#I also remember my mother being in this same position and saying “some people are born to call and some are born to be called”
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This reply has 2 parts. One for Op and another for anyone in a similar position who wants ideas on how to deal with it.
For Op: do not ever open the door to "what if it's me?" because it's not you. I took a glance at that door once, and my self-esteem is worth more. Some people just don't know how to keep friendships. Some people have things going on in their life ("me too, so what" shhhh). It hurts, but it's still not about people not wanting your presence, it's about them having life getting in their way. They will think about you and miss you, they just won't let you know about it. It's a pain in the ass, though and it makes me mad and sad, so I get you. In any case, it's not that they don't want your presence, it's that their life is doing things to them. "But my life doesn't get in the way of me making plans with them" and that says a lot about you and how you deal with your relationships, but it doesn't say they don't like you. Do not open the door to lowering your self-esteem or doubting yourself in any way. It's them and their life.
For anyone looking for ideas:
I have been in that position, and I still am. I came to realise, at age 34 or so, that there are a lot of things at play. One of them is not only me wanting to hang out with my friends (specifically), but also needing a social life, needing a way to fulfill my interests, doing things with people.
If people who I consider my friends do not make any effort (this means "I make 10 plans and they only make 1", for instance, I do not really keep track but you get the idea), the friendship will end. And it will end whether I want to or not. A relationship is a 2 people job, and I cannot be the one pulling all the weight just to have some company. This is hard to accept and it hurts. It helped me to think that there are other people that maybe wanted to hang out with me more but couldn't because I never spoke to them because I was busy with friends who wouldn't make plans with me, I could try my luck there.
Very often those people DO want to be my friend and to be in my life and all that: they just don't know how to*. In the meantime, I will find other people to spend time with and make friends with, and we'll see what happens. Those who want to stay and know how to do it will be there. I will call the others whenever I miss them, whenever I think of an specific plan with them, but I won't do my most socialising with them in mind.
So at some point, I prepared for "having a social life" but not "being the one making plans". Whenever I'd like to see my friends, I'd say "I am doing this thing, if you want to join me", but for most of my social life, I decided I was tired of being the organiser. I need the plan to already exist.
[A thing to keep in mind about me is: I am very used to doing things alone and I do not struggle to do things on my own. If you do struggle with this, I recommend you find a way to get used to being on your own and doing things alone, not only for the purpose of this advice, but in general in life. I can try to offer advice for this, but I may not be the best because it comes naturally to me. Message me if you want and we'll figure it out.]
So I looked for things I liked to do. I took up Portuguese, and Yoga, and painting. I spent months preparing myself mentally to not see my friends as often, because I knew it would happen. I knew it would be lonely but having plans already organised with people would aliviate it. This is very hard, and if your friends are your main support, it will be very very hard.
After some time, I told the friends I made plans with (during a boardgame night I had yet again organised): "I am tired of being the one making plans. If you make any plan and you want to invite me, I will say yes, whatever you propose, I will accept. But I won't be the one calling you because I am always the one doing it". One of the friends agreed with me. She made more efforts than the others.
During all this time, I learnt to embrace and enjoy small talk and any and all types of socialisation I could get. I made some friends along the way too because I remembered some nice people I had met that I could try to see if we could become friends. I still get angry that some of my friends don't make plans with me.
Regarding that group, I know some of the others were going through stuff, but so was I. That is a thing to keep in mind. I understand other people's lives and situations, but I have mine too. Specifically, during those years, I was severely disabled, couldn't really walk and was in great pain daily. I could keep in mind someone had anxiety, but they couldn't keep in mind I couldn't walk? I wished and still wish other people remembered that as cheerful and organised as I am, I still have problems, but well. That is for them to do.
So I went from seeing some of those friends weekly to monthly, and sometimes even less. With one friend I mainly lost contact for over a year (again, I knew he was going through stuff, but so was I and he never knew because he never asked). I was really mad at him, I even told him, he said he understood why. Still several months went by before he could get back to texting me sometimes. We are more or less in touch now, he managed to more or less came out of his shell a bit and I am very easygoing, so I made peace.
But I am now very clear that 2 people have to make the effort. Even if I make the effort 20 times and you only make it 1, you have to make it 1.
*I remember a friend who never ever proposes plans and never ever is the one to initiate contact saying "but I don't want to bother you!" as an explanation for why he never ever did those things. And it pissed me off. Do be a bother. Really. Bother me. You feel like you are nagging but you really aren't. Check your messages if you need a reminder because if you are like him, you will see a hundred messages from me and none from you. So really, bother me on purpose and make plans with me.
is anyone else always the one doing the reaching out to try and make plans with friends/inviting people to do things?
does anyone else in that position wonder if they should just stay in their room all day whenever they're off work, because it doesn't really matter, because it's not like anyone wants their presence anyway?
#op: never ever open the door to “what if i'ts me and nobody wants me”#because it's not true. it's not you. life is complicated for everyone#and it is a hard exercise. I have found myself closing that door more than once because I refused to accept it#some people really want to spend time with me and maybe I just need those people#I also remember my mother being in this same position and saying “some people are born to call and some are born to be called”#it pissed her off#for many years I liked being the one calling because I could do whatever I wanted and invite people or not#but now... it is just tiring. I need sometimes for things to be easy as well#because I also struggle. I also hurt. I also need rest.
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Levi Ackerman headcanon — (My) analysis on his intimacy
Each time I wander around Tumblr and I read about how AOT fans picture Levi in a sexual context, I see a lot of fanfictions of him being a dom and a master of sex—very dominant, rough, knows every single position in bed. Given that I respect people's personal headcanons when it comes to characters since those aren't absolutely hurtful to anyone, I felt like sharing my own headcanons on his sexuality.
If we read the manga and analyze Levi's background, there's nothing that tells us that he's a virgin or not. Unless Isayama would say he is (I don't think he specified it, correct me if I'm wrong), there's a big question mark on that matter. What I do believe is that Levi knows about sex. He is, to me, like Sheldon Cooper from The Big bang theory: he knows the basics. The media shows him as a bookworm, which leads me to think that some of his knowledge on that subject came from books that he read during his life. I do picture him as one that he began to read to fight against the picture he had about himself, as an Underground resident; later in life, he began to read because he enjoyed it and it relaxed him.
That being said, just like Sheldon Cooper approached the topic of sex, flirting and dating, Levi knows how men and women would flirt and the purpose behind it for example. He mostly sees it from his comrades and the people in the Underground, but even though he recognizes a certain flirty comment or attitude, it's just that. It's like he would talk about it like he's reading from a manual. That doesn't mean he lacks affection, he's one that always showed that he cares in his own way.
Here it comes the topic of sex. I previously stated that we don't know if Levi is a virgin or not unless Isayama makes it canon. In my honest opinion, he is. During all his life and since he was a kid living and growing up in the Underground, he mostly focused on surviving, filling his stomach and not getting physically abused (just like in the Bad Boy chapter). An important detail, however, is that his mother Kuchel was a prostitute. Now, houses in the Underground were surely cramped and small; think about when Kenny found little Levi, that house was surely small. Or even the scene in Bad Boy where he makes tea; that house most likely had a bedroom, kitchen and living room altogether. If it had other rooms, those were as small as ever. A kitchen that if two people fit inside would get stuck, or a bathroom that was a stall.
When Kuchel had her clients inside her house, I firmly believe she tried to protect her son by letting him hide somewhere. Little Levi learned to recognize the moments where his mother had to work, hiding in a spot where the men she "welcomed" there wouldn't see him or else, they'd leave and that meant no money. No lunch nor dinner. Or worse, some sick men would try to have his way with him (remember in Bad Boy when those men talked about him having the same "skills" as his mother and wanted to sell him? Also, he didn't seem to be unaware about what they were talking about. That means Levi knew about what his mom's job was).
Kuchel would teach little Levi to hide, cover his ears and wait until she was done. But sometimes, as we know, men are brutal with prostitutes. She got some violent ones, and as much as she tried to keep quiet, Levi would hear her. And when he would see how those men were doing to poor Kuchel, he got traumatized. He heard their lewd words, their slurs and curses, and that got Levi permanently traumatized. From that moment on, he would see sex as violence, pain, something hurtful. No matter if he would educate himself on the matter, the wounds would always be fresh. He got so sick of that scenery, that it was like something switched in him. With him joining the Scouts and everything he went through while being a soldier, he – of course – focused on his job and the people he unfortunately lost up until the final battle.
In terms of approach to his own sexual desires, I see him being conflicted. He's a man, a human being; he got aroused at least once, to me. But that would be it. He knows what his body is trying to tell him, but indulging in self pleasure would be just because he feels too overwhelmed by it. As if he feels itchy and needs to scratch.
He surely had women flirting and throwing themselves at him. Just like he said to Zeke, he had a few successes with ladies. But that didn't mean he slept with them; again, he could recognize he was popular and some shamelessly drooled after him. He knows what dates are (he said, somewhere in the manga, "hot titan date" which if we want to be obnoxiously meticulous, that means he knows what a date is. Oh well).
This is just a little rant and random headcanon I wanted to share after quite a long time of pondering if it was a good idea or not. Once more: that's just my personal headcanon on Levi. Feel free to agree, disagree or share your own if you want 🩵
#aot#attack on titan#snk#shingeki no kyojin#aot headcanons#attack on titan headcanons#snk headcanons#shingeki no kyojin headcanons#levi#levi ackerman#levi headcanons#levi ackerman headcanons#my headcanons#levi ackerman headcanon#levi headcanon#snk headcanon#shingeki no kyojin headcanon#aot headcanon#attack on titan headcanon
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The choiceless hope in grief
Summary: Leo Valdez has lived and died for the gods. Their war has shaped his life since he was a baby. With Gaia defeated, he sort of hopes he can finally rest. He has friends and some semblance of home to return to for the first time since he was eight years old. Just this once, he allows himself to hope the good things might stick.
But the gods aren’t done with them just yet, by the time Leo finds his way back, Jason is gone.
This time, Leo decides he’s done just taking the Fates’ bullshit lying down. If getting his best friend back means striking a deal with the gods and venturing into the Underworld… well, it’s probably not even the most reckless thing he’s ever done.
The caveat of said deal? He has to trust Jason will follow him, or his self-doubt will doom them both.
And after the life he’s lived, Leo is so intricately familiar with self-doubt that he could probably trademark the word.
Or: The only possible way for Orpheus to succeed is if he learns to think of himself as a person worth loving.
Word Count for chapter 1: ~5k
Rating: Teen and Up
So! *claps hands together* I’ve been threatening you guys with my Orpheus Eurydice valgrace fic for a while! Technically I wanted to wait to post this until I’m completely done writing the fic, and I mostly intend to stick to that! I’m only posting this now because I have a minor surgery tomorrow and I’d rather be anxious about fic related things than about the surgery in question. So, take this chapter as a preview of sorts, more to come soon-ish but probably not immediately!
A couple of important notes before we start:
-TW for suicidal ideation. It’s less Leo actually wanting to die and more his canon behavior of “I’m doing something extremely reckless that might succeed but if it doesn’t, my death is an acceptable consequence”, paired with general grief related self-loathing, but if you think you’re not in the right headspace to read about that, come back when you are or at least tread carefully. This fic pics up at the end of The Burning Maze, so especially the beginning is pretty heavy on the grief stuff.
-Since ToA is vaguely canon to this fic, Leo and Calypso are technically dating in the beginning, but they don’t really interact positively as a couple (honestly they don’t interact that much in general) and break up pretty early on. Just be aware in advance that they’re still together for a little bit.
-Fic title is from Talk by Hozier which is maybe a painfully obvious pick but it was too perfect for me not to use it.
Chapter 1: Leo and Piper have an extended sleepover
It wasn’t a discussion between Leo and Piper whether or not to go to Jason’s funeral. They came to the decision that they wouldn’t silently—or as silently as one could come to an agreement when all parties involved were sobbing.
Maybe it should have been a discussion. There was a part of Leo that worried he’d regret this later—his refusal to take this chance to say goodbye and let himself grieve.
But Leo remembered his mother’s funeral. Remembered the way his aunt Rosa had looked at him like she knew his mother’s death had been his fault. Leo couldn’t stand the thought of people looking at him like that again.
He also didn’t remember his mother’s funeral bringing him any sense of closure or comfort. He’d stood at her grave, afterwards, just as desperate and afraid and utterly inconsolable as he’d been before the funeral, except it had suddenly felt sickeningly final. The wound it had torn in his soul had kept bleeding for years, and the scars would stay forever. He didn’t need any of Apollo’s shitty oracles to know Jason’s death would be exactly the same.
At this point, Leo was pretty sure his sanity was being held together by a combination of jokes and a truly questionable amount of duct tape.
Beyond all that, though, Camp Jupiter was a battlefield right now. It would continue to be a battlefield for the foreseeable future.
Leo wasn’t a coward. It wasn’t that he didn’t want to go back and help. But one of his best friends was already in a box, and there was no way in hell he’d risk the other.
With how tightly Piper was clinging to him, maybe she was thinking the same thing.
For all his big talk about dragon escorts, Festus did most of the actual escorting on his own, occasionally torching what Leo hoped were monsters and not random public monuments. Leo, for his part, spent most of the journey crammed into the backseat of the car next to Piper, sandwiched between her and a bunch of moving boxes that seemed determined to flatten him into a Leo-shaped pancake whenever they took a sharp turn.
He’d spent so long thinking about seeing her and Jason again.
He’d talked Calypso’s ear off about them the whole journey, to the point where it had clearly started to annoy her. He’d thought about various ridiculous entrances he could make, and the fact that he’d probably get yelled at, but he’d also thought about sitting together by the campfire, sharing nachos. He’d thought about Jason hugging him so fiercely that he couldn’t breathe, and Piper cussing him out while she held him, making him promise never to do anything that reckless again.
Now Piper was actually holding him, and Leo couldn’t feel anything. There was a numbness in his chest. He wasn’t sure he had it in him to ever feel happiness again. Hell, even if he did, what was the fucking point? Every time anything even remotely good happened in his life, it got ripped away from him again.
They didn’t talk a whole lot for most of the drive. They cried until it felt like they couldn’t anymore, clinging to each other like desperate children.
Even if they’d wanted to talk about what had happened, Piper’s dad was right there, and despite the Mist usually working overtime for them, having him overhear seemed like a gamble. Or, well, maybe that was what Leo told himself. Maybe he just wasn't sure he was ready to hear it all. He still felt like he couldn’t think. He was overwhelmed to hell and couldn’t stop fidgeting.
Several hours into the trip, his stomach started grumbling. Piper dug through the bag at her feet and offered him one of her PB&J sandwiches, but Leo couldn’t eat. He hadn’t skipped a meal in forever—he’d been homeless and unsure when he’d even get access to the next meal enough times that it had been all but tattooed into his skull that he couldn’t afford to—but he couldn’t even think about eating without feeling sick. He thought about Jason. He thought about the state he’d left Camp Jupiter in and the fact that they hadn’t even been able to give the dead their proper funeral rites.
Had Leo’s help made any difference at all? Had anything he’d done in his life changed things even slightly?
Leo knew the Fates had intended for it to be fire that fell—for him to burn in a bright, hot blaze and turn himself to charcoal. But he’d refused to stay dead like a good little pawn, and now Jason was gone, and it was all his fault.
He wasn’t sure how Piper could even look at him right now, but he was beyond grateful that she was holding onto him as tightly as she did. It was the only reason he didn’t fall to pieces completely. The cog at the heart of Leo’s machine had broken in a way that made it utterly beyond repair, and now it felt like a matter of time before the whole thing came apart. Piper holding him was the only reason his remaining pieces were still functioning.
It should have been impossible for Leo to fall asleep under these circumstances, but he’d been traveling for hours and fighting before then and he’d cried out his remaining energy, so eventually, the world started to fade around him, reduced to just the sound of Piper’s breaths, until finally, those went, too.
~~~~
It would have been kinder, maybe, if Leo had dreamed up some shitty visions promising violent death and/or the end of the world. That would have been business as usual.
Instead, he dreamed of his time on the Argo II—of one of those early nights when the different groups were still getting to know each other, having a brief moment to breathe between their ridiculous tasks and saving the world.
It had seemed reasonable to catch each other up on what had happened on their end. Percy, Hazel and Frank had talked about rescuing Thanatos, and Piper, Jason and Leo had told them what had happened with Hera in turn.
This would have been a boring intel conversation at best, seeing as Leo had been there for all of their part, but they’d grabbed snacks and sat on cushions on the floor and made it a whole bonding activity. Jason had been wedged between Piper and Leo, and they’d taken turns storytelling.
And Jason had bragged. So much. But he hadn’t even had the decency to brag about himself like a normal human being. Instead, he’d talked about how capable Piper and Leo had been, somehow managing to make Leo sound like the coolest person he’d ever met. Which was ridiculous, considering he’d met everyone else on their team.
And sure, Leo made it sound like he thought he was amazing all the time, but he was exaggerating, which everyone, himself included, knew.
Jason didn’t seem to have gotten the memo, though. He had one arm wrapped around Leo the whole evening, and he got all starry-eyed when he talked.
“Leo took on three Cyclopes by himself. Three!”
“Dude, stop!” Leo had laughed, shaking his head. “I know I’m incredible and you’re blessed to be friends with me and stuff, but you weren’t even conscious for that part.”
“Still happened, though.” Jason had beamed at him. “You’re amazing, dude. I would have died about fifteen times on that mission if it hadn’t been for you. You guys should’ve seen him.”
It would have been easier if Leo had thought Jason was just trying to talk him up to the others to make them more willing to trust him after how badly he’d messed up in New Rome, but Jason wasn’t the type. He’d looked like he honestly believed every single word he was saying.
So, of course, Leo had refused to seriously deal with any of the things that made him feel.
“Sorry, Pipes, but I’m pretty sure your boyfriend is in love with me. It’s the fire powers, I’m afraid. I’m just too hot to resist,” Leo had joked instead, and Piper had untangled herself from Jason’s other side to throw Doritos at Leo, and everything had been right in the universe.
~~~~
Waking up from that, blearily blinking himself awake in the car full of moving boxes and remembering… that was a worse punch in the gut than waking up from most nightmares had been. And Leo should know. He’d had so many of those over the years that he was basically a certified nightmare expert at this point.
Leo wanted to go back in time and spend forever in that one evening, living it over and over and over again until the Fates or a temporal paradox or something eventually killed him. He wanted to hold on to what they’d been back then—the three of them together and happy and whole,back before they’d realized what the prophecy really meant.
He wanted to stay wrapped in Jason’s arm and hear him laugh at whatever stupid joke Leo came up with while he and Piper threw snacks at each other like ten year olds. He wanted to believe he could actually be the person Jason was bragging about—this invincible hero that could do just about anything and saved people’s lives.
But Leo had never been that hero. Even his sacrifice had been the selfish decision of a coward who wasn’t ready to die just yet. Jason had been their Superman. The guy who could fly and threw lightning and saved people from falling to their deaths. Jason had been the hero. And ultimately, that had been what killed him.
Leo wasn’t exactly sure what he planned to do once they got to Oklahoma. He should have been heading back to the Waystation, to give Calypso the normal life he’d promised. But he wasn’t thinking about Calypso, or the Waystation, and the thought of a normal life had gone out of the window the second he’d seen the coffin. Besides, the Waystation would mean people asking questions, wanting to know about his mission and asking him to talk about his feelings, and he didn’t want that.
The only thing Leo really wanted to do right now was not think.
By the time they got to the house, it was so late that cross-country dragon flight seemed inadvisable for visibility reasons alone, so Leo agreed to stay the night. Festus nuzzled him for a bit, got a fuel snack from the canister Leo had brought and then folded down into his million pound suitcase form for the night.
It took a little under two hours to carry all the boxes inside, which was an annoying amount of time to be carrying boxes but seemed like an absurdly short amount to move the contents of an entire life.
They spent some time in search of the necessities that needed to be unpacked, but the house was still furnished and also had running water and electricity as of a few days ago, so it wasn’t that bad.
While Piper went in search of some ancient camping gear so Leo wouldn’t have to sleep on the floor—this seemed silly to him, the floor was far from the worst place he’d ever slept—Leo asked Piper’s dad if he could help with dinner.
Tristan looked relieved at his offer, actually. He’d been staring at the assorted vegetables with a slightly lost expression, trying to hack at one of the zucchinis with a butter knife. It seemed like he was trying to remember how cooking worked and had just discovered he had absolutely no idea.
Considering how long he’d been an insanely rich guy with a personal cook, Leo guessed that actually might have been a pretty accurate read on the situation.
“You might want to try a sharper knife,” Leo suggested, which made Piper’s dad look absolutely mortified. “Try not to chop off any of your fingers, though. I think Piper’s been traumatized enough for one week.”
The words were out of his mouth before Leo could think to stop them. Tristan didn’t laugh, but at least it didn’t seem like he’d be tossing Leo out of the house over this. Maybe he realized people sometimes said stupid shit when they were grieving. Maybe Piper had just warned him in advance that Leo was like this sometimes.
Tristan just went to find a different knife, which would have maybe been concerning if he hadn’t gone back to hacking at the vegetables a moment later.
“Well, at least this one is actually cutting through the zucchinis. That’s already an improvement.”
“Yeah, I’m basically a cooking expert,” Leo said with a grin, only half-joking. He went to peel and chop up the carrots, and was done with those and about half the mushrooms by the time the poor zucchini had been hacked to bits.
“You and Piper went to school together, right?” Tristan asked after a while of them quietly chopping vegetables for the casserole, trying to make sense of things with information he didn’t have and that, judging from past evidence, probably would have made his skull crack. “You and her and Jason.”
“Yeah. We went to Wilderness school together.” Leo winced, trying not to think too hard of Jason while also trying to remember the lies they’d already told Piper’s dad. At this rate, he was pretty worried his own skull would crack, too. “Then all three of us switched to a different school. Then I was gone for a while.”
Tristan nodded like this made perfect sense, though he mostly seemed lost in thought. That was a little rude, in Leo’s opinion. If he went through all that effort to remember their elaborate setup of lies, the least Piper’s dad could do was appreciate it!
“I’m glad you’re here now, with everything that’s happened. Piper was really upset when you left,” Tristan said, still with that faraway look in his eyes. “The last few months were hard for her. Between the move and the breakup, she really could have used a friend.”
Leo promptly lost all rights to make fun of Piper’s dad and his vegetable chopping skills because at the word ‘breakup’, the knife slipped and he nearly sliced off two of his fingers.
“Fuck! Ow!” he said eloquently, trying to avoid bleeding all over the cutting board in his attempt to get to the sink. “Jason and Piper broke up?”
The question sounded absurd even to his own ears. Why would Jason and Piper break up? They’d been happy together.
Surely, Piper’s dad had to be talking about something else.
To Leo’s shock, Tristan nodded.
“A while ago, yes,” he said, but he didn’t go into details—possibly because Leo was bleeding all over the sink. “We should bandage that. Do you think you need stitches?”
“No, the cuts aren’t that deep,” Leo decided, turning on the faucet and holding his bleeding hand under the stream of cold water. Maybe he should have been more concerned about the injury, but his mind was still whirring at the thought of his best friends breaking up. Unfortunately, the cold water stung like hell. He hissed with pain. “Sorry for making your kitchen look like a crime scene right after moving in. Usually, I at least have the decency to wait a day or two.”
Because the house was a small, cozy place and Leo had not had the decency to curse quietly, Piper appeared in the doorway a moment later, an alarmed expression on her face.
“What happened?”
“I’ve been bested by a stupid potato,” Leo cursed, holding up his bleeding hand and wiggling his fingers for emphasis. He figured out immediately that this was a mistake. “Ow.”
“Stop that, dumbass!” Piper cursed, moving to stand beside him. “Sink was the right call, but you need to use soap or the cuts could get infected. Dad, any chance we have gauze lying around somewhere?”
Tristan didn’t seem to question why his daughter had immediately jumped into emergency medical treatment mode. He just abandoned the cutting board and headed for the front door.
“Not exactly sure what box our regular medical supplies are in, but I’ll get the first aid kit from the car. I’ll be right back.”
“Do we have to do the soap?” Leo whined, because fuck, that stung, but Piper nodded with a scary expression on her face, so he complied. “How do you even know this stuff? Are we sure you’re not secretly an Apollo kid?”
“I know this stuff because I’m friends with a bunch of morons who have zero sense of self-preservation,” Piper cursed, gritting her teeth. “You shouldn’t be around knives when you’re this distracted.”
“I can usually cook just fine when I’m distracted. Your dad was the one who told me you and Jason broke up in the middle of this stupid potato,” Leo said defensively. “Is that the Mist messing with him?”
That was the only explanation his mind had supplied so far that made any sense to him.
Piper shook her head. “We really did break up. That was a few months ago.”
Leo felt his jaw hit the floor.
“What the hell happened? You were together for ages. I thought- you always seemed so happy.”
“I know, but-” Piper broke off abruptly when her dad came back inside with the first aid kit. Demigod stuff, then?
Leo’s mind was racing. The breakup was a completely stupid thing to focus on, considering everything that had happened in the last few days. He knew that.
But it was easier to try and make sense of this than it was to try and make sense of the fact that Jason was gone and he’d never get to see him again.
“Is it alright if we do this somewhere else?” Piper asked her dad, taking the first aid kit from him.
“Of course. It might be easier to patch him up when you’re both sitting down, anyway.” He turned towards Leo. “Thank you for your help, but I think I can take it from here.”
Leo sent a silent prayer to whichever deity was responsible for protecting vegetables—Demeter, probably?—and gave what he hoped was an encouraging thumbs up with his uninjured hand before he followed Piper into the hallway to presumably be reprimanded some more.
~~~~ They ended up sitting on an old bed that looked like it had lived a long, miserable life and was excited for retirement, but the wooden frame thankfully didn’t break down under the weight of the new mattress or the additional weight of them sitting on said mattress. Piper explained that this had been her dad’s room when he’d lived here as a child, and that it would probably become her room now. Then she went very quiet and focused on bandaging his hand, clearly avoiding looking at him.
“It wasn’t because of me, was it?” Leo asked. The thought made him feel ill. “Please tell me it wasn’t something like, I don’t know, you two being unable to stand being around each other after what happened to me. I think I’d actually have to blow myself up again if it was.”
He tried to make it sound like a joke, but it didn’t feel like one at all. The thought that he'd managed to ruin his best friends’ relationship on top of everything else made it hard to breathe.
When Piper shook her head, it felt like a whole boulder was lifted off his shoulders.
“I actually think we would have broken up sooner if you hadn’t gone missing. We leaned on each other a lot after you disappeared. It wasn’t until we realized we wouldn’t find you and things started to settle down a little that I had time to think. And when I did…” Her voice went very quiet, and she still didn’t look up at him. “I realized I wasn’t happy in the relationship. I don’t think I ever was.”
“How did I not know that?” Leo wondered quietly. “I just… you two seemed happy to me. What kind of garbage best friend am I?”
Piper shook her head. “It isn’t your fault. I was telling myself I was happy for a long time. It’s almost- sometimes I wonder if I was charmspeaking myself. That maybe I kept saying I was in love with Jason until I convinced myself I actually was. And with Hera and my mom setting it up… I love-” her voice caught in her throat, and Leo felt like maybe he needed to throw up, “-loved Jason, but not like that.”
“Pipes, I’m really sorry.” Leo squeezed her shoulder. “That sounds like it was super hard for both of you.” Leo felt awful about the fact that he hadn’t even been around to comfort either of them, but it wasn’t like he could fix it now. It was just another item on Leo’s unending list of epic screwups he’d never be able to make up for.
“Jason was… well, he took it exactly like I expected him to. He was surprised, but he didn’t get angry or anything. He mostly seemed okay. Part of me wonders if maybe…” But whatever Piper had been thinking about, she seemed to decide it wasn’t important. “It was hard to get a proper read on him, and as nice as he was about it, things were still super awkward after. I'm terrified he died thinking I didn’t care about him.”
And then she was tearing up again, and Leo thought he would shatter if she cried.
“He knew you cared,” he said as earnestly as he could manage, pulling Piper to his chest again. “You love way too annoyingly for him not to have known. Hell, even I know you love me, and we both know I’m a fucking nightmare when it comes to this stuff.”
“I missed you so much,” she whispered, wrapping her arms around his back like it was the easiest thing in the world.
“Oh, I’m about to make you regret saying that,” Leo said, forcing himself to smile. “I’ll bring it up each and every time you say you find something I do annoying.”
“You’re annoying as hell, but you’re still my best friend.” He could feel her tears dripping onto his shoulder, and he knew that would make him start up again too. “I don’t know how I’d do this without you.”
And well, passing away from dehydration after crying too much would be a really lame way to die the second time, but everything was just too much right now, so if that was how he went, Leo wasn’t sure anyone could blame him.
~~~~
For the next couple of weeks, Leo stayed.
Helping Piper and her dad unpack was the perfect way to keep himself occupied and not have to think. Usually, a mundane task like this probably would have driven Leo nuts. But right now, it was a bit of a godsend—if not literally, at least figuratively. Being productive was always so much easier when it was done in order to avoid something you wanted to do even less. There was a reason his spaces in the foster homes had only ever been tidy when he had exams coming up.
He helped cook, too, and Piper’s dad became increasingly less garbage at it the longer this went on—like muscle memory was finally kicking in after years of disuse.
It was mostly good—listening to Piper reminisce about trips she’d taken with her dad and where she’d gotten the weird variety of items she kept in her room. When they weren’t unpacking, Leo and Piper played video games or watched movies or explored the area. Twice, during the night, they took Festus on a little flight to a nearby fast food place. Finding a parking spot was a bit of a nightmare, unfortunately. Leo would submit a complaint about their inability to accommodate celestial bronze dragons the first chance he got.
The first time they tried hiking—Leo didn’t even like hiking, he’d spent enough time outside for several lifetimes, why did he do this to himself—they got hopelessly lost in the woods, and of course, due to demigod bullshit, neither of them had brought a phone, so Google Maps wasn’t an option. It was probably for the better. The last thing that situation needed on top of them being lost was a monster attack.
They were already jokingly planning out their new life in the woods when, thankfully, a girl their age came to their rescue.
“A human being! Thank the gods. The squirrels weren’t talking to us,” Leo greeted her, which had Piper shout “Please ignore Leo!” loudly from the branches of the tree she’d been climbing.
The girl lifted her head, spotted Piper and promptly burst out laughing.
“What in the world are you doing up there?”
“Trying to get a better vantage point,” Piper sighed, making her way back down the tree. “We’re hopelessly lost.”
“Well, nice to meet you, hopelessly lost. I’m Shel,” the girl said, still grinning. Leo decided immediately that he liked her.
Piper had almost made it back down when she somehow missed a branch and fell the rest of the way. In comedic movie fashion, Shel moved before Leo had the chance to and caught her mid-tumble. “That was a bit of a dramatic way to get my attention, but you’re cute, so I’ll allow it.”
“Oh yeah, Piper’s got a bit of a thing with falling for people that way,” Leo commented, and Piper gave him her most murderous look while she got back on her feet.
“You guys need help getting back?”
“Please, yes,” Piper said immediately. “It turns out we’re both garbage with maps.”
“Maybe you just need a tour guide next time,” Shel suggested, winking at Piper, whose face turned scarlet. Leo wasn’t even mad about being the third wheel for once. He’d give her so much shit about this later.
And he did. And then Piper properly came out to him—no label or anything, mostly as extremely confused but sure she liked girls, which also made a few additional pieces click into place regarding her breakup with Jason. She ended her anxiety-riddled explanation by thanking Leo for being so normal and annoying about all this.
Which was how Leo realized he’d apparently never told Piper he was bi.
Or maybe he had, and it had gotten lost along with their other memories of Wilderness. Stupid memory-stealing babysitters.
Well, at least they got to hug about it now.
~~~~
It was strange how normal some days felt when nothing would ever truly be normal again. When in every moment Leo and Piper spent together, the gaping hole that had been ripped into their trio was so blatantly obvious.
The benefit and problem of this friendship was that Leo and Piper were both experts at not talking about things they were struggling with.
This wasn’t exactly news. From what little Leo did remember of Wilderness School, they’d spent months not talking about his mom, or about the fact that Piper’s dad kept canceling their weekend plans. They’d both known there were things left unsaid, but as long as they’d been able to cheer each other up, that hadn’t really mattered. It made sense, honestly. Put two people who hadn’t had a shoulder to cry on for ages in a room together and see what happens!
Right now, this meant they were expertly ignoring the box of belongings Piper had picked up from Jason’s school. It had been pushed so far under the bed during that first night that it was no longer visible, and neither of them made any effort to move it out of its new home since. They ignored the topic of Jason, period, until it inevitably hit them in the face again.
It was mostly dumb shit that set them off. Piper automatically reaching for vanilla ice cream at the grocery store because it was Jason’s favorite—seriously, who in their right mind even liked vanilla ice cream?
Sometimes, Leo would make a joke and burst into tears instead of laughing because he knew it would have cracked Jason up. They found old photos unpacking. One time, Piper’s dad suggested they make tacos and they started simultaneously bawling their eyes out.
Leo had spent a long time exactly like this—pretending everything was normal and okay when it wasn’t either of those things until he inevitably broke down. Then he’d started to actually feel sort of okay whenever he was with Jason and Piper. Now, he was sure he would spend the rest of his life pretending.
His appetite was too used to being stuck in survival mode for him to bow to nausea for long, so he went back to eating properly after a few days. He still cried himself to sleep most nights. He kept dreaming about Jason. The memories wrapped themselves around him like a safety blanket that he knew would get ripped away again in the morning. He always woke up feeling empty. Sometimes, he wished he could just go to sleep and never wake up again.
But other than that, it was mostly good.
Then demigod communications went back up, and everything went to hell.
———
Chapter notes:
Fun fact! I originally planned for this chapter (as well as the next few chapters) to just be backstory in my head and for me to maybe do a flashback or two. Unfortunately for me, Piper McLean waltzed into the room and refused to leave.
I do actually think the fic works better this way, but it will take a second to get to the plot! Hopefully you’ll enjoy the whole journey :)
I may not be able to have Leo and Piper go to Jason’s funeral without seriously messing with the plot of Tyrant’s Tomb, but I could at least pick the most evil reason possible for them not to go!
Side note: I sort of forgot that Hedge and Mellie were supposed to be here according to TBM, but by the time I remembered I already had this chapter written out and, as someone who cannot be bothered to figure out how to write them, I decided to just leave it. ToA is vaguely canon to this universe, but only for the most part. Some details are inaccurate, and I think that’s okay.
Anyway, thank you so much for reading! Comments and reblogs super, super appreciated as always!!
List of people that at some point asked to be tagged when I post this: @poppitron360 @ginnyluna @keefessketchbook (feel free to comment if you want to get taken off or be put on the tag list for future chapters!)
#tchig#valgrace#leo valdez#jason grace#piper McLean#lost trio#hoo#heroes of olympus#ToA#trials of Apollo#the burning maze#leo x jason#jason x leo#pjo fanfic#HoO fanfic#my writing#Leo pjo#piper pjo#Jason pjo#Leo Valdez angst#long post
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Okay so I was thinking about Melvik last night because the streets(one person) asked for a Melvik playlist and I wanted to make sure I did it right and I think I've come to a conclusion about what the hell is going on with those two. There's so many different ways to interpret it, so I'm not saying this is objectively correct. We're in the corkboard with strings and pictures stage of shipping rn.
Okay so if we're being honest, there's not a lot to work with in terms of character interactions but there are clues in other places. One of the things I noticed is that they mirror each other. Mel has freckles in similar spots to Viktor's moles, she's the sun and he's the moon, she's covered in gold while Viktor has a lot more silver in his palette, she's a princess while he's some guy from Zaun but they're both fighting for legitimacy.
So they probably didn't like each other at some point.
Think about it, sometimes people who hate each other are exactly like one another. That bothers them. Maybe that was the case here. Then you add on the layer of their individual goals and I could see how they might clash. I could see how they might not understand each other at first.
I feel like after that, it probably became a game of cat and mouse. A rivalry if you will. It could've been academic, depending on how long they knew each other (we don't know). I could see there being a lot of competition in their relationship, but the thing is, it was never a fair fight. How is a man from the undercity supposed to compete with an exiled royal? You can't. People are more likely to give her what she wants than even consider your position just by default. And then you also have to consider that this is Mel we're talking about. A goddamn mastermind if I've ever seen one, if she didn't already have privilege on her side, she definitely has the people skills to compensate. It was probably frustrating, in a lot of ways.
But wait! There's more. There's something to be said about how the "evolved" humans are white and gold, Mel's colors. Even the way the gold is placed is reminiscent of her. Perfection, the peak of humanity, in Viktor's mind is Mel (and Jayce too if you remember that his little husk still kept a lot of his features, but his look was still inspired by her).
So in Mel, I think at first he saw everything he lacked and it was pissing him off. That probably stemmed from his need to get where he wanted to be quickly, because he knew his time was limited. Like fuck, I'm gonna die and you're in my way by being better at everything.
For Mel, I think she saw everything she wanted to be. Self assured, with direction in life. Peace is such a broad goal to have, living up to your mother's standards is a little more specific, but what does she want to do for herself? Where does she want to be when it's all said and done? Wherever she's been told she needed to be? In a throne or a seat at the council's table? Viktor knows what he wants, he sees it clearly, and he couldn't care less about anybody's standards or expectations besides his own. There's something so ruthless about that, and Mel envies it.
What I think changed with them is an understanding, realizing that it would be more useful for them to work together and be on the same team rather than continue to compete with one another. But how do we get there? Judging by how most of the romance in Arcane works, it was probably sex. I'm not even joking, this is a consistent thing. Jayvik? One of their key moments together involved Viktor saying "wait this isn't my bedroom", Mel and Jayce's relationship was kind of confirmed with a sex scene, Vi started flirting with Caitlyn in a brothel of all places and then LATER there was the whole thing in the prison cell, are we seeing the trend here? Sex and arcane go together like Jinx and explosions.
Anyway, right, back on topic. So yeah, I think unlike her relationship with Jayce, things were not nearly as thought through with Viktor. It definitely feels like a spur of the moment kind of thing, probably involving alcohol. Let me explain. I'm probably not going to phrase this right, but somebody else explained the bond between these two sort of like magnets. They attract and reject each other at the same time. They're so similar that by all means, they could be together, but something keeps pushing them away from one another. Knowing Mel's relationship with trust, and Viktor's relationship with time, this could make perfect sense. This could give way to some very complicated feelings. Knowing Mel, that wouldn't have been good. But then you start to remove those inhibitions, either through something artificial or just heightened passions, next thing you know shit happens.
Now we're in what I wanna call the situationship era! Because god forbid our favorite metal eugenicist has a committed relationship ever.
Mel doesn't know what she wants out of this so it stays casual for a while, Viktor wants more but he's scared to ask because he doesn't wanna scare her away. He knows she's conflicted about it, otherwise she wouldn't act the way she does. Still, it drives him fucking insane. He could die within the next few years, he doesn't have time to be playing will they/won't they. Especially not when the most perfect woman- no, person, he's ever seen in his life is right there in front of him. It's several months of "maybe we should stop doing this", that attracting and repelling I was talking about, with no conceivable end, but eventually it does. Eventually they both find they have better things to focus on than this. Not that they don't love or care about each other anymore, but the stress just isn't worth it. The world needs them, and they can't keep holding each other back.
However, that's not quite the end of their story.
In the words of our Lord and Savior, Shadow the Hedgehog, the light still shines even when the star is gone. They do try to keep their relationship as professional as possible, at least when there's eyes to see it. Outside of that though, it's clear that they're still attached somehow. Is it romantic still? That's up for interpretation, but regardless, no matter how much distance they put between each other, they'll always be drawn to one another.
Then here comes MC Hammer, and now the situation is like this. The moon (Viktor) revolves around the earth (Jayce), who revolves around the sun (Mel). They're all so interconnected now and if you take one out of the equation, shit gets messy. Can't take out the sun, the whole galaxy will collapse. Can't take out the moon, the earth will be in ruin. See what I mean? As Jayce and Mel get more serious, I think both of them wonder what could've been. They're happy where they are romantically but it's always something to ponder. What would it have looked like if Viktor was the golden boy, not Jayce? If they were the ones holding it down in those council meetings? What would it be like if her warmongering mother knew she was in love with someone like Viktor, someone so physically weak? Would she be rejected again? Would she approve based on the false notion that he was only a pet to her? That he meant nothing?
Maybe it's for the better that things are as they are, but when he thinks of what humanity can be at its peak, all he can see is her. When he's gone all she can hope is that he comes back to her. It's so beautifully tragic.
#this is probably dumb#arcane#arcane s2#viktor arcane#mel medarda#arcane spoilers#melvik#KNEE DEEP IN THE PASSENGER SEAT AND YOU'RE EATING ME OUT IS IT CASUAL NOW#rivals to lovers#please tell me you get it#i need someone to tell me this isn't delulu asf
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Pick-A-Card: Messages from Bhagwan Ganesh
𐙚˚ Here's my masterlist for more !
𐙚˚ Make sure like/follow/reblogg for more !
वक्रतुंड महाकाय सूर्यकोटि समप्रभ। निर्विघ्नं कुरुमे देव सर्वकार्येषु सर्वदा।
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/811cd0452075676fee58f5c8c20b2bba/f67321b383347b58-ea/s540x810/5b98d9d081f820e6ae407e84474af1c7da734d4c.jpg)
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/b8d1550940a8bce8f629e3d455084b9c/f67321b383347b58-44/s540x810/1e417771596e7f5552c28f122f33d5147841107e.jpg)
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/510af5f1866187b446adb41e6310b236/f67321b383347b58-6c/s540x810/bdb43b4150bf8410c326aaf893baf816ad1111cd.jpg)
Pile 1.
Namaste pile 1 ! Let's get with your reading :
The very first thing that I chanelled was a plane flying and red colour , which could mean that if you had any travel plans then its going to be successful but be aware of some things too as that's what bhagwan ganesha wants to say. Another message he is giving is that the real happiness you are finding are with those who are close to you actually, but still it's you who needs to take the step first by being happy internally or allowing yourself in another sense . I must say that if you people lost that shine which you are finding right now then soon that spark - feeling of contentment and blessings is coming to you , not only this but protection too but he says , " Call Me and Remember" . He says that currently you are taking a step which is not for you - your approach and your mentality. Bhagwan Ganesh is saying that you need to trust in yourself and be calm because if you won't take the step for you no one can help you and when the moment you are going to let that belief come in which allows you to be yourself then you will see miracles in your life.
✧ Randoms : Aeroplane, goat , capricorn, cancer, 4th house , 8 , 6 , 10 , 11 , jupiter , Saturn , third eye chakra and progress .
Pile 2.
Namaste pile 2 ! Lets get with your reading :
The very first thing I would say is you people are dealing with Many things in general or you are just very over powered like you have Messed up your energy so bhagwan ganesha says that be calm please . He Says that you are very intutive people and when you are in doubt your first gut feeling can always be trusted , I sense that you are waiting for something too so don't worry it work in you favour . I see something related to friend or partnership too and other thing he told me is that you will be blessed with every aspect soon - finance , love , spirituality and everything you can think but what calls you is that to be happy and calm so you can attract good energies. Some of you are soon to meet your soulmate or a proposal is coming on your way also if you were stucked then things will take positive movement forward .
✧ Randoms : 19 , 2 , 6 ,Kurti , scorpio , leo , cancer , virgo , Pisces,11th house, 6th house and 8th house .
Pile 3.
Namaste pile 3 ! Let's get with your reading :
Bhagwan Ganesh says nothing but sweetly and calmly like a mother that just let yourself heal because that's how you will heal your life . You are being told to manifest and start your gratitude journal so you can do well again by shifting your perspective slowly Also there is this emphasis about going slow and soft on yourself . Don't take any guilt on you buddy just relax and move ahead . He Says that whatever you lost was for a reason only to let you know that you deserve more better and best and surely you will be recognised for it for same just don't give up and strive ahead leaving past behind. He Says for some people that it was right to raise your voice and to take that trust inside you and also he says that don't feel guilty because you called yourself out because you realized it. Start a new journey ahead !
✧ Randoms : Toxic people , 17 , 0 , 15 , 001 , venus , jupiter , trauma, failure and butterfly.
#theladybrownstarot#tarot community#free tarot#tarot reading#tarotblr#pac#tarotscope#astro community#tarot witch#pick a card#pick a photo#pick one#pick a picture#pick a pile#witch community#witchcore#witches#witchblr#witchcraft#astro observations
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I don't personally feel shame for enjoying Veilguard but I feel like it's vital to support positive readings of the game's content, given the amount of vitriol. And I adore that there are people like yourself encouraging individual engagement and entertainment, thank you 🧡🍊
So, here's my question for you: What do you think of Morrigan-Mythal's role in the game and how her motherly aspect was depicted?
Ohhh my god, I love this ask. I LOVE this ask. (And thank YOU, anon!)
I'm sure people are going to disagree with me, but I loved it. Hear me out, people.
My own relationship with my mom is nothing short of fraught. No, I'm not going to divulge a lifetime's sorrows here in a response to an ask, but I feel like it is important context for everything I'm about to say. My mother has done frankly inexcusable things, and those things will not be excused! Not by me!
That said: I think Morrigan's adoption of Mythal was masterfully done. The biggest reason I love it is that it harkens back to everything we learned from Anders and Justice during DA2.
Morrigan talks about how Mythal appeared to her, and how Mythal appeared as a combination of herself and Flemeth. This shows me that BioWare are still very much writing from the same place, the same bit of lore, that created the best parts of Anders' arc (to me).
During DA2, I was frankly startled by how different Anders was to the one we saw in Awakening. But it soon became clear to me why: Anders tells you that the moment he took Justice into himself, willingly, that their two beings fused in a way impossible to extract or pick apart. Not even Anders knows how much of him is Justice, anymore.
His same sardonic humor from Awakening? His same wolfish grin and renegade attitude? Changed, irrevocably. We only get little glimpses of "Awakening Anders" throughout DA2.
The same, I feel, is true of Morrigan—and if it causes anger, fear, uncertainty, then I feel that is because it is supposed to. We can no longer see the line where Morrigan ends, and where Mythal begins.
I see her reasons, first and foremost, for taking Mythal into herself. Morrigan reminds me of me. As I've grown older, while I do not (and will not) forgive my own mother for some of her actions, I see their motivations in clearer light now. I see the person my mother is, and I see her good intent. I know how to be a different person than her, how to act better on my own good intentions. If I were to inherit all of her belongings and all of her diaries/memories today, I would not become her. I would use those things to do better in the world.
And if you look at some devnotes left in DAI for that scene with Solas and Flemeth, you'll see that Flemeth was always scripted as passing along her/Mythal's memories and spirit. She did so with the intent of those things being a gift to Morrigan. Whatever you believe about Flemeth, the fact remains: Morrigan was always going in this direction.
It is important, also, to remember that Flemeth is dead. Even if Morrigan is taking Flemeth's memories, the mother who abused Morrigan is gone. I think, as she's aged, Morrigan can see that for herself. Taking Mythal's spirit, and willingly, does not mean becoming Flemeth. It means being able to use Flemeth's tools, her magic, in better ways. It means being able to take Flemeth's intentions, whatever they were, and do better with them. Be better. End the cycle of hurt.
How much of that is now coloured by Mythal remains a mystery, and I love that mystery.
Much of Morrigan is precisely the same. Her quips, much the same. Her speech patterns, the same (go look at how much she uses the Hallelujah cadence in DAI, I dare you, everyone). She speaks of motherhood so reverently that if your worldstate inclues Kieran, it fits.
But there is something different. Something calmer, more refined. Something that speaks with more precision, and something that betrays less heated emotion. Something aloof, watching, from behind Morrigan's eyes. Age has done a lot to temper Morrigan, yes... but look at how she appears to not have aged much at all in the time since DAI.
Morrigan, in DATV, is kind, helpful, and reliable... for the same reasons that Solas is cunning, calculating, and unafraid to betray Rook many times over. Because it suits the Evanuris living inside her skin. There is no reason for Morrigan to give Rook any evidence to distrust her with. There is no reason to be anything but pleasant. There is no reason to not talk about motherhood and show Rook her soft side.
And on the opposite side of the coin? Emmrich (I believe) makes note of how spirits do not process emotions and move through them on their own. This is why Solas is stuck in the same regret for 10,000 years, until he gets the external help that lets him let go. This is also why Mythal, jumping from host to host to host (my theory is she was in Andraste, first, or Andraste's half-sister), has learned to soften and empathize with people in that time. Her hosts are that external help, enabling her to process feelings, to learn and grow in ways the other Evanuris (Solas included) have not.
We see it even when she is in Flemeth, and when Flemythal are venting about the betrayal that will shake the very heavens. In the same conversation, she is the only Evanuris who has ever said a kind word to one of the Dalish People. "You do the People proud." (or something similar!)
When within Morrigan, that statement goes one step further. Morrithal says that modern elves will eventually surpass their ancient ancestors, hinting that it is because of their mortal (multifaceted) spirits.
That said... Mythal, I am watching for you, and I am so ready to see your beautiful face in Morrigan down the road.
#answers#i hope i phrased a lot of that right#this is my seventh (?) ask this morning and it took brain power! but i'm hoping my main point came across!#no i do not think flemeth is a good guy!#but also? i think it is good that morrigan became the next vessel. we were going in this direction ANYWAY#and it lets us see that sometimes you can move on from abuse without completely running away forever#while also not forgiving your abusers#or empowering them to hurt you/others more#nuance: that's always been the message of dragon age!!
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I personally think the wof mental health rep is a lot better than it seems at first glance.
I should say upfront that I'm not a professional, though one of my biggest interests is psychology and majority of the conditions I talk in this post I either have or have traits of (and I'll clarify which I don't).
Whiteout is the only canonical neurodivergent character as far as I know, having associative synesthesia, but many headcanoning her to be autistic. I haven't read the books in a long while, but from what I remember I can agree, though I'm not autistic (despite meeting criteria... long story) so I won't for sure say if I think her traits are enough for a diagnosis or not (again, haven't read the books recently), but everyone seems to think they are so I'll agree.
Hawthorn has psychotic symptoms, which I think is important to represent since people with psychosis (whether that be from being on the schizophrenia spectrum or some other reason) are very often put in a bad light. Hawthorn is too, to an extent, but that's more so due to the Breath of Evil and not due to his psychotic symptoms, or from what I can remember, at least. I don't think Hawthorn has a mental disorder like schizophrenia since symptoms of psychosis can be caused by isolation (I'm not actually 100% sure if this is true, this is just something my psychologist told me), but I think the representation is still important either way. I relate to him a lot due to his symptoms.
Darkstalker very clearly shows symptoms of NPD (Narcissistic Personality Disorder), I don't think you can even argue that (sorry, narcissism anon from a month or so ago). I myself fit the criteria for NPD, and I definitely see myself in him. I doubt he can be diagnosed since he is still a child, but his symptoms might be extreme enough to warrant one, I'm not sure (coming from a minor who's doctors referred them for a personality disorder screening themself). Of the nine (9) criteria for NPD, just off memory he fit basically all of them. I won't go into all of it but I will definitely mention his splitting, seeing how he goes from loving Clearsight to thinking he can kill her if she doesn't meet his expectations. He also has the aspect of how it develops too, that being trauma (I recall Arctic being abusive to him which is definitely enough to warrant trauma), and being spoiled as a child (this could be my brain making things up but I swear this happened, or at least he was overly praised or something). So yeah, fairly sure he would have been diagnosed with NPD if he didn't eat the strawberry.
Moonwatcher seems to have social and separation anxiety. I like this, since I am diagnosed with both and they are both very difficult to live with, and I like seeing another character having it that I can relate to in that way. She also has symptoms of AVPD (just from what I remember), but she's only like... twelve (12) so there's no way she could be diagnosed.
Anemone, while not having any mental disorders specifically, still had a rough mental health journey so I think it's important to bring up. She grew up with her mother, Queen Coral, who was a complete helicopter parent, and likely never met her Father, King Gill. She was praised and adorned all her life, so it makes sense that when she was eventually separated from Coral, she acted out what she thought she deserved. While I think Darkstalker has NPD, I can't say the same for Anemone, since she was so young and it's normal for young children to have narcissistic traits. When she met Darkstalker, they clicked well due to both being animi and having... less than positive thoughts on the dragons around them. Darkstalker ended up lovebombing her, and telling her to leave when she got mad at Moon. She lashed out at Turtle afterwards, before they reconciled later. I thought this would be important to mention.
Peril likely has a few personality disorders as well, the most likely ones in my opinion being BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder) and DPD (Dependent Personality Disorder), which isn't surprising given her situation. She likely has tons of trauma so it's only natural for her to develop a traumagenic disorder. I say those in particular because of her rapidly changing thoughts and emotions and her over attachment to Clay, which I can definitely relate to given how I act with my DP (Dependent Person). I don't have BPD though I show traits (not sure if enough for a diagnosis or not) and I remember Peril showing traits too.
There's also a lot of dragons that probably have PTSD in some way, Fathom, Peril, and Jerboa III being the first ones that come to mind specifically.
I seriously think this is an important topic and I might make a video on it at some point. Like I said, I love psychology and I think it's interesting how it impacts characters from my favourite book series.
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Eleven fought Vecna two times, the first time she won, the second time she lost. But why ?
I feel like we don’t talk about that enough.
I haven’t seen anyone mention the difference and the similarities between those two times, or maybe some people did and I just missed it but I think we still need to talk about them.
Let’s remember how the first time went shall we ?
The first time she did she tried to think of things that made her sad, but also angry, just like Henry told her.
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/53b45ad993acadb63d5ba153795fa07a/0e6ad24ddc2e472a-d6/s540x810/eb0fae8ca48e8f6d5d2a2f36b620ebead1422ffa.jpg)
But as we can see, it’s not enough. It doesn’t work because Henry is angrier.
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/931876d71fd9cadf3bd8858507eb1655/0e6ad24ddc2e472a-ec/s540x810/d1c231aae40095fd39d70c8c306b8456cf9564e4.jpg)
Then as she is on the verge of being killed she remembers something, her birth.
We can hear a baby crying and then there is another voice calling out to El, the voice of a mother so happy to have her little girl with her, but there is one thing she says, she says "I love you", she tells her daughter that she loves her and it sound so so so sincere.
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/74bc84eaf501d047b8e0d743ab5e5d65/0e6ad24ddc2e472a-16/s540x810/6b74ec1bb436df93d94e376f66e9a87f5e7060e5.jpg)
El remembers that and she uses it against Henry.
She wins.
Thanks to the love her mother has for her, she wins.
The second time she does she is trying to save Max but she finds herself in the same situation as the first time.
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/a9bd766016a833204facae9b09f7dc48/0e6ad24ddc2e472a-1e/s540x810/6a0f1f05d19a076b2f85d2f13b1a7194039949f1.jpg)
"Outside" in the pizzeria everyone is freaking out and Will tell Mike that he is "the heart", we can see Mike hesitate but then he tells El "I love you".
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/a050e5928c8b115aa10715df780267fd/0e6ad24ddc2e472a-85/s540x810/6dfabc89074a8ece4d1c8d95c69065f6c7607008.jpg)
We have El’s reaction to this.
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/84783b9a3d224cbd9e807d908128c621/0e6ad24ddc2e472a-db/s540x810/43613cb1306ba18a6f95a799978d177398f51071.jpg)
She somehow doesn’t look happy about that, she looks sad. Mike makes his monologue, and as he does we can see the vines around El’s throat tightening. But then Mike says something, something that, as we can see, makes El mad, he tells her that she is his superhero.
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/d840bade390250b94b752059447108ea/0e6ad24ddc2e472a-24/s540x810/d1b82cba1499899e155de8ef7ae2fdd8e323fee7.jpg)
He tell her that she needs to fight, and she does but only once she looked towards Max.
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/c6cc52b9c73492af1aa097624b2ab5ec/0e6ad24ddc2e472a-95/s540x810/7216660027e870c2363d91285c5bd2315c90d0e2.jpg)
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/7aed617260d59ca7c52f0d7965009042/0e6ad24ddc2e472a-5c/s540x810/0b167c932875a4129115ab3ca4c48fca78774a72.jpg)
She throws Vecna against one of the pillars but that’s it.
Everything around her fades away when Nancy, Steve and Robin try to kill him.
This time she failed, she failed because Max is in a coma, she failed because the upside down is taking over Hawkins. She failed, she lost.
Let’s see the similarities between those two scenes
In both of these scenes she finds herself in a position of weakness, in both of these scenes she hear the three same words being said to her by people that are important to her, in both of these scenes she does end up fighting back.
But then why does she fail the second time ?
Because the first time she acted on love, her mother’s "I love you" was powerful and sincere.
The second time she acted on anger, Mike hesitated and didn’t sound sincere. He says things that El doesn’t look like she associate with being loved, like saying she is a superhero.
Mike was pushed into saying he loved El, but her mother said it spontaneously when she saw her daughter for the first time.
Thats why she failed, Mike wasn’t sincere.
Anyway thank you for coming to my ted talk :)
(sorry if some things don’t make sense, I’ve reread it but I might have missed things thanks to ADHD ;-;)
Have a nice day :D
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So I saw an opinion on a character that I, respectfully, don't agree with at all, and it isn't the first time I've come across this particular take either. I don't like nor want fandom discourse, making counter points to arguments in general make me nervous, but as someone particularly attached to them and their related characters, I have a lot of thoughts I want to get out there in the hopes that maybe they can be seen from a more positive perspective. So um, here they are. Get comfortable, this is gonna be a long one. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In Defense of Lily (Pokémon XD).
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/0df4b3d1f5373322147f3f60fa8d7725/8881875d7d18f5bd-22/s500x750/5898112a2e791898fc1c9c9c23f8f634f7e6b0be.jpg)
Those of you who've played this might already know what I'm referring to, so I'm just going to rip off the proverbial band-aid. Right at the start of the game, as you, the player, are being introduced to her, one of the first things she says is;
...and ok yeah, I admit. This is kind of a weird thing for her to say (in front of her son too, oops). This is usually one of two instances that people latch onto to prove she's an awful mother, but there is, at least in my opinion, some hidden context to her words. First of all, she's not wrong; the whole lab does in fact constantly sing their praises and fawn over both these kids (which is adorable tbh). Secondly, it's not unreasonable for her to believe that lots of inflated praise on a child, no matter how well meaning, may have negative consequences on their development. A kid receiving a constant stream of "you're so cool/special/talented" may end up with an inflated ego and become depressed, or even lash out in anger, if that praise either stops or something comes along to disprove it (like failing a test or making a mistake).
(Side note, I came across some partially related studies (x), (x) and an article from a parental psychologist (x) that go into different types of praise given to children; person, or ability praise ("you're so clever") vs process, or effort praise ("you worked really hard"), their effect on self esteem, personal growth, and performance, and how ability praise actually negatively effects a child's sense of worth compared to effort praise or even no praise at all. It's a lot to go through right now and this post is already going to be super long, but I mention them here because I'll go into something later that you may find rather interesting. I know I do. They're fascinating reads, too, I would recommend!)
Now listen up! Lily, contrary to the belief that she's a cold-hearted mother who shuns her offspring, actually does praise and engage with her children! Throughout the story, she'll talk to Michael and say some interesting and wonderful things as his adventure continues! The problem is that unfortunately, a lot of this proof is hidden throughout each story beat in a section of the lab that is no longer required to enter to progress (and most people won't bother to go back and speak to their own mother who apparently "hates" them). Off to find Jovi:
🥹 baby... Before saving Phenac City:
🥺😭euuhhbbebeh father mentioned During the Phenac City hostage situation:
After the Phenac stuff:
"I'm proud of you." You literally cannot get a more explicit form of praise than I'm proud of you. Hell, I can't even recall a time my own mother told me that. Fucking hell. Also. Pampered?! You hear that? She's practically contradicting those accursed two lines! By her own admission, the kids are pampered babies! Her concern isn't that people will spoil them—because they're already spoiled!
(Jovi is a pampered baby princess). I think Lily's worry in her comment is that may roll too far; it's like she says—spoiled rotten.
Ok one more example for this section:
(disclaimer: these screenshots are from the romhack XG which is why her name isn't in all caps; trust me, this same line is in base XD too) Remember the types of praise I mentioned earlier? Ability (person) praise and effort (process) praise? And how the former could be damaging to a child's self esteem? Do you notice anything particular about the way she speaks to Michael and praises him? "You've become an outstanding trainer in your own right." Not "You're so strong." "You're doing so much for the good of others." "Your courage will save the Shadow Pokémon." Not "You're so brave." "You did it all by yourself without anyone's help." She's praising his actionable efforts! She's applying process praise! (Pleeease read those studies and article, at least the first study I linked, it's genuinely insightful and fascinating, and it's even more amazing that an example of it is featured in a video game by a character most people won't interact with beyond necessity! I love this game! So! Fuckinhg!! Much!!!
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA-
Ahem. She's also not saying that people shouldn't praise her kids either; only that she wishes it wasn't gushing praise all the time. Too much of a good thing could be harmful, after all. Let's see...
Sounds reasonable so far, right?
...Galactic peace?! My brother in Arceus, all he did was beat you in a friendly Pokémon battle—a battle that Michael's already been led to believe he'd win anyway thanks to that previous comment from his coach (those screen caps are in chronological order)! Even without the fact that by this point he's midway through a dangerous fight against a criminal organization, it's probably not a good idea to give a developing young teen a literal God complex; what if he gets so full of himself he genuinely believes he's unbeatable... and then loses? That child's mental state is going to plummet. So even if you don't agree with Lily's praise comments, you might at least better understand where her concerns are coming from if this is potentially the kind of thing that's being told to her kids regularly.
Moving on, try putting yourself in her shoes a moment. She's a working, grieving, single mother of two who, according to an NPC in the lab "has an exceptionally high sense of responsibility".
As a scientist with the necessary expertise, she has the heavy task of helping realise a sensitive project—sensitive not just in terms of urgency (as Krane predicts Cipher is going to be a threat again), but also in terms of emotional weight; this project was something her late [husband] poured everything into until his death, so both her and Krane continued on with it; by the time the game starts, they're agonisingly close to completion. And time is of the essence. Quick tangent: watch the cut scene post Krane kidnap again. The camera rests on Lily an awfully long time. The father of her children died before this project was finished, and now Krane, a close friend of both of theirs, has been taken away by force. Both her children have witnessed something traumatic. Her daughter is sobbing. She's literally being told the situation is "hopeless" by a colleague. Imagine the sheer anguish this woman must be going through before having to push through all of it and take complete charge for the sake of finishing the project. For the morale of the entire lab staff. For the sake of keeping her kids calm. For the fate of the region itself. Anyway, because of this project, and how close they are to finishing, she isn't able to afford much, if any, time off to spend with her kids "this instant". It's probably why the lab staff have pitched in to help look after them (which must make her feel pretty damn guilty with that high sense of responsibility of hers). It's why she asks her son to go find his little sister in her stead.
And this brings me to point number two that I've seen used countless times to slander her:
She just lets Jovi run off on her own, and doesn't care what her kids are up to.
Which... no, sorry, hang on here. Lily isn't letting Jovi run off on her own. For starters, both her and Krane believe she's in or somewhere outside the lab grounds, playing hide and seek with the caretaker, Adon.
A game of hide and seek (particularly if they're taking turns hiding) is likely why nobody's seen her since lunch, by the way, and not Lily not giving a damn about the whereabouts of her child. And when she's found and brought home again, Lily says this;
This implies she's spoken to her daughter about running off on her own before, and we do later get to know that Jovi has a habit of running off ahead; she runs off down the steps in Gateon ahead of her brother, she rushes off to deliver the machine part by herself to the chamber, and even though Michael is the one asked, she runs off to go see Datan—despite Lily telling her she doesn't need to do that. This means if Jovi gets invested in something, it's apparently hard to stop her. Visiting Kaminko's is a recent fixation of hers, and if Adon is already aware of where else she might have gone off to if she's nowhere on lab grounds, it might mean she's been there before (that, or Adon was the one who caved and told Jovi where to find the place). I might even speculate and say Lily has specifically told Jovi before about not running off to the manor. Anyway, check out what she says when you find the little runaway but come back empty handed.
The heart-sinking realisation and disappointment in that "...Oh" alone....
So no, Lily isn't letting her young child run off on her own—Jovi is disobeying her mother. She's either used the game of hide and seek as an excuse to dip (and then forgot about Adon entirely), or she got bored midway through and decided to head to her new place of interest despite any of her mother's previous objections. (And before anyone says anything, no, that doesn't mean Jovi is a bad kid, either. She's, what, around 7 yrs old? She is doing typical little kid things, emulating her older brother, and discovering and pushing her boundaries as she grows up. I have seen some putrid, abysmal hate for her over the years too. She is a child, leave her alone.) Onto the second half of the above statement; she doesn't care what her kids are doing. As in, Michael is on a treacherous journey against a dangerous group of people and she's totally ok with letting her kid do that (as if that isn't the case with practically every mainline entry protag mother but alright, I'll bite).
Introducing one of my favourite exchanges with her in the game. During this time, the purify chamber still isn't complete, and they'll need to use an alternate way of purifying Shadow Pokémon until then—the Relic Stone in Agate Village.
oh it worries her, does it? You know what happens when No is selected?
And then she drops the conversation. There's no endless loop to get him to go, which would have been the more convenient thing for the devs to implement. But this was a very deliberate choice that tells me more about a character than I've seen done in a video game before. She's respecting her son's decision to stay home. She is not forcing him to do something he isn't comfortable with. Of course, as a video game, the purpose is to progress to the next story beat. So he has to go. Better talk to her again.
I don't even think I need to add any extra commentary, this should really speak for itself at this point.
I've also reached the image limit on this post so it's probably time I wrapped this up, so in conclusion; is Lily a bad mother, as I've seen people claim? No, and I believe I've showcased plenty to prove she isn't. She's not perfect, no parent is, but she's a damn sight more involved in her children's lives than the mainline moms, who are often nothing more than out of the way Pokémon Centers that don't acknowledge their child's journey in any meaningful way. So then, was she in the right for saying what she did at the start of the game, right after Krane praises her son, who is in earshot of this conversation? Well... also no. She could have picked a better time and place to bring it up, honestly. But God forbid a woman make a mistake or voice a concern, lest her be mischaracterized and demonized forever by two unfortunately worded lines of dialogue.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "Michael, you're finally going off to the ultimate battle, aren't you? You've really grown in stature. As your mother, it makes me feel conflicted. I'm happy and proud on one hand, but I'm also a little sad. Go and get rid of Cipher, and make it quick! And come home safely."
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ If you've managed to reach the end of my ramblings, I'd like to say thank you. Hopefully I've given you some food for thought. Maybe I've even changed your mind about her. And even if I haven't, I appreciate you taking the time to read this regardless.
#i'm uh shaking#this took me several days to write#i needed time to really articulate my thoughts#oh and another point i wanted to add that i couldn't find the right place in the post to mention#is that as funny as JaidenAnimation's XD video was#it has done irreparable damage to Lily's reputation#the fate of women in media amirite#long post#pokemom#lily#jovi#trainer michael#pokemon xd#orre#ravinranting123
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How do you even end up in these situations? Not in a bad way, but the idea of talking to people in public like that little girl with the makeup or yelling back at that lady is so terrifying, my social anxiety could never, but I wish I could?
Hard to pinpoint. I think for context, you have to know that at 18, when I was first starting out in university, I had such bad social anxiety that I couldn’t stand in a crowded lecture theatre to go pee because the idea of people looking at me was so scary to me. Medication didn’t help, and therapy worked up to a point. I sympathise, because social anxiety is literally the devil. It made my life so hard, and I remember being really frustrated with people around me who could just…do things.
Things that personally helped me:
• Majority of my friends are major extroverts. I find having extroverted friends, at least a few, is really helpful because the majority of the time they’re happy to bring you along to whatever they’re doing, they basically act as social lubricant (introducing you to people and vice versa, softening the scary parts of initially meeting people) and you can learn a lot by watching how they interact with other people and conduct themselves.
• In the same vein: joining any sort of hobby group, or group that has at least semi-frequent meetings. Easier said than done, I know. The good thing about this is that with similar or shared interest, again, you shave a lot of that awkwardness off of first meeting people and trying to establish initial contact.
• Similar but not quite the same: volunteering. Volunteering helped me a lot, because volunteering groups and movements tend to be an incredibly diverse mix of people. Especially older people, people in retirement, quirky old women, etc. A lot of these people in volunteering won’t even blink if you are a little shy or socially awkward at first, and much like extrovert friends, are great to observe and see how they do it. Plus, I find regular volunteering really helpful for confidence.
• This might be controversial but: I worked a shitty retail job for 3 years while studying, because I financially had to. If you’re young, you can physically handle it, and you’re in a good place to do so, even some casual or part time work can be a game changer. I’m not going to lie: 9 times out of 10, these jobs suck. The general public can be a nightmare. However, you are quickly forced to adapt. I view it almost like in the Sims, levelling up charisma, because you have to deal with people. In the right kind of workplaces, it’s also an okay place to meet other people and socialise more.
• I wish I could remember what she said to me word for word, but my mother had sat me down in my later teenage years when my social anxiety was at it’s height, and broken down some aspects of what I was doing. A lot of the time, I was curled in on myself, eyes down, head down, frowning (if not outright glaring), and generally giving myself a very hostile aura. At the time, I was pissed about this advice don’t get me wrong. Once I started actually using it a few years later though, it worked. She had pointed out that the vast majority of people are actually pretty friendly or genial in their day to day lives, and it really pissed me off when I realised she was right. I smile at pretty much everyone - most people, even people who look hostile or angry, smile back. I would say an easy 80-90%. I hold doors open for people, I say please and thank you, I ask cashiers and things how their day was. These little social interactions cannot be taken for granted, because yeah, sometimes someone is in a bad mood, or not interested in engaging, but the vast majority of the time people respond positively, and that feedback is an incredible tool for building social ability. This is pretty much how I’m able to strike up conversation with random strangers now - once the little interactions got familiar and stopped being scary, the idea of turning and talking to a stranger in an aisle becomes less of terrifying task.
I say this about a lot of things, but again, I think a lot of times, people mistake social skills for something inherently innate, and not a skill you can build much like a muscle. It’s especially really hard for those of us who suffer/have suffered from social anxiety, because there’s a whole other mental health aspect to it, but even trying little things if you can will pretty much guaranteed help you feel a little more secure.
(One of my best friends since early teens is autistic, and has always struggled really badly socially. Around mid-university, she began to transform into a social butterfly; she’s involved in so many committees, groups, parties, events. People love her. I asked her curiously once how she’d facilitated that change over coffee, and she shrugged and told me she basically decided to project the same energy as a golden retriever or Labrador, and go from there lmao.)
#this might not be applicable to you or it might be#I do feel you though ❤️#sometimes people send me asks about those posts like THAT NEVER HAPPENED R/THAT NEVER HAPPENED#which honestly reminds me painfully of myself when I was at my most anxious. the idea of ever interacting with anybody casually?#people made that up. that didn’t happen.#it’s a very slow journey and you gotta be gentle with yourself#katie rambles
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I've disappeared from Tumblr again and I want to apologize for that ^^"
But I come with empty hands? ^^""" I want to show you two more character designs of the universe
V.D.Gaster
A scientist who survived the war between monsters and humans, who was eventually trapped in a dungeon with everyone else.
In the universe, he is the father of Sans and Papyrus. (This is my personal head on him..) That's why he is a skeleton. This is noticeable even in the second form - the forgotten one.
Initially, he is a pretty positive character, wishing with all his soul happiness for the whole dungeon. The scientist begins to lead a project on the transformation of the soul, its strengthening and the acquisition of some skills. All this should allow the monsters not to take care of their health anymore and not worry about being killed at the hands of a new hitman.
One of his assistants is the eldest brother of the family, Sans, who was chosen as stronger and more enduring. One of the experiments gets out of control, turning the lives and destinies of two monsters from head to toe.
Gaster becomes obsessed with experiments, forgetting about all the "humanity" in understanding our perception of humanity. This leads to discord and constant quarrels. All his followers and assistants are now afraid of the scientist like fire and are afraid. After a while, the scientist goes missing, leaving almost nothing about himself. It was as if such a monster had never existed in the dungeon before. Most of the monsters say that the skeleton brothers got into the dungeon alone and all this time they survived by themselves, not without the help of other people's neighbors, but … the brothers remembered that they did not get here alone. It scared them. What if they disappear too? Or one of them… How then will it survive the second…? Only those who survived the V.O. experiment remember this great, but at the same time terrible monster.
Chara. I don't have much to add to its design, I'm quite happy with everything.
But the meaning of her story changes a little!!! The charm in Saforex is not an evil child at all!!! In the subsequent plot, she will not be involved in all the events in any way. Chara is the first child to enter the dungeon and the only one who has never even thought about attacking a monster. A child of the kindest soul, who lived up to the age of 19. She also dies early after due to the fact that the human body could not get used to the new conditions of the dungeon and despite all the attempts of the new mother, she languished, dying from the inside.
Further points repeat the plot of the original.
After her death, she left forever, because she died still in the arms of her beloved brother, not knowing what followed. I wonder if anyone has read to the end?
#art#my art#my draws#drawing#artists on tumblr#tumblr draw#undertale au#skeleton#art oc#undertale#saforextale#undertale oc#digital art#saforexchara#saforexgaster
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Natal Saturn Retrograde - Personal Observation
I'm currently reading Uranus: Freedom from the Known by Jeffrey Wolf Green! I'm on page 4 and I already have thoughts lol
Some things he said about having Saturn retrograde in the chart
A retrograde archetype is simply the need to withdraw, to retreat, to rebel from the status quo expectation of how that planetary behavior is meant to manifest from a societal point of view. This necessary rejection of the status quo via the retrograde principle accelerates the natural evolutionary pace. Because when you are withdrawing from the status quo you are arriving at your own unique and individual expression, essential individuality, of whatever planet or function is retrograde.
This is interesting bc I have Mercury, Saturn, Neptune and Uranus retrograde in my chart loll I do spend like 80% of my time thinking about my own behavior and other people's behavior and societal reasons for them. Definitely more than the people around me so I can see how that would accelerate evolution. I'm big on learning from other's mistakes lmao I also don't believe a lot of the same things as the people around me which can make me more withdrawn at times bc I know I'm the odd one in the room lol
Could we deduce that the Saturn retrograde person is going to be intrinsically oriented to rejecting, rebelling, withdrawing from, and questioning such social imprinting? The individual would come to define her or his own natural authority (Saturn), customs, regulations, norms, taboos, and ways of integrating into the culture that he or she is born into. When Saturn is retrograde the door is open and pointing to Uranus.
I wrote before how with Saturn 1H I basically raised myself when it came to my values and principles lol guess saturn retrograde played a part in that too! Idk when exactly it was to know what transit I was going through but within like the 2019-2021 time period I had a meltdown about my non existent kids feeling left out culturally bc I don't intend on abusing them omggg and like a lot of the Haitian comedy shit is about how the parents treat their kids so badly! I got over it lol bc obviously there are many other cultural aspects that are unrelated to that but it's funny how that was such a distressing thing for me! I'm also the odd one out of my catholic/christian family bc i'm pretty anti religion lol
The very nature of the individual's consciousness is intrinsically different.
All of this is screaming you're a weirdo to me lmfao but trueeee I always find myself in positions where I say something to people around me and they're like huh...never thought about it like that before
There is more of a sense of distance or detachment from the immediacy of one's family and culture, a sense that there is more to reality (Saturn) than is being focused upon by the family or culture.
I'm def the estranged family member lol the only person in my family that I talk to regularly is my aunt and she also lives in my building so! I come from a family that was very idek like the types to act like everyone gets along and are all happy together and having parties and dinners but then I realized that not only do they not know a lot about each other, they don't even like each other! Right now my aunt is trying to force this family dinner of just her and I with her brother that she talks to only when she reaches out (he doesn't ever remember her birthday after 62yrs) and my godmother's brother bc he just got divorced lol her thing is all "we don't act like a family!" and I'm like girl if I wasn't related with these people I wouldn't even be acquaintances with them lmao
Commonly, the Saturn retrograde is going to have a problem with one or both parents. In certain family situations this can be a problem and can create emotional distance from the offspring to such a parent. And, from an evolutionary point of view, necessarily so.
Yeah I don't talk to either of my parents lol no contact with my mother bc she's a narc and I just don't have a relationship with my father like he wasn't really around when I was younger but then I "met" him around 14ish and things were okayish but it wasn't real bc it was just my mother forcing things bc she wanted access to him again lol now he's just a follower on IG who likes my stories sometimes and we don't talk lmfao but I do see how stifled I was before getting away from my mother. There's a lot of mental blocks I had put in place just to deal with her and now I don't have them and it's sad bc now I see the same pattens between some of my other friends and their mothers but they're still in the "that's just how my mom is but we have a great relationship as long as i'm not [insert long list of conditions]" and I'm just like yikes!
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I'm also currently in my saturn return along with most of my friends and only one other friend has saturn retrograde and I feel like we're the only two on our saturn return journey who are idek on a straight course? Like we hit an obstacle we work through it and move forward with the lesson but it seems like the others are stuck on a hamster wheel like they have to get the same obstacle over and over and they still aren't getting it and when I talk to them they sound like they're about to take a step forward like yeah they can't live like this anymore they're gonna do this instead but then nothing happens nothing changes and we're back to the same issue omg idk if that's a thing or if it's just an observation of my friends and I lol
Bc of how mercury rx happens I had this idea that saturn rx would work the same way as in slowing me down and keeping me stuck in cycles longer than others but reading about how saturn rx acts more like uranus it does make more sense for me lol a lot of my growth starts by surprise and it triggers like a very quick spiral where I start connecting all the dots and then I'm like whoa....like when I first realized my mom was a narc I wasn't even looking for it lol I was looking for ways to implement better boundaries to help our relationship lmfaooo then i was basically spiraling for 6months every time she did something I was like omg that's literally a tactic and then I went no contact by literally blurting it out over the phone bc I got frustrated lol I shocked myself!
Wild stuff!
#astro#astrology#astro tumblr#learn astrology#astro community#saturn retrograde#natal saturn retrograde
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ready to fight for my life for ty blackthorn when twp is released because the way people are already infantilizing and patronizing him bc he’s autistic is so….
no one asked for this but i’ve seen a lot of people have weird takes on his autism so as an autistic woman i need to clear some things up ok 😭 so buckle up, this is gonna be a long one (seriously, it’s long)
the main arguments i’ve seen are: (i’m paraphrasing here btw)
“ty didn’t cry when livvy died but he did cry when kit said he wished he’d never known him so it’s clear that he does love kit.”
and
“ty clearly loves kit because he cried when they argued and it’s hard for autistic people to cry.”
and
“ty gets on my nerves because he didn’t react at all when kit told him he loved him”
like. i do get what you’re saying (with the first one. not the second one, that’s a stereotype, and also not the third one bc that’s just weird), because it does show that ty cares but like. obviously? all his actions before that showed that he cared too.
saying “he cried when him and kit fought but not when livvy died” just comes off as acting like he’s more upset about kit leaving and insulting him than he is about kit dying and that just rubs me the wrong way.
i know this is not common knowledge but autistic people often have delayed processing, especially when we’re grieving because it can be so overstimulating and even when we do grieve, it’s not gonna look the same as when an allistic person grieves.
so, delayed processing:
delayed processing in autism is where you are recording/aknowledge events as they happen, however that information is stored elsewhere in the brain and isn't taken in.
once the brain is ready or has capacity the information is suddenly taken in. this could be hours, weeks, days or even months later.
an example (from justkeepstimming_ on instagram):
An autistic person whose mother died at quite a young age. At the time, when his father was grieving, it did not appear the autistic son was upset.
However, one year after his mother's death, he suddenly processed that she was gone (permanently) and only then started the grieving process.
that example is pretty much exactly what happened with ty in qoaad.
partly, ty didn’t cry when livvy died because he didn’t accept that she was dead. he was so sure that he was gonna bring her back and for a long time, he probably didn’t even consider the fact that he might fail.
after livvy dies, kit says this:
“Everyone had been terrified. Ty would fall apart, they’d thought. Kit remembered Julian standing over Ty as he slept, one hand stroking his brother’s hair, and he’d been praying—Kit didn’t even know Shadowhunters prayed, but Julian definitely had been. Ty would crumble in a world without his sister, they’d all thought; he’d fall away to ashes just like Livvy’s body.”
if ty were allistic, he probably would have reacted like this immediately. and he does react like this eventually when his brain fully processes that the ritual didn’t work, that livvy is actually not coming back:
“Livvy!” Ty didn’t scream the word so much as it was ripped from him; he curled up, hugging himself, as if desperate to keep his body from shattering apart.”
this is when ty actually processes that his sister is gone. so saying, “ty didn’t cry when his sister died but he cried when him and kit fought” as if it’s some really romantic thing that he was sadder about kit leaving than livvy dying (which is not true) is just iffy because it’s such a stereotype and a misconception that autistic people don’t seem to care at all when people die, and way too many people from this fandom are feeding into that so much.
and ty does show is grieving throughout qoaad but because it’s not in the allistic way, a lot of readers don’t recognize it.
(i was actually so positively surprised to see that cassandra clare, an allistic woman, wrote the grieving process for an autistic character—and everything else about being autistic tbh—so well but it gives me so much hope for twp)
for example, autistic people (this is obviously not all autistic people as all autistic people are different but i'm just listing the signs i've seen in ty in qoaad) when they're grieving might show their grief gradually in more subtle ways by hurting themselves, emotionally or physically, which ty does do:
"The only person he was unkind to, Kit thought, was himself."
and we also see in gotsm that ty is continuously punishing himself because he is still grieving. livvy is simultaneously there and dead, and ty has to live with both the grief of her death and the guilt of her being stuck as a ghost.
there's also the fact that kit observes that ty starts keeping secrets and doing things alone, which is also common when trying to process emotions that haven’t fully caught up yet:
“In the past days, though, since Julian and Emma had woken up, Ty had been harder to find. If he was working on something, he hadn’t included Kit in it—a thought that hurt with surprising intensity.”
like. ty is pulling away because he is trying to process everything that’s happening. him excluding kit is very likely a symptom of some kind of delayed grief because it’s very unlike him to exclude kit from anything, as we can see when he says multiple times outright that he doesn’t want to do things without kit.
just because it’s more subtle than breaking down into tears doesn’t mean that he doesn’t feel it at all. it’s more likely that he simply feels too much and is shutting down because of it.
and of course his grief is gonna be subtle when he hasn’t even accepted and processed the fact that she’s dead yet.
and yes, he cried when kit told him he wished he’d never met him but that is so different because there was no room for denial. kit told him that word for word, the processing wasn’t delayed this time because there wasn’t really that much to process.
ty truly believed right away that his only friend wished he had never known him, and when livvy died he didn’t accept that she was dead. those things are different and pitting them against each other is weird.
so, onto the second argument/misconception i’ve seen that:
“ty clearly loves kit because he cried when they argued and it’s hard for autistic people to cry.”
this is a misconception stemming from the stereotype that autistic people are emotionless. yes, some autistic people might have a harder time crying because of shutdowns etc. but generalizing it to it’s hard for autistic people to cry is just wrong, especially because this has never been implied about ty in the text.
in fact, it’s the opposite:
“Ty heard everything twice as loud and fast as everyone else. The headphones and the music, Kit sensed, were a buffer: They deadened not just other noises, but also feelings that would otherwise be too intense. They protected him from hurt.
He couldn’t help but wonder what it would be like to live so intensely, to feel things so much, to have the world sway into and out of too-bright colors and too-bright noises. When every sound and feeling was jacked up to eleven, it only made sense to calm yourself by concentrating all your energy on something small that you could master—a mass of pipe cleaners to unravel, the pebbled surface of a glass between your fingers.”
so implying that it’s harder for ty to either cry or feel sad is just wrong. kit notes that “every sound and feeling was jacked up to eleven”, and this includes ty’s grief. him not crying when livvy died has nothing to do with how much he may or may not be feeling and everything to do with how delayed his processing was.
and the third complaint of ty is frustrating because he didn’t react when kit told him he loved him.
first of all, i don’t know if it’s my autistic ass not understanding allistic people but is it not normal to be in shock when someone tells you they love you in the middle of a necromancy ritual???
and second of all, this scene from city of heavenly fire where julian says “i know it’s hard to understand, ty, but we love you” like it’s supposed to explain their actions and ty reacts like this:
Ty looked at him blankly. He knew what “I love you” meant, and he knew it was good, but he didn’t understand why it was an explanation for anything.”
ty looking at kit blankly in surprise in qoaad is not him “not reacting”, it’s him trying to process 1) what that has to do with anything and 2) why that would be an explanation or an argument as to why ty should stop the ritual.
(it is probably also partly because ty thought kit had feelings for livvy at this point but that’s just speculation so i won’t get into it now)
to kit, this was probably his way of saying that because he loves him, ty can stop the ritual and kit will help him with the aftermath.
to ty, kit’s confession made no sense in that moment because why would kit loving him mean that he should stop the ritual? and this was most likely also the moment when his grief was really starting to kick in, so that just adds to it.
yeah idk if anyone made it to the end but as you can tell, i have a lot to say and i’m tired of people romanticizing ty’s grief.
#this is so long i’m sorry#sick of fandoms infantilizing neurodivergent characters#ty blackthorn i will always defend you#i’m putting my english degree to good use#the dark artifices#ty blackthorn#livvy blackthorn#the wicked powers#kit herondale#kitty#kit x ty#shadowhunters#actually autistic#twp#cassandra clare
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in the defence of Ruki Mukami - why Ruki's trauma has just as much influence on his actions as everyone else
i am sitting in the chemistry library at uni right now and am going to spend my time on the most useless task ever to avoid doing anything impactful. please don't take this too serious because i can't write meaningful character analyses.
so i've seen a ton of stuff around, because i know Ruki's not one of the best loved characters in the western fandom. well, of all the characters, i see nearly the most Ruki hate. and obviously everyone is entitled to their opinions, whatever. but what DOES bother me is the reason.
a lot of people say that Ruki's trauma doesn't correlate to his actions, or explain abusive behaviour in the same way that the other characters' do. and i would die for Ruki and we know this, but i've thought about it a lot and i have a Theory as for why some people seem to view his character this way. (i have also studied neuroscience at degree level and learnt about trauma and synaptic plasticity)
to summarise for those who perhaps haven't read all the games (my sources for all this is basically Ruki's MB, DF, and LE), Ruki was born as an only-child in Romania to a rich family, and his father was revealed to be a politician during the Ceaușescu period in Romania. they had a lot of servants, all of whom Ruki learnt from a young age to abuse. he admired his father very much and looked up to him, and his mother was good to him and was close to his father. it would seem like a very good, perfect family - although i'll briefly discuss later why this wasn't necessarily the case.
unfortunately, in the DL universe lore, Karlheinz and Ceaușescu were buddy-buddy politicians, and Ruki's father was eventually chased out of his position. during his downfall, Ruki's father became an alcoholic and began abusing Ruki's mother, verbally and physically. Ruki saw a lot of this as well: somebody he looked up to, admired and trusted, becoming an abusive monster in a very short period of time. i think that's part of why Ruki overlooks Karlheinz's crimes and sees him as a good father anyway.
not only that, Ruki's mother - once again somebody who nurtured and cared for him - turned out to be having an affair. and shortly after that, his father committed suicide: something Ruki actually walked out on.
that in itself is a lot more traumatic than i think people consider. a lot of the DL characters have long-term trauma, but intense sudden trauma, such as your "perfect" life falling apart due to an alcoholic, abusive father killing himself and his mother having an affair, has similar psychological impact. remember, these are people who were supposed to care and nurture him, he trusted them a lot, and they both abandoned him abruptly in very extreme ways. that's the number 1 root of Ruki's trust issues. he's been seen to cut Yui off entirely because he's scared of becoming his abusive father.
similarly, living in a "perfect" household as a spoiled only child can be inherently traumatic. i don't know about you guys, but i've met some (only some, not the majority) of very, very emotionally constipated spoiled only-children. a lot of children showered with materialistic affection are missing key emotional maturity developments. their outlook on life is very narrow and they lack the emotional components of attachment; this is part of why Ruki is quite emotionally immature.
not only that, but growing up as an abusive sociopath to "lower" members of society such as servants is a form of abusive on his parents' behalf. they did not teach him proper world awareness. some children are born as psychopaths etc, true, but the majority of "sociopaths" (diagnosed as ASPD) are that way because they were not taught remorse as a child. Ruki would've learnt to treat his servants that way because that was how his parents did (and we see his father being a dick to the servants in LE too i think), and that in itself is inherently traumatic too.
imagine then, with very little capacity for remorse or a concept of societal hierarchy, being thrown into an orphanage. Ruki is a dick to everyone, yes, but the shock of having everything you know challenged suddenly and without explanation or support is going to cause further trauma. i think people just don't like to consider the fact that a lot of "sociopaths" (again, ASPD is the correct label there) were victims too. he went from being the "master" to being "livestock" and that's going to very rapidly alter your young brain chemistry, entering a "master" mindset as a defensive mechanism. that's why he gets angry/upset/confused when it's challenged.
Ruki has a fuck ton of PTSD as well - he's the only character who i've seen literally throw up MULTIPLE TIMES when experiencing flashbacks.
but i think people generally know that, perhaps not thinking about it as deeply. my Theory as to why people don't seem to see this as being as "extreme" as the other boys' trauma goes further than that.
diabolik lovers follows this dynamic between the Sakamaki's vs Mukami's, whereby Yuma, Kou and Azusa (Yuma and Kou more strongly) have this mindset of "the Sakamaki's can't have trauma because they were rich" and obviously as readers, we're supposed to be like "um, no, the Sakamaki's can have trauma too" because they do.
with that said, Kou and Yuma do successfully get to Subaru/Laito and Shu's heads respectively with this narrative. especially Subaru and Shu who get really fixated with this "i was a spoiled, privileged kid" and because of that, naturally we, as readers, lean towards feeling sorry for the Mukami's especially.
obviously, Ruki is the odd one out when it comes to the Mukami's. he had a sheltered upbringing whereas the other brothers were fighting for their lives in poverty/on the streets, victims and witnesses of the civil war and orphan crisis. Yuma particularly pushes this "Ruki had it easy" notion too, and i've definitely noticed that a lot of people who don't particularly like Ruki tend to fall towards that.
this idea of "not enough" trauma has enough to unpack as it is and we won't do that to, but personally i think that all of Ruki's abusive actions are justified. no, they are not an excuse. none of the diaboys' behaviour is excusable, but i think Rejet did quite a good job of giving them enough fucked up backstory to make us as readers at least understand why that might be how they act.
and from what i see, it seems to be Ruki who people think is the exception to this the most, because his trauma isn't in the same vein as the rest of the Mukami's. the "rich people can't have trauma" narrative gets pushed so hard that i think people forget 1) it isn't true and 2) Ruki went through a ton of fucked shit as a kid, and i don't think any of his actions made me feel any differently than the other diaboys' awful behaviour towards Yui.
you can find Ruki boring, not interesting, or just not your type. but he very, very much has "sufficient" trauma to explain his toxic and dominating actions. thank u for coming to my TedTalk.
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Katara made it very clear that she never ever wants to see Yon Rah again and most of the Zutara fandom supports that decision of hers.
So I guess the possible downside of Katara choosing to marry Zuko means sharing Zuko's burden of reforming and rehabilitating depraved war criminals like Yon Rha and all those who are even worse than him.
Then there's this whole thing with Aaron Ehasz imagining Zuko being Azula's Iroh and she reforms in that way along with my and a few other's ideas of Aang showing her how open and master her own chakras. Speaking of Iroh, does anyone remember his ruthless and brutal 600-day siege anymore? There's no way he'd avoid dropping bodies that whole time.
Looks like Katara will ironically be taking Aang's advice about forgiveness after all but I don't think it'll be necessary for Katara to look for Yon Rah again and say so.
What do you think?
Tw: War crimes, genocide and nazism.
Disclaimer: I don't know what actually happened post canon. I tried to look on internet forums and it seems as the topic wasn't addressed in the comics. For this answer, I'm going under this assumption.
Sorry for not getting to this sooner, life got busy and I didn't want to give some half assed answer to such a delicate topic. There's a lot to comment on so I'll break this down step by step.
"Katara choosing to marry Zuko means sharing Zuko's burden of reforming and rehabilitating depraved war criminals"...
The fire nation commited atrocious war crimes, leaving them with with many war criminals. War crimes are more than punishable. If it were real life, neither Katara or Zuko would have to reform and rehabilitate any of them.
An example of this would be the Nuremberg trials after WW2. Even recently, in 2022, Irmgard Furchner (an 98 year old women) faced a trial for being a secretary of a concentration camp (to put it lightly, she was very much a murderer). No one is getting away with their actions.
I read the relevant section from a Red Cross's document titled "Analysis of the punishments applicable to international crimes (war crimes, crimes against humanity and genocide) in domestic law and practice". (The section being "States’ obligations under IHL to prosecute and punish international crimes").
I found something interesting. (ID in alt text).
![Tumblr media](https://64.media.tumblr.com/6263f5b14471da9c95a8f37432632275/fcc03746a2c17d58-25/s540x810/0da66c1ccb81df58b670355d831560d11913c86f.jpg)
*Grave breaches are more serious, vile violations of humananitarian law. Everything above applies to "genocide and crimes against humanity".
If Katara were in a position of power in the Fire Nation, not only would she not have to reform anyone, she also might get to help with the trials for them.
"Then there's this whole thing with Aaron Ehasz imagining Zuko being Azula's Iroh"
I don't know about his plans for Aang's other ideas, so I can't comment on them. What I did find was a short thread of his. And after reading it, I maintain that – like most ideas – his vision can work with sensitive execution.
Azula was still very much a 14 year old victim of grooming when the series took place. Her brother can help her through her redemption under one condition – the desire to be better should come from her.
He shouldn't sit through any mistreatment whatsoever. He'll guide her through a path he already went through, but she has to walk with him. Azula needs to be safe for Zuko. Only then, redemption would be possible.
"does anyone remember [Iroh's] ruthless and brutal 600-day siege anymore?"
The difference between Iroh and Yon Rah is what they're up to now. In the present Yon Rah is just some guy living with his mother. Meanwhile Iroh took back Ba Sing Se from Fire Nation colonizers.
Yon Rah isn't out here fixing his mistakes, he just got off scot-free. On the other hand, Iroh is a changed man and took action to correct his past on the same scale.
At the end of the day redemtion isn't Aang's idea. It's one of the major themes of Atla. It wants to show that people can change and grow. So it does. Zuko changes, Mai changes, Ty Lee changes, and Iroh is their future.
He tried to conquer Ba Sing Se, and now he took it back from conquerors. He was the worst of them all, and now he's unrecognizable. He's warm, wise and sweet. There's a meaning to it.
That doesn't mean that war criminals in the current day, scums who made no affort, will get away with their crimes. That doesn't mean Katara would have to go through the mental torture of reforming her colonizers.
That is it! I hope I didn't come off as aggressive, I didn't mean to. Thank you for the ask, sorry for taking me forever to write this, and have a lovely day!
#zutara#zutara meta#zukoxkatara#zuko x katara#kataraxzuko#katara x zuko#anti kataang#anti maiko#ambassador katara#anti anti zutara#pro zutara#tw nazism#tw war crimes#tw colonialism#tw nazis#tw genocide#uncle iroh#iroh#azula#the southern raiders#aaron ehasz#zutarian#zutara was robbed#zutara analysis#zutara nation#asks#asks open
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I would absolutely love to see examples of historical terminology? I feel like I've only scraped the surface.
So I'm going to focus mostly on 18th century English because that's what I read the most (we will dip a little into French but mostly from an English perspective). Even narrowing the focus there's still kind of a lot. Like I'm probably going to forget something cause there is so much to talk about.
Sexuality
The first thing that's important to understand is sexuality labels were action based not attraction based. This doesn't mean people didn't understand sexual attraction, they very much did, it's just that terminology was based on action not attraction. Terminology was essentially separated into men who have sex with men and women who have sex with women. It also important to remember that these terms were not exclusive to men who only had sex with men and women who only had sex with women but also applied to people who had sex with both men and women.
Men Who Had Sex With Men
Sodomy/Buggery
The terms most commonly used in formal/legal contexts were sodomite and bugger. Bugger comes from buggery and sodomite from sodomy, both of which broadly speaking referred to anal intercourse or bestiality regardless of sex/gender but was most commonly associated with sex between men. The legal definition of sodomy in English common law was as follows:
Sodomy is a carnal Knowledge of the Body of Man or Beast, against the Order of Nature; It way be committed by Man with Man, (which is the most common Crime) or Man with Woman; or by Man or Woman with a Brute Beast. Some Kind of Penetration and Emission is to be proved, to make this Crime, which is Felony both by the Common and Statute Law, in the Agent and all that a present, aiding and abetting; also in the Patient consenting, not being within the Age of Discretion.
~ The Student’s Companion or, the Reason of the Laws of England by Giles Jacob, 1734, p239
However colloquially it was generally used to describe sex between men without the focus on Penetration and Emission.
Related to sodomy were the words sodomitical, sodomitically and sodomiting, these terms were used to describe a person, action or place that was related to sodomy (esp. sex between men) but did not necessarily constitute legal sodomy. (for examples see Trial of Martin Mackintosh, 11 July 1726, A Treatise of Laws by Giles Jacob, 1721, p165 and Trial of Thomas Gordon, 5 July 1732 respectively)
From buggery we get the presumably derogatory term buggeranto. (for an example see The London Spy, part III, published 1703)
Molly
The preferred term used by the community was molly. Rictor Norton explains in Mother Clap’s Molly House:
The early church fathers stigmatised homosexuals as molls or sissies, and secular society called effeminate men molly-coddles and homosexuals mollies; having no other self-referring terms except the even less appealing Sodomite or Bugger, gay men transformed Molly into a term of positive self-identification, in exactly the same way that the modern subculture has transformed Gay (which derived originally from ‘gay girl’, meaning a female prostitute) into a term of pride and self-liberation.
Molly (plural mollies) was a noun:
Sukey Haws, being one Day in a pleasant Humour, inform’d Dalton of a Wedding (as they call it) some Time since, between Moll Irons, and another Molly,
~ James Dalton’s Narrative (1728)
Molly/mollied/mollying could also be a verb:
I was going down Fleet-Street, I was just come out of Jail. This Man, the Prosecutor, is as great a Villain as ever appear'd in the World. I was coming down Fleet-Street, so Molly says he; I said, I never mollied you. My Lord, I never laid my Hand upon him, nor touch'd him; I never touch'd the Man in my Life.
~ Trial of Richard Manning, (17 January 1746)
And mollying could be used as an adjective:
But they look'd a skew upon Mark Partridge, and call'd him a treacherous, blowing-up Mollying Bitch, and threatned that they'd Massacre any body that betray'd them.
~ Trial of Thomas Wright, (20 April 1726)
A molly house was house or tavern that catered to mollies. Molly houses would typically serve alcohol and often had music and dancing. Usually there was a room where mollies could have sex known as the chapel. (see Trial of Gabriel Lawrence, 20 April 1726 for an example of the term molly house in use, Trial of George Whytle, 20 April 1726 and Trial of Margaret Clap, 11 July 1726 for details on the chapel, and Trial of William Griffin, 20 April 1726 for molly houses taking lodgers.)
Mollies also had their own slang which I have a separate post on if you want to learn more about that.
Euphemisms
Euphemisms for men who had sex with other men included Back Gammon Player and Usher, or Gentleman of the Back Door. To navigate the windward passage was a euphemism for anal sex. (see The Classical Dictionary of the Vulgar Tongue, 1785.)
References to the classics were also sometimes used as euphemisms. A common example is Zeus's male lover Ganymede. (for an example see Public Advertiser, 4 Sept 1781)
Anal Sex Roles
The roles in anal sex were known as pathic (sometimes spelt Pathick) or patient (bottom) and agent (top). I have a longer post about the cultural perception of roles in anal sex if you're interested in that sort of thing.
Other Terms for Men Who Had Sex With Men
Pederast: In the 18th century the word pederasty was used synonymously with sodomy and did not denote age simply sex. An Universal Etymological English Dictionary (1726) defines “A pederast” as “a Buggerer” and “Pederasty” as “Buggery”.
Catamite: In particular catamite often, but not always, denoted the younger partner in a male-male sexual relationship. It was sometimes used to specifically describe boys but it was sometimes used it to describe men. Cocker's English Dictionary (1704) defines catamite as "a boy hired to be used contrary to nature, for Sodomy" but The New Royal and Universal English Dictionary (1763) defines catamite simply as "a sodomite." Catamite was also sometimes used as synonym for pathic.
Gomorrean: Like sodomite this one comes from the biblical story of Sodom and Gomorrah. However it wasn't nearly as commonly used. (for an example see The London Chronicle, 4 - 6 Jan 1757)
Madge Cull: This one came about towards the end of the century. It comes from a combination of Madge a slang term for “the female genitals” and Cull slang for “a man, a fellow, a chap.” (see Green’s Dictionary of Slang)
Women Who Had Sex With Women
Sodomy
While English common law did not consider sex between women sodomy this was not true across Europe. (see Louis Crompton, The Myth of Lesbian Impunity Capital Laws from 1270 to 1791) Most English colonies followed English common law however this aspect of the law was not unanimously agreed upon.
In 1636 Rev. John Cotton proposed to the General Court of Massachusetts a body of laws that would define sodomy as "a carnal fellowship of man with man, or woman with woman". (Crompton, p19)
In a 1779 bill submitted to the Virginia Assembly on crime and punishment Thomas Jefferson explicitly includes sex between women. He quotes Henry Finch's Law, or, a Discourse Thereof; in Four Books which defines sodomy as "carnal copulation against nature, to wit, of man or woman in the same sex, or of either of them with beasts." Jefferson disagrees with Finch on including bestiality because it "can never make any progress" and "cannot therefore be injurious to society in any great degree". However he doesn't dispute the inclusion of sex between women. He proposes that the punishment for sodomy be "if a man, by castration, if a woman, by cutting thro’ the cartilage of her nose a hole of one half inch diameter at the least." (see A Bill for Proportioning Crimes and Punishments in Cases Heretofore Capital, 18 June 1779)
While there was some disagreement on the legal definition of sodomy, colloquially if someone was talking about sodomy they were probably talking about sex between men. A clarification would likely be added if they were talking about women e.g. female sodomite.
Tribade
Coming from French tribade was defined in The New Pocket Dictionary of the French and English Languages (1781) as a "female sodomite". Tribade was used in English at least as early as 1585. It originally comes from the ancient Greek word τρίβειν meaning "rub" and is a reference to tribadism. The word tribadism however did not come into use until the 19th century. (see OED)
Sappho was a famous Tribade; as appears by the Testimonies of all the old Poets, but particularly from that beautiful Ode (addressed to one of the Ladies, with whom she was in Love) which Longinus has preserved, and which has ever been so highly esteemed by all the Critics.
~ William King, The Toast (1732)
Sapphic
Sapphic (sometimes spelt sapphick) originally meant "relating to, characteristic of, or reminiscent of Sappho or her writings". (OED) It became a term for sexual activity and sexual desire between women in reference of course to the accent Greek poet Sappho's love poems addressed to women. In fact in 18th century England Sappho was often cited as being the first woman who had ever had sex with another women.
Sappho, as she was one of the wittiest Women that ever the World bred, so she though with Reason, it would be expected she should make some Additions to a Science in which Womankind had been so successful: What dose she do then? Not content with our Sex, begins Amours with her own, and teaches the Female World a new Sort of Sin, call’d the Flats, that was follow’d not only in Lucian’s Time, but is practis’d frequently in Turkey, as well as at Twickenham at this day.
~ Satan’s Harvest Home (1749)
Sapphic is an adjective:
Look on that mountain of delight, Where grace and beauty doth unite, Where wreathed smiles must thrive; While Strawberry-hill at once doth prove, Taste, elegance, and Sapphick love, In gentle Kitty *****.
~ A Sapphick Epistle (1778)
Sapphism is a noun for the act or desire:
it has a Greek name now & is call’d Sapphism, but I never did hear of it in Italy where the Ladies are today exactly what Juvenal described them in his Time – neither better nor worse as I can find. Mrs Siddons has told me that her Sister was in personal Danger once from a female Fiend of this Sort; & I have no Reason to disbelieve the Assertion. Bath is a Cage of these unclean Birds I have a Notion, and London is a Sink for every Sin.
~ Hester Thrale Piozzi, Thraliana, 9 Dec 1795
Sapphist is a noun for the person:
Nature does get strangely out of Fashion sure enough: One hears of Things now, fit for the Pens of Petronius only, or Juvenal to record and satyrize: The Queen of France is at the Head of a Set of Monsters call’d by each other Sapphists, who boast her Example; and deserve to be thrown with the He Demons that haunt each other likewise, into Mount Vesuvius.
~ Hester Thrale Piozzi, Thraliana, 1 April 1789
Lesbian
Originally meaning "a native or inhabitant of the Greek island of Lesbos" (OED) this is another reference to Sappho who was from Lesbos.
However, this little Woman gave Myra more Pleasure than all the rest of her Lovers and Mistresses. She was therefore dignified with the Title of Chief of the Tribades or Lesbians.
~ William King, The Toast (1732)
Tommy
Tommy (plural tommies) is a fairly uniquely 18th century term as it doesn't seen to have been used earlier and is rarely used later. Speculatively it may be etymologically linked to tomboy which dates back to 1656. (OED)
Women and Men, in these unnat'ral Times, Are guilty equal of unnat'ral crimes: Woman with Woman act the Many Part, And kiss and press each other to the heart. Unnat'ral Crimes like these my Satire vex; I know a thousand Tommies 'mongst the Sex: And if they don't relinquish such a Crime, I'll give their Names to be the scoff of Time.
~ The Adulteress (1773)
Euphemisms
The game of flats, game at flats or simply flats was a euphemism for sex between women. Rictor Norton explains it was “a reference to games with playing cards, called ‘flats’, and an allusion to the rubbing together of two ‘flat’ female pudenda.” (Mother Clap’s Molly House, p233)
I am credibly informed, in order to render the Scheme of Iniquity still more extensive amongst us, a new and most abominable Vice has got footing among the W—n of Q—–y, by some call’d the Game at Flats;
~ Satan’s Harvest Home (1749)
In a diary entry Hester Thrale Piozzi repots "’tis a Joke in London now to say such a one visits Mrs. Darner". This was in reference to the rumours of sapphism that surrounded the sculptor Anne Damer. Piozzi goes on to recored a poem concerning Anne Damer's relationship with actress Elizabeth Farren that was being passed around her social circle:
Her little Stock of private Fame Will fall a Wreck to public Clamour, If Farren herds with her whose Name Approaches very near to Damn her.
~ Hester Thrale Piozzi, Thraliana, 9 Dec 1795 (see ‘Random Shafts of Malice?': The Outings of Anne Damer by Emma Donoghue for more on the rumours surrounding Anne Damer)
Absence of Sexual Attraction
With 18th century sexuality labels being action based rather than attraction based we have no exact equivalent for the word asexual. Just as we have no exact equivalent for the word homosexual. There was of course words for people who had never had sex (virgin, maiden) and words for people who planned on never having sex (celibate).
However this doesn't mean 18th century people had no way of talking about a lack of sexual attraction. The Chevalière d'Eon in a letter to the Comte de Broglie talks of "the natural lack of passion in my temperament, which has prevented my engaging in amorous intrigues”. Her lack of sexual interest became part of her self-styling as La Pucelle de Tonnerre (The Maiden of Tonnerre) after Joan of Arc who was known a La Pucelle d'Orléans (The Maiden of Orleans). (see D’Eon to the Comte de Broglie, 7 May 1771. Translated by Alfred Rieu, D'Eon de Beaumont, His Life and Times, p141; also for examples of the English press calling her La Pucelle d'Orléans see the Public Advertiser, 4 May & 11 June 1792)
The Third Sex/Gender
In the 18th century intersex people were predominantly referred to as hermaphrodites (while it is now considered offensive I will use it in this post as I think there is educational value in understanding it's historical use). In The Mysteries of Conjugal Love Reveal'd Written in French Nicholas de Venette explains that intersex people were permitted to "chuse either of the two Sexes". However if they strayed from the chosen role of man or woman they could be "punished like a Sodomite". (p465)
In the 18th century the words sex and gender were used somewhat synonymously. The word hermaphrodite along with third sex and third gender were used to describe not only intersex people but also gender nonconforming endosex people. Your clothes, interests, speech patterns and the way you move were all considered part of your sex.
Consider The Fribbleriad by David Garrick. Garrick was an actor known for playing fops. In the poem he portrays his critics as a group of effeminate men who were angry at him for they way he mocked them in his work:
In forty-eight— I well remember— Twelve years or more— the month November— May we no more such misery know! Since Garrick made OUR SEX a shew; And gave us up to such rude laughter, That few, ‘twas said, could hold their water: For He, that play'r, so mock’d our motions, Our dress, amusements, fancies, notions, So lisp’d our words and minc’d our steps, He made us pass for demi-reps. Tho’ wisely then we laugh’d it off, We’ll now return his wicked scoff.
"OUR SEX" is understood to be the sex of effeminate men. A sex distinct from that of acceptable manhood or womanhood which is defined by their "dress, amusements, fancies, notions" as well as the way they "lisp'd" their words and "minc’d" their steps.
John Bennett in his popular conduct book Letters to a Young Lady on a Variety of Useful and Interesting Subjects advises young women against wearing riding habits warning that they would "wholly unsex her". The Guardian reports that some people had "not injudiciously stiled" the riding Habit "Hermaphroditical". And The Spectator complains about riding Habits calling them an "Amphibious Dress" and describing women who wear them as "Hermaphrodites" and a "Mixture of two Sexes in one Person". (The Guardian, 1 September 1713, reprinted in The Guardian edited by John Calhoun Stephens, p 486; The Spectator 19 July, 1712)
The word amphibious is one that comes up a lot in the 18th century in regards to gender. A dictionary of the English language (1794) defines amphibious as "living in two elements". John Bennett describes effeminate men as "poor amphibious animals, that the best naturalists know not under what class to arrange."
Alexander Pope famously called Lord Hervey an "Amphibious Thing!" that acts "either Part". Lady Mary Wortley Montagu said that "this world consisted of men, women, and Herveys". And William Pulteney describes him as "delicate Hermaphodite", "a pretty, little, Master-Miss" and "a Lady Himself; or at least such a nice Composition of the two Sexes, that it is difficult to distinguish which is most predominant." (Alexander Pope, Epistle to Dr Arbuthnot; The Letters and Works of Lady Mary Wortley Montagu edited by Lord Wharncliffe, v1, p95; William Pulteney, A Proper Reply To a late Scurrilous Libel)
Macaroni, amazon, virago, fop, petit-maitre, coxcomb, amphibious, unsex, dandy, namby-pamby, he-she things, lady-fellow, master-miss, fribble, dubious gender. These were all terms to describe gender nonconforming people. Many of these terms were used in a derogatory way but not all of them were intended as such and some GNC people identified with some of these terms. For example a young Charles James Fox described himself as a petit-maitre in his 18 Oct, 1763 letter to his father. While at Eton, which he found "more disagreeable than I imagined", he laments "you may see the petit maître de Paris is converted into an Oxford Pedant."
Many of the people who were labeled as third sex/gender would not necessarily have identified as such. With even the smallest deviation from the norm giving rise to the label. Including one 1737 article which claimed that "Ugly Women" may "more properly be call'd a Third Sex, than a Part of the Fair one". (Common Sense, or The Englishman's Journal, 28, Feb)
Gender Presentation Through Gendered Language
While there is no real equivalent for the word transgender in 18th century English this doesn't mean people had no way of expressing their gender though language. People referred to themselves as being men, women, both or neither. Gendered names, titles and pronouns were also used to express one's gender.
The Chevalière d'Eon
D'Eon asserted her gender identity though gendered names, pronouns and titles. When she started openly living as a women she changed her first name to Charlotte making her full name Charlotte-Geneviève-Louise-Auguste-André-Timothée d’Eon de Beaumont. However she preferred the name Geneviève and would often write her name simply Geneviève d'Eon.
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[Admission-ticket for Geneviéve d'Eon, with red seal; c.1793; via The British Museum (C,2.3)]
D'Eon used she/her pronouns. Here is an example of her using she/her pronouns for herself when writing in third person:
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[Invitation from the Chevalière d’Eon to Lord Besborough; c.1791; via The British Museum (D,1.268-272)]
As she was French d'Eon used French titles even in English. She would sometimes use the title Mademoiselle (a title for unmarried women) but other times she used Chevalière. In 1763 she was awarded the Cross of Saint-Louis and with that came the masculine title Chevalier. When she started openly living as a women she switched from the masculine Chevalier to the feminine Chevalière. Perhaps the most fun example of her using the feminine Chevalière is the sword she gifted to George Keate which was inscribed: "Donné par la Chevalïere d’Eon à son ancïen Amï Geo: Keate Esquïre. 1777"
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[The Chevalière d’Eon’s Sword, hilt: c.1700s, blade: c.mid-1600s, inscription: c.1777, photos via the Royal Armouries Museum (IX.2034A)]
Public Universal Friend
The Public Universal Friend claimed to be a genderless spirit sent by god resurrected in the body of Jemima Wilkinson after she had succumbed to a fever in 1776. The Public Universal Friend gained a small but devoted group of followers that understood and respected the Friend as a genderless being. When one traveler asked for directions to "Jemima Wilkinson's house" a women replied that "she knew no such person; "the friend" lived a little piece below." (A Ride to Niagara in 1809 by Cooper Thomas, p37)
For the most part followers of the Public Universal Friend avoided using gendered pronouns for the Friend*. However they did not use gender neutral pronouns (such as they/them) but instead avoided third person pronouns completely. You can see an example of the sort of gender neutral language used for the friend in this letter from Sarah Richards to Ruth Pritchard:
Dear Ruth This is to be a Messenger of my Love to thee. Hold out faith and patience. Thy letter was very welcome to me. I want Thee should make ready to come where the Friend is in this Town. The Friend has got land enough here for all that will be faithful & true. Dear Ruth, I will inform thee that Benedict has given the Friend a Deed of some land in the second Seventh in the Boston perhemption, which Deed contains five lotts and the Friend has made use of my name to hold it in trust for the Friend, and now I hope the Friends will have a home, and like wise for the poor friends and such as have no helper, here no intruding feet cant enter. Farewell form thy Affectionate Friend, Sarah Richards
~ Sarah Richards to Ruth Pritchard, March 1793 (printed in The Unquiet World by Frances Dumas, p166)
* In contrast to followers that avoided gendered pronouns completely ex-follower Abner Brownell claimed that some followers called the Friend "him." (see A Mighty Baptism edited by Susan Juster & Lisa MacFarlane, p28)
It's impossible to seperate the Friend's genderlessness from the claim that the Friend was a messenger sent by god resurrected in the body of Jemima Wilkinson. The followers of the Public Universal Friend used genderless language as a way to indicate their religious devotion. In "Indescribable Being" Theological Performances of Genderlessness in the Society of the Publick Universal Friend, 1776-1819 Scott Larson explains:
The language one chose to describe the Friend indicated whether one was part of the community of the saved or part of the "wicked world." Conversely, community members and followers used the name "the Friend" quite deliberately, and that use became a marker of belonging. This sense of belonging could last longer than the community itself did. Huldah Davis, who was a child when the Friend left time in 1819, shared her memories of the Friend in 1895. In her recollections, Davis refers to Jemima Wilkinson but is careful to note that her parents, followers of the Friend, always referred to "the Friend," and Davis uses the community's language through most of her account. Language choices could also mark points of entering and exiting the community, as the apostate and denouncer Abner Brownell refers to "The Friend" in diary entries written during the time of his membership in the Friend's community but then calls "her" "Jemima Wilkinson" in his later published denunciation, Enthusiastical Errors, Described and Decried.
Mollies and Maiden Names
Gendered language could be used to express queer identity without necessarily expressing a transgender identity. Mollies took on feminine sobriquets known as maiden names. A maiden name was a typically made up of a combination of either a feminine title or name (molly and variations being the most popular) and often a reference to something notable about the individual. It could be a reference to their profession for example Orange Mary was an orange merchant, Dip-Candle Mary was a tallow chandler and Old Fish Hannah a fisherman. It could be a reference to where they were from for example Mrs. Girl of Redriff was presumably from Redriff. Some maiden names were somewhat suggestive like Miss Sweet Lips or Molly Soft-buttocks.
(Sources for maiden names: Orange Mary, Dip-Candle Mary, Old Fish Hannah, and Mrs. Girl of Redriff are mentioned in James Dalton's Narrative; Miss Sweet Lips is mentioned in The Phoenix of Sodom by Robert Holloway; Molly Soft-buttocks is mentioned in Account of the Life and Actions of Joseph Powis)
While mollies took on these feminine names, they more often than not still lived as men. Most mollies wore men's clothes, used he/him pronouns and referred to their partners as their husbands not their wives. (for the use of husband in the molly subculture see the trial of Martin Mackintosh, 11 July 1726 and the trial of George Whytle, 20 April 1726)
However some mollies did wear women's clothes and used (at least some of the time) feminine pronouns. Take for example Princess Seraphina who during the trial of Thomas Gordon (5 July 1732) is described by Mary Poplet as follows:
I have known her Highness a pretty while, she us’d to come to my House from Mr. Tull, to enquire after some Gentlemen of no very good Character; I have seen her several times in Women’s Cloaths, she commonly us’d to wear a white Gown, and a scarlet Cloak, with her Hair frizzled and curl’d all round her Forehead; and then she would so flutter her Fan, and make such fine Curties, that you would not have known her from a Woman: She takes great Delight in Balls and Masquerades, and always chuses to appear at them in a Female Dress, that she may have the Satisfaction of dancing with fine Gentlemen. Her Highness lives with Mr. Tull in Eagle-Court in the Strand, and calls him her Master, because she was Nurse to him and his Wife when they were both in a Salivation; but the Princess is rather Mr. Tull’s Friend, than his domestick Servant. I never heard that she had any other Name than the Princess Sraphina.
On a final note I would also recommend looking up many of these terms in the Oxford English Dictionary (you might be able to access this for free through your library) and Green's Dictionary of Slang both of which include multiple examples in use.
#sorry this took so long I couldn't resist making it far too long#if you want me to talk your ear off just ask me about 18th century queer language its my favourite topic#queer history
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