#And her relationships with Batgirl
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sbd-laytall · 6 months ago
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I'm living for the utter exasperation from Steph in regards to Damian.
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Batgirl (2009) #17
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andstuffsketches · 2 days ago
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Maybe not Impulse, But I think she would date Cissie
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a glimpse into a possible future....
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spiritleigh · 1 month ago
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This line goes so hard
(Batgirl 2024 #1)
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farshootergotme · 4 months ago
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Anyone else thinks DC should've made Dick and Barbara's relationship be more like Dipper and Wendy's from Gravity Falls? As in "I had childhood crush on an older girl who's now just one of my closest friends"?? Just me? Okay...
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casscainmainly · 6 months ago
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Race and Perception in Batgirl (2000)
This is a companion piece to my two gender posts on Batgirl (2000). There are many interesting takes on race and Cassandra Cain, but most focus on whether she is a 'racist' character or not. This post is not about that, though I think my stance is fairly clear given what my blog is about. Rather than retreading the same ground of whether the conception of Cass is racist (something I might tackle later, because some arguments are flat-out wrong), I want to look at how race actually plays out in Batgirl (2000).
This post focuses on how Cass' Asian identity influences her views on perception, beauty, and agency. As usual, feel free to disagree as I'm not an ethnic or Asian studies expert.
Mask of the Batgirl
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We all know and love Cass' iconic Batgirl costume. Besides its distinctive total-blackness, the most interesting aspect is the full-face mask. She is the only Batgirl to cover her face completely - when Stephanie takes over, one of the first things she does is rip the bottom half off.
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Skin and external perceptions don't mean the same things to Barbara and Steph as they do to Cass. Cass' entire life is fraught with not just the male gaze, but the White male gaze - her father, David Cain, films her on video tapes, and Bruce later views these tapes (importantly, Cass herself does not get to). These tapes symbolise how her appearance does not belong to herself, but to external White perceptions.
In issue #1, Batman says the following:
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"You... are me." Here, Bruce posits that the full-face mask makes Cass more like Bruce. It functions to hide their racial and gendered differences. By covering her face completely, Bruce (and Cass) tacitly suppress her race. Once again, White men are controlling the way she is perceived, something that began with David Cain and continues with Bruce.
Interiority and Exteriority
A common Asian stereotype is that Asians are mechanical - they have no interiority. The common conceptions of Asians as STEM majors and being emotion-deficient all come from this core belief, that Asians are utilities for White people. For Cass, this belief manifests from Babs, Bruce, and David Cain:
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Babs says it's hard to care without knowing what's "going on in her head." She cannot connect with Cass' exterior, and finds it hard to imagine what her interior is like. Even worse, Bruce and Cain both argue that Cass belongs to/is like them, almost treating her as property- they reject Cass' own interiority and project theirs onto her, using her as a tool to extend their own identities.
In the early issues, Cass doesn't have an internal monologue. This somewhat reinforces what Babs, Bruce, and Cain all believe about her interiority. However, in issue #5 a White man gifts her the ability to think in language:
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This plot point serves to demonstrate Cass' interiority to the reader, but it is another example of a White person choosing for Cass. She didn't get a choice to be raised without language, and she doesn't make the decision to receive it. Both externally and internally, White people control her narrative.
The Shiva Solution
After her newfound language skills impact her ability to fight, Cass encounters Lady Shiva, her future surprise mother. Shiva is the first one to ever acknowledge Cass' race.
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Unlike Cain or Bruce, Shiva doesn't say 'you're like me'; she says, "we're a lot alike." She doesn't map herself onto Cass, but finds something they both have in common. By naming Cass' race ("in terms of our coloring") and framing their similarities in this way, Shiva affirms Cass' difference from White people, while providing an alternative solace: Asian solidarity.
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Shiva gives Cass her first real choice. It's not exactly a good choice, and it's somewhat coloured by White perceptions (the idea of 'perfection'), but it's still the first major thing Cass gets to decide for herself. She even frames Shiva's path as opposing "Batman's method;" it's the beginning of her path away from White control, towards racialised agency.
It's no surprise, then, that Shiva is the one that helps Cass over her death wish. Not Bruce, not Babs, but Shiva - a literal and metaphorical link to her heritage.
Another Stephanie Brown Segment
As an integral part of Cass' sexual and gendered awakening, Stephanie of course plays a role in Cass' understanding of race. Moving from Puckett's run into issue #38, Stephanie and Cass have this iconic conversation on the rooftop:
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I've written before about how this marks the beginning of Cass' foray into gender and sexuality, but this scene has a different meaning when viewed from a race angle. Stephanie is the quintessential American girl, with blonde hair and blue eyes; additionally, she's sexually and romantically experienced. Cass' own Asian appearance, then, may be causally linked to her lack of experience.
When Stephanie comes back as Robin, we have this moment:
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Cass is unable to be perceived as non-threatening, helpful, or friendly, while Steph achieves all this with ease. Beyond the differences in temperament (Cass is definitely the spooky scary type), it's also the difference in costuming - Robin's bright colours and majority-unmasked face make for a friendlier appearance than Batgirl. Once again, Cass is unable to control other people's perceptions of her.
It's notable that the majority of Steph's appearances throughout Batgirl end with her leaving Cass on a rooftop. This happens in issues #38, #53, #54, and of course War Games. Their relationship is consistently tenuous, and I think this contributes to Cass feeling like she'll never belong in Steph's world.
Tai'Darshan Turns the Tide
At this point Cass is in pretty bad straits: no one has ever shown romantic attraction to her, Steph is mad at her, and she still doesn't have a full understanding of her race (bar Shiva, she's encountered no other Asians). This feeling of disenfranchisement from both the White and Asian worlds is a very common experience among third culture Asian kids, particularly mixed-race Asians.
Then comes Tai'Darshan, the second major Asian person Cass interacts with.
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He is the first person to show romantic interest in her, and asks to "see [her] face." He wants to see her interiority and her skin - Cass' Asian features are now described as something attractive, something worth seeing.
Where Cass is creeped out by Conner's gaze on the boat, she's not similarly affected by Tai'Darshan. She's beginning to understand racialised dynamics, and finding comfort within other Asians rather than her majority-White friends and family.
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Both during the fight with Tai'Darshan and the later fight with Bruce, Cass wears these eye-cut-out masks. The eyes are both the site of perception and the site of Asian racialisation, as the most identifiably 'Asian' part of people's faces. By wearing these kind of masks, she's allowing others to perceive her race, reclaiming racialised perception as an act of choice rather than something imposed onto her.
Choosing
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In the final arc of Batgirl (2000), Cass sets out to find Shiva. The decision is spurred by this conversation, where Brenda explicitly asks about Cass' race. Everything has been building up to this acknowledgment of Cass' fuzzy origins, a recognition that the uncertainty around her race impacts her ability to achieve full self-actualisation.
Cass rejects Batman's help on the matter, instead going to Onyx:
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By going with Onyx, a Black woman, instead of Bruce, Cass is starting on her journey towards racial solidarity beyond Asian communities.
The abrupt ending to Batgirl (2000) kinda cuts off any definitive arc, but I actually think what we have already paints a solid picture. There definitely is a lot more room for explorations into Chinese culture (Spirit World kinda covers this), Cass' relationship to White proximity, interactions with other Asian characters and more. I think her Asian identity deserves more of a spotlight, and I'm hoping more comics in the future delve into it.
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leoleolovesdc · 1 month ago
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I feel like i’ve said this before but koncass would be fire if the transfem-kon pitch wasn’t rejeted and we could see both of them explore their gender + sexuality as a sapphic relationship
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lilaclilyroses · 4 months ago
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This could be a reverse Robin au but that’s not my intention. I want Steph to be angry and powerful!!! Im thinking that after Black Mask kills Stephanie Brown she is resurrected by her father who stole a vial of liquid from the Lazarus Pit. Instead of this being an act of love, Author Brown uses this to get her to work with him. He says he forgives her for working with Batman, that it’s even a blessing in disguise because she knows inside information. Stephanie pretends to work with her father for a while while she gets stronger and gains allies. She eventually kills Roman Sionis for revenge and takes his place as the Black Mask. She throws her father back in jail with her new found power and names herself as one of the top crime lords in Gotham city. Stephanie is sick of Batman and his rules, and Tim Drake who originally pushed his superior morals on her. The Batfamily for never really believing in her, who never gave her the tools to succeed. Her father who took advantage of her at every turn and made her life a living hell. Her mom who never thought she was worth getting sober for. This whole damn city for never accepting help. Well Stephanie will never let herself be hurt by anyone again, this time she’s made sure of it.
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haveihitanerve · 5 months ago
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I believe fully, in my heart of hearts, that Barbara Gordon is one of the only people who gets a genuine “thank you.” from both Batman and Bruce Wayne, because with Dick the thank you’s are unspoken, a subtle nod, a little hug, nothing overly major, and as he adopted more and more kids bruce became more emotional constipated (#not at all how character development and growth are supposed to be cough cough dc cough cough but whatever) so they don't really get thank yous they get more grunts of pride/acknowledgement/thanks but with barbara he always says thank you, whether its a soft, relieved little ‘thank you.’ after she gives him life saving info for his kids, or if its a gruff ‘thank you.’ after she proves him wrong but helps more people, or a standard ‘thank you.’ for giving him information and locations on villains. And everytime she responds with either a soft, comforting, “not a problem B. I got your back.” or a cheery, obnoxious, “you are welcome!” or even just a mutter of “you wouldn't be able to tie your shoes without me” that bruce pretends he cant hear. 
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winged-bat · 6 months ago
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early stephcass both feeling a sense of inadequacy to each other is something that can be so personal actually
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ronniesart · 9 months ago
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being a cass fan is 100% believing that the cass story in Detective Comics #1084 is setting up for a cass solo (please DC)
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littlefankingdom · 21 days ago
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~ Batgirl (2000)
This one screenshot has been sitting in my galery for months. "Papa Bat" is pure gold. I love when people call Batman the father or the mother (yes, mother. Joker did that in the 2004 Batman cartoon) of the batkids.
This is happening when Cass isn't Bruce's daughter yet. He is still very awkward with her. But I love it, because it really shows that people see the bats and birds as Batman's kids. They see how Batman is with them and they think "He's their dad". It doesn't matter what relationship Bruce actually has with them, people see the Batgirls, the Robins and the others and think "the Bat's offsprings". Y'all are wasting time arguing if Stephanie and Barbara see Bruce as a father-figure, while Gothamites are like "all Batgirls are the Bat's daughters, he will kick your ass if you touch them, and they will rat you to him".
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sbd-laytall · 9 months ago
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God, he's so insane for this.
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Batgirl (2000) #27
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necrotic-nephilim · 3 months ago
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saw you wrote reverse robins too, it always has a thing for me. what's your headcanon about it? any particular ship you like?
oh i ADORE Revers Robins, i wish i got the chance to write it more! i think there's something interesting in the challenge of flipping these characters and trying to see how they would change in each other's arcs. How Tim would approach being Red Hood, how Damian would approach being Nightwing, etc. it's all so interesting to me. some headcanons i have are
i think, making Damian the oldest and forcing him to mature on his own with just Bruce is fascinating. bc it's going to make a *very* emotionally closed-off Bruce. the bulk of Damian opening up happens when he's Dick's Robin, so to make it just him and Bruce destabilizes a lot of that. Bruce chose Dick, but if Damian's the oldest, it's likely he didn't choose Damian, he got stuck with him. which adds to their dynamic and imo makes Damian a bit more stunted in the way Dick is, in that being raised solely by Bruce can make one. emotionally constipated. i do think Damian would be forced to mature a lot faster and would be a very quiet person.
i've mentioned this in a post talking about JayTim in RR AUs, but Tim as Red Hood would be *far* more calculating, imo. i think a lot of the emotion of Jason's actions would be stripped from it. even if you make Tim a killer (such as when Tim is Savior in a future universe) he's never going to be a "heads in a duffel bag" killer. he's going to be planned and methodical about it. (like how he almost killed Boomerang) half of his plans would be hidden from Bruce and i think part of the game for Tim would just be seeing how much Bruce even figures out.
replacing Tim with Jason instead of vice versa is interesting, bc it forces Jason to enter the role of Robin with a lot more caution. i think his backstory still works in a RR situation, street kid Bruce just kinda plucked from nowhere and called Robin. bc Bruce is grieving, and this if the first kid whose mischief sort of reminds him of Tim. but bc there's a dead Robin before Jason, it means he's going to be treated with much more care. and his anger regarding entering a Red Robin role could be interesting bc he is known for his anger and i do think he'd be far more violent about the transition, as opposed to Tim's self isolation route.
for RR, i always always prefer that it's Damian who adopts Dick. usually i like it best as Damian adopting Dick when Bruce is "dead", but i think it also works if Bruce is alive when Dick comes into the picture. it'd make for a stunted relationship bc of how closed off Damian is while *wanting* to do right by this kid, or at least do better than Bruce did. and i think Damian as Dick's mentor figure would make how Dick confronts his anger very different.
as for Steph, in any case where i do a Reverse Robins, mentally know i'm also picturing it with a Reverse Batgirls. and to keep from Cass just not moving around, i'd include Helena's time as Batgirl and thus, Steph is Oracle, Cass is Huntress, Helena is Black Bat, and Babs is Spoiler. which, makes canon ships like TimSteph and DickBabs a lot of fun. also you have a lot of curious things to explore by flipping Cass and Helena's moral codes under their vigilante titles. Cass as an outsider to the Batfam instead of being under Bruce and Babs' wings? could *really* force her to do unsavory things. and Helena with more support could be a bit softer around the edges. honestly, i could make a whole post about Reverse Batgirls too bc i think most RR AUs don't tend to address the women in it, which is terrible. gimme Oracle!Steph. and with Spoiler!Babs, if you play with Babs brother that rarely exists being the person she becomes Spoiler to stop, that could be super fun.
as for my favorite RR ships: i'm a suck for RR!TimDami. i think it's just bc of all ships, that one tends to play with the AU the most, in my experience? which is *so* fun bc Nightwing!Damian and Red Hood!Tim struggling to reconcile is everything. i devour every fick. i'm also particular to JayTim, just bc i think Jason as Robin seeing Red Hood!Tim would *immediately* be too interested for his own good as he copes with his anger of being replaced as Robin. but seriously any RR ship if the worldbuilding is done well will always draw me in. i just adore seeing how ppl explore filling in the logical loopholes and if backstories need to be adjusted or not and how personalities would naturally change in the situation. it's endlessly fascinating to me.
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horsechestnut · 3 months ago
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Villain Cass Arc bad, but I do think it's very cute that she is immediately like "I want Tim to be my partner. Surely he'll understand, he's brother shaped :)"
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welcometogrouchland · 10 months ago
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Babygirl I can concieve of stephcass dynamics you couldn't even imagine (arospec Cass not understanding why "probably bi but has a job so she doesn't have time to think about that" Steph apparently needs a man (she doesn't, it would just be nice) and doesn't want to platonically settle down with cass in their old age)
#ramblings of a lunatic#dc comics#stephcass#another sure to be no-notes banger#anyway I think steph and cass are both very. meh on labels#like i said Steph has a job (in my heart it's retail or like a fast food joint or something but in canon its just being batgirl/spoiler)#so she's not thinking about that rn#and cass was raised so outside of conventional society that she. technically understands why ppl want labels for things#but when you grow up in essentially a few rooms with just you and one other guy 90% of the time it just feels unnecessary in her heart#likewise she was raised so far from conventional romance and has such strong emotions about those she cares about#that she's just. not that interested in delineating romantic vs platonic feelings. She Likes You. Deal w/ it#steph on the other hand. oh boy steph#I'm not gonna say comphet I genuinely think she was deeply madly in love w/ tim and that's important to her character#but at the same time she's so. she's so#steph puts a lot of stock in her romantic relationships bc shes on a perpetual quest for connection and to be seen and appreciated#but. at the same time. she resents that part of her i think (at least early spoiler characterization does?-#-local girl desperately wants your approval and would rather be waterboarded than admit that to herself bc that's embarrassing)#so she's just kinda. acting like she's in it for the fun of it but that girl is searching for a soulmate#i genuinely think pre break-up she thought tim was the guy she was gonna marry. not consciously but if it were anyone it'd be him#and the whole ''married with kids'' thing IS something i think she wants. not every female character wants to be married/a mom#but Stephanie does imo#(also lets not even get into how much her breakup with tim SHOULD'VE effected her considering how it went down-#-and how that was never really gone into besides being hinted at in batgirls and kinda. dismissed in Tim's pride special-#-like on the one hand i get it bc of optics but on the other hands. he's really important to her! this should make her so much more upset!!#ahem. anyway#I'm not even the worlds biggest tim/stephanie guy i just think they're inch resting#and Cass. is close w/ Tim and Steph and should Get all of this since she's so adept at reading ppl#but like I said she's bad at categorizing platonic/romantic feelings in herself and doesn't totally Get it w/ steph#i should just write fic about this at this point these tags are too much
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casscainmainly · 4 months ago
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CASS PLATONIC SOULMATE!?? people would say steph and i totally see it but like, stephcass shipper over here soo... yeah! any thoughts xo?
Honestly I'm not sure!! Canon-wise Steph is definitely the platonic soulmate, but only because they refuse to make it romantic. Excluding her (because I'm holding out on a very small hope they will confirm StephCass), I don't actually think Cass has many close friends.
We've seen her friendships with Clayface in Tynion's 'Tec run (which was great, but very much contained in that run), and Big Barda in BoP (not long/entrenched enough yet). Otherwise she has very few close friends outside of the Batfam, which has always been kinda sad but very much in character.
'Cause Clayface/Big Barda (and Steph, Tim, Jean-Paul, Duke, Harper etc.) are either people in a team with her or a Bat-associate. I think she's not great at maintaining relationships when it's not directly in front of her, which makes sense because she was never taught how to do so. Most of her foundational relationships in Batgirl (2000) required the other person (thinking particularly Steph and Babs) to put in a lot of effort, and they very easily fell apart.
The one exception is Brenda, who (besides Steph) was the first person Cass consciously formed a relationship with, and who is very important to her journey of self-discovery. But that didn't last either :(.
So in short I don't really think she has a platonic soulmate, because most of her friends are either Batfam or extremely short-term and limited to one run. Crossing my fingers that Brombal's new run introduces more long-lasting Cass friends!
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