#'oh aspec people can still date/have sex!'

[knifearo]

ultimately when it comes to shipping and fandom space treatment of aspec characters i just don't accept "aro/ace people can still date/have sex" as an answer from nonaspecs. like yeah. mhm. okay. now i think we both know that you're not saying that out of real interest in the diversity of aspec experiences. so you can turn in your seventeen-page essay on why and how you plan to examine this character's aspec identity within the context of a romantic or sexual relationship complete with evidence from canon and peer reviews from multiple aspec people within the next week or i'm putting you in the pit from the edgar allen poe story

[streetsandsodiumlights]

(tags from @no-1-rosalind-lang-apologist)

By the way "some aroace people still date and have sex" and "it's weird how internet spaces makes every single aroace character romance and sex favourable" can and should co-exist. Sincerely, an aroace person

[alastors-antlers]

Being someone who sees a lot of talk about shipping Alastor (sexually, romantically) in fanworks, I just want to take some time to talk about both sides of the issue. It's long, I know - please, please bear with me until the end, and I hope you'll understand what I mean in a bit.

I hope this helps someone, but as an aroace person who understands the frustration and hurt, this is often how it feels to me:

Alastor, being one of the limited cases of aspec rep that I've seen and one of even fewer which I actually enjoyed, means a lot to me.

That being said, his canon rep establishes that he's aroace but not much about how this factors into his life or relationships at all -- and when there's a gap in canon, I turn to fanfiction, which tends to spotlight characters' queerness even when the source material doesn't or can't. Don't we all want to see ourselves in the media we engage with?

When I pull up AO3, there are already a good number of fics about him. Great! Some of them are definitely incredible; but as I read on, it starts to seem like a lot of fics I see acknowledge that he's asexual or aromantic in some way but don't really factor that into the story. It reads like you could have written the story without keeping his queer identity in mind, and it would've come out the same.

Even when representation that does resonate with me exists, it starts to be exhausting to pick through the slash tags to see which ones are written in an aspec-coded way, so I wonder if it would be easier to not read anything with slash at all. On the other hand, when you filter ships out completely, only a tiny fraction of the fanworks are left.

People often respond that aspec people can have relationships, and I think we tend to know that. They can have sex, some can experience sexual attraction in select situations, they can romance others beyond romantic attraction -- any combination of things. But some aroace people don't want either, and sometimes we're struggling to see ourselves in how Alastor is typically portrayed.

Out of all of the fics, sex-repulsed, totally aromantic Alastor isn't seen much. And when Alastor's limited canon seems to be pretty supportive of a reading where he is those things...

Sometimes, you start to feel lost. If fics were evenly distributed along the aroace spectrum of experiences, wouldn't you expect more fics of him being the "totally uninterested" brand of aroace? But there aren't. People seem to have a preference toward seeing him in relationships. Even if they mean well, it can make you think: what does that say about how we view asexuality/aromanticism as a whole?

Is there something less interesting about Alastor, when romance is taken out of the picture? Do others find him less appealing as a character if they can't see him dating, or in love, or having sex or wanting it? Why do we need romance, when romance is already everywhere else, when it doesn't even feel like he was originally really interested? It brings to mind a struggle to be societally accepted, even today.

Even when it's not technically wrong to write Alastor as you see him, being told that we should all be able to ship him however we want can feel like this:

It brings to mind people who try to swing in with misinformed good intentions, telling us "oh, you're aromantic? but you can still have romantic relationships, right? so you can still be normal." when all we want is to be okay outside of the normal.

Or trying to find a partner who can be with us, out of everyone who tells us "I know you don't enjoy sex, and that's okay, but I can't have a romantic relationship with you without it." and being so tired of hoping for someone who gets it.

Or talking with peers, and hearing them all commiserate and fawn over their experiences with love, then telling them about someone you like non-romantically and getting "aww, it sounds like somebody's got a crush!" but not being believed when you tell them it's not like that at all.

Alastor is not a big deal, not really, not in the grand scheme of things. But in an allonormative world, it can feel like a sudden splash of cold water when we were expecting a warm fire to sit around. Even within this ecosystem, we squint to see ourselves reflected.

Society isn't built for us. It can be exhausting to be reminded of that.

~~~

I hope to support people writing Alastor as any variation of aspec, or not even aspec at all. At the end of the day, I think that fanon is really whatever you want it to be, and everyone has their own reasons for writing what they find enjoyable. They should be allowed to do so, and I want to believe that people do what they do with good intentions.

They want to imagine scenarios with the templates of characters they love, and that's okay; even beyond sexuality/queer identities/etc., fan interpretations of characters can be incredibly, wildly different from who they really are in the story anyway, and that's what I try to remind myself. But still, I also can't help feeling disappointed about the aroace representation we could have seen.

(Is Alastor canonically sex-repulsed? Uhh, maybe. If I had to guess, that'd be my top guess, but this might be a hot take: I wouldn't really say there's enough to go off of considering that this view is supported by Angel propositioning him both times, and it's not like Alastor is a particularly big fan of Angel at those points anyway lol)

To my fellow aroaces struggling with Alastor's fandom rep: if you need a break from it all; if you need to block the tags that you hate; if you need to talk to someone about how you're feeling; that's okay. It makes sense that you'd want more representation in a way that helps you feel seen and validated and less alone. I can't speak for everyone, but I think I get it.

I don't have any solutions for how you're feeling, because sometimes I'm feeling the same way. I understand that you want others to get your position and you have the right to express your feelings, but even if you're correct, often being angry or frustrated won't help change others' minds, so let's try to save our energy and take care of ourselves.

Something that helps me to think about is that even now, asexuality is gaining more visibility. We're gaining support. Real change is happening in the world that's helping incredible amounts of aspec people feel freer to be themselves. And maybe one day, we won't be reaching to protect our scraps of representation.

Let's fight until that day together <3

[main-character-moment]

I think the reason Alastor shipping discourse is so annoying to me is the fact that, yeah. Ship what you want forever. But consider you’re also straight up erasing a queer identity that the creator went out of her way to include in the show!

People bring up the argument of “oh but people always make straight characters gay! Why can’t we make aro/ace/aroace characters be in relationships?” Because you’re erasing a queer identity. If there was a canonically gay character in a show, and a huge portion of the fandom went “actually no I want to write him with a woman instead” there would be bloody murder over it. But when an aspec person has their identity erased? It’s always “I’m just having fun with the dynamics! Vivienne said we can ship what we want!” And that’s well and good but it doesn’t change the fact that you’re still erasing an extremely underrepresented queer identity.

There’s also the argument of “but aro/ace/aroace people can still have sex/date/whatever”. Also true! But a lot don’t, and I see no one calling out that fact. The only people I’ve seen saying that are saying so justify their ships. Outside of fandom it’s always an argument that aspec people shouldn’t/can’t have sex/date. There’s also the fact that Vivziepop has heavily implied he’s aro and not that into sex, be it repulsed or neutral.

It just bothers me so much that people will go out of their way to ignore identities. Like, ship him all you want with whoever you want! I can’t stop you! All I can ask, though, as an aspec person who’s neutral/positive across the board, if you’re doing so to explore dynamics, ffs remember his identity. It’s an important part of his dynamic with other people. Plus, it’s an interesting one to explore! How does an asexual (and implied aromantic) character deal with the very sexual hell? How would a relationship form with someone who wants genuine romance? In radiosilence/one way broadcast you have a plethora of ways that you can fuck around with dynamics too!

There’s so much you can do with it. Please I’m on my knees begging. For once just let aspec people be aspec.

[prototypesteve]

The Vanguard of Assholes: first, fast, and loud. Also, not worth your worry.

What it feels like: “As aspec identities rise in visibility, the world is pushing back with organized aphobia and closed-mindedness, and we’re surrounded.”

What it’s more like: “Most of the world has no idea you even exist yet, because they’ve been busy with their own shit. But a few people hate everything new¹, and they’ve noticed that you’re showing up more and more, and they don’t like new things, so they’ve decided to turn into whatever your natural enemy is. This week, they’ll be aphobes, and next week, they’ll be concerned parents against bicycle lanes. They just pick new stuff, and hate on it. They are The Vanguard of Assholes.”

There’s always a Vanguard of Assholes who show up first, fast, and loud, as the “dissenting opinion” to anything new¹.

Study the history of every “new” thing that emerged into public consciousness, and you will see examples of the Vanguard of Assholes showing up first, fast, and loud, claiming to be “everyone”, as they try to push the new idea back out of public consciousness.

They come disguised as moral panics, reactionary causes, NIMBY protests, book-burnings, trucks covered in upside down flags, traditional values voters, disingenuous debate-me bros, and “this is just too much too soon” editorials… it’s the Vanguard, losing their shit because they’re terrified of something new.

But not far behind the Vanguard of Assholes are the more than 90% of people who don’t have an opinion about you, good or bad, and won’t have an opinion about you until they get to know you. Find a way to sidestep the Vanguard, and get to know people from the big majority, be your own representation, and often be the first real live aspec person they know.

Appendix A: “So we should just let them?”

Now, a fair question is, “Shouldn’t we confront the Vanguard, because don’t they also talk to the majority?” Nope. The Vanguard prefer to engage a small, friendly audience in their immediate orbit, or with the groups they’re trying to chase away, because they know the Vanguard is small. They’re hoping they’re a little bit bigger than the group they’re chasing². They know that whenever they try to talk to the majority, they’re dealt with in seconds, because they’re very obviously filled with hate-fear.

If a Vanguard aphobe went on network TV tonight, and talked about why Loveless needs to be pulled from Amazon and Audible, to protect kids from asexuality, the majority would rightly ask them, “What the Kentucky fried hell are you even talking about? Asex. Is that like… abstinence or something?” And when the majority did look up what Loveless was about, they’d be more likely³ to respond, “I don’t see a problem here, there were three asexual characters in a book that mentioned multitudes of people, and none of them made anyone else asexual,” or “Oh, I have a friend/coworker/classmate/relative who’s like that. Xey didn’t date…” and so on.

Footnotes:

¹ No, asexuality itself isn’t “new”—I’ve been asexual for all of my 53 years—but asexuality’s presence on cultural radar, as a thing of note, is relatively new. You can still fit all of the asexual characters in commercially available fiction or media into a single tour bus. Season 2 of Sex Education (the season with that clip), Angela Chen’s Ace, and Alice Oseman’s Loveless were all released or published in 2020. The Sunset aroace flag only dates back to 2018. The purple asexual flag only dates back to 2010, which makes it younger than the iPhone.

² Low estimates put us at around 1 to 2% of the population. Even if aphobes were 4% of the population—which they aren’t, but pretend they were—they might seem to outnumber us two to one, but that would still leave 94-95% of the world outside of the discourse, and not currently on anybody’s side, but not likely to be swayed to the irrational aphobe side. Not in 2024.

³ This is based on observation. I’ve come out to roughly a thousand people. Most are like, “Hey, glad you’re happy.” None were openly hostile (including people from a very diverse queer community, or my extremely religious and/or conservative friends). Fewer than five have asked me more about it because either they or someone close was possibly aspec.

[lalaloobzy]

Random aspec fictional character HCs

Matthew Cuthbert (Anne With an E)

Asexual + aromantic

Lived his whole life unmarried like his sister but, unlike Marilla, never had any relationships in the past. Doesn't reciprocate Jeannie's feelings and tells her his love for his adopted daughter (Anne) is the only love he has room for. Was TERRIFIED when Anne tried to set him up with Jeannie.

*(this is specific to AWAE but I think it can apply to book Matthew as well)

Selah Summers (Selah and the Spades)

Asexual + aromantic

Tbh this one might be canon (or at least heavily implied). Never has been in a relationship. Admits to Paloma that she's just never been interested in anyone in a romantic or sexual way.

Monkey D. Luffy (One Piece)

Asexual + aromantic

Just doesn't seem remotely interested in romance or sex. Gets grossed out/ annoyed when people kiss in front of him.

*(this is specific to the anime, idk about the manga or live action adaptation)

**(I am not caught up on the anime, this may turn out to be incorrect)

Willie Jack Sampson (Reservation Dogs)

Asexual + aromantic

Never had a love interest or showed attraction in the show (to the best of my knowledge. If she did, I missed it). Also, THIS OUTFIT SPECIFICALLY. Her hoodie is aroace colors and her socks look like a mix of the asexual flag and the aromantic flag.

Lucy Wells (Harlots)

Grey asexual/ greysexual (+possibly aromantic? Maybe demiromantic? I haven't decided yet)

Born into prostitution but HATES sex. Avoids it as much as she can and by the last season finds a way to do her job without having to have sex. The reason I said grey ace is because she DOES seem sexually attracted to Fallon after some time of being with him (I think? I was a little confused about how she felt tbh).

Birdy (Birdy)

Asexual + demiromantic

Everyone in his life thinks it's weird that he's so interested in birds and not girls. Admits to Al he doesn't see the appeal of sex at all. Very reluctant to go to prom with Doris and had no idea what to do when she parked the car and offered him sex. I can see him developing romantic feelings after close friendship (like with Al) which is why I think he's demiromantic.

Bilbo AND Frodo Baggins (The Hobbit/ The Lord of the Rings)

Both asexual (+ maybe demiromantic, though I can also see Bilbo as aro)

Both remained bachelors all their lives. Bilbo lived alone and later with Frodo who was like an adopted son. Frodo lives for a long time with Sam and Sam's wife Rosie. I personally think that Sam and Frodo are in a romantic relationship, while Sam and Rosie are in a sexual relationship. Frodo seems content with this arrangement which is why I believe he's ace.

Ted Buckland (Scrubs)

Asexual

Simply because of the part where Carla says "I don't want any MAN filming me giving birth unless he's completely asexual" and then Ted walks in with a camera and Carla smiles and says "oh hi Ted!". (I think this was a poorly-aged joke about him being "ugly" more than anything but I'm still claiming it). Also when he sings the duet with Gooch and Gooch says "I want to screw you" while Ted says "I want to kiss you.

Fabian Rutter (House of Anubis)

Asexual

He's nerdy and into space (I know this is a stereotype but representation is scarce I take anything I can get... you get it right). Also his relationship with Nina is very innocent and I can't see him developing sexual attraction even when he becomes an adult.

Dirk Gently and Bart Curlish (Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency)

Dirk- Asexual

Bart- Aromantic

Neither of them have love interests in the show (although Bart/Ken may have been implied) so this is just how I felt about the characters personally. I think Dirk definitely had a crush on Todd and is gay but I don't think he gets sexual attraction. Bart is the opposite. I can see her developing sexual attractions and feelings but being repulsed by kissing/ dating etc.

*(this is specific to DGHDA, idk about any other versions of these characters)

Anybody feel free to add thoughts and your personal aspec character hcs <3

[king-nyx]

The Rising Son sexuality and gender headcanons

Apollo - bisexual with a preference for men. Apollo is a romantic who dotes on all his lovers. He definitely can connect with both men and women very very easily. He's a feminine guy which lands him in a weird area when he's perceived, but he is cis.

Artemis - butch lesbian. honestly, don't think Artemis ever thought there were options outside of lesbianism. she definitely leans into dressing more masc and enjoys presenting as more masc, however she is cis and has her moments where she wants to wear dresses and put on makeup (Apollo helps her)

Dionysus - bisexual with a preference for women. Dionysus has an easier time connecting with women and also tends to have more romantic relationships with women. His relationships with men, while some are romantic, tend to be mostly about physicality. Gender-wise, he's trans and uses he/him pronouns.

Hermes - bicurious to bisexual to pansexual. he didn't have a whole crisis, he kinda just wondered what it would be like to date men. started dating men, enjoyed it and it kinda spiraled from there. he's gender neutral, still uses he/him pronouns because that's what everyone assumes and he doesn't really bother with pronouns. it's all just meh to him. he's a guy in the same way a group of people are a guy.

Ariadne - femme lesbian. her issue is that she didn't think lesbianism is an option. with theseus and dionysus, she thought she was on the aspec or the arospec, because she didn't have any of the firework, heart leaping into the sky type of excitement. but, when she ended up dating women, she knew she was a femme lesbian. she is pretty sure she's cis, but she isn't against exploring her gender if that ever comes up. and, she has used she/they pronouns before

Ares - unlabeled. he hates labels, he hates when people ask him what his label is. he hates when people assume his sexuality. he hates when people try to push labels on him. he hates all the discourse. he hates all of it. to him, all that matters is that he likes the person and the person likes him back. nothing else is important to him. this has led people to assume he's pan online and those people have become public enemy number one to him. ares appears to be a macho buff cis dude, but honestly he's a softie. he is cis though. he's also definitely experimented.

Aphrodite - pansexual and nonbinary. they also hates labels and they don't really appreciate what they deem a simplistic way of perceiving a person and their capabilities of love. the reason they chose their labels is because, unlike ares, they wanted to end all discourse around their sexuality and gender identity. however, they are also just a person. they're femme and they're attracted to all things that are feminine.

Persephone - thought she was a lesbian, is actually a bisexual with a strong attraction to women. she never really considered dating men until she met Hades. Hades was where she started exploring her sexuality more. not in a "turned her straight" way but in a "oh, i thought i only liked x turns out i also like z" way.

Hades - straight (non-derogatory)

Poseidon - straight (derogatory)

Zeus - sexually fluid, biromatic and cis. listen, you don't sleep with that many people and not be sexually fluid /lh.

Hera - demiromantic, demisexual, cis. Zeus is the only person she has ever felt romatically and sexually attracted to.

Athena - aroace, uses she/they pronouns. thought she was a lesbian asexual at one point, but she realised that she did not feel any romantic feelings either.

Lex - lesbian and asexual. she always hated sex and sexual relationships were never something she ever wanted to explore. she is happy in romantic relationships.

(Bonus because I love her) Peitho - bisexual. she thought she was straight for the longest time, but after befriending Aphrodite, she decided to experiment and found out she actually did like girls. She and Aphrodite had a thing for a bit, but they decided staying as friends was a better option for them.

[werestorm]

For your aro writing;

i don’t have anything specific. i’m aro myself and wrote an ace character who varies on how sex-repulsed he is (only to be told that the character isn’t ace, even if i made him after my own experience of asexuality. asexual is not *nothing*, it’s little to none and that character is specifically just ‘aspec’ that identifies as asexual). what i’m trying to say is; someone will always criticise you. It’s not that serious, thankfully!

Only silly flavour I can offer you is that i’m romance repulsed, but despite that, -have- dated several times, so even when aware, some of us probably have dating history regardless.

Uhh… for anything in general additional, a pattern i noticed with myself and another friend is that we’ve both dated people with the intent of ‘well, it won’t bother us that much probably and this person we hold important will benefit and feel better!’. 0/10 it sucks to be a people pleaser.

Oh yeah, and, this is really specific of me— but I’ve started calling the people i feel strongly for (= a connection i feel is deeper than just a friend, but not in a romantic sense) by more serious terms, usually familial. IE, someone i briefly dated is someone I currently call my husband, because I realised he does not drain my social battery and I could feasibly live together with him. Despite that term, we are not dating and he’s aware of that. We aren’t QRP either. But it’s a ‘special’ term for him to point out he’s important.

Oh!! This is pretty useful actually!! Thank you, for this. I know that there's going to be criticisms regardless, especially given that the character is more arospec and isn't ace either, but it's still nice to get info from diff perspectives, ya know?

But thank you again for the info/perspective!! I'll be thinking about this when I get to that part.

[transfemlogan]

16?

- 🌧️

i have already answered 16 for the positive one here . & i have been asked 2 answer it 2 more times after NSHSJDNDH so instead. i will answer 16 on the negative one & if i can think of another small detail in canon ill talk abt it. it's just hard 2 know whats a "small detail" & whats not

negative fandom ask game

you can't understand why so many people like this thing (characterization, trope, headcanon, etc)

i can't understand why everyone loves soulmate AUs.

that's a lie and exaggeration, i do get it to some extent. i understand that it's because the concept of having a "one true love" that will love you forever and ever is appealing & comforting 2 a lot of people. i respect & understand that.

but i fucking hate soulmate AUs.

for background: i am a relationship anarchist & a nonamorous romance + sex repulsed aroaceapl. i do not date, i do not have sex, i find romance & sex repulsive, i do not have queerplatonic relationships, i don't feel platonic attraction most of the time, i'm touch repulsed, i want to live alone; the idea of "dying alone" & "being alone forever" is the most appealing thought ever. & it's how i want my future to be.

SO. i find soulmate AUs to be the most horrifying & terrifying thing on the planet DNEHRKFNFJ

ignoring the fact that all soulmate aus are aphobic & actively ignore aspecs, the ones that do attempt to include aspecs tend to still exclude people.

"well you don't have to have a romantic soulmate! you can have a platonic one!" what about aplatonic folk? what about people who don't want to have friends?

& then its "well not everyone gets a soulmate!" what about aspex who DO want a soulmate? like genuinely what does that mean? how can you take in account every single unique sexuality & experience. i understa d that obvs soulmate aus r not trying 2 do thst but like. how does that work.

& you never ever see a soulmate au that takes in account aromantic allosexuals, because obviously having sex w/o feelings attached to it is evil & wrong. (HEAVY SARCASM!)

i do not want the universe/government/etc to pick who I get into a relationship with? who's the universe or the government or whoever tell ME who i can & can't date???

i think relationships need to be built and made and formed. I understand it's like "oh, but you have someone who is destined to love you forever", but it's like... i'd rather have someone who chooses to love me. not is forced to. someone who is willing to build a relationship with me & is choosing to love me.

i have wanted to write a soulmate au where a side (probably logan) actively ignores their soulmate & goes against the rules but i havent done it yet & i probably wont.

IDK I KNOW THIS IS ALL JUST SILLY BUT LIKE. HOW DO YOU GUYS FIND THAT ... APPEALING??? THAT WOULD BE TERRIFYING. if there was someone out there destined for me??? That i HAD to get into a relationship with whether i liked it or not???? whether it was my choice??? like ABSOLUTELY NOT. i don't want to be forced into a relationship just cuz the universe told me i should be. & i dont want to be forced into loving someone just because someone else told me I should be. that i had to love them because they loved me back!!! like this sounds like an abusive manipulative horror story waiting 2 be told (<- which now i def want to see. someone get on that. write a soulmate au where the persons soulmate uses it as an excuse to abuse & manipulate them & guilt trip them that'd be cool)

AND THEN SOMETIMES SOULMATE AUS HAVE THE MOST TERRIFYING SYMPTOMS EVER??? i saw one where you are constantly hearing your soulmates thoughrs. thats fucking terrifying. to never have a moment alone? to never have fucking privacy?? in ur own head? i saw a fic, which like no hate 2 the author it was beautifully written just so terrifying to me, where janus shares his thoughts w/ logan constantly & tells logan 2 "shut up so he can get work done" or whatever. LIKE WHAT DO YOU MEAN. WHERE AM I.

maybe its just cuz i was abused as a child & have been in an abusive relationship & im traumatisdd & its affected my way of living & entire life, but all i can hear when i see soulmate aus is how genuinely terrifying it would be if you were in an abusive relationship w/ a soulmate.

imagine have your thoughts always be read by your abuser. that no matter what happens, your abuser will always hear what you're thinking. you can't think of ways to escape or even begin to examine your relationship, because youe abuser will always be able to punch that down. & even if somehow you do escape, you will never bs free of them. thats fucking terrifying. & also a great metaphor for experiencing an abusive relationship & having ptsd after it can someone write that too. someone get on that.

if i shared my thoughts w/ my "soulmate" id probably actually kill myself i knkw thats a wild fucking thing 2 say out of no where but i am not joking. if i could never ever have a moments alone in my own head id actually be ending it right now. its almost 1 am can u tell i havent gotten sleep at all.

ANYWAY I HATE SOULMATE AUS. NUMBER ONE SOULMATE HATER !!!! ITS TERRIFYING & SO UNCOMFORTABLE 2 EVEN THINK ABOUT

negative fandom ask game

[pageofheartdj]

Hi! Autistic aroace anon from before! I saw your post abt ace Donnie and aro Leo (which btw, I LOVE how their colors are basically their flags? But in Leo’s case it’s his green tone)

And I totally agree!! Donnie seems to have somewhat interest in romance, like the innuendo at the Bearnardo “why I always like the cute and mean ones” and with Atomic Lass. But a teen flirty normal level (thank god, I also agree with you at the “pls they dont care yet, its hormones. Pls focus family and friends), than to actually have smth not rlly, and the arosexual part? I may be projecting a lil here. But he always seemed more interested in the flirt part than anything else.

With Leo, he liked to flirt, but more to charm the person to gain their favor than actually flirt, like in Donnie’s case. He always seemed averse, but not against it, just “yuck”. I felt that was also a normal teen reaction like “I don’t wanna get strings attached” but with smth more, a “yeah, rlly not for me” thing. I can totally see him being gray/demi aro (again projecting? I’m gray/demi aroace), since with some stuff he seems fine but with others, more exaggerated or “honeyed” ones, he gets uncomfortable. But I could understand if ppl put him on sex-repulsed full Aro in the spectrum.

It’s totally wild and funny to me how the fandom is rlly 8/80. The dynamics of both of them being switched in the fandom to fit the box idea that they created for these two is wild to me. “Oh, Donnie’s autistic and 10% of the time, specially in stressful situations, he doesn’t want to be touched? And also a genius nerd? Nah, he’s a goofy goober which the idea of relationships is totally alien and foreign to him, he totally runs from it and has 0 experience of it”. “Oh, Leo’s has narcissistic tendencies and flirted to gain favors before in specific and numbered occasions? He’s totally a flirt, believing everyone wants to date him and he’s a heartbreaker, he totally loves that attention, not uncomfortable at all”

So yeah, sorry for my lil rant, but I rlly do feel whatchu said in that post a whole lot!!

Speaking of colors, he is blue and wore that orange uniform in Air Turtles so yaknow XD

The thing is, the turtles are teens, PLUS they lived an isolated way of life. They had NO way of acting on their interests no matter if they had or didn't have any.

And also. Attraction and relationships are not connected whatsoever! They can. But they don't have to! So the allo person might not want any relationships and aspec person can want and be in one. The relationship status says NOTHING of their identity xD

And moving on to Donnie. He has crushes on fictional character and makes sense, again, no people around. But he also used this his type on Strawberry who are very real and in the moment and is very cute and is very mean to him xD Donnie has a type with real girls too. What he wants to do with this attraction and if he has any sexual attraction is unknown and obviously, it's a kid's cartoon and romance is basically a non-existant part of it(thank god xD). And anyone can hc almost any queer and not queer identity on him, because all of them can and will work xD

Same with Leo, we have some canon moments with him, but it can work for so many queer identities. He is aro as a very direct conclusion. He is grey or demi and his repulsiveness tones down if he falls for someone, etc xD He can also be just a teen who is not into romance but now it extra disgusts him. Anything can work and as long as we are not forcing our hcs on others, it's all good xD

I also hc Donnie a quick developer, he had his plastron developed first, he instalearned his mystics. He could get into the whole romance territory earlier than Leo too xD Leo might not be that enthusiastic the way Donnie is, but still!

Although Mikey doesn't seem to mind and Raph is a big supporter as a comparison xD

And yeeeeeeah I am not a fan(although I can VERY much understand) of latching on this one trait, no matter if it's a rare one or not, and making it the whole personality. Donnie is autistic and very rarely is not 100% excited for a touch? He is touch repulsed autistic. He has canon romantic interests? Nah he is aroace. (Which I LOVE aroace hcs. But I've noticed that in fandoms aroace hcs 99% mean NO romance and NO sex NEVER, even though aspec has SO much variation). With Leo he has these few sad moments and BOOM he is a 100% 24/7 sad boy that was born depressed and all that. Despite the fact that he is very joyful and very confident and very cocky most of the time. YES he copes with jokes, this doesn't mean ALL his jokes are just cover ups. Donnie's copes with collecting data, doesn't mean he doesn't do it on regular just cause he likes it. HECK both of them tend to cope with the thing they like, so they would feel better. Donnie likes data collecting so he copes with it. Leo likes joking so he copes with it.

I love your rants🤝

[thisvegetabledoesntfallinlove]

having aromantic feelings in this denny’s tonight bc i had to go on a blocking spree yet again.

I just think like... people don’t know shit about what it’s like to be aromantic. aphobes complain about the Fandomization Of Pride and say shit like “asexuality is basically a fandom thing; if your community is entirely online and based around tumblr tags and headcanons, you cant possibly compare it to actual real life gay experiences”

and like. i have some bad fucking news for you about gay people who live in super homophobic backwater small towns. I’ve known plenty of gay people who were completely closeted irl and whos entire interaction with queerness was online communities, especially gay shipping. that doesn’t mean there aren’t other gay people in those homophobic little towns, its just often too dangerous to look for them. there are definitely other aro people in my backwater little town! I just can’t find them. I’m not saying this is the best way to interact with the queer community! or even a good way! for instance, nobody gives a shit about gay vs aro or bi vs pan irl! this drama is all internet shit! but being terminally online is certainly not a problem unique to aspec people.

honestly, as someone who’s trans, bisexual and aromantic, the thing that’s actually made my life the most difficult for cishets to swallow is the aromantic part. my backwater town is fairly liberal, so they can be chill about the gay thing, they can even tolerate the trans thing, but not getting married???? what do you mean you can’t be like the sweater-wearing chaste gay dads in the commercials? what do you mean you don’t want to date but you still want to have sex???????

nothing about my identity is palatable. nothing about me is relatable or marketable. my life, my future, my happiness, looks completely alien to your average cishet. the first time I told someone irl that I was aromantic, the immediate reaction was “oh my god I’m so sorry” as if I just said I had cancer.

like. actually. yknow what. yeah I think the aromantic experience is very easy to compare to my experience as a disabled person. its because I’m fundamentally missing something that Typical People consider completely intrinsically tied to their worth and their happiness. what’s the point of life if you can’t get married? whats the point of life if you can’t have a job? “i’m so sorry to hear you’ll never experience the be all end all of human existence; retiring to live comfortably with your aging partner as your grown children take up the mantle of your legacy.”

people don’t know what its like to be aromantic. they think of it as a tumblr tag, or headcanons, because the only time they bother to interact with aromanticism is when they’re complaining about our headcanons. no one can deny that aspec identity in this decade is intrinsically connected to the internet, in the same way that no one can say that gay identity in 1970s and 80s america wasn’t intrinsically connected to gay bars. its because That’s How You Meet People. queer people have always taken whatever was the current way for humans to connect to each other and carved out their own space.

aromanticism is in the stage where its hard to find other people, and no one knows what you are, and if you explain it to them they think you’re sick. we’re in the stage where we don’t get a lot of explicit canon representation, we have to scrape by on aro readings and subtext and coding.

and it IS coding! its coding! I don’t care if aromanticism wasn’t named yet back then! there are plenty of instances of queer coding from before we had words like “trans” or “gay” or “lesbian” or even “queer.” what matters is that someone somewhere was like “this character has the experience of not feeling the socially mandated attraction to the opposite binary gender,” which is a queer experience whether the person feeling it is gay or aromantic. just like bisexuality and lesbianism weren’t separated for a long time because straight society didn’t care if the wlw could also technically like men, lesbianism and aromanticism and asexuality weren’t separated because straight society didn’t care if the woman who wouldn’t get married to a man wanted to kiss girls or not.

this is way longer than I intended it to be and it got kinda rambly and train-of-thought, and I don’t think I really have any particular conclusion here. just aro feelings. idk if this makes sense but I’m tired of trying to edit it to make more sense so I’m just hitting post

[aroaceconfessions]

I feel like the way many allos deal with aspecs in shipping is just crap for every part of the community involved.

Repulsed or disinterested aros and aces get shoved to the side because they justify shipping and sexual scenarios with "Well some aros/aces still date/have sex" completely ignoring if that character even seems favorable at all. Or they pull demis/grays/fluxes/ etc. into it, again ignoring if it works for the character.

Romance and sex favorable aspecs are stripped of any aspec traits, in fan media it is simply not discussed or it is seen as fixing.

And the microlabels are dropped as soon as it's not convenient anymore, treated similarly to the favorable aspecs and/or the fact that people that use microlabels can still experience a variety of repulsion, favorability and complicated feelings about romance and sex is ignored as well.

Even QPRs feel like they're being pulled into the mess because it's starting to feel like "oh no they're not romantic they're in a qpr" is just "oh yeah they're together but I won't label it as such".

[rjalker]

I am aroace. Being ace and aro are inexplicably tied together for me.

A few years ago now I made a post about how asexuality is not pedophilic, in direct response to seeing what I thought was a trusted mutual reblog a post saying, "It's important to teach kids it's okay to be gay, but it's pedophilic to teach them about asexuals" and teaching kids about it can only help them, so they know it's okay not to want to date or kiss other people.

And ever since I made that post people have been fucking getting pissy about me using "ace" and also talking about not feeling romantic attraction.

And a few years ago I did make an addition to the post apologizing.

But you fucking know what? No, I've changed my fucking mind. I'm not going to apologize for saying ace and also meaning aro.

Literally no other fucking orientation forces people to use the split attraction model, and I'm fucking tired of people acting like being ace and aro are completely disparate things that never have anything to do with the other -.-

You use the split attraction model? Cool.

Now, honestly, shut the fuck up and stop policing how other people are allowed to talk about their experiences.

People are allowed to just say "ace" and mean someone who does not want to have sex or date, or kiss, or do anything romantic either.

No, it is not fucking aromisic or acemisic for people who are both to talk about their experiences without always using the fucking split attraction model.

I usually refer to myself as aroace - but I shouldn't fucking have to. You know why I do? Because otherwise if I just call myself ace, people will ignore my aromantcism. If I just call myself aro, they ignore my asexuality.

And that is fucking unacceptable.

I am sick and fucking tired of the aspec community acting like the split attraction model is mandatory and applies to everyone, when it's fucking optional.

Fucking shit like assuming someone who says they're ace still experiences romantic attraction unless they state otherwise is literally fucking amatanormative. Someone saying they're aro and people assuming they still experience sexual attraction unless they state otherwise is literally fucking amatantormative!

Assuming that someone who says they're "ace" or "aro" still experiences the "other" form of attraction unless they state otherwise is literally amisia, by acting like people who are ace or aro need to be fucking redeemed by experiencing other forms of attraction, and they can still be fucking "shippable" and "normal".

I'm fucking tired of it.

I'm aromantic and asexual.

I should be allowed to make a post about being ace or aro without people fucking jumping down my throat about how I'm erasing people who use the split attraction model.

No other fucking sexuality or orientation treats the split attraction model as mandatory, and it's fucking amisic as shit that people in the aspec community think it's okay to do so.

Assuming I'm still redeemable or normal and am willing to date people if I say I'm ace is amisic as fucking shit.

Assuming I'm still redeemable and normal and willing to fuck people if I say I'm aro is amisic as fucking shit.

Leave aroace people alone, and stop fucking demanding people use the split attraction model.

Shit like this is why the first question out of amisics mouths when I tell them I'm ace is "okay, but who do you date?" and why they think it's okay to erase a character's orientation so they can still ship them, because "oh it's definitely ace, but romance was never mentioned!" even when the character is explicitly just as repulsed by romance as sex.

Stop fucking forcing people to use the split attraction model. Stop fucking acting like it's okay to assume someone can still be fucking redeemed by being "normal" in other ways. I'm going to rip the next amisic I see to fucking shreds, and no, fucking ace and aro people who use the split attraction model, you are not fucking exempt!

Especially because it seems like every few years there's yet another fucking form of attraction that you're assumed to experiences unless you state otherwise. "Oh you might be aroace, but you still want a QPR, right? Oh you still experience platonic attraction, right? You still want to get platonically married, right???"

How many more fucking times do I need to say no??

[scampfire]

Idk if my answers will contribute to anything, but this questionnaire seems fun so let's go

1. How do you identify?

I identify with the labels aromantic, alloaro, demisexual, greyplatonic/aplspec

2. How do you feel about the following

Romance: repulsed

Touching: I don't like body contact in general, but that's my autism, it has nothing to do with me being aspec

Hugging: that's okay as long as I'm asked first

Kissing: not in the face/ on the lips. Everything else is okay (except my chest. Trans guy struggle)

Sex: great I think. Ask me again when I'm not a virgin anymore

Love: I kinda relate to loveless people. I don't feel love for anyone, not romantic or platonic or queer platonic or anything else. But I love the whole world and nature and my fandoms and everything so much that I don't label myself as loveless.

Queer platonic relationships: awesome concept. But I dislike that (some) aro people now seem to have replaced romantic relationships with queer platonic relationships in an amatonormative way. That they praise qprs so much and think every aro needs one or wants one. Just recycled amatonormativty

A significant other: don't need one. It's fine when other people find joy in it, just not for me

One night stands: valid as heck. Nothing wrong with them. I fight everyone who says otherwise

Porn (video): my demi ass doesn't like naked people I don't know, so not for me. But I'm not against them, consume them if you want, or not when it's not your thing. You can do whatever you want forever

Smut (written): smut is awesome. It's not easy to write good smut, but when you have the required skill you're basically a god

Dates/Dating: I don't date. And I don't understand the difference between dating and just hanging out. Someone explain to me please

3. What is one thing most people misunderstand about your identity?

I don't talk about my identities that often. But you can't look at my labels and know what's going on inside me, so I guess that could confuse people. Like, I'm aplspec but still want a friend with benefits. Technically I'm demi, but I still find people attractive after a few hours of knowing them, so I consider myself also alloaro. I'm aromantic but Love shipping. So I'm more complex than you'd think I guess

4. Have you encountered aphobia in your life?

I'd say no, but I encountered amatonormativity so much. Every person I'm out to supports me, but the amatonormative brain rot is real. So a person can support me, but still say it's valid that another person destroyed our plan to meet because she'll meet her girlfriend and romantic relationships are more important than platonic relationships. Why does relationship hierarchy even exist anymore

5. Anything else you'd like to add on the topic?

No hate against aces, but I'm tired that they overshadow every other aspec identity. It sucks that the aro tag is unusable when you don't want to consume ace content. It sucks that books about the queer community have whole paragraphs or even pages about being ace, but aros just get a few sentences. And it's often explained in detail that aces don't have to be aro, but we aros just get something like "oh and sometimes aros aren't ace" and then nothing's mentioned about alloaros ever again. Aces and aroaces are totally valid, and they deserve their communities and own spaces, but I just want a space for aros to exist without having to think or talk about asexuality. A space that's purely focused about being aromantic, and nothing else. I'm not even angry anymore, just so tired

The Aspec Questionaire

Aspec is such a vast category and one some folks (especially allo folks) tend to treat like a monolith. So I thought it’d be good to do a little questionnaire to demonstrate.

(Skip anything you don’t want to answer.)

1. How do you identify?

2. How do you feel about the following, one word answers are fine if you want:

- - Romance

- - Touching

- - Hugging

- - Kissing

- - Sex

- - Love

- - Queer Platonic Relationships

- - A Significant Other

- - One Night Stands

- - Porn (Video)

- - Smut (Written)

- - Dates/Dating

3. What is the thing you think most people misunderstand about your identity?

4. Have you encountered aphobia in your life?

5. Anything else you’d like to add on the topic?

[birdsong-18]

hi!

i’m a little late to the party, but i’m so proud of jaidenanimations’s new video where she comes out as aroace!

i dont openly talk about my sexuality online much (really because i don’t know what my sexual orientation really is), but i do know that i am 100% on the aspec.

my experience is very similar to jaiden’s, where i went through my life feeling like i was missing out on feelings because i didn’t have many crushes and didn’t get crushes in the same way others do. i soon came to realize that i was demisexual and demiromantic, where i had to form a close bond to a person before i began to feel any form of attraction or desire to date. this is why so many of my “celebrity crushes” have been on youtubers, and why i’ve only had 4 serious crushes in my lifetime (and one boyfriend who i never had sex with even though we dated for 9 months).

i’m so happy that jaiden was able to express these feelings as well, and her points on societal pressure to date are also very prevalent in my life as well. now that i’m in college, everyone is hooking up, and getting dates, and i feel almost left out at points as some of my friends talk about the “football guy they’re crushing on” or the “guy they hooked up with last night, but she doesn’t really like him.” i feel like i have to keep up with everyone even now, and seeing someone with similar experiences to me made me feel so much better.

you don’t meet many aspec people in daily life. it’s hard for me to sit through conversations of sex, feeling like i’m confused and left out because sex to me is such an intimate form of love, the last base that someone must unlock with a key they find through getting to truely know me.

but having a public figure, someone who i have been watching for almost as long as i have known i am aspec, come out as aspec… well i almost teared up watching that video. i’m so proud of her for becoming public with this, for being that figure that so many people need.

if she had been out when i was at the age of confusion, maybe i would have figured this out more quickly.

i was 17 when i came to realize that i was on the aspec. i’m 19 now, and still struggling with societal pressures. it’s always the question of do i want to have sex? do i really like that person? why don’t i get crushes like my friends do?

the shot that hit me the hardest from the video, however, was the shot of the aspec community standing across a crack in the ground from the rest of the lgbt community. and there is separation in the lgbtqia+ community as well. like, yes i am in the community, but even then i get forgotten or looked over. im constantly mis-labeled as “straight” (im not, i would date the opposite sex if the feeling arose, it just never has. i tend to label this as ambiguous more than anything), and often times my lgbt friends will hush up about sex, as if they think i don’t want to hear it (i don’t mind sex talk, i am just confused about some of the emotions behind it).

aspec people almost get babied in the community. we get told that “we wouldn’t understand” and get left out of normal everyday conversations about sex and relationships because people think it makes us uncomfortable (i do know for some it does). that makes me almost want hide this from my friends. what do they need to know about my sex life, who i’m attracted to? but that also just tends towards a feeling of left out, like you’re hiding yourself. and many of my straight friends and even some of my gay friends don’t know anything about the community. they’re so misinformed.

an example of this happened to me recently. i have an ace flag on my desk. one of my roommates was talking about the movie 50 shades of grey, and was explaining a pretty explicit sex scene. my other roommate joked “oh god, song, i’m gonna need that flag,” as if i choose to be this way. so many people don’t understand it’s not a choice

that is why jaiden’s video is so important. it’s the first step of bringing awareness to people, so people can feel comfortable with their identity. so they have somewhere where they belong.

i only know of two public figures on the ace spectrum, who are open about it, talk about their experiences, and are proud.

the first is even edinger, who introduced me to the concept back in 2015.

and the second is jaiden, who is helping so many people in 2022.

if anyone is struggling with their identities on the aspectrum, please feel free to contact me. my inbox is open, and i’ve been in the same exact spot you are. i’ve been comfortable with myself for almost three years now, and i am so proud of everyone who has found the bravery to come out after jaiden’s video.

<3 song

[allagogtoreblog]

sorry in advance for this really long ask, hopefully it’s not too annoying to come to you like this, but that meme you posted about being interested in sex only in the fictional sense actually means quite a lot to me… i’ve been IDing as aspec for a couple years now, it took me a while to figure it out because i’ve always been interested in romance and sex in fiction and fantasy and have had somewhat of a crush on one fictional character or another since puberty, but i’ve never wanted it irl or had any sort of romantic or sexual encounters in reality. eddie’s the biggest fictional crush i’ve had since i was a teen, to the point where sometimes i was starting to question my asexuality. but when i do that i have to remind myself that i wouldn’t want him if he were real, my interest entirely hinges on everything being fictional and safe in my head. i’ve only recently discovered the label aego and connect with it quite a lot, so it was thrilling to see both it and the concept of enjoying sex exclusively with fictional characters in the wild on your blog! i’ve just been having a hard time deciding whether i ‘remove my self’ from the equation, if you will. the definition is a little bit hard to puzzle out and i know it’s slightly different for everyone. anyway, thanks for posting that meme because it helped me find your blog, and it was so lovely to see aego in your bio as it’s the first time i’ve encountered that since i’ve been considering the label for myself. if you don’t mind my asking, how long have you ID’d as ace/aego, and how did you decide aego was the right label for you? oh and just for fun, if you’d like to answer: what are some headcanons that feel specific to Your Eddie, the eddie in your head, compared to popular fanon/canon?

Thank you so much for your ask! And trust me, it’s not annoying at all! There are not many people in my life that I can discuss things like this with, so I was kind of thrilled when I read it. I apologize for the lengthy reply, but I was SO excited to answer this.

Honestly, I started to realize I was “different” around JR high (which for a little context was about 25 years ago) when everyone around me was feeling that first rush of hormones and so excited about boys (or girls) and dating and first kisses, but I just never really felt that way. That’s not to say that I didn’t get crushes or find boys attractive (the posters on my walls of boy bands and teen idols would attest to that), I just didn’t see the point in romantic/sexual interactions with people I knew.  

I never really gave it much thought at the time though or tried to understand why I felt that way because JR high and HS were a really rough time for me. I was being badly bullied, my house burnt down, my parents were getting divorced, and I was struggling with depression so, I’ll be honest, I kind of assumed that things I felt (or wasn’t feeling in this case) were a product of nothing more than low self-esteem. Obviously, the only reason I wasn’t interested in trying for a relationship is because they’d just reject me anyways, right?

Yeah, I told myself that’s all it was for a really long time. Not because I was particularly embarrassed by my lack of personal interest but more so that I didn’t fully understand that I had a lack of interest.

I think it was because, around the age of 18, I found fanfic for the first time (SPUFFY 4 LYFE) and you best believe the smutty stories were my favorite (still are btw). Before that? Oh, this movie has a sex scene? Imma just watch it a dozen times, okay? So, clearly, I’m interested… maybe I just haven’t met the right guy?

It’s only been recently – around the last 5 years ago – that I’ve attempted to identify my sexuality. The catalyst of which was a particularly memorable event where I was literally sobbing at the thought of hanging out with a casual friend that I knew was interested in more. It was the first time anyone has ever told me that they were attracted to me and I was horrified by it.

So, yep, it appears I’m repulsed by sex? Great, I’m asexual.

But what about the fanfic and those dirty sex scenes, allagog? If you like watching/reading it, you must (subconsciously) want it in real life too.

So, I start reading a bit more and landed on the term graysexual for a few years – because I assumed my interest in that stuff proved I was sexually interested in people, therefore I straddled the line between asexuality and heterosexuality.

But I still felt like it didn’t fit.

It wasn’t until I started reading x reader fanfic daily (before that, I’d check out a story here and there) with the introduction of Eddie Munson (not unlike you) that I began to understand that the only time I was remotely interested in someone was if:

They were a celebrity who I will never, EVER meet

They were a fictional character

So, like one is wont to do in this day and age, I googled: “only sexually attracted to fictional characters’

And Aegosexuality popped up. And even though it’s not 100% a perfect match, of all the terms I’ve come across, this one fits the best.

The “remove yourself” bit you mentioned is also one of the parts that I don’t fully identify with (masturbating is the other), but I think that’s open to interpretation. It may not be the same for you, but when I’m reading x reader fics or imagining scenarios, I don’t actually picture me as I am, but a FICTIONAL version of myself.

In the end, the most important thing about identifying as any sexuality is that it's the right fit for you.

As for Eddie headcanons, I can't say I really have any that are entirely specific to me. For the most part, I love (most) of the versions that other authors have created or built upon. I love awkward, affectionate, sweetheart Eddie the most and almost always imagine him as much. Virgin!Eddie or sexually inexperienced are also 100% canon for me.

I'll also admit to really struggling with Asshole/Jerk Eddie and promiscuous Eddie (especially when combined with the Asshole/Jerk version of him). No disrespect for the people that read/write this version but I usually avoid them.

Thank you again so much for your ask! If you (or anyone else) ever want to reach out again - about anything, anything at all! - I'd love to hear it! <3