#you've never going to be able to stop people from shipping all kinds of dynamics

[thejustmaiden]

Jaken = Rin's Dad?

Okay, is this how a daughter treats their so-called father?

Most definitely not.

Rin and Jaken's relationship clearly screams of your typical sibling rivalry punctuated with cute and silly moments of playful bickering.

Yes, Jaken may technically be her main provider, but that doesn't necessarily equate to him being more of a father than Sesshomaru. If anything, he demonstrates more of a brotherly love towards her. As we all know, parents (which Sesshomaru embodies more based on real life patterns and parallels) will leave their older more capable children in charge of looking after their younger brothers and sisters. In this case, that would mean making Jaken responsible for watching over Rin and protecting her if need be. Ah-Un offers protection, too. Think of it as Jaken as the big brother and Ah-Un as the family dog who are babysitting while Sesshomaru as the parent of the household is away at work or taking care of business. I mean, they literally fit that description to a tee and I'm dying at the accuracy of it all! 🤣👌

[Quick! Someone write up a modern au where Sesshomaru finally gets out to have a nice date night but everything goes wrong in the most spectacular way. Like maybe Rin and Jaken catch a ride on Ah-Un to go spy!]

I recently revisited some episodes from The Final Act, and I couldn't believe how many moments like this there were where Rin got after Jaken or when she would "put him in his place" so to speak. Obviously, all of it is mostly harmless. I was only surprised by how often it occurred, not to mention how Jaken would just stand there and take it. Towards a supposed father figure, Rin's behavior is downright unacceptable. There's a certain level of respect a child is expected to show their parents/guardians, and that's just not what I'm witnessing here between them. Like at all.

Rather their dynamic has the nature of some sibling relationships like I mentioned above. So I really wish fans would stop pretending otherwise, because based on what we know of father-daughter relationships- healthy ones at least- they don't appear anything like what Jaken and Rin have. If you could please provide me other examples of where we've seen similar portrayals in fiction or in real life, then perhaps I can get on board.

Look, that doesn't have to mean that because Jaken isn't her father then Sesshomaru must be. They can both be her caretakers without necessarily filling that traditional father role. I'm just saying that if we're going to start assigning titles to characters, let's make sure we are accurate and truthful in our assessments. If you're going to label anyone Rin's dad, then it needs to be Sesshomaru. Jaken doesn't have precedence over him in terms of fatherly attributes, that just wouldn't make sense.

After all, this isn't about what you want to see, this is about what Rin very likely sees. It's safe to assume that she views Sesshomaru more like a father than she does Jaken. She knows she's safe with him (broadly speaking lol) and that he'll come for her no matter what. That sense of security and comfort is what a child seeks and what they should always feel in a parent's presence. She trusts and even idolizes him, just as a young and innocent child tends to do with their parents. At that age, parents are perfect and could do no wrong in their child's eyes. Idk about you, but this describes perfectly how Rin is around Sesshomaru.

Rin adores him and will follow him anywhere- yes, even into danger! That's what the innocence and unconditional love of a child will bring them to do if necessary. Fortunately, at the end of The Final Act we learn Sesshomaru takes Kaede's advice when he realizes that leaving Rin with her in the village is in her best interests. That way she'd be able to lead a more normal and safer life alongside other humans. Remember, Sessrin shippers, that doesn't mean he wasn't still a part of her life and didn't witness her become a young woman over the years right before his very eyes. Therefore, if they eventually do become romantically involved, then most if not all of those gifts had intimate and seductive intentions and it essentially constitutes as child grooming.

I understand from a Sessrin shipper's point of view why it'd be so much easier to claim Jaken as the father. In doing so, they diminish Sesshomaru's role in her upbringing. By refusing to acknowledge the real role he had in helping raise Rin (short periods can be crucial and impressionable too esp. in a child's early years so yes they did assist in raising her not only Kaede), these shippers are better able to justify how their filial-like relationship evolved into a romantic one. So yeah, I get it, if I were a Sessrin shipper I'd probably do the same. It's one of the more plausible arguments available to them, after all. "Let's pin Jaken as the father to fend off antis!" is the best chance they've got, but even so, it's still not good enough. But if you insist Jaken is indeed like a father to Rin, then Sesshomaru is most certainly one too. Who says she can't have two fathers anyway?

The thing is however much you want to deny or downplay what Sesshomaru truly means to Rin and vice versa, nothing will ever change or hide the truth of the matter. Please, stop acting like they're only traveling companions and nothing more. Some of y'all even go so far as to say that they're like strangers. Knowing potentially little about a person is not equal to a lack of love and affection. Making big assumptions such as this to defend your ship is actually doing you more harm than good. Let me elaborate.

According to your reasoning, if that's all Rin ever was to him was a companion and Sesshomaru had no real attachment to her, then what precisely is the basis of your ship? Recall that Adult!Rin doesn't exist yet, thus we have no real idea what she will be like or if she's even alive. So how can you make comments like that but then go on later to say "they have such a unique and unbreakable bond" or "only Rin can be the mother because she's the only human he ever cared for" if all that time spent traveling together didn't amount to much in the first place like you claimed to believe beforehand? Do you see how your rationalizing is confusing?

Contrary to what some of you may think, I'm not just saying all this because I'm an anti and I'm obligated to disagree with you, or whatever other excuse you want to tell yourself. Believe it or not, I'm attempting to give as unbiased and objective of an analysis I can based on widely accepted interpretations of family dynamics, development, and any history we know of.

Of course I respect that at times fans will perceive things differently since that's bound to happen. What's hard for me to wrap my head around however is the unwillingness of some fans- not exclusively Sessrin shippers- to apply basic common sense and sound judgment to their observations and deductions.

Looking at all our facts, then taking the small handful of scenes Sesshomaru and Rin do share together into account, one can logically conclude that their dynamic is akin to one found in a typical parent-child relationship. If you still fail to recognize Sesshomaru as a parent to Rin, then that's fine too. In the end, that won't really change the fact that he'd still take on a role resembling an adult figure overseeing a young child's care and protection. Be it as a vassal, guardian, what have you. Plus, nobody is saying here that Sesshomaru doesn't make mistakes regarding Rin's general well-being, but so do all parents. Overall, I think the majority of us agree that Rin is in good hands. Whether it's in his direct company or in his occasional supervision from his frequent visits to the village.

In other words, it doesn't really matter what exact title you assign him in relation to Rin, as the distribution of power is all inherently the same with any and all adult-child relationships. That bond never changes once you've established it either, seeing as it's a special kind of connection one can only form with a child and a child alone.

I was a teacher for a few years, and speaking from personal experience, you don't need to be a parent, per se, to take on a role of authority in a child's life. I know without a doubt that I could never and will never view any of those kids I taught in a sexual/romantic light later down the road; yes, not even once they become grown-ups who are independent and more than capable of making their own decisions. Those of you who disagree are usually missing the whole point though, because we're not trying to dictate what Adult!Rin can and cannot do like many tend to accuse of us doing. This isn't a question of taking away from her autonomy nor does it fall under "purity culture," which is why people shouldn't continue jumping to these outrageous conclusions and really listen for a change. You're deflecting from the real issue here when you choose to misinterpret what we're saying by ignoring the problem we're actually referring to. You cannot present a valid counter-argument if you persist in twisting our words.

Bottom line: once these kids become old enough to pursue a sexual/romantic relationship, of course they have that right if they're ready. All we're trying to say is you guys ought to stop pushing forward this it's-completely-normal-to-want-to-bang-your-adoptive-dad-since-you're-an-adult-and-can-do-as-you-please agenda and not expect backlash. Ship it if you want, but please stop acting like their romance would be the epitome of a pure and healthy relationship.

Sesshomaru may not wear his heart on his sleeve, but it's foolish to presume he didn't actually care about Rin during their whole time together just because he didn't openly express his feelings until the very end. Surely everybody can comprehend that people handle and process their emotions differently. The way Sesshomaru chooses to is completely valid for the most part, so let's cut him some slack regarding this already.

What I'm trying to get at is that any child whose life you played an influential role in will always be a kid in a lot ways to you even when they're old and wrinkly. Just as they will always picture you as the loved one who guided and protected them when they were most vulnerable and couldn't always fend for themselves. Can't we relate this to children we know personally and apply it accordingly?

Finally, I want to end on this note. Could you kindly take a look at these two images below for a second?

The reason I ask is because of something I recently read that's relevant to the topic. There was this pro-sessrin tweet I saw that stated Rin trying to take care of Sesshomaru when they first met is what a mom would do for a child, which in their opinion, translates to Rin being more like a mother than a daughter if anything.

First off: are you freaking kidding me????

Seriously, so now children aren't allowed to tend to their sick or injured parents?! Parents are apparently superhuman and shouldn't be offered a helping hand from a child, even if they mean well and want to help their parent who's in pain?? Now this Twitter user was mostly being a smartass, but at the same time, it was evident they genuinely thought they offered a valid enough point that warranted no further explanation or clarification.

Secondly, by saying this Sessrin fans don't seem to realize that in actuality they're contradicting themselves and proving the point we've been trying to make all along. Glancing at the first picture and moving down to the second, the role of the one being cared for and the caretaker is reversed. So then by their own logic, Sesshomaru IS in fact like a father to Rin.

What it comes down to is the names you give to the roles these characters play aren't as crucial as the dynamic they share. The specific characteristics of that dynamic are what define the importance of said role, not so much the name in the role itself. So real father or not, Sesshomaru and Rin clearly mean a lot to each other. Close relationships are defined and solidified by the devotion and belonging they have to one another, not solely by the duration of time spent together and their proximity.

Well, that's a wrap! I hope you guys got something outta this blog, and that you enjoyed or found some portions of it interesting. I would love to hear your thoughts on the subject from this fandom, but only engage in conversation if you plan to be respectful. Thank you!

[feathersandblue]

So you ship winc*st? Like, you've been talking about the finale and how much you hate it but then you make this post which is all winc*st rects. Not be judgmental here but ... why would you ship that? And if you ship it, why aren't you happy with the finale?

Nonnie, I started out as a Sam/Dean shipper. I got into SPN after reading fanfic about it and caught up to the show only in season 6. Back at the time, there was a lot of excellent fanfic available and Destiel wasn’t yet the huge juggernaut ship it became on tumblr. When I got into the SPN fandom, the fic was still scattered on LJ, and a lot of it was archived either there or in smaller archives. 

Hell yes, I ship it. But the thing is, I ship it in fanfic, and that’s an entirely different thing than wanting to see it happen on screen. And I ship it BECAUSE of the dysfunctional dynamic, not in spite of it. So much Wincest fanfic has exact the right amount of UST, of pining, of guilt, of pschological drama, of angst. It has that edge that I’m looking for. And it fit very well with the tone of the early seasons, where Sam and Dean are caught in this gritty, dirty road movie/urban horror story where they can only rely on each other.

As opposed to that, I never read a lot of Destiel. For one, a lot of it is AU. Coffeeshop AU and things like T&S and “OMG they were roommates and Cas is the nerd and Dean the jock”, but that’s not the kind of fic that I’m looking for. There are some canon-compliant fics that I like, but none that stand out to me, whereas there’s tons of early season Wincest fic that I can come up with from memory (and did, as you see in that rec post, because those were all fics that I immediately recalled when I started thinking about it).

Again: I never wanted to see Wincest in the show. For the actual show, I wanted character development that allowed the two brothers to move on from their mutual co-dependency. I wanted them to grow up and learn how to communicate, I wanted Dean to let go of the idea that Sam’s well-being was his sole responsibility, I wanted Sam to be allowed to carry his own share of the burden, I wanted for the two of them to get a life that wasn’t just each other. Because otherwise, what kind of story are the writers even telling?

And then Destiel snuck up on me. I wanted for Dean to be able to have that close relationship with Cas. I wanted it to become canon. In season eight in particular, the writer seemed to steer into that direction, but then season nine rolled around and they toned down on the romantic subtext. I kept watching until season 10, Fan Fiction, which I understood as a love letter to fandom but also as a warning that Destiel was never going to happen. At that point, I saw very little character development, and knowing that the show was just going to keep running, going through the motions with no resolution in sight, I stopped watching.

When I learned that season 15 would be the last one, I started catching up. And I was surprised that Dean’s and Cas’ arc seemed to be actually going somewhere. Still with the no homo (pal-buddy-man-dude) and the carefully maintained distance but also with a surprising amount of parallels and symbolism and subtext and romantic tropes.

I have to admit, 15.18 blindsided me. And it did awaken a desperate hope in me. But then the finale rolled around and it turns out they did, in fact, bury their gays, and they decided that Dean was not allowed to cross that line. Instead, the show did a one-eighty and ... delivered what I like to call emotional incest. Sam and Dean living in domestic bliss in the bunker. Every other character erased from the brothers’ world. That exclusive focus on each other. Sam, once again, being the only thing in Dean’s life, framed and coded as Dean’s One True Love, including the death scene where Dean confesses his undying love and devotion to his baby brother.

The thing that makes incest problematic isn’t the religious taboo. It’s the fact that incestuous relationships almost exclusively happen in the context of dysfunctional family dynamics. Let’s face the facts: Very few sane and consenting adulds suddenly decide to bone their siblings. We’re not wired that way. Stuff like that happens, it’s usually a reflection of unhealthy mutual obsession. Of fucked-up childhoods. Of an emotional inability to form fulfilling relationships with other people. And the SPN finale reflects all these things, the brothers fit that description to a T.

Hell, it made me wish, for the first time, that the show had made it explicit. At least then someone would have gotten an orgasm out of it.

The thing is, I wanted Destiel also because it’s a way for Dean to grow. I wanted for the writers to let him change. I wanted to see him get the chance to become more, not less. To mature, not to regress.

The same goes for Sam. The fact that they wrote Eileen out of the finale and never gave Sam that emotionally fulfilling relationship that we know he would have been capable of forming with her is a form of betrayal too.

I think it boils down to this: Fanfic is one thing, canon another. I wanted a satisfying ending, not this hot mess that makes no sense - to a point where I felt compelled, as I’ve rarely been before, to fix it in a rewrite. I usually write fanfic when a random idea comes to my mind that refuses to let go of me. But in this case, it was different. It was this need to fix it. Fix everyting. They got everything wrong and I had to make it right.

It’s not always black and white, nonnie. I can hate the finale - and what it took from the characters (and, in extension, from us) - till all eternity, and yet enjoy the early season fanfic that pulled me into fandom.

[aros001]

Going in blind: Watching season 1 for the first time. Random thoughts.

This show is kind of nice because I have no memories of the original She-Ra show, or even any of He-Man, honestly. I'm not sure if I ever watched the original, so I have no frame of reference for how the series is "supposed" to be. I can just take it and judge it as is.

Of the bat, all I know is that supposedly She-Ra and Catra get together as a romantic couple later, but I'm also a huge My Hero Academia fan and the fandom around me ships every character with every other character, so for all I know that might just be shipper wishful thinking I've been seeing and hearing. Given fandoms for Gravity Falls, Thor, and Supernatural ship even siblings together, I've learned not to trust anything except for what I see in the series for myself.

By the way, this isn't a review, just random thoughts and comments I'm having as I'm going through season 1 for the first time.

Episodes 1 and 2: Right off, I really like Catra's "No duh" response to Adora about the truth of the horde. She knows they've been lying to them and have been doing terrible things, she just doesn't care. If she and Adora play their cards right they could end up being the ones in charge and then they'd have all that power. Not necessarily to make things better but enough to where they could do whatever and live however they want. That's a good build for an antagonist. Not ignorant to the fact what they're doing is wrong, just simply so selfish that they don't care.

Episode 3: It really feels like there was no good reason why Glimmer didn't just outright introduce Adora to her mother and every reason she should have known it was a bad idea to try and hide her for a surprise. Being a former horde soldier she'd probably get treated with hostility if Glimmer brought her to the front gate but you'd almost guarantee Adora would get arrested or outright killed if she got caught while no one else knew she was there.

On the other side, we have Hordak being pretty intelligent in promoting Catra. He probably knows Shadow Weaver already doesn't like him, so it's not like he's losing anything making her upset with him, and it's clear she favors Adora way more than Catra, so that little bit of advancement towards Catra probably goes a long way in earning her loyalty to him and a person on the inside with Shadow Weaver.

Also, I'm not the only one who saw Madam Razz and immediately thought Adora had found her Yoda, right?

Episode 4: I don't know how it was in the original She-Ra and He-Man series but I kind of like She-Ra being this title from legend. Adora is not the first She-Ra, given what Razz was talking about with a Mara, so instead of being something new, impressing everyone with abilities they've never seen before, and creating the legend, Adora is placed in a position WAY over her head where she's having to live up to what came before her.

Episode 5: Calling it now, as long as her personality is genuine I think Scorpia is going to be one of my favorite characters in this show. She's...endearing, I think is the best word. She's like a mix of Kronk and a nicer Shego.

For a little bit I thought Mermista was voiced by the same actress who played Poison Ivy in the Harley Quinn animated series. She's not but they do have the same kind of Daria-ish inflections, thus by confusion. Given the prom episode, Sea Hawk feels kind of like her Kite Man.

Episode 6: Okay, now it's between Scorpia and Entrapta who are likely to be my favorites by the end of this. She's fun and quirky.

Episode 7: Quite the lore drop. Shadow Weaver was once a Mystacor sorceress known as Light Spinner. I like to imagine we'll get more on that later. Her haunting Adora reminded me of the Teen Titans' episode where Robin was similarly haunted by Slade. This didn't go as far as that but that's probably for the best, since TT had two and a half seasons to build that dynamic up with Robin and Slade while we're only now halfway through the first season.

Episode 8: Well dang. Again, I don't know for sure if Adora and Catra do end up together but boy do I buy why they're shipped together after that dance. Also, good on Bow for standing up for himself. It's clear that he'll always be Glimmer's friend and this won't change that but that doesn't mean he has to just accommodate her. I understand where her issues stem from but I am still glad he gave her a reality check. It helps him feel a little more like his own character.

Also, another nice little bit of lore and worldbuilding. Scorpia's a princess, the horde landed where her people lived, and they seemed to join them willingly.

Episode 9: Surprisingly don't have a lot to say about this other than I don't buy for a second that Entrapta is dead (EDIT: She's not). This was mostly action.

Episode 10: Not going to lie, this one kind of annoyed me a little, at least the first half. The conversation between Glimmer and her mother saved it a bit. It was a bit of a trifecta. You have the alliance breaking apart, saying that the loss of Entrapta only happened because they were all together...even though Entrapta only "died" because of her own machine obsession that caused her to deliberately walk back into the purging chamber. You have Entrapta who might be turning to the horde's side because she feels abandoned by the other princesses...even though they thought she was dead, and again it was her fault they got separated. And you have Glimmer refusing to tell her mother that Shadow Weaver's dark magic has caused her powers to go on the fritz and is causing her great pain. It just feels like none of this would be an issue if most of these people would stop being self-absorbed for three seconds and talk like any normal person would. It feels very CW drama, like something I'd see in a bad season of Arrow or The Flash. The only person whose issues I buy is Adora, who is basically a soldier who was never properly raised to deal with emotion or loss and is already struggling with the burden of being She-Ra, the legendary savior. I get why she's beating down on herself for not being able to do more even if nothing that happened was her fault.

Episode 11: JEEEEEEEEEZZZZ, that was such a good episode! Focused entirely on Adora and Catra and their past together. Like, just showing someone this episode alone could probably get them to want to watch the series. That was everything you needed to know about their dynamic and history together.

Also, that moment when Catra and her past self are looking at each other, while obviously Catra takes the opposite lesson, it reminded me of this fanart I'd once seen of Jason Todd, the Red Hood, looking at his past self as Robin. The past says to the future "You ruined everything". Catra could be happy but, ironically for someone who hates Shadow Weaver, she's probably going to be a lot like her, sacrificing everything for power and ambition.

Given the way she looked, I'm guessing Shadow Weaver is either addicted to the power of the Black Garnet or she suffered some kind of past injury and its power is the only thing keeping her going. Or both.

Episode 12: I'll be honest, Swiftwind being able to talk kind of gobsmacked and I needed a moment to recover. What a great voice they chose for that character.

So She-Ra is kind of like the legendary heroes from Rising of the Shield Hero, coming from a long line of people chosen to wield the sword. I tend to dislike chosen one types of stories because I think prophecy takes a lot of weight out of the character's actions, so this and Avatar are more what I like. The MC is special but not the only one who's ever been special and they can still easily fail. Their destiny was only to be able to use the weapon, not that they would succeed in any specific purpose.

And dang, Catra's turn against Shadow Weaver happened faster than I thought it would but I'm not complaining. That great "This is what you've really been preparing me for" speech and Hordak, again, being an intelligent villain. "Oh, this experiment could net me a MASSIVE gain and all it could potentially cost me is this rock I already gave away to someone who lately hasn't been producing any results and has been consistently disobeying me. Yeah, I'm going to let this play out."

Episode 13: That was kind of a brutal fight between Adora and Catra. Not the worst I've ever seen even in other shows for this age range (Samurai Jack, for example) but those punches are connecting and those claws are leaving marks.

Also, maybe I'm just misunderstanding the exact situation but shouldn't the good guys' side be called the Resistance instead of the Rebellion? Being a rebellion would imply they are rebelling against an established power or rule over them, but the actual conflict we are shown is the established power and rule that is the kingdoms of Eternia resisting an outside force that wishes to establish a new order over them.

Season 1 verdict: I'm into it. I'm definitely more invested in the villains' side of things but that's not a fault of the series, that stuff is just way more geared towards me than the current princess stuff. I actively am at attention whenever the horde main characters are on screen. For the good guys it's mostly Adora and the She-Ra stuff I'm invested it. That isn't to say I have any real dislikes for that side. Bow especially I'm liking much more than I thought I might. He has kind of this gravitational pull around him. You will be his friend regardless of how much you might want to resist. He's definitely the rock for everyone else to hold onto.

Minor side note, kind of like Korra in Legend of Korra, I love how even when her powers aren't active Adora is shown to still be pretty strong physically with how easily she was lifting people up at the prom.

And I was right, Scorpia is my favorite side character.

On to season 2!

Original Reddit post: https://www.reddit.com/r/PrincessesOfPower/comments/nyll2e/going_in_blind_watching_season_1_for_the_first/

[thatpinkbetch]

I'm going to answer it this way, because I'm actually not a fan of some of those, and I've heard this is the way to do it if you don't want it ending up in the tag or the search I think? If i censor any of the ship names it's not out of malice! I simply don't want any of this to end up in front of eyes that just want to enjoy their ships 💖💖💖 if there is anyone who doesn't want to see opinions against t*d*d*ku, k*r*b*ku, or even iz**ch*ka, please don't read any further! Oh my goodness i hope this is all legible...

Anyways, hello!! Thank you so much for the ask!! I love talking about my opinion avkvmsocnaocjsoxks it also makes me really happy you like my blog 🥺🥺🥺 (I hope this answer doesn't ruin that avskvneognsocjs)

I'll start out by confirming that I'm not a multishipper. It makes me excited to see how the act of shipping itself can make others happy, but it's just not that way for me. I actually never read fanfic until I got into bnha (bkdk is just that powerful 😁😁) I'm actually...a little serious when i ship, or when i enjoy media, i analyze pretty heavily, so also, if that doesn't sound like anyone's cup of tea, i would once again recommend to stop reading and enjoy your day please!

I love analyzing characters and storylines and dynamics, but i will admit, I'm not a fan of most of the ships - not romantically. I think all the characters have interesting relationships to each other, all of the kids are great friends, and I love bonds and friendships so much 🥺🥺🥺

Those first two are perhaps the biggest, at least they definitely were the biggest when I first entered. Once i caught up, I didn't really understand the enthusiasm, but people have fun shipping, so that's nice! I think of those two as easy ships, if that makes sense? They're pretty simple, and easy to digest.

I personally am not a fan of romantic t*d*d*ku for a very specific reason; it feels weird to me for Todo to immediately fall in love with the first person who's ever shown him kindness (since his mother of course). Todo had never had any friends, nor any want for friends, obviously because of the abuse he faced as a child. Mido was his first exploration at a life outside of his father, a life he got to make for himself, it just doesn't feel right to me that he should immediately think "oh, is this romantic love? Is this the one and only for me?" Well, perhaps a teenager might think that way, but i don't think that's actually how he feels deep down, and I'm sure that's something a lot of us have to learn as we grow (I've definitely struggled with my own understanding of romance for the past 8 years). I think he still is trying to learn how to socialize and to make friends and to be a friend (and he's doing SUCH a good job!) But to immediately plunge into romance, which can be complicated, i don't think that would be right for him. I hope that makes sense! I know they're a very cute ship, which makes for fun! But again, I can be a little serious when i ship...

K*r*b*ku kind of falls into similar territory for me? Baku definitely had friends growing up, but he's seemed to always have trouble understanding his feelings and where he stands with others, causing trust issues. Kiri is really the first person he knew where he stood with, a person for him to be comfortable with and feel on equal ground, which i think is such a huge and positive role in his life, and i don't necessarily think that it needs to be romantic - for both of these, i think these relationships are incredibly important, to everyone involved, and making them romantic doesn't make them any more important!! In fact, i feel like them as friends actually can offer a more complex, interesting, and human dynamic between these characters, as sometimes people simply default to romance and then end up pushing for the same old tropes and ignore all the intricacies Horikoshi includes in his writing.

Again, I love Mido's friendship with Todo, and I love Baku's friendship with Kiri. I think these relationships are incredibly important, and friends are incredibly important. People who ship them are having fun, which is so lovely, and i hope they continue to have fun! I hope you personally find more fics about them that make you smile and brighten your day 💖💖💖

Iz**ch*ka is a little difficult, because they certainly are cute, separately and together. I thought they were cutest before Ura was told about her potential crush on Mido, when she was simply a source of bubbly energy and positivity that helped Mido open up and feel comfortable around other people. I feel though that, romantically, it's extraordinarily one-sided, and at this point, i have to wonder if they really are "end goal." End goal for shounen, of course, is hardly ever explicit ahzovndlfjsoxo but i feel like a better storyline for Horikoshi to take would be for Ura to realize that she's been confused, and these feelings haven't really been a positive experience for her. I've definitely gone through things like that as a teenager. Now, the ship can be very cute! They're basically the same person, and they're cute and bubbly! But again, it simply isn't for me.

I think Momjirou is very cute!! Of course, as a lesbian, i sense strong lesbian vibes from Momo, and strong bi vibes from Jirou, and I also saw the ship potential ever since the USJ attack - which i think, so did everyone else ahaovndofjsojfsk they're best friends without a doubt, though i have to say, i really like Kamijirou. She just makes him so soft, and he's so in awe of her, and she thinks he's so funny, I love how supportive he is of her, especially since she can be really insecure 🥺🥺🥺

I also think Ura and Tsu are very cute but another easy ship, and i kind of really like Ochamina 🥺 they're both pink and space themed, they're bubbly and energetic and kick ass, and i think they'd be super cute...

I saved todobaku for last, because, you know what they say, best for last! 😇😇😇

I've said it before, but if there was no Mido (impossible obviously, and i would never want that) then todobaku is where my heart would lie. Baku has never really been shown chasing after anyone except for Mido...and Todo, which really gets at my heart. There's a grudging respect there - very, very grudging ahakckdkfjskdk which i find very appealing! Todo is very important to Baku and he has also been able to show Baku some things about himself that he needed to question and reevaluate. Meanwhile, Todo puts up with exactly 0% of Baku's shit, which i find absolutely hilarious. It's funny to me how Baku wishes to intimidate Todo as he does everyone else, and Todo simply does not care. And Baku wants to be mad, and ends up mad that he can't be mad since Todo is a strong and worthy opponent. They just have such an interesting chemistry, there's so much friction, so much tension, and I enjoy it, particularly since they clearly should be friends, would be great friends, want to be friends, but Baku simply won't get over it 😂😂 I do prefer them as friends, but friends that are incredibly close, two people that understand each other on almost a telepathic level, two people that give each other shit while also refusing to take the other's shit.

I do agree that many people in this fandom seem to think their ship stands on some moral high ground? It could be a disconnect from the previous generations of fandom, or it could also be the growing mentality on this site that everything needs to be a battle of moral superiority, and also that what you like is part of your personality, and if someone doesn't like what you like, then they don't like you or that they think you're factually incorrect. I personally have stopped going into the bn/ha tag simply because I don't enjoy, well, many things i find there, and I'm happy with those that i follow. I've definitely seen hatred and invalidation for both LGBT ships and m|w ships, neither of which I'm comfortable with. I definitely don't go off tumblr for fandom stuff because there's practically no acceptance for any same gender ships, or any queer headcanoning, which, I'll be honest, makes me scared, as i am a very anxious person avdkvndkfje i do think it should be noted that we should be as accepting of cishet ships as we are of queer ships - no debate on this one - but again, you are right when you say that many cishet headcanons have been used to invalidate LGBT voices, and any and all allies must always be aware of this! It is much more often that queer voices are silenced, that queer ships are ridiculed, that queer shippers aren't allowed to enjoy or see themselves. And to anybody that doesn't want to be an ally... Whelp ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ what are you doing here ajxkvmdogjdicjsicjsodj I'm gay

I haven't really read much of anything recently, let alone other ships, platonic or otherwise, because energy has been low for me for a long time. I wish i could participate more and support all my friends and other fans, but it's been a bit of a struggle 😣😣😣 I'm so sorry! Something that I can do is make posts and analyses and metas, as those are quick and make me excited, so I'm always happy to respond to asks like these! (I say as i take two hours to write this response...)

I hope people have been taking care of themselves and remember that tumblr is really good at letting you cater to your own interests! I hope if you've made it to the end of this response that you enjoyed it, and you're not mad at me ahsovjekgjsocjwodkso if you are, that's fine, I'm sorry, I probably am really bad at social/internet etiquette and such that help you filter 😣😣

To any who are curious, you cannot change my mind ahdogmdocjdidk thank you to whoever sent this ask!!! A lot of this is a bunch of rambling I've always wanted to talk about but was frankly too scared to post! I hope I made sense and answered everything you were asking!! Please have a good day/night/life!!! 💖💖💖💖💖

[aelinbitch-archive]

You've probably said this before but what's your favorite aspect of the TOG series? I've only read like ten pages of the first book lol

aaaaa thank u for asking!! this sort of leads into something i’ve been meaning to talk about for a while so i hope you’re prepared for An Essay No One Wanted By Me. anyway this is a two-part answer, read below:

1. Aelin. Celaena. The main bitch, whatever you wanna call her lol. Without her I probably wouldn’t have cared about the series at all and wouldn’t currently be trapped in ToG tumblr hell reluctantly stanning a racist and homophobic series, but unfortunately when I was like twelve years old or whatever and read the first book I literally imprinted on Celaena like a baby duckling. To the extent that she became, like, the default avatar for all my maladaptive daydreaming and If I Don’t Project On Her At All Times I Will Die. It’s not like she’s the only thing I like about the series (I loooove a lot of the other characters, especially the gals, and the writing can be really great and engaging and cinematic) but Aelin has always been the supermassive black hole at the center of it all for me. I wouldn’t know how to even begin untangling her character from my psyche at this point. It’s honestly a little disturbing. Anyway. 

2. Part two is a quality of the series that I feel was unprecedented in its strength in the first five books of the series (ToG-QoS plus the prequel novellas) and really really disappointingly weak in the last two books (EoS-KoA). Like I said above, Aelin has always been my main interest in tog so I read and enjoyed the last two anyway, but I definitely felt the loss of this - “this” being the detail and attention paid to all different types of relationships between characters, and how rich and unpredictable those relationships were as a result. 

That sounds like kind of a broad, vague thing, but what I mean is that (in my opinion) rarely are romances and friendships and rivalries explored with such nuance, complexity, drama, and realism in most YA as they are in ToG. I remember reading Cassandra Clare’s books (lmao.) as a pre teen and loving those as well, but totally being able to predict who was going to end up with who, and finding the character dynamics to be pretty cut and dry. 

In ToG that’s not the case at all. Like, you’ve got Celaena and Sam, a really complex example of enemies to lovers to….. Tragically Dead Boyfriend Whose Demise Fuels My Guilt and Self-Hatred For Seven More Books, Lysandra and Aelin, two girls pitted against each other by their abuser who team up a year later to unlearn their internalized misogyny and kill him, and Aelin and Chaol, who… how do I even describe the ups and downs (and downs. and more downs) of their relationship. 

And that’s just three pairs! Pull the names of two characters out of a hat and I can almost guarantee essays worth of material could be written about them. Arobynn and Aelin? Aelin and Nehemia? Chaol and Dorian, as much as I hate both of them and feel that their relationship as been widely mischaracterized? All fascinating!!! No two people in those first few books are just friends, or just lovers, or just enemies. It’s always more complex, there’s always a history or tension or competing agendas or viewpoints that Fuck Shit Up. 

And benefit of that is twofold: one, everything that happens between the characters just…. lands so well. The betrayals and triumphs and losses and victories of The Assassin’s Blade and Crown of Midnight and Queen of Shadows (especially TAB) are fucking heart-stopping. It’s great character-driven entertainment!! Gripping and engaging and vivid to the point of being painful. 

And two, there’s no way to predict where a relationship is going to go. Aelin and Lysandra teaming up in QoS instead of returning to their rivalry? Who would have thought! Ansel and Celaena’s summer fling (they were in love. fight me.) ending like That? Holy fuck. Nesryn and Chaol breaking up in ToD? Oh shit! I fell for it again! Rowan and Aelin ending up together after everyone swore they were brotp in HoF? Hell yeah! Chaolaena seeming like endgame and then ending forever, with Chaol and Aelin realizing that the rift between them that began in CoM was something that would never sufficiently heal? Unprecedented. Fucking badass for a YA book to curve everyone like that. Tween me was shook out of her mind. 

(Important to note, though, that the downside of this style was that SJM couldn’t tell where ~unpredictable relationships and characters~ ended and fridging began, and as a result, not one but two woc were killed off to make white characters sad and it sucked beyond belief). 

Aaaaaand then QoS, the peak of literature, turned into EoS, and SJM just… gave up on all of that. I remember the first time Dorian and Manon met, and I was like oh, okay. So they’re going to end up together. And I was right. I remember that on this site, before EoS came out, before Lorcan and Elide ever fucking MET, people predicted the existence of Elorcan!! And they were right!! Like how fucking boring? Everyone is just paired off into completely predictable heterosexual ships and those are now the only relationships we get to read about (with a few exceptions, like Aelin/Aedion, Aelin/Fenrys, etc.). 

I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again: my least favorite thing about Manorian is not that I find the relationship to be shitty (although I do, I really do). It’s that Dorian is suddenly the only character Manon gets to interact with in any meaningful way. 

Like, are you kidding?! I want to read about Manon and Elide, Manon and Asterin, Rowan and Lorcan, Aelin and Lysandra, Aelin and Nesyrn, even if it’s not romantically (although some of them, like Manon and Elide, absolutely should have been, and the fact that not only was that ship very thoroughly sunk, but also they didn’t even get to TALK after QoS, felt like a real slap in the face to gay fans, but I digress), because those pairings previously had hella complexity and drama. But we don’t get to. 

And this trend that’s so painfully present in the last two books Sucks for two reasons: one, every relationship that isn’t romantic (which were previously some of the most interesting ones) is abandoned so that more time can be made for The Hets™ and two, the relationships that are romantic, now the only ones left, are totally fucking boring and predictable!! If two characters are interacting at any point (if one is male and the other is female, of course) then you know for a fact that they’re not only love interests, but endgame. 

And that makes me not care even when there is drama between them. Elide giving Lorcan the cold-shoulder for three hundred pages, and Manon and Dorian arguing, and Aedion being cruel to Lysandra weren’t compelling narratives to me like they should have been, because the whole time I was just thinking “but it doesn’t matter. I know it’s still endgame. There are no stakes here whatsoever; it’s a done deal.” Whereas Chaol and Celaena’s devestating breakup in CoM felt like (and was) suuuuper Real. An all-in bet on the wrong person. Crazy shit. 

And not that I think two characters should never have a happy ending together (I really like rowaelin and nestaq and I would have loved malide!) but imagine how much cooler and subversive and entertaining it would have been if Elorcan, which seemed soooo totally cute and endgamey and borderline like fanfiction throughout all of EoS just ended forever right there and then on the beach, with Elide turning to Lorcan and saying “I hope you spend the rest of your miserable, immortal life suffering. I hope you spend it alone. I hope you live with regret and guilt in your heart and never find a way to endure it” - and BAM. She never speaks to him again. He’s dead to her. 

I mean, talk about shock value! (See, Sarah, you can have shock value without killing of a person of color to make a white character sad 🙃). And I totally get that relational twists like that alienate fans more than just going the expected route and having them kiss and make-up does (I mean, the ending of Chaolaena in QoS certainly did, Jesus Christ) but I, Bella aelinbitch, personally live for that shit, and isn’t it only fair that all media cater directly and specifically to me? Lmao. But seriously, I do think it’s objectively more interesting, and that it keeps readers on their toes (I was on my ASS in EoS and KoA. Like. I was flat on my back sinking into the Earth). 

And there are still sort of… glimmers of the old way she wrote in the first few books, but it just feels like a tease rather than something that’s really explored and indulged in the way it was before, and it just ends up being more frustrating (like what was the point of Manon and Dorian not getting married at the end of KoA if I would bet my life savings that in World of Tog it’ll be confirmed that they’re either married or still together) and sometimes downright problematic? Like to return to a previous example, I think all the drama between Aedion + Lysandra was a result of Sarah’s previous (good) instincts to shake stuff up and complicate the character dynamics, but it backfires because when they end up together, it’s not ever… worked out? Or addressed? If you create really intense drama between two people, then that needs to show up in their relationship, no matter how happy they end up together. It doesn’t just disappear.

And despite the fact that her understanding of that concept (that shit between two people doesn’t just disappear like magic) is one of my absolute favorite things about the first few books, Sarah even went as far as to use the last two books to retcon some of the original complexity away, which makes me want to rip out my hair!! Like Aelin at the end of KoA just going “Love you Chaol and Love you Dorian xoxoxoxoxox best friends forever!!!” instead of having, like, any type of mixed feelings about the way these boys treated her? I mean, come on! 100 pages earlier Chaol was openly saying she should die instead of Dorian! Why is everything just peachy-keen instead of fraught with tension!! (I know why. I know. It’s because she introduced way too many characters/POVs/storylines as the series went on and didn’t know what to do with them all besides sideline the nonromantic ones and pair off everyone else boy-girl boy-girl down the line). Or if it has to be peachy-keen, why is the peachy-keeness never critically examined as, perhaps, a repressive mechanism for Aelin to avoid dealing with painful truths from her past? Now that would be interesting. 

(My ideal World of ToG would be just a transcript of the characters’ therapy sessions where Aelin realizes that her insistence that “Chaol and Dorian Are Her Friends!” is actually a way to keep herself safe emotionally and that she has plenty of reasons to hate them, and Lysandra realizes she should divorce Aedion lmao).  

Anyway tldr: The variety, complexity, depth, and unpredictability of the relationships in Throne of Glass was simultaneously the most realistic (sometimes relationships of all kinds fall apart or veer off in unexpected directions and love is temporary and the boy you met in the first chapter isn’t actually your soulmate and it doesn’t mean he’s a villain) and the most gripping and dramatic (I would have been totally chill if maeve and erawan weren’t a thing and tog was just like a medieval soap opera, that’s how entertaining the character dynamics were) thing about the series, and to lose that in the last two books because of Heterosexuality (and introducing too many POVs and not knowing what to do with them all)…. kinda devastating. 

This ended up being waaaaaay more complaining than it was talking about what I loved, but the only reason it bothers me so much is because it used to be so good!!! So just imagine the inverse of all the frustration I just vomited into this ask and you’ll have a good idea of how much I loved the series when things weren’t this way.

[kirisunshine-ejirou]

Hiya! We've never talked before, but I love ur blog all the bnha posts you rb! :) And SINCE I saw recently that you've gotten into Banana Fish too, brace urself for these asks :D 1 Fandom : Banana Fish 2 Ship : Asheiji 3 Character : Eiji Okumura Hope you're having a lovely day! 💕

Aww, you’re so sweet! I actually watched Banana Fish a few months ago, but I recently re-watched it with my sister (and ripped my heart out again in the process), so that’s why I’ve been posting more about it lately!. Anyway, thank you for sending me the ask! :) Here are my answers:

001 | Fandom: Banana Fish

Favorite character: Honestly, as much as I love Eiji, it’s gotta be Ash. I will never stop grieving for him, and I appreciate the complexity of his character.

Least Favorite character: Yikes, there’s so many assholes in this show. I’m gonna go with Abraham for creating Banana Fish and then being a weak little bitch about it when shit hits the fan, and for hurting Shorter. Eduardo is also SCUM.

5 Favorite ships (canon or non-canon): I’m not sure if I could come up with 5 ships for this show…Asheiji for sure. Also Max + Jessica.

Character I find most attractive: Ash

Character I would marry: Blanca (hahaha, he’s well-read, attractive, mature, and cares for Ash despite the circumstances they’re both in)

Character I would be best friends with: I wanna be friends with Cain!

A random thought: Cain is such an underrated character! At least, I don’t hear much about him within the fandom. Sing is also a precious bby.

An unpopular opinion: Ash’s full name sounds kinda ugly? Like I love the meaning behind it, but Aslan Jade Callenreese is a bit much.

My Canon OTP: Asheiji

My Non-canon OTP: Don’t really have any.

Most Badass Character: It’s pretty much a tie between Ash and Blanca, but I guess I’d have to pick Blanca since he taught Ash.

Most Epic Villain: Dino. I wouldn’t call him “epic,” but his evil is an evil that’s not so in-your-face, but that still permeates the entire series (Please read @softasheijis‘s analysis of this, it’s great! Linked here: https://kirisunshine-ejirou.tumblr.com/post/183846304436/softasheijis-takes-a-long-sip-of-hot-tea-dino)

Pairing I am not a fan of: Hm. I don’t know of many pairings in the fandom, but Ash + anyone other than Eiji just isn’t right, hahaha. Also Blanca + Yut-Lung is gross b/c of the age thing.

Character I feel the writers screwed up (in one way or another): Some characters may be screwed up in the head, but other than that, no one.

Favourite Friendship: Shorter + Ash!

Character I most identify with: Ash. I have never experienced any kind of trauma to that comes anywhere near to what Ash had to endure, but I identify with the difficulty he had with believing he’s someone worthy to be loved. I’ve got low self-esteem and it can really get to me at times :/ I also don’t tend to trust people very easily.

Character I wish I could be: Hmm, well, I don’t think I’d want the tragic life that comes with being any of the characters…but if I had to choose I guess it would be Yut-Lung so I could have his wardrobe, lol.

002 | Ship: Asheiji

When I started shipping them: Honestly - the pole vaulting scene - I knew they were a ship from what I heard about the show before watching it, so my love of their connection was instantaneous. More realistically - that tender moment in Ep. 11 when Eiji promises Ash that he’ll stay by his side, even if the rest of the world turns on him. (God, I’m almost crying just writing this).

My thoughts: This is one of my all-time favorite ships  because the dynamic between the characters and what could have been between them sticks out for me. They deserved better.

What makes me happy about them: Their trust. They would give their lives for each other, and even though this turns out to get them both in a lot of trouble, it comforts me to think that Ash found someone he could rely on after 17 years of hell. Also, the fact that they can both be themselves in the relationship; as Max said, Ash found someone he can finally act his age around, unguarded.

What makes me sad about them: Ash will never get to go to Japan with Eiji :’(

Things done in fanfic that annoys me: Making them suffer any more than they already have.

Things I look for in fanfic: More fluff/hugs/domestic content <3

My wishlist: I don’t really understand this question? I wish for them to be happy. That is all.

Who I’d be comfortable them ending up with, if not each other: There’s just no other non-platonic pairing for either of them that I can think of.

My happily ever after for them: Ash goes to the library after being stabbed, but calls himself an ambulance, or Max, or anyone who could get him to the hospital, recovers, then meets up with Eiji in Japan where they live a happy, simple life together (as much as possible, ik Ash still has a ton of shit he needs to sort through.)

003 | Character: Eiji

How I feel about this character: His pureness always makes me smile, but he’s also got some spunk! Lol, as in, he teases Ash and isn’t afraid of him (the pumpkin thing, being able to wake Ash up when everyone else is terrified, throwing Ash in the shower, etc.) and he also becomes more able to defend himself as the show progresses; first he goes to Chinatown to find Shorter wearing that ridiculous outfit, then he holds Yut-lung hostage (kinda) and (tries) to shoot Dino. Bless him.

Any/all the people I ship romantically with this character: Ash

My favorite non-romantic relationship for this character: I love his interactions with Bones and Kong!

My unpopular opinion about this character: Not sure if this is “unpopular,” but I’ve heard some stuff about Eiji being more “edgy” (haha, see what I did there) in the manga, so I’d like to see more of that play out in the anime, to give him a little more nuanced character.

One thing I wish would happen / had happened with this character in canon: I wish we could’ve got more background info on him. Like we know that he’s a former pole-vaulter and that he has a little sister, but not much more than that. I think one of the side stories of the manga has this content though!

Favorite friendship for this character: Eiji & Shorter! Shorter was so protective of Eiji during their limited time together, and I would have loved to see more Ash - Eiji - Shorter friendship interactions.

My crossover ship: Hm, can’t think of any at the moment!

Sorry some of my answers aren’t the most straightforward, haha. Also, @silverquillsideas I just wanted to say, your blog theme is gorgeous, and even though I follow you, I don’t think I’ve seen any of your Banana Fish art/fics until now (I just reblogged an asheiji work of yours!), but I’ll be sure to look out for more :) Hope your day has been great; see you around!

[fiddler-unroofed]

27 - what is your take on their dynamic in canon?

Really close to my headcanon one, that's for sure! Cartman loves making Kyle's life hell; Kyle feels obligated to stop whatever bullshit agenda he's got going while secretly getting a little kick from it.

It's also interesting to point out that?? Kyle empathizes more with Cartman than Stan??? When Stan becomes semi depressed after being dumped, Kyle ditches him. When Stan becomes actually depressed after 'growing up', Kyle ditches him for Cartman. Like...

Stan: *goes through period of depression*

Kyle: LMAO... I DONT NEED THAT KIND OF TOXICITY IN MY LIFE....... BYE

Kyle: *goes to hang around Cartman, local Nazi, part time schemer and fulltime asshole*

???? Something ain't adding up here, buddy.

Meanwhile when Cartman is bummed out about something, Kyle gets it. He just... fucking gets it. And while I ship Style (a lot), I dunno if they'd ever be able to overcome these empathetic differences they've got and grow as a couple.

Anyway. Back to Kyman.

Generally I feel like they've got a pretty toxic symbiotic relationship going for them. Cartman needs Kyle so he can torment someone while also staying in line, Kyle needs Cartman so he can exercise his twisted martyr complex on someone.

29 - do you think that canonically, cartman really IS in love w/ kyle, as speculated?

Uhh... define love.

I don't think he wants to cuddle with Kyle on the couch, eating chocolates and smooching under the sunset, but I do think he has some kinda fucked up longing for him. Like a sort of 'he's mine' mentality that he subconsciously (or consciously) projects both onto him and the people around him so they know to fuck off. That projection is also probably why Kyle's the only kid to have never had a real girlfriend agdjhsjs

Idk how to explain it for sure but... yeah.

I definitely think there's something there, but I don't think I'd call it love.

30 - does kyle really care for cartman, or is he just doing “the right thing”, any time he helps/rescues him?

OH BOY.... CONTROVERSY IN AN ALREADY CONTROVERSIAL SIDE OF THE FANDOM....... HNNNGH.....

Okay, so... I'll try to split this out as evenly as I can.

On one hand you've got Kyle The Martyr. Kyle The Brave. Kyle The Only One Willing To Tempt Fate And Stand Up Against Eric Cartman.

And look, Kyle is a good kid, and he is trying to do the right thing-- but I don't think it's just for the sake of doing the right thing. He wants to be held on a pedestal or some shit because of it. He feels guilty over things because he knows he's supposed to, and then he tries to make amends until a better option comes along.

Like in that one episode about TPing someone's house that I don't really remember that well whoops-- Kyle was all "oh no We Must Confess!" up until he found out someone else had taken the blame. And then at the end, instead of just having his conscience cleared by confessing like he claims he wanted all along, he actually rants at Cartman for stealing his spotlight.

Like wow. Real nice morality checks you've got there, kiddo.

You sure confessing was the only thing on your mind??

Anyway what I'm tryna get at with all this is that we could just as easily apply all this to Cartman and say that Kyle hangs around/helps/stops him just so he can get a little kick to his morality's ego. Make him out to be the Good Guy, someone to be congratulated.

Or... we could take the other route, and say he actually cares about Cartman and that's why he hangs around/helps/stops him. Which I can believe, to an extent.

But honestly in the end I think it's somewhere in the middle. Because Kyle needs some way to let himself be hailed as a martyr, and when that way is another person, well-- you kind of end up growing at least somewhat fond of them, no?

31 - how do you think, in canon, kyle and cartman REALLY feel about each other?

Ack, at this point I just feel like I'm repeating myself but: Toxic symbiotic relationship.

"I torment you because it's fun and you give the best reactions while also letting you keep me in line" vs "I keep you in line and stand your tormenting because that makes me a good guy and I really wanna be the good guy."

They're such fucked up little shits, and I hate them so much sgdjsghs

[postmodernmulticoloredcloak]

I'm really curious about what thoughts you've been having regarding fandom dynamics, but if you don't feel like talking about that rn that's cool, too :)

Well it’s more like that it’s a very complex topic and I am a very small potato and I tend to write things out if I can explain my thoughts in full and clearly and nicely. Also I don’t have much first-hand knowledge of fandom culture and dynamics, most of what I know comes to me through reflections and refractions so to speak, so I’m afraid that I won’t be able to make the topic justice or really manage to express my thoughts clearly and correctly.

Basically, I have read a post about shipping culture especially in regards to what has going on with the Sherlock fandom, which I am not a part of - I have watched the show, I follow some people who post some Sherlock, and I am generally aware of things, but I can’t call myself an expert of the dynamics of the Johnlock fandom. I know that some not very healthy things, to put it mildly, went down there, and I’m not going to say that everything is kittens and roses but I can’t really make statements because as I said I am not fully knowledgeable about the topic.

That said, I think that there is a discourse going on about... shipper entitlement, we could say? I guess that in recent times the relationship between fans and creators have changed, and fans have more chances to interact with (and impact on?) creators. And I guess that among fans there has been a phenomenon of “losing track” of the distance between fandom and the so called Powers That Be, you know? And some Bad Things(TM) have been happening, especially in regards to some fans undoubtedly feeling entitled to the producers, writers, actors choices/opinions/private lives, in various ways.

Now I think there is a discussion about (against?) this kind of “entitlement” from the fans, but I am wary of it. Like - shippers have lost the sense of what “shipping” is! It should be fun and separated from the canon/creators!

I understand the “shipping should not be about stomping your feet until the ship becomes canon” sentiment, or the “shipping should not be about fighting with shippers of other ships” sentiment too. Of course.

But am I the only one that feels that the “protection” of fandom from “entitled shippers” risks to be a form of policing against queer fans’ desire for representation, among other things?

And first of all, this kind of discussion seems to treat every kind of creators as the same. But there is a difference between, let’s say, Moffat and Dabb. Or, let’s say, BBC and a conservative-led American Hollywood franchise. How is it possible to make general statements of what is the correct/appropriate/respectful/etc approach to “TPTB” when every franchise, network, producer, writer, actor etc has their own way to approach the fans, the issues fans are sensitive to, LGBT issues, etc? I think it’s wrong (and inappropriate and disrespectful, and, well... silly) to assume that every creator is the same, some kind of entity that fluctuates above the entertainment media industry.

Second, are we sure that it is a good thing that “shipping” gets confined away from the territory in which fans meet creators? Or is it a way to tell people who “ship” same-gender couples, that’s not canon, it’ll never be*, so stay in your lane? Don’t we just end up in a situation where creators are allowed to queerbait and then it’s the fans’ fault if they’re upset because the creators never said they meant for them to be a couple! Despite them writing a story that was blatantly queercoded, in a way that queer fans have learned to decode for decades of queercoding in visual media production?

*I get the difference between “you can’t be entitled to have your ship become canon just because you like it” (which is totally right) and “shut up you delusional, that’s not what the story is about stop pestering the creators to make the story about it”. Which is usually directed to people who ship couples whose relationship is heavily framed as couple-y anyway. And composed of people of the same gender, which makes me think the problem is not fan-creator dynamics, or whatever, but a way simpler queerphobia.

I am not saying “shippers” are all queer fans that long for representation. There are frankly disgusting things in shipping fandoms and I (a queer person, not straight, not cis, definitely not the kind of “straight girl who fetishizes queer men” fan) will never pretend they’re not there. There are a lot of cases of violation of of boundaries. Yes, fan entitlement is a problem. There are a lot of problems and we can see them from our little corner of the fandom.

But I am wary of a discourse about shipper entitlement.

Just to mention one case I am vaguely more knowledgeable about - I have seen shippers of Steve Rogers ships other than Stucky complain about the fact that the hashtag #GiveCaptainAmericaABoyfriend was dominated by Stucky shippers. I may be biased but how can you call that “entitlement” when the franchise purposely wrote a love story there and then spat in people’s faces? Can you say that every ship is equal when one ship was queerbaited and then brutally denied (let’s not talk about how)? Can you say that Stucky shippers are “entitled”? To what, not being mocked? I wouldn’t call that entitlement.

I hope I have made sense. Feel free to tell me your thoughts!