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heilewelt · 7 years ago

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“Is it good to be satisfied?” - An Interview With Kellermensch

There are not many bands I’ve missed as much as Kellermensch in the last couple of years. They released their s/t debut in 2011, disappeared for a few years and now returned with their amazing second album “Goliath”. It was about time. Seeing them on stage the day after our interview was one of my most favourite moments of 2017, the same intensity I loved back in days. One that I’ve never found in any other band.

Six years ago singer, guitarist Sebastian Wolff, guitarist Jan V. Laursen and I sat down in a cold, grey conference room of Universal Music, this time I spoke to Sebastian, John V. Laursen (upright bass, guitar) and I enjoyed a very interesting conversation (as always) over some coffee and cake at my favourite coffee place in Berlin, the Ramones Museum. The rest of the band, Jan, Claudio W. Suez (bass), Anders Trans (drums), Christian Sindermann (vocals, organ) and more, waited around until Sebastian played a very special “acoustic” gig. The difference between the interview places is also a little symbol for the many changes the band went through in the last couple of years. Only one thing remained: a certain amount of hopelessness at the beginning. But read yourself.

Dörte: Are you David?

Sebastian Wolff: In a way, I guess. The title “Goliath” was something I suggested early on.

John V. Laurens: It gave more sense later on.

S: The further we got in the process of making this album, which was very difficult, the title became more and more fitting. I think in the end it felt like the album is the rock we throw against Goliath. In a way the band is David and the making this album felt like facing a giant. It was an uphill battle.

It's also what it sounds like. When I looked at the lyrics the title could have been found at the end of the process as well. It's always a bit like a small person fighting for love, for being accepted the way he is and so on.

S: I think that's true. It might be surprising it was suggested early on and it became so filling. A lot of the lyrics involve a struggle somehow to get love or recognition or just to get by. That's what the album is about: the feeling of being underappreciated.

J: This struggle has always been a theme in our inspirational sources. We looked at different bands, even in Rock and in Metal it's a theme. We love bands like Rage Against The Machine, even the band name displays the same struggle, defying the giants. It felt good and right.

S: I think also it was the literature that we read. When we started the band we wanted...

The album still fits your band name.

S: We wanted to be able to write about every day stuff and still do it a way that is dramatic and intense. I think we succeded on this album with writing about every day stuff. We're not writing about revolution or war or any political stuff. Some of our heros, including Dostojewstij who wrote the book “Notes From The Unterground”, do this excellantly. They write about how they see the world and their lives.

(...and there are still two members missing on the photo...)

I felt this album is unlike the first album closer to me in a way that it's simpler written.

S: I'm glad that you say that because when we started working on this album we had very few hopes or goals that we wanted to archive. One of them was to write songs with a clear character who appears in the songs. If we can do it that way we can have a character like in the movies or in a book. That was one of the things we wanted on this album: To have a clearer character that the audience can relate to. We speand a lot of time on the lyrics and on the athmosphere of the songs.

When we looked at our debut album it happened sometimes by chance. When we started writing the lyrics for this album I had to remind myself and Christian and Anders and whoever helped writing the lyrics that we needed to play with open hands. Sometimes when you write movie lyrics with metaphores you can loose the audience but they can still feel the athmosphere but they don't really know what they're singing about. We wanted to avoid that and make sure that we play with open cards and people know what we're singing about. So, I'm happy that it translates to the audience.

I remember when you wrote the first album you said that the band was like a hopeless project in the beginning and everything was really hopeless because you're so different and then there were years of nothing where I checked you Facebook and stuff and I thought you gave up without telling anyone. And now your back and being rather big in Denmark.

J: Yes, it's also a good thing to be a bit different from all the others. Now we're maybe the dark horse that the festivals can take in. That fits our role pretty good and it feels comfortable.

S: I think the process of writing this album was so difficult that I remember thinking that we need to reach the point where everything is hopeless because maybe that's where we feel most productive. And then start to rebuild it. We definitely hit that level of hopelessness writing this album. But then releasing it in Denmark was surprising because there was a lot of positive feedback. People were really happy to hear the album. And then again now is the first time – we never really fit in – but now in Denmark Rock is so out of fashion that we look around and wonder where all the other rockbands are. We've been away for 5 years and now they're all gone. It's really strange. Here in Germany there are a lot of Rock bands around. We did an interview in Copenhagen and he asked 'What is it like returning after all these years?' And I told the story when we went to England to do a showcase in 2010 and a journalist who saw us compared us to the band playing on the Titanic. Coming back after 5 years with a new album feels like being that band. All the other rockbands are leaving the boat trying to get off.

You've never been in a certain genre. I never really considered you a rock band, I always thought of you as a band.

J: Many of the reviews from Germany are from Metal sites. They include us there but it's out of our hands really. Some think it's Indie. There's growling, there's rock music, there's comtemporary, there are classical instruments.

S: I think we never tried to think about genres. I think part of the success it due to the fact that there is no competition with bands that are playing distortion guitars and real drums anymore. A lot of Danish bands are electrionic which is cool and it also leaves more room for us.

What I found funny listening to this album is that the further you listen the more growling is happening until “Moth” where it's almost nothing else. It's like a theater play.

J: It's quite systematical for many of the songs. There is a huge force in having Christian growling, especially in the end parts it's a climax. It makes it more dramatic.

S: I think it's true that on the debut album each song had it's curve but on the new album it's the whole album.

Was it something you planned when you wrote the album?

S: No. I remember I spoke to Christian about it and we suggested that we take that approach. We had the songs ready and thought about how can we fit them together. What if it becomes more and more dramatic? Maybe have an exit where we drive off the cliff and then there is only the closer which sounds like everything has been falling apart now.

J: I remember talking to Michael who had another take on it. He asked some guys how to do it when you put it on vinyl. It's a bit of a different story what is first, what is second and when you flip it to the b-side it supposed to be something powerful as well. He had some technical thoughts about how to do it.

S: It made sense. There was on thing that was deliberate from the beginning: We wanted the songwriting to be in the focus when we worked. On the debut album we were all in the room so we all play on every song. We wanted to challenge that and let the song dictate who plays. We did that intensely that when our guitarist Jan wrote the chords for the first song “Bad Sign” we arranged it so uncompromisingly that we removed his guitar. There is no guitar on it although it was his song. We wanted the song to have the perfect arrangement regardless of the band.

Especially because it is so inviting when you're such a big band to use everything you have every time.

S: That was an approach we had from the beginning which let to a lot of the songs like “The Pain of Salvation”, “Bad Sign” and “Atheist in a Foxhole” not having growls on them but it wasn't a deliberate intend to have less growl. I remember we spend months trying to work out songs that were heavier and “Moth” was actually a song that took quite a bit of work. We really wanted this album to have this edge and I think I would have liked to have more with the time we had and the inspiration we had....

You mean the six years?

J[joking]: Great. We needed more time...[we all laugh]

S: The way that the songs don't have every bandmember on it that was deliberate from the beginning but the have this curve something that was just like playing Tetris when we did the track list.

J: We're still refining songs. We have a new sound engineer who is really talented and who has an a approach of the live feel. Sometimes he asks if we would like to change small parts like less gain on the guitar or something like that, so the track would fit better live.

Also, it often looks odd when someone leaves he stage because he has nothing to do. I know bands who do that quite well like Archive. They can be just four on stage or six, seven people. It always changes.

S: I remember the first time I saw Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds in Copenhagen. There were like 14/15 people on stage. It blew my mind. I think there were two or three piano players and when they had nothing to do they just sat around smoking cigarettes. That was very cool.

J: It's a funny thing - this activity to be on stage. Kellermensch played three or four shows before I joined the band but I know that you [looking at Sebastian] switched instruments a few times. Sebastian would play organ or something. He switched places. Some bands can do it. I know Arcade Fire does it all the time. It didn't work out for us. That's why we made a new constellation.

S: I have no time on stage to do anything. Last night we played in Hamburg and we had a band called Paul opening. Somebody turned my setlist upside down while the first band was playing. Then we went onstage and I never had time to flip the page around because I'm so busy trying to tune guitars, change guitars...so if I had to change instrument it would be too much.

I'm really looking forard to see you again because you're one of the most intense live bands I've ever seen. I remember the last gig I've seen from you quite vividly. I don't know many bands that are like you, perform like you.

S: I'm actually very happy that you say that. I remember when we started playing I think we often played when nothing really worked. The sound was shitty, there was always this feeling...

The sound can be shitty but the thing what it depends on is you and your presents on stage and that's amazing.

S: We didn't have a way of doing it that was controlled. It's still not controlled but now we feel we get to where we want to go. I think it always felt like we do something differently. I remember in the beginning when we got off stage there was never any 'oh, I didn't play that fill the way I wanted to', it was always like 'it wasn't interesting'. The question we always had was: Is this interesting? That's what we always chased. Later we had a bit more time to think. Now we try to say 'Ok, we're doing the chaos, can we do something to make sound a bit better?'

J: We also have time to see the audience and how they react and correspondent to reactions from the stage. And now we can think how can we do it differently.

S: In the beginning it was just chaos. Nobody really know what is happening.

J: We only knew it was a good night when Sebastian had a bloody hand or something like that. Then it was a good night.

One thing that is very close to me are the being heartbroken angry songs on the album. Were you so heartbroken angry or did you just know so many people who were?

S: I was heartbroken angry. I actually went through a break up during the process of making the album. In order to write the lyrics you search for something that works and sometimes you don't really have a rulebook or instructions. You just have to fumble around in the darkness to stumble upon something. I think “Bad Sign” was the first lyric that I wrote and I remember thinking that it was surprisingly close to what I was experiencing. Sometimes I wondered if it's this simple to write down something that happened a month ago and then boom, it's interesting reading. It was an ambition for the album to make it personal but I was actually surprised how personal you to have write to make it personal. You have to go very close to something you have experienced to achive that.

Do you still relive the situation you wrote about nowadays or is it too far away now?

S: It's very surprising. I still remember the first time I was heartbroken like it was yesterday. For a songwriter women become this assembly of all the women you have met, all the women you know. Sometimes it becomes very personal. It's not really pointing at something specific but it's still connected somehow.

J: I don't know if you thought about it in the process of making songs but a few days ago I read a passage that Bruce Springsteen wrote about writing an album - being specific or being not too specific – it still has to be a story that everyone can relate to. It can't be too specific. It also has to be something people can relate to and think that could easily be my life. There is room for the story to unfold to the audience so they can relate to it.

Even with a song like “Mediocre Man” I can relate to it although I'm a woman and it's funny since it's a different gender.

J: It's not the sex or the identity that it's about.

S: I get the feeling that it can be surprising.

A lot of songs are using “you” and “I”, there is not gender in there and then you have something that is specificly man related it's sometimes funny when you feel it reflects yourself as a woman.

S: But it's funny about the songs being personal. I remember writing “Bad Sign” and thinking sometimes you write better when you know what the song is going to be about but sometimes you don't. At some point I thought this song is defintely about a break up but it's also about getting older, being ready for settling down and then having that being ripped apart. Realising that you're not in control of your life. These things happen. I thought the good sentence in this song is the last one “Funny thing about freedom is once you look for it/ Inside of a cage is where you're gonna find it” but when we released the song the one sentence where everyone told me “that get's me” is one of the first verses “As I walk past your window and I didn't peek”. That one was pretty personal because she lived - the woman I broke up with is now my wife and we have three kids – on a second story apartment. I always passed her appartment on the way to the studio. It was very close to me and an experience I had. That's just something you write. That was the one sentence that most people were like 'That gets me' or 'I've experienced that'. That's very funny. Sometimes the portion of a lyric that you think that's the good one sometimes isn't. What I can learn from that is: Sometimes going closer and more personal connects more with an audience than being clever or well worded.

And then you can be funny, mentioning yourself in a song. In the context were you mentioned it it's again a very hopeless situation. I really had to laugh when I realized the lyrics the first time, especially considering our first interview.

S: Something that might have completely drowned or not translated to the audience is another goal we had was to introduce a slight bit of humour. But I think when we release the album no one was laughing. A lot of people said to me that listening to the album hurts and it's painful to listen to. “Carring my Name” was a funny little song we had to... [we laugh]

J: It has kind of dance to it...

At least I found one bit of humour. I think your music is always heavy on the feelings for me and finding a bit of humour in there is funny.

S: But that was also something we wanted to do because I always think when you just have minor chords and sadness all the way through you need a breathing hole.

J: A lot of the tunes have these sad verses and choruses and then there are these parts which are kind of uplifting or getting on. Positive things, not only the dark side.

It's not only dark...

J: Full of despair.

...it's also angry but also anger management after a broke up. It's like saying you're missing out not having me. That's what half of the album is telling me.

S: It's very funny because this feeling of being underappeciated... one of the good things about being a songwriter is that it's therapeutic that you can exorcise your demons. One of the big fears in life is not having your loved returned, so that's a great inspiration for me. It's a good metaphor for feeling like an underdog. I remember seeing an interview with Woody Allen. He said that he basically archived all of his dreams. He made all the movies he wanted to do, he wrote all the books that he anted to write and he played concerts in all of the great concert halls but then he finished the sentence with 'Why do I still feel like I got screwed?' It says something about that it maybe is not the life that you live, maybe it's the mindset, that if you have a hungry personality and a soul that wants a lot of things then you will sometimes feel that way.

You never reach the point of being 100% satisfied, maybe 98% on good days...

S: But the you focus on the two missing percent, feeling screwed. There is something beautiful about that in the sense of 'what do you do when you reached the end?' It's the end then.

J: Is it good to be satisfied?

S: The discribtion you see in a cartoon of heaven for cats where milk flows like water and the mice a slow. That's hell. A cat can't be a cat. It's all over. I think in a way it's healthy to be at least a little bit angry and frustrated because it shows that you're still hungry and alive. That was deep. [we laugh.]

Will it get any better than this?

J: Wait 8 years for our third album.

No, you're not allowed to another six years for the next album.

S: I think we're very happy being where we are right now. We are actually recording new songs already and we basically had the time to hit rock bottom and then say let's get back to the things that are important. Now we focus a lot more on having fun being in a band. With the first album we got to a point were everything was stragegic, everything was 'what are gonna do?'. Working with major labels were everything was a strategy. Now we just focus on leaving out the noise and do the things we want to do and play the shows, tours and festivals we want to and videos that we want to do but always try to remember 'what is the artistic point in doing it?'. Don't just do a video to promote the song, do a video to do something with it. The same with the shows. Don't just go and play a hundert shows just to play a hundert shows. You have to have the room to breath to do something with every show.

J: Last night we played Molotow and it was really great playing a sort of smaller venue. It had some limitations on stage in space and sound but it made it all very real and more dramatic and explosive. It was quite nice to get on the ground again.

I'm looking forward to see you tomorrow at the Musik & Frieden. I'm quite curious how you'll fit the stage there if you already didn't fit on the one from Lido.

J: Sebastian actually stood on the floor in many German venues.

S: We did that last night spontaneously. We started out with me on the stage and all of a sudden Claudio was pushing everything. He knocked over the upright bass and it fell down. I thought I had to go down on the floor. But I like these shows. There was no lightning guy so the light was just constantly on. It's been a while since we played these kind of shows but I like to do it. I think that's one of the first obstacles that you have to break through when you're in a band. The first one is going into a room, nobody knows you, nobody cares, the lights are ugly and the sound is shit and then then you still have to do something to get the audience attention. Sometimes being away from that a couple of years might make you less able to do it. We doing it again now and it's fun. You have to take the room and shake it.

J: Fight for it.

I remember you like having obstacles.

S: Yes, definitely. We want to know where the limit is and then balance on that limit. Sometimes we fall over and the show is shit and everything is chaos but sometimes you can balance. It's still sounding pretty good and being interesting and then balance there. Those are the best shows.

J: Sometimes it's the small things that make it a bit more interesting for people. Yesterday when Sebastian went on the floor he accidently hit the mic stand and it flipped 360° and it landed on the floor and two guys in the front just dropped their jaw and were kind laughing. It was landing perfectly. They laughed and shoke hands and were like 'that's cool'. It's the small things that can makes something rememberable.

I remember you're having a thing going on with microphone stands being broken...

S: Doing different things also helps to do something new. We played in a big music hall, room made for classic music, so everyone sits down. We had to play only 30 minutes because it was a festival and I just remember it was surprisingly easy. The room had about 1800 seats. We went on and only 30 minutes, so we just wanted to get started and played all the fast songs and the heavy songs in a row. People were 'woah'. We just had to get onstage and say boo. When we played Roskilde Festival on the Arena stage where 1500 fit in it was really difficult. You go boo and everybody is like 'did someone say something?'.

J: Silence.

S: You just can't attack the room because it's so big. You have to think and put a lot of effort into the setlist to activate a room that size.

J: Even the phsical distance is a problem. There is quite a lot of space between the audience and the stage. We tried the opposite also. We played a 360° stage. There were people all around you. That was fun. Guitars were dropping off stage and people helping putting them back up on stage. It was kind of interacting.

It's good especially considering how much stuff gets stolen these days.

S: After I played one or two shows my guitars are worthless anyway.

J: Damaged goods.

Thank you for the interview, John and Sebastian!

If you haven’t got it already, go and get their second album “Goliath” now. You’ll find comfort in pain.

Thank you for reading,

Dörte

P.S. We haven’t changed at all, have we?

#Kellermensch #goliath #rock #metal #interview #bad sign #mediocre man #hopeless #denmark #concert photography #sebastian wolff #musik und frieden #berlin #Christian Sindermann #anders trans #Claudio W. Suez #Jan V. Laursen #John V. Laurens #music

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