#Destiny meta

[a-driftamongopenstars]

a few thoughts I had about the whole symbology around the Light and the Darkness, and especially with the new trailer dropped.

i love how much shapes are being put to the front of it all.

not just the title, although this is a part of it.

shapes are the most basic thing, it's how we learn. we learn to create from shapes, the most simple ones, circles and spheres, triangles and pyramids, squares, and then we built these complex things, but at the heart of it all - it's made of basic shapes.

there is something so... thematic about them. it's like going back to the basics, to the start, where there is black and white, right and wrong.

but it isn't that easy.

and then we arrive to the final shape.

as if the witness is trying to make it all... simple. to unify all these complex shapes into something singular, understandable, palatable.

but it doesn't work like that.

i don't know yet what those cubes are going to be within the new dlc, but they also look so wrong against this amazing, varied, colourful landscape. beautiful and terrifying and wrong, because you so rarely find perfection out in the wild.

anyway, it's about the shapes!!

[synnthamonsugar]

My issue with D2 isn't that it's bad.

Bad media can be, and frequently is, fun, strange, shocking, thought-provoking, entertaining. Bad media often has things to say (even if not said clearly), it's often heartfelt in ways that bigger and more-polished productions cannot be since it's more likely to be the brainchild of an individual or small team instead of a committee of writers working under tight managerial control.

Even through its better-crafted plot beats, I think Destiny (counting both games together here) has often felt bad to me. I say this with utmost love and respect. There are limits to its model of storytelling, and there have always been plot holes, strange bits of characterization, setups without payoffs, weird dialog, gameplay-narrative dissonance, etc. and I think it's easy to focus so much on the high points in its history that we forget that being bad isn't atypical for Destiny, and that this is fine!

The issue is, it used to be that even when it was bad it was genuine, meticulously detailed, oozing with character and heart in every line and lore tab, had bits of world-building and background that made me desperate to know more. It was a rambling story from a friend, who might not have a point but they're so into telling it that it becomes the most interesting thing in the world to listen to. I think, for much of Destiny's history, you could feel Bungie was putting their whole back into it, that the creators made it with love and care. It was impossible not to get invested in return, even when it was a little corny.

The issue is, it doesn't feel like that anymore. It feels like something that's being made because it's contractually obligated. It feels like something neither Bungie nor the creative team wants to put effort into, and I frankly cannot blame the creative team given what we know is going on behind the scenes. That doesn't make it less disappointing or frustrating - in fact it might make it worse because I can't help but see it as something being made under a level of duress. (More than the typical level, for anything made in capitalism.) But it certainly explains why.

And of course, given we know they're trying to make the bottom line there's always the question of how much executive meddling is affecting the story. I definitely have qualms with some of the narrative team, but I do wonder what Destiny would look like today without the stress of meeting sales goals and deadlines.

I think you can sort bad media into roughly two buckets. There's the good-bad media, the kind I talked about, the passion projects bristling with heart and character and vision if nothing else. Then there's the bad-bad ones, the ones that were produced to make a paycheck, be consumed and forgotten ...

My (rhetorical) question is: why should I care about something whose creators don't care about it? If something is a cynical cash grab, how can I feel anything but cynicism toward it?

[cassiefisherdrake]

The game refers to The Witness as "they/them" multiple times.

Hi, anon! Because you provided zero evidence (really? I'm not mad at all about your assertion, but, man, not even one bit of evidence provided? Come on, at least help me out here), I went on a search by myself. The dialogue I remember used only it/its, but one lore piece seems to flip it and they but only in a certain condition (discussed at the end), while it/its remains the primary pronoun used to refer to the Witness. I have provided five examples of the 40ish lore entries that I read that used pronouns for the Witness. All entries below are Final Shape lore entries (thus, spoilers abound) as that remains the most current content, with it/its highlighted in yellow and they/them in purple.

Matadoxiá:

(Oops, only just noticed I missed one more it/its pronoun usage here re: "... waiting to be freed by its hand." I'm on my phone and my hands are cramping from all the swapping back and forth between tabs and photo editing, ngl.)

The First Knife (ship):

Gifted Conviction:

The Final Shape (quest lines):

And you wanna know what I noticed? With evidence? Every time a character refers to the Witness, the pronouns are it/its. When referring to itself (in the third-person, thus when not using the first-person collective we/our/us that it more commonly uses), the pronouns are it/its. RARELY when referring to itself, the pronouns are they/them. In fact, of all the lore I looked at, the two purple highlights I saw up there were the ONLY they/them usages that I found, both in the same entry, lending to why I decided to use only Final Shape entries versus, say, Lightfall or something (where it/its retains the same usage). I should also note that pronouns are self-determined; some people have pronouns that are used exclusively for themself, not to be used by others. This could be the case here, though we'll likely never have an answer on that front. More likely, the two instances they/their used in that singular lore entry, Matadoxiá, seems to be referring not to the Witness itself but to the individuals of its species who existed before the Witness became what it is.

Noting again, searching through Lightfall and a few other seasons, I only found more usage of it/its, none of they/them. But also again, I'm on my phone, and after reading about 40-some entries that all said it/its only, I kinda gave up searching further for now. I might take some time later on my computer when my head doesn't hurt as much. If you find some current they/them pronoun usage evidence, I'm genuinely happy to look at it, but this is it for me for right now.

Please also note that this is about the English version of the game which is, ya know, the native language of the game. Not all languages have an equivalent pronoun to it/its and not all translators, whom have their own personal biases, may have followed the same it/its usage equivalent even in languages where such an equivalent exists.

Moral of the story?

It/its is the current primary pronoun of the Witness and the only one used by other characters to refer to the Witness.

(Seriously, what is the beef with just using it/its with some people? Not necessarily @ you, anon, just that people can be so cruel when it comes it/its usage. Just say it/its first and foremost. This is basic, entry levels of respect for talking to or about it/its users.)

[locrianking]

Lightfall & Aspect

hi destiny tumblr!

it’s me, your local lore geek. as we speak, i am working on a (long!) meta post about the connections between the lightfall campaign & the aspect lorebook. i haven’t really seen people talking about these ties so i wanted to do it myself.

in the time it takes me to write this, i really really encourage anyone confused about lightfall to read aspect! if nothing else, read it so you can rip my theories to shreds when i finish this meta. but seriously i can’t encourage it enough, go check out aspect please

[cassiefisherdrake]

I know we'll never have a definitive answer and therefore can only really play in the sandbox here, but a few things are possible given what we know of Fundament but also the proto-Hive krill which can give a lot of credence to 3 year-old siblings being navigators, engineers, etc. Namely, we know Fundament is a gas giant - usually these types of planets have an orbit that is further from the star it orbits, most of their heat generated by planetary action rather than proximity to their star. The next factor is star size. If we assume Fundament was orbiting a star similar to ours (small, yellow, burns around 6000 Kelvin) and we assume all gas giants function the way the Solar System's do, the nearest Fundament could be to its sun would be Jupiter with an orbital period of 12 Earth years. This would put 3 year-old krill at between 36 and 47 Earth years of age which, if the Hive grow on a scale even somewhat relative to humans, would make a lot of sense for all of their abilities by the time the siblings go diving around looking for answers. Given the flashbacks to Sathona don't have red-coloured skies (I think they're a green-blue?) or anything that might indicate a red star, it's not impossible for their star to be similarly yellow like ours.

But assuming they have a different star that burns at a lower temperature or a different mass, Fundament could be theoretically much, much closer to its sun, and therefore have a much smaller orbital period. Their year could start becoming less than that 12-year orbital period, fractional to an Earth year, or even become exactly an Earth year in length. But without a lot of proof for Fundament's star, we can run circles around this idea all day without getting anywhere, so my ideas lend toward what is more plausible for a lifespan, not in years but in biology?

Now, the suggestion is that a 3 year-old by Earth standards couldn't do the things that the siblings do in the Books of Sorrow is, in my opinion, not supported by anything! Not even just from orbital period and year length but biology. This suggestion relies on aging like humans do... but most animals on Earth don't have lifespans comparable to humans. If you take the average animal, you're likely to get an insect which lives months to days. They have to rapidly mature to survive. Given their size, this is a lower energy expenditure and therefore can be done more rapidly. But lots of animals get to human sizes and still only have a fractional lifespan compared to a human. A really typical example of this might even live in your house: a dog!

Dogs live an average of 10-14 (Earth) years, though this is highly breed-dependent. Obviously some can live closer to 20 if very healthy and lucky on the genetic lottery. Many large dog breeds grow to the same weight ranges as humans (and some even larger!) and have average lifespans of 10-12 years, so pretty comparable to a proto-Hive krill. Dogs tend to reach adult maturity around 16 months, though this can take up to closer to 2 years for larger dogs. At this age, they're already settled into the personalities they'll have for the rest of their adult lives, capable of breeding without age-related complications, and more.

Well. Feels funny to compare krill to large dogs biologically, but anyway. It is technically possible for krill to have aged similarly to dogs in exactly Earth-length years. And, in my opinion, it's way more compelling for 3 year-olds afraid of death to old age at 10 years and of a terrifyingly close apocalyptic event to be battling against than for the event to actually be Earth-decades away. It adds a severe tension to the story that lends to their incredible desperation to save themselves and the rest of the krill by any means, including giving oneself over to something they barely understand and have to bargain to achieve.

A caveat though: the Hive are not my niche of enemy faction so there might be information I don't know well enough to make more accurate guesses! But Hive growing on scales relative to dogs, cats, etc. and reaching adult maturity even before age 3, only to die at age 10? Yeah, perfectly biologically plausible!

i wonder how many earth years fundament's year counts

cuz we are told that krill are naturally shortlived and live only 10 years at best but... 10 years of fundament. how long is one fundament year though?

like, considering some eliksni are pre-golden age and still kicking, avarge 300 years golden age human lifespan is laughable. if one fundament year is, idk, 6 earth years? 10 fundament years would be 60. not ideal and pathetic among many species but also not that bad honestly. also more plausible than "they were literally 3 earth years old and already were navigators, engeneers, martial artists ect."

[writing-for-life]

The Endless Are Not Their Opposite--They Only Define It

I read quite often, on here and elsewhere, that the Endless are also their opposite (@tickldpnk8 and I were just talking about an interesting thread on Reddit), so I just decided to speed-complete this one and get it out of my drafts before it dies in there (so not as much in-depth as originally planned, but sometimes, you just need to run with it 🤣).

The Endless are not their opposite. They define it. It’s a (in my mind, and I’d love to hear what you think) massive difference. And they define their opposite by their absence. If they truly were their opposite, it would give very different meaning to canon, and if we were to do so, a lot of it wouldn't make sense in my view.

Dream is not also reality. He defines it. He is, and forever will be, unreality. It is his absence that defines reality. A dream that becomes real isn't a dream anymore--it's real. That’s the main reason why pulling the ship into reality in Overture weakens him. If he were reality, he could have just snapped his fingers and make it happen. If he were reality, a lot of his problems wouldn't be... well, problems. The fact he is (a) D/dream is pretty much why all his relationships are doomed to fail. Dreams don't last. Dreams are forever strange and can't be truly known.

Delirium is not also sanity/clarity. She defines it through her absence. And when she pulls herself together like in Brief Lives, it hurts her "muchly". It is immeasurable pain for her because it is what she is not and cannot be for any extended period of time without hurting herself.

Despair is not also hope. She defines it via her absence. As long as you hope, you don’t despair. If Despair were also hope, we would not have 6 issues of Overture very clearly showing us who and what H/hope is. If Despair were also hope, we wouldn't need a little girl called Hope reach out her hand and touch Dream—he would have a sister who could do it. But the only time Despair shows up for him, so to speak, is after he killed Orpheus—make of that what you will.

Death is not also life. She defines it. The fact that she is there at your beginning does not mean she is the one who gives you life. She is there so you will remember her, always (and especially when she takes your hand), hence you will cherish life. She does not directly give life to immortals either--they are immortal because of her absence, because she withholds her gift, like she does with Orpheus and Hob (the Eblis-situation has nothing to do with anything in my mind and is linked to a funeral rite, and we are clearly told it is not something she usually does [“it’s been so long”], or is remotely comfortable doing. It is just that she is the Endless that is most life-adjacent and hence the one who will have to do it. Just like Dream is the most reality-adjacent and hence the one who has to pull the ship).

Destruction is not also creation. He defines it. He is what gives us the blank slate, he is what makes creation possible, he is what starts the cycle and ends it, but he is not creation himself. Keeping on destroying makes creation impossible. There needs to be a pause, a break for creation to come to fruition—the absence of destruction. If he were also creation, he wouldn't create so badly (to the extent that it is canonically turned into a running gag), and being around him and seeking him out wouldn't be an issue. But it is.

Desire is not also hatred (I’m still not sure if hatred is really the opposite of desire, but I’ll run with it because that’s what Gaiman chose). They define it via their absence. You know how Dream doesn’t want Desire in his life anymore after one major spat (whether he had reason to or overreacted isn’t really the issue). And what feelings are often left in the absence of Desire? And what does Desire feel and gets themselves tangled up in because they are pushed away and are basically not acknowledged/desired by their own sibling despite constantly trying to show him they are important (desire is not just a sexual thing, people, get your mind out of the gutter 🤣)? Yeah, about that one… There is definitely a different type of enmeshment here which sometimes seems a bit plot-hole-y to me, but I think that might be down to the fact that Desire is the chosen antagonist (and even that, only to a degree until they aren’t). Even so, it still makes sense.

Destiny is not also freedom. He is the absence of it. All paths lead to the same end. Or a decision you make was the decision you were going to make all along, and what looks like a different ending was the ending that would have happened anyway. And even if you choose, the book will start to make that choice destiny again. Only Delirium knows what’s not in his book, and in this universe, the only true freedom is not bound by any rules, logic or sanity…

[the-kaedageist]

I can't stop thinking about the developing dynamic between Essek and Fearne, especially since Fearne seems to have discovered a particular joy in needling him, possibly because a lot of his sarcasm has been aimed at her.

But then there was that little moment where Fearne said, "I thought you said don't touch anything" and Essek gave her that little smile and replied, "I'm not touching it, am I?", and I thought - oh. He's starting to like these little shits, especially the faun who won't stop giving him trouble. From Fearne's reaction to this - the mocking that turned into a grin, calling him cheeky - you can see her starting to understand Essek's particular brand of humor in return.

It would be so hilarious if Essek comes out of this adventure having been adopted by an entirely new adventuring party who have forced friendship on him. I can think of nothing I'd wish for him more than that.

[starcurtain]

Following Topaz's explanation that Cornerstones are made to fill the hole in the user's heart, what "hole" in Aven's heart do you think his drag queen powers are meant to fill? Especially since Topaz remarks he's the only one with such showy powers

Still trying to catch up with all the messages in the inbox; sorry to everyone for taking a million years to respond.

So cunty, and for what???

Anyway, first, when Jade talks about the Stonehearts' "voids," the alternate reading above that word is actually "ambition." And she mentions that the reason she risked reaching out to Firefly is that she views herself as similar to Firefly--Jade is someone with an unfulfilled wish.

I think there's enough here to suggest that the Stonehearts' voids are not quite what we would normally think of when hearing the word "void"--rather than being best understood as something removed or something lost, their voids seem to be "something desired." An unfulfilled goal. An unmet need. A burning ambition. A secret wish. They all have somewhere they want to get to, and they've signed on-board with Diamond's Preservation project because his power is the fastest way--maybe the only way--to get there.

The implication here, by the way, is that the Stonehearts are acting out the very act of Preservation itself with Diamond. The goal of Qlipoth is for the universe to be saved, an unshakeable resolution to stop Destruction's wanton obliteration. Thus, Preservation itself can be understood as "A desire that must be continuously protected and relentlessly pursued." To live. To endure.

In using the power of an emanator to protect and provide the Stonehearts with ways to pursue their own desires, we replicate in miniature the exact resolve and endless pursuit of perseverance that Qlipoth is acting out in the broader universe. The will of Preservation empowers the Stonehearts--and in turn, the Stonehearts swear an oath to aid in Preservation's mission. It's a mutually beneficial arrangement, and it also simultaneously imitates Jade's shop perfectly: I'll give you exactly what you want, if you give me what I need.

I should clarify that I don't actually think the cornerstones themselves fill the Stonehearts' voids. Rather, they seem to me to be a tangible symbol of the oath between Diamond and the Stonehearts--"I'll give you this power to fulfill your deepest wish, if you work for me." Jade suggests that the power of the cornerstones provides Stonehearts with the means to fill their voids (I.e., having superpowers makes it possible for you to pursue your wish), so I think their individual cornerstone abilities are best understood as "The exact power I need to achieve my particular goal."

So what does that say about Aventurine's "showy" transformation?

Pretty much all the rest of this is just going to be my personal speculation, but I'd say the most telling glimpse we get into why Aventurine's power is so "visual" comes from these lines with the future "Aventurine" in 2.1:

There's two completely contradictory desires being expressed here: Aventurine's life "is the chip he's most eager to lay down" and "always has been"--that is, he genuinely wants to die. He isn't just willing to gamble with his life, he's eager to. The future "Aventurine" also says real Aventurine wants to be "polished up" (to be controlled and molded by others) and "cuffed with red-hot chains" (to be made powerless and not responsible for making his own decisions, to be punished).

But conversely, the real Aventurine also wants to be perceived as "a smooth operator" and "the solid gold deal-maker who doesn't waste a drop of sweat." He wants to be in charge of his image. He wants to be the one who controls the narrative and defines how others think of him. He wants to be "spotlit center stage"--to command the eyes of the world. In short, we could say that Aventurine wants his death (and conversely, his life) to mean something.

From these conflicting desires, I think you can derive a few totally opposite but equally valid interpretations of why Aventurine's cornerstone power is so "visual":

A combat-oriented transformation is another means to seek death.

Jade's power is scary, but she isn't using it to literally launch herself into fights. Topaz's seems to be similar--something that might allow her to win over her opponents in some way (she was about to use it in Belobog to no-sell the Trailblazer), but she clarifies directly that it is not a "transformation." Aventurine just literally turns into a boss enemy and goes straight out on to the battlefield.

In the fight, he doesn't even use shields. (Now whether that's something he never does because the cornerstone powers don't actually come with shields while in his monster form, if he couldn't use shields because his cornerstone was broken, or if he just chose not to use shields in this fight to give Trailblazer and Co. a fighting chance, only time will tell. However, it might be worth noting that his empowered Apocalyptic Shadow form doesn't come with shields either, despite having other new mechanics.)

The point is, this form, while looking cool and seeming strong, is actually a gamble in and of itself. To go out onto the battlefield, where you might not actually be the strongest combatant, is always a risk. And I think this is the kind of risk that Aventurine manifests continually in his life. He is constantly creating opportunities for his own luck to fail. His unfulfilled desire, the "ambition" he was desperate enough to join the Stonehearts to pursue--as his original goal to save his people is completely gone, his only current goal might actually just be a chance to die. His powers may manifest as a combat-oriented transformation because that is just one more way to throw himself into the crossfire.

In fact, this is exactly what Sugilite accuses him of in Jade's myriad celestia:

You didn't need to snatch his wig this hard, Sugilite. (Also I need you all to know I originally wrote "You didn't need to come for him this hard, Sugilite," but then I realized how unfortunate that wording was, so...)

You could even argue that the fact Aventurine's transformation comes with a mask that obscures his entire face is a sign that we're supposed to see this form as dehumanizing.

The facial features are completely obscured and asymmetrical, there's no mouth, his fingers have become claws--despite his body staying mostly human-shaped, it's obviously intended to hint at something monstrous, subsuming his original identity behind a violent facade.

Kakavasha disappears entirely behind "Aventurine" when he transforms, becoming a faceless enemy at the risk of (perhaps in hopes of) entirely losing himself. Maybe every transformation lets Aventurine throw himself closer and closer to the edge of death--and perhaps, before Penacony, only death could ever have filled the "void."

But, on the complete opposite hand (because Aventurine is always both sides of the coin), we could also argue the other end of the spectrum entirely:

A combat-oriented transformation is a show of force.

This screencap brought to you by Mr. Rubhen925 of Youtube.

Aventurine's entire life has been marred by disenfranchisement, by violations of his basic human rights, freedoms, and agency. At every turn, he has been victimized by others more powerful than himself: his childhood consisted of his clan being relentlessly hounded and hunted to extinction by the Katicans, having their food constantly stolen, their meager belongings burned to the ground, and each one of his family members systematically slaughtered, often in front of his eyes.

After his childhood, he was bought and sold as chattel for pennies, branded like an animal, and forced into a fight where to he had to beat other innocent people to death just to keep himself alive, all for the entertainment of the masses. Even Jade, who promised to help him achieve his goals, treats him like a business investment more than a friend.

In Penacony, we watch everyone he talks to degrade and ostracize him. Even though Aventurine led him into doing it, Sunday tortures and re-traumatizes him live for our entertainment.

Even more that, we see Aventurine constantly struggling with the question of whether his life is really his own or whether his blessing from Gaiathra means that his entire existence has been predetermined, his fate sealed in blood and sand from the very moment of his birth, utterly inescapable.

No matter how Aventurine tries to portray himself as the ultimate winner, he's only ever the "final" victor--being the only one left standing at the end is meaningless if on the road to getting there, you were treated like fate's favorite punching bag. Winning in the end is utterly pointless if on the road to winning, you still lost it all first, from the things you loved to your personal freedom.

What does a person who has been made powerless again and again truly desire? What void do you seek to fill if life has denied you your agency over and over?

Power. Dominance. The ability to literally strike back at those who've wronged you. The strength to intimidate and force people into a corner the way you've been intimidated and forced before.

If we say that Aventurine's "void" is not a literal desire for the release of death, then it might make sense for the "void" to instead to be a frantic desire to gain control over his circumstances. To be the one finally in charge of deciding his own fate.

Particularly in light of his character story which tells us that Kakavasha's original goal for joining the Stonehearts was to save his people, the desire to take on an impressive form that screams "I'm powerful" and has the ability to physically enact vengeance on others feels directly aligned. And it remains aligned even after the reveal that the Avgins are all gone--once more fate strips Kakavasha of his power to make a difference in the world, to achieve what he truly dreams of.

The Apocalyptic Shadow version of his boss fight is called "Desperate Diceroller."

How angry he must be, deep down. How hateful the world must seem. How sad it is to feel that way.

If destiny won't let you out of the cage, your only choice is to grow claws to tear it open.

Okay, but WHY so much swag though?

Are the peacock feathers and spandex really necessary?

Listen. Everyone talks about Ratio having "gifted kid" syndrome, but I'm here to tell you that Aventurine is actually a burnt out gifted kid extraordinaire.

He's literally, canonically, explicitly the chosen one of his people.

From the moment of his birth, his mother and sister--and presumably others in his clan even--were telling him that he was their clan's most precious treasure and that he would lead them to prosperity and safety.

He carried this weight even after fleeing from the massacre, all through his childhood and teenage years, through slavery and abuse, putting his very life on the line to join the IPC in hopes of finally fulfilling the destiny his mother and sister promised he could.

He was supposed to save them. That was his meaning. That was his purpose in life.

But he was too late.

The fate he was born for, raised believing, and risked everything to achieve... is still incomplete.

So, for all that talk about suicide and power-seeking, my real answer is this: Aventurine's "void" is his unfulfilled destiny.

His whole existence has been predetermined, his life's journey laid out in prophecy and blessings from the very beginning. Yet what he thought was his fate betrayed him, and where you head after becoming an unsuccessful chosen one is a question without answer.

His thoughts constantly circle around how he is a "failure" and a "loser."

When you have no sense of purpose, when your life has no meaning, when what you are still seeking is the role you were supposed to have from the moment of your birth: the glorious destiny of being a savior, being the "happiness" of your people, being the hero...

Of course you crave the spectacle. Of course you long for the spotlight--you long to be recognized. Because Kakavasha's the chosen one. "Spotlit center stage" is where he's supposed to be--in the leading role that was stolen from him.

I think that Aventurine's cornerstone transformation is so flashy because, at the core, it represents a longing to truly be the "precious wealth" of the Avgin that his sister promised him he would be. It represents his desire to transform from a useless, "discarded" person into a larger-than-life version of himself. (Hey, fun fact, out of every official depiction of Aventurine, his boss model wears the only outfit in which his slave brand is not naturally visible.) He literally transforms into a supernatural being, capable of seizing others' fates in his hands. It represents the power he needed to save his people and himself. Its extreme flashiness screams for attention, demands to be witnessed as something beyond a helpless human.

It's almost as if Aventurine is a child writing a wish-fulfillment story where he transforms into a hyper-glamorous, all-powerful masked superhero who is capable of saving the day and winning against his enemies every time.

Unlike Jade and Topaz, Aventurine can't hide his deepest desire. It was always going to be a "transformation," because Aventurine's unanswered wish is to be someone better than himself.

His "void," his deepest unachieved ambition--it's written right there, all over his body.

Aventurine's cornerstone power is a story he's telling himself about the person he was supposed to be.

But as Acheron claims, that's life itself.

Aventurine doesn't feel like he has any control over his journey's ultimate destination.

He doesn't know where's he's headed or what the purpose of it all is. But...

Jade explicitly describes the Ten Stonehearts and Diamond's endeavor as a "journey" as well:

Because Preservation represents the continuance of life itself, and the Stonehearts with their endless "voids"--Aventurine with his soul-deep longing to become someone better than himself--represent all of us very real human beings, trying our best to find our own "cornerstones," to gain the means to finally, finally achieve our own sweet dreams.

[cassiefisherdrake]

This is a wonderful discussion and I think hits the nail on the head regarding the seemingly polar views of the community at large! I have a lot of fun playing in the sandbox, but it can be very frustrating at times listening to the other kids complain about there being sand in the sandbox. There are definitely gripes to be had about Destiny and I think you nailed a goodly portion of them. It is really cool to see this from a newly returned player (welcome back)! There is something I want to comment on re: DLCs/expansions and vaulting, not as a critique to you but as something I almost never see people mention when it comes to paying for new content. Specifically: Bungie has devs - real people and employees who make the game - that need to get paid. I also wanna talk on a pipe dream I have re: losing seasonal and vaulted content, just because I think it's a neat idea that I would love for Bungie to some day hear if more people voice it.

As much as it can suck constantly paying for new DLC and expansions... yeah, this is a live game and you (general you, not you specifically, op) have to accept that means paying for new content, but ALSO it means you have to acknowledge that you are getting these things because a group of people in real life worked on those things and have to get paid for them. We are paying for these things because base Destiny is free to play (F2P), and as with all F2P games, they rely on people loving the game enough to buy extra content. We are getting this extra content because someone out there - a lot of someones out there, even - is very hard at work to create extra content. It isn't just "this is the way of gaming nowadays," it is "we are constantly being given new content that somebody made and somebody has to get paid to make a living." It is equivalent exchange. We pay $12 (formerly $10) a season for hours and hours of new content in the forms of new storylines, new dialogue, new maps, new mechanics, new weapons. And for each and every one of those - and many more that I didn't list, like QA/QC bug-wrangling - someone worked very hard to give it to us. This isn't Jax & Daxter or Uncharted or Celeste or Professor Layton or any other one-time linear storyline game where the product is shipped with the story complete and ready to be played start to finish. This is a constantly evolving story! And to get more evolutions of this story, we have to pay the devs. Otherwise, there will never be ANY new content. This is an equivalent exchange: just the same as you have to pay once for a one-time linear story game, you have to pay multiple small increments to get new, ever-evolving stories from live service games.

Now, don't get me wrong, it sucks major booty that we lose seasonal and vaulted content once it's done. We lose what we paid for and it SUCKS. I am very, very, VERY much a proponent of "if I pay for something to own, I should own it forever" (which is why I am a disc >>> digital player forever) and something that genuinely bothers me a LOT re: Bungie's current strategies. I wish so badly I could replay the Red War and Forsaken and some of those early missions. Unfortunately, there are really only a limited number of solutions to this: increase game data bulk (which gamers, as you the op described, are already upset about), increase irl server banks so our consoles don't have to directly store the content and instead stream it from these servers (which means Bungie has to buy the server space irl which means we have to pay Bungie more so they can buy and maintain those servers - this is the case with FFXIV and just look at their subscription rates), or... we ask Bungie to add a rotating vault playlist, which is something I have mentioned to my clan a few times.

My idea is that this playlist allows players old and new to play previous seasonal and vaulted content by rotating it through once a month (or thereabouts - idk what good timing would actually be so for now I am just saying one month). Once a month, this playlist will contain 2 activities: one expansion that has been discontinued and one seasonal storyline. Every month, it rotates to a new expansion and storyline, allowing players new and old to experience or re-experience previous storylines. If you think about it, this is very similar to the legacy raids! It would reduce FOMO which currently ostracizes new and returning players, allows veteran players to return to and access content they once paid for, and keeps game data bulk/server storage at (I think) only slightly higher than current standards. This could also help them achieve the 'we are no longer vaulting/sunsetting content' without driving up data bulk.

This kinda got away from me but I hope this all makes sense. Again, not a criticism for you at all, op, just an observation and a suggestion for Bungie that I hope the community at large picks up one day.

The difference between "fanatics and gamers"

So basically I'm just gonna word vomit about this topic in regards to destiny because it's been on my mind a lot recently since I've came back to destiny and I've been watching a few vids on the whole discourse surrounding destiny and it's state as a game and feel like I've kinda come to a resolution in my mind about why a lot of this is happening and why some people feel differently about the game. PSA this post isn't supposed to be some big angry discussion trying to say people's concerns about the game is wrong or invalid I kinda jus wanna spew my thoughts out there but do feel free to comment your thoughts about it if you wanna discuss it!

So I start by differentiating between "fanatics" and "gamers" which probably seems like a cringey way to put it but it's the only kind of physical representation of both sides that I could think of. So fanatics are people I'd describe as being absorbed in every aspect of the game, lore, art comics, gameplay, characters etc the type of people who are out here writing fanfics and creating ocs where as gamers are people that are here solely for the game itself. They are playing a game for its mechanics and enjoyment and their involvement in the greater community doesn't span much further than that. They might be interested in the lore (obviously you'd have to enjoy the story to play the game in the first place) but they're not out here making their own content in regards to the game i.e reading/creating fanfics and ocs etc. Now after establishing what each side means from what I can tell the people most upset by the state of the game are the gamers while the ones defending the Devs and just having a good time within the game and it's universe are the fanatics.

So why are people mad?

Well both sides seem mad in the current situation of destiny. The gamers are upset that the contents running dry and the fanatics are getting upset about the gamers constant anger and bashing directed towards the game and the Devs. Like don't get me wrong I understand where people come from when they're annoyed about bugs, it makes the game harder to play and then there's the issue of content running dry and then the vaulting of older content (something that I find extremely upsetting). But I think the constant negative approach towards these issues isn't always healthy to the game, play wise and the actual players mental health wise. I recently watched Mr Fruits video on this talking about the video Datto made and I think the main message there is something that so many gamers need to keep in mind and it's that if your not having fun playing a game and you can't find anymore satisfaction from it play something else. If your playing a game for the content it's Devs are providing you and that content isn't as fulfilling and entertaining for you anymore then just play something else for a while. I think a lot of people have these really unrealistic expectations as to what the Devs can produce within the game and I think if you believe the Devs are seeing the discourse going on in the community and people voicing their issues with the game and are just deciding to sit back idly and do nothing about it then you're a fukin idiot. The people at Bungie are just that, people. People with limitations. There's probably an infinite amount of reasons as to why the issues that're there are there and these things will take a long ass time to fix. If they were easy to fix everyone and their nan would be making bestselling games. In terms of content running dry for people of course this is gonna happen. There's a limit on people's creativity and the amount of content a single group of people are able to produce. And with the amount of content already in the game it's gonna be extremely hard to make new content that's cohesive and makes sense in the greater universe of the game. So yeah it might've only taken you a couple tens of hours to complete the campaign content with your clan full of experienced players but that's not what it's there for in my opinion. The game isn't there to just be played it's there to be enjoyed fully and completely. This is content that the creators have poured months of their lives into thinking up and designing. If destiny was pumping out content at the rate some people seem to think it should come out the game would be a shit show. It would be riddled with plot holes, stuff that just doesn't make sense and would eventually fuck up the game even more gameplay wise. I'm sorry but I don't want this game to turn into some sci-fi Fortnite. I want the Devs to take their time making compelling content that's actually engaging.

Superiority of the fanatics

Please hear the sarcasm in that subtitle but the point of what I'm saying is the fanatics are the ones winning here and I think this is the fangroup that the games actually directed towards. Destiny is a storytellers game, that much is obvious from the games expansive lore and world building. Your given a platform to create your own character and create their story following the campaigns that the company themselves are providing which is something very reminiscent of ttrpgs like dnd or lancer. Obviously it's not got the same customisation as those games but the idea is there. The reason why a lot of fanatics aren't getting super upset about the "lack of content" in the game and it's bugs is because they understand that the content is fucking there but sometimes you gotta warp the content yourself a little to keep up that sense of enjoyment. People do this by writing fanfics, creating art, creating ocs etc. When Bungie aren't directly giving us content to play we are making our own content and sharing it with others because this is what destiny is for us it's not just a game it's a world we're experiencing and being a part of. And that's my point, destiny isn't a game for gameplay mechanics sake and if your playing it for that reason and getting upset then it should be obvious your playing the wrong game and maybe it's time to take a break and try something new. If your wanting a game that spoon feeds you content to keep you hooked then I don't think Destiny is the game for you it's never been that sort of game in my opinion. When I came back to destiny I was hyped to dive head first into lore books, video essays, blogs because I knew I had a lot to learn and create myself and that's what I expect from destiny and tbh it's what I'd think any newcomer to the game should expect. And in terms of bugs in the game obviously they're annoying but I feel like from having a greater respect for the Devs and the content they're making your in a mindset that makes it easier to digest that these things take time. For a company to be making all this content, world building, server mechanics, game mechanics and so much more it's gonna be rough to get to every single bug in the game. And tbh I've been playing the game again for almost a month now and I haven't actually experienced that many bugs in the game, no more than what I've seen in other games I've been playing but I want everyone to take that with a heavy pinch of salt because obviously everyone's experience within the game is different.

The issues of paywalls and vaulting content.

Now this. THIIIISS. I get it, I really do having to pay for seasonal content and constant dlcs is probably the most frustrating thing about modern gaming. But that's the thing it's not just a destiny issue this is a modern gaming worldwide issue. Fucking hell even Pokémon is drifting into the dlc hell hole and paywalls with many of their services. Like it's just apart of gaming now and it can be frustrating but it's something you kinda gotta accept and it's not something you're gonna really be able to avoid no matter what game you play that isn't an indie game. As for the vaulting of older content and the removal of game aspects as seasons progress this is probably the single most frustrating thing about the game right now for me especially as a returning player but I also see why destiny is doing it. The game is reaching a size which is becoming unmanageable and the removal of some content is a necessary evil to keep the game going in my opinion. And to Bungies credit they have announced they will be no longer vaulting dlc content going forwards since last year I believe. And look yeah you can't play the content anymore but it's still out there to enjoy in the form of lore and video essays and play through videos. It's not the same but it's something and I've been enjoying sifting through the content available to me. Again I feel this is where the difference in destiny fan comes in. Gamers aren't satisfied with just consuming content about the game which is a totally fair stance to have on the game but there's also a number of games out there that aren't doing this sort of stuff cus they dont have to and maybe those are the type of games that you should play.

The state of the game for new and returning players.

Now this is probably my biggest fukin gripe with the gamers side of the community because in my opinion the biggest thing that's damaging the experience for new and returning players isn't the games bugs, it isn't the games slow approach to releasing new content or the vaulting of content, it's the constant negativity being emitted by that side of the community in regards to the game and the Devs as well as their attitude towards people wanting to learn more about the game. When I decided I wanted to make a return to destiny I did what I'd say a lot of other people have done and taken to sites like Reddit to ask questions about the game so I'd have some idea of what to expect coming back in and the responses of got of people who are meant the be "fans" of the game were sickening. Id have to sift through maybe 15 responses telling me to delete the game, I'm an idiot for wanting to play it, the games at its worst state than ever, there's no point even trying, before I found even one post actually giving me the information I was asking for and giving me tips on how to get back into the game. The only thing that actually made me contemplate not getting back into destiny was the constant negativity being emitted by that side of the community during that time. Not the negative aspects of the game that're definitely there, it was just the sheer miserable energy I was receiving from these people. And that's the thing while yes the game really isn't at its best state for new or returning players there are still ways to make it work and I found those ways buried underneath all the bullshit negativity the others were spouting. This is what's hurting the games ratings in my opinion. The games not at its worst state it's ever been for new and returning players entirely because of what the Devs are doing, a huge chunk of that issue is the negativity coming from this side of the player base.

In conclusion.

If your not enjoying destiny at this moment in time then stop playing for a bit. Maybe consider that this game isn't for you. Voice your opinions and concerns in a respectful manner. And for new people wanting to get into destiny jump right in! If you wanna get the most out of the game then it's gonna take some effort ima he honest. It's gonna take more than just hopping on the game and playing. And if that's not your vibe then that's totally fair not every game is gonna be for every player. And take my advice if you do wanna learn more about the game and how to get into it please stay away from Reddit. Stick to Tumblr people are actually nice here and wanna educate you in a positive and reaffirming way that is healthy for the state of the game and it's community. Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.

[myoonmii]

I keep thinking about Merlin’s love for Arthur and how it’s so clearly portrayed in the show to the point that it practically drives the plot of the show. However when it comes to Arthur’s love for Merlin it’s more subtle and sometimes difficult to even grasp, and I started thinking why that was, aside from the obvious fact that Arthur has a lot of trouble expressing his emotions affection or otherwise. I think it also lies in the fact that Merlin knows Arthur intrinsically throughout the show; he is one of the closest people to Arthur, and sees him for who he really is. Arthur admits as much.

Sure, Arthur knows Merlin but the main part of the plot is that he really doesn't know Merlin. Merlin wants him to desperately understand him and “see me for who I am” but he can't yet. And I think this subconsciously creates a barrier in the way in which Arthur can care for Merlin, and how Merlin can let himself be seen by Arthur.

Which is why I think he was also so hurt when the magic reveal happens because more than the betrayal of Merlin having magic, it was the betrayal of Merlin not letting Arthur see him for who he really is and for hiding a main part of himself. Arthur says it himself “why did you never tell me” that’s what hurt him the most.

I think the most damning piece of evidence for this is the fact that while we see snippets of Arthur’s feelings for Merlin thought the show, the biggest signs are in the last episode after the magic reveal; in which he finally gets to understand Merlin, and this time REALLY know Merlin, and as the barriers of what held them back from understanding each other truly fall away, Arthur evidently “falls in love with Merlin all over again”. We see him actually express himself to Merlin.

This is another reason why I think if anyone was ever to create another season of Merlin after Arthur’s return, it’s physically impossible not to make it about Merlin and Arthur acknowledging their feelings for each other. Because there is no way forward without them acknowledging how deeply they care for each other, obviously anyone is free to argue what kind of love that is, but its impossible not to see the deep love there either way.

They always knew they loved each other, just maybe never realising how much and what that means, because its almost second nature to everything that they do.

[skywalkr-nberrie]

I just love how in the SW novels or any other extended content it’s more clearer that Anakin and Padmé specifically choose missions they know the other will be on to join. Whether it be Anakin as her guard, or Padmé as his ally.

We see in Forces of Destiny that Anakin tries to get missions as Padmé’s bodyguard.

So we can assume that this becomes a thing between the two of them 🤣 trying to hack missions they’re both on to be together more. I mean, if it was up to them? They’d be attached at the hip 24/7.

Even in TCW, we see Padmé making moves to get Anakin on the same missions she’s on, asking Yoda and Mace to send OW and “Skywalker” because she’ll be needing Jedi aid for her excursion 😏 and we see the same thing take place in Brotherhood, when Anakin and Padmé go out on a date. Though in the BH novel, she knows it’d be easier for her to secretly go on a date with her husband than spend time with him on duty where they’re still trying to hide from the gaze of others.

Well, you guessed it! This unspoken deal between them extends to even the other novels too! Like here in Secrets of the Jedi. Palps tells Anakin that Padmé personally chose to go on the mission that Anakin was sent on, despite that Anakin was afraid and didn’t want Padmé to come, we see how his mind later changes after talking it out with Padmé. He tells her that he won’t leave her side and she responds in kind by saying that this was exactly what she wanted. (For him to never leave her side.)

And later on in the same novel, now on the mission, Anakin decides he’s gonna do some exploring on the ship they ended up on. Right after Padmé not so discreetly says she’ll “join him” masking her reasoning with “mission investigation.”

Further into the novel now, Anakin advises Padmé to return to Coruscant for her own safety, requesting her, and silently begging with his eyes for her to listen to him. Triggering the topic between them of how they hate to be apart from one another and that it’s so hard to live this life, despite that they’ve already decided long ago that it was worth it to belong to each other.

Padmé wanted to stay on the mission and be alongside Anakin, but she inevitably listens to his plea and goes back.

However, the reasoning behind Padmé wanting to stay on missions with Anakin isn’t just to spend time with him, but also it’s also parallel to Anakin’s reason for wanting her to stay back and away from the danger. She can’t bare to be with him go away, and she can’t follow. She has to see him or else she’ll go “crazy” worrying over him. This is also one of the reasons why she drowns herself in work whenever she can’t join him. (Excerpt from Star Wars, Clone Wars Gambit: stealth.)

And this is why Padmé encourages Anakin to take her with him when he’s on missions, as shown here in Queen’s Hope.

They just never want to be separated from one another, and I just love a clingy and madly in love cute couple, okay! They’re made for each other!

[synnthamonsugar]

Genuinely, honestly, and from the bottom of my heart, not even exaggerating a bit

If you're reading this you can write Destiny better than the current round of Destiny writers can write Destiny

[cassiefisherdrake]

[Eriana's Vow]

[Techeun's Regalia Plate/Vest/Robes]

[Struck by Wonder]

give me a story all about hope and I will be unwell about it for free

[cassiefisherdrake]

Since we now know that the Pyramids are quite literally shaped by the Witness' experiences and will, it makes me wonder... how much are the Winnower, the Darkness, and the Witness all shaped by each other? They are separate entities, but how much changing of shape do they exert on each other? Are the Pyramids allowed to change shape under the Witness' experiences as if the Winnower does not care what shape it takes so long as the tool does what it is meant to or is it a give-and-take? A mutual exchange of ideas that forward the end goal of the Winnower's desires for the Flower Game?

[ahamkara-apologist]

okay disclaimer: ik that categorizing female characters as the 'mom friend/figure' is a legit disease in fandom caused by general misogynistic views of female characters, and it's something that personally greatly irritates me bc its not only awful to do, it also tends to ruin the characters its put upon. ESPECIALLY in D2, which is outstanding in its cast of strong female characters

however. in the case of Eramis, I do believe that the fact that she was a mother and is a genuinely caring, nurturing person at heart is something that is a deeply important core part of her character, as well as thematically important to the future of the Eliskni moving forward. It's important because in her case, I believe that her motherly inclinations are why, pre-Witness-whispering-through-the-Darkness, Eramis was such a successful kell- because unlike some other kells who sought a future for the Eliksni via domination, her main focus for them was to create a haven for her people that could be defended from Lightbearers. Riis-Reborn wasn't something to sniff at- it was the closest thing to an actual Eliksni city in a very long while. What got her was her trauma of the Whirlwind and her desire to destroy the Traveler to level the playing field for everyone involved- trauma that the Witness preyed upon in order to get to us. Like a parasite, seeking its secondary host. Eramis certainly is not the only Eliksni who lost her family during the Whirlwind, but I think that her specific brand of anger is closest to that of a mother lion whose cubs are in danger, and is lashing out in a furious fight-or-flight reflex at anything that she perceives as a threat. It's just that in this case, her 'cubs' were the Eliksni as a whole, and the threat she perceived before the Witness started torturing her was the Traveler.

I also think that her relationship with parenthood also makes for a very interesting character contrast to Misraaks (aka the other successful kell viewed as a source of hope for the Eliksni), and helps to set them up as antiparallels to each other. Eramis was a gentle, nurturing mother with a reverence for the Traveler who turned into the bitter, cunning warrior we see now when she lost access to her wife and children; Misraaks was a fearsome, ruthless pirate before he became a father, which gentled him and turned him towards being more pious. Eramis represents the old ways, and offers hope to the Eliksni who cannot bear to cohabitate with humanity; Misraaks represents a change in the tide, and kells the open-minded Eliksni who are willing to lay down their arms to live among the humans of Sol. Misraaks is of Light (change, forgiveness, moving forward), while Eramis is of Darkness (memory, control, looking back). They're opposites in every way except for the fact that both of them were/are amazing parents, and I'd argue that their ability to nurture and overlook others is what led to their success as kells.

Most importantly, however, is their relationship to Eido, who represents the future of the Eliksni. Misraaks was her father, and he did his best to raise her to be kind and openminded, but he also shielded her from the horrors of the past a little too well. She's outgrown that, and now that she's strong enough to handle said horrors, Eramis has been acting as a mentor to fully introduce her to the tragedy of what she lost and why elder Eliksni are so angry about it- and I don't think that she would have been receptive to Eido attempting to talk to her if it weren't for the fact that under all of her prickly armour, she's still that nurturing person at heart. It's her desire to care for others and to see a better future for her people that has kept her going despite her having no hope for herself, and it's that loving heart that has saved herself and her people from utter destruction at both our hands and Fikrul's- because if she didn't look at eido and go 'oh this child is the future of our people and i must protect her with my life', then both her and the rest of House Salvation would have been marked for death. And now here she is, continuing to care for Eido even as her father declines by telling her stories about Riis and helping her track down an apothecary to try to cure him, despite her not believing in his ways. I don't think it's entirely because she used to be a mother, but...I do think that it's playing a huge role in it.

(I also think it's personally fascinating to see how someone who used to be known for being a doting, sweet mom to her hatchlings and a caring mate to her wife can turn into someone who's a terrifying warrior on the battlefield and a cunning, politically saavy ruler, but even then, that doesn't surprise me all that much- if you've got a dearth of experience wrangling hatchlings, then being kell of a house is basically just wrangling a bunch of grown-up hatchlings. Same principles, just upped a level or two in complexity.)

[crazy-ache]

I’m never going to buy the “Elain is a spoiled rotten child” interpretation that I see floating around fandom. To me, Elain is a chronic people pleaser.

She desires to please everyone around her at the expense of herself. It is why she so desperately wants to be seen. She is deeply unhappy. Symbolically, Elain is described as a trembling fawn because she is frozen like a deer in headlights in the face of what she wants vs performing what other’s expect of her.

She does this because she is suffering from self worth issues and does not believe her needs or wants are important—and that she doesn’t possess value beyond her complacency and her superficial beauty.

In fact, I believe her book is going to be about becoming selfish. I HOPE it’s about finally becoming MORE SELFISH, which she has never afforded herself to be. I hope she’s selfish and leaves the cage of limitations that has been created for her in the Night Court. I hope she’s selfish and chooses love and a mating bond because she wants it. I hope she’s selfish enough to finally put herself first in order to become the strong and brave female character she was always destined to be.