#undertale made the player actually an entity in the game

[lynxgriffin]

Do you have a favorite interception of a Player that's not technically a "player". In fanworks.

What I mean is sometimes people will introduce a player as a real person, but sometimes, a writer will have them as a cosmic force or entity created by gaster. Or the soul becomes a character.

My personal favorite was one where a "Player" was sucked into the game, but it's revealed that he wasn't a real person but a artificial soul made by Gaster to mimic a player and have false memories. This was because it was somewhat meta that this au wasn't a game but written work, so gaster had to mimic the game. It's was confusing and a bit of a mess, but it was fun.

Mmmm, I don't know if I really have a favorite version of that concept? I feel like it's pretty difficult to pull off, which is why I so far default to either "the player is the reader" or "the player isn't a factor in this story." That particular concept is why Undertale and Deltarune work with games as a medium...you as an actual person are an important factor in them!

So yeah, I guess the best interpretation would just be whatever works best for the story you're trying to tell.

[lyril]

can you give me the rundown on only human i tried to read it i swear i did but the way it was written was so pretentious i couldnt

LMAOOO that's so fair, it also doesn't really state the thesis at the beginning either... i had to go into knowing what the context of the conclusion even was. and i'm a slow reader cus i like to absorb things as best i can so it literally took me like all evening to get through... off the top of my head though:

as the intro states, the common perception is of three seperate entities (you, as the player, frisk, as the human, and chara, as the narrator/a ghost, or otherwise present in some way) making up the protagonist role in undertale. in the only human theory, the reading is that you "are" chara, who is also "frisk", as a cartoonishly reanimated body as well as a new identity by the end of the game. instead of 3, it is 1 mix of entityslop, and thus "the only human".

and the document is there to go over all the important evidence for and contrary to the other interpretations, of course. its not perfect, in the sense that you essentially have to take on a brand New set of suspension of disbelief (like, the biggest hurdle i think is having to re-put on the cartoon world lens and remember how ridiculous everything else is) in place of the usual (but fairly critiqued) understanding.

i think one of the most important things it does, regardless of theory, is re-ground one's perception of what the game actually tells us without a lot of stuff that is either 1. assumed but is made up by the fandom, or is 2. leaning too heavily into subtext in favor of literal text to the point of overriding what are supposed to be moments of clarity. i know i've been on a "wait a second, this is... widely accepted fanon/speculation!" streak myself, and so the big thing it sets out to do is reset that to some degree, and then re-establish it in this lens. so, despite the "tone", i do really appreciate that, honestly

but, this is especially important to chara, who IS supposed to represent the amalgamation of "you" experiencing the game, while still playing with metanarrative, and that's very explicitly what the game tells us but is also very overlooked/ignored either in favor of truly seperating these entities or using them as a scapegoat. (one thing i never thought about is how chara only "showing" themselves at the end of no mercy despite always being present in some form is a literal manifestation of how "LOVE" is said to "distance you from yourself" and truly seperates us again)

i haven't replayed undertale in a couple years, so i'm sure when i do i'll have more questions about it too, and i'd especially like to zoom out to see the greater effect it has on our perception of undertale's narrative, since it also doesn't get into all the implications it would have AFTER we establish this (great time to think about "de-termination" for example...)

and also i'm saying this as someone who FAR prefers the idea of regular-style narrachara as a personal interpretation, where this is so perspective shifting that i... actually kind of hate what it would mean for the K/F/C trio? but, i can't deny how interesting it is to think about Because of that — it's almost just kind of fun to see it in a new light, even if i don't think if it's the One True Reading or anything. and, of course, there's a lot of merit to the actual evidence/debunks and all. ultimately, i do feel mixed on it and i'm not sure how i want to look at everything. but the fact that the reading has literally been around since the game came out but never truly picked up traction... haunting.

[cosmica-galaxy]

Im obsessed with the power dynamic between the Player and the character they control.

With the Player by the Batter's side, he's pretty much unstoppable. They upgrade him, they control his movements, solving puzzles, combat strategies, attacks, sometime answers for him, if he die they can bring him back. They made him powerful, and without them he's no longer is.

Thinking about it, if we were able to control other characters- they'd be op as well, in the way Batter is under our control.

In the last battle with Pablo, if we were to side with the cat then it seems like Batter's Add-ons aren't there. Or maybe it's still there, but inactive, as the Add-ons only answers to The Player. Despite Batter having purified nearly everyone, the guardians, the Queen, he lost... to a cat. Because we no longer size with him anymore, his power is also stripped.

If we continue siding with the Batter, then The Judge is 'purified' like everyone else

..... do you think Zacharie got small chills down his spine whenever he comprehend The Player's power?

Why am i fr glazing The Player out of everyone to you rn. Actually- forget everything I just send.

NAH GIVE ME MORE MY PRECIOUS POSSUM MOOT!!! In fact, I have the PERFECT example of when a Player pulls back their powers from their chosen vessel!

If you brush past how silly this is, you can really see how this character, that once could do nearly everything and NOT die/get hurt, is suddenly stumbling around like an idiot without the Player's input.

This is how I envision an argument a player has with their vessel. The vessel gets so cocky that they think they can do anything without the player and then the player pulls back their influence in retaliation. Making the vessel realize that without them, they are just like every other flawed being in their universe without your guidance. They are suddenly no longer the protagonist. They are just another unremarkable mortal that exists within their universe. This is more of the light-hearted side of things, mind you. Cause a malicious player can simply force their vessel into a death for disobedience. Such as making them stand still and letting the enemy kill them or allowing them to be harmed again and again until they eventually die...and the vessel can't do anything about it. The player can be as merciful or as malicious as they want to be. It's that power that separates us as "gods" from our vessels. The relationship goes both ways too and it's mutual at the core. We need a vessel to interact with their digital world and they need us to either help them stay alive or to find strength in hard times. We get to help out by using them as a vessel and the vessel gets to be the 'savior' of their world and has a much higher chance of not dying. Another thing--if the vessel dies, the player just simply rewinds time back to a safe point and they erase the failed timeline completely. Making it like it never even happened, while carrying the knowledge over from that failed timeline to make sure that the next one is the "good" timeline.

This also carries over to us resetting the timeline completely to "replay" a game again. This is evident in Undertale and it is hinted at that a being is responsible, because Flowey was able to reset the timeline...until WE showed up. I don't even mean Frisk either, as they are just our vessel and we can choose to be as evil or kind as we want. It's no surprise that Gaster is wanting to know more about this entity that can control people, manipulate time, and even find him hiding in the lost realm in between. Now endure MY rambling, moot! >: )

[weirdmarioenemies]

Happy Groundhog Day! I think it is so wonderful that there is an entire holiday dedicated to a specific burrowing rodent. Americans love this thing! And who wouldn't? Their burrows aerate soil, and provide homes for many other critters!

A lot of people wouldn't love the groundhog, actually. In 1883, the New Hampshire Legislative Woodchuck Committee put out a statement calling groundhogs "wayward sinners" whose grooming habits suggest good manners, but who in reality have "not made any material progress in social science". You think the Discourse is bad today? They used to form committees to complain about a squirrel's moral character!

However, this is not the extent of the disrespect toward groundhogs. It happens to this day, and we all take it for granted, and most don't even bother to realize it has to do with a marmot in the first place! Let's talk about...

Name: "Mole"

Debut: Whac-A-Mole

Sorry this picture is not very good. There are just not many pictures available that show that weird old "mole" figure that I have in mind specifically! Here's a green one.

Anyone familiar with the "Mole" series of animals will know that this is very much Not A Mole! The distinct head, the visible ears, the blunt nose, the buckteeth... this, my friend, is 100% Ground Squirrel! And this game is FAR from the only instance of moles and burrowing rodents being mixed up.

It actually makes sense that this mistake would happen, though! Moles are synonymous with burrowing, to the point unrelated burrowing animals are named after moles (including Mole Cricket, perhaps the ORIGINAL mole). But moles spend ALL their time burrowing, rarely if ever coming to the surface, so even though we all know moles, we are rarely blessed with SEEING moles. I have never seen a mole in person... yet! I would love to! Ground squirrels, such as groundhogs and prairie dogs, are also little burrowing critters, but these ones are commonly seen on the surface, ever alert. I think it's reasonable to mistake them for "moles"!

Alas, the popularity of Whac-A-Mole has cemented Ground Squirrel as essentially the "canon" Mole design for this context. And what a context that is! A classic, even GENRE-DEFINING game, all about whacking critters as they emerge from their burrows. So rude! They're not posing any danger, and the player isn't hunting them to eat, either. This is simply a game of spite. How DARE that rodent try to see the sun! This is just like Undertale.

Whac-A-Mole is one of the most straightforward types of game for any device with a touch screen or anything similar. Just gotta tap a thing! Very easy. This has led to such variations such as Whack-a-Monty from New Super Mario Bros., where the player bonks Monty Moles (more like Monty Gopher am I right) while sparing the many, many Luigis. Obviously, the Luigis must surface in order to initiate courtship, ensuring future generations of Luigis.

Now that I think of it, Mario is one of the only times I've seen the ethics of Whac-A-Mole called out, through the endangered Whacka from Paper Mario! I'm surprised the genre is not deconstructed more often (I love that this sentence is about Whac-A-Mole).

I think this is where I will end the post, because this silly game has so permeated human culture that I could go on and on and on! So strange that an entire animal now has a reputation of "pops out and gets bonked on the head". Conceptually, I certainly prefer the "parasitic aliens emerging from an astronaut's body orifices" aesthetic for this kind of game, but obviously kids aren't going out and bludgeoning real rodents because of this game, so whatever.

But still, what if instead of moles, the whacked entities were something humans have no problem attacking with a second thought...?

Get ready for an action-packed new game set in the Bowling universe!

[swagrum76]

Just gonna put all the facts about my mc character/oc here

Instead of blood or anything, he has something called "glitchiness", which is essentially his life force. Also, it enables him to corrupt worlds and glitch things around. It is a solid magenta color, particularly hex #FF10FF.

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If he dies, his colors fade and a frown appears on his face. This is because the glitchiness fades away from him if he dies. His glitchiness can also leak out of him when he dies..

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His name is, quite literally, my Minecraft username. It is literally SwagRum76_

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Also, I don't consider him as my persona, as I don't like the word persona for some reason. But he does literally everything I do in Minecraft on a daily basis, causing chaos everywhere he goes. So technically he is my persona, but isn't my persona at the same time, which is quite paradoxical.

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He's a sentient missing texture/glitch.

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He uses anything he can find to build/destroy. Anything. Even air or bedrock.

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He won't hesitate to take revenge if you bother/disturb him, and he feels no emotional attachment to any Minecraft mobs and will kill them on sight.

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An AU of him exists called Sin!Swag, which is literally the embodiment of all my darker thoughts and/or urges. It's based off of those Undertale AUs where Sans goes mad and kills everyone.

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He can also be smoked, but it results in you getting a high where there's a high likelihood of you never coming out of said high. Said high often includes very vivid hallucinations that feel like you're actually there, and even a smoking a small amount of him can trigger these effects. You can move around and whatnot within these hallucinations, but IRL, you'll be locked in a coma-like state pretty much forever.

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Also, I often make versions of him/this mc skin to suit my mood and to have a little variation on everything. For example, I have made a version of him with a sad expression. I also sometimes make versions of him based off of Undertale AUs, such as one based off of Insanity Sans.

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He usually attacks with a sharpness 2,147,483,647 netherite sword/axe. This weapon also has every other enchantment in the game, all at level 2,147,483,647. (He also prefers commands too, particularly /execute and /kill)

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If I, as in the creator of him and his little world, happen to somehow die, he dies too. He's metaphorically tied to me in that way.

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He tries to be nice sometimes, as he realizes that you can't always cause chaos everywhere in Minecraft. He acts nice mostly towards his friends or allies.

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He's definitely a villain with a chaotic evil personality type, but due to his variants, that can change at any time. But he mostly does what he does because he is constantly bored and wonders how much chaos he can cause out of boredom.

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The mc skin for him is actually a missing texture skin I made for another youtuber named NoodlesTheAsian, but he told me he quit Minecraft at the time, so I started using it as my main mc skin.

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He is very, very hard to kill/destroy, as he is a glitch, and glitches practically never die. Glitches can only be patched, and they have a chance of coming back.

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He only causes chaos and destroys/steals things when he knows he is alone and isn't being watched by anyone else. Other versions of him aren't restricted by this at all.

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You can use the "ask" section on my profile that reads "[ERROR 404]" to ask him/my oc questions, and I will try my hardest to respond in-character. Feel free to do it right now.

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If he can't find a physical form or is defeated somehow, he can corrupt the players around him with his glitchiness and partially take control of them. And by partially, I mean he will take full control of you and your body, but you are forced to watch as he does his usual stuff and demolishes everything. Also, he can attempt to revive his fallen allies using his glitchiness, but it often backfires and turns them into zombies.

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Any entities or players he possesses will end up having a missing texture pattern on some parts of their body, and that's how you can tell if someone is possessed by him. And once someone is possessed by him, you cannot reverse the possession. He can only possess another entity/player if he is defeated while he is possessing a player/entity, thus limiting him to only 1 possession at a time. {the people who he possesses could potentially try to fight the corruption if they had enough determination}

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He has access to creative mode and access to commands/nbt editing. When he decides to use these really powerful features/tools, he cannot be hurt, and he causes chaos even if people are watching him. This is basically a say-goodbye-to-your-world feature/tool he can use and abuse to his will. He uses these most of the time.

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Only ONE weapon is capable of defeating him, and that weapon is a sword completely made out of bedrock and enchanted with sharpness 2147483647. There's only one of these items in the entire Minecraft world, and if you really want to defeat him, you'll have to obtain bedrock as an item somehow..

Maybe a pickaxe made from netherite blocks and blaze rods will do..

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He mostly lives in a world that is on a repeating seed, but he does sometimes visit other worlds/servers too.

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There's an alter version of him called InvertSwag, and it basically does the absolute opposite of everything he does. Instead of destroying, InvertSwag creates. This version is also known as Negative SwagRum or _67muRgawS. I prefer to call him Negative SwagRum, as it fits well. (also Negative SwagRum's goals and ambitions are the complete opposite aswell.)

Also, he rarely appears if SwagRum glitches out severely enough. He is also more unstable than the normal variation, and always has to keep the regular variant of swagrum at bay.

Negative SwagRum skin URL -

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SwagRum Skin url:

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A new variant called Hollow!Swag was made by me for Halloween. Neither me or anyone else know much about this variant, but we can interpret this as a version of him that viewed everything and everyone as "Hollow". As a result, he decided to forcefully try to show everyone the hollowness he viewed within everyone and everything.

Here's the skin for that variant -

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Also, one final thing, he has a character ai;

{i highly dislike Ai but I will keep the link here regardless.}

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He has cooked the Roaring Knight, credit for this fact goes to my friend TerriAndy

OC GUIDELINES

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Under NO circumstances should you ship my OC to anyone or anything. Unless you're shipping him with a toaster, as I find it funny. Also only platonic/"as a friend" ships, no romantic ships. Also, you are NOT allowed to make NSFW content/porn of him, unless it's gore.

I have thought about letting people make gore of him for a while, and I've finally decided that since it would be nothing but magenta, it would be okay.

Now that I have an idea of what kinning is, I'll allow it. Also feel free to genderbend my OC in fanart and whatnot.

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That's about it.

[shenyaanigans]

as im turning deltarune over in my mind for the twentieth time, i'm thinking about the question of agency again (lol), but this time as it relates to the player. deltarune ch3-4 spoilers below.

the most important line of the opening sequence in deltarune is "no one gets to choose who they are in this world." this is after you created a vessel, named it, and then offered your own name to the unknown entity at the beginning, only for them to throw it all away. i think it's important to note that the player does not initially choose to steal kris's body; we are as displaced as they are, trapped in a body we did not choose.*

moreover, undertale and deltarune are both JRPG-inspired games, and they rely heavily on choices made through dialogue to shape the story. which means, the options you're given are being limited by something. we can't actually do whatever we want. so the question is: who is limiting those choices?

my initial thought had been kris. though not able to control their body, the choices we are offered seem to be informed by kris's personality—they're within the realm of possibility for kris to do, or perhaps they are thoughts kris might have but wouldn't ordinarily act on. your choices when you find moss are to leave it alone or eat it; eating it has to come from somewhere. it would make sense if that was coming from kris. we can't make them do something wildly out of character.

however ch4 complicates this theory; kris has started resisting certain choices when they disagree with us. refusing to be rude to ralsei, biting their hand if we try to make them say they'll never play piano again—these two acts of rebellion are counter to the normal way they get around doing things they don't want to do, which is through malicious compliance. ordinarily, kris does the task we ask them to do, but does so in a way where we don't get what we wanted—they'll open the door to asriel's room in queen's castle, but they won't open their eyes to let us see it. they'll look at berdly's room but they won't tell us what's in it. they'll turn the knob on the closet door but they won't open it bc they know the knight or someone else is inside. these aren't true acts of rebellion. but biting your own hand to ensure you don't say something you don't want to say? that's pretty blatant. if we get our options from kris, why was that even there to begin with?

the theory still works, though: these options they detest are still options they would do or maybe would have done before. with ralsei, this is possible. you have the opportunity to be warm with him from the beginning, but you also don't have to be. i don't know if i subscribe to the idea that kris doesnt like/always disliked ralsei—the tea is flimsy evidence in my opinion; we can extrapolate what it means but it's not hard evidence—but i do think their attitude has changed no matter what: at one time they would have been fine being cold to ralsei. but now they're no longer willing to do so. perhaps there was a time when kris no longer wanted to play piano, but these new adventures they've been on with susie have inspired change.

however, there is also another option: the choices we're given are not related to kris at all. in which case—who is it? i mean there's an obvious answer. the game's creator. toby crafted the choices we see; he is our puppetmaster. and he's been demonstrating more and more the way he controls the game in deltarune through increasing appearances of the annoying dog. i KNOW it seems kind of silly to read into what are ultimately easter egg jokes, but they have a effect on the game, however funny that effect may be. in ch4, you can't play megalovania on the piano where you can theoretically play whatever you want; he literally runs you over with a car. as a reference to the annoying dog stealing your ultimate treasure in undertale, you have to race against the annoying dog in a climbing race, but that race is rigged—you will always lose. it's only because the annoying dog chooses not to take your treasure that you keep it (though the treasure is. a single dog dollar iirc). in ch1, you can't go into the librarby's computer lab because a dog is working hard on a game in there—chapter 2, of course—and when you try to go to the annoying dog room in ch2, the annoying dog once again comes out and hits you with his car, killing you. and these are just the moments i experienced and can remember.

and to be clear, i do NOT think the annoying dog is like. going to become the main villain or something like that. although it would be funny (and i wouldn't put it past toby to make the annoying dog a secret boss for ch7), it's more likely the annoying dog as a funny easter egg is a reminder not only that this is a video game constructed for us, but there's another creator-like voice that's been here since the very beginning: the unknown entity who has finally revealed their ultimate motivation to create "[their] deltarune". whatever that means. are the choices we are given then of their design, regardless of who kris is? and what does it mean that what we have colloquially called "snowgrave" is internally referred to as the "weird route"? do those choices help this mysterious entity the way our normal choices do? if so, how? why is it weird then?

(in case it is not obvious, these are rhetorical questions i am chewing on. i am not asking these. please do not reblog this post to definitively answer them with your theory; i am not interested in game theories and trying to determine what comes next. i want to analyze what currently exists from different perspectives)

this post is long enough as it is, and in many ways, it's unsatisfying. the game is not finished, and there is no way to know who or what is impacting the choices we're given. but i think it's important to remember that they are limited. even as we have immense power in the world of deltarune as a SOUL, we, like every other character, have a role to play.

* also, i know this was a throwaway paragraph at the beginning, but i think it's important to acknowledge, however, that despite not initially choosing to be kris, we as players do continue violating them of our own free will. to play the game you have to erase kris's save file (even if you choose not to in ch1, kris's name does not carry forward to chapter 2). i don't want to imply that kris and the player are in equal situations—rather, that the game itself is about gradations of fate, agency, and violation, and the player's agency is also being limited by a higher power the same way we limit kris's agency. but the player reckoning with violating kris's autonomy as deltarune's price of admission is a tangent to the point of this post.

[canadiancryptid]

So I started thinking about the game on Asriel's computer, and now I can't stop thinking about the possibility of Asriel and/or Kris being the ones to create Undertale. I mean, if Gaster might have created Deltarune, why couldn't they have made Undertale?

I mean, its clearly supposed to be a reference to the Asriel fight, but I started questioning if there might be more to it, and here I am.

They way this has been piecing together in my brain, I see it as more Kris picking up what Asriel started and never finished some time after the events of Deltarune, with every intention of having it played by the same entity that controlled them.

All of the similarities between the games can easily be things that were based of their actual adventures and people from Hometown. What I'm interested in are the major differences.

- Most of the magic used by monsters could be based on what little magic they can use in the Light World, as well as magic used by both Lightners and Darkners in Dark Worlds.

- Frisk and Chara being so similar to Kris makes perfect sense if they were inspired by them. They both share a ton of traits with Kris, but Chara seems to have the most. Frisk is the player character based on their experience while under the player's control, and Chara is the self-insert that fills their role in the Dreemurr family, but is also one of two characters in the game who directly speak to you as the player.

- Gaster and all his mysteries could be based on whatever entity we've been assuming IS Gaster in Deltarune. They never fully found out what was going on there, but they knew putting in references to it would drive the curious players insane.

There's something about the idea of Kris creating Undertale because of the events with the player in Deltarune, only for most of us to find Deltarune in the first place because of Undertale.

The one major part of this theory is how Asriel is depicted in Undertale. I guess it could be explained as Asriel's edgy OC from when he was working on it getting reworked for the story, but that might be stretching it a bit.

Do I think any of this is even close to canon? Not for a second. Pure crack theory. But I can't stop thinking about it and it makes a concerning amount of sense. There are a bunch of other smaller things I can think of that could be looped in, but these are most of the main ones. I don't like how deeply this has infected my brain.

[jpx0999]

I had an Idea for an undertale Au which i dont think anyone made yet("think" because there are soo Many i am actually NOT Sure)

The name would be "Anomaly Completion"

The Idea of the Au came to me when i realized even tough frisk is truly a separate character from us,unlike Kris from deltarune who has a backstory of theyre own before we come into play,frisk has NO backstory at ALL

That made me think of the Idea of frisk NOT EXISTING before the events of the game,quite literally the moment we start the Run being the moment they are born

Then after brainstorming a little about How such Idea would interfer with the plot o realized Nothing would changed much,NOT even after the true pacifist ending because the choice to stay with toriel would lead to no conflicts with frisk real parents or Any human civilian because frisk has no connection to those

Then i realized,what If i play the reverse,frisk NOT Only Dint exist before they fall but also they cease to exist after they leave the underground,Thats why neutral runs we get ZERO Idea of what is going on with frisk...

It then hit me,It Gave me a reason for a genocide Run frisk WHITOUT the need of a player interfering or even EXISTING at all in the story

Frisk starts the genocide Run because they need more Power to keep EXISTING,and the easiest and most effective Way to obtain Said Power is a genocide run

I then realized... Wait,WHY would frisk NOT exist before theyre Fall and THEN come into existance out of nowhere and THEN suddenly cease to be From existance once they leave the undeground

I decided then to change the plot reatroactively now... My mind pierced together the clues and made an idea

Gaster,the delta rune Angel's prophecy,the implications the Power of LOVE can make a non corporeal entity more "real" from The end of genocide,the previous fallen children mistérious reasons for why would they come to Mont ebott and the world being sentient implications from The genocide Run(mostly undyne speech and background noise during It from "but the earth refused to die")

And then came the plot

The deltarune was created by gaster long in the past(because he was shattered across space-time the fact he affected something from before his own birth is kinda completely possible),the deltarune Tells the tale of an angel who Falls from The Surface to inevitably free the underground.

The world is sentient,but acts more like a computer kinda of sentient than anything Else,It receive input X then It give output Y,aways,NO exception,gaster abuses that to make the world FORCIBLY try Its best to make the prophecy inevitably comes true,not matter what

It changes things,a Flip or a coin there, gust off Wind here,a bird decides to pick the worm on the left instead of the rigth and soo on,until a giant domino effect brings chara to MT ebbot,the barrier is too powerfull and the world cannot change things inside It in the same Way It does outside of It(undyne's DT allowing It for a brief moment as the exception)

Because the world cant mess with fate inside,It cant stop chara's plan,and the Power of a Monster with a human soul is too big for It to be affected too(they ARE powerfull enough to Cross the barrier,thus more powerfull than It)

Because chara died the prophecy cant come true thus the world has to bring another child into the underground again,thus the reason why they come,but they are killed by asgore,thus the prophecy is Still incomplete

After enough disapearences on MT ebbot,the humans decide to Just straigth UP board UP the entrance to the underground and put a few more barris(not Magic ones) around the area

The world can no longer manipulate fate to being humans there because what It could do had to Still bê in line with what was possible,since entrance to the underground was now COMPLETELY sealed then It was no longer possible and thus the world has to take even more Drastic measures to Follow gaster's prophecy disguised command

It then created a entity,a blob of magical energy not that diferent from a amalgamate Monster,It Falls on top of chara's grave and thus take a form awfully similar to them due to it

Thus

Frisk's existance start,now with the purpose of the deltarune's angel ingraved into theyre Very soul

And the Run can finally start

[terramythos]

while replaying deltarune (once more. god) i'm have been dumping dialogue/flavor text/visual bits i find interesting (to me anyway) in the current post episode 4 context

under the cut

chapter 1

obviously knew the SOUL goes in there if you finish chapter 1 but directly controlling it in the overworld trying to escape/navigate makes me assume it's tried to escape quite a lot. other than kris throwing it in there.

i don't think he talks much about his history books when you meet him. like during the fight mostly talks about lord of the hammer? and is more fixated on susie than kris

when kris doesn't respond to her question-- makes me wonder if they really CAN'T respond there

not that susie would have done it anyway but now we know why she has a high opinion of toriel. also the thing about 'burying her child' - kind of relevant with the whole dess thing, assuming she is in fact dead

i didn't get the screenshot, but you 'save over' kris' file and replace it with your name, which is interesting. why do they have one in the first place? and why would reaching out to it be second nature, beyond it being obviously a save point from undertale (since there's a non-zero chance the player never played that game). this makes me wonder if kris explored dark worlds before as themself without the SOUL's intervention.

i have no earthly idea what these fucking things are but they show up in chapter 3 too. some attack you too as the little tutorial bit, those ones are dark though

👁

(obviously the eye is an intentional reference/setup for their prevalence in ch 4, but the building material and dark gaps do specifically remind me of when you climb the titan)

i also don't know what the fuck these actually are. i know we hide behind them but they seem to be breathing or sleeping. but if you interact with them they blow away and leave a husk (and kind of make a coughing noise-- not sure). makes me think they're a representation of dreams, maybe?

obviously it's not, and we do encounter total darkness later where you really can't see anything. so what is meant by this

kind of funny with the eyes. though you get this dialogue in various places so it's not necessarily related lmao

a dark fountain is what wakes up the titan in chapter 4

i wonder if ralsei even HAS his goatlike form before he encounters kris and susie. if he exists at all before we come here?

this also makes me wonder if there is an entity that made the prophecy or if it's just a universal constant? seems like the latter based on chapter 4 but we are probably supposed to subvert it in some manner. anyway, ralsei says in chapter 4 that he knows the entire prophecy (and thus, knows everything that will happen in the story beforehand)

i never told him 'no' about hearing the prophecy so this is a fun reaction. i'm mostly going to try being a dickhead this playthrough

... do we, beyond the meta sense?

i kind of feel bad lmfao

(continued)

[tastyfresh]

my least favorite UTDR character is without a doubt "The Player". This supposedly canon entity that is, yknow, YOU, playing the game in a meta way and controlling the characters through the funking screen. I really dont find that concept interesting and think it actively would make the story of Undertale and/or Deltarune worse if it were directly canonized. The upside being "The Player" isn't technically directly actually stated to 'exist', so much as they are heavily implied.

But i think the story of Undertale is SIGNIFICANTLY more investing if its a story of how the power to Save And Load can corrupt someones curiosity and drive them to do horrific things, when they think that their actions have no consequences, ultimately teaching the lesson that your Actions, Do, have Consequences despite your weird superpower you got from being really determined to stay alive. And i think that's a valid interpretation of the story, rather than it saying "oh you the human being in real life playing the game are actually a piece of shit because you engaged with the story in the evil way". That's just un-immersive and uninteresting, to me.

And i think the story of Deltarune (though unfinished obviously, i cant predict what they will actually do) would be dampened if it is, in fact, "The Player" playing the game and controlling Kris and telling them what to do against their will. I think its a lot more compelling if it's the Knight or some other antagonist within the story that does not force me to confront the fact that i am playing the game and therefore am not longer invested in the story because im made aware that it is fiction, despite how much it tells me that its actually for real and i should feel bad for being the bad guy in the story. I would rather feel bad for my actions as a character within the universe, because that's immersive and that lets me engage with the fiction instead of being forcably reminded "this fiction is fiction its not real you cant be invested because its a fake story right now and there is no 4th wall". It just supremely dampens my engagement in any story when the 4th wall is broken, or in the case of "The Player" being a real entity, when there essentially ISN'T a 4th wall because im canon in the game.

HI!!

I wanna know who's your LEAST favorite character in deltarune/undertale

[carlyraejepsans]

do you prefer frisk being the genocidal one and chara being the pacifistic one or vice versa?

much much, MUUUCH more complicated than that buddy. from a meta/actual game's message pov? i think it's important that frisk has the space to live their own life and be themself only after we've set them up to be a merciful person with true pacifist. at the same time, they're also willing to fight when we want to!

as for chara, i think the distinction between their and the player's will is pretty much useless in any run other than genocide, where we DO push them to become as bloodthirsty as we are, but we make them so powerful they become their own entity, completely alien to our will and ungovernable once the run is completed. in this run, frisk is progressively pushed aside by the narrative as the focus shifts on the separation of us and chara, until frisk is completely taken over. honestly... i really like the theory that frisk is, technically speaking, chara's reincarnation, and that while pacifist allows chara's unfinished business to be dealt with and their spirit to be put to rest (allowing frisk to move on as their own being), killing everyone in the underground will do the opposite, make chara's spirit stronger and stronger through LV and EXP (kind of as an inverse parallel to flowey taking everyone's souls and turning back into asriel in PP) until they eventually take over entirely and confront US, player, face to face.

from a more... how do i say. fanfictiony pov, taking undertale not as a videogame with meta elements but as a story that stands on its own... i like to imagine they made decisions together. it's implied that when a monster absorbs a human SOUL and is killed/defeated, that human SOUL dies/disappears entirely. so if chara still lives on as a ghost bound to frisk, they're technically SOULless like flowey, which would cause a sense of detachment in the event of violence taking place. i think... they feel through frisk. so if frisk behaves with kindness and mercy, their feelings will follow, and if they don't... well. same thing really. they're partners :]

[leshyleaf]

YOU TALKING ABOUT THE PARALLELS BETWEEN OFF AND UNDERTALE-

Just, that whole post has so many great just!!! You know?? Its such a good post, and now I wanna rewatch someone's playthrough of the game.

YEAHHHHH DUDE THERES SO MANY ITS CRAYZAYY.

Off is such a weird, trippy, complicated game (not really gameplay wise, but lore wise, yget me), and I know that toby literally did take some inspo from it, but my neurodivergent brain loves finding the similarities between two things and pointing them out to me like some kind of overexcited bird dog.

If you play undertale blind, you’ll probably kill everything in sight because this is how you have been taught to play rpgs your entire life (assuming you have been playing rpgs a lot lol). Throughout the game, you may slowly realize that what you are doing might not be as neutrally necessary as you once thought. And that actually, you might be making yourself into The Bad Guy by acting this way.

off spoilers below if you mind

Off is like that, but that feeling is obligatory. Whether or not you slowly begin to understand that your objective to “purify the world” isnt really the holy mission you thought it was, (which, if you visit the previous zones after you “purify” them, you might realize this very suddenly), there is no pacifist route. You continue, that’s your only option.

But that absolute wipe of all life; the merciless mass murder of monstrous beings in the pursuit of, well, something…(in both games, the player is a character who is left in the dark about the batter/chara’s true intentions until the end) is one of the biggest similarities between the two games for me.

To expand on the player thing: both in Off and in Utdr, it is purposefully made abundantly clear that the player and the protagonist are two separate entities. In undertale/deltarune, this is slightly more subtle, (but no less true), while in Off, Pablo (the judge), and Zacharie both pretty much only speak to you, not the batter. You are called “the puppeteer.” Even the batter speaks about you, and is aware of his lack of control over his own actions. Unlike some other puppet from deltarune, but much like Kris (minus the snowgrave route), he is unconcerned by this.

Now, deltarune. This is a game where we explore worlds created by something called “The Knight”. We navigate through some crazy imagination land, probably brought into being solely through someone’s determination, their mind expanded outward.

At the end of Off, we find out that the world was already destroyed long before we begin the game, and that we are navigating through some crazy imagination land, probably brought into being by someone (Hugo’s) determination, their mind expanded outward.

I like to connect deltarune and off with these themes of apocolypse and creation, although they seem to be happening in the opposite order. 😳

And damn I mean, not only are a lot of the themes between these games similar, with a similar vibe for secret bosses and puzzles as well, but even in Off’s overworld artstyle you can see, like…especially looking at undertale in comparison: The simple but bold and saturated color schemes, the box-like platforms your character is laid upon…they’re both just really simple but effective,I don’t know how to explain it better lol.

Mannn and don’t even get me stahted on the character parallels :,)…

Two royally-appointed judges with a lazy streak and little brothers? Who have neglected their duties and therefore have to fight you in an epic fkin final battle at the end?

Two younger brothers in law enforcement…ruthlessly killed by something seemingly small and innocent…

Two watchful guardians of their own zones, looking after their denizens, and seeing you, a threat (their duty?) and making it their mission to stomp you out.

Self aware shopkeepers…they know they are in a video game, and lemme tell ya, they are apathetic and sad about it! (And a little crazy too)

Two old entities…leaders, rulers, former lovers. One abandoned their post long ago (one of them to live in the ruins and wait for the protagonist, and one of them to live in the void and…wait for the protagonist), and one rules still, neglectful in their own way without really meaning to be.

I don’t know how to end this rant bwaha. I’m running on 3 hours of sleep cut me some slack 😔🤟

In any case, i love these games a lot lol

I’m responding to this ask woefully late, but yeah, you should totally rewatch it if you haven’t already ^^

[rayshippouuchiha]

*deep breath* OK SO-

An important aspect of Undertale that makes it so fascinating is the way it turns classic RPG mechanics on their head, and at times even uses them against the playe. It masterfully hands you little tidbits that help you figure out the truth very gradually, until you are hit in the face with the unavoidable truth only near the end.

Deltarune is much the same, but it targets a very specific aspect of RPG gameplay - the player's control of the main character. It's something we think about so little, since it's so ubiquitous to nearly any game, but in Deltarune it is made increasingly clear that something is... off about it. Initially, you set off on your adventure with someone you don't know very well and meet a bunch of new people and nothing seems strange there. However, once you make it back home, if you take the time to talk to your neighbors and friends, inconsistencies start to pile up.

People will start to mention how the main character, Kris, looks very pale or sick, is acting more extroverted/strange than usual, and other such things. At one point, you can try to play the piano and apparently their skill level has changed?

Then, at the very end of the 1st chapter, it is implied very strongly, in a rather dramatic fashion, that Kris and the player are two separate entities entirely, and Kris might be trying to shake off their control.

The differences are made even more stark in Chapter 2. When given dialogue options at certain points, sometimes the other characters will comment on how Kris' tone doesn't match their words, making it clear that some of the player's choices are made against Kris' will.

Later on, you can return to that piano from before with a friend in tow, and they will comment that Kris looks frustrated at their inability to play to their usual level of skill.

Then, most damning of all, Kris will freak the fuck out after they encounter a puppet-like character, who seemingly dies when we try to set them free.

I was left with so many freaking questions. Kris can seem mean at times, but their reactions when made to take actually "evil" actions make me doubt they are completely evil themself. They clearly want to be free, but then how did they become like this? Did someone FORCE our connection to them? Will we be split from Kris by the end of the game? Were they actually the villain all along? It's all so intriguing and exciting, and I can't wait to see where Toby Fox goes with it from here! There's ton of hypothesizing online, tons of people making theories about Kris' real personality based off of the little crumbs given to us by the dialogue options. It's a lot of fun.

I also love how the game makes me think about the implications of this for other RPGs. It may even be possible that the same is true of Undertale, but because the main character there is a complete stranger to everyone they encounter, no one was able to tell whether they were acting off or not.

In any case, while I initially thought Deltarune Chapter 1 was just "pretty good", Chapter 2 blew my entire mind. The visuals were upgraded to an outstanding degree, the plot Thickened(TM), the OST reached Undertale levels of Amazing, the battle mechanics were improved, and I fell in love with literally every single character new and old. There are other mysteries buried in there besides this one, as well as some of the best humor I've seen in a game for a very long time. It had me crying from laughter at least 4 separate times. I really recommend playing through it. Both chapters are available for free on Steam, give it a shot if you have the time I promise you won't regret it!

Btw, if you do play it would be good if you looked up Let's Plays of a certain... Weird... route afterwards. I don't know how he did it, but Toby Fox managed to inspire an even deeper level of emotion in me than in Undertale's no mercy route with that one.

Not gonna lie, I live for your enthusiasm

[starlightshore]

Why do you think the player is an in universe entity? In undertale specifically. I feel like it takes away a lot of what Frisk could be if they are only a puppet

it’s both! frisk is both their own person and under the control of the player. I think Frisk has more control than Kris, but still very much influenced by the player.

long post because i don’t want to clog ya’ll’s dashes.

I think we can all agree on this? you control the soul, same as you do in deltarune.

See, even choices are chosen with the soul. This is the same.

Now, for the choices themselves, I believe they are the opinions of each kid.

They can drastically different opinions!

But I think the biggest and most important viewing of these choices as each kid matters the most here, when you’re at Toriel’s house.

Chara wants to stay and is inquisitive about the Snails. However, Frisk is persistent about leaving, referring to their original home and asking the same questions three times.

And Frisk does more than just supply potential replies -They can even talk on their own without your input.

Frisk will ask Gerson: “What if the child is a human” which -at this point, Frisk wouldn’t know about Chara and is actually about themself. (Chara should already know this information, so we know this is Frisk asking.)

And then in the pacifist ending, you have two choices: “I want to stay with you” and “I have places to go.” Now, either Frisk is unsure of staying with Toriel, or because of the chat with Gerson I believe it’s Frisk who is sure. They want to stay with Toriel -but Chara prefers Frisk go somewhere else. (Each interpretation is valid, who’s to really say!) But here we are! An actual character arc, right here! So Frisk isn’t just walking along the ride but rather reconsidering their choice to leave the Ruins. Toriel even finds it funny.

So on a quick tangent, i promise this is relevant: the plaque in the first puzzle room recommends you stick to one route and stay on that route -that a middle ground is not an option. Which references the Deltarune prophecy, and also references your actions as the player having to stick one method of either FIGHT/MERCY to get the two major endings. In addition, monsters believed was Chara originally, and now view you to be it.

Asgore in neutral/pacifist: (It’s Chara-Frisk’s hopeful eyes that remind him of the hope for monsters/the prophecy. He believed in both kids.)

AKA: this is me proving the Deltarune is important to both Chara, Frisk and the Player. How it’s both shown repetitively to matter to your choices and the game’s routes pretty explicitly -or at least as explicit Undertale gets.

Anyway the point of this is to show that both routes are majorly important, and that Your specific choices influence both kids (both literally, as you playing the game and in-universe here) depending on your choices of FIGHT/MERCY.

Going to briefly recover this talking point, sorry to go over it again so soon:

The dog food bag changes depending on your exp. How Chara views the world within the glass half empty/half full depends on if you’ve been killing or not.

If you punch the dummy, depending on your LV, Frisk will feel different about hurting the dummy.

Frisk is only named in Pacifist, while in No Mercy is defined by You, the player, selling Frisk’s soul -aka the culmination of Frisk’s entire being. A name has power, a name is also the culmination of someone’s being in a sense. The two routes are two extremes on the spectrum.

Now, back to Toriel and Frisk at the pacifist ending. Toriel talks to Frisk, naming them and talking about their choices on this. When Toby is very clearly separating the player characters and You the player in both Undertale and VERY explicitly in Deltarune, this matters a hell of a lot. We, the player, don’t have the choice to stay with Toriel forever because Frisk made that decision to move forward -and it’s their choice and their life to live with Toriel or not.

It’s why it’s so important that Flowey emphasizes this if you try to True Reset:

So, please.Just let them go.

Let Frisk be happy.

Let Frisk live their life.

I think that sums it up. Frisk goes on this journey WITH you, and is not you. It’s still partly their choice -as much as someone who is under control of the Player can choose of course.  And by the end of no mercy, they have zero input if their literal soul is sold or not. And it’s your choice if Frisk gets keep their happy ending, too.

EDIT: this is just more for fun than for the analysis i made above lol.

so like, Frisk acts out their own in cutscenes. I think if Chara’s control is only relevant in No Mercy, because the moment you spare Chara steps back and is unsure of the plan. that you showed kill or be killed in not a rule anymore, and that its possible to get by with sparing. Anyway, Frisk will do things like chase after the annoying dog on their own, play along with the puzzles in snowdin ect.

for more frisk characterization, they’ll have opinions and feelings that chara describes.

* (Playfully crinkling through the leaves fills you with  determination.)

* "Ballet Shoes" - Wpn AT 7 * These used shoes make you  feel incredibly dangerous.

* (Your face reflexively scrunches up.) (referring to Papyrus’ spaghetti)

* Look at these cool toys! * They don't interest you at all.

Tldr;.....frisk is baby :)

[agyrius]

a Red SOUL and a Knight

a somewhat sequel to "What even is the Red SOUL?" in which I talked about what I believe to be the Human SOUL, which basically concluded with:

-An Human SOUL that is fully independent in its existece and not Kris or Frisk's actual SOUL being possessed, instead a Red SOUL of unknown qualities that has retained sentience and upon inserted into a human can possess them

and having all that in mind, the question I want to answer about the Red SOUL is:

What is the Red SOUL's Origins?

The Red SOUL isn't the Player, not in a 1:1 kind of way atleast

The Red SOUL IS meant to be representative of us the players, but only in a Meta way, Kris isn't being possessed by Frank from the Marketing department

Kris is being possessed by weird eldritch entity that has travelled here from a different universe and is pretty much immortal and unmurderable

Which begs the question, if the Red SOUL is a character within the world, then does that mean that it existed and keeps on existing even when we are not around playing?

in other words...If the Red SOUL isn't the player...then Who are they?

as I've said the Red SOUL is a Human SOUL

And Red SOULs are something that people can be born with...Tho their capabilities are entirely unknown other than what the Ball Game Flag flavor text, which says:

Which implies that Red SOULs are like...on a whole different level in terms of capabilities unlike the rest of the common Human SOULs

in other words, Red SOULs are special...Which just makes it harder to understand what they can actually do since this would mean that the limitations of the other Human SOULs might not really apply to them

so there's that

so let's focus again on the question...What is the Red SOULs origins?

well assuming that it's not something along the lines of "It's the Player's SOUL"

this leaves us with 2 options on its origins:

1. The Red SOUL was artificially created, which basically means that someone made it, which would explain all the wacky stuff it's capable of doing...Like Possessing people, or travelling between different universes or in general being fully sentient, things that normal human SOULs...don't do

As to who could do such a thing...It's entirely unknown, we haven't met anyone capable of creating SOULs, not even Gaster, who when meeting us treats us like a soon to be partner or something like that, not like we are his creations....so yeah, no way to know who would be capable of creating a Red SOUL

but again, this could just be explained with the fact that the Red SOUL....Is Red, apparently being something entirely above all other SOUL traits.

and on the other side we have:

2. The Red SOUL once belonged to a Human....Because it's a Human SOUL, it would make sense that it once belonged to a Human

but to who? The KFC gang are all confirmed to not be the owners Red SOUL, so who does that leave us with?

are there any other humans that we've seen that could possibly be the owners of the Red SOUL?

....Well there is one...

THE (human) KNIGHT

-images from undertale collector's edition booklet drawn by Temmie (aka they are mega-canon)

As in the Human Knight that has a sword and fancy cape and seemed to be the Leader/Hero of humanity during this war

which would mark them as quite the important figure and not just a random stand in for Humanity (Like they are literally there about to face off Asgore, I think that's telling)

and they even were present when the monsters were about to be sealed, right next to who I assume is the Head Mage

which make it even more convincing that they are not a random human warrior but rather the Leader/Hero of the humans that fought the monsters during the war, and here they are, overseeing the entrapment of the defeated monsters

....and as you have just noticed...They are...Very Similar to Kris

and well I have 2 different ideas as to why:

1. Is that, IF the Red SOUL is or once belonged to the Human Knight from UT, then when Kris enters the Dark World while they are being possessed by us, the Dark World would choose an outfit that wouldn't be meant for them, But for us, in other words

think of it like some sort of "advanced possession" , where the possessed person's appearance begins to twist and change in order to match the one of the person possessing them when they were alive....Which would mean that if Kris entered a Dark World without us they would get an entirely new armour, which would be dope!

personally speaking seeing as Kris has an interested in the occult and one of their searches in their guest room in Queen's palace was about magic, it could be argued that their preferred class would be more akin to a Mage (which might have some implications for the Human Mage that stood along the knight)....But then again the Dark Worlds might just be racist and humans cannot become Mages cuz they are made out of meat

...But also this could explain certain details...Like the fact that Kris can no longer play the piano, it's not like Kris forgot how to do it, its just that they can no longer use the skill they learned

...And why is that? The Red SOUL doesn't tamper with Kris' mind in any way, only their body and we are not given the option to play it either, meaning that it was Kris themselves playing it....but they just cant...

My theory on why is that, is that Kris' skills have been Replaced, which would explain how they are a capable combatant even thought they are lacking in magic like the other Monster and Darkners of the Fun Gang (like come on, Susie uses her Rude Buster spell on everything she considers alive and an enemy and her normal attack seems to be more dependent on raw strength rather than skill)

...Because Kris' only method of attack are the standard melee attacks, which are purely physical

...So...

What if the Possession took away their own Skills like playing piano and replaced them with all the sword fighting skills of a Human Knight (even during the Snowgrave Spamton Neo Fight, Kris' new Damage attack is still purely skill based, they didn't get more powerful, just more talented in their sword use)...And the Dark World would on top of that give them the equipment and weaponry they wore during their prime to best use said skills (although changed a bit to fit Kris' Teen self)

...So that would mean that the Human Knight upon their death underwent some as of yet unknown event that lead them to end up underground and in Frisk more 1000 years after the war that trapped the monsters in the same Underground, and from there the rest is history

....Tho an issue arises with the idea that....The Knight can choose to befriend the monsters...and date a skeleton....and even in deltarune want to hug a fluffy goat boi.....So yeah, their personality will need some explaining as to why that is thing they can choose

2. Would be that....Kris IS the Human Knight, as in Kris in the world of Undertale WAS the Human Knight

Kris is neither Frisk or Chara and neither a combination of the two...since nobody else undergoes a change in personality or appearance other than clothing so I highly doubt Kris being the exception

And as for why the Human Knight that lead the humans that trapped the monsters beneath the earth of untold generations....Is now devouring Toriel's pies at 3AM, more than a 1000 years into the future....

Well the short answer is that time seems to also have been greatly shifted in DR than the one of UT, since you have Undyne being the same age she was in UT being older than Asriel who died like a 100 years before the event of UT even though Undyne and many of the other monsters weren't even alive at that point in time

....and if that can happen then I think it's more than possible for a Knight from a thousand years to be present in here during their Teens

...Soo yeah!

Either the Human Knight is who the Red SOUL once belonged to....Or they are who Kris was in the world of UT

Can't really find anything to make one option more likely than the other...So...I guess we can leave it at that...as unsatisfactory as it is...

soo in conclusion:

The Human Knight that appears in the Intro UT is the most likely candidate to be the one to who the Red SOUL possessing Kris and the one we play as belonged to

thank you for reading!

[twilightofthesandwiches]

Your analyzes are awesome 😭, keep'em coming. Adding to the theme of eyes, your thoughts on why we can not see Kris's expressions? nor hear/read Kris's talk? What could be the meta explanation for it ? And in-universe explanation for it? Illusionary magic? The SOUL having expressions blindness towards Kris?

Well, from a meta-perspective it's kinda the same thing as with Chara. Kris is currently the most mysterious of the Deltarune main cast. BECAUSE they are always under our control, we can't truly know who they are. All the info the fandom we have is through inferencing hints and we can't be sure until... well, until we'd get a real chance to interact with the real and free Kris.

And so the game deliberately obscure Kris' dialogue, expressions and eyes - to make it clear that we cannot see the 'real' Kris and to keep the idea that they are distant and unknowable to us. Notably, the only time we get a glimpse of Kris' eyes and see their expression changing is... when they are free from our control.

And as from an in-universe perspective... well, not seeing their eyes is mostly cause Kris is an emo teen who won't cut their darn bangs, but as for the lack of expression and us not 'hearing' their dialogue. I have two theories.

1. Being unable to see the expressions\hear the words of your host is just Part of What Happens when an Unkillable Time God posses something. Namely, it's interesting to note that being unable to read when the player character's expression has changed or what they are saying IS consistent with Undertale.

It's harder to notice, because the game deliberately tries to obscure it rather than intentionally shove it in your face like Deltarune does, but there are several instances in Undertale where Frisk is described by the other characters as having a certain expression even though we can only ever see them as -_-, or a few cases where Frisk is explicitly speaking words but we cannot 'hear' them (most notably when they tell Asriel their name).

And also notably, when the player encounters Chara at the end of the Murder Route... We can read their words, but they're the only character without voice-blips.

2. But the second thing is... back in Undertale, it's not we just couldn't hear or read the expressions of the human we were possessing... we couldn't hear Chara either. When we flashback to Asriel and Chara's meeting back in Waterfall, and when we watch the Dreemurrs' home videos in the True Lab, we only ever hear Asriel's half of the conversation.

This can be explained in Theory 1 with, well, Chara's spirit is along for the ride with us and Frisk so we might be just as unable to perceive them as we are our physical 'host'. But it's a bit weird that this perception field extend to video recording made long before we started sort-of possessing them. So what if...

What if a perception filter for whatever kind of otherworldly entity we are playing as is Just a Thing With Humans in this Multiverse? Like, whatever we are in this universe, we are a Thing that cannot hear humans' words or read their expressions. It's just hard to notice when all of these games have like... a maximum of 1.5 humans. The only reason why Chara was able to speak to us at the end of the Murder Route is because our actions have made them something other than human and even then, their words could only be read and not heard.

Since Human SOULs vs Monsters SOULs doesn't seem to matter as much in Deltarune as it did in Undertale, that could be the new angle for why Humans Are Special. They're the ones who have the best chances at subterfuge against mind-controlling, all-seeing, unkillable time-gods.

Both of these ideas work well with the Meta interpretation. This is all, like, a statement about the relationship between Player and Player Character, right? About how Player Characters are actually the characters we know the least about because they are forced into being our 'blank slates'? Well, being processed by an unkillable time god IS basically what being a 'Player Character' is in this universe. And Undertale had that Thing where Humans were the "Player Character Race" on an in-universe level. And that mostly manifested in the explanation of how levels of powers and SAVEs worked, but for Deltarune, it could be instead about the fact that they make for easier and blanker slates for the amusement of the Time Gods because we can't see their expressions.

The real difference is in what it means for Kris, if Theory 1 is closer to reality than we can see Kris' expression in the ending cutscenes because they are free of our control. Simple enough. But if there's merit to Theory 2, that means that Kris might have the ability to turn into something other than human. Which would also explain the glowing red eyes, humans generally don't have that.