Now we try to say 'Ok, we're doing the chaos, can we do something to make sound a bit better?'

J: We also have time to see the audience and how they react and correspondent to reactions from the stage. And now we can think how can we do it differently.

S: In the beginning it was just chaos. Nobody really know what is happening.

J: We only knew it was a good night when Sebastian had a bloody hand or something like that. Then it was a good night.

One thing that is very close to me are the being heartbroken angry songs on the album. Were you so heartbroken angry or did you just know so many people who were?

S: I was heartbroken angry. I actually went through a break up during the process of making the album. In order to write the lyrics you search for something that works and sometimes you don't really have a rulebook or instructions. You just have to fumble around in the darkness to stumble upon something. I think “Bad Sign” was the first lyric that I wrote and I remember thinking that it was surprisingly close to what I was experiencing. Sometimes I wondered if it's this simple to write down something that happened a month ago and then boom, it's interesting reading. It was an ambition for the album to make it personal but I was actually surprised how personal you to have write to make it personal. You have to go very close to something you have experienced to achive that.

Do you still relive the situation you wrote about nowadays or is it too far away now?

S: It's very surprising. I still remember the first time I was heartbroken like it was yesterday. For a songwriter women become this assembly of all the women you have met, all the women you know. Sometimes it becomes very personal. It's not really pointing at something specific but it's still connected somehow.

J: I don't know if you thought about it in the process of making songs but a few days ago I read a passage that Bruce Springsteen wrote about writing an album - being specific or being not too specific – it still has to be a story that everyone can relate to. It can't be too specific. It also has to be something people can relate to and think that could easily be my life. There is room for the story to unfold to the audience so they can relate to it.

Even with a song like “Mediocre Man” I can relate to it although I'm a woman and it's funny since it's a different gender.

J: It's not the sex or the identity that it's about.

S:  I get the feeling that it can be surprising.

A lot of songs are using “you” and “I”, there is not gender in there and then you have something that is specificly man related it's sometimes funny when you feel it reflects yourself as a woman.

S: But it's funny about the songs being personal. I remember writing “Bad Sign” and thinking sometimes you write better when you know what the song is going to be about but sometimes you don't. At some point I thought this song is defintely about a break up but it's also about getting older, being ready for settling down and then having that being ripped apart. Realising that you're not in control of your life. These things happen. I thought the good sentence in this song is the last one “Funny thing about freedom is once you look for it/ Inside of a cage is where you're gonna find it” but when we released the song the one sentence where everyone told me “that get's me” is one of the first verses “As I walk past your window and I didn't peek”. That one was pretty personal because she lived - the woman I broke up with is now my wife and we have three kids – on a second story apartment. I always passed her appartment on the way to the studio. It was very close to me and an experience I had. That's just something you write. That was the one sentence that most people were like 'That gets me' or 'I've experienced that'. That's very funny. Sometimes the portion of a lyric that you think that's the good one sometimes isn't.  What I can learn from that is: Sometimes going closer and more personal connects more with an audience than being clever or well worded.

And then you can be funny, mentioning yourself in a song. In the context were you mentioned it it's again a very hopeless situation. I really had to laugh when I realized the lyrics the first time, especially considering our first interview.

S: Something that might have completely drowned or not translated to the audience is another goal we had was to introduce a slight bit of humour. But I think when we release the album no one was laughing. A lot of people said to me that listening to the album hurts and it's painful to listen to. “Carring my Name” was a funny little song we had to... [we laugh]

J: It has kind of dance to it...

At least I found one bit of humour. I think your music is always heavy on the feelings for me and finding a bit of humour in there is funny.

S: But that was also something we wanted to do because I always think when you just have minor chords and sadness all the way through you need a breathing hole.

J: A lot of the tunes have these sad verses and choruses and then there are these parts which are kind of uplifting or getting on. Positive things, not only the dark side.

It's not only dark...

J: Full of despair.

...it's also angry but also anger management after a broke up. It's like saying you're missing out not having me. That's what half of the album is telling me.

S: It's very funny because this feeling of being underappeciated... one of the good things about being a songwriter is that it's therapeutic that you can exorcise your demons. One of the big fears in life is not having your loved returned, so that's a great inspiration for me. It's a good metaphor for feeling like an underdog. I remember seeing an interview with Woody Allen. He said that he basically archived all of his dreams. He made all the movies he wanted to do, he wrote all the books that he anted to write and he played concerts in all of the great concert halls but then he finished the sentence with 'Why do I still feel like I got screwed?' It says something about that it maybe is not the life that you live, maybe it's the mindset, that if you have a hungry personality and a soul that wants a lot of things then you will sometimes feel that way.

You never reach the point of being 100% satisfied, maybe 98% on good days...

S: But the you focus on the two missing percent, feeling screwed. There is something beautiful about that in the sense of  'what do you do when you reached the end?' It's the end then.

J: Is it good to be satisfied?

S: The discribtion you see in a cartoon of heaven for cats where milk flows like water and the mice a slow. That's hell. A cat can't be a cat. It's all over. I think in a way it's healthy to be at least a little bit angry and frustrated because it shows that you're still hungry and alive. That was deep. [we laugh.]

Will it get any better than this?

J: Wait 8 years for our third album.

No, you're not allowed to another six years for the next album.

S: I think we're very happy being where we are right now. We are actually recording new songs already and we basically had the time to hit rock bottom and then say let's get back to the things that are important. Now we focus a lot more on having fun being in a band. With the first album we got to a point were everything was stragegic, everything was 'what are gonna do?'. Working with major labels were everything was a strategy. Now we just focus on leaving out the noise and do the things we want to do and play the shows, tours and festivals we want to and videos that we want to do but always try to remember 'what is the artistic point in doing it?'. Don't just do a video to promote the song, do a video to do something with it. The same with the shows. Don't just go and play a hundert shows just to play a hundert shows. You have to have the room to breath to do something with every show.

J: Last night we played Molotow and it was really great playing a sort of smaller venue. It had some limitations on stage in space and sound but it made it all very real and more dramatic and explosive. It was quite nice to get on the ground again.

I'm looking forward to see you tomorrow at the Musik & Frieden. I'm quite curious how you'll fit the stage there if you already didn't fit on the one from Lido.

J: Sebastian actually stood on the floor in many German venues.

S: We did that last night spontaneously. We started out with me on the stage and all of a sudden Claudio was pushing everything. He knocked over the upright bass and it fell down. I thought I had to go down on the floor. But I like these shows. There was no lightning guy so the light was just constantly on. It's been a while since we played these kind of shows but I like to do it. I think that's one of the first obstacles that you have to break through when you're in a band. The first one is going into a room, nobody knows you, nobody cares, the lights are ugly and the sound is shit and then then you still have to do something to get the audience attention. Sometimes being away from that a couple of years might make you less able to do it. We doing it again now and it's fun. You have to take the room and shake it.

J: Fight for it.

I remember you like having obstacles.

S: Yes, definitely. We want to know where the limit is and then balance on that limit. Sometimes we fall over and the show is shit and everything is chaos but sometimes you can balance. It's still sounding pretty good and being interesting and then balance there. Those are the best shows.

J: Sometimes it's the small things that make it a bit more interesting for people. Yesterday when Sebastian went on the floor he accidently hit the mic stand and it flipped 360° and it landed on the floor and two guys in the front just dropped their jaw and were kind laughing. It was landing perfectly. They laughed and shoke hands and were like 'that's cool'. It's the small things that can makes something rememberable.

I remember you're having a thing going on with microphone stands being broken...

S: Doing different things also helps to do something new. We played in a big music hall, room made for classic music, so everyone sits down. We had to play only 30 minutes because it was a festival and I just remember it was surprisingly easy. The room had about 1800 seats. We went on and only 30 minutes, so we just wanted to get started and played all the fast songs and the heavy songs in a row. People were 'woah'. We just had to get onstage and say boo. When we played Roskilde Festival on the Arena stage where 1500 fit in it was really difficult. You go boo and everybody is like 'did someone say something?'.

J: Silence.

S: You just can't attack the room because it's so big. You have to think and put a lot of effort into the setlist to activate a room that size.

J: Even the phsical distance is a problem. There is quite a lot of space between the audience and the stage. We tried the opposite also. We played a 360° stage. There were people all around you. That was fun. Guitars were dropping off stage and people helping putting them back up on stage. It was kind of interacting.

It's good especially considering how much stuff gets stolen these days.

S: After I played one or two shows my guitars are worthless anyway.

J: Damaged goods.

Thank you for the interview, John and Sebastian!

If you haven’t got it already, go and get their second album “Goliath” now. You’ll find comfort in pain.

Thank you for reading,

Dörte

P.S. We haven’t changed at all, have we?