#Fire Knight Wego

[thysia]

For the sake of our Lord, we will burn it all down! - akiaji81

[nuadha-airgeadlamh]

concerning the specimen storehouse

Since the DLC released, I've seen some thoughts floating around about the Specimen Storehouse, Messmer, and how the Crusade contingent viewed the Hornsent. Specifically, I think it's quite a common idea to think of the Storehouse as a good thing, a sign from Messmer that he harbored a modicum of sympathy for the Hornsent and wanted to preserve their culture. I want to explain why I think this idea is very flawed, and why, on the contrary, I view the Storehouse as another testament to the horrors delivered upon the Hornsent by Messmer and his Crusade.

The ashes of Fire Knight Hilde give a glimpse into the construction of the Specimen Storehouse:

Hilde was a dear friend to Salza the sage, and joined those who urged that the specimens be preserved. Hilde's ashes were enshrined as a charm to protect the storehouse.

Hilde and Salza were part of a faction of Fire Knights who wanted the specimens to be preserved. This faction had to "urge" for this to occur; therefore, this must not have been a universal opinion among the Fire Knights, and a convincing case had to be brought forward in order for the Specimen Storehouse to go ahead. As this same item description points out, the Fire Knights answer directly to Messmer, so he would most likely have the final say. However, this makes it clear that the Specimen Storehouse was not his idea. If it was, there would have been no urging needed— he is the ruler of this keep and he makes the decisions.

The information on Salza further characterizes this faction within the Fire Knights. The item description for Salza's Hood sketches out his stand against violence:

"A disciple of the elder Wego, he refused to burn down an old ruin, at the risk of his own life."

Given Salza's positioning and its relative lack of damage, I would hazard that the "old ruin" in question here is Rauh. The description states that Salza protects this ruin "at the risk of his own life", and his placement puts him directly in opposition to Shadow Keep. He attacks at the end of the bridge and faces towards the keep; he targets us, and we are coming out of the keep. I think all of these facts point to the conclusion that Salza's instincts towards preservation estranged him from the rest of the Fire Knights, and that he is literally standing in defense of Rauh at the moment you encounter him. Why else would he be standing directly in front of Rauh, facing Shadow Keep, if he was not defending Rauh from Shadow Keep?

The description for Salza's incantation "Rain of Fire" reiterates his less violent outlook, but also importantly points out his hypocrisy.

"Salza's disdain for barbarism never waned, even as he burned more villages and scorched more land than any other."

Salza didn't want to engage in such violence, and he protected Rauh at the risk of his own life. But that doesn't erase the reality that he leaves behind a disgusting legacy of destruction and death. It begs the question: why do these specimens need preserving in the first place?

If the Crusade had never been waged, then the Specimen Storehouse would never have needed to exist. It sounds all nice and sweet on paper that there are Fire Knights out there "preserving Hornsent culture", but they are the very reason why this culture needs protecting. The Specimen Storehouse is a monument to their own atrocities: its very existence depends on an annihilation they orchestrated. Hilde, Salza, and the rest of them can be disgusted by their own actions as much as they want, but they are ultimately responsible.

It's also important to point out that neither Hilde's ashes nor Salza's Hood mentions any sympathy for the Hornsent themselves. They wanted the specimens to be preserved and protected a ruin from destruction; nowhere do these descriptions mention Salza and Hilde's great sympathy for the Hornsent's plight. Salza's big stand against Shadow Keep is protecting a ruin— not a city full of people, a ruin. He has a "disdain for barbarism", not a bleeding heart for those who are dying. In the Salza's Hood description, Salza is described as the "sage of the Fire Knights", and the term "sage" describes a person of great wisdom. The Specimen Storehouse is a giant library, a great depository of stolen Hornsent scholarship. I would hazard to say that Salza and Hilde's moves towards preservation stem more from a thirst for knowledge than a humanitarian urge to save Hornsent culture.

I've also seen it claimed that the shadow-men who attack with Messmer-fire in the Specimen Storehouse are Hornsent, and use this information to extrapolate about the Storehouse at large. However, this isn't true:

Here are images of Hornsent shadow-men in Belurat and Gravesite Plain. Their horns are clear, defined, and opaque, even with the shadow filter over their models.

This is an image of the spirit in front of Scorched Ruins without the shadow filter. You can see that the style of the horns remains consistent across designs.

Compare this with images of the shadow-men in the Specimen Storehouse:

Their head designs are markedly different from those of the Hornsent in Belurat. Their supposed "horns" are wispy and vague.

You can best see it in this photo where I'm clipping into his head that these "horns" are actually a layer of unruly hair. The little tufts of hair poking out from their heads can easily be mistaken as horns, but they do not match the other shadow-men in Belurat. Furthermore, their clothing also differs. While the Hornsent shadow-men wear tunics, the men in the Storehouse wear garments similar to togas. I think it's far more likely that these are Crusade scholars who are under the same shadow effect that happens to the other spirits in the Shadowlands. There is no Hornsent presence in the Storehouse.

Finally I would like to come to what Messmer thinks about the Specimen Storehouse, and for that, there's little that's actually textual. We know from Salza and Hilde that there was backlash to the construction of the Storehouse and the preservation of Hornsent knowledge from the wider Crusade contingent, and we know he must have consented to the Storehouse's construction, but there's no hard evidence as to what he truly thought of it. What we can do, however, is take a look at Messmer's characterization in-game and speculate from there what his opinions might have been, and what we can see about Messmer is that he clearly despises the Hornsent.

We know from our vengeance-seeking Hornsent that he thought of them as "savages"; the furnace golems are tailor-made to prey upon the Hornsents' fears through their references to the fire giants; the existence of the jar clinic and the protections around the shaman village imply he has knowledge of what happened to Marika and her people, which would only intensify his hatred. And we can't forget that he has taken it upon himself willingly to literally annihilate them from the face of the earth. Now, that's not to say that Messmer isn't a person capable of empathy and kindness; we know that through his relationships with Gaius, his Fire Knights, and his common soldiers. However, just because he can have sympathy for these people does not mean that that translates to the Hornsent. If I went into all the details of this I would double the length of this post (in fact I will probably make a whole separate post expanding on this), but I think Messmer as a character is allowed to contain contradictions— he can be capable of great cruelty and great kindness. I think it's clear from everything I've explained above that there are many pieces of evidence to indicate that Messmer did not harbor secret sympathy for the Hornsent.

Therefore, I would guess his approval of the Specimen Storehouse aligns with what I theorized for Salza and Hilde. The Storehouse is useful. It's a depository of an entire culture's knowledge; it would be foolish to throw that all away. As I've stated, the Storehouse's entire existence depends entirely on the genocide being enacting by Messmer and his Crusade. They are engaging in preservation only for their own benefit. The Hornsent gain nothing by having their own scholarly work snatched away from them and hoarded by the very ones who are murdering them.

[katyspersonal]

So like... thoughts on Messmer's crew? Not the man himself, just the guys he hired.

I actually found the remaining two Fire Knights just recently! :D I didn't post about it yet, but I assume this is all of them! ...I hope. Shadow's Keep has too many turns. Who knows.

This is sweet how they all are close with Messmer and stood with him no matter what.... Unlike THESE traitors:

(Sorry I forgot to copy the screenshots so have bad phone images fshhds) Like @heraldofcrow said earlier, it is really stupid how they could accept like genocides and whatever but drew the line at him being a snake sdfhfghds Well, Fire Knights definitely didn't!

Queelign was the first one I've met, and apparently in the wrong order since I missed him in Belurat and had to go back there! And I instantly hated that zealot, even before I had the picture of what exactly Fire Knights were!

^ As if Queelign's dialogue was not enough, he also dropped THIS! The reason I will ALWAYS respect Miyazaki no matter what is that he always finds the way to throw a jab at this particular grudge at human race fsdhfdsh

He is still a terrible person, but since then I warmed up to him when I've found some potential in him! He is not only the most fleshed out from the Fire Knights, but also in JUST the right way! He is very passionate and fanatical, but also very genuine and naive with his feelings. And he not only wants to be like Messmer, but also has very strong fixation on Marika! Like I keep joking, she is such a bad mother that even people who aren't her children have mommy issues over her fhhdsf

But he also, interestingly, reflects that weaker, childish part of Messmer that still wants his mom to love him. Whereas Messmer is at least good at repressing it, with Queelign it is completely loose and earnest, and the guy is probably not aware! He IS like a little version of himself in this way.. Not sure whether Messmer dislikes him, or pities him, or maybe at least several times told him to NOT try to be like him! In any case, it is really cool how there is the guy who gives that interesting insight. You could write headcanons essays on the psychology between Queeling and Messmer, or just Queelign. I wrote an essay on what could transpire if Tarnished healed him instead (I believe he dies when we find him, from deadly wounds since we only access his chamber after beating him twice).

Like, you can work with this character, you see what I mean? I never found a similar rambling potential in, say, Alfred or Lautrec. They're religious fanatics too, yet that was exactly ALL I could tell about them. MEANWHILE I've made like FIVE posts about Queelign already and they are all substancial! And, boy, any writer WANTS a strictly cruel, fanatical, irredeemable, negative character to give something to talk about besides just kicking the topic of them being bad. If you are writer, remember to similarly give the topics of discussion to your villains! I agree with what Izunia said earlier:

+ Correction though: Petrus does NOT belong in the list of fanatics xd He has opposite problem! He is a selfish, opportunistic, corrupt, cowardly parasite that benefits from the religious institution and doesn't actually HAVE any beliefs he will kill and die for. He kills for his benefit, like how he killed Reah after her being rescued clearly so she would not rat him out, ie risk his position as elite cleric! There is a good reason why of all cleric/religious/etc characters he is the only one who has no simps!

This guy kicked my ass a couple of times, but if Fire Knights are Messmer's most important people, that makes him second most important person in his army? ...okay third, after his wife Rellana fsdjhdfhssd Really clever how only the captain wears a helmet fashioned after this creature, since he keeps Messmer's military forces in check here

1) I also assume that the "loneliness" Wego experienced was from having outlived the people he held dear as not only being in the military but also elder! Because why else would he be strictly lonely, if he has friends within the covenant? Like look right here, he had a pupil! :p 2) This implies that disagreeing with Messmer was a huge risk.. but not only Messmer spared him, but also actually listened to his request!

So basically, Salza is okay with burning people and their homes, but he draws the line at destruction of like, culture, knowledge and ancient architecture fshfds And not he alone:

It were Fire Knights who asked Messmer to have the Specimen Storehouse, so there is at least historical remains about the species they destroyed! So as funny as the double standard looks, it makes a lot of sense; like it was mentioned earlier, all Fire Knights were nobles at the Erdtree! Of course they have it internalised to preserve culture and knowledge for the future! They all had to be well-educated and well-cultured people, not sympathising with the type of hatred that aims to erase as much as history! And at the same time, being educated didn't help them to consider not participating in the HoLy cRuSaDe to begin with..

And this is so human. It is very realistic. There is a lingering misconception that it is ignorance, poor quality of living, low class, bad past or all at once that makes people prone to crime, but in reality there are criminals in every class and every demographic. We should not attribute the root of all evil, crimes and harmful prejudices only to concrete group, because this is always just a matter of multiple people gathering and deciding to do something. When it is not mistreatment and despair that drives people to evil, it is power and corruption, because people ARE evil by nature.

_______________

So yeah, I really like what they did with this covenant! They did well with giving the sense of each of them being an individual by naming and distinguishing five characters like this! For Soulsborne games, this is rich x) They have some tweaks to their outfits or weapons, they have characterisation that makes them unlike each other, and THIS is what's wild; how so many people that clearly can and always could think for themselves ended up here! Queelign too! I could speculate that Alfred has been indoctrinated and brainwashed since young age, or that Lautrec lost his marbles after some sort of grasp by Fina, but Queelign apparently was no less of a noble that decided to go like his peers, nor he'd be any more embraced by Marika than everyone else with grace! He is Just Like This fshdfhs

They made the covenant very real an interesting. (Also rich for creating OCs if you like writing awful people and want to be close with Messmer 😔)

[dridersgeorg]

The fire knights were proving to be a challenge, one that Sandoval was having trouble overcoming, Messmer's forces were relentless, and left few openings to counter. Wego's knives raced like flashfire, and Sandoval's footing was unsure on the pond scum coating the stone floors of the Church District. He jumped backwards, dancing out of the way of a viciously timed swirling flame, and gripped the support beam above, vaulting into the rafters. These beams were damp, but a sight less slippery than the cobblestone.

"Coward," Wego sneered, launching another cursive fireball at him. Sandoval dropped, gripping the edge with one palm, straining to hold his grip.

"Clever," Sandoval winced, swinging his leg over the beam and aiming his crossbow. He pulled the trigger, lily-tipped darts firing in a spread towards the Fire Knight. "Did you learn that two-syllable word all by yourself?"

Wego swung backwards, all but one dart missing their mark. It glanced his forearm, and he gripped the wound. Sandoval dropped back to the ground, drawing his silver blade.

"You will bathe in the inferno-"

"Dark above, do you ever tire of listening to yourself?" He gritted his teeth, slicing open his hand. Black, half-congealed blood clung to the blade like sludge, almost bubbling upon contact with the air. He thrust forward, the tip of the blade puncturing Wego's thigh.

He spat in response, his daggers whirling out, leaving a light cut on Sandoval's cheek as he nearly avoided the advance.

Sandoval winced, and swung the sword across Wego's chest, rivulets of blood seeping through the gaps in his armor. He sputtered, stumbling backwards, gripping his chest.

"What... What have you done..." The blood vessels in his eyes snapped, red streams falling from his nose and lips. Sandoval gripped his oozing palm, holding it close to his chest. There wasn't time to apologize, to make amends. He moved past Wego as he fell to his knees, Sandoval's toxic ichor put to work.

He found his way to the chapel, putting his shoulder into the passage doors to force them open, and stepped on to the elevator, cleaning the blade off on his waistcloth. Callar was waiting for him - there wasn't a moment to lose.

The stone plinth descended rapidly, and quite a ways down. Shadow Keep was intimidatingly large, and he was having trouble getting his bearings. Every headless statue he encountered reminded him of the stone platform he'd abandoned - a crumbling, powerless god, decapitated at a timeless altar. He shivered, and made his way through the passage.

He could feel something ahead. St. Trina's guidance? His feet found the sap, the dredge of the Scadu Tree's lifeblood, oozing into a mire at its base. The sky had been eclipsed by its twining form, a haze rising from where it all pooled - and a lone, desiccated sunflower, solitary in the center. Trudging through the muck, he marched closer, squinting slightly.

The ground began to quake, and Sandoval found his footing, his hand on the hilt of his blade. The sap erupted, the Scadu Avatar swinging out of the earth, radiating malice and hatred. His eyes widened, as it dug its roots in, waves of deadly barbs rocketing across the pools towards him.

"Oh, for the love of-" He was launched into the air, the thorns tearing at his skin and his clothes. he landed on his back, the wind expelling violently from his lungs. Scrambling to his feet, Sandoval sprinted forward, and leapt, both hands on the hilt. He pivoted in the air, driving the blade into the great flower's face, using his weight and momentum to tear his sword downwards. It followed immediately downwards, pummeling him beneath it, the barbs from its roots once again piercing upwards into him.

It propelled itself violently into him, and he gathered the sum of his determination into withstanding its blows, countering when he could.

Finally, its great head collapsed in the sap, and Sandoval delivered a clean final blow, clutching his own ravaged torso with his golden arm. He let out a breath, and peered downward, wondering what it may have been guarding.

"Nothing...?" He breathed, his brow furrowing. That can't be right. Something was here. He could *feel* it.

And then the ground trembled once more. He leapt backwards in shock, as the fallen Sunflower arched its stem.

"No. No no no no-" It coiled, and shot itself forward, barreling towards him at a blinding speed, Sandoval flipping backwards out of its trajectory.

"You have *got* to be joking." Injured and struggling, be braced himself once more.

---

He gasped, crawling in the bog to the small, shining fragment in the sap. A shattered great rune, nearly crumbling in his hands. He used his sword to lean him to his feet, utterly exhausted and littered with cuts and punctures.

Kindly Miquella had discarded his shard here - an offering? An apology? He clutched it close to his chest, limping back the way he'd come.