#tmagp critique

[skyeoak]

Tmagp 30 thoughts

Vocal performances all slayed. 10/10

I think there’s a lot of good and bad in the finale! But overall, it feels underbaked. (Or overplotted/overplanned?)

I’ll save my finalized thoughts on the hilltop center to see if it’s developed in further seasons, because uh, hmm. Jonny said in the live drop that carousels of horrors were his favorite to write, but they sure are not realllyyyy my favorite to listen to. They’re kind of thematic scattershot. And yeah, one of my critiques about TMA is that I don’t love how we only rarely see how the fears combine and interact. Having multiple creepy things in a curiosity cabinet -com shopping center doesn’t really solve that problem for me.

The idea of a character turning a blind eye to an obviously creepy job is still interesting, especially in how it parallels the staff of the OIAR. But that’s kinda the start and end of my interest in the custodian? It feels like this story could have been shrunk to 1/3 length and had a better effect. I just feel like this should have been a midseason statement, and the finale could have focused on having some sort of action or tension. Honestly, I wasn’t expecting the finale to have a statement at all, to be structurally in line with early TMA. Maybe a full statement/story from Celia, giving the non-TMA audience some idea of why she thinks there’s nothing to go back to in her universe. Hell. Maybe she could just. Tell Sam, uncompelled. I would have loved to see her try to convince him to jump. Convince him that her new life matters more than his (perceived) failure of one. Instead… this is another episode where I feel like the double meaning titles weigh down what the statement could be. And it’s the season finale.

I wondered early on if the finale for this season would feel more like setup for future seasons, and yep. Yep it did. It just felt like there was this inherent tension between the stakes of the story, which are already at interdimensional travel, and the level of danger it feels like everyone is in. Not to mention how Celia just drops a list of alchemical balance things out of the blue. Magnus Protocol is in a tricky situation: they need to set up a new conflict and new characters, and at the same time, Magpod has already done mega-apocalypse hellscapes and so TMagP might feel the need to go bigger. (Imo I don’t think sequels always need to raise the stakes but I understand that’s industry standard). It’s also tackling alchemy, a notoriously complex subject that’s probably hard to explain to an audience in any way that feels natural. You can’t just throw murder worm lady and screaming main character in the finale and call it a day. There’s a lot going on, less time, and I don’t know if the characterization this season was consistent (/consistently good) enough to hold the full weight of it all.

OKAY, WHELMED THOUGHTS OVER, now for the good! Surprise surprise, it’s all the little character payoffs!

Gwen and Lena’s confrontation was EVERYTHING. Gwen is kicking anthills, and Lena is so content to let her stand in them while the ants crawl up her legs. I won’t lie though, I’m not sure if this plotline will be interesting to me. I think it depends on how fast the OIAR staff can get Gwen to actually be on their side.

Sam deciding to protect Celia by pushing the archivist into the void is SENSATIONAL CHARACTER PAYOFF. (This is my interpretation of the scene, audio was super unclear once again, and there was a line change from transcript to podcast that made this super ambiguous in the actual canon audio.) My poor guy has ZERO self esteem, and still wants to be a hero. He probably realized that if what Celia just told him was true, an archivist could actually kill her on the spot. My guess is that (tma spoilers) this balanced the rift not because Celia replaced her own missing soul (plenty of folks got sent through hilltop road in that same incident) but because an archivist+a person were pulled through to replace Jon and Martin. Truly excited to see where they end up, and if this archivist gets developed more as a character next season. Also the implications of interdimensional balance on what happened at the end of TMA are… interesting.

Oh Alice. Everything in this intricately balanced house of checking up on people and soothing them and deflecting tension with jokes is about to come crashing down. I’m so sorry this is happening to you.

And yes, this is a super lukewarm episode review but I do wanna say I liked this season a lot, and TMAGP is still a cut above a LOT of horror I have read/listened to this year. I’m hoping seasons 2 and 3 will either steer further into a direct TMA sequel, angle OR steer clear and become their own thing. TMAGP is stuck uncomfortably in the middle right now. Just be the good parts of her. But completely new.

[aediondraws]

tmagp comic bc I'm not normal about them!!

ep 12

[little-fandom-dump]

hoes when every other character on the podcast is being subjected to The Horrors but their blorbo is doing just fine

[the-lightless-flame]

look ik why it was there from a narrative standpoint but part of me really wants to believe that the scene with alice and gwen in episode 8 was just there bc they needed smth for them to do so they just let them have homoerotic tension at each other for a while

[admiral-blackwood]

you all are giving alex way too much credit, I honestly think he just thought it was a funny idea to use exaggerated gen z slang

[ashes-in-a-jar]

Am I the only one who immediately pictured the whole team in the Magnus Protocol as not skinny?

(Except Colin, he's a twig full of anger)

[ceaselessims]

see the funny thing about tmagp critiques that i have seen are the exact same ones i had for tma s1 when i was first listening. there were stand out episodes that haunted me, but overall i was underwhelmed when i first listened to s1.

it wasn't until s2-s3 when characters started reacting to the horrors, started actively making choices against the horrors and figuring out the mystery and developing, that i was able to be like OHHHH and look back on s1 and see the crumbs of genius planted.

i think it will be the same for protocol. i think once characters start making definitive choices and actively working to figure out the mystery, the audience will be just as hooked as they were for tma.

[magpod-confessions]

I find it amusing how some people in this fandom are always trying to sound smart and use words like "capitalism" and "classism" and try to "analyse" even the most shallow critiques of anything (currently within tmagp, like genuinely episode 15 is not the great commentary some people think it is)

I'm not saying there's nothing there (and that I haven't over-analysed a thing or two myself), but a lot of the time the analysis works backwards with the goal of saying something "deep" first and then tries to find proof and a lot of the time it ignores and warps other stuff to make its point. Same thing happened with the "the fears are capitalism" thing, like, it's not that simple please expand your horizons I am begging. The world consists of multitudes and contradictions, it doesn't have to be just one rigid thing

Anyway if I have to read the words "class-shame Mr. Bonzo" again I am going to explode

.

[landscaping-your-mind]

Predictions for TMAGP!! And/or wishful thinking. Template by @pinkelotjeart.

[ID: Bingo card underneath text reading “The Magnus Protocol” From left to right, top to bottom, the squares are:

No our world jmart

Different entity categorisation system

Flesh (or adjacent) avatar Grace Wilde

Trans body horror

Alasdair Stuart

Trans main character

Classism a major theme

Redacted is a previous Archivist

Gertrude burned down the institute

Section 31 features

Heavy critique of British government

Start with more knowledge of supernatural

Licensed under a Creative Commons Non-Commercial ShareAlike 4.0 International License

No mysteries from 199/200 resolved

Agnes Montague

One of the worlds the fears were sent to

The inherent horror of mass surveillance

Main character becomes an Avatar

MAG 100 statement givers

More cults

Odd teeth collections

Gwen Bouchard is not a villain

Guest writers explore folklore from other cultures

The horrors of war

Celia is the one from TMA

/End ID]

Elaborations under read more.

No our world jmart

While I think there’s a good chance that we’ll get tapes from our world jmart, maybe an appearance in the flesh, I don’t think that TMA’s jmart is going to show up in podcast, outside of previous recordings. Jonny’s too good of a writer for that.

Classism a major theme

Jonny’s said that TMAGP will be a lot more focused on groups rather than individuals like Magnus was. Also, we got introduced to Gwendolyn Bouchard and Grace Wilde. We know the Bouchards are upper class, and Grace is aaid to be quite well to do. I think TMAGP will focus on classism.

Section 31 features

As previously mentioned, Jonny said that TMAGP would focus more on groups. If TMA is individuals in systems of oppression, then TMAGP is about systems of oppression, is what I understand.

Which leads us to the police, which sure is a system of oppression. All cops are bastards, but also all cops are bastardised, the system encourages the oppression, I can see that being explored more in TMAGP.

No mysteries from 199/200 revealed

I think it would ruin the question of “is it right to spread the fears” and the mystery of Jmart’s fate it these questions were answered. Jonny’s too good of a writer for that.

MAG 100 statement givers

Celia’s already there, and I want Robin Lennox to come back.

[ragtimesss]

TMAGP theory (spoilers)

it doesn't mean anything until you make it mean something.

in other words, fuck around and find out.

it's hard to put this one into words, but bear with me.

in the magnus protocol, i believe that there is a continuous theme of needing to be known. ink5oul is a fantastic example. gwen did not compel them, ink5oul NEEDED their story to be told.

i honestly think this is the same for TMA. in many of those cases, the statement holders gave up those stories willingly, almost as if they needed to tell the story to achieve some kind of peace. it needed to mean something to somebody. jonathon sims did not compel most of those people, but instead acted as a vessel to consume their stories. he was not about compelling, but about consuming. there was a thirst for some kind of knowledge in him. he had to know, and that made him a perfect vessel for consumption. an archivist is really a glorified hoarder if you think about it. he's hoarding this information.

i personally don't think that the smirke categories matter at all. i don't think that's the point. i think the point is that they scared you and they meant something to you. the story was told, and you consumed it, and that gave it power. at the end of the day, the story was told. to categorize it is to take away meaning. if you think about it, a lot of the statements do not perfectly fit into one or even two categories. more often than not, you can assign 2-3 Fears to any one statement. and that takes away meaning, because categorizing it rationalizes it and takes away the fear.

OIAR employees are consumers. they, like us, are consuming the stories. some of the employees, like alice, stick it in a box and call it a day. others, like sam, ruminate and investigate (which ends up hurting people). i think that categorizing the stories takes away from the actual meaning, the actual point. i think that the OIAR's arbitrary categorization system is almost a critique of the smirke system and how we as an audience have latched onto it. it doesn't make sense. the stories don't fit into one category. alice says "nope, you have to pick ONE". i don't think there ARE categories, smirke or OIAR or otherwise. the only thing that matters is that you consumed it.

you can be alice or you can be sam. alice consumes the story and does not let it get to her. sam takes it and dwells on it and investigates it and gives it meaning and makes it real. sam found something in the institute because he looked for something. and because he found something, people got hurt.

and isn't that what we're doing? investigating. freeing this thing and letting it consume? when we consume, when we ask for more, people get hurt. all of these stories are about somebody in distress, and we feed on it. when we asked for a sequel, we were asking for more pain and more suffering.

i think we're sam and i think we're alice. sam consumes the conspiracy, and alice throws away the stories. because, let's face it, we aren't here for the grotesquely genius short horror story writing, we're here for the overarching plot. we categorize the story and put it in an arbitrary box, and we throw it away so we can focus on the conspiracy. the conspiracy that, if we feed into, hurts more people. maybe it hurts the characters we love.

i think that jonny and alex are enticing us with red herrings, with the promise of an overarching story (which we probably will get!), while also forcing us to listen to stories their friends wrote. we need to consume every bit of everything, and so jonny and alex use our attention to direct us to some really fantastic, lesser-known writers.

i also think that TMAGP is a critique on consumption. all of the statements, or at least most of them, are about wanting more, not being satisfied, or needing to be known.

this is pretty disjointed, and there are definitely some flaws in my line of reasoning, but i wanted to throw it out there. with all of this being said, i am still going to try to find an overarching plot because, let's face it, we are all jonathon sims.

Some other considerations that did not fit:

the entity in the newest episode identified itself as "an archivist" not "The Archivist". jonathon sims would refer to himself as The Archivist if it were him. this might be an archivist, or the leftovers of one, but it isn't Our archivist.

the OIAR as an organization doesn't actually know what it's doing, but it feels like there's something important about it and that's why it categorizes it. much like us. we think it's important so we consume it. but it might just be a damn good story

jmj is obviously jon, martin, and someone. i think it is jurgen, not jonah. jon, martin, and jonah are all avatars of the web in my opinion.

that being said, it is all the web and it always has been. jon was never an avatar of the eye. he was ALWAYS the web. it is all the web, and it still is

jon, martin, and jurgen are not trapped in the computer. they are remnants of themselves. this universe is controlled by the web, and since everything is connected, it knows that these 3 people are important but they aren't sure why, so they stuck their voices into something that is important. i don't think they are literally stuck in the computer as themselves, i think they're stuck in the computer horcrux style.

finally, shoutout to my father for the basis of a lot of these points. he knows what's up

[just-an-enby-lemon]

I can see and even agree with a lot of tmagp critiques specially from disapointed tma fans except the ppl saying it's too conspiracy board interconected mystery compared to tma, like excuse me, ppl lit revised tma to identify the fears like i'm sorry what?

[macabresymphonies]

Here are few ideas for people who want to scratch weird fiction bureaucratic itch during the TMAGP break:

- watch X-files - the classic of weird/science fiction TV-shows

- read "Teatro Grottesco" by Thomas Ligotti - urban decay with some government critique sprinkled in, as anthology the stories vary, but some of them definitely hit the same notes

- read "Southern Reach" Trilogy by Jeff VanderMeer, especially prelevant once you get to "Authority"

- you can also watch the movie "Annihilation" which is adaptation of the first book in "Southern Reach" Trilogy, although this one is more in the vein of "what is Starkwell up to during the events of TMAGP"

- play the game "Control" - directly inspired by "Souther Reach" AND directly inspired TMAGP as per Jonathan Sims

- play any of the Project Moon games - all of them are basically bureaucratic weird fiction and have very unique gameplay mechanics

- get into SCP Foundation - do not get discouraged by the mountain of content, read what you like, because nothing is canon and everything is relevant if you're brave enough

- try to apply for some type of government project - expirence first hand the horrors of repeating corridors, confusing mountains of boring papers and hostile office ladies making you think you even breathe the wrong way

[aediondraws]

the Magnus Protocol Character Designs

these are just my current headcanons, as well as some things I've seen from others. idk who came up with the Sam amputee hc but I rlly fwi! These aren't final, so feel free to tell me your hcs in the comments, I'd love to hear about them!!

Colin, Lena & Celia are next, and if i find the time I'll try to work on some others like Bonzo etc.

Some details:

[atomic-madness]

Blog Thesis

Hello and welcome to my page! I have a lot of different interests, so I figured I should probably make an introduction or something to help navigate the chaos.

What you’ll find:

Random thoughts/opinions

Reblogs of whatever I’m interested in at the moment

Halfway-decent poetry (feel free to critique!) (#original poetry)

Various aesthetics

(Anything original is tagged under #atomic or #atomic asks)

Fandoms I’m currently following:

The Magnus Archives (#tma)

The Magnus Protocol (#tmp)

The Magnus Archives *plus* The Magnus Protocol (#tma x tmagp)

Stardew Valley (#sdv)

(I also have a tag catalog that has tagging info for topics/fandoms that I’m not currently active in)

My other blogs:

@the-bio-babe: biology, life sciences, and academia content

@eco-skunk: eco-friendly and environmental activism content

I go by Atomic online, and I use she/her pronouns. My asks and inbox are always open so feel free to hit me up!

Hope you enjoy your time here and have a good day <3

- Atomic

(Last updated: 16/8/24)

[mostlyvoid-partiallyflowers]

For the ask game, can you answer the letters that spell KEVIN DAY? :3c

oh my god absolutely! this is the best ask thank you so much!

K - What character has your favorite development arc/the best development arc?

probably andrew, i love how he learns to find community and satisfaction in neil over the course of aftg and begins to heal

honorable mentions being kevin, i love seeing him being able to stand up for himself and know his worth, and trent crimm from ted lasso actually, i love how he went from this really jaded reporter to being a friendly, community oriented, queer role model to the team, it just makes my heart happy

E - Have you added anything cracky/hilarious to your fandom? If so, what?

no not really, but the first fic i ever published on ao3 (back in may) was one where kevin basically got kidnapped by allison and taken to a sex shop to buy lingerie which is kinda hilarious

V - Which character do you relate to most?

my top five characters i've related to over time has been: jo march, remus lupin, yuri katsuki, henry from red white and royal blue, and probably kevin day

note: i am a recovering harry potter fan, that series was my hyperfixation for over 8 years of my life so i can't get rid of the fact that it was so important to me. i fucking hate jkr and i have serious critiques of the series as a whole which i'm happy to discuss at length

I - Has Tumblr caused you to stop liking any fandoms, if so, which and why?

i can't get into ofmd anymore, people were campaigning super hard to get it renewed back in oct/nov after taika waititi signed the "good on you biden" letter and it was just really off putting for me, like there is a genocide happening and you're worried about a tv show getting renewed? like i wish ofmd had gotten renewed for a third season too but i just really don't like the culture the fandom turned into in pursuit of that. it just felt really toxic and uncomfortable and i just can't really engage with the show anymore without feeling vaguely uncomfortable. this is just my take tho, no hate on anyone who still loves ofmd

N - Name three things you wish you saw more or in your main fandom (or a fandom of choice).

more aaron minyard love, he deserves the world and i feel like he gets written off as homophobic or boring by a lot of the fandom which is a shame. by extension, more kevaaron. it's my favorite ship rn and i just adore them together so i wish there was more of it. i love it when people draw/write andrew as a big guy, like he's super built but also built like a brick shithouse, that's a fave

D - A pairing you wish you liked but just can’t.

idk i like most pairings or can at least see where they're coming from so there's not any i really can't get into under certain circumstances. maybe jonelias? i don't like it that much but i can see why people like it

A - Ships that you currently like a lot. (They don’t have to be OTPs because not everyone has OTPs.) Friendships, pairings, threesomes, etc. are allowed.

kevaaron, andreil, kevjean, kevjerejean, kevkateaaron, i love jean and neil's friendship, i'm a big fan of kevin and allison being friends, dyhard from tmagp is big rn for me as well, labru (laois/kabru), tedpendent (ted lasso/trent crimm)

Y - What are your secondhand fandoms (i.e., fandoms you aren’t in personally but are tangentially familiar with because your friends/people on your dash are in them)?

there's so many at this point lmao. the silt verses and malevolent are big rn and lots of 9-1-1 and i weirdly get a lot of buffy the vampire slayer posts from time to time (i tried watching buffy a couple years ago and just couldn't get into it but i do appreciate a lot of the posts). i've got lots of tags blocked though because i just get overwhelmed by the number of posts i see about some stuff.

link to the prompts: https://www.tumblr.com/mostlyvoid-partiallyflowers/756757932546359296/gehayi-a-ships-that-you-currently-like-a-lot?source=share

[teamfortresstwo]

My fatal flaw is being curious . I want to look at what critiques people have of TMAGP but I know it will inevitably make me resent it like it did with TMA