#subs vs dubs

[thowawayuntilfurthernotice]

One of the most annoying things about being an anime fan who watches subs and dubs is that I get hate from both sides of the “Subs vs dubs" debate.

If I admit that I like an English Dub, sub purists will claim that I didn't experience the show the "right way" and if I criticize a dub, dub fans will feel the need to defend every localization choice.

I'm glad that some folks are enjoying the Dandadan dub, but please don't accuse me of being a sub purist just because I'm not a fan of some of the localization changes.

I don't mind subs or dubs, but that doesn't mean I can't be critical of both.

[matt0044]

"Only 12 Voice Actors"

The "only 12 voice actors" thing in anti-dub circles is frustrating because I've seen animation that only had a limited amount of actors to spread across multiple character. And a lot of them are damn impressive with all that they've had to work with.

Monsuno only had Cam Clarke, Chris Corey Smith, Karen Straussman, Kirk Thorton and Keith Silverstein. Each played one of the five man band protagonist group but also had to play many of the characters either reoccurring or one-offs.

Code Lyoko, a childhood favorite, only had nine voice actors to spread across the show. Aelita and Jeremie, the main couple were both played by Sharon Mann. David Gasman played William and Jim among many other supporting or one-off cast members.

But going back to Anime, it's actually exceedingly rare these days for any dub to have two characters share the exact same voice actors. You only get double casting when it's with maaaaaaybe a random extra but even then, there's additional voice credits for other VAs.

Hell, it's surprising given how dubs aren't known for going for high paying rates. If they wanted to cheap out, they could legit go with a limited amount just for main roles. Yet each character has one voice actor these days.

Buuuuuuut the anti-dub crowd doesn't know about this because it would run against their viewpoint of what they hate passionately. Like... the fact that they think that it's only FUNimation and that they have a "clique" of select voice actors is amazing.

Like... maybe a lot of voice actors get a lot of roles across these dubs because they are good at their jobs. Additionally... it is their job to get a role that can pay period. If they don't voice act, they're not doing their job. Which is to voice act. Ah, doy!

[tranquil-slaughterhouse]

Any dubbed version of media (tv show, movie, web show) that's superior to the original should be called a Dom.

e.g. I love the English dom of Ghost Stories

[forteania]

Back on my bullshit (watching Pokémon Subs cause I'm tired of waiting almost a year or so to get the Dubs).

[paperbagedhead]

: Hey Sexy 😛💗, you into subs? 😉😚

: Subs?  No, sorry, I prefer dubs.  It's kind of hard to focus on what's happening on screen when I'm reading the subtitles.

[greatwyrmgold]

I really hope there's going to be a Trigun Stampede dub.

Normally I don't care much between dubs or subs; they each have their advantages and drawbacks, and the relative quality has more to do with the translators and vocal performers involved than anything innate to dubbing or subtitling. They both work, I'll watch whichever is convenient/available. But Trigun Stampede is an exception.

Most anime, being traditionally-animated by a handful of overworked and underpaid artists, don't have much animation during dialogue. It's called "limited animation," and it's fine. But whether for technological reasons or budgetary ones, Trigun Stampede has lots of facial animation during dialogue scenes, both subtle and broad.

For people who don't watch subtitled anime: It is very hard to look at a character's face while also reading their subtitles.

[manic-raichu]

This is not a choice for me. I need dubs.

[stolen-wolfbread]

Ableism is so casually ingrained into our culture that it's easy to overlook it. There are so many features and things that might seem silly to abled people, but are actually really important to people with disabilities.

Like the whole "subs vs dubs" thing in the anime community. I am firmly a subtitle girl. I hate how the text and speech don't match up with dubs, plus subs allow me to practice my Japanese listening comprehension. But dubs are really helpful for people with dyslexia or people that struggle with reading in general.

Then, there was a debate amomg tarot readers in a group I followed about whether digital readings were valid compared to physical readings. One person wrote that they had a disability that affected their hands, and were unable to shuffle cards. Digital readings allowed them to continue with tarot and their spiritual practices.

So the next time you see an option in an app or a button on your phone that seems useless, don't mock it. It's there for a reason. You might never need to use it, but there are people out there that need it.

[thepantyreckless]

My friend: I couldn't get into Derry Girls.

Me: Did you try watching it with subtitles on?

Friend: no.

Me: What about the English dub?

[halliescomut]

So I do prefer subtitles overall...probably since I use them already because...ADHD and auditory processing issues.

All animated stuff is essentially dubbed anyway, so that's aa awkward argument because you're essentially now arguing over the two different translations. Which is kinda fair, because I do find it confusing when they keep the original subtitles, dub something, but the dub is not saying what the subtitles say. That's something that has never made much sense to me.

But here's my thing specifically- I don't love dubs over live action. That's kind of my line. But there's an awkwardness for me to know an actors voice and not hear that when I'm watching them in something, as well as sounds and mouth movements not lining up well. I am aware that there are a massive number of drama's (most commonly Chinese dramas) where actors are dubbed over the original language so the visual to audio contrast issue isn't really present. I'm still watching those shows subtitled anyway, the fact that they're dubbed is almost immaterial.

Having watched a massive number of shows with my friend who is Japanese and fluent, there's always going to be a sort of loss of clarity or intention in translation of any piece of media. So I don't think there's really one that's inherently better or worse than the other in presenting a story, or emotion, or idea. But with subtitles, I feel like I have the base information, and I can get more context from the tone of voice of the actor. It's not to say voice actors can't convey that context, but they're already working from a translated idea. Also, I think in the moment of actually filming there's maybe a closer connection between the actors, the character, and the story, that kind of gets watered down when you are now removed into a recording studio.

Is this far too much detail? Probably. Could I have just answered the poll and RBed it? Sure, but I actually have pretty articulate feelings about this, so I wanted to talk more about it.

As always pls reblog for bigger sample size!

[thowawayuntilfurthernotice]

As someone who watches anime subbed and dubbed, I kinda find it funny how the whole “Subs vs Dubs” debate is still an issue online.

There are plenty of dubs I don’t care for, and there are plenty of subs that I thought were mediocre.

And sometimes both the sub and dub end up being enjoyable.

Still, I can’t stop laughing whenever I see sub purists claiming that I didn’t truly experience a particular show the “right” way, all because I ended up watching it dubbed instead of subbed.

Anime is anime, there is no “right” way to experience it.

[solarmusick]

this sheds light on where the subs versus dubs struggle originated

We (somewhat rightly) mock the 2000's era fansub translation notes for their otaku fixations and privileging of trivia over the media, but they should be understood as serving their purpose for a bit of a different era in the anime fandom. Take this classic:

Like, its so obvious, right? Just say "pervert", you don't need the note! Which is true, for like a 'normie' audience member who just wants to watch A TV Show - but no one watching, uh *quick google* "Kamikaze Kaitou Jeanne" in 1999 is that person. The audience is weebs, and for them the fact that show is Japanese is a huge selling point. They want it to feel as 'anime' as possible; and in the west language was one of the core signifiers of anime-ness. 2004 con-goers calling their friends "-kun" and throwing in "nani?" into conversations was the way this was done, and alongside that a lexicon of western anime fandom terminology was born. Seeing "ecchi" on the screen is, to this person, a better viewing experience - it enhances their connection to otaku identity the show is providing, and reinforces their shared cultural lexicon (Ecchi is now a term one 'expects' anime fans to know - a truth that translator notes like this simultaneously created and reflected).

But of course your audiences have different levels of otaku-dom, and so you can't just say 'ecchi' and call it a day - so for those who are only Level 2 on their anime journey, you give them a translation note. Most of the translation notes of the era are like this - terms the fansubber thought the audience might know well enough that they would understand it and want that pure Japanese cultural experience, but that not all of them would know, so you have to hedge. The Lucky Star one I posted is a great example of that:

Its Lucky Star, the otaku-crown of anime! You desperately want the core text to preserve as much anime vocab as possible, to give off that feeling, but you can't assume everyone knows what a GALGE is - doing both is the only way to solve that dilemma.

This is often a good guideline when looking at old memetically bad fansubs by the way:

This isn't real, no fansub had this - it was a meme that was posted on a wiki forum in 2007. Which makes sense, right? "Plan" isn't a Japanese cultural or otaku term, so there is no reason not to translate it, it doesn't deepen the ~otaku connection~.

Which, I know, I'm explaining the joke right now, but over time I think many have grown to believe that this (and others like it) is a real fansub, and that these sort of arbitrary untranslations just peppered fansub works of the time? It happened, sure, but they would be equally mocked back then as missteps - or were jokes themselves. Some groups even had a reputation for inserting jokes into their works, imo Commie Subs was most notable for this; part of the competitive & casual environment of the time. But they weren't serious, they are not examples of "bad fansubs" in the same way.

This all faded for a bunch of reasons - primarily that the market for anime expanded dramatically. First, that lead to professionally released translations by centralized agencies that had universal standards for their subs and accountability to the original creators of the show. Second, the far larger audience is far less invested in anime-as-identity; they like it, but its not special the way its special when you are a bullied internet recluse in 2004. They just want to watch the show, and would find "caring" about translation nuances to be cringe. And since these centralized agencies release their product infinitely faster and more accessibly than fansubs ever did, their copies now dominate the space (including being the versions ripped to all illegal streaming sites), so fansubs died.

Though not totally - a lot of those fansub groups are still around! Commie Subs is still kicking for example. They either do the weird nuance stuff, or fansub unreleased-in-the-west old or niche anime, or even have pivoted to non-anime Japanese content that never gets international release. But they used to be the taste-makers of the community; now they are the fringe devotees in a culture that has moved beyond them. So fansubs remain something of a joke of the 90's and 2000's in the eyes of the anime culture of today, in a way that maybe they don't deserve.

[unsubscribed]

I think one of the main reasons I still prefer watching anime subbed, especially when I'm with someone, is that the fandom in general doesn't know Japanese VAs as well as English language ones. Which means it's actually possible to get invested in the story without being constantly dragged out of the narrative to talk about minor celebrities.

There's no like "oh hey that's Matt Mercer, oh hey that's Sam Riegal", they're just the character, that's their voice.

[vivianvixen]

One reason I usually can't stand anime dubs, especially ones that take place in Japan, is that they make the characters sound so rude! Like, a character will make some sarcastic quip and I'll be like umm that's your senpai, why are you talking to him like that? And that character would never call a girl the b-word, what the heck?

Also my native language is Finnish so there's no real reason for me to want to watch anime in English, nor is the localized dialogue any more familiar in tone to me.

Not that I'd actually watch a Finnish anime dub, though. Reading subtitles is easy and also I understand spoken Japanese well enough to cover for translation mistakes.

But those last two are just reasons not to watch dubs. The first reason is why I take actual psychic damage from doing so.

[3scythes]

subs vs dubs: where dubs lose the original meaning (Naruto)

For context, I have audio processing issues and like to watch everything with subtitles, and for anime this means I usually have the English dub on with the original subtitles.

In a lot of cases the changes to dialogue are mild, and some can make more sense colloquially to an English speaking audience, but occasionally the entire tone or meaning of the original dialogue is completely butchered.

I noticed this most recently while watching Naruto, in a scene where a young boy’s house has been broken into by bad guys and his mother is essentially about to be kidnapped. In the sub, her tone is harsh and threatening, and she says something along the lines of “if you hurt my son I will bite my tongue off”, and she repeats the part about biting her tongue off quite a few times. However, in the English dub, she’s crying and pleading, only saying (paraphrasing) “please don’t touch my son”.

In this case, I have a strong feeling that Naruto as a whole was “watered down” in the English dub when being adapted for North American audiences, meaning that even in a show with loads of graphic violence, since the “shonen” genre is typically for audiences of 9-18 years of age, the dub was adapted to be more “kid-friendly”, and be slightly less serious in tone than the original dialogue had been.