#yeah guys this is about B*lly

[withacapitalp]

How come "books are books, shows are shows, do whatever you want w characters" doesn't apply to B*lly? Not trying to start drama, just genuinely want to understand. Is it because he's a bad guy I can't reshape him into something I'd like and ignore what's "canon?"

Oh boy Nonnie okay I'll try to be really clear but it probably won't come out super legible. I'm putting it under a read more because I don't wanna clog up my dash w a long explanation (which knowing me it's going to end up being) I also want to say that all of this is MY opinion. I'm no one's ultimate judge, I'm just a guy on the internet who writes stories.

All that to say, this is why I think that fundamentally the idea that Eddie's sexuality and Billy's racism can be manipulated in fandom on the same level is really flawed.

Overall I think that the point of fan fiction is personal enjoyment. Ultimately you're creating something with yourself as the audience in mind. If not, then I don't really get it. So, for you, maybe it can mean that. Do I personally agree? No, but I can't stop anyone from creating something and putting it online. That's the whole point of ao3, no bars, no barriers. When you start putting that kind of wall in place, a slippery slope starts to form, so even if I would never personally partake in some forms of fanfic, I get why it's important to have a place where any kind of fic can exist. Back button exists for a reason, block button exists for a reason, curate your own online experience.

I'm not gonna be the person who says like if you like Billy you're a garbage person, because like that just isn't true? The two aren't automatically associated. Do I think that people who want to erase that part of Billy should maybe examine that urge? Yeah, but I think we all need to look inside and see where systematic racism might make us think things are more acceptable than they should be. I also can't understand people who want to give Vecna a redemption arc, or the people who think Sn*pe was just misunderstood. Regardless, we're all works in progress, and 90% of people to me are capable of learning more and growing and seeing where they might be working with a bias. I know I definitely have my own too.

I personally just will not give him redemption of any form or reshape him, because to do so seems to be disrespectful from my point of view to real life people. I'm not a person of color, Billy's racism is at the forefront of his character, so for me to reshape that and erase it in a fanfic feels like I would be ignoring a serious thing and pretending like that never happened, when it exists in our society in a major way. There isn't a point where Billy's racism ever gets resolved. In fact, the whole thing gets dropped completely in s3 which seems like a really terrible oversight by the Duffers. It's used as a plot point when it was convenient, which is messy and wrong.

But All of that is just background to your real question here which I believe is this-

Why is it okay to change a character's sexuality, but not their bigotry?

For me, I don't really like to equate the two? I think that the idea that someone's sexuality is a 'flaw' that needs to be reshaped is kinda problematic, and we also don't actually know Eddie's sexuality. Everyone can say what they think till the cows come home, but at no point did we get 'Eddie is confirmed gay, straight, bi, etc. etc.' EVERY single interpretation of Eddie's sexuality is someone shaping canon as they see fit right now.

With Billy he is confirmed racist. He is 100% undoubtedly a racist. Not even someone who used to be racist who learned and repented. He was always racist and tried to commit a hate crime against Lucas (I would argue that he did, because holding a twelve year old up against a wall and threatening to kill them because they're black and they dared to want to get to know your sister feels like a hate crime to me) The only reason he didn't seriously hurt Lucas was the fact that Steve stepped in. That's it. He was going to assault a child for his race.

To compare ignoring that to playing with a character's sexuality feels....mm I just strongly don't agree. I don't exactly have words to explain, but I really don't.

I think there are things you can change about characters easily. You can change their sexualities, their ages, their genders, their backstories, but to fundamentally erase something like that just doesn't line up for me.

No call out here Nonnie, I appreciate that you wanted to ask and be open, but this is my question for people who want to change Billy that way- What is it about Billy that is so compelling that it feels necessary to change that part of him? Why is Billy the character you *need* to write for?

Jonathan is a fantastic big brother who has a ton of issues and was abused by his father. If you're having the hankering to try and examine a flawed big brother, he's right there.

Eddie is an outcast (and strongly implied that he comes from an abusive home) and if you're looking to try and write about that, he's right there.

Steve is the character that has actually GONE through the redemption people always try to give Billy. He said slurs and did bad things, and almost immediately went to make amends for them when he was able to acknowledge he did the wrong thing.

Billy never even apologized. He hadn't changed by the time he died, and no I don't think sacrificing himself was some major change. I think that a villain can be tragic without needing to retroactively make them a better person. Billy is a flawed and broken person. Yes that probably relates mostly to the way he was raised and the fact that his family was violent, but that doesn't excuse it. The Byers have an abusive home, and at no point does Jonathan act the way Billy does. I think they're really good foils to each other on what can happen with a big brother.

Anyways this was a really really long answer nonnie, but I hope I got it across why I really disagree with that stance. If anyone was offended or upset, know that wasn't my intenion, and feel free to let me know.

[sheryl-lee]

I say this as kindly as I can. Sterek in crack would be whatever. But it fell into the type of mlm ship that cis girls obsess over and they blow it up to be bigger than it really ever is. Other examples sherlock/Watson, dean/that Angel guy, Steve/Eddie, and so many more. I’ve been on this site for so long.

so true!!!! it honestly annoys me so much, especially when people who ship crackships belittle the canon ships and harass people who ship canon ships when like... they're canon???? and the crackship will never be canon??? and idk what did they expected??? when that's quite literally what a CRACKship is???? dfjjvdfkjvdf

and you're so right, there's definitely a pattern of cishet yt women obsessing over two (canonically straight) men who've said barely two words to each other. and that's fine in isolation!!! ship what you want of course. but when you go to the extreme where you're shipping something pedophilic and/or you're deluding yourself into believing that you're being "queerbaited" and it's all some massive conspiracy that it isn't... that's when it's time to put the phone down and go for a walk or do yoga and reconnect with nature or whatever.

[downforthegas]

The late night hor//niness struck me again and I was given this idea out of no where:

The Welc//ome Ho//me cast of characters except they’re all farting on you

Ok byyYYYEE-

Yooooo you know what? This post gives me the perfect opportunity to reveal my fart headcanons of the characters: how they fart and their attitudes towards it (and how they would feel farting on you) (long post)

Number 1 is Wa//lly Dar//ling🍎

This little guy doesn't fart around anyone unless he's really close to them, like Ba//rn//any or Ho//me. He likes to be a gentleman about it and maybe sneak off to a quiet place to toot if he's around other company. But more often than not, Wa//lly let's it slip accidently. He's such a little guy, if he has too much gas, he can't possibly hold it in for so long, which in itself is kind of embarrassing. And what do his farts sound like, you might ask? There's no sound! Just a gentle breeze *Fffffffffffffsssssss...* that smells vaguely of rotten apples. You almost wouldn't know he farted, only his blushing face giving him away. Sometimes he'll let out a particularly smelly one that makes a noise. A tiny noise like *Blrt.* or *Prt.* That'll make you go "aww." If he was asked to fart on you, he'd be a little confused. He's been taught that farts are rude but knowing that you find them delightful makes him feel good about it. But he's more comfortable doing lap farts. Face farts (especially bare butt face farts) get him so flustered.

Number 2: Ba//rn//aby B. Be//ag//le🐶

You wanna talk CONFIDENCE? Cause that's our be//ag//le! Man will fart anywhere, but will make sure his little buddy doesn't get caught in the wind storm. He does think it's funny to fart on Fra//nk though. Sometimes he'll use his farts in his gags or jokes, like farting into his microphone (and potentially blowing out the speakers), or saying things like, "That sure was a gas!" right before ripping a loud one. He would do the fart in a jar gag, but his farts are so powerful, he just breaks the glass. Yeah, his farts are loud, and burn your nose with their potent stink (as dog farts do) and given his size, they sound a lot like *BBBRRRRRPPPBBBRRRRRRRTTTT!* You'd be lucky to not pass out. Or at least get into a coughing fit. If you wanted Ba//rn//aby to fart on you, for one, you'll be buried under a huge, furry dog butt that stinks, but you'll be hit with enough gale force winds that'll knock you unconscious on the first fart. Still, he'll do it anyway. He's not one to yuck anyone's yum.

Number 3: Fra//nk Fra//nkl//y🦋

Just the OPPOSITE of Ba//rn//aby's attitude. Knowing him, he'd be WAY TOO embarrassed about farting, way more than Wa//lly. I imagine he's not a very gassy person, but whenever he gets gas, he'd try his hardest to hold it in until he's home. Or at least sneak off to a private spot. Because of this, he ends up getting bloated, his stomach distending enough to stretch the buttons on his vest. Ed//die has to be the one to rub the farts out of him, since Ed//die's the only one he's comfortable farting around. But he does get embarrassed when he needs help. But Ed//die doesn't mind. His gas usually gets held in a lot, so it's usually very long, like *Fffppplbbblllrrrrrt!* sounding a little wet and a little airy. Sometimes he'll try to *ahem* spread his cheeks to fart quieter, but sometimes that only makes it come out more wet sounding. If you wanted him to fart on you, it's gonna require a lot of convincing. But if he knows this is your thing, he'll happily do it, but only if you don't talk about it afterwards (unless you want to fluster him).

Number 4: Ed//die De//ar💌

Such a clumsy, scatterbrained mailman, I can't imagine it's easy for him to hold in his farts. Anytime he needs to, it just happens no matter what, and leaves his face burning with shame (but Fra//nk thinks it's kind of cute). He'll be holding a huge stack of packages and a huge fart, and trust me, neither of those are gonna be held for long despite his efforts (poor guy). They're not much, just little *BRRRRT!* or *FLRRRRRBBBBTTT!* mainly from his jeans. They do stink pretty bad though. But it's ok cause he's shame free about it around Fra//nk. If you wanted him to fart on you, he'd be a little awkward about it at first, but he'd still comply. He'd be more comfy lying on his stomach with your face in his butt, since he'd be scared of crushing you.

Number 5: Pop//py Par//tri//dge🦚

Ooh, the resident worrywart. She's the kind to think she's got something deeply wrong with her when her stomach hurts, only to be relieved (in both ways) if it's just gas. Like Wa//lly's, they're quiet and airy, but have a slight sound and only last one to two seconds, like *Ffft.* and *Ppprrt.* and they gently blow the strings on her apron. They also smell a lot like bird seed, since that's what she mostly eats. She'll also often wave her wing behind her after each one, despite how little they stink. She's very close to Sa//lly and Fra//nk, but its still hard to get comfortable farting around them. When asked to fart on you, she'll need heavy convincing just like Fra//nk, but when she's comfortable enough, she'll be gentle with you. She's a big bird after all.

Number 6: How//dy Pi//ll//ar🐛

Oh jeez, it's almost like we're talking about Ba//rn//aby again, except it's not as bad (but they're still pretty bad, trust me). I feel like it's implied he's vegan (he's a caterpillar so...) so I imagine he mainly has veggie fueled farts. They're not as potent as Ba//rn//aby's but they're still very stinky and powerful, and blow his apron strings so hard, they twist together, something like *BRRRRRPPPPPPRRRTT!* He's only really comfortable farting around Ba//rn//aby (who I imagine have fart contests together). He tries to keep his farts from slipping so as to not scare off his customers, but it's hard when all you eat is leaves. But it's mainly to keep the customers around. If he wasn't in his store, he'd be a little more comfortable farting in public. When asked to fart on you, How//dy would totally go for it, even if he does think it's a little weird. He'll even make a deal with you that if you can sit through his smelly farts while standing the weight of his body, you get a 50% off discount at his bodega.

Number 7: Ju//lie Joy//ful🌺

Being a rainbow monster, I feel like she actually has lovely scented, fragrant farts. Like the smell of strawberries or lovely flowers. It just seems like something a rainbow monster would do, but I like to think certain foods (maybe eggs or dairy) can turn her farts rotten. Her fragrant farts can be used to set a pleasant aroma in the air if there's no incense to use, and if she farts on a wilted plant, it'll be revived. Because of this, she's 100% confident farting in public, it doesn't matter who it is she's around. Sometimes her farts flutter her dress, being a little forceful and not as gentle as you may think. Farts typically sound like *Ffrrrrrraaaapppp!* a little wet, a little loud, and mainly high pitched (sometimes they hurt Ba//rn's ears). If you want her to fart on you, it won't be much trouble. She's totally down to endow you with her flowery scent and leave you feeling fresh.

Finally number 8: Sa//lly Star//let☀️

Let's end this long post with a bang. Sa//lly's a star, stars are made of gases, stars are also hot, therefore, Sa//lly has some loud, hot bubblers, like *SPPLLLRRRRBBBBBRRRRTTTSH!* and she has them a lot. But you'd never notice cause she's an expert in hiding her farts. No one's ever heard her fart (except maybe Pop//py), and if anyone heard it, they would never think it would come from Sa//lly. And when I say hot, anything she sits and farts on is left feeling hot to the touch. It's pretty embarrassing for her, even in private, considering the star she is, and believes she is. She also gets some pretty bad stomach aches from holding it a lot, but she won't dare go to anyone to relieve the pain. She'd much rather do it herself, even if it takes a while. Her farts are also full of helium so she's able to inflate balloons with her farts. And if you do want her to fart on you, you better be ready to be yelled at for even requesting something so disgusting. You'd have to either piss her off enough to warrant such punishments, or hide in her dressing room and wait for her to blow off some hot steam. Just be prepared for the room to get hot and stinky, and for your voice to get higher in pitch

~

Ahh, to be with a gassy puppet! Sorry this post was so long, but your message made me so excited, so I just had to get these headcanons out. I might release more headcanons soon, but they'll be more situational based and not general like this one. Anyway, thanks for the post! Currently thinking about the neighbors all farting around me in a circle, all the different smells and sounds ringing out... it's nice hehe

[findafight]

WIP Wednesday Game

@eriquin I'll be doing this thursday and the weekend too (i'm posting this late as i JUST saw the notification) so even if you think it's late send an ask! make me write!

Rules:

In a reblog of this post (so people can find you in the notes) or new thread (w/ rules attached) if you want to play on your own, post up to five (5) filenames of your WIPs; not titles, file names.

Post a snippet from one of them. Snippet must be words you wrote in the last 7 days. We’re posting progress here. If you haven’t made any, go make some and come back to play!

After you’ve posted, people can send you an ask with one of your file names. You must then write 3 sentences in that file. If the filename is one you can't share from (for example, an event or gift fic), write 3 sentences on it anyway, and then 3 more on another to share.

That’s it! You can invite others to join in, or just post. I’ll be searching the reblogs to find people to send asks to!

If you’re reading this, you’re invited!

If you see someone posting a WIP Wednesday Game snippet, send them an ask! Make them write.

File names and snippet under the cut!

Chapters 11-20 (RaSEPSM)

fail b!lly/eddie to soft steddie

starbara s1

the party discuss the camera incident

joyce doesn't like steve au

Snippet from fail b!lly/eddie to soft steddie (this stupid fic has become way longer than i thought it would and i want it FINISHED.)

“What, no, you’re the only other person I’ve met willing to, like, acknowledge it.”

Steve looked confused. “What about the— your him.” he made an effort to drop his voice even lower than it was.

Eddie Snorted. “What part of I have shit taste did you not get?”

Steve winced. “So he, like. Kissed you and stuff? But then, what? Said “Just kidding!” like that makes it not count?”

He groaned. This was embarrassing, and Eddie never thought he would be admitting to it to Steve Harrington of all people. “More like…” he sighed, and stared up at the stars. “More like he would call me names after kissing me, like it was all my idea or he had caught me doing something, instead of him being the guy that pushed me against a tree and shoved his tongue in my mouth.”

“Ew.”

“Yeah. He fucking sucked, dude. Not even the fun way.”

tags: (i have forgotten everyone i know on this website oops)

@momotonescreaming @withacapitalp @thestobingirlie

[thestobingirlie]

it's really frustrating how common it is for fics to include steve having been attracted to b*lly as if it's a given when (imo) it's v obvious that any attraction there was one-sided. like b*lly was p obsessed w steve (and that one showers scene is certainly something🙃) but steve always just looks irritated by b*lly or baffled by how much of a dick he is (thinking specifically of that scene where he offers steve a hand up on the court and steve has such a 'wtf' look on his face lol). like we've seen how steve acts around ppl he's into so i don't understand how his constant irritation at even being around b*lly plus his monotone, bitchy comments (like that time he asked b*lly if he was dropped on his head as a child) reads as anything other than steve disliking b*lly. also i wanted to clarify i'm not talking about h*rringrove shippers w this - this pops up constantly untagged in any fic where steve is queer/bi/etc from ppl who (from what i can tell) do not actively ship them. also also all of this analysis is restricted specifically to pre-b*lly's racist ass trying to attack lucas bc anyone that genuinely thinks steve could have been attracted to b*lly after that does not even remotely understand steve's character imo. maybe this is just the natural result of h*rringrove being the predominant steve ship for so long but if all you want is a cheap joke about steve having bad taste in men just say he had a crush on tommy, it would make more sense. this becomes doubly annoying when ppl contrast this w nancy as an example of his good taste in women when we all know how she ended up treating him. i've also seen ppl do this w steve being into jonathan w no effort at setting up them actually interacting substantially which similarly makes no sense to me but it annoys me less bc i like stonathan.

i can definitely see the argument for billy having some sort of feelings for steve, because he is fucking weird around him and oddly obsessed.

but yeah, i don’t see in canon any evidence for steve reciprocating, he kind of always looks like his goal is to be anywhere else.

and it’s weird to just use it as some kind of evidence that steve’s been attracted to boys before, it’d probably be easier to just make some guy up. but like, even if steve thought billy was hot, i think that feeling went away after he beat him unconscious.

i love stonathan, but they definitely require more set up than most people feel like putting the effort in for.

i feel like so many steddie ‘tropes’ are just ways of making fun of steve for no fucking reason. like, they make up a list of men that steve was attracted to, solely so they can mock that taste in men. it just doesn’t make sense.

[coruscant-cosmonaut]

If I'm honest, I find it disappointing that B*lly has become the poster boy for the Stranger Things fandom lacking empathy for characters handling trauma poorly. Because there is an issue with it, but...uh...he is the worst example of it? Like ever? Like, by season:

Even in season 1, we have Lucas clearly struggling with the stress of Will going missing. He wants to find his friend, he feels like he's being manipulated and his friends care more about a stranger than Will. In my mind it's like, of course he'd be upset! But there are people to this day who still hate him for being rude to El.

Season 2 is just the spawn point thousands of traumas.

Nancy lashes out at Steve because she's traumatized by Barb's loss and everyone, including him, is ignoring that. The fandom calls her a bitch - hell, I even saw a post saying she abused him!

Mike is traumatized by watching El - in his mind - literally being vaporized and dying inches from his face. Probably also, I don't know, from nearly dying when he threw himself off a cliff. Yet there was so little sympathy from fans when he didn't want Max in the party (which is entirely reasonable, by the way! He was rude about it, but Dustin and Lucas were entirely unfair for only half letting Max in, knowing it put her in danger.) People who do give him slack don't at all acknowledge his suffering - even wanting him to go back to this era.

Max herself! She'd just been hauled across the country, isolated to her abusive family. And I still saw a lack of sympathy.

In season 3 and 4 Mike is massively struggling. He's an insecure teen in his first relationship. He's not even a year out from believing he watched El die. And you don't expect him to be a little concerned when people are asking her to use her powers willy nilly again? To worry she won't need him in season 4? For fucks sake! People have that worry in normal, non-super power relationships.

Let's not even get into Will. People seem to be of two mind with him. The truth is, he was immensely self-centered and selfish in season 3 and 4. I sympathize with his struggle, but it was rude to constantly nag Lucas and Mike when they were clearly upset and entitled to expect Mike to do all of the work to connect with him after the move.

But he's not the goddamn devil! He's a traumatized kid trying to get back to normal. Yet people seem to act like admitting his behavior was bad is the same as calling him evil - either refusing to admit it and boiling him down to a poor innocent baby or treating him like the single worst person in existence.

And finally, Lucas. Again. If anyone tells me he "abandoned his friends" I will bite them. Or at least block them. He didn't want to be bullied and he finally found a way to not be! More over, Lucas actually seem to enjoy basketball. Imagine watching him find a new hobby and explore it, his friends shoot it down and even mock him for it, and then decide "yeah, Lucas is the bad guy." Good lord.

And I'm sure people could find more. But yes, the person that really needs to be defended is the racist abuser. The one the creators have gone out of their way to say is a racist abuser. I could turn this into a whole rant about how protagonists are held to impossibly high standards, especially compared to antagonists, but that's another post.

[brekker-by-brekkerr]

Hi! I was looking through tumblr’s “best of” 2022 and couldn’t believe that Stancy apparently didn’t make the ship list? And I guess Nancy didn’t make the characters list, either. I mean, how can people have talked more about J*ncy? I know that for some weird reason locals were obsessed with them in s1 but wow, it blows my minds that after all the pathetic mess their ship has gone through they’re still that delusional about it? I don’t want to be mean but also it’s just so sad that Steve is there with people shipping him with someone like B*lly… I just think Stancy deserved to be there and to be more acknowledged since, you know, unlike most ships on that list they are canon. We need to talk more about Stancy and what will happen to tumblr antis in s5 when they’re endgame? What then?? I hope I’m there to see it, that’s for sure!🥹 Love your blog & wise opinions btw 🤍

Hi!! Thank you for this ask because I didn't even realise the lists had come out yet. Wow. I'm blown. How are H*rringrove and j*ncy on the list but not Stancy? Two objectively messed up ships (especially h*rringrove. like j*ncy is more subtly wack but H*rrngrove is just straight up messed up) made it over a ship with two people who care about each other and want the best for each other and support each other. like, the ship where a guy non-consensually took pictures of a girl naked and had them developed at a school where others could see, and the ship where a racist guy who abused his little sister almost beat a guy to death, make the list, but not the cute little second chance romance?? Again, why are people so offended by Stancy???

Also on the note of Steve, yeah, it's so sad that he was on the list of most popular tags and he's so well-loved yet people would want him with someone so toxic. It's like, do you really love him at that point? Idk about that.

Also, Nancy not making the character list is disappointing because this is the first year people have started to really like her and talk about her but it's not super surprising because so many people are misogynistic about her. It's disappointing but not unexpected unfortunately :(

I feel like the list can't be real because there were Stranger Things ships on there that I haven't seen talked about as much and others I'm surprised I didn't see. Like how was jargyle on there but not stancy?? (no hate to jargyle i think it works I just never see people post about them)

You're so right, anon. Stancy deserved to be on that list. "We need to talk more about Stancy and what will happen to tumblr antis in s5 when they’re endgame?" I'm with you bestie let's make this happen. Let's put Stancy on the 2023 list. And then we can all scream and cry and dance around together when they become canon.

And thank you so much!! You're so sweet!! Whoever you are ily💛

[pynkhues]

Hi! I’m just curious what you don’t like about B*lly H*rgrove and H*rringrove? I definitely u sweat and any ship is not everybody’s cup of tea but I find the character really fascinating almost as a character study type thing, haha! I also really love hearing peoples opinions on him and why bc most people feel so strongly either way!

Promise I’m not starting drama with you! I like to hear everyone’s reasons either way and your opinions are always so well thought out! Thanks! 🤍

Hey! Ah, you're sweet, anon, haha, honestly, my answer's not really that complicated. I'm just tired of being told that I need to empathise with abusive men, and I'm tired of the sexualisation and fetishisation of them too, both in narratives themselves and by fandom.

Billy was a racist misogynist and a violent man, and while I am interested in stories about cycles of violence, I don't think that's a theme Stranger Things has the nuance as a show to explore in any sort of meaningful way. His arc as a result was one I found personally to be cloying, derivative, and a part of a larger tendency in storytelling that tells us men deserve sympathy and understanding before accountability, and as someone currently embroiled in the fallout of what that looks like irl, it chafes to say the least.

And the ship itself - - look, it's not for me, and I personally feel like the fandom only paired them together for the same reason they paired Steve and Eddie. They're a couple of pretty, white guys who were in each other's proximity for a minute. It's cool if you're into them, just there was nothing there to me that was particularly compelling or inviting of a deeper intimacy. I will say it's been a while since I've seen those seasons of the show though, so who knows, maybe I've missed something! But yeah. Not for me.

[two-sides-samecoin]

No I don't get Stonathan at all, especially after season two. Same with St/ncy after s2, Jonathan slept with Nancy knowing she was with Steve. He betrayed him as well, idc if they didn't like each other you don't sleep with someone who is taken. Plus he still thinks of Steve very low, aka the s4 comment. It indicates to me that both him and Nancy would make fun of Steve, given he said it so unprompted, like the conversation wasn't even about Steve and yet he had to make fun of his intelligence or capability. He seemed also genuinely shocked Nancy defending Steve, like it's ooc for her to do which just further confirms my suspicion that they both bitched about Steve negatively. They should be glad Steve was being so supportive about Jancy, also they should be a little ashamed of hiding the truth from him about how the relationship started. Steve saved his ass twice, Jonathan has seen him change and yet. I just want Steve find someone who loves him for him. No proving to his partner he has changed or having to constantly beg for forgiveness. Plus if he finds out Jonathan slept with Nancy's at Murray's place, he will be super upset, hopefully he will find out because he deserves the closure.

Also even in s1, Jonathan violated Steve's privacy, he was being a creepy stalker and he hasn't apologized to Steve at all.

It's also concerning the amount of people who ship Stonathan because the alley fight looked so homoerotic. Why start a ship based on violence? Same with H//rringrove (🤢) you see B//lly almost killing Steve and still think yeah that's hot and romantic? Or Eddie holding a broken bottle to Steve's neck, being used as this ultra hot scene. Not when Steve was literally tortured 8months prior. Almost every popular Steve ship has always this element of violence, where Steve gets the short end of the stick by being overpowered.

I ship Steve with him getting the hell out of Hawkins with Robin, starting somewhere knew where people see the good in him and he doesn't have to prove himself to them constantly. He deserves better than what's given in the show.

LITERALLY ALL OF THIS!! like you said especially after season 2 like jonathan willingly knew that steve and nancy were together or knew that they were going through a rough patch and still decided that he was going to pursue nancy. they just discussed steve and the whole stancy thing with murray and jonathan is the one to bring him up! ngl that’s comment in season 4 still bothers me like we did not need that comment at all - it’s just setting up another character to be like ‘ohh steve’s actually a good guy’ as if the audience needs to be constantly reminded that steve changed! like i don’t give a fuck about how he was in season 1 at this point - i care how steve is now. and i’m genuinely concerned that the comment is just going to lead into an awful plot line with them because genuinely they do not need to be friends at this point. they have not talked since season 2 and things were already awkward between them - i just think it’s fandom’s thing where they want everyone to be close friends with the monster hunters in st but they do not need to always be besties or even friends! like the dynamics get so boring if you just want everyone to get along - where the spice?

honestly it so indicates that to me too especially cuz you brought up about him being surprised about nancy’s comment. like why would he be surprised unless they’ve talked about steve before in a negative way and now nancy is giving him one compliment (which really isn’t even a compliment at all - genuinely annoyed that fandom and canon always sees steve growing up as a good thing when no it’s legit now because it’s traumatized. like maybe in season 1 it was good growth but now it genuinely seems to me like it’s coming from a place of trauma with steve that he’s growing up) sorry that for ranty lol. legit they both should be glad that steve is supportive bht honestly canon shows that they don’t give a fuck about steve which is why i also don’t see the stonathan angle at all - anyway yeah like that convo was never about steve so like whyd he get brought up? god i want steve to find out so badly about what happened at murray’s place because i just want steve to be angry again like he doesn’t deserve this and instead i just want the narrative to let him show his anger again but i just know the duffers will not do this so rip.

so annoyed that jonathan doesn’t apologize to steve either! oh god yeah - it’s also so ironic to me how people who saw the alleyway ship them because they will also acknowledge how steve was awful to jonathan in that scene and that steve deserved the punch. like girl if that’s how you see the scene then why the actual hell do you ship it? honestly steve’s ships in canon are just violence against steve and i think that you can tell who just doesn’t give a flying fuck about steve with his ships. especially cuz they want his ‘ i awakenjng’ to be rooted in violence against steve like please stop! and the thing that bugs me even more is that they see it in a happy way too. it’s sooo ironic and funny how steve antis are always like ‘well you treat him like he’s a child and a wet blanket’ to steve fans when they’re the ones who are also falling into doing this like girl you actively want him to be a wet blanket in a violent ship/ship that has roots with violence.

LITERALLY EVERYTHING YOU SAID IN THAT LAST PARAGRAPH! him and robin need to get the fuck out of hawkins and buy a nice house for themselves. steve legit deserves so much better than what’s been in canon.

[piastrinorris]

edancy for this ask game because its me and of course i'd ask JHBSDKNJF

wouldn't expect anything less, bby <3

when I started shipping it if I did: shortly after joining the server and seeing the eddie x nancy channel, even if i was too overwhelmed by it to ever really contribute LMAO. but yeah, i'd never really thought of it as a pairing until i started reading you guys' works.

my thoughts: i love them to bits. i've been rarepair shipping for years, but being out of fandom so long made me forget how much i loved it until edancy sucked me right back in.

what makes me happy about them: they're so opposite but so complementary? like i'm watching brooklyn nine nine rn bc the final season is finally available in the uk and they're literally just stranger things' peraltiago.

what makes me sad about them: well, eddie's dead. so there's that. but also the fact that there was prime chance for nancy, while talking to wayne, to have learned things about eddie that she could have asked him about and we could have gotten more of his backstory? AND the same thing that makes me sad about every eddie ship, for a small town that seems all up in everybody's business, i wish there'd been some kind of allusion as to how they perceived each other growing up. especially with it being canon that nancy used to play d&d with the party, surely they'd have encountered each other looking it up in middle school??

things done in fanfic that annoys me: honestly i've only ever read fics written by people who are in the server bc you guys' characterisation of them both is the only one i trust, lol.

things I look for in fanfic: again, since it's a rarepair, literally any lmao. but i do skim the fic just to make sure the characterisation of nancy is just right. there's a lot of people out there who do her dirty.

who I’d be comfortable them ending up with, if not each other: pretty much anyone with either of them, except b*lly, j*son, and i don't ship st*ncy unless platonically, either.

my happily ever after for them: again i accidentally helped make this part of road trip canon lmao, but the two of them travelling the world together, kicking ass n taking names. deciding to elope somewhere just bc they feel the moment's right.

who is the big spoon/little spoon: i don't really see them as "spooners" necessarily, i think they typically cuddle with nancy laying her head on his chest.

what is their favorite non-sexual activity: i just really, really love the idea of them essentially doing parallel play together. eddie strumming on his guitar while nancy reads. nancy plotting where she wants corroded coffin to tour next so that she can tag along while he busies himself writing his next campaign.

[aeide-thea]

defending h*rry styles is really, really not the hill i want to die on—i'm not even a fan of his!—but i gotta say, i'm really tired of the line of discourse i keep seeing that's like, 'he hasn't suffered enough to deserve credit for being gnc' or whatever the fuck, as if that were even remotely how these things work. like. there are a lot of good and important conversations to be had about the role of privilege in the kind of press he gets—maybe we could have those conversations without sounding as though we resent that he's not getting beaten up instead, as though that would somehow improve things???

[rotisseries]

b*lly stans will be like "but he had the potential to grow and become better 🥺" like that isn't actually a statement with no supporting evidence

b*lly stans will be like "but I wanted a gay abuse survivor storyline 🥺" like will isn't right there and also not racist

[jonathanssweatercollection]

stranger things s4 volume 2 thoughts. profanity warning lol

* i’m sick to fuckin death of yuri. when is he dying

* steve talking about having a big family is like. obviously fan service but i love it and also i’ll be using it for stoncy fuel bc fuck you

* i need nancy to break jason’s nose

* i also need el to brutally eviscerate brenner in ever horrific way she can manage

* argyle nolastname is my best fucking friend. like what IF nina was a small woman. let’s hear him out

* why the fuck wasn’t jonathan included in the byers-hopper sibs hug. i’m mad. i’m gonna fucking bite someone

* why the fuck are the duffers so against jonathan being hugged by his family. i’m gonna kill

* MAN I THOUGHT THEY WERE GONNA RUN BRENNER OVER. MISSED OPPORTUNITY (though at least the cunt is dead)

* robin didn’t have to go out of her way to get that fruity little beret but i’m so glad that she did

* i’ve said it before and i’ll say it again. max mayfield i would kill for you

* “take your hands off me, potatohead” okay i still want him dead but that was funny as fuck of yuri

* I THOUGHT THAT I SAW HOPPER’S ASS. POINTED AT THE SCREEN AND YELLED “BUM”

* TWAS HIS FUCKING ARMPIT

* yay hopper kiss <3 good for them :)

* robin helping nancy up the rope <33 that’s so cute

* omg omg theyre playing the score from previous seasons

* god i feel so fucking unwell. i’m so anxious and jittery what the fuck

* EL’S LITTLE DRAWING OF MAX ON THE VAN WINDOW 😭 I’M GONNA COMBUST THAT’S SO FUCKING CUTE 😭 THE LITTLE CURLS AND THE LITTLE SMILE

* argyle voice: my dude is a gender neutral term of endearment

* JONATHAN SAID MY DUDE. HE’S BRIBING PEOPLE WITH WEED. HE’S HOLDING A BLUNT IN A WAY THAT NO ONE HAS EVER SMOKED WEED HAS EVER HELD A BLUNT. THIS IS THE LOVE OF MY LIFE

* robin rly runs like a weirdo i love her

* st@ncybaitgate: *happening ig* // my mother: “don’t” // me: “don’t” // my mother: “don’t” // me: “don’t do do it” my mother: “don’t” // me: “don’t i’m begging you” like a fucking greek chorus

* ugh my family are so fucking mean about the characters’ looks. it’s even worse when theyre making fun of the kids’ appearances

* lumax are making me so emotional i’m gonna throw up

* el being a pineapple on pizza truther. makes so much sense

* her and argyle teaming up to feed mike pizza nd chanting “try before you deny” <33

* BYERS BROS BYERS BROS BYERS BROS BYERS BROS

* MY BOYS. MY BOYS ARE SO GOOD

* i love el’s socks

* oh man she’s gonna have wet jeans. has she not had a bad enough day already

* max praying for bad things to happen to b*lly and him dying. so true same bestie like me too exactly

* max and el being foils particularly in regards to the abuse theyve suffered and in turn the deaths of their abusers. so fucking true

* sadie is giving an award worthy performance to a light. she is one of the greatest young actresses of our generation i mean this wholeheartedly

* ELMAX RIGHT ELMAX RIGHTS LET’S FUCKING GO ELMAX RIGHTS HELL YEAH

* omg are we finally gonna learn why max had to move to hawkins. pls i wanna know

* FUCKING HELL THAT PIECE OF SHIT IN JASON’S GANG FUCKING TACKLED ERICA. THAT’S AN ELEVEN YEAR OLD YOU CUNT. SHE BETTER SUE HIS ASS

* omg the snowball my beloved <3

* i can’t tell if theyre doing an aliens homage. if so fuck yea

* steve’s little dancing jumps 🥹 hopscotch king

* ROBIN HOLDING NANCY’S HAND BC SHE’S NERVOUS AWW

* “a memory inside a memory” my guy argyle is gonna fucking love inception

* “i’m not having another funeral” yes this is a kinda funny line on surface level but also my fucking god that’s such a tragic thing to say. joyce byers you deserve the world

* the hawkins group spent like at LEAST over a hundred dollars on all of their ammo and shit and dustin nd eddie are fighting for their lives with sticks, little bitch knives and bin lids

* steve handing nancy her gun. yes bitchman that is true malewife behaviour <3

* i’m surprised by the restrained amount of swearing this season. like this is all very s2 in the way that nobody has said fuck but everybody has said asshole at least thrice

* basically i want max to call vecna a cunt

* i fucking knew eddie was gonna sacrifice himself. this fucking himbo

* oh fuck the sound design is so moody and cool i love it

* SINCLAIR SIBLINGS BEATING THE SHIT OUT OF PPL IN QUICK CUTS. YES

* MAX VOICE: MY GIRLFRIEND’S BACK AND YOURE GONNA GET IN TROUBLE HEY YAAAAA HEY YAAAAAAAA MY GIRLFRIEND’S BACK

* the steve and lucas parallel of getting their heads smashed with cutlery. kings

* “I PIGGYBACKED FROM A PIZZA DOUGH FREEZER” “what” POTENTIALLY A CONTENDER FOR THE BEST EXCHANGE OF THE SEASON

* “IF YOU TOUCH HER AGAIN I WILL KILL YOU. AGAIN” EL I WILL FUCKING DIE FOR YOU SHE’S SUCH A GOOD GF

* ELMAX AS FOILS IN REGARDS TO THE ABUSIVE BROTHER FIGURES AND DESPERATELY SEARCHING FOR PROTECTION IN THE PPL THEY LOVE BUT RUNNING AWAY AND CLOSING THEMSELVES OFF BC THEYRE AFRAID OF FEELING VULNERABLE AND GETTING HURT AGAIN

* YES this mindflayer shit is lovecraftian. this greatly appeals to the horror fanatic in me

* mike’s proclamation of love literally sounds like wedding vows this is so fuckign precious i love them so much

* MAX’S ARMS

* NO NO NO NO THEURE NOT DOING THISGHEYRE NOT

* THANK FUCKING GOD MAX IS ALIVE

* murray saving hopper parallels steve saving jancy in 1x08. bc i say so

* everything is about polyamory. fuck you

* why the FUCK is there a sword. so conveniently placed next to hopper. like i know why but. i’m???

* i mean i’m not complaining bc it’s cool tbh

* YES RUNNING UP THAT HILL SYNTHWAVE STRANGER THINGS REMIX LETS GO

* nancy shooting the living fuck out of vecna is the hottest thing i’ve ever seen. i’m proposing

* the jopper hug im so fucking emotional

* omg is vecna michael myers-ing them

* “I THINK ITS MY YEAR HENDERSON. FINALLY MY YEAR. I LOVE YOU” FUCKING GOD ARE YOU KIDDING ME

* THE RETURN OF THE MOBY SONG

* MAX BETTER BE OKAY

* I’LL KILL KUSELF OLEASE FONT DONT DIE PLEASE MAC PLEASE LELADE MAX LLADEAD PLEASE MAC OLEASE PLEASE I’lL LILL MUSELF PLEASE I’M GONNA FUCKING FIR PLEASE PLEASE I’m GONNA DIE PLEASE MAX NO PLEASE PLEASE GOD FUCKING DAMN IT

* the gate opening up through jason made me fucking laugh tho

* OH FUCK THIS IS EPIC

* fucking elmax rights yet again

* BRING HER BACK BRING HER BACK OKEASE BRING HER BACK

* TWO DAYS FUCKING LATER ???????????

* omg the leaving hawkins sign my beloved

* none of the cali gang have changed their clothes in like a week. that van will reek

* “quaint town of hawkins” bitch how many murders have happened here over the past four years

* THE FUCKING LIBRARY NO. THAT’S MY HOUSE

* NANCY’S MR RABBIT. I LOVE WHEN SHE HAS STUFFED ANIMALS

* IT PARALLELS JONATHAN BEIBG FORCED TO HUNT A RABBIT WHEN HE WAS A CHILD BY HIS DAD. BC RABBITS ARE CLEARLY A SIGNIFICANT PART OF HOW THEY REMEMBER THEIR CHILDHOODS. FUCK I HAVE TO MAKE A GIFSET

* STONCY STINCY STINCY OLEAEE I STONCY STIBCY OLEASE STONCY STONCY PEASE STIVFY stONCY OLEPASE

* FUCKING YES MAX ISALIVE

* YES HE’S READING HER STEPHEN KING FUCK UEAH FUCK YEAH

* el’s little ET hoodie bless

* love all the little parallels of calling things miracles this season

* let’s give a hoot and a hurray for neurotic lesbian representation

* EDDIE’S UNCLE IS GONNA MAKE ME CRY. WHAT THE FUCK

* they need don’t mess around with jim playing the background of them cleaning up the cabin

* jonathan still looks at nancy with these shy lovestruck puppy eyes after all these years. someone kill me

* “OTHERWISE WHO WOULD BE IN CHATGE??? STEVE??” STONATHAN CRUMBS LETS GO

* okay fuck its the coca cola bottle el and max played with in s3. im sad

* max better fucking be okay. i’m so fucking worried for her even now

* JESUS GOD THE EL AND HOPPER REUNION IS MAKING ME FUCKING CRY

* “what do you think?” // “bitchin” I’M GONNA KERPLODE

* YES YES HUGS ALL AROUND FOR EVERYONE YES EVERYONE HUG

* argyle is still hunting for mushrooms while dimensions are colliding isn’t he

* can dustin please have a cane. please my poor guy just give him a cane to help him out please

* the fucking score RULES

* my mother after watching this episode “so the upside down is in the downside up”

* hell FUCKING yea siouxsie and the banshees to close up the season this rules

* seeing the monkey massacre logo always fills me with joy. god fucking bless and goodnight

[solarsleepless]

Abuse Does Not Excuse Abuse

yeah this is about b*lly har6rove

so, i saw a point recently which said that b*lly antis (like yours truly) aren't reasonable or smth like that while saying something about b*lly

that person (who is going to remain nameless) said that they had also been through abuse and honestly, i give my full sincerest apologies. that is the worst, and i feel very lucky to have parents who love and support me unconditionally. i hope that any of my followers who are in that situation the best of luck.

but abuse does not excuse abuse.

yeah, b*lly's dad is a top tier asshole, but that does not excuse:

threatening to run over three pre-teens just to scare your little sister. whether he would, or wouldn't we'll never know, but he still threatened to.

belittling and bullying (and eventually almost killing) steve for being the 'popular guy' before him.

shoving lucas against a cabinet because of the color of his skin. i kid you not, this happens. and before any b*lly apologists come over to say "oh but he was just doing that to protect her!", no he wasn't. he literally could've just grabbed her arm and left, but no. also he says earlier that there are "certain types of people you stay away from, max. and that kid is one of them." look me in the eyes and tell me thats not racist

and that's not all. billy is literally abusing max. and i'm not exaggerating, look:

Verbal abuse is a form of emotional abuse. People have suffered verbal abuse from their bosses, their loved ones, and even perfect strangers. Just because verbal abuse does not leave a physical scar does not mean that it did not deeply hurt the victim. Verbal abuse can also refer to what is not said.

Emotional abuse is a pattern of behavior in which the perpetrator insults, humiliates, and generally instills fear in an individual in order to control them. The individual's reality may become distorted as they internalize the abuse as their own failings.

you can't tell me that is not what billy is doing to max. he literally BREAKS her stuff as a 'consequence' of not listening to him. 1) with the skateboard and 2) (attempted) with lucas.

yes, he's been abused. yes, he's had a tragic life. but when you're 17-18, by then you know how the world works. you know when you do bad things and good things at that point. by then, you what is right and what is wrong. especially considering neil seems to let billy kind of do his thing.

max is breaking the cycle of abuse, and i am so proud of her. she could have chosen to hurt lucas, or be mean to him, aka continuing the cycle of abuse, but she didn't.

[hazardsoflove]

desperate to hear your list of reasons why eddie is not dying i need it i fear

oh i’m about to sound SO delusional rn it’s not even funny. no one contradict ANYTHING i say bc i need to live in this little fantasy world and this all could mean NOTHING but it means everything to me. okay here goes

i feel like joe quinn is doing WAYYY too much press n such for a character who’s just going to get killed off. like he’s doing magazine interviews n promo stuff like on netflix geeked etc etc i feel like why do all that if he’s just gonna die. like i’ve seen next to nothing w the actor who played argyle so idk. IDK idr how it was w other new characters who died like sean astin but i just feel it in my bones this means something

yeah they kill off a new character every season BUT they also KEEP a new character each season. max (and b*lly ig) in s2 and robin in s3. i just cannot see argyle mixing with the rest of the main cast or leaving ca (bc i feel like after s4 the byers are moving back) and that russian guy is for SURE not going to be seen again. and no one likes jason so like. that leaves eddie and he’s obviously the logical choice bc he fits in so well w everyone in the main cast like he’s been there the whole time

this one’s a little iffy BUT i also noticed that all the characters they introduce that they keep get like. rly involved w the upside down. like lucas brought in max in s2 and she’s still here and then in s3 robin got dragged into it w steve dustin + the rest of them bc of the russians under the mall thing and then the mind flayer and she’s still here. and then bc of what eddie saw dustin filled eddie in on the upside down and they told him everything and now he’s like. actively trying to help them defeat vecna. like bob (fly high) he was never directly involved jsut involved by proxy and never actually told Anything and then alexei in s3 also was like that he was just a scientist trying to open a gate he wasn’t Doing anything. eddie is Doing things like max and robin were

i know the entire szn is already finished filming so they can’t change anything bare on reception BUT i think they had to have known eddie was going to be the fan favorite of s4. there’s NO way he wouldn’t have been hellfire merch from like. hot topic is on back order until like fucking september/october. no one’s gonna want jason or argyle (even if i like him) or the russian guy over eddie. everyone likes him too much the audience AND the hawkins gang i feel like it would be a bad move on the writers’ part. and even a character like bob who was played by fucking sean astin i feel like wasnt This level of popular when st2 came out even tho that’s fucking sean astin. i didn’t even like bob that much until like an ep before he died i did not trust him. but look into eddie’s big brown cow eyes and tell me he should die

i know ppl think he’s gonna sacrifice himself or whatever and be the hero and not run but sorry he already did that when he dove after nancy and robin to save steve from the upside down!!! he’s IN this shit now he’s not running anymore and if the guitar solo scene is a distraction like ppl are saying that doesn’t mean anything. literally nothing. dustin’s there he’s not gonna just sit and watch eddie DIE he went up against russians with jsut a 10 year old girl a deadly weapon and a dream to save steve and robin he is not going to leave eddie to die ESPECIALLY bc he looks up to him so much and i definitely don’t believe that the rest of them would either

i would jsut be SUCHHHH a let down ending for his character if he’s just here to die. like what’s the point why introduce this complex dynamic character who fits in with EVERY ONE of the main cast that’s in hawkins rn just for him to die. literally NOOO reason to i just can’t see it happening i think that’s bad writing to waste the potential of a character w that much chemistry w everyone else. i just can’t see it happening

i just rly genuinely do not see it happening i know i am just maybe setting myself up for disappointment and wanting to kms BUT i have to move like this or else i will go out of my mind waiting for v2 i’ve gotten too attached and i’m not letting go so easily he WILL see s5 he WILL graduate

[thestobingirlie]

idk if it's gotten less rampant or if i just managed to figure out how to avoid it but that period of time where the jokes about steve getting manhandled/literally beaten up homoerotically were inescapable was absolutely insufferable. the jonathan fight is the one i understand best bc of how it was choreographed (ie steve and jonathan literally writhing around on the ground together) but when ppl try to act like it was genuinely a sexuality realization for steve i sincerely end up wondering what they were on when watching the show. like that fight is steve and jonathan both being so angry and hurt that they just completely lose it - it's not about dick. everything that comes w ppl suggesting this about any confrontation steve had w b*lly is gross for many reasons. the boathouse thing is so stupid to me - steve literally just looks uncomfortable bc eddie is holding a fucking broken bottle to his neck yet ppl act like that's some kind of realization moment for him. also there is one person on this website that insists eddie was like,,, holding steve up off the ground during that scene? for some reason that is lost to me?? and i just want to complain to someone about how absolutely idiotic that is. sorry for the rant it was inspired by me being subjected to one of those posts against my will for the first time in months.

the jonathan and steve fight is a bit weird in a gay way, because they do literally just kinda roll all over each other. but i hate when people make jokes that that was steve’s gay awakening. especially because both jonathan and steve are just lost in their anger and emotions in that scene, in no way were they thinking about sex.

(also, steve’s known he was into boys since he was like 10 and he and tommy kissed for practice)

but yeah, it’s just this really gross thing where people portray gay relationships as violent. and i think it’s really prevalent in the stranger things fandom.

and yeah, i don’t get the realisation thing in the boathouse. like… steve thought he was about to die. he wasn’t thinking that the guy with a broken bottle to his neck is hot.

(this is another issue, but this is also why i take issue with everyone deciding that steve, like, canonically likes submissing and bdsm, as if he hasn’t been fucking tortured. the man doesn’t enjoy violence in bed, please.)

eddie was not holding steve off the ground, and it’s weird to me when people, like, insist that eddie is so much stronger then steve. he just took him by surprise. and then had a glass held to his throat.

i love when people just rant into my inbox! it’s fun, and gives me an opportunity to complain lmao